Latest / Sometimes There's Side Eye / STSE #76: "Misbehaving" Dogs

Transcript

STSE #76: "Misbehaving" Dogs · Sometimes There's Side Eye

0:12
Welcome to Sometimes Their Side Eye, a podcast about two friends
0:16
having real and unfiltered conversations about dogs and
0:20
people. Listen as we talk about our
0:22
lives with dogs, training, behavior, share some laughs and
0:26
a whole lot of banter. I'm Heather.
0:30
And I'm Christy. What are we talking about this
0:32
week, Christy? We are talking about the concept
0:37
of misbehaving dogs. Oh, misbehaving dogs, yes, I
0:42
mean, they're all out to get us. They are out to get us and end
0:48
of episode and what end of episode?
0:55
That's all they're out to get us.
0:59
So I recently saw a post that said dogs don't know how to
1:05
misbehave. Misbehavior is a human concept
1:09
we apply to dogs when they don't meet our expectations.
1:14
I mean, it's true. It is.
1:17
I feel like dogs are just being dogs and sometimes that all
1:21
shorten our human world. Yeah, and I feel like it is
1:27
sometimes easier for our human brains to explain dogs behavior
1:33
in certain ways than actually think about breaking it down and
1:37
trying to figure out how to fix it.
1:43
Like it's easier to say, oh, they're just being stubborn than
1:48
to actually sit and think, OK, why is my dog doing what they're
1:53
doing or not doing what I think they should be doing?
1:57
And where is the breakdown in their training?
2:01
And is it a concept that they don't understand the way that I
2:04
thought that they did? Is it something else?
2:08
Is there pain involved? Is there confidence issue is
2:12
like, what is it? That's such a big thing to kind
2:17
of whittle down that I think a lot of times it's easier just to
2:21
say they're stubborn. Yeah, I do think that's that's
2:25
true. I also think sometimes dogs, I
2:29
don't know if you'll agree with me on this or not, but I think
2:32
sometimes dogs just don't want to do a thing.
2:36
Not because they're in pain, not because they're being mean to
2:39
you or or out to get you, but they would just rather do their
2:42
own thing. Lucy was that.
2:45
Yeah, Lucy. Was 100% like if what you want
2:48
me to do is in line with what I want myself to do, then we're
2:54
golden. But like otherwise, your
2:57
reinforcement has to be really high for me to do the thing you
3:01
want me to do if it's not in alignment with what I want to
3:05
do. I'm going to agree with you
3:06
because I live with Trent, so I'm totally gonna agree with you
3:12
on that. And you might not agree with me,
3:15
but I'm gonna say that that is a female dog thing more than a
3:18
male dog thing. I.
3:22
Feel like a one minute point in my life I would have probably
3:27
disagreed, but now that I have a male dog, yeah, I think that's a
3:31
female thing maybe more than a male dog thing, although I think
3:34
it's. Both.
3:36
Both do it, but. It it's probably a.
3:38
Gross in his younger year. Tater.
3:41
Yeah, yeah, interesting. It's a fairpoint.
3:46
And then I'm going to Pooh, Pooh that away a little bit and be
3:48
like, well, bulldog, you know, like like if I compare a female
3:54
Rottweiler to a male Rottweiler, it's so clear to me that females
3:58
are like, what's in it for me? Is it worth it?
4:01
Is it worth whatever you're asking?
4:03
Whatever the reward is, is. Whereas the boys are like, OK,
4:07
I'll do it just because you looked at me.
4:12
Well, what is that new study that keeps popping up on my
4:15
socials that female dogs can can sort out incompetence in humans?
4:23
Oh my I. Have not seen.
4:27
Oh my, that is not surprising to me.
4:30
And it and if you've had a female dog like like I've read
4:34
the report and was like, of course, of course they can.
4:37
That makes me not surprised at all.
4:40
Total sense, yeah. But I think.
4:44
The concept of dogs misbehaving. Yes.
4:48
I like how you said in the beginning, and I'll butcher
4:52
exactly what you said, but the a dog's motivation for anything is
4:56
completely different alignment than a human's motivation.
5:01
The reason that they do so many of the things that they do has
5:05
nothing to do with why we do things the way we.
5:09
You know what I mean? Like, it's just we're different
5:11
species. Yeah.
5:13
Yeah, we're different species and somehow we have invited this
5:17
other species into our house and then don't fully understand them
5:22
and then get mad or assign different emotions or behaviors
5:27
to their actions. Yeah, yeah.
5:30
And it's so funny to me, 'cause I know all of that stuff, but I
5:35
will still be like, oh, they're just being XYZ, you know?
5:40
And like assigning a human emotion because it's easier just
5:44
to explain it away in a language that other humans understand
5:49
and, and just be very succinct about what I'm trying to say
5:54
instead of being like, oh, they're just being stubborn.
5:57
And then on the flip side, actually they just don't want to
6:00
do XY and Z because the reinforcement motivation is not
6:04
high enough. And blah blah blah blah blah,
6:06
like Oh my goodness. Yeah, it's funny.
6:09
I recently had a conversation with another dog person who's in
6:14
sports, and I was talking to her about outside trailing sports,
6:18
sniffing sports things. And I said I think Jackson would
6:22
be really good at it. Like when we go on walks, his
6:25
nose is on the ground like the whole time, like he's always
6:27
sniffing. And she said that's just a
6:29
poorly behaved dog. Yeah, I disagree with that.
6:33
And I had to laugh and I, you know, I felt comfortable saying
6:37
that's not a poorly behaved dog. That's a dog doing what dogs
6:42
naturally do, sniffing, and me as an owner not stopping it and
6:46
not telling him to do anything differently.
6:48
Yeah. And she saw and she sat and
6:51
thought about it and she said, you know what, You're probably
6:54
right. Yeah, yeah, if you're not
6:55
telling him to be better behaved.
6:58
And she went back to behavior like better behaved.
7:00
Yep. He said if you're not telling
7:02
him to be better behaved then yes, but that's on you.
7:06
But isn't that just about your expectations?
7:08
There's there's more. That's more about the human
7:12
expectation than the dog's actual behavior.
7:14
Exactly. And I think that happens a lot
7:18
where we judge behaviors that are very naturally dog behaviors
7:25
in a way that aligns with human expectations, but not in a way
7:30
that honors dogs as dogs. Well, yeah.
7:34
And I think that I do think that some of that is changing because
7:39
education is changing and awareness is changing.
7:43
Me 15 years ago would probably not have taken Tiago yesterday
7:50
on 1/2 a mile walk. And I mean, we barely moved.
7:54
Like he, he was sniffing all the things and peeing on all the
7:59
bushes and sticking his head here and doing all the and I was
8:04
just like, yeah, dude, go for it.
8:06
That would not have been me 15 years ago.
8:09
I would have been like, you're in a focus heel.
8:10
Off we go. Yeah.
8:13
But I understand more and my expectations and my really my
8:22
expectations and my confidence as a dog owner is different.
8:29
And what I mean by that is I don't give a shit if someone's
8:32
like driving by and Tiago's pulling me on a leash like to go
8:36
sniff the next Bush. I don't care.
8:38
I don't. I have nothing to prove to
8:39
anyone. I'm out.
8:41
Just like letting my dog dog. Right.
8:44
And I don't think there's anything wrong with saying like,
8:48
hey, you can't pull me or hey, we got to behave in these
8:51
situations. But also like giving your
8:53
chance, your dog a chance to dog, I think is so important.
8:58
And when they do something that you're not expecting them to do
9:03
because it's a dog behavior, not jumping to like they're out to
9:07
get me or they're they're such a brat.
9:10
They're so I'll behaved. Well, maybe they just did.
9:13
They get the resources that they needed today.
9:16
As a dog, you know, there's a lot of things that we can
9:19
consider before we jump to they're just a terribly behaved
9:23
dog. Yeah, no, I totally agree.
9:27
In fact, I was talking to someone actually over the
9:29
weekend and they had two of the best behaved dogs.
9:33
They were just fantastic. And when I asked about the dogs,
9:37
they said, well, this one is perfect.
9:39
And then that one is terrible. And I said really, 'cause I was
9:44
like, Oh well, you never get to meet my dog because like your
9:47
version of terrible is pretty fantastic.
9:52
And I was like, why would you say terrible?
9:54
And as they described it, I thought, oh, you don't mean
9:58
terrible. You mean high high strung?
10:02
You mean hyper? You mean not even high arousal?
10:09
Just. High energy, just energy.
10:13
I did see a little arousal, a little frustration that I was
10:16
like, oh, this is an interesting display where the he had been
10:20
calm so long and then I asked him to do something and he
10:24
couldn't. He didn't understand what I was
10:25
asking him to do. And so he just put his his mouth
10:29
on my arm, not bit down, but just put his mouth on my arm.
10:34
And then somebody asked him to do something else immediately
10:37
after. And I thought, oh, this is an
10:39
interesting display. And I just put him down and I
10:41
was like, OK, we can be done. Like we don't need to do this
10:43
thing. And those someone else is like,
10:45
no, no, like you can, you should sit down right here and we'll
10:47
get a picture. And then so he went and put his
10:49
mouth on her arm and she's like, what is happening?
10:52
Oh my gosh. And I was like, oh, I think he
10:54
is a little over aroused right now.
10:56
Like it was the calmest over arousal I've seen in a long
11:00
time. But yeah, but I thought, oh,
11:03
that's funny that this, what somebody can call terrible, is
11:08
really just an energy level of a of.
11:13
A dog, well, yeah, because a dog with high energy that isn't
11:17
fulfilled is going, it's going to come out in ways we don't
11:22
want to see it come out in Right.
11:24
And and some like not everyone understands that and dog with
11:33
that is not having their exercise needs met or other
11:38
needs. It doesn't just have to be
11:39
exercise. Any need mental stimulation?
11:42
Right, right. If those needs aren't being met,
11:45
they will come out wherever, wherever the volcano erupts.
11:50
Yeah. Right.
11:51
So it's going to seep out somewhere.
11:54
It might seep out in a way that you don't understand.
11:57
It might seep out in them tearing the drywall up.
12:01
It might seep out in them digging in the backyard, them
12:06
putting their mouth on a stranger.
12:08
It might like somewhere or something you gotta.
12:11
Get like they knock over your elderly neighbor 'cause they're
12:14
excited to see new people, you know?
12:17
And that's just like the burst and where it comes out.
12:20
Yeah. I So I went to Nevada this
12:24
weekend with friends to go for a dog show and I had Trin with me
12:30
just for fun. Like she just went along for the
12:33
ride and she was, I asked so much of her this weekend to be
12:42
quiet and to be calm and to wait and to rest and to all of the
12:47
things because everyone was showing and she was literally
12:51
there for nothing but to be with me.
12:54
And I noticed that at times when I was really thinking about and
13:03
present with what I had asked of her during during those hours
13:10
that I was much less short fused about her, her yelling,
13:20
screeching or barking or whatever.
13:24
If she she would pass, there were like these two Bernese
13:28
mountain dog puppies that were like wild on leash.
13:31
And if she passed those dogs, she was like, like doing her
13:35
whole thing. And if I was of present mind to
13:39
be like, hey, you know, she's really been doing a lot for me
13:43
this weekend in being a really good girl, I was gave her so
13:47
much more grace, you know? And if I was just sort of like
13:52
trying to rush somewhere or like do this or do that or get
13:55
something finished, then I was like, she would do something
13:59
that was just like this display of behavior.
14:02
And I'd be like, what the fuck, you know?
14:04
Yeah, exactly. She's not trying to piss me off
14:08
and misbehaving, right? She's just like, that's got to
14:12
come out somewhere. And I thought about it a lot
14:15
throughout the weekend and was like really trying to stay like
14:18
presence of mind. Like she's not misbehaving,
14:20
right? She's just, she's at her fill
14:25
and like she needs a place to let it all out.
14:28
Yeah, yeah. She just needed, you know, an
14:31
outlet somewhere. Yeah, yeah.
14:35
So she got some. Good.
14:37
I and I think it's helpful to recognize when they need an
14:40
outlet so we can provide that hopefully before the explosion
14:44
happens, but if not, then before the big explosion, you know, if
14:50
there's a little explosion happening, like let's mitigate
14:53
it before the full eruption that that obliterates the town.
14:58
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Oh yeah, I agree.
15:03
It'll be interesting to see after this weekend and
15:06
everything that went on how she is at barn hunt, like passing
15:09
dogs this weekend and see if it made any kind of impact.
15:13
Yeah. Like, negatively, because there
15:16
were, there were a lot of dogs and everyone was staying in the
15:20
casino resort. So every single dog that was
15:22
entered in the show was like staying there.
15:25
It was the most dogs ever I've ever seen in a hotel
15:29
environment. It was bonkers.
15:31
Yeah. There was one woman walking five
15:34
boxers. Oh wow.
15:36
Yeah. It was a lot, a lot of boxers.
15:39
It was for one person. Yes.
15:41
So I was also thinking today on my walk that when I got Jackson,
15:45
he had some issues with human beings who didn't have dogs with
15:49
them. He's gotten a lot better.
15:51
He mostly ignores other people on walks unless they come up and
15:55
are asking to pet him. He really doesn't care about
15:58
other people. He's gotten better about not
16:00
having to keep tabs on every single person in the park.
16:03
But today there was a gentleman who was walking and I saw him
16:10
walking behind us and I scooted over into the grass so that he
16:13
could pass us on the sidewalk and Jackson could just sniff.
16:17
But he he stopped right where we were and he was looking at his
16:21
phone texting. And Jackson was like, that's
16:24
weird. Like I don't like that you're
16:26
stopping right parallel to us. So I encouraged Jackson to keep
16:30
going. And then the guy caught up to us
16:33
again and stopped again right behind us and parallel to us and
16:38
was texting. And I was like, come on, dude.
16:40
Like be aware of your surroundings.
16:42
Kind of. And so I kind of tried to issue,
16:44
you know, shoe Jackson along a little bit and and the guy then
16:48
starts walking as soon as we start walking, right.
16:52
What the worst time in. Yeah.
16:54
And Jackson turned around and he boofed at him a couple times and
16:58
the guy, like, wasn't paying any attention.
17:01
And I thought, you know what? I'm also a little creeped out by
17:05
this guy because he's not paying attention, but like he is in our
17:09
space. He's invaded our space now a
17:11
couple times. What's what's your deal, man?
17:14
And I think he was harmless, although he did keep an eye on
17:18
us a few times. So I was like, you know what?
17:20
I'm going to let my dog poof at him.
17:23
Like my dog's not one to be trifled with.
17:26
He doesn't want to be a friend. He's not going to let you
17:28
approach us. And then I thought, how how hard
17:31
is it for dogs to navigate when when it's appropriate to tell
17:36
people I'm not friendly, don't approach her.
17:39
And that's just our neighbor, Sue, who doesn't have a dog
17:44
coming in. Yeah, you know.
17:46
I mean like I. Have such a natural dog behavior
17:49
to to alarm and to say like, hey, I don't know, you don't
17:55
come into my circle. And yet we say, well, that's
17:58
such a bad, badly behaved dog because they bark at strangers.
18:01
Yeah, don't. Do you wonder though, if Jackson
18:04
was like keying into your feelings though too?
18:09
No, because I I feel like it happened instantly.
18:13
OK, like the moment I like, he barked.
18:16
At the same moment I was like, this is weird.
18:19
He was like felt it at the same time.
18:21
At the same time, we were both like, I don't know.
18:24
And then I was like, you're fine, buddy, let's keep going.
18:27
And then I was like, you know what?
18:28
It's nothing. It's nothing.
18:30
And Jackson was like, I don't think it's nothing.
18:32
I'm going to keep an eye on this guy.
18:34
Yeah. And then after the fact, the
18:36
guy, we went kind of a different way.
18:38
And the guy, like, kept turning and looking at us.
18:40
And I was like, oh, that's weird.
18:42
That's like, that's like one of those moments where you want
18:45
your dog to quote UN quote, misbehave, right?
18:48
Like you want want them to to be a dog in that moment.
18:52
And I don't know, how do you, the reason I was asking about
18:56
like do you think your dog was responding was because I don't
19:00
know if you remember, it was probably six years ago Christina
19:05
and I were staying down in Casa Grande.
19:07
Right. OK, so we're staying in Casa
19:09
Grande. We don't stay down there
19:11
anymore. Sorry, Casa Grande, but the
19:13
hotels are sketch. But we, it was when we would
19:15
still stay down there and we had Pilot Stafford, Staffordshire
19:20
Bull Terrier and we had Tiago and we were out at night and
19:26
there was a motorcycle gang truly staying.
19:30
They were having their annual conference at this hotel, motel
19:33
and whatever they were staying there.
19:35
There were like bikers. There were like bikers
19:37
everywhere. And the dogs were totally cool
19:41
that night. The guys were giving them, Hey,
19:44
can we give them pizza? They were petting the dogs.
19:46
Like everything was totally cool.
19:48
The guys were all very, very nice.
19:49
Christina and I did not feel uncomfortable at all.
19:53
So that's, that's like Friday night, Saturday morning, I get
19:58
up, I take Tiago out for first potty.
20:00
It's probably like 6:00 AM and I'm walking him and he stops
20:07
dead at one of the guys from the night before and he starts
20:13
growling. And that was not a response to
20:17
me because I was none the wiser. Like I felt comfortable and.
20:23
He just like stopped and did this guttural growl and I was
20:26
like, trust your dog. And I looked down at Thiago and
20:30
I was like, good boy, let's go. I just went about our business.
20:33
I told him he was a good boy. But it just made me wonder like,
20:36
was Jackson picking up to you or was he making a choice?
20:40
Like there's something sketch about this guy?
20:42
Cuz Thiago made a decision. There's something sketch about
20:44
this guy. Yeah.
20:45
Yeah, Jackson definitely made a decision that.
20:49
And I know Jackson actually doesn't like to be followed from
20:53
behind. He just, he doesn't like that he
20:56
he that's sketchy. Like why you got to be behind
20:59
me? If you're my friend, you should
21:00
be up next to me otherwise or somewhere I can keep an eye on
21:04
you. Yeah.
21:05
But I would say like those instances, I would rather my dog
21:11
have the autonomy to see something sketch and make a
21:18
decision to growl then me quote UN quote.
21:25
Train that out of them, you know?
21:28
Yeah, I know. One of my friends sent me a
21:32
message that he was concerned his dad was going with a, a dog
21:36
trainer who used some pretty harsh methods.
21:39
And I and he said, do you have some options for I, I think it
21:45
was barking, I think it was just barking.
21:47
And he said, do you have some options for barking that maybe
21:50
would be less punishing to the dog?
21:53
And, and he sent me, he says, this is the guy my dad is
21:56
looking at going with. And I looked at the website and
22:02
the website said barking is an indicator of dangerous behavior.
22:09
And I thought, what? What?
22:13
No, we need to be aware that barking is just a dog, a natural
22:18
dog thing to do. That would be like saying
22:23
talking is an indicator of a serial killer.
22:28
Well, yes. Yes, serial killers also often
22:31
talk. Yeah, like they're not.
22:33
Doesn't mean that all talkers are a serial killer.
22:37
Right. All serial killers are talkers.
22:39
Not all talkers are serial killers.
22:41
So yeah. And I thought, wow, that is so
22:45
twisted to take such a natural behavior and turn it into a
22:50
money grab because obviously anyone who believes that their
22:55
dog has probably barked. I mean, every dog barked.
22:58
So you know, oh, my dog's gonna now turn into a biter because
23:02
they bark. And I thought, but how?
23:05
That one seems so obvious to me. But then I thought, well, how
23:08
many times do we do that to dogs?
23:12
Or we turn the natural behavior into something more than it is?
23:16
Yeah, because it doesn't fit our lifestyle.
23:19
Well, I mean, old school beliefs was, you know, if a dog growls,
23:23
you tell them not to do it. And modern belief is which makes
23:29
sense. You never punish the growl
23:30
because the growl is the dog saying I'm uncomfortable and the
23:34
growl is before the bite. And so we never want to punish
23:39
the growl, right? We want the dog to communicate
23:42
to us because that is part of them in being having bite
23:47
inhibition, right, because they're not going straight to a
23:50
bite. They're saying, hey, I'm
23:52
uncomfortable. Stop doing this right.
23:54
So if we punish that, then we're stopping them from being able to
23:58
say, hey, I don't like this, stop doing it and they're going
24:00
to go straight to teeth. Not all dogs, but like that's.
24:03
You know, I do think that's awesome.
24:05
Extreme, yeah. It's an extreme, but I'm just
24:07
saying the old school belief was so.
24:10
And that is, I mean, growling is quite naturally a way that a dog
24:15
communicates. Yeah, but.
24:17
I I do think that it depends on the dog and their constitution.
24:23
Yeah. Because in that example with
24:26
Tiago, Tiago growled at the guy and I rewarded him.
24:28
I was like, good boy. If I was if I was laying with
24:34
Tiago and we were just relaxing and he growled at me, that would
24:40
be a huge red flag to me. Like like that is not part of
24:43
his constitution. I'd be like, what the hell is
24:46
going on? Something is majorly wrong and
24:49
and I would fly off the handle. Whereas if I was like laying
24:55
with Bulldoggy and I went and like moved him a certain way and
25:01
he growled, I would I would Pooh, Pooh that away.
25:04
I would be like, whatever, I would ignore him.
25:07
I wouldn't take it some type of way.
25:09
I I would take it as communication.
25:11
I would take it as him being like bitch don't move my leg you
25:14
know? What I mean like.
25:17
But it wouldn't be like a 5 alarm fire, yeah?
25:20
And it is interesting that you say that because there are dogs
25:23
who come over to my house. That one I'm thinking of in
25:26
particular, that I allow to growl in my house.
25:30
I allow him to growl at Jackson specifically.
25:33
Yeah, because they have really solid communication.
25:38
They're very relaxed around each other.
25:40
But Jackson has a habit of trying to steal things from him,
25:45
to engage him and play like, come chase me.
25:47
And he doesn't like to play that way.
25:49
So now he growls at Jackson if he gets too close and.
25:54
And Jackson's like, oh, right, you don't like that.
25:57
I need to take that. And there are other dogs that if
26:01
they growled, I would immediately step in because
26:04
that's going to escalate very quickly.
26:07
And not that I would punish the growl, but I I recognize it as
26:12
something to step into. It's something to manage, not.
26:16
Punish like I need to step in here, I need to help the
26:19
situation and then there like you said, it depends on the dog.
26:23
Cause the other dog I'm like, OK, well, he told you what he
26:25
wanted Jackson. Like respect that.
26:27
Jackson's like, cool, I will. Yeah.
26:29
I mean, it's just like even though earlier I labeled female
26:33
dogs versus male dogs, I I would say, you know, we really do have
26:37
to pay attention to the individual dog and think what do
26:41
we know about this dog? What has been tried and true
26:44
about this dog, if we've known them for a long time, is this
26:49
outside of their normal behavior, outside of what we
26:53
would normally expect from them? And then also looking at the
26:57
environment there that they're in and being like, well, is this
26:59
environment the reason for the change or the reason that
27:03
something's happening? Just taking and keeping in mind
27:07
all the different factors and not just saying, oh, they're
27:09
misbehaving. Well, like look at the big
27:11
picture and look at what you know about the dog and really,
27:14
really look at the the deep down core of what's going on and see
27:19
if because if you parse it all out, you could find something
27:24
really simple that solves the problem and the behavior goes
27:29
away. Not always, but yes.
27:33
I mean, you could though, if you actually do look at it and
27:36
consider. Are you saying always?
27:39
You can always find it Simple? No.
27:42
No, I'm saying sometimes if you. Parse it all out.
27:45
You could find something if you look at OK, this is abnormal for
27:49
the dog, and then you look at the environment or whatever.
27:51
You might find something if you look, instead of just saying
27:54
they're misbehaving, look at the whole picture and like where the
27:58
motivation's coming from. You might find something that
28:01
can make a real difference. Not always, Sometimes like.
28:06
Should just happen. I was like, I was like, no, no,
28:08
some. I don't want people to walk away
28:10
and think like, well, if you would just take a look, it's
28:13
very simple. No and.
28:16
There are some complex behaviors.
28:20
I find I find some of Trent's behaviors to be extremely
28:24
complex. Our some work instructor was
28:27
saying last week, I might have to find a celebration for her
28:30
when she finds her hides. That is not food, that is
28:36
something else that's extremely rewarding for her.
28:39
And she was like, what would that look like?
28:42
And I stood there and I was like a bag.
28:47
A bag, I said. She really likes to play bitey
28:51
face, you know, with. Long ham, bitey face, Bitey
28:55
face. But I don't know that she would
28:57
play that in an outside environment.
28:59
She she likes to be focused like one-on-one little bitey
29:02
FaceTime. So I don't think that's a good
29:04
fit. She loves to be able to lick you
29:08
and be like give you kisses all over your face.
29:10
So I was like, well, that I was going through all these
29:13
different things because she is very complex at times.
29:16
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. OK, so how do we help our dogs
29:24
meet our expectations more easily so that we don't so that
29:30
we solve the problem before it ever starts?
29:36
I think we train for the situations that we need to or
29:40
that we we consider misbehavior situations.
29:45
And we also do some management. If your dog misbehaves in
29:52
quotations by getting into the trash can or the recycle bin and
29:57
you're not able to train that because you're away, they only
30:00
do it when you're away, then let's manage that situation.
30:04
Like do we have a, a self closing garbage can or do we put
30:08
the recycle bin on top of our garbage can so they can't get to
30:12
it? Or do we create our dog when
30:14
we're gone? Or, you know, there's a lot of
30:16
options to think through about management and then if it's just
30:21
a training issue, breaking down that training so that we can
30:28
have the results that we want, that those results are
30:31
reinforced repeatedly. Yeah, I think there's no shame
30:35
whatsoever in management. I think that management is a
30:38
huge tool that can be used whether and it, it can be part
30:45
of a training plan or it can stand alone.
30:47
Maybe you're using management while you're training something
30:51
to solve the problem before it starts or, or you know, to stop
30:55
it before it ever starts again, or you're just using management.
30:59
I use management every single day and there's nothing wrong
31:04
with that. And I don't think that there's
31:06
anything wrong with kind of thinking through.
31:09
And I'll use an example. If I would have people over, I
31:13
would leave a bag of treats out front and ask everyone to grab
31:17
some, right? And when they walk through the
31:19
door, don't, don't pay attention to the dogs.
31:22
Just throw the throw the treats on the floor so that the dogs
31:26
are going for the food, right? And they have an opportunity to
31:28
calm down. Asking other people to to be
31:31
involved when there's, there's place for it, I think is fine as
31:35
well. And maybe that management is
31:38
something as simple as what you said, pick the trash up, put the
31:41
shoes away, put the dog behind the gate, whatever it is.
31:45
But I do think management is a huge part of it.
31:48
Understanding what truly motivates your dog and then like
31:51
working through how you pair that motivation with whatever
31:56
you're trying to train that makes sense, that's achievable.
32:01
Yeah, let me, let me throw this at you.
32:05
Do you think Jenny the Black Devil was a misbehaving dog?
32:14
I do, but I do I I would not have been able to handle the
32:24
things that Black Devil did like I I that would not have gone
32:30
well for me. Right, Yeah, No, I I agree, but
32:35
thinking in it on it from this lens.
32:39
Yes. She she was never again, she was
32:44
never doing things deliberately to get me or to be quote UN
32:51
quote, a bad dog. But I do think she had a little
32:54
bit of separation anxiety. Yeah.
32:57
I mean, and I think she just enjoyed chewing things and
33:01
knocking things over. I'm getting into like, and I
33:05
think her nose was really good. So like she enjoyed getting.
33:09
She wanted to, like, find the interesting things, yeah.
33:12
Eat all the things. I mean, I'm going to do the
33:15
human thing and say it was misbehaving.
33:17
But I agree with you. When you think about like what
33:19
really motivated her, I think she was just like, fuck the
33:21
world, I'm going to die. Like I'm going to do all this
33:23
fun shit, you know? I would definitely approach it
33:26
differently now, but yeah, yeah, I would and not, I would do more
33:32
management like there really was no training.
33:35
Yeah, You were just letting her, like, live her best life because
33:39
you thought she was going to die in like a week, and then all of
33:42
a sudden a year later she was still there.
33:45
I think it was like 8 or 9 months into it, I was like, OK,
33:49
we're going to have to do some training now.
33:51
I literally feel like the reason Jenny lived so long is because
33:56
you let her do whatever she wanted, truly.
34:01
I was thinking, well, it's her last, yeah.
34:04
It's her last hurrah. It's the last favorite shoe of
34:07
mine she's going to chew. It's the last this, the last
34:10
that. Never the last it.
34:12
Was never the last, but yeah, I mean, I just did it here.
34:15
I'm like, yeah, she was misbehaving.
34:17
No, she was like, had all these motivators, right, But like,
34:20
we're just going to throw it in the misbehavior bucket.
34:23
That's. Funny, which I do think
34:24
sometimes is easiest to do, but and at the end of the day, I
34:30
don't really care if people call it misbehaving as long as you
34:35
come up with a plan or you you recognize where those behaviors
34:40
are coming from so and you don't take it personally.
34:44
I don't want, I just don't want someone to take it out on their
34:46
dog. Right.
34:48
Yeah, and I think when a dog does something that you consider
34:53
misbehaving, it feels very. Personal it does.
34:58
And I remember talking to a dog trainer and I said, what do you
35:01
think the biggest difference is? Because I'm watching these
35:04
owners and they're doing the things you're doing, but you're
35:07
getting a different result. And she goes, I'm not taking
35:10
anything personally. The dog wants to bite my face
35:12
off. She goes, not personal, no big
35:14
deal. Like just address the problem
35:17
that is. Yep.
35:18
Because the dog wants to bite their face off.
35:21
It's a. It's a.
35:22
Very personal, because that's a good.
35:26
Point Love that dog. Yep, it's such a good point
35:29
where our emotional point is with that dog is like sometimes
35:34
really hard. I mean, y'all know have struggle
35:38
with trend that makes that emotional connection or
35:41
disconnection. I mean, it's a big deal.
35:44
So that can, that can really, really be difficult to handle
35:50
when you're trying to see the dog's behavior just through a
35:54
behavior lens instead of a, an agenda.
35:58
She doesn't have an agenda against me, although it feels
36:01
that way. She really doesn't.
36:05
She really doesn't. Being a dog.
36:07
She's just being a dog. She's being the spicy dog I
36:10
asked for, Yeah. She's being a sentient being wit
36:15
who has her own emotional regulation and her own ability
36:22
for choices. Her own motivators, her own
36:25
everything that hits, that hits Christy.
36:33
Yeah, if you've enjoyed this episode, subscribe, rate and
36:39
share us wherever you get your podcast.
36:41
Also come on over to Instagram and engage with us at Sometimes
36:45
Their Side Eye. Thanks for listening everybody.
36:48
Talk to you next time. Bye bye.