Latest / The Immutable Word / EP033 The Doctrinal Expression Model: Two Whys for Every What - Speak Your Faith with Clarity

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EP033 The Doctrinal Expression Model: Two Whys for Every What - Speak Your Faith with Clarity · The Immutable Word

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And baptists shy away from that intellectualism because
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they see that they think it's an enemy but the
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truth of the matter is our shallowness is because we've
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reverted to emotional preaching christians were not taught how to articulate
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and they were not given good reasons they were just told to believe it our churches
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should be training grounds for apologetics our churches should be training grounds
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for Christian intellectualism.
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Our churches should be training grounds for that stuff, but they're not.
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The failures of teaching the next generation is that we don't establish and
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ground them in the faith.
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And one of the model they came up with was called the two whys for every what.
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Hey, we're back with another episode here at The Immutable Word.
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I have Robert with me today.
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Today we're going to be talking about a particular framework for articulating
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our beliefs and how to structure it and organize our thoughts.
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And I was thinking about this. A lot of people have problems with trying to
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convey something that they know. It could be anything.
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We're going to talk about our faith today and how we can break it down.
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But have you ever come across anybody that just had a really hard time communicating
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what they believed or just even just explaining something in general because
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they can't organize their thoughts.
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They have everything they need. They know what they know, but they just have
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a hard time conveying exactly what it like what I'm doing right now.
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I'm guilty of it. But have you run across people like that?
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Yeah, I mean, I've run across people on both sides of the fence, right?
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Either believers or unbelievers alike. Like, I experienced it several times,
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you know, over the course of my Christian walk in faith.
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And I don't know how many times I've been faced with a dilemma or a challenge to my faith.
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And I knew that a doctrine was right before.
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But I struggled with how to explain it to somebody.
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It's like you're trying to organize your thoughts in a cohesive way or a particular
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order. You just can't get it out.
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I mean, aside from the emotions, aside from the fallacy stuff that we've been
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talking about, it's just, I go through that too.
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It's just like, you know, you have the knowledge, but you're not able to spit
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it out with clarity. Well, Dennis Prager of PragerU, he said this quote.
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I love this quote. He said, I'd rather have clarity than agreement. That's what he said.
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And meaning that most arguments, most conversations, you're not even really
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clear about what you're discussing.
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And so you go down these multiple rabbit holes. And again, it's because somebody
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just does not know how to communicate clearly and effectively.
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There's another statement I heard a military leader. I can't remember.
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It was an officer of some sort, Colonel, Lieutenant Colonel Major.
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I can't remember. But he said this. He said that he said efficient communications is, how did he say it?
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He said it's like using an economy of words.
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So you're saying something that's profound in the least amount of words possible,
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which kind of comes down to the bluff thing that we've talked about before, bottom line up front.
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And I'll tell you really two reasons why people don't do it.
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Number one, I think is the most obvious, is they really don't know why they
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believe what they believe. So it's hard to explain to somebody.
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They just believe it by blind faith, right? The other one is,
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is they've never really sat down to comprehend it enough to communicate it to somebody else.
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Somebody once said that a great sign of a great teacher or, you know, a great,
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you know, a proof or attributes or characteristics of a great teacher is that
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they can take something complicated and then simplify it in their own words and teach others.
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I think it was C.S. Lewis that said something like that. He says, if you can't.
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Rephrase a complicated thought or principle in uneducated words,
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he said, you didn't really understand it in the first place.
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So that's what it boils down to. The reason why we have, we struggle with articulation
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is because we haven't actually sat down and thought through it.
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Yeah, that reminds me. We're both in tech and in our earlier days,
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you know, we were technicians and engineers, and we had to understand at a very technical level.
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And part of it was drawing things like networks and memorizing all the network
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components and how they talk to each other.
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And then a lot of times you were then tasked with training others,
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other techs, other engineers, to understand networks.
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But you had to break it down. Right.
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And I know that forced me to break it down into the most simplest terms.
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And I loved drawing on the whiteboard because that's like a perfect way to do
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it and show pictures of things. I like pictures.
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And if somebody's trying to explain something to me, I usually try to tell them
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like, look, tell me like I'm three years old because you want to grasp on as
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quickly as you can to the concept that they're trying to teach you. Right.
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So if somebody can break it down that way, that means they have a fundamental
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understanding of something that's complicated. So that is very true.
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Yeah, somebody once said that the best way to learn a subject is to teach it.
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And because if you, because in order to teach it, you got to put it in words
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that not only you understand, but to the point where your students or your audience understands it.
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There's a, and you know, this is, this gets a little bit deeper into comprehension,
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learning comprehension, but there's a taxonomy, which is just means structure,
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but it's called Bloom's taxonomy.
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And you learn from Bloom's taxonomy that the most basic, basic,
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basic level of understanding is repetition.
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You just repeat data and facts. That's it.
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And then as you get, as you move up that taxonomy, it's a pyramid that,
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you know, that you eventually get to repetition to where now you can kind of
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articulate it in your own words.
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And then you get to the point where now you can take complex ideas and principles
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as part of whatever that knowledge structure is, and you can simplify it.
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And then you get to the point where now you are contributing to that particular knowledge base.
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You're coming up with innovation and
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ideas new information right but it has to
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do it so he so he levels that in
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bloom's taxonomy he shows that that shows a mastery of comprehension that's
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how that's the levels of learning and unfortunately most people most americans
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because they're just entertained the only level to ever get to is repetition
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they know their phone number they know their birth dates.
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They know how to get to and from work through muscle memory,
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driving. You know what I mean? That's the level of comprehension they'll get to.
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They'll never get to the point where they get to the creative stage where they're
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literally innovating and creating and contributing to philosophies and ideas
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and deeper meaning of thought.
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That's just not the way we are, you know? And so there's, and you know,
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we've talked about it before when we are talking about fallacies,
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but one of the reasons for apologetics.
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You know, the ability to be able to defend your faith and contend for the faith,
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one of the reasons why we're so weak at it, especially Baptists.
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Baptists are terrible at this. I'm embarrassed to say that a lot of our Protestant
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brethren on the Reformed side, Calvinists and whatnot, tend to be more intellectual than Baptists.
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And Baptists shy away from that intellectualism because they see that,
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they think it's an enemy.
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But the truth of the matter is our shallowness is because we've reverted to
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emotional preaching instead of intellectual preaching.
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You know, you cannot love God with your mind if you don't think intellectually. Anyway.
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All that, to me, is the fruit of not being able to articulate what you believe.
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But there was a, you know, if you take Protestant catechisms,
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and catechism, you know, there's a negative connotation to it because the Catholics
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have used it, right? But Protestants also have their own catechism.
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And all catechism simply means is teaching.
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That's it. It's just teaching. It's a baptism. Yeah.
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And what they did in Protestant catechisms is they would establish when kids
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were young, I mean, you're talking about three, four, five years old on up.
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Stuff like the Baptist distinctives and things like that. Yeah,
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you would take, like, say, Statement of Fates.
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And so they would be like, for example, one of the catechisms is,
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what is the purpose of man? And the purpose of man is to worship and love his
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God. And they would memorize that and they would associate a verse with it.
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Romans 4.12, for example, for thy pleasure we were and are created,
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right? Or something like that.
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So they would memorize a statement. They would ask a question.
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That's what the catechism was. What is the purpose of man?
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Or what is the sole purpose of man? the sole purpose of, and they would rephrase
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the question and then answer it. What is the purpose of man?
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The sole purpose of man is to glorify and to worship his God.
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So it was just, they would drill that into the children.
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So immediately, anytime that child was ever questioned or challenged for their
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faith, they would immediately draw back on the catechisms they learned. That's a memory.
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Matter of fact, there was a missionary to the New Hebrides islands.
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He was a Scottish missionary.
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It's going to bug me that I don't...
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Oh, New Hebrides. It's like crying at the tip of my tongue. It's yeah.
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He's a Scottish missionary. He went to the New Hebrides Islands and his dad
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was a minister or he was, I think he was an elder or a deacon or something like that. John Patton.
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Patton. Patton. Okay. John Patton or Payton. Sometimes people say it,
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but John Patton, and this was in the 1800s and John Payton, he grew up in Scotland
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before he went to the New Hebrides.
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Now, the New Hebrides Islands was completely peopled by cannibals.
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Two missionaries attempted to try to reach the New Hebrides prior to John Payton
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landing on the island, and as soon as they hit the beaches, they were killed and eaten.
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He landed there and ended up spending over 40 years in the New Hebrides Islands
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and the chain of islands in that area, South Pacific Islands.
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He ended up converting nearly almost every cannibal to Christianity over 40 years.
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He buried most of his kids, his wife there.
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Matter of fact, he had to guard his wife's grave so that they wouldn't dig it up and eat her body. Wow.
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Well, anyway, somebody had asked John Payton one time, how did you make it?
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How did you survive 40 years in a cannibalistic society of heathens and pagans?
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How did you do it? And you know what he said?
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He says it's two things. Number one was the memory of my father,
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because his father had a great influence on his life.
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His father was phenomenal prayer warrior.
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He would hear his father. Matter of fact, he said that one time a harlot in
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their town, a famous harlot, very well-known harlot, ended up getting saved
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overhearing John Payton's father praying in his prayer closet.
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She was next to the window and she was hiding or trying to get shelter from
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the weather, and she overheard him praying.
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And just his prayers alone, she got under conviction and ended up getting saved.
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That was the kind of prayer life that his father had. Then secondly,
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he said, was the catechism I was taught.
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Every time I was challenged by the pagan, heathen worldview,
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I would immediately fall back on my catechism that structured my faith and reminded
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me why I believe what I believed.
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That's the importance. That's the practical aspect of it. And Baptists have missed that.
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You try to talk to the average Baptist and say, hey, why do you believe,
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why do you go to a Baptist church?
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Man, nine times out of ten, they have no clue. My parents, my grandma.
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I've just, I've always been, or these people are really nice or they have great
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singing here and people cannot articulate.
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Like if, if, if you had to sit and let's just say you were in front of a court
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and you're in front of a judge and you have a jury sit in the jury box and you're
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in front of this big audience in the court.
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And they said, okay, David, Sue, you're sitting in the box or you're a lawyer.
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You need to make a legal, logical argument for why you're a Baptist. What would you do?
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What would you fall back on? What would you rely on? What would you appeal to?
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Christian performance. But you see what I'm saying? Yeah, I know.
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I mean, it's easy to be sarcastic about it because it's a joke.
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Because I'll be honest with you, most Baptist, most Bible-believing Baptists
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do not know how to articulate why they believe.
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I listened to, and it was a short. It was a YouTube short. I heard it the other day.
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And it's a podcast. I'm not going to name the podcast because I actually like
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the podcast. It's actually a really good Bible-believing podcast.
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But it was, again, it was a snippet of a conversation. So it's hard.
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I'm not going to make a hasty generalization, you know, and take a small amount
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of data and make a judgment.
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But what he said in that snippet actually mirrors what a lot of believers say.
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So, and the title of it was, you know, why do you believe the King James Bible is the Word of God?
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And you know what he said in the little, whatever, minute and a half short?
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He goes, because the Holy Spirit told me in my heart that this was the Word of God.
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Now, I understand the conviction behind that, and there's nothing wrong with
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that conviction, but that short little, you know, spurt, because he started
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kind of almost preaching a little bit, right?
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He didn't provide any evidence. There was no logical premise.
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Appeal to feeling or appeal to emotion.
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Right. I mean, it was a circular argument begging the question because he really
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didn't provide any evidence for it. He just made a claim.
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And of course he was appealing to pity, which is, man, I just feel this in my
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heart, You know, and listen, there's no, we talked about it before about fact, feeling, faith, right?
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Or fact, faith, feeling.
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The feeling is always the last part.
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I have strong confidence and peace whenever I read my Bible and knowing that's
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the absolute Word of God. No problem.
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I have no issues with that. But it's based off of the right facts.
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So, anyway, kind of going back to the articulation thing.
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Before we get into the model here, which we'll go into a second,
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we've talked about how our Baptist brethren have often, or they don't understand,
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or they can't articulate why they are Baptist or believe what they believe. believe.
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Whether they understand it or not, they just don't know how to articulate it.
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You gave a good example of the missionary to the New Hebrides, right?
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And very quick to answer, he had catechisms and his father, being a Roman,
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had a strong prayer life.
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And does it seem like in the last 50 years that we've sort of veered off,
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our Baptist brethren have veered off from focusing on where they stand in their
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beliefs and really being able to articulate it to more of the feeling and performance Christianity?
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At what point in time do you think that's happened in the last 50 years or so? I don't, man.
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It's hard to say, because I want to say it's probably longer than that,
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because if you were to take 40 years ago, 30, 40 years ago, we had a huge rise in fundamentalists.
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And the fundamentalist movement focused on bus ministry, soul winning,
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building big churches, big Bible colleges, and things like that.
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So their thrust was numbers.
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Their thrust was performance. Their thrust was, you know, kind of a salesman
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type religion. Get as many people in.
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Get them saved. That's all it was. It was like, get them saved,
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do a short, quick discipleship, get them grounded.
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And the main focus is get them, you know, giving to missions,
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showing up for soul winning and getting involved in the church.
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I'd say like the 50s when all the revivals were happening.
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Yeah. Well, the fundamentalism itself...
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Gave rise actually in the 30s and 40s and
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it was supposed to be a counter to the destructive
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philosophies like marxism evolutionary you know
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that you know catholicism and and these modern versions
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and bibles that were coming out so they shifted strategies to get more people
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it was the other side of the ditch okay because what it is like oh well you
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know we just got to be you know what they did is they firmed up what they believed
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it was okkingay is his name harold I think it was kind of the leader of the
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fundamentalist movement.
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And what they did is they identified fundamentals that they all agreed on.
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We agree that Jesus was God. We believe that the Bible is the word of God.
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It's the final word of God, you know, so forth. So it's salvation by grace through faith.
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They would agree on certain fundamentals and emphasize that.
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Everything else was just artificial,
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it was artifacts because— Became less important or less emphasized.
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It wasn't important because the thing is, you know, you had to preach till you're
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blue in the face to convince people versus getting people to think through their faith.
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Critically think about why they believe what they believe. There was no critical thinking.
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There was no logical argumentation. So, in their minds, they wanted to remove
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the barriers of entry to Christianity.
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Yeah, yeah. Well, they saw intellectualism as the enemy of the faith.
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They saw it as a dichotomy. So it's like a, this was the separation of faith and reason.
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That's the dichotomy. Okay, that's when it happened. You cannot be a,
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you can't love God and be an intellectual.
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You see what I'm saying? So that movement, that's what really was born out of the 50s, 60s, 70s.
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And then, of course, in the 90s, they perfected it. And now we're at a point
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in the 2000s where those IFB movements, people hated them because it was all about performance.
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It was all about how you dress. Basically, you're right with God if you dress right.
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You give to missions. You tithe. You show up for soul winning.
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Now you're right with God. And this created what we have today,
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which is class Christianity or compartmentalized Christianity.
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You're either in or you're out.
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Well, and the point is this, when it comes to what we're talking about tonight,
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is the fact that Christians were not taught how to articulate,
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and they were not given good reasons.
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They were just told to believe it. If you don't believe that KJ's Bible is the
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word of God, then you're full of the devil. That's what it was.
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If you're a Baptist church, you ought to be in a good, soul-winning,
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fundamental, independent, Bible-believing Baptist church. Why?
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Because we're right and they're wrong. You know what I mean?
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That's it. There's no good reasons.
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There's no logical arguments. There's no premises that build towards a proposition
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or a conclusion or an affirmation of what we're trying to believe.
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Like when somebody says, hey,
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why do you believe the word of God is preserved in the King James Bible?
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Well, let me walk through my good reasons.
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And here's the thing, because people aren't trained that way,
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they're not going to articulate their faith that way. Number two,
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because they do not have good reasons for their faith, they're not going to articulate it that way.
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So that's the problem is they've never been trained that way.
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Our churches should be training grounds for apologetics.
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Our churches should be training grounds for Christian intellectualism.
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Our churches should be training grounds for that stuff, but they're not.
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So we've had a departure, let's say I said 50, it's really 100,
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because this is, I think this was repetitive.
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This was drilled into our children in the 1800s.
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And then that's when, late 1800s when evolution came along and the whole modern
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thinking, German rationalism and all that.
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You know what all people have to do today, honestly, pick up a book written
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by a Baptist in the 17-1800s.
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Read it.
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Read their arguments. Maybe we'll provide some resources as an example.
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So what we're really doing here today, this is a little bit of a history list
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of why we're even here talking about this, is because in the last hundred years,
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we've departed from where we came from, where we want to come back to again.
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And, and so this is, we're going to be talking.
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So let's, before, before we get into, and, and the model is simple.
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That's why, but I'm going to say this.
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Part of the reason for the model is that we want to make sure we are clear on
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why we believe what we believe.
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So when somebody hears it, there's no ambiguity, there's no confusion,
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there's no mischaracterization, right?
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They know exactly what we're arguing for. That way you know exactly what to
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defend and you would know exactly you know how to how to resolve their objections
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when you hear them You don't go off into irrelevance.
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You don't go off onto red herrings and rabbit trails the one of the one of the
22:07
most important effective methods of debate or discussion or argumentation or
22:13
dialogue is to make sure that you stick to the point.
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And if you don't know how to articulate your faith in the first place,
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you'll never make a point. You need to go back and study. Yep. Yeah.
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All right. So, today we're talking about the doctrinal expression model,
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the model that you've been alluding to.
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Yep. A great way to structure your beliefs, your thoughts, and be able to convey
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it in a clearer way. And there's three parts to it.
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I'll let you explain it. Yeah. What is it?
22:41
Why is it true? It doesn't matter. Yeah. Let me get to this point.
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Number one is, I didn't make up this model originally.
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I've built upon it. So I read a book, you know, that I'd like for us to do an
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evaluation of at some point, but it's called So the Next Generation May Know by two apologists.
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One is Josh McDowell, and another one is Brother Wallace.
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Book here, I think. Yeah, Brother Wallace is the one that— Jay Warner Wallace.
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Paulus is, you know, he's an ex-cold case detective, and both of them are apologists.
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They train in apologetics, but they were youth ministers at one point.
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And they said one of the failures of teaching the next generation is that we
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don't establish and ground them in the faith.
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And one of the things that they would, the model they came up with was called
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the two whys for every what.
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And they said no matter what the topic is It can be, you know,
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it can be religion It can be the cult, paganism It can be doctrines like the
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deity of Christ The blood of Christ, eternal security,
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heaven or hell That you would always express those beliefs Using the what and
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the two whys And what it is simply is this Is for every what,
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that's the doctrine That's the claim, that's the assertion that's the conclusion
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that you're trying to prove, you have two whys.
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The first why is, why is it true?
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That's where you provide the evidence for the what.
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So if you say, I believe Jesus Christ is God, okay, why is that true?
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And then you show Jesus Christ received worship, Jesus Christ claimed to be
24:24
equal with the Father, Jesus Christ exhibited divine.
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Immutable attributes, right, that are incommunicable, meaning that man can't
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just picked them up, right? He was eternal. He was omniscient.
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Jesus Christ raised himself from the dead, so forth and so on, right?
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Those are the things that show why it's true.
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Okay, then the second why is why does it matter? That's where you show what
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is the implication if I reject this?
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What is the consequence if I reject this what that Jesus Christ is God?
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Well, if you reject it, then what happens is salvation, the doctrine of salvation
25:04
falls apart because if Jesus Christ wasn't God, he didn't have God's blood and
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his blood that was shed could not save you and I and we're on our way to hell.
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So what they did is they took the two whys for every what, and they basically
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said, look, if every Bible teacher, every preacher,
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every, you know, institute professor would adopt that model,
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two whys for every what, they would be able to give a fully balanced articulation
25:32
of whatever doctrines we believe.
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And he said this, he said, and this is what they said, both Wallace and McDowell.
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They said, look, when you teach your kids the what that we believe, you're clarifying.
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You're giving them the bottom line up front. You're giving them the conclusion.
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This is what we believe, period.
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That's the 30-second response. okay?
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When you show them why it's true, you're grounding them in scriptural evidence why it's true.
26:03
Then some kids will get that. Some kids say, yeah, you know what?
26:07
I believe Jesus Christ is God.
26:09
But the last part, the why it matters, is keeps them in the faith,
26:14
keeps them in church, and keeps them motivated, and gives them a reason why
26:20
they should defend the truths of the Word of God against the pagan religions
26:26
and the false biblical worldviews.
26:28
That's what they showed. It's a balanced way.
26:31
So what I did is just built my doctrinal expression.
26:36
I call it doctrinal expression. Same anatomy with the what's and the two why's.
26:40
And for those who are familiar with bluff, I really like bluff because it's
26:44
always kept me on track. It's the same thing.
26:47
You're stating the thing bottom line right up front. It's an elevator pitch.
26:51
Right. Hey, look, this is what I believe.
26:53
This is why I believe it. This is why it's important.
26:56
And the why it's true is if you have, let's just say, give me a scenario.
27:01
You're in an elevator. Somebody says, oh, wow, you know, you go to a Baptist
27:05
church. Why are you a Baptist?
27:07
Okay. The assertion or the conclusion is, I would say my 30 second response
27:12
is, well, because the Baptist church is the closest thing to the model of the
27:16
New Testament church in the Bible.
27:18
Okay, that's a big claim. I just gave him bottom line up front.
27:22
But let's just say his next question is, why do you think that's true?
27:28
That's the why it is true. That's the second part of that, the doctrinal expression
27:33
model, right? The first why.
27:35
That's where I provide the evidence for it.
27:37
There's a longer conversation. Maybe we go sit down and have coffee and I'll go.
27:41
Now, what I did is I divided the why it's true into two subparts, okay?
27:48
And that is, what is the nature of biblical evidence?
27:52
It's two subparts. Number one, it's explicit passages of Scripture, okay?
27:59
There's explicit evidence in Scripture, meaning the Bible says,
28:02
you know, let's just say Jesus Christ is God.
28:04
That's what we're arguing for, okay? The Bible says in John 1,
28:08
1, in the beginning was the Word, Word was with God, and the Word was God.
28:12
The Bible says in 2 Timothy 3.16, or 1 Timothy 3.16, and, you know,
28:18
the great ministry, the mystery is God manifest in the flesh, and so forth and so on.
28:23
The Bible says that Jesus Christ is God, 1 John 5.7.
28:27
Those are explicit passages, okay?
28:30
That's the first part. That's the first part of the evidence you show.
28:33
Then the second part is implicit proof or evidence.
28:38
Implicit just means there's patterns in the Bible.
28:41
There's a preponderance of scriptures that lead us to a biblical conclusion.
28:47
For example, Jesus received worship. He never stopped anybody from worshiping him.
28:52
Jesus forgave sins when the Pharisees knew that only God could forgive sins.
28:57
Jesus Christ claimed to be able to lay down his life and to take it back up again, right?
29:03
Jesus said things like, before Abraham was, I am.
29:07
Because this is the reason why the explicit and the implicit evidence is so
29:12
important is because it's a holistic, balanced way to prove why something's true.
29:17
Muslims will come to you and say, well, show me in the Bible where Jesus said, I am God.
29:22
Right? And it's an argument from silence. Well, God, he never said it,
29:26
therefore it must not be true. No, no.
29:28
The word Trinity isn't the Bible, but it's taught implicitly through the Bible.
29:32
The word rapture is not in the Bible, but it's implicit all through scripture. You see what I mean?
29:38
Can you give us a secular example of this? What's that?
29:42
About the implicitness of proving something that's true.
29:47
You don't have to specifically say it, but maybe it's— That's what the patterns
29:51
are in the Bible. We say pattern.
29:53
Is there a pattern that you can find? Are there— Is it consistent?
29:58
Right. Well, it's consistent. It'll never contradict itself.
30:01
But implicit means implied.
30:04
Right. Like if you told your, let me think, your wife tells you to go to the
30:09
store and, you know, she says, man, I'd love to eat cereal, but you know there's no milk.
30:15
So there's an implied ask, can you go get milk? Because you usually eat it.
30:19
She didn't explicitly say it, right?
30:21
But that's what implied means. It means, that's what implicit means.
30:25
It's something is implied. It is not explicitly stated.
30:28
But it's all part of the body of evidence. evidence yeah
30:31
when we say evidence again there's two types of
30:34
evidence it's the nature of evidence in the bible is either
30:37
explicit or implicit it is either by
30:41
precept a thou shalt not or
30:44
it is a implication it is a principle which is principles we covered principles
30:50
have a much broader application okay so that's why you know explicit and implicit
30:57
evidence in your bible is a balanced way to prove something is true.
31:02
Okay? So, the Bible is not, we don't believe in solo scriptura.
31:08
We believe in sola scriptura. What's the difference?
31:12
Solo means all truth is found in the Bible.
31:16
Every single truth, the fact that all the ingredients of pizza is found in the Bible.
31:20
No, that's not what we believe. We believe that the fundamental truths of the
31:26
nature of the universe is in the
31:28
Word of God, but they're not going to be explicitly stated all the time.
31:33
You're going to find implicit principles found throughout the Bible, okay?
31:39
So when we talk about the proof, it's always going to be explicit.
31:42
Cite the verse, state the doctrine directly. What is the verse?
31:47
Like the preservation of God, Psalm 12, 6, and 7 says, the words of the Lord
31:51
are pure words as silver tried in first earth, you know, seven times so forth.
31:55
And he says, thou shalt keep them, thou shalt preserve them from the,
31:59
that's an explicit statement.
32:01
Well, what are the implicit statements about preservation?
32:05
Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words not pass away.
32:07
He doesn't say that he's going to preserve them in that, but it's implied that
32:12
the Bible is going to be around after the heaven and earth are gone.
32:16
You see what I'm saying? So implication, Anyway, so when you when you're trying
32:20
to prove something is true, you're proving it through explicit proof or implicit proof. OK, both.
32:27
Yeah. So that's why that's a good way to articulate it.
32:31
And, you know, I don't want to try to get, you know, we're moving away from
32:35
this articulation model because it is a very simple model. But the point of it is this.
32:41
Whenever you claim the what, it's your proposition. It's right up front what
32:45
it is you believe. I believe Jesus Christ is God.
32:47
Okay. Then the next step is the why is it true?
32:51
I'm going to show you both explicit statements in scripture,
32:54
and I'm going to show you implicit principles and proves in Scripture that Jesus is God.
33:01
That's what it is. And then the implication of if you—and this is what we call
33:08
the logical necessity, why it matters.
33:10
Why does it matter that Jesus Christ is God?
33:14
And this is why it's important, because if you don't express the why it matters,
33:20
then somebody may not think it's important.
33:23
Okay, great. You think Jesus is God, but not everybody, you know,
33:27
I never saw Paul state Jesus Christ was God. So how do you know he saved?
33:32
He never, because again, if Jesus Christ is not God, he did not have a,
33:39
he didn't keep the law perfectly.
33:41
He didn't satisfy the wrath of God and his blood, if it was human blood, couldn't save a flea.
33:47
That's why it matters. So that's why you got to understand if you're going to
33:50
tell somebody what you believe, number one, be able to tell them what you believe
33:55
right at the top of your head.
33:56
Number two, be able to prove it implicitly and explicitly.
33:59
Then number three, explain to them why it matters. What happens if that doctrine is not true?
34:06
That's it. That's as simple as it gets.
34:10
Yeah. So three parts, the what, why is it true, why it matters. Remember that?
34:15
Start with the bottom line up front that clarifies, and you're very specific
34:20
in what it is that you're claiming.
34:22
Right. And then you just back it up. You know your stuff. You're going to be
34:25
able to cite your reasons behind it and why it matters, the impact.
34:31
Yep. All right, so let's move into the primer on logical argument structure.
34:35
I want to bring us into that one.
34:37
Yeah, I mean, when it comes to logical argumentation, when you learn,
34:42
this is important like in apologetics, is how to construct a logical argument.
34:47
We're not talking about arguing like yelling at people.
34:50
There's a difference. Logical arguments is a logical form or structure where
34:56
you're presenting a case.
34:57
You're presenting what's called your premises, which are your premises are your
35:02
supporting evidence that leads to a conclusion, okay?
35:07
So, you know, a real simple logical argument is this, all men are mortal.
35:12
That's premise number one.
35:14
Number two, Socrates is a man, okay?
35:17
Then the conclusion is, therefore, Socrates is mortal.
35:21
The reason, and that's called a syllogism, by the way, where you have a premise,
35:24
premise, conclusion. So premise one, all men are mortal.
35:28
You have to ask yourself, is that true? Well, yeah, that's true.
35:32
That's deductively true, meaning that all men are mortal.
35:36
Socrates is a man. He wasn't an angel. He wasn't a god. He was man.
35:41
Therefore, he was mortal. Well, we know that to be true.
35:45
So that's called a deductive argument, meaning that if the premise is true,
35:50
then the conclusion will always be true. That's a deductive argument.
35:55
So the argument is valid because the conclusion logically follows the premises.
36:03
Meaning all men are mortal. Yes, all men are mortal.
36:06
Socrates is a man. Yes, he was a man. Therefore, Socrates is mortal.
36:10
There's no disconjunction in that argument. It makes sense, and it makes sense
36:16
that that conclusion works. That's what's called a valid argument.
36:20
But it's sound because both of the premises are true.
36:25
This is, you know, it gets deep into this part, but it's actually important
36:29
to understand logical argumentation structure because most people don't give an argument.
36:34
If you don't provide an argument, let's just say you just give a claim.
36:38
Say the last part socrates is mortal and you
36:41
just throw that out the problem is and a
36:44
conclusion without a premise is literally
36:47
an opinion you haven't provided any proof yeah anything with no evidence any
36:53
any proof is that's all it is that's it and and if all you do is give a premise
36:58
and you don't provide a conclusion then it's pointless it's just a set of facts okay all men are mortal,
37:06
Socrates is a man, great, what's your point?
37:08
You didn't make an argument. And the reason why that's important to understand
37:12
is it is important for us as believers, and we never even went into this,
37:17
but on the outset, there's two primary verses that we base this conversation on.
37:23
Isaiah chapter 41 and verse 21, God said this, produce your cause,
37:28
that's going to be your argument, produce it.
37:31
Say it to the Lord, bring forth your strong reasons, say it to the king of Jacob.
37:37
So he says, produce your conclusion, but you got to bring forth your premises,
37:41
your supporting points.
37:43
Don't just make a statement. Don't give me a cause without a reason for the cause.
37:49
And then 1 Peter 3.15, which is the verse that we build the whole structure of apologetics on,
37:56
it's the Bible says, but sanctify the Lord God in your hearts and be ready always to give an answer.
38:04
That's an obligation. Be ready always.
38:07
So whenever you feel like it, no, always.
38:10
To every man. You mean to the people that want to hear?
38:14
No, no, to every man that asks you a reason of the hope, not the hope,
38:20
the reason behind the hope.
38:23
Yes, I know you believe Jesus Christ is God, but why do you believe Jesus Christ is God?
38:27
Yes, I know you go to, you believe it's right to go to a Baptist church,
38:31
but why do you go to a Baptist church?
38:33
Yes, I know you believe that it's just faith without works to get saved,
38:38
but why do you believe that's true?
38:39
I know you believe you can't lose your salvation, but why do you believe? You see the difference?
38:44
Give a reason, you have to, they ask you the reason of the hope with meekness
38:50
and fear, and that's the behavior and attitude we should have.
38:53
So that's, this doctrinal expression model actually obeys those two verses.
39:01
You are not obeying those two verses is that all you do is give a conclusion
39:06
without a premise. Then it's just an opinion.
39:08
You're not obeying those verses if all you're doing is giving a premise with
39:11
no conclusion. You're not making a point.
39:13
You're not giving a reason for the hope. You're just giving them the hope.
39:17
So there's a problem. That's why the logical argument, you know,
39:20
the logical argument model is so important.
39:23
But if you stick with the two why's for every what, you're actually complimenting
39:29
that because the what is your conclusion, okay?
39:33
The why is it true is your primary premise. That's your main premise. Why is this true?
39:40
Why does it matter is your secondary supporting premise because now what you're
39:46
doing is showing there's an implication to this argument.
39:49
Why does this argument even matter?
39:52
Again, and let me give you a practical example. There was a video of an interaction
39:57
between, you know, some transgenderists and this biology teacher.
40:02
He was a fifth grade biology teacher, right?
40:04
And they kept telling them that gender is fluid.
40:08
That's what they kept saying. Well, gender is fluid. Gender is fluid.
40:12
And his biology teacher, he says, you're not making an argument.
40:15
You're just making a claim.
40:17
He goes, what's your argument? You're not providing any proof.
40:20
You just keep saying gender is fluid.
40:23
We get caught up in those conversations. Like say, for example,
40:26
you're knocking on a door and he says, hey, Jesus is the answer.
40:30
Okay, great. I'll talk to you later. What's your point?
40:34
You're not making an argument. You're just making a claim. Well,
40:36
you know, it's just right to believe on Jesus. Okay, you're not providing any supporting evidence.
40:42
Or you could say, look, Jesus received worship.
40:46
And Jesus, you know, he fed the hungry and he clothed the naked.
40:52
And he gave, you know, he gave places, the homeless places to rest.
40:57
Okay, great. What's your point? You can make statements without a conclusion.
41:03
Or you can give a conclusion without a premises and you're not providing a good
41:09
logical reason for somebody to believe what you believe to be true.
41:15
If you don't use the doctrinal expression model or you don't use a logical argument
41:20
model in some form or fashion, then all you're doing is giving people your opinion
41:25
or you're giving them a bunch of useless facts. That's it.
41:28
That's why it's so important to learn how to explain these things.
41:33
If you're a Bible teacher and you teach a bunch of kids, don't just,
41:38
you know, show kids a bunch of little pictures and stuff like that.
41:41
That's what the catechisms are so, that's the strength of the Protestant catechisms,
41:46
is they would state up front what the belief is, right?
41:52
But they would ask it in question form. They would answer the question and they
41:57
would provide a verse of scripture as the supporting evidence.
42:00
And that's what solidified the belief, their faith, that doctrinal belief in the child's mind.
42:07
Let's look through some bad examples, because I think if you articulate some
42:11
of these bad examples, you'll see why there's a problem with Christians today
42:16
that don't know how to articulate their faith.
42:18
Would you also say, too, that if they start training themselves to articulate
42:25
their faith using this model, thinking logically, this will also keep them on
42:29
track from committing fallacies, and we've been covering that. I hope so.
42:33
That's the whole point of it. Here's an illogical argument.
42:37
If your premises are not sound, what was the definition of a sound premises?
42:45
It's because the premise is true, right?
42:48
If your premise is not true, guess what? There's a fallacy.
42:52
That's it. If your premises is not true, you've committed a fallacy.
42:56
So if you're missing anything in this anatomy, you're committing some sort of
43:00
fallacy for just throwing it. Yeah.
43:02
So I want to be clear here because there's a friend of mine that likes to throw
43:06
the word fallacy out almost every single time because something doesn't make sense to him.
43:11
He says, and he'll send me a meme all the time and say, hey,
43:13
is this fallacious thinking?
43:15
I'm like, number one, it's just a statement. There's no argument here.
43:19
Unless there's a practical application behind the statement,
43:22
I can't tell you whether it's fallacious.
43:24
So he's committing a fallacy. Fallacy, fallacy.
43:28
But that's the point is, is, you know, I don't want to just throw the word fallacy
43:32
out there just for the sake of throwing the word fallacy.
43:35
When we say there is an error in the argument, either the premise is not sound
43:41
or the conclusion is not valid. It does not follow.
43:45
It's because it's possible you're committing a fallacy somewhere.
43:49
Or you're at greater risk of creating a fallacy. Yeah, I mean,
43:52
again, if it doesn't follow, it could be a formal fallacy.
43:58
A formal fallacy is the structure of the argument is incorrect.
44:01
There's post-ad hoc, there's a propter ergo hoc,
44:05
there's different types of structures of arguments that are like,
44:10
so for example, say that you're getting the conclusion ahead of the premise
44:14
without arguing for the premise or providing evidence for the premise.
44:18
That in itself could be a fallacy of
44:21
structure anyway but that's why
44:24
you know again we're not teaching apologetics here
44:26
we're teaching a form of apologetics the doctrinal expression model is simply
44:31
just to get you to articulate in a sound way a good reason for why you believe
44:37
what you believe and yes it does prevent you from committing a logical fallacy
44:42
because you're forced to think through your argument.
44:44
You're not jumping to a conclusion or like, for example, if you don't provide
44:49
a good argument for what you believe and all you do is provide a conclusion,
44:52
then that's begging the question because that's circular reasoning.
44:56
Remember what we said circular reasoning was? I believe this is true because
44:59
it's true. Right. Well, why?
45:02
Well, just because I think it's true. Well, look at these bad examples.
45:05
I've written down a couple. Here's an argument from emotion, for example.
45:09
I just feel in my heart that God wouldn't send people to hell.
45:12
A loving God would never do that.
45:16
Well, again, that's an argument from emotion. That's a fallacy.
45:20
What's the point here? The point is, is they're providing a conclusion,
45:24
but no premise, no evidence, nothing that will support that statement. It's just an opinion.
45:32
So why is it flawed? The argument is based entirely on feelings and subjective
45:36
ideas about love rather than biblical revelation. What is the biblical revelation
45:43
supposed to be? Your biblical evidence.
45:45
It makes human emotion the authority instead of scriptures. It's very subjective, right? Right.
45:51
Ignores biblical texts and teaches, you know, right, that teach back,
45:55
especially what the doctrine of hell is.
45:56
Most people don't understand what the purpose of hell was, why somebody would go to hell.
46:02
It's not because God is a bad God. It's because it is a necessary conclusion
46:08
to a life that has rejected the revelation and truth of God.
46:13
It basically tells you what you believe, but it doesn't offer a valid why.
46:18
So that's the problem with that statement. It's just an opinion.
46:23
You're not using the doctrinal expression why you don't believe a loving God
46:27
would send people to hell.
46:28
And here's the thing. If somebody were to respond to me to that,
46:31
I just told my heart God wouldn't send people to hell.
46:34
I might respond like, well, great, you're entitled to your opinion.
46:37
But why do you think that's true?
46:39
When you say, why do you think that's true? I'm forcing them to give me the
46:44
evidence why they think it's true.
46:46
And then I might ask to further challenge their paradigm and worldview.
46:52
Why does that matter? What you're saying, why does it matter?
46:56
If that's the case, that a loving God wouldn't send people to hell,
47:00
who cares? Why does that matter?
47:01
You know what I'm forcing them to do is I'm forcing them to justify their response.
47:06
Another one is argument. So that's an argument from emotion that's very subjective,
47:10
right? Well, here's an argument from tradition. This is what I'll hear.
47:13
Both, matter of fact, all of these that I'm citing here, I've heard from Bible
47:17
Believing Baptists in my own church.
47:20
The argument from tradition. Our church is always taught that you get baptized to be saved.
47:25
Now, I haven't heard this one in our church. Well, actually, I might have.
47:29
But our church is always taught that you get baptized to be saved.
47:32
My parents and grandparents believed it. So it must be true.
47:35
Well, what's the flaw in this argument?
47:38
It appeals to tradition as the authority, right?
47:42
It's not, again, you're not substantiating that belief with scriptural evidence.
47:49
The why it is true is completely ignored.
47:54
And, of course, traditions, they can be valuable and they can be important,
47:59
but they're not infallible.
48:02
This gives you the real reasons behind a belief. I mean, it's the same thing
48:05
about why you're a Baptist, why you believe the King James Bible is a word of
48:09
God, because my grandma always used it.
48:13
Again, yeah. It's all tradition. Yeah, it's appealed to faulty authority,
48:17
which is tradition in this case, right?
48:19
Yeah. And again, this approach, same thing as the other one,
48:22
needs direct scriptural proof.
48:25
You have to say, what is the reasons behind this?
48:30
You can't just say that you need to be baptized to be saved.
48:33
You need to provide the evidence.
48:36
And again, you can't just say, well, it's true because it's always been true.
48:40
Again, that's kind of a circular reasoning argument.
48:42
Then you have the argument from personal preference. I don't believe the King
48:47
James, I don't like the King James Bible because the language is too old and too hard to understand.
48:51
I prefer versions easier to read, so that's one that's right for me.
48:54
And of course, this is personal comfort becomes the preference in the final authority, right?
48:59
The argument isn't evidenced, you know, of a translation's accuracy or even
49:04
doctrinal faithfulness, right?
49:05
It's the readability and the modern appeal, that's just an assumption,
49:09
but it's not argued for. They haven't made an argument for this.
49:14
It's just, you know, Again, it's a consumer-based choice rather than a theological
49:18
conviction that's based off of Scripture.
49:22
Principles, precept and principles, right? If you cannot back it up with Scripture,
49:26
then I don't have a good reason to believe what you're saying is true.
49:29
It's basically, again, just your opinion, right?
49:33
Then, of course, you have the argument for an assertion, and this is circular reasoning.
49:38
Here's the way it goes. Of course, there's a God. The world is just too complex
49:42
to just have happened that way. It's just obvious.
49:45
If you don't believe in God, you're an idiot.
49:48
And some people even like to throw out Psalm, you know, 14, one or Psalm 50,
49:52
you know, where they go, oh, well, you know, the fool said in his heart, there is no God.
49:57
And that's all great and fine and dandy. And again, there's an old statement,
50:01
maybe we'll do an episode on it, but the principle is never quote a verse.
50:05
And because you don't, when you just quote a verse, you're leaving out the context.
50:10
You're not providing any background behind the verse to justify,
50:14
substantiate what you're trying to believe. But in this case,
50:17
of course, there's a God.
50:18
Okay? You didn't provide any evidence, right? Even if your conclusion is correct, right?
50:25
Well, like I said, you've given a proposition, you've given the conclusion,
50:28
but it's just a restated opinion without any supporting premises or evidence.
50:35
Again, if you just give a conclusion with no premise, it's an opinion.
50:39
If you give a premise but no conclusion, it's just a set of useless facts.
50:44
That's it. If you can remember that.
50:48
Hopefully, it'll try to force you to go, man, why do I believe the King James Bible is the Word of God?
50:53
Why do I go to a Baptist church? Why do I believe in the pre-tribulation rapture?
50:59
Why do I believe that the Jews, the state of Israel today under Netanyahu,
51:04
is actually biblical Israel? Why do I believe that?
51:07
Because if you cannot back it up with biblical evidence, then again,
51:13
it's just an opinion. In this case, it's circular reasoning because they're
51:18
just saying, well, why is that true?
51:19
Of course there's a God. Well, because there is a God.
51:22
That's what you're saying. Well, how do you know there's a God?
51:25
Because he just is. I've heard that.
51:28
Well, God said it. Therefore, I believe it. I mean, look at this world.
51:33
It's beautiful, isn't it? Right. That's why.
51:37
Again, this type of reasoning, it fails to engage logically,
51:41
right? It's basically saying, look, it's true because it seems true to me.
51:46
It's a personal opinion. It is an emotional thing or it's anecdotal because,
51:53
you know, I believe it to be true because it's true for me.
51:56
The problem with that, that leads to the philosophy is, well,
52:00
your truth is just as valid as my truth is.
52:04
And that's at the end of the day, what you're saying is there is no final scriptural
52:08
authority to substantiate a belief.
52:11
And so it kind of falls back.
52:14
What is the whole point of this expression model? It's to train you to use a
52:19
simple model to be able to give
52:22
good reasons for why you believe what you believe. Here's the exercise.
52:26
Somebody comes up to you. This is the way I would say every Christian listening to us.
52:31
This is what you ought to do. Go through your statement of faith on your church website.
52:35
Go to your church website. Look at your statement of faith. And it will say,
52:38
we believe about the scriptures the following, and it'll list out whatever the statement is.
52:44
It's going to say a conclusive statement, an assertion, a proposition.
52:48
And then it may give supporting verses and evidence, right? It just may not
52:53
be articulated that way.
52:55
Use that as the basis of your articulation model. Now sit down and rewrite it this way.
53:00
What is it I believe? What is it I believe about the scriptures?
53:04
And then you can look at your statement of faith. Use that That's fine But see
53:09
if you can reduce it Into a 30 second statement.
53:12
What is it I believe about the scriptures? Well, I believe the scriptures are
53:15
the inspired revelation of God. Okay.
53:19
Now ask yourself the next question. Why do I think it's true?
53:22
Why is it true that the scriptures are the inspired?
53:26
Well, because it's self-evident and it's contained in scripture and it possesses
53:32
the attributes of God himself.
53:35
It's non-contradictory. It's immutable. It's consistent from Genesis to Revelation
53:40
because it contains prophecy.
53:43
It would have been impossible for me. You can come up with a thousand different
53:47
premises to prove why it's true.
53:51
And there's no limit to premises, by the way. You can have 20 premises if you want.
53:56
But that's the truth. Then you have to answer the last why.
54:00
Why does it matter? Why does it matter that the Bible is the inspired revelation
54:06
of God? Why does it matter?
54:07
Because if it's just another human book, why should I believe anything it says?
54:12
Why should I believe what it says about heaven or hell? Why should I believe
54:16
what it says about Jesus Christ being the way, the truth, and the life?
54:19
Why should I believe anything it says about the resurrection?
54:22
See the implications? That's why it's so healthy to go through your belief system.
54:28
I believe every Christian listening to the sound of our voice ought to go through
54:33
a list of everything they believe and try to prove it to themselves.
54:37
Number one, why is it true? And then secondly, why does it matter?
54:42
I think that's a really good exercise just in general.
54:46
If you're trying to think of a way to reinforce this model, I was just thinking
54:50
about it while you're saying, we should actually write our own statement of faith individually.
54:55
Yeah, absolutely. Church is a good start, right? You can look at different churches'
54:59
statement of faith or the church that you go to.
55:01
But you, as an individual, should write your own statement of faith.
55:06
I'm going to do one for myself. You know what I would encourage everybody to
55:09
do? Here's a really good practical exercise.
55:13
Open up the inner leaf of your Bible where it's blank and write down 10 of the
55:18
most critical things you believe.
55:20
What do you believe about heaven and hell? What do you believe about salvation?
55:23
What do you believe about eternal security? What do you believe about the Bible?
55:26
What do you believe about the Trinity?
55:28
What do you believe about why you're a Baptist? What do you believe? I mean, all that stuff.
55:33
And write it like using the what and the why it's true and the why it matters.
55:39
Use that model for everything you believe and abbreviate it as best as you can
55:46
in your inside the flap of your Bible.
55:48
So when you're sitting down with your family and you're doing devotion and your
55:53
kids say, Dad, why do we believe Jesus Christ is going to come first and we're
55:57
not going to take the mark of the beast?
56:00
And then go through and answer that question using the biblical expression model.
56:04
Because you're going to tell them what it is we believe. Be clear.
56:08
Define your terms. Make sure that the conclusion is absolutely fundamentally clear to your audience.
56:15
Then the first why is it true is you're going to now prove why it is true.
56:20
And you're going to use explicit and implicit proof as evidence.
56:25
And then you want to make sure your kids understand, if you're doing a devotion, why this matters.
56:31
If you can articulate your faith and your doctrinal beliefs using that simple
56:38
model, trust me, not only is it going to reinforce and strengthen your faith,
56:42
but it's going to reinforce and strengthen the faith of those that are listening to you.
56:45
So if anybody has any questions, let us know, email us. I was just thinking
56:49
that if anybody is interested, we can send you the show notes or share the show notes.
56:55
I think it's a great reference to anybody who's getting familiar with this model,
56:59
and you do a really great job of breaking it down. I actually have a – I can
57:03
send you – I have a supplement that I gave to my students. Oh, a handout.
57:07
Yeah, a handout for the expression model. Oh, beautiful.
57:10
Okay. Yeah, so if there's anybody that's interested, let us know.
57:13
Email us, drop us a message. If you want it, we'll send it to you.
57:16
Can we put it in the podcast description?
57:22
Yeah, we might be able to do that. Okay. Potentially.
57:24
Yeah, we'll check it. If not, like you said, email us at theimmutableword at
57:29
gmail.com or ping us on the podcast in the comment section or even in the YouTube
57:35
section if you're interested in it.
57:37
And we'll try to get back with you. Yeah, and eventually, when we do have the
57:40
website up someday, we're going to start archiving these things there where
57:45
it'll be available as resources to you as well.
57:47
So, a couple takeaways. I thought those verses that we're mentioning here,
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everything here hinged on those, on the Word of God, right?
57:55
So, Isaiah 41, 21, produce your cause, bring forth your strong reasons, right?
58:02
Saith the king of Jacob, sanctify the Lord God in your hearts and be ready always
58:06
to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is
58:11
in you with meekness and fear.
58:13
That reason of the hope, I think, is so important because I remember reading
58:17
over that passage a million times and just completely not paying attention to it.
58:22
But it said, you know, because we always say, well, the answer is Jesus. Right.
58:26
Because the answer is, you're right. You're absolutely right.
58:29
The answer is, the conclusion is correct. But what are your premises?
58:32
What's your supporting evidence to prove that's true? And then, why does it matter?
58:37
So anyway, I just think that if you force yourself to ask those questions constantly.
58:42
Trust me, you will start to challenge yourself.
58:46
Ask yourself probing questions. And I'm going to say something to those of you
58:50
that are afraid to witness.
58:51
You're afraid to get you know engage in
58:54
a conversation with your neighbor or you know
58:57
person at the store or whoever you're trying to talk
59:00
to about the faith the better you get at this biblical expression model the
59:07
more confident and the more bold you'll be in your witnessing trust me because
59:12
you will know why you believe what you believe so i mean think about this Here's
59:17
a real super practical example.
59:19
Some of you are huge sports fans and you can sit there and enumerate every sports
59:26
fact about a team or a player or play or maybe even, you know,
59:32
the procedural, you know,
59:34
details of how to play a particular game.
59:37
And you'll know that and you will argue till you are blue in the face with somebody.
59:42
You're not afraid to get in somebody's face and argue your point and try to
59:48
prove your point because you got the facts behind you.
59:51
And when you have the facts behind you, it increases your boldness and your confidence.
59:55
And I'm just telling you, if you learn how to express yourself and articulate
1:00:01
your faith using this model, you will be able to have that same type of confidence.
1:00:07
In telling others and contending for the faith and defending the faith.
1:00:11
Yeah, again, not to be used against your spouse. I've tried.
1:00:16
I was confident. I was bold. It didn't work. With all meekness in your heart,
1:00:20
you know what I mean? Yeah, there you go. That's where you got to be humble.
1:00:24
All right. All right, Robert, this was another good one. I think we'll wrap it up here.
1:00:28
Again, reach out to us if there's any questions. We'll try to share out the
1:00:31
show notes wherever or just ask us for it and we'll shoot it over to you.
1:00:36
But I appreciate you tuning in. Hopefully this was helpful to you and we'll
1:00:40
see you on the next one. Thank you.