Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / LITTLE GIRL, 7, FOUND LOCKED IN CLOSET STARVED, 1 CORN-DOG A DAY, SEARCH ON FOR LITTLE SISTER, MISSING SINCE 2017

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LITTLE GIRL, 7, FOUND LOCKED IN CLOSET STARVED, 1 CORN-DOG A DAY, SEARCH ON FOR LITTLE SISTER, MISSING SINCE 2017 · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A little girl just seven
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  Speaker 1: years old found locked in a closet, starved at best,
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  Speaker 1: getting one corn dog a day, and tonight the search
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  Speaker 1: is on for her little sister, Lassigne two thousand and seventeen.
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  Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for
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  Speaker 1: being with us. With me an all start pound to
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  Speaker 1: make sense of what we know right now. Listen to this.
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  Speaker 2: On April third, twenty twenty five, Austin Police Department responded
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  Speaker 2: to a nine to one to one call for a
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  Speaker 2: seven year old child that was found locked in a
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  Speaker 2: closet and starving. The seven year old was immediately taken
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  Speaker 2: to a local hospital for medical treatment and it's currently recovering.
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  Speaker 2: There were six other children found in the home that
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  Speaker 2: appeared physically healthy.
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  Speaker 3: Police officers at an Austin apartment find a severely malneurish
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  Speaker 3: year old girl who is barricaded in a bedroom closet.
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  Speaker 3: The child has found soiled, weighing just twenty nine pounds
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  Speaker 3: and has been confined to a three foot by two
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  Speaker 3: foot clauset space for approximately a month. Investigators find the
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  Speaker 3: child has been given one corn dog and a half
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  Speaker 3: a cup of water a day, doctors at Deell Children's
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  Speaker 3: Medical Center determined the little girl is suffering moderate to
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  Speaker 3: severe cerebral atrophy from prolonged malnutrition, damage from which she
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  Speaker 3: will never recover.
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  Speaker 1: What did that, even, Maian? How can a child survive
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  Speaker 1: day after day, week after week, month after month locked
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  Speaker 1: in a dark closet, living off nothing? Again with me
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  Speaker 1: an all star panel, But first straight out to Christina
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  Speaker 1: Ohio joining US investigative reporter Christina this child locked in
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  Speaker 1: a closet. What happened?
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  Speaker 4: Well, according to the affidavit, when police got there, When
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  Speaker 4: the caller called in for the welfare check and police
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  Speaker 4: got there, they found a seven year old little girl
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  Speaker 4: locked in a closet. It was barricaded by seventy five
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  Speaker 4: pounds of boxes. They opened that door, they found that
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  Speaker 4: child in there. She was soiled, surrounded by feces. She
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  Speaker 4: was severely malnourished. She had dark spots all over her body,
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  Speaker 4: which is a sign of severe malnourishment. They took her,
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  Speaker 4: of course, to the hospital where she weighed twenty nine pounds,
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  Speaker 4: and medical personnel say that because of the prolonged starvation
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  Speaker 4: of that little girl that she will have permanent brain damage.
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  Speaker 1: Permanent brain damage caused by starvation. Joining me, Virginia Bagbee,
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  Speaker 1: Director of Child Help, National child abuse hotline Child Help Virginia,
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  Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. Many people don't know
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  Speaker 1: that starving a child can result in permanent brain damage.
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  Speaker 1: Have you ever seen anything like it before, Virginia.
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  Speaker 5: We have definitely heard about cases like this, and they
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  Speaker 5: happen all too often.
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Kendall Crowned, Chief Medical Examiner, Terran County. That's fort worth,
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  Speaker 1: never a lack of business. He is the esteemed lecturer
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  Speaker 1: at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU and has
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  Speaker 1: just launched a hit podcast, Mayhem in the More. Doctor
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  Speaker 1: Kendle Crowns, thank you for being with us. I know
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  Speaker 1: that you heard this, but let me repeat it again.
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  Speaker 1: A seven year old little girl barricaded in a locked
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  Speaker 1: bedroom closet lot from the outside soiled. A seven year
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  Speaker 1: old weighing just twenty nine pounds, confined to a three
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  Speaker 1: by two foot closet, she is being given at most
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  Speaker 1: one corn dog and a half cup of water a day.
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  Speaker 1: She is now suffering permanent, moderate to severe cerebral atrophy
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  Speaker 1: from prolonged malnutrition. The dock states she will never recover.
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  Speaker 1: Could you interpret that please?
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  Speaker 6: Certainly? Not being given much food or water. I mean
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  Speaker 6: a corn dog and a cup of water is not
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  Speaker 6: much for a child or anybody for that matter. Her
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  Speaker 6: body is losing its depleting its muscle, depleting its stores,
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  Speaker 6: so her muscles are wasting away, her bones are starting
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  Speaker 6: to not form properly, and she's being starved. And part
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  Speaker 6: of being starve results in your cardiac muscle or your
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  Speaker 6: heart muscle mass starting to also fade away or go away,
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  Speaker 6: which reduces your heart's ability to pump your blood, which
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  Speaker 6: results in your kidney's failing and you go into kidney failure.
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  Speaker 6: You also start having gut issues as well, and this
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  Speaker 6: can all affect your brain and your brain's development, especially
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  Speaker 6: in a child. So all those factors combined will result
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  Speaker 6: in her having these issues that the doctors are describing.
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  Speaker 1: Nonder general crowns, a child of seven years old should
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  Speaker 1: weigh around seventy pounds forty five to seventy pounds, Is
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  Speaker 1: that right?
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  Speaker 6: Yes, that would be about the average pit of a
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  Speaker 6: child at seven.
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  Speaker 1: A seven year old average. Of course, they grow in
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  Speaker 1: different ways. The average is fifty one pounds for a
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  Speaker 1: seven year old child, but it ranges from forty three
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  Speaker 1: to seventy So where would you place twenty nine pounds
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  Speaker 1: in that spectrum? Twenty nine pounds if a seven year
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  Speaker 1: old can weigh up to seventy three, she's not even
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  Speaker 1: half the weight of a seven year old.
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  Speaker 6: Yeah, the weight you're describing as a severely malnourished child,
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  Speaker 6: So she's been starved for a prolonged period of time.
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  Speaker 1: How does that make a child brain damaged?
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  Speaker 6: It's from the body shutting down, the lack of food,
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  Speaker 6: the lack of loss of muscle mass, the heart muscle
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  Speaker 6: mass being lost and not circulating properly, the organs aren't
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  Speaker 6: getting enough oxy genated blood, and of course the brain's
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  Speaker 6: part of this, so the brain's not getting proper oxygenation. Also,
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  Speaker 6: the brain relies on glucose or sugars to grow and develop,
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  Speaker 6: and it's not getting that as well, So the brain
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  Speaker 6: is basically maldeveloped, not getting enough oxygen, so you get
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  Speaker 6: brain damage.
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Crowns, isn't it true that a child weighing twenty
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  Speaker 1: nine pounds typically, and I'm basing this on charts of
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  Speaker 1: statistics that I prepared, is typically a twenty two month
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  Speaker 1: old child at twenty nine pounds.
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  Speaker 6: Yes, I would be correct.
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  Speaker 1: A seven year old little girl, doctor Tyndall Crowns, that
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  Speaker 1: should weigh seventy one pounds fifty one to seventy one
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  Speaker 1: pounds weighs twenty nine pounds. With a child starving, what
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  Speaker 1: would she be enduring on the floor of that locked closet,
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Crowns.
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  Speaker 6: She would be the enduring infusion, dehydration or a very
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  Speaker 6: dry mouth or throat. It be dry, She'd have trouble swallowing,
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  Speaker 6: She'd be very tired and just not able to even move.
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  Speaker 6: And then you would add on to that the fact
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  Speaker 6: that without the food she'd start hallucinating and then eventually
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  Speaker 6: just slip into a coma and finally die.
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Jendal Crowns. Would the child lose her hair? I
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  Speaker 1: know that she's losing all muscle tone. Would she be
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  Speaker 1: losing her hair? Would her faculties or hearing her sight?
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  Speaker 1: Would that be intact? And what would her brain function
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  Speaker 1: be lying on the floor of a dark closet starving.
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  Speaker 6: So yes, hair often will fall out in individuals who
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  Speaker 6: are starved. Her brain function would be very minimal. She'd
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  Speaker 6: be confused, even possibly hallucinating. And just completely fatigued and
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  Speaker 6: not even feeling like moving.
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  Speaker 1: Is it true? Doctor General Crowns that when someone has
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  Speaker 1: been starved of prolonged period of time, is in this case,
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  Speaker 1: when you give them food they can't even eat it.
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  Speaker 6: Yes, you can have what is called if you give
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  Speaker 6: a person who's been starved, you feed them too quickly,
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  Speaker 6: you can have what is called refeeding syndrome, where they
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  Speaker 6: actually will from the food intake. It will cause so
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  Speaker 6: much of a shock to their body that they can die.
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  Speaker 1: Guys, When police show up to a home, they find
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  Speaker 1: six children and then a seventh locked in a closet
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  Speaker 1: weighing just twenty nine pounds, but ironically amazingly listen to
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  Speaker 1: the condition of the other six children.
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  Speaker 3: Six other children in the apartment, ranging in age from
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  Speaker 3: two to fourteen years old, are found to be an
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  Speaker 3: apparently good physical condition. The apartment's pantry, refrigerator in freezer
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  Speaker 3: are stocked with various food items. The oldest children were
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  Speaker 3: given strict orders to put the little girl in the
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  Speaker 3: closet because she had bladder can issues and she was
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  Speaker 3: trying to eat things she wasn't supposed to. During the investigation,
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  Speaker 3: police learn there's an eighth child, Ava Marie, who is
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  Speaker 3: not in the home with the other children.
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  Speaker 1: We've got one starved child who has permanent brain damage.
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  Speaker 1: A seven year old little girl weighing twenty nine pounds
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  Speaker 1: locked in the closet. Now I've got a missing child too.
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  Speaker 1: But to doctor angel Arnold joining me, renowned psychiatrist out
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  Speaker 1: of the Atlanta jurisdiction at ANGELA Arnold MD dot com,
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Angie, thank you for being with us. Did you
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  Speaker 1: hear what was just reported that there were six other
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  Speaker 1: children in the home seemingly healthy, and they were encouraged
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  Speaker 1: to keep the little girl locked in a closet, starving
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  Speaker 1: her because the little girl would eat things she wasn't
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  Speaker 1: supposed to eat. You know what, doctor Angie, I've heard
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  Speaker 1: every excuse in the book about why parents starve the children. Oh,
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  Speaker 1: the child ate a candy bar, I'll starve it. The
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  Speaker 1: child eats too much, I'll starve it. The child has behaved,
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  Speaker 1: I'll starve it. I mean, there are a million excuses
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  Speaker 1: I have heard as to why moms and dads starve
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  Speaker 1: the baby dead. But yet we see six other children
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  Speaker 1: seemingly healthy, And.
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  Speaker 7: This is oftentimes what we do see in cases like this, Nancy,
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  Speaker 7: So I the other children need to be taken care
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  Speaker 7: of as well as this goes on, because they have
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  Speaker 7: been suffering something called Stockholm syndrome. They want to They
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  Speaker 7: are so scared of the abuse that they see being
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  Speaker 7: heaped on this other child that they that they go
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  Speaker 7: into it with their mother literally to protect themselves. Okay,
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  Speaker 7: because Nancy, imagine how scared these other children are. They
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  Speaker 7: never know who's going to be next to be locked
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  Speaker 7: in that closet. So they're going to listen to the mama.
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  Speaker 7: They're going to do what she says. And I think
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  Speaker 7: that they could probably also psychologically sort of break off
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  Speaker 7: from from feeling towards the child that is being locked
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  Speaker 7: in the closet so that they can protect themselves. Because
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  Speaker 7: this is chaos that this family is living in. It
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  Speaker 7: is complete and utter chaos, and all of those other
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  Speaker 7: children are suffering. They may not be brain dead, brain damaged.
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  Speaker 7: Excuse me, they are not being you know, they're not
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  Speaker 7: being starved, but they are also being damaged by this
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  Speaker 7: so called mother of theirs.
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  Speaker 8: A missing child case takes a dark turn after a
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  Speaker 8: disturbing discovery inside a family home.
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  Speaker 1: It brings to mind the case of another seven year
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  Speaker 1: old child, Adrian Jones, there wise just handed down a
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  Speaker 1: multimillion dollar verdict against the state of Kentucky. Adrian Jones
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  Speaker 1: was systematically starved, forced by his mother and father to
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  Speaker 1: watch the rest of the family eight. They would put
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  Speaker 1: bars of soap in his mouth while everyone else ate
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  Speaker 1: forced him to stand outside, chin deep in a pool
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  Speaker 1: until finally the boy died. They killed the boy. Listen.
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  Speaker 3: Former bailbondsman Michael Jones is awarding custody of his son,
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  Speaker 3: Adrian Jones, and takes the boy away from his mother.
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  Speaker 3: For the next four years, Adrian is regularly starved, rudely beaten,
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  Speaker 3: tortured taste, and locked in a shower naked for months.
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  Speaker 3: Adrian's brothers and sisters do not suffer the same fate.
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  Speaker 3: Adrian is singled out by his father and stepmother. When
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  Speaker 3: the child dies, Michael Jones buys two pigs and doesn't
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  Speaker 3: feed them while the Adrian's body is left in the
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  Speaker 3: shower for two weeks. When the pigs are starving, Michael
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  Speaker 3: Jones feeds his son to the pigs. Michael and Heather
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  Speaker 3: Jones pleaded guilty to first yeary murder and are serving
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  Speaker 3: twenty five years to life.
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  Speaker 1: So in one closet, we've got the child starved and
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  Speaker 1: a missing child. And back to you, doctor Anngie Arnold,
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  Speaker 1: you said the other siblings are gonna have to be
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  Speaker 1: in treatment. You're right, because they didn't just watch their
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  Speaker 1: sister starve slowly to death. They were forced to keep
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  Speaker 1: her in the closet themselves. They're going to go the
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  Speaker 1: rest of their lives thinking they starved their sister and
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  Speaker 1: now she's got permanent brain damage. Antie, that's exactly correct, Nancy.
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  Speaker 7: These children have been abused in a different way, and
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  Speaker 7: it's all for a matter of control. It's to keep
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  Speaker 7: all of those children in control, Nancy, because you know,
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  Speaker 7: you can only imagine there's one mother all of these children.
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  Speaker 7: If somebody got old enough to decide, you know, we
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  Speaker 7: really shouldn't be treating this person them this way, they
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  Speaker 7: can possibly escape or something like this, right, But that
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  Speaker 7: mother is making sure that they are so terrified. They
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  Speaker 7: are so terrified in the home that they live in,
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  Speaker 7: and she and she feeds them so that they have
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  Speaker 7: this odd relationship where with the mother where they still
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  Speaker 7: need her, but they're scared of her, so that none
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  Speaker 7: of them will go against her to.
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  Speaker 1: Brown Blake joining US agent, professor of University Texas School
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  Speaker 1: of Law, Chief Legal officer Texas Advocacy Project, Brown, thank
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  Speaker 1: you for being with us. I've seen it many many times,
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  Speaker 1: like in Adrian Jones, like in this case, for one
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  Speaker 1: child out of the whole group is singled out and
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  Speaker 1: they're the ones that starved. That child is the one
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  Speaker 1: that's abused. I don't understand the phenomena, but I accept
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  Speaker 1: it because I've seen it over and over, even cases
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  Speaker 1: that prosecuted other children would go unscathed while the one
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  Speaker 1: child would end up dead.
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  Speaker 9: The idea that abuse is all about power and control
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  Speaker 9: really helps explain this dynamic. This person is not out
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  Speaker 9: of control. They're being very calculated and systematic in who
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  Speaker 9: they abuse and how so all of those children experienced abuse,
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  Speaker 9: just in different ways.
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  Speaker 1: Guys. Not only do we have a child starved your death,
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  Speaker 1: languishing on the floor of a locked closet, we have
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  Speaker 1: a missing child. Listen.
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  Speaker 2: During the investigation, police discovered that there was an eighth
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  Speaker 2: child who was not found inside the home. The missing
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  Speaker 2: nine year old child was identified as Ava Marie Gonzalez.
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  Speaker 2: Missing Persons detectives determined that Ava was last seen in
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  Speaker 2: December twenty seventeen, when she was two years old and
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  Speaker 2: in the custody of her mother, Virginia Marie Gonzalez.
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  Speaker 3: Learning there should be eight children in the apartment, not
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  Speaker 3: just the seven they found, police opened an investigation and
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  Speaker 3: quickly determined Ava Marie has not been seen by family
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  Speaker 3: or friends since she was two years old in twenty
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  Speaker 3: seventeen in custody of her mother, Virginia Gonzalez. Considering the
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  Speaker 3: condition of Ava's seven year old sister when she was found,
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  Speaker 3: Austin police detectives are very concerned about Ava's welfare.
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  Speaker 1: So they've got six children seemingly healthy, you've got one
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  Speaker 1: child starved locked in a closet, and now you've got
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  Speaker 1: a missing child. Joining me is a special guest. This
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  Speaker 1: is Leanne Marie, friend of the children's mother, Virginia Gonzalez. Leanne,
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  Speaker 1: thank you for being with us, Yes, ma'am, Leanne Marie.
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  Speaker 1: Tell me about Virginia Gonzalez.
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  Speaker 10: So from what I know, she was just a normal person.
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  Speaker 11: I mean, honestly, she never really had her kids with her,
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  Speaker 11: like you know, presence the only one that I seen
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  Speaker 11: with her in the past year was the oldest one,
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  Speaker 11: the fourteen year old.
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  Speaker 10: Besides that, we never knew that she had, you know,
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  Speaker 10: the little girl. We only knew of boys.
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  Speaker 11: So she was just a typical person, partying out in
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  Speaker 11: the clubs and the bars. I mean, she she was
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  Speaker 11: just she never lived like she even had nine eight
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  Speaker 11: nine kids.
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  Speaker 10: Very very you're scaring me.
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  Speaker 1: Now there's mommy, Hi mom, Yeah, but there she is.
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  Speaker 1: Party down mom. Where are your children right now? William
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Marine just said something that scared me? Okay, hold on,
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  Speaker 1: So I know that there are six children in the home,
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  Speaker 1: healthy ish, one starved in a closet, and one missing.
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  Speaker 1: That's eight. But you mentioned nine. The possibility of a
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: ninth child, yes, ma'am, very ninth child.
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  Speaker 11: Yes, So it's right now they're saying that this night child,
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  Speaker 11: he is not he does not have a social social
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  Speaker 11: security here in Texas, so he's not registered here in Texas.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, Darryl Parker, I need you and I need you
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  Speaker 1: now there's another missing child. Did you hear that? Darryl Parker,
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  Speaker 1: former Lieutenant Fannin County Sheriff's Office, former marine, former Texas
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: police officer, helped me. So we're learning right now that
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: there's a ninth child that's in the wind. Nobody knows
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: how old the child is, where it is, it doesn't
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: have a Texas Social Security number.
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  Speaker 12: Yeah, Nancy, that's pretty concerning. I know that the mom
• 18:36
  Speaker 12: has already made several statements to police that are inconsistent
• 18:41
  Speaker 12: about the child that is missing already that they already
• 18:44
  Speaker 12: know about. And it'll be interesting to see if some
• 18:48
  Speaker 12: follow up questioning can reveal anything about this ninth child.
• 18:51
  Speaker 12: Possible ninth child.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: Virginia Bagby joining us from Child Help National Abuse Hotline
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: going into this right now. I knew that there were
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: eight children, six in the home, one starve near death
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  Speaker 1: with brain damage, and one missing since twenty seventeen. Now
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: I'm hearing about child number nine. Is that child dead?
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: I mean, what do you do when you get a
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: call like this the Child Help hotline?
• 19:18
  Speaker 5: Well, this is a really difficult one.
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  Speaker 1: I would encourage.
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  Speaker 5: Somebody to reach out to the local hospitals potentially where
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: all the other children have been born, to see if
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: they have any record. This is very concerning to have
• 19:29
  Speaker 5: two children missing. Now these other children have probably are
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: aware that they have siblings that are missing. Add that
• 19:35
  Speaker 5: to the terror. They've been experiencing.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
• 19:50
  Speaker 8: A shocking discovery inside a home leads police to investigate
• 19:53
  Speaker 8: a long buried secret.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, Liam Marie is joining U. A friend of the mom,
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  Speaker 1: Virginia Gonzales MS murray, thank you because what you've just
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: said could save a child's life. Yes, However, do you
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: know Leanne is the ninth child older younger girl.
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  Speaker 11: Boy, it's a boy and he is around age nine
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  Speaker 11: to ten years old. So she has a fourteen, an eleven,
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  Speaker 11: A ten, A nine, A seven.
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  Speaker 10: I know she has two three year olds the newborn.
• 20:32
  Speaker 10: So there's there's there's nine. From what I'm hearing right now.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, hold on, let me have this up. There's a
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: fourteen year old, an eleven year old, a ten year old,
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: A nine year old is the boy that you think
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: is missing? A seven year old is a little girl
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: starved in the closet? Two three year old? Ok one, two, three, four, five, six,
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: seven eight, I'm missing somebody fourteen, eleven, ten nine missed
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: a three and three and a kneeborn. What now?
• 21:03
  Speaker 11: So Eva's around eight nine years old and then the
• 21:06
  Speaker 11: little boys right after her eleven months difference.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: You stated that Virginia Gonzales, the mother the starving little
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: girl and the other missing girl, was quote normal would
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: go partying at the clubs and the bars. Hey, I
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: don't have a problem with that party down mommy, But
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: what would she ever mention who was taking care of
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: the children while she's at the bar.
• 21:35
  Speaker 11: So, from what we understand was that the kids, all
• 21:38
  Speaker 11: the kids were left with the grandmother of She has
• 21:42
  Speaker 11: three kids that belonged to one father and they were
• 21:46
  Speaker 11: that was who she was with the past seven years,
• 21:48
  Speaker 11: and so they were supposedly all living with the grandmother.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: You're seeing mommy now out partying on a boat, drinking
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: straight out of a vodka mini bottle.
• 21:58
  Speaker 6: Oop.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: There's she is in a bar. Why bother with a glass? Seriously,
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: why who needs a glass when you can drink straight
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: from the bottle. There's mommy chowing down on some free
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: toes and chips on a boat while her twenty nine
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: pound seven year old daughter is locked in a closet
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: at home. Okay, DOCTRINNGI Arnold, I need to shrink because
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: why is she had on a boat partying while her
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: child is starving in a closet and two children are missing, right.
• 22:33
  Speaker 7: And Nancy can she how can she just be so
• 22:36
  Speaker 7: unattached from all of these children that she's having. So
• 22:40
  Speaker 7: my question is why is she having all of these children?
• 22:44
  Speaker 7: And I'm sorry, is it to support her lifestyle? And
• 22:48
  Speaker 7: where are the fathers of these children? We always have
• 22:51
  Speaker 7: to ask where is We're always you know, why isn't
• 22:53
  Speaker 7: the mother taking care of them? Okay, yeah, she is
• 22:55
  Speaker 7: a horrible person that has done horrible things to at
• 22:58
  Speaker 7: least two of her children that know about. Where are
• 23:01
  Speaker 7: the fathers of these children? And why are any of
• 23:04
  Speaker 7: them involved? But Nancy, I don't believe she should be
• 23:07
  Speaker 7: out partying on our boat. I think that when you
• 23:08
  Speaker 7: have children, you should be at home taking care of
• 23:10
  Speaker 7: your children and not relying on someone else to take
• 23:13
  Speaker 7: care of them, because again we don't know how children
• 23:18
  Speaker 7: take that, but oftentimes when mothers are not around, children
• 23:22
  Speaker 7: do since a fear of abandonment when their mother is
• 23:26
  Speaker 7: not taking care of them.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: But to Ron, when Blake joining us as junct professor
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: University takes as school of law, Rowen, I'm not the
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: church lady. If mom wants to party, go ahead. If
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: mom wants to vape and smoke, have at it. The
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: issue is intent. When she is out partying in her
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: club and bar finery, her child is at home starving
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: and two of them are missing. Now that goes to intent.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: When I'm trying to prove any child neglect to a jury,
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: that's when that type of video, let's see the video
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: again comes in to play. I couldn't care less what
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: mommy whares or what Barshi goes to. Don't care, But
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: if your child is at home starving in a closet,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: suddenly your behavior, your actions during that time are relevant.
• 24:23
  Speaker 9: Absolutely. I can tell you're thinking like a prosecutor. The
• 24:26
  Speaker 9: contrast between the images you're showing of these this child
• 24:31
  Speaker 9: and then her mother partying, it tells the whole story there.
• 24:34
  Speaker 9: And unfortunately many of users present one face to some people,
• 24:38
  Speaker 9: can be very charming to some people. And then we
• 24:41
  Speaker 9: hear about these horrible things happening at home too.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: Doctor Kimmel Crown's is joining me, Chief Medical Examiner, Terrant County,
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: that's fort Worth. Doctor Kimmel Crowns. I've got one child
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: starved almost beyond recognition, her bones sticking out, you know,
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: like they're visible through the skin. I've got that child
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: starved almost dead, permanent brain injury. I've got a missing
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: little girl, and now I'm learning from leam Marie there's
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: another boy missing that is about one, two three fourth
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: in the progression line of children. Leam Marie joining us
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: a friend of mom Virginia Gonzales. Did you know that
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: Ava was missing?
• 25:28
  Speaker 10: No, we had no idea.
• 25:31
  Speaker 11: Back in twenty eighteen, when I originally first met Virginia,
• 25:36
  Speaker 11: we only knew of three little boys. So after talking
• 25:41
  Speaker 11: to mutual friends and all concluding that she had Ava's
• 25:46
  Speaker 11: hair shaved like a boy, she never had Ava in
• 25:51
  Speaker 11: her possess. I mean, she never let us know that
• 25:53
  Speaker 11: it was a girl. She had her presented as a
• 25:57
  Speaker 11: boy to all of us, so we were all in shock.
• 26:01
  Speaker 11: We didn't nobody knew that she had Ava.
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: Leanne, I don't understand this. So she showed you Ava,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: But this is the missing child, not the starving child. Right,
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: you saw Ava, and she had her dressed like a
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: boy with her head shaved.
• 26:19
  Speaker 11: She had her hair, She had him. She had a faid,
• 26:23
  Speaker 11: He had a faid. I definitely confirmed this with her
• 26:28
  Speaker 11: landlord and roommates that she lived.
• 26:30
  Speaker 10: With back in twenty eighteen.
• 26:33
  Speaker 11: Everybody concluded that and confirmed that it was a little boy.
• 26:37
  Speaker 10: It was not nobody knew she had a little.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Girl, leanne knowing the mother. Why do you think she
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: shaved the little girl's head and passed her off as
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: a boy.
• 26:47
  Speaker 11: I feel like that she had a anger issue with
• 26:53
  Speaker 11: the little girls because of the way her mother treated
• 26:56
  Speaker 11: her back when she was little, and I think that
• 26:58
  Speaker 11: she was taken it out on these little girls because
• 27:02
  Speaker 11: from all the evidence and information that I've collected, it's
• 27:05
  Speaker 11: all based on the girls.
• 27:08
  Speaker 10: So you know, she sold the baby who was a
• 27:09
  Speaker 10: little girl that was just born in March. She starved
• 27:13
  Speaker 10: a re.
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: Reading whoa, whoa, whoa. My head is spinning. What did
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: you just say she sold a baby?
• 27:19
  Speaker 10: Yes, and CPS just found that baby.
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: When okay, glads, that's the newborn baby that was just
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: born in March, So that baby's been sold. Yes, but
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: see how much does she get from the baby?
• 27:30
  Speaker 10: From what I heard twenty five k.
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: Christina Whyo tell me about the newborn baby girl that
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: just got sold?
• 27:38
  Speaker 4: Well, apparently from my investigations online and none of this
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: has been confirmed yet, but she did have this newborn
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: baby and according to all person who says that they
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: are a close relative of the family. She did have
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: a newborn baby.
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: It was sold to a couple.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: So if that is in fact the case, there could
• 27:55
  Speaker 4: be a possibility that Aban Marigan Solace was also sold,
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: and that something that will have to be looked into,
• 28:01
  Speaker 4: because it would be my opic of us to think
• 28:03
  Speaker 4: that that possibility isn't out there.
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: You know what, Christina Ariyah, I can only hope and
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: pray that she was sold and that she's alive and
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: being treated better than the little seven year old to
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: Leanne Marie, a friend of mom Virginia Gonzalez. Why did
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: she sell her baby?
• 28:25
  Speaker 11: I'm guessing financial issues, But at the same time, you know,
• 28:29
  Speaker 11: all the money was going downtown Sixth Street and at
• 28:32
  Speaker 11: the strip clubs. I mean, she was just making it
• 28:35
  Speaker 11: rain with money and buying bottles after bottles and buying
• 28:39
  Speaker 11: everybody buying the bar out. I mean, that's where I
• 28:41
  Speaker 11: seen the money going. I didn't see anything.
• 28:45
  Speaker 10: Else that she had that.
• 28:46
  Speaker 11: I mean, she didn't even have a vehicle, you know
• 28:48
  Speaker 11: what I mean. So, I mean I think all the
• 28:50
  Speaker 11: money was just going to party in I don't think
• 28:52
  Speaker 11: it was ever to just take care of her and
• 28:55
  Speaker 11: the rest of the kids.
• 28:56
  Speaker 10: You know what I mean.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: I noticed in the party video she's got a Gucci
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: bags strapped around her front. Was that a fake? Was
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: that a fruity? A fake Gucci?
• 29:06
  Speaker 11: From my understanding, everything that the police found in her
• 29:11
  Speaker 11: room was everything was name brand. I don't think it
• 29:15
  Speaker 11: was fake, but I do now know that a video
• 29:19
  Speaker 11: was taped back in May a year ago. She would
• 29:23
  Speaker 11: just cover up her stomach. I mean she would, honestly
• 29:27
  Speaker 11: now that I'm thinking, I'm thinking she was trying to.
• 29:29
  Speaker 10: Hide the pregnancy. Why because she was out there partying.
• 29:32
  Speaker 11: I mean on the boat party, which was in September
• 29:34
  Speaker 11: of twenty twenty four, my birthday. You can see in
• 29:38
  Speaker 11: the video she was kind of closed. She didn't take
• 29:41
  Speaker 11: the whole shot. And I got other, you know, videos
• 29:43
  Speaker 11: of footage of her putting the shots on the side
• 29:46
  Speaker 11: when people weren't watching. So I think she knew she
• 29:49
  Speaker 11: was pregnant, but she just didn't want the other the
• 29:53
  Speaker 11: world to know that she was pregnant. So she would
• 29:55
  Speaker 11: literally buy bottles, get everybody drunk, and guess what, then
• 29:59
  Speaker 11: nobody notices anything.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: Lean question, did she discuss openly that she was selling
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: the baby?
• 30:06
  Speaker 10: No, no, ma'am.
• 30:07
  Speaker 11: I found that out through the one of the children's families,
• 30:11
  Speaker 11: the ones that I've been speaking with since the very
• 30:13
  Speaker 11: beginning of the case, when it first started getting investigated.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: Do you know who she sold the baby too?
• 30:22
  Speaker 10: I do not know them personally. I just know that
• 30:24
  Speaker 10: it was a couple.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: Well, I am why did she keep having children if
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: she hated them so much?
• 30:29
  Speaker 11: I don't think that she was having the children to,
• 30:33
  Speaker 11: you know, just be this mother and to take care
• 30:36
  Speaker 11: of them. I think she was living off the benefits
• 30:37
  Speaker 11: the snap and the EBT and the fathers. I think
• 30:43
  Speaker 11: that was how she would hold some of these men,
• 30:45
  Speaker 11: you know, in her life, because a lot of them
• 30:48
  Speaker 11: didn't deal with the children. They only dealt with her,
• 30:51
  Speaker 11: And a lot of them didn't want the children, they
• 30:52
  Speaker 11: just wanted her. So I think that it was like
• 30:55
  Speaker 11: the kids were like a tool for the men. You
• 31:00
  Speaker 11: know how they say there's womenizers. I think she was
• 31:03
  Speaker 11: like that with the men, like where she idolized men
• 31:07
  Speaker 11: before her children.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: Did anyone ever wonder who would be taking care of
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: the children while she's out partying.
• 31:13
  Speaker 11: So from my friendship experience with her, she would come
• 31:19
  Speaker 11: and go, so one minute she was out here popping
• 31:22
  Speaker 11: bottles for about two or three months, and then she'll
• 31:24
  Speaker 11: go ghost for six months a year, and then she'll.
• 31:27
  Speaker 10: Pop out out of nowhere again. So it wasn't really
• 31:31
  Speaker 10: she was really just screep with the children.
• 31:33
  Speaker 11: Like I said, I only went to her that apartment
• 31:35
  Speaker 11: where they found the child that was starving and the
• 31:39
  Speaker 11: other six children. I only went to that apartment one time,
• 31:41
  Speaker 11: which was to go pick her up, and she it
• 31:46
  Speaker 11: was clean. It was the fourteen year old was the
• 31:48
  Speaker 11: only one there. I didn't ask because every time I
• 31:52
  Speaker 11: asked about the children, it was that they were with her,
• 31:55
  Speaker 11: the grandmother, because her baby daddy was, you know, crazy
• 31:59
  Speaker 11: after her, so she just left the children at him
• 32:01
  Speaker 11: so he would be calm, is what she would tell us.
• 32:08
  Speaker 8: Crime stories with Nancy Grace, a shocking discovery inside a
• 32:17
  Speaker 8: home leads police to investigate a long buried secret.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: So you think that she's having the children in order
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: to get state benefits.
• 32:26
  Speaker 10: I don't think it's just state benefits.
• 32:28
  Speaker 11: I think, like I said, it's more of a tool
• 32:30
  Speaker 11: for the men that she was in love with. I mean,
• 32:32
  Speaker 11: I mean some of them, some of the from what
• 32:34
  Speaker 11: I'm understanding too, is some of the kids. I mean
• 32:36
  Speaker 11: she don't even know who the fathers is to some
• 32:38
  Speaker 11: of the kids. I mean, she was known for being
• 32:41
  Speaker 11: in the club, you know, with multiple men, So I
• 32:44
  Speaker 11: mean I don't think that.
• 32:46
  Speaker 10: She used the children just for the benefits.
• 32:48
  Speaker 11: I think it was just more of tools to keep
• 32:50
  Speaker 11: the men in her life to help benefit her with
• 32:53
  Speaker 11: the money and the pain for this and paying for that.
• 32:55
  Speaker 10: And that's what I think.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: To Daryl Parker joining me former Lieutenant Fanning County Sheriff's
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: Office at Blackfish Intel dot com, Daryl, how do we
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: go about finding the two missing children? You've got the
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: little girl missing, We've got an eighth progress photo of her.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: You've got her missing. You've got a nine year old
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: boy missing. I believe the little newborn girl that was
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: sold has been recovered. But how do you go about
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: finding the two missing children?
• 33:27
  Speaker 12: Well, you know, Nancy, I see a lot of parallels
• 33:29
  Speaker 12: between this case.
• 33:31
  Speaker 13: And the Kasey Anthony case. And if you recall, the
• 33:34
  Speaker 13: thing that really bogged down that investigation was Kathy Anthony's
• 33:39
  Speaker 13: multiple stories where she gave the police all these different
• 33:43
  Speaker 13: versions of what happened to her child. And so in
• 33:46
  Speaker 13: this case, I.
• 33:47
  Speaker 12: Think the mom has given them some inconsistent stories. All
• 33:50
  Speaker 12: they're going to have to track these down. And this
• 33:53
  Speaker 12: is over a period of time too. Seven years is
• 33:56
  Speaker 12: a lot longer period of time than when Kasey Anthony's
• 33:59
  Speaker 12: child was missing, so it's going to be a lot
• 34:02
  Speaker 12: more difficult for law enforcement to piece that together.
• 34:05
  Speaker 13: But she couldn't have done all this without other adults
• 34:08
  Speaker 13: being aware of what.
• 34:09
  Speaker 12: Was going on, at least collaterally, So I think there
• 34:12
  Speaker 12: are going to be some other collateral witnesses that can
• 34:14
  Speaker 12: help provide some information to try and find the kids,
• 34:17
  Speaker 12: Rob and Blake.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: I don't understand how the mother can be getting government
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: benefits but they're not in school because the government does
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: know they exist and they're off school age. How does
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: that work.
• 34:32
  Speaker 9: This is not supposed to happen when you hear a
• 34:34
  Speaker 9: story like those. Multiple systems have failed. This mother was
• 34:39
  Speaker 9: purposely not taking her children to school, I'm sure, because
• 34:43
  Speaker 9: the teachers would have seen something. She's not taking them
• 34:46
  Speaker 9: to their doctor's appointments because the doctors would have seen something.
• 34:50
  Speaker 9: Here in Texas, every single adult is a mandatory repporter
• 34:54
  Speaker 9: of child abuse, not just those professionals I mentioned, neighbors,
• 34:58
  Speaker 9: family members, if anyone saw something, it's the love that
• 35:01
  Speaker 9: they had to report it.
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: Christina, Wya, what more do you know?
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: Well, there the woman who is online identifying as a
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: very close family member.
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: She revealed that the newborn baby was sold.
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: She also was revealing some of the details about what
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: Virginia was telling each one of the family members. It
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: kind of lines up with what Virginia Gonzalez's friend was
• 35:22
  Speaker 4: telling us about the story. She was saying she pitted
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: the two families against each other. She allegedly told one
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: family that the kids were in the care of the
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: other family. Her side of the family told her mom
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: the same thing, vice versa. This woman also claims that
• 35:35
  Speaker 4: the father of three of Virginia Gonzalez's children actually took
• 35:40
  Speaker 4: care of six of the children for two years until
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: he went to jail, allegedly back in December, and that's
• 35:46
  Speaker 4: when she's saying that Virginia Gonzalez went and picked up
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: all the kids. She had kept the fourteen with her
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: fourteen year old with her originally and then went back
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: and picked up all the kids. So that was in December,
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: which means that if she picked up the little seven
• 35:59
  Speaker 4: year old girl who they are calling re Rea in December.
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: Then that means that little girl was suffering, most likely
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: six months of abuse before that nine to one one
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: call came in and they discovered her in the closet.
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: So apparently this woman is describing Virginia Gonzalez as very manipulative.
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: And it's crazy because they also say that she didn't
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: allow any of the children to go to school, and
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: there are no records of any of the children being
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: in school. And as for abram Marie Gonzalez, there's no
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: medical records, there's no legal records. So this is a
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: really convoluted case. And if it's true what they're saying
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: about the baby being sold to a couple, that the
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: possibility of abram Marie Gonzalez being sold to a couple
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: is there as well. But it might have been sold
• 36:40
  Speaker 4: the baby might have been sold to a more nefarious outfit,
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: which means we could be looking at something concerning child trafficking,
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: which we hope that's not the case. But either way,
• 36:50
  Speaker 4: there's a lot of avenues that investigators need to go down,
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: and there are a lot of leads that they need
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: to investigate.
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: Leam Marie, now that you realize the extent of what
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: Virginia Gonzales was doing to her children?
• 37:04
  Speaker 11: Are you surprised, very I'm very shocked. I'm very disbelief.
• 37:10
  Speaker 11: I just I can't believe it. I mean, she put
• 37:14
  Speaker 11: up this image. I would have never, in my rights
• 37:17
  Speaker 11: say to mind thought that she was starving a kid
• 37:21
  Speaker 11: or abusing the children like that.
• 37:23
  Speaker 10: I would have said something.
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: To doctor Angela Arnold. How can you present one facade
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: to the public and live such a dark private life?
• 37:33
  Speaker 10: You know what.
• 37:34
  Speaker 7: Comes that comes from years and years of abuse, Because
• 37:39
  Speaker 7: people who have been abused learn how to compartmentalize different
• 37:44
  Speaker 7: things in their life. So this woman, because of the
• 37:48
  Speaker 7: purported abuse that she experienced as a child, has learned
• 37:53
  Speaker 7: how to contain the different parts of her life and
• 37:59
  Speaker 7: separate them. It all stems from her abuse.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: If you know or think you know anything regarding these
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: missing children, please dial five one two five seven two
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: eight four seven seven repeat five one two, five seven,
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: two eight four seven seven. We remember an American hero,
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: Chief of Police Stephen Desaio, Kirkersville, PD, Ohio, shot and
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: killed in a line of duty. Survived by wife now widow, Aaron, children,
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: Olivia Brayden, Grace, Chloe Cameron, and Liliana American Hero Police
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: Chief Stephen Desareo. Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend,