Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #530 From the Doctor's Desk

Transcript

#530 From the Doctor's Desk · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: It's the podcast for.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: The time poor parent who just wants answers now.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Being on Instagram and following all of these parenting accounts
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: has also been shown to make mums feel less competent
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: because they start comparing themselves to others and everyone else
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: seems to be getting it.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Rock and Now here's the stars of our show, My
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: mum and Dad.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Hello. This is doctor Justin Coilson, the founder of Happy
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Families dot com dot you and dad to the six
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: kids that I share with my wife. The podcast host partner,
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Kylie miss Families, who joins me today for an episode
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: of The Doctor's Desk. Today, it's a conversation about the
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: latest science, the latest research, the latest findings that relate
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: to parents and Kylie, today's some doozies. These are the
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: kinds of conversations where we pause and go, okay, so
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: what do we do with this now? But it's information
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: that I think parents need to have. So we've got
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: three studies to go through in our conversation today. Where
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: do you want to start? Pick one? Pick a card,
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: any card. We've got three to choose from.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Let's start with ADHD. Recently you did a webinar on ADHD.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, two hour workshop actually with about fifty people. It
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: was great, and so I'm thinking that we'll start there. Okay,
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: this kind's a fairly controversial piece of research. I think
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: just published May nineteen, so it's only a month old,
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: comes out of Ohio State University, and it's part of
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: a much larger study. But essentially, researchers have asked parents
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: of one hundred and thirty four kids with ADHD to
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: complete a very detailed questionnaire about the kinds of foods
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: the kids eat, including how much over a three month period,
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: And then they've got another question. They're asking them to
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: rate the symptoms of inattention, which is obviously a central
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: pillar for so much ADHD in their kids, like having
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: trouble staying focused, not following instructions, difficulty remembering things, difficulty
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: regulating emotions, all that kind of thing. And what the
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: research showed was that kids who consumed more fruits and
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: vegetables showed less severe symptoms of inattention. In other words,
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: eating a healthy diet, including fruit and vegetables, may be
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: one way to reduce some of the symptoms of ADHD.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: Now this is provocative because research for the last couple
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: of decades has kind of raised questions about whether diet
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: does or does not have anything to do with ADHD.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: This is not saying, by the way, that getting diet
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: right will cure ADHD. What it's saying is that it
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: reduces some of the symptoms that we see with ADHD kids,
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: specifically around that inattention side of things.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: So there's still no clarity.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: Really well, I think science is one of those things
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: where clarity comes bit by bit, studied by study, year
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: by year, decade by decade. I think that if I
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: was to read this as a parent with a child
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: who has ADHD, it would be a reminder that I'm
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: going to give my child the best shot at regulating
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: and inhibiting those responses that are some how so unhelpful.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: So often, if I can help my child to stay
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: off the process stuff and eat more fruit and vegetables.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: In other words, the better my child's diet, the more
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: likely it is that they'll be giving themselves the best
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: shot at doing as well as they possibly can.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: I know, over the years, we've had lots of conversations
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: with lots of different parents who have recognized that certain
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: additives or food colorings have had a huge impact on
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: their children's behavior. This study hasn't actually looked at any
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: of that. It's just the acknowledgment that food and vegetables
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: support healthier development.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're exactly right. There was nothing in here that
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: I can find in the study that's looking at all
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: of the process stuff, the additives and so on. What
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: we do know though, is that the studies on fruit
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: and veggie intake and the role of food in security,
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: because food and security came up as well, and the
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: more insecure kids are around the ability to get food,
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: the more likely it is that their ADHD symptoms will
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: be exacerbated. So kids that are living in poverty basically,
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: or kids that don't get access to good, healthy, save food,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: they're much more likely to have higher reports of ADHD symptoms,
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: especially around that in attention. So food and security, it's basically,
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: if you don't know that you can get food, if
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: you're hungry, you're going to get irritated. That happens whether
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: you've got ADHD or not. It's just that the ADHD
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: symptoms are exacerbated in that case. So that's the study,
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: like I said, comes from the Ohio State university, and
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: it's a kind of an interesting one. We will link
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: to that in the show notes. Essentially, if you've got
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: kids who are not neurotypical, then it might be worth
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: just having a quick look at their diet and maybe
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: you might find that the more fruit and veggies they get,
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: the greater the reduction in their ADHD symptoms. Of course,
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: there's many other things that play a role in whether
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: or not your child is going to have exacerbated and
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: amplified symptoms or not. But this is just one part
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: of the one part of the recipe for trying to
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: make things go better.
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: Well. Setting number two is all about childcare, so let's
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: dig into that.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, this one has the potential to upset some people.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: I promise you we're not sharing this to be provocative.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: My job here is to share what the latest research shows,
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: and studies into children in childcare have been controversial and
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: provocative for the last several decades. Jay Belski has probably
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: done the best work on this over the decades, but
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: now he's quite an elderly gentleman and the baton has
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: been passed on to some others. So the one comes
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: from the University of Zurich. It was actually published a
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: couple of months ago in March of this year, thirteen
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: hundred kids from Zurich or going to school, their teachers
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: their parents suggest that the more time that kids spend
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: in external daycare, the more likely it is that they're
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: going to exhibit problematic behavior. But the research also showed
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: that by the end of primary school that problematic behavior
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: seems to disappear. Now, this is an association. It's not
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: what we say, if you put your kids in childcare,
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: they are going to be problematic. That's what we call
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: a causal relationship. And you can only figure that out
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: if you randomly like a bunch of people and stick
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: them met of childcare and randomly select another bunch and
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: don't stick them in a childcare. We obviously can't do
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: that as an experiment that we just ethically we can't
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: do it, but also logistically, like families have to live
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: their lives, and so it's what we call correlational or
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: it's looking at the association between these things. And essentially
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: what it showed is that the kids who are in
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: childcare do tend to have some more challenging behaviors throughout
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: their early childhood.
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: It's interesting in some ways, it just kind of makes sense.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: When you have your children in your home and they're
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: not in any kind of external care, you have absolute
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: control over who your children associate with when you put
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: them into even once they hit school. Once you put
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: them into school, you're actually opening them up to a
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: wide variety of social contexts in one setting. And so
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: I remember when my littlest sister went to day care
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: and she came home with the F word.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: Really family, real family, We.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: Don't we didn't swear, we don't swear. And she came
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: home and it was like she was saying, I want
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: an apple. She would just use that it would come out.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: My mother was horrified. But the reality is she was
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: now associating with people who had different values, different standards,
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: and different ideology around life in general. And so all
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: of these things that we often see is bad behavior
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: and not necessarily bad behavior, but different values.
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I think what also could happen here is
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: not only are kids being exposed to different ways of behaving,
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: they're also, as they get older, started to move more
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: and more towards what's popular, what's going to bring me
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: social status? How do I fit in where do I belong?
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: But it's also possible that external childcare could lessen the
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: strength of child parent attachment and interaction. And some early
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: research going back to like the nineteen nineties early two
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: thousands showed that the more time kids spend in childcare,
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: the greater the risk was that the parent child attachment
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: could be affected. And that makes sense.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: There's just less one on one time, That's what I
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: was going to say. Once you're in a classroom situation,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: you've got twenty twenty plus kids to too adults.
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: And it's less time with your grown ups that matter most.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: Your mum, your dad, your parents, your caregivers less time
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: with them as well. And again this isn't to put
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: guilt on parents at all. It's just to highlight that
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: when we put our kids into childcare, there and many
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: parents have no choice. I mean, we live in a
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: society now where if you don't have that double income
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: it's because you've got somebody who's doing very well with
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: the primary income, or alternatively, you're going to struggle. Like
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: it's really challenging. And so the goal is how do
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: we help our children to have the very best attachment
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: relationship with us when they're not in care. How do
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: we manage how do we amplify the quality of the
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: connection that we experience with them? Because ultimately, the two
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: things that the research is behind this study have pointed
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: to are these two issues. One that you raised, the
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: one that I raise, That is the attachment relationship being affected.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: That is the quality of the connection being reduced because
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: parents drop the kids off early, they pick them up late,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: they're exhausted. They basically give them breakfast and give them
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: dinner and put them to bed, and they really spend
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: time with them on the weekends. That's part of it.
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: And the peer group, the challenging behavior that gets picked
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: up in broader social settings is the other thing. So
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: that's pretty much it. Now. I do want to highlight
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: one other thing with this study, Kylie, and that is
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: that while it sheds some light on some possible unfavorable
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: links between external childcare and the way kids are developing,
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: specifically later on as they age, there is no causation here.
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: It could be any number of other things. And there's
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: also this issue of the quality of the childcare that
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: the kids receiving outside the family.
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: A'm just about to say that I think about the
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: experiences our kids have had, and I would say, hands
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: down nine times out of ten they've actually brought home
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: positive yeah behaviors as a result of the places we've
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: chosen to place them in.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: Right, and Australia is very lucky in that we do
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: have a we have quite a high standard of childcare generally,
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: especially in comparison to other places around the world. I
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: know that there's still plenty of room for us to
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: move improve, get things better, but we do pretty well
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: compared with other places around the world. So that's the
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: second study. Oh and I might also throw in just
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: so that people know we're not throwing shade. All of
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: our kids have gone to childcare. We needed the break.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: So after the break, we're going to talk about one
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: last study about how Instagram affects the way mums feel
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: about themselves. Family life is pretty tough going. Sometimes most
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: days are a struggle between strong willed children and frazzled parents,
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: but it can be better. The twenty one Days to
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: a Happier Family program is designed for busy parents who
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: want a calmer, happier family, and it can be done
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: with evidence based strategies and practices that really work. In
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: twenty one days. All resources are available for your family
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: for twenty one days to a happier family at happy
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: families dot com dot au.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast, the podcast for the time
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: poor parent who just wants answers now. And we have
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: one more study.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this one is kind of interesting to me. It
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: highlights once again just how challenging it is to navigate
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: the world when social media is involved. We talk all
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: the time about how kids are affected by it, but
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: one thing we don't talk often about is how parents,
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: specifically mums, are affected by it. And a brand new
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: study published in Actors Psychological explores the impact of parenting
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: related Instagram accounts on mums and what the researchers have
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: found is quite a mixed experience. So mums will often
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: feel really well supported by a community of fellow parents.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: They're following this page. They feel like this person gets them.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: They're keeping it real, they're talking about the ups and
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: the downs and the good and the bad, and that's great.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: But being on Instagram and following all of these parenting
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: accounts has also been shown to make mums feel less
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: competent because they start comparing themselves to others and everyone
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: else seems to be getting it right. I've even seen
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: this on my Facebook account. Right, So, a few weeks
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: ago we had that Carrots and Sticks webinar, and a
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: bunch of people were sort of saying things like, I
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: wish that I could be as good as everyone else
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: who's on here, commenting about how well they do their
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: parenting and how much they managed to not hit everyone
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: with carrots and sticks and all that sort of stuff.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: So there's that whole sense of, well, you've all got
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: the answers and I don't, And I'm feeling even less
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: confident because I'm reading all of your comments and you're
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: telling me how good you are. I don't seem to
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: be able to hold it together at all.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: It's interesting, most of us actually have the answers. We
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: could sprout them off to anyone every day every week
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: through it, but once we're actually asked for practice it,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: everything goes out the window, because, as you've said multiple times,
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: it's easy principles having to be applied in the hardest moments.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's right. Parenting is actually really easy when
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: it's somebody else's kids. You know, the answers. We had
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: all the answers before kids came along and you can
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: see what your sister in law should be doing with
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: her kids and the name should be doing with theirs.
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: But your kids that they're a bit different. We need
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: special help with them. So this was research conducted out
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: of the University of Copenhagen two hundred and seventy moms
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: with one or more children, and basically they were asked
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: how much time on average they spent on Instagram every
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: day during the last week. Then they indicated what sort
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: of accounts they followed, and if they followed insta parents
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: like influencers who are posting about their experiences with parenting,
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: that's where the research really took off. They also looked
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: at other kinds of accounts that could be followed, like
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: professional accounts that share information about child development or parenting,
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: or even university run Instagram accounts that post about child development.
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: And basically, when they walked through this, the results show
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: that mums frequently follow accounts that discuss parenting. And we
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: know that because we've got a couple of hundred thousand
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: followers on our Facebook account and I know tens of
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: thousands of followers on our Instagram account. They spend nearly
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: an hour a day on the platform, nearly an hour
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: a day on Instagram, and about forty point seven percent
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: forty percent of parents basically said, yet this is negatively
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: affecting me. The insterta parent accounts make me feel like
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: I have to be comparing myself to others. I'm not
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: living up to the expectations. I'm being negatively affected by
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: what I'm reading. And it seemed like the insta parent
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: profiles had much more of a negative impact on the
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: way mum's felt about themselves in terms of feeling like
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: they were incompetent and not feeling the same level of
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: support compared to the more credible accounts from university on
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: pages or people who actually really know what they're talking about,
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: rather than being an insta influencer parent.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: So I haven't had a lot to do with social
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: media since really the beginning I started. I have an account,
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: and I usually use it more now just to stay
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: in touch with people by a messenger. But part of
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: the reason I stopped using it was because I looked
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: at everybody else's photos and I'm not very technically challenged,
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: and so I don't know how to use all of
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: those filters and things and so in my own space,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: in real life, everything looked beautiful to me. But then
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: compared to the photos other people were posting of their things,
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: my photos just didn't do my space or my family justice.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because you've got to know how to use the
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: lighting and the filters and all again and get it
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: all looking right. Yeah.
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: So in the early days, I actually stopped posting because
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: it was just like, I can't I can't compare with that.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: You know, they were posting what looked like magazine worthy
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: photos and my photos were just photos.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: But obviously as your profile has increased, I've actually stopped
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: posting to kind of give us a little bit more
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: privacy in our kind of private lives.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I've only got one one image on my
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: Instagram account, just one photos all I've ever posted with
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: my Instagram account. I don't even know how to log
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: in anymore. But let's move back to this so they'll
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: take our message from these studies, because we do need
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: to wrap up number one when it comes to ADHD.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: There are multiple things that are going to exacerbate or
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: lessen the symptoms that our kids are showing, and new
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: research that contrary to previous research. Of course, that more
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: fruit and vegetables may have some impact, especially on the
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: inattentive side of ADHD symptoms. The second thing that we
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: talked about is that childcare, well, the more of it
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: your kids are exposed to, the greater the risk that
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: attachment and challenging behaviors from peers could affect their behavior.
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: And so we want to make sure that we're really
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: creating secure relationships for our kids if they're in childcare.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: And the final take home messages social media, stay off it.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: It's not helping you, fair call.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: I know that my life's better when I'm not spending
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: so much time on it.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: The Happy Families Podcast is produced by Justin Rowland for
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. All of
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: these links to the Doctor's Desk articles will be found
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: in the show notes of this podcast. And we can't
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: wait for you to join us tomorrow for our Old
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: Do Better Tomorrow episode of the Happy Families Podcast