Latest / From 9 to Mom / fun, grief & building an empire
Transcript
- Catie: Welcome back to from nine to mom. Danielle: Where we discuss balancing the nine-to-five hustle with the beautiful chaos that we call motherhood. And today we're very excited. We have Jamie Kolnick. She is the founder and CEO of Jam with Jamie. It is a really cool company. It's a nationwide music company that's geared towards education and entertainment with kids. There's over a hundred performers across the nation in 10 cities that bring music to play groups, birthday parties, and preschools. She's also the creator of Little Jam Fest, which is Miami's premier. family music festival, which sounds awesome and we're gonna have to go to at some point. She's also a mom of three doing all the things. And I think it's amazing, Jamie, how you are raising kids, building a company, and creating communities everywhere you go. So Jamie, welcome to the pod. We're so excited to have you. Jamie: Thank you for having Catie: Yeah. Jamie: me on from Nine to Mom. I'm so excited to chat with you guys today. Catie: So we have to dive right into having three kids because I feel like right now with two, I'm like, I can't bring any more chaos. But we're curious. And I know it's still like end of summer. By the time everyone's listening to this, we're in our gonna be in our fall vibes. But what's the chaos in your household right now? Like what are you guys going through over there? Jamie: Well, typically it's two boys, one girl. I have a ten-year-old, an eight-year-old, almost five-year-old. I question myself often and say to my husband, like, what like what were we thinking? Like, I know that we Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: like have this idea of what parenting would be and both come from families of three kids. so it's like what was in our what was ingrained in our mind of what we wanted one day. And I also wonder like how my parents did it. It's insane. I mean, it's it's just Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: insane. My boys are iPad, Fortnite, you know, YouTube weird episode Catie: Yeah. Jamie: obsessed. And I have to like hide the iPads for them. Not sometimes I'll find my eight-year-old like in one of our bathrooms under this cubby, like with his iPad. Like what I didn't realize that was gonna happen. But luckily, right now, my kids are at sleepaway camp. That's why it's so that's Danielle: This sounds awesome, by the way. Jamie: why it's so it Catie: I know. Jamie: it is pretty amazing. it's such a privilege and my kids are fully spoiled and have it very good. my eight and ten-year-old boys are at Sleep Boy Camp in the Poconos and I just have my almost five-year-old Zoe and it's honestly a dream. Catie: I can imagine though, like the chaos that the boys bring to then just having like your sweet innocent girl and like you guys hanging out. It's good time for you guys too. Danielle: Wait, but I have a question. Is Jamie: my god. Danielle: I feel this with my son and there's one weekend that they go to like sleepaway camp, him and his dad. It's like called dad camp and Daisy's not old enough. And while I feel like the girls are sweet, is your daughter also like as feral and like I'm scared for the man she marries as mine? Jamie: She she calls me bro. Catie: Yeah. Danielle: I love Jamie: So Danielle: it. Yes. Jamie: if that says enough, she calls me bro. I I keep saying, like, I'm I saw something probably on Instagram, like you only, you know, only three people get to call me mommy, and you have to call me mommy. Nobody else gets to call me mommy. It's a really special name. Please call me mommy. And me and my husband, Sean, we're just calling, like, please, Zoe, please stop calling us bro. She's like, okay, Danielle: Dig why. Jamie: bro. She thinks it's funny. Like, she's Catie: No, yeah, it eggs them on. You're like, Okay. I'm in Danielle: Yeah. They just Jamie: I I think I just Danielle: go on. Jamie: have to let this one go. Like, I she's just gonna have to call me bro until she stops calling me bro. And yeah, she she also said recently, Mom, why can't I say the B word? And I said, What B word? I was just curious. She goes, Catie: Yeah. Jamie: bitch. And I was like, because Danielle: Ha ha ha ha. Jamie: that's a bad word, like we don't say it. And she's like, What's bitch? Like, why can't I say bitch? I was just Danielle: 'Cause they don't understand it. So what did you explain? Did you do the female dog pathway or? Jamie: I just said, just don't say it. I was like, just, Danielle: It's not nice. Just don't do it. Jamie: just don't say it. It's a bad word. If you want to say all your bad words now, just get it all out. I've done this with all my kids just to see what they come up with. They curse all the time. It's so bad. Danielle: Sometimes it's the best. Cause when they're younger, they're like, I'm gonna say the S word. And you're like, Okay, what's the S word? Like, stupid, shut up. But then when they actually come out with a real word, you're like, and then I remember telling Colton that he couldn't say it unless he can spell it and now he can spell them all. So that's a problem for me because he remembers. So it's great. It's great. We're doing we're doing all the things. But right? So like speaking of Jamie: Yeah. I we're doing our best. I don't know. Catie: We are. That's that's right. Danielle: like all the things, Jamie, tell us how your pathway and like what landed you, you know, in the position you're in today? Three kids, your own company. Can you give us a little bit of the history? Jamie: Sure. So the three kits definitely just had this I don't know, a really beautiful childhood, two older brothers, and it was just instilled Danielle: just like you. Jamie: in me from a young age that that was the dream. to have the house and the family and the kids. I didn't realize all the chaos that would come with it and the insanity and the cursing and the therapy and the the the and calls from school and the illnesses and also like my career path and what I might. want to do one day and how that might intertwine with this idealistic family life. I never fully thought thought it through. I don't think anyone fully thinks it through. you just have this idea of what you want one day and it's ingrained in you. And then if you're lucky enough to be able to get all those things, then great. You're like, I'm blessed. This is awesome. My upbringing, I was I I was raised in Miami, South Florida, and my parents w Murray and Cheryl were incredible parents. They've since passed away from cancer. My mom passed from breast cancer in 2009. My dad passed from leukemia in 2004. and my brother passed away in a car accident when I was 13. So my childhood was very much painted by loss after the age of 13. I was still figuring out my identity and living with these big traumatic Events and trying to sift through my own emotions, plus watching my parents go through their shifts at an age where really I wasn't fully developed to understand what they were going through in the least. if anything, I was fairly selfish just thinking about my myself and if I was gonna get a boyfriend. And I mean, I'm really at Shiva in the Jewish religion. there's something called Shiva, which lasts for seven days after someone passes. Away. And I remember after Alan died, he was 18. He was a student at UF, a freshman at UF. Huge, tragic, obvious loss in the community. And in at Shiva, like I was torn. I wrote in my journals. I was devastated. Everybody was in mourning. Danielle: Of course. Jamie: Like I could see it all around me. But like my f the first few pages on my journal are like talking about what happened. And then by the sixth page, I was talking about how this guy, Evan, was coming to Shiva and I really liked him and I wondered if he was gonna ask me out on a date. Danielle: Ha ha. Catie: My gosh. Jamie: or a date, like kiss me or whatever you do. They don't you don't get asked out on a date when you're thirteen. And he ended up asking me to be his girlfriend. I don't know if I had this like mourner's glow about me. Danielle: my goodness. Jamie: but the sad girl, like, I don't know, like it was kind of hot. It worked, like whatever works, Catie: my god. Yeah. There's he was into it. He was into it. Danielle: It w it worked. Jamie: I I leaned in. so a lot of my childhood, you know, was idealistic and beautiful and I mean, truly it continue to be like my parents were there for me as much as they possibly could be. I mean, they could be. They were they were, now that I am a parent, I I know that they were the absolute best that they could be. losing a child, I like can't even think about, but Danielle: No. Unfathomable. Jamie: When I went to so I went to college at UT Austin and my dad was sick during that time. It passed when I was a sophomore in college. And my mom was sick the whole time. you know, it was a 15-year span. So that was just that was just how it was. Like my mom was in and out of losing her hair and wearing wigs, and she was so positive and such a light. And my parents started this scholarship foundation for my brother. That's still going on today. And me and my brother Mike run it. We have over 300 recipients of this scholarship foundation in memory of Alan. Danielle: That's crazy. Catie: Yeah, Jamie: It's another hat that I wear. They just showed me really early on that shit happens and you figure it out. that you that you figure out how to still go on the trip, that you figure out how to laugh, that you make jokes, that you still go to work, that you have friends and you socialize and you keep doing things. You don't stop. And I learned that from them. So I continue to have my aspirations and went to UT Austin and had a great time in college, even with the loss of my father, because he instilled in me that you you live with the loss. Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: you continue on to honor the people that you've lost and you do all the things that you are planning to do, even though it's hard, incredibly hard and For anyone that is listening has experienced loss, they know grief can creep up on you at any minute and any street corner at any stoplight. Like you it you don't know when it's gonna come. You don't know what memory is gonna trigger something and how deep it's gonna feel, even if that person passed 25 years ago. so I take that with me, and it's why I think I've Turned so many of the things that I've wanted to do into things that actually exist. Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: because that was instilled in me from a young age. I always wanted to be an actress on Broadway, which is why I went to New York. I'm kinda glad it didn't work out because Catie: Yeah. Jamie: eight shows a week. I've watched a lot of friends do it. It is no, as my dad would say, no babies game. and it's really hard. Danielle: I like that. Jamie: Yeah, I know, no babies game. it's really hard to like have your family do it too. But I know a lot of people who do it with flying colors. I just don't think it was ever really for me. And maybe that's why it didn't come to fruition. But I love performing, I love singing, I love acting, and I do a lot of that on Instagram now because I'm not doing it professionally. So I do a lot of like comedic reels. I've always wanted to be on SNL. I've love characters. I love improv. So I use Instagram, even though it Jam with Jamie's a children's entertainment company. I really love to play. And I think we all need to figure out what that outlet is to play and to have hobbies. And it's just fun for me to like act like a kid and really silly and put up funny mom reels. Danielle: That because why do we ever stop? Like the movie that is playing nonstop in my household still is Gabby's Dollhouse. I don't know if anybody else is watching it, but it's a movie about like adults. We stop playing and we stop believing and we stop Catie: Right. Danielle: having fun. And it kills your dreams and the vision. So, I mean, I love what you're saying there. Like, you can still be a kid as an adult. Like, you can live in that world and enjoy life and So many people are like, I hate play, like make pretend. Like I don't like make pretend. I love make pretend because it gives you an opportunity to be whoever or whatever you want to be. And I don't know when that spirit stops in kids. So I know a lot for you came out of tragedy in terms of your your family, but like what a beautiful lesson they taught you that you're now teaching your kids that it's okay to be a big kid in an adult's body. Like you shouldn't have to sacrifice one thing for the other. Jamie: And I think it's imperative that we play. Like I think that we need to lean into whatever those interests are and the things that made us light up when we were little and continue to do them. Danielle: And that's what you've done with Jam with Jamie. Like really, like that's you took your passions and put it into something that you could do with your family and your kids. And you started it with your mom, right? Like this was a thing that you did with family that continues on. Jamie: Yes, yeah, definitely. And Jam with Jamie is A joy company, which I mean, let's be honest, it's still a small business. So yeah, it's not all rainbows and butterflies. Danielle: Ten cities is not small. Jamie: It's I it actually still considered a small business, but yes, it's not small. We've been around for almost 18 years, 100 performers across the country. I started off doing all the parties and classes myself, and I was in a woman's group, maybe like four years in, and we talked about Our goals with whatever we were doing at that moment. And one of my goals became to not be the main performer of the company and start to hire other performers in the company. And one performer led to another and one state led to another pretty organically. And you know, here we are now, 10 cities later, and over 100 performers on the team that are in and out. A lot of them, they're actors, musicians, they're on tour. They're so we have a lot of people on the team so that we have availability we are always growing always figuring out what's next we're moving with you know, the times trying to utilize AI on the back end of to make things Catie: Right. Jamie: smoother, to streamline. I think we're all figuring out how to use AI in the best way possible. And I I I love it. It's it's grown to a place that's not like overwhelming. I'm like nervous for it to get too much bigger because and I have this tendency as soon as things feel comfortable to add more to my plate. Danielle: Mm-hmm. Jamie: So I'm trying to not do that But then, of course, I started Little Jam Fest, which is a family music festival. It'll be in our fourth year next year, just in Miami only. and it's it's been great. We have over a thousand people. We have 40 brands that are participating, musicians that are local, some Grammy nominated, Grammy Award-winning artists that perform, children's groups, children's dance groups that perform throughout the day, and then brands that are activating food, drink, fun, and And it's a lot of work. so Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: It's a lot of work. It's fun. Everybody has a great time. And it's only this year become profitable. but I don't know if it'll stay profitable. I mean, it's a year-to-year thing, and we're now nonprofit for that entity, which I'm very excited about. running another nonprofit through the scholarship foundation. I care a lot about nonprofit work, so I'm excited to be make it more accessible, make the tickets less expensive, continue to have it be something that fuels the Miami community. Catie: Yeah. How did you like find the niche to work like in the children's space for this? Jamie: So when I was a child myself, I worked in children's theater in Miami at a place called Actors Catie: Okay. Jamie: Playhouse. I was in a show called Babes in Toyland. I was in Christmas Carol. I was in this group called Musical Miracles and performed all over South Miami with this children's group. And when I moved to New York after I graduated from UT Austin, I did children's theater there. I just kept finding myself working with kids. And It was a niche of mine. Like I was an assistant to a music teacher at a preschool here in Miami during a summer camp. And then throughout the year, when I was in New York, I was a music teacher. I just found myself as this music teacher working with kids. And that was just because I needed a job, you know, and I sang Catie: Yeah. Jamie: and I liked kids and I loved babysitting. And I just was like, okay, well, I like babysitting, I like kids, and this camp. Is hiring me. I guess it makes sense for me to like work in the music department because I love music. And it just naturally happened that when I moved to New York, out of jobs that were available for me, it made sense for me to like lean into this singing teacher. and I loved it. And I was working for other companies first before I started my own company. Catie: How old will now I'm trying to do the math. Where were your kids in the start of your business? Had you not had them yet be when 'cause you eighteen years, yeah. So you didn't have kids when you first started. How did that transition to like where were you when you started having kids with the business? Jamie: So 2008, I came up with the name with my mom like named the company. And originally I thought it was a really bad name. I thought it was pouring. I did. And then when I Danielle: Exactly. Jamie: started hiring other people, we called the Jam with Jamie and Friends. Went bad, went back to Jam with Jamie. so I from 2008 to 2016. I ran the company on my own, started growing it in 2016. Well, 2015 I had I was pregnant and I remember how pregnant I was at this party I did at Sixteen Handles. Do you know that? Yogurt shop, Sixteen Handles? Is it still Danielle: Yeah. Catie: No Jamie: around? Okay. it's like a froyo shop and Catie: Okay. Danielle: Good for you. Jamie: I was it was a I love a good froyo. It was a birthday party for like the founder's daughter's son. Like some like like a an important person at Sixteen Handles and I get a call, I'm like about to pop. And I'm not doing parties at this point. This is my first kid. I get a call that from the birthday party parent that the performer is not there. And I'm like, God. And this is not the first time this has happened. We've run a people business. Like, shit happens. Danielle: Mm-hmm. Jamie: so I jump in a cab. And I head over the Upper East Side from the Upper West Side. And I I my guitar wasn't tuned. My props were all over the place. I didn't even know if I remembered how to do the party. I was like really Danielle: I'm about to burst here. Jamie: I was really, yeah. And I Catie: Ha ha. Jamie: was really pregnant. I was like, how do I even hold my guitar in front of my belly? And I'm talking to my team. I had one person, my team, I had one other person that was helping me at the time. I'm like, just send anyone, like anyone else that knows the set to Catie: No really. Jamie: please support me at this party just in case. And halfway through the party, the guy that was supposed to do the party showed up. I had somehow figured it out because I think as a a showman, you've figure it out and the the everybody was happy. The parents are fine. I think they were probably like, what the hell is going on? Why would they start so late? But we always try and figure it out. Even if you know things go massively wrong. We do our absolute best to make it up to the client and figure something out. So made it work and I didn't get birth. So that was good. Catie: I mean that is Danielle: Win. Catie: the win not going into labor at the party 'cause that would have Danielle: The stress could have put you into labor alone and then your water breaks in front of all these little kids. Like that would have been an epic story to tell. Jamie: That would have been a really good episode of some T V show. I think that would actually be really Danielle: Oof. Jamie: good. I am actually writing a book. I Catie: Then we would have had to get you into book writing and you would write a book about your experiences. Are you? Jamie: am. I am. I've been writing it for like twenty thousand years. Danielle: What's it about? Catie: All right, so one day. Danielle: Like, is it fiction or non fiction? Jamie: It is a it is nonfiction and it is a memoir. it's probably for the best that I am not done with it because so much life has happened. But I put the book down in writing and was working with editors when Zoe was born, when my third was born. And I thought that like during my maternity leave, although small business owners don't have maternity leave, but during my quote unquote maternity leave, that I would finish writing the book and sell it and like be with my three kids, like running around the United States talking about my book. And I Catie: On a book tour. Danielle: When you're book signing. Jamie: just started looking at it again and Zoe's almost five. I actually started to look at ChatGPT with it and upload Catie: Mm. Jamie: all of every single thing that I've written and where I was at just Just to get a sense of what was missing. I'm like, don't write anything for me. I do not want your creative like help with words or anything. I just think I need an accountability partner to help me get to the finish line here. Can you be Catie: Yeah. Jamie: that? And it's like, sure, Jamie, of course. Like I can, we can write a chapter a day. Catie: Whatever you need. Jamie: Like, I don't know. So I love it. So supportive. Danielle: That's why I love Chat G B T. It's so supportive, you know. Katie and I have names, but it's nice that you can you didn't have that tool even Jamie: I know. Danielle: five years ago to be able to say, Hey, like where the gap? Like that's very nice to have. And I do find Jamie: I think so. Danielle: accountability in the apps so weird but true. Jamie: Yeah, it doesn't like remind you yet, but I think it's getting close to that. Like a ping on like, did you write your thousand words today? That's kind of what I'm looking for. I also was looking to it for some ideas for maybe outline or I shared all the news the other stories that I haven't put in it yet, that where I'm at, just like regurgitating all my thoughts and then having it help me organize, but not write. I said Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: like act as an editor to like point things out that I can fix and like just help me get organized, which Danielle: Yeah. And not to digress, go to try Claude because it will like send you summaries Catie: Mm-hmm. Danielle: every day. Like it's a little bit more. You could set it up that way, whole nother conversation. Jamie: okay. I use Claude too, but I I it's like so annoying. I already started the conversation with Chad, so I wish that they would just talk to each other sometimes. Danielle: You can download the conversation from chat and throw her right into Claude. Jamie: I love this for me. Danielle: Mm-hmm. But Catie: It was Danielle: you know, we digress. Catie: a big transition. I just got Danielle to make it because we felt we both named our chat GPTs. Like we were so like we were in a great Jamie: Invested. Catie: friendship with it and we I've slowly transitioned fully to Claude at this point. And Jamie: How's Chat GPT feel about that or whatever you name chat? Danielle: I use both still Catie: I Danielle: and motion. Catie: yeah, I Jamie: I don't use Notion. Catie: it's it's hard because I find myself that I'm doing more things now. I talk to it all day because I saw yeah, so I saw Jamie: Ch Claude? Okay. Catie: a a a reel of like how much time you save if you speak into your AI instead of typing. someone like actually ran a clock and was like how long it takes you to type stuff into chat versus talking to it. And they're like, that's the number one thing you need to do because that's your best form of communication is speaking. Not everyone's a strong writer. So like to get that out, it's I am. It's really Danielle: He's walking around looking like a boomer talking into her phone all day. It's cool. Catie: hard for me because I you like the first time I did it, I'm like, I just aged myself. Like I am now on this side of it where I'm talking into my phone. But here we are. Danielle: No, you're being Jamie: But Danielle: productive, maybe. Jamie: like, but you're with the times and you're and you're being efficient with your time. As moms who are running businesses, like we don't have that much time. It's and then of course on top of that, you gotta work out and eat enough protein and make sure you're getting Catie: A whole Jamie: on your shake plate and doing your weighted vest. And how well are we gonna how are we supposed to fit all of Catie: mask to this. Jamie: it in? Catie: I it's very difficult, but I actually made me think of a question for you about like running your business in that. I feel like you your business relies heavily on your creative input and that like in the beginning part where you were the sole, you know, performer, how did you manage like the business port part of it plus, you know, putting out the creative in like output that was necessary? Jamie: Yeah, I think that I'm so sorry, can you ask that again? Someone was texting me and I got distracted. It was actually frickin' Jacob. I'm like Jacob! Catie: No. I'm doing things Danielle: Some of our busy. Catie: doing what I'm supposed to right now. how did you in the the early times where you were the sole performer manage like the business side, but then also like have the time to put the creative input because I assume you were you were creating, you know, the parties and you know the prompts you were saying in that, like how did you still manage the the back end of the business? Jamie: I didn't have three kids, like anything was possible. Like Catie: Yeah, that's true. Like that Danielle: You look like that's a superstar. Catie: the amount of time that is a true thing though. Like the Jamie: The amount of time. Catie: mess the message I wish you could give yourself pre kids, like when you used to think you were like so busy and so tired and that and then once the kids come in you're like, I was an idiot. Jamie: Yeah, and I was I think I was I was I did have a ton on my plate, I always have I was auditioning, I was doing shows. I did a show in South Korea. I was, but that's when I started Catie: Mm. Jamie: running my business with help. I had done I'd worn every hat. I was the one that was on call for every single party. We didn't do a ton of classes at the time unless I was doing them myself. But I wanted to be the one that they were calling. Like I wanted to be the one that was talking directly to the performers. I think that's how I built a really great foundation, was that it was just me on the ground and I think now small business owners that are startups with the use of going back to AI like they could do frickin' anything. I have a friend who has an Catie: Yeah. Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: interior design company right now and she's hired some help with like designers like to help her with I don't know how to explain it but to help to assist her. But she Danielle: Markup. Catie: Yes. Yeah. Jamie: uses AI for so much and she's doing really well. financially, and lots of clients and getting so much done. I think as moms, we're like the most powerful people on the planet. So we can take on more than we should typically Danielle: I agree. Jamie: because we know we have like 10 heads at all times and 10 hands. So when you add in a mom, Who's also running a business, they're typically gonna run it really well. The only issue that you might run into, and I see this with my friend, is she's like, I can't do it anymore. There's burnout, right? Catie: Yeah. Jamie: Like you do so much that you then might burn out. And I'm the one that encouraged her to get back Danielle: Have you experienced that? Jamie: into design. And she's like, it's your fault. I'm like, but I'm I'm so Danielle: But have you experienced it? Catie: Help me 'cause I have a Jamie: proud of you. Sorry, what was your question? Danielle: I think we all need like a cheerleader, like I think we all need a cheerleader who's like supporting us. It's a working mom, like that owns her own business too, because you get it. But have you experienced burnout over the last like ten, fifteen years? Jamie: yeah. I've wanted to like throw my business in in the trash multiple times. And I love my b Danielle: What got you through? Jamie: I love my business more than anything. delegating. I Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: I'm just like so I was so controlling over various aspects of the business and just thought that I could only do it alone. And when I started to release the control and train other people on my team and trust them and learn how to be a good CEO, not just a founder, but a good CEO, then we were able to be even more successful and I was able to not have the burn. Out that I was about that I was having, especially with kids, because there was there's Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: so many hormonal changes happening. My body, I've fought multiple autoimmune disorders over the past 10 years or sorry, 20 years, but since I had my first kid, they got worse. So anyone that has autoimmune disorders that then had kids might there's a pr pretty big percentage of us that then experience more autoimmune disorders with pregnancy and hormone changes that I was. not expecting and I want to talk about more because I think there's so many moms, new moms, that begin to experience different things and don't really know what's happening. And I really, Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: I really believe that it's well I know it's like hormonal changes and need it really needing to be on top of your your health care as much as possible with your rheumatologist or whoever monitors Catie: Mm-hmm. Jamie: those autoimmune disorders to ensure that doesn't happen. Because I I like went month, months, and months, months, months, Months without realizing that it was connected. And it just took me a long time. But I think in general, it takes a long time to figure out what those things are. And they become autoimmune disorders. And it's just hard to figure out which one you have. It was like a 20 to 25 year experience for me. So that was also burnout. That was burnout for me. Danielle: And I I think like Jamie: Like as my body was actually, Catie: The stress and Jamie: you know, I would have like random bruises on my body, which is called paniculitis, and it's an inflammatory. thing that can happen. that was my body saying like slow down, stop, take care of yourself. And then anxiety, panic, like all of those things, of course, I have a history of of loss. So it all can catch up to you. So when you're a doer and sometimes a doer to a fault, then you can get into trouble because that can be a defense mechanism doing to like not pay attention to the things Danielle: Mm-hmm. Jamie: that are eating you up inside and then you can really burn out. So I don't know the full answer, but I've come to I've I'm on the other side to some extent and I have a great awareness for what what are the red flags to burn out. Danielle: I think that's important to know and I wanna tie that in a little bit to community because I know you're big about community and Katie and I always talk about the village and things we didn't know that could happen because no one told us and then other moms tell us. How do you interweave that into your day to day? Jamie: I love hanging out with other women. I love getting to talk to you today. I think that socializing ourselves, especially as women, having a sounding board can sometimes be better than any therapy session that you might have. It can be even more enlightening sometimes because I don't know, like when you connect with another woman or even a man, but typically I've just found that these relationships happen with other women, other moms that carry a lot of mental load, even with support from their husbands. Just carry a lot, do a lot. I get through it with my friends. I play mahjong. I I go to the gym. I'm not, I'm, I don't socialize much there, but I always happen to make a friend wherever I go. So I have a couple gym buddies. Danielle: that for you. Jamie: I I make space for going to the dinner on Saturday night or having a date night with my husband. I I meditate as much as I can. I technically should be meditating. Twice a day according to transcendental meditation rules, which I learned a long time ago with my mom when she was with hospice. And I love that practice. I just don't always do it. I have to get better at that. I know those are the things that make me tick properly. Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: and so I go for the walk, I get in my self-care, and and community I also bit. build through having my company and having Little Janfest and connecting with other brands and connecting with the families. And that is just so important to me. It's so fueling for me. Catie: And I know so a lot of our listeners tend to have the little ones still. They're they're in kind of like our phase of life. And I think too, it's something we lose a little bit when the kids are so little and you start getting it back as you go. Do you feel like that happened to you a little bit? Or have you always made that a big priority? Because of the business, really. Jamie: So I craved connec I've always craved connection. So when I was when I had my first Zach, I was living on excuse me. Let me just take a sip of water. Catie: Yeah, you're good. Danielle: You're gonna be drinking coffee the whole time. Jamie: So when I had my first sack, I was living on the upper west side. And while I had friends that were in various spots throughout the city, I didn't have a ton that had just had a baby. Either they had had one a couple years ago or they were about to be pregnant, but I was in this, like I was, I felt a little alone. And there was this app called Peanut. Have you heard of Peanut? Catie: Yeah. Danielle: I remember. Jamie: Okay. Catie: Yeah. Jamie: So I I came across Peanut, which is a mom dating app. And I have been with my husband since we were junior juniors in college. So I never did the dating app thing and I was kind of jealous of the people who got to do it. It seemed like a lot of fun. Catie: Like the judgment, like 'cause that the Danielle and I are with you on that. Neither of us we both have been with our now husbands a long time and it's like, Yeah, I've I would have loved to judge people and swipe, you know. Danielle: I use all my friends' apps just to throw it out there. But Jamie: Yeah, it's so fun. You what? Danielle: I s I go on every single friend I have, I go on their app and I do the the judgment thing, the match, not for you, for you. I'll start talks. I set Catie: So you're living vicariously through them. Jamie: You do it for them. Danielle: up dates for some of them. It's a great time. So it's a great time. So thank you for creating one for moms, you know. Jamie: That's amazing. It's a great time. What a great hobby. You're trying to be fun, trying to be fun, Catie: Yeah. Right. Jamie: playful, creative. If you can't think of anything through this conversation we've had so far, go on one of your single friends' dating apps and do that. Danielle: Ha ha ha. Catie: It's a great outlet. Jamie: It's a great idea. It's a great outlet. It's not knitting. It's not mahjong. It's it's that's a great pastime. It's better than Instagram scrolling, I think. It's it's hard out. Danielle: Yeah, like bumble, you gotta think of what to say. I mean, it's tough, man. It's hard out there. I'm glad we didn't have to do it, but I like doing it for them. Catie: Ha ha ha. Jamie: So I was like really excited when I came across Peanut because even though I had a lot of friends in various places and some with kids, they weren't right there. And I wanted someone down the street that was in the same situation that I was in with a baby. And I made a few friends through Peanut. I swiped right Catie: So cool. Jamie: or swiped whatever the right way was on a couple of friends. And one of the friends, her name is Lindsay, and she She has a company called Show Up Authentic. I love her. She does marketing and social media for various women brands, women founders. I think some men's brands too, but like focus on good Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: women's friends. Anyways, we became fast friends. And within like a month, I was like so happy. We were meeting up all the time, going to the playground. And she told me she was moving to Jersey City. And I was like, you've gotta be fucking kidding me. Like, we just Catie: I just found you. Jamie: We just found each other. I need the mom down the street. Now you're moving to Jersey City. I'm not interested in you anymore. We're still very good friends. Catie: I needed you right here or it wasn't gonna work. Good. Jamie: but I was not happy about that. I'm like, I guess that's how it feels in the dating world. They just leave you and go to Jersey City. Danielle: Yeah. That's true. I never thought about that. I Catie: Right. Yeah, right. Like you just get ghosted, people move. Danielle: I feel that with adult relationships. Like my next door neighbors are moving and our daughters are the exact same age. And we just really started having them like asked to play together. And they're moving in the same neighborhood, but they're moving to a bigger house like on the other side of the neighborhood. And I'm like, what are you doing? Like you can't do this to me. I can't have you on the other side of the neighborhood. Like our kids just started being friends. You better not Jamie: It's it's inappropriate. Danielle: Yeah. I don't accept it. Catie: How dare they? Jamie: I don't accept it either for you. I think it's wrong on so many Danielle: Thank you. Thank you. Jamie: levels. Catie: All right, so we have to ask. We always try to end our episodes with our guests with Danielle and I have this thing of it's the shit you can't make up. And it's typically things that your kids have done that have either been like not embarrassing, but like for lack of better word, embarrassing, funny, like just we have found ourselves saying so many times. Like you can't even make up that they did that. do you have a story for us that you could share? What comes to mind? Jamie: I do. I'm already embarrassed thinking about it. Danielle: Ha ha ha Jamie: okay, here goes nothing. So my son my son Evan, I feel bad even naming Okay, so my son's in the bath. And we do we have bath bombs, like a bunch of bath bombs. And the but we have the bath bombs with toys. Those are the coveted item in the house. That's what gets the kids in the bath. So we have these. This is a story and a warning. so the bath bomb has these little tiny toy plastic toys in them. And my son s screens I'm like in the other room, like he's in the bath. Like he's seven. So like Catie: Yeah. Danielle: It's okay. Jamie: he's fine. Catie: Yeah. Jamie: So he goes, mom, mom. And I was like, what? Like, what's going on? He's like, I had that little tiny like snail that was inside of the bath bomb. I put it in my butt. I said, Danielle: став Jamie: you I said, you did not. You did not put it in your butt. He goes, I just I thought it would come out. I don't know. Like I thought it would come out and it's still in there. And he wasn't like he wasn't like fully nervous or scared at that point. He thought it was funny, he was laughing, and I was Catie: Well, thank God he told you, yeah, and wasn't embarrassed to like hide it. Jamie: I was like, my god. So like I didn't know what to do. I like immediately like went to go see if it was like I I mean like once it's in there like it's not like you could just squeeze Danielle: It's good down up. Jamie: the butt cheeks and it comes out. It's not like I So then I'm like, all right, well Danielle: Now your fingers are like like this is some place I never thought I'd be. Catie: Yeah. Jamie: like, okay, so I'm like feeling around and like I end up like putting my finger in his butt and like feel like the tip of like this pointy little plastic snail. And Catie: my god. Jamie: I was like, what? So I have a friend, a gastroenterologist on speed dial, and I texted her immediately. thank you. Shout out, Morgan Shane, she's the best. and she's like, Look, there's a couple ways to go about this. One is you just get some Vaseline, you land down on the floor, and you just go in there and scoop it out. And I said, but what if like could I shove it more? Could I do damage? Like Danielle: Yeah. Jamie: could I shove it more Catie: Right. Jamie: up there or where? And she's like, no, it's not going anywhere. You just go in and you can scoop it out. It's like hand motion. You're not watching. It's a hook. Catie: Like if you guys aren't watching us you need Yeah. Danielle: This little snail out of your butthole. She's scooping. Jamie: It's an in and a hook. So Danielle: Ha ha ha. Jamie: I said, okay, and she said Catie: my god. Jamie: the alternative is you go to the hospital and they'll take it out. And I was like, right, like I I'm not doing that. Like, let's let let's go. Let's get our gloves Catie: Here we go. Yeah. Danielle: Okay. Jamie: on. I didn't have gloves on, but like, let's let's do this. So I lay him down on the floor. and I get the Vaseline, and the first try did not get anything. He's crying, he's screaming, and Catie: Course. Jamie: I like take a deep breath and I go back in and I like do like the a big hook and I grab it with my finger and I take it out. And it was like not it did not fully fit through the whole. This is very graphic. I got it. I got it out. It was really Danielle: Well, I mean, I think this is hysterical. Catie: We're living for this. Yeah. This is Jamie: uncomfortable for him. He was screaming and crying, but I got it out and you can't make that up. Danielle: That is next level. Like that is the best story I've heard. Catie: That's the best one we've ever gotten. The best one we've gotten. So we'll give we'll ship you a for Danielle: 'Cause they would say that, like, Catie: that. Danielle: yeah, so far you're the best. Jamie: Accept my word because I raw hand to get the snail. Catie: It's good. Jamie: And I want to just let you know Danielle: Okay. Jamie: that I still have the snail. I just couldn't throw it out. I did wash it. We washed everything Catie: Course. Jamie: thoroughly. I just decided we have so many of these little tiny, you know what I'm talking about. These plastic toys. He keeps them in the Catie: Yes. The little to yeah. Danielle: Yes. Little tchotchkies everywhere. Jamie: tchotchkies everywhere. We keep a ton of them, but I kept the snail. It's a memento. A memento of what Danielle: Listen, I think you should keep the snail Catie: That one is special. Jamie: us moms do. Danielle: and either you keep it and like you put it in like your memory box or when he is like getting married to the his partner, you give it to them as a gift. Like I this, you know, this is a memory. Like I'm handing off the responsibility. Jamie: I give it to her. that's so nice. Catie: You'll be a great mother in law. Jamie: Do am I sharing this like on their wedding day? Like this graphic story with the Vaseline? Danielle: Yeah, you could be like, This is a responsibility. If he sticks something else up his butt and it gets stuck, it's it's on you, kid. Like this is your turn now. Passing the torch. Yeah. Now I know. I get it. Jamie: And she'll be like, that's where it started, huh? No, I'm just kidding. Catie: You're gonna be label like you're gonna be that mother in law. Yeah. Jamie: Poor kid. Sorry, Evan, I love you. If you if you hear this thirty years Danielle: Dude, I love it. Every kid says something weird. Jamie: from now and you're like, Mom Catie: It is. Danielle: No, this is great. Thank you for sharing. Evan, you're a hero. Jamie: I mean, look, if like God forbid something happens to me, my kids have so many, so much footage of me telling Catie: Right. Jamie: their horribly embarrassing stories. I don't have that of my mom. I'm this is a gift. That's right. That's right. Catie: They will be craving the story at that point. Danielle: Yeah. It's great. Gift to you for your future self, obviously. Catie: Well, you are amazing. We've had so much fun chatting with you. We could probably talk Jamie: Likewise. Catie: for hours. But if anyone wants to check out Jam with Jamie, we will have all of the links in the description here with the episode. We'll make sure that it's easy to find you. but with that, I think it's time for us to clock out and clock back into the end. Thanks for thanks for Jamie: Thank you for having me. Danielle: Thanks, Jamie. Catie: coming on.