Latest / Pod Save America / CTRL-F 'Trump' in the Epstein Files

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CTRL-F 'Trump' in the Epstein Files · Pod Save America

• 0:00
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• 1:33
  Speaker 3: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
• 1:35
  Speaker 4: I'm Dan Pfeiffer.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: On today's show, we're going to talk more about the
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: treasonous coup that our old boss almost got away with.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: Were it not for Tulsi Gabbard. Talk about the president
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: arguing with the Fed chair about line items in our
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: renovation project while wearing construction helmets on live television. Also
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: going to talk about why a man who was serving
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: time in Venezuela for a triple homicide is now somewhere
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: in America. thanks to the Trump administration's recent prisoner exchange.
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: And then later you'll hear Tommy's interview with the top
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: Intel committee Democrat Mark Warner on the latest Tulsi nonsense
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: and lots more. But first, as much as we all
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: want to talk about the many pressing challenges facing this country,
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: Donald Trump has again made headlines about his decades-long friendship
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: with child sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein. You may remember that
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: last week, Trump got asked what he'd been told by
• 2:31
  Speaker 3: Attorney General Pam Bondi about her review of the Epstein files.
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: Here's what he said. What did she tell you about
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: the review? And specifically, did she tell you at all
• 2:40
  Speaker 3: that your name appeared.
• 2:42
  Speaker 5: In the file?
• 2:42
  Speaker 6: No, no, she's given us... Just a very quick briefing
• 2:47
  Speaker 6: and in terms of the credibility of the different things
• 2:50
  Speaker 6: that they've seen. And I would say that, you know,
• 2:53
  Speaker 6: these files were made up by Comey.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: They were made up by Obama. They were made up by.
• 2:58
  Speaker 6: The Biden, you know, and we went through years of that.
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: Specifically, did she tell you your name was in the files? No, no.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: That was last week. And here's the Wall Street Journal
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: headline from this week. Justice Department told Trump in May
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: that his name is among many in the Epstein files.
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: That's right. Pam Bondi told the president that he and, quote,
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: many other high profile figures were named hundreds of other
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: names in the more than 300 gigabytes of Epstein related
• 3:30
  Speaker 3: material they have, but that they felt the files contained, quote,
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: unverified hearsay about Trump and all those other people. The story,
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: which has been independently confirmed now by the New York
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: Times and CNN, among others, was sourced to multiple senior
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: administration officials, though the journal specifically cites FBI Director Kash
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: Patel as someone who's been privately telling other government officials
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: that Trump's name is in the file. You always want
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: your FBI director to be the office gossip. That's the
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: person you want to trust with the nation's The top
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: law enforcement official, you know, he's got loose lips. Loose
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: lips sink ships there, Kash Patel. The president seems to
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: know where this is all going. A witness leaked to
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: Playbook that Trump said in the Oval, quote, they're going
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: to accuse me of some funny business. And that even
• 4:24
  Speaker 3: though he claims he didn't do anything wrong, quote, they're
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: going to fuck me anyways. Delicious. What do you think, Dan?
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: How does this explosive revelation that we all saw coming
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: change the nature of this almost three-week-old scandal now?
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: I would hope that this changes how everyone, ourselves included,
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: talks and thinks about this scandal. Because we've had a
• 4:50
  Speaker 4: lot of fun with this. We're going to have fun
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: about it on this podcast, I hope. There's something amusing
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: about it. But I feel like everyone has been treating
• 4:58
  Speaker 4: this kind of from a perspective of bemusement. Like, ah,
• 5:01
  Speaker 4: look at these conspiracy-pushing grifters who've been hoisted on their
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: own petard, right? Where the real crime here is hypocrisy
• 5:08
  Speaker 4: and deception, right? They said they released the Epstein files,
• 5:10
  Speaker 4: but they didn't do it. Trump's breaking a campaign promise. Ha,
• 5:14
  Speaker 4: take that. Dog that caught the car, all of that.
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: But I think we do really have to take a
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: step back. And I know this is going to sound
• 5:19
  Speaker 4: like hyperbole. I know it will, but I truly believe it,
• 5:21
  Speaker 4: that this scandal now, with this revelation, this scandal now
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: should be treated like Iran-Contra, Watergate, other major political scandals.
• 5:31
  Speaker 4: Because what we have here is the President of the
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: United States, the Attorney General, the intelligence community, FBI director,
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: and the Republican Congress, all part of a conspiracy to
• 5:42
  Speaker 4: cover up information about the President of the United States'
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: relationship with America's most notorious child sex trafficker.
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: And lying about it.
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  Speaker 7: Right.
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  Speaker 4: And he lied to the American people, either by direct
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: order or by implicit request. The intelligence community, we have
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: intelligence professionals, like what's theoretically one of the most apolitical
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: parts of the government, concocting a bullshit report we're going
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: to talk about to try to distract people from the
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: political fall of this. We have the Republican Congress shutting
• 6:11
  Speaker 4: down and going home for a month because they are
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: so afraid to vote on a measure that could shed light,
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: once again, on the President of the United States' relationship
• 6:20
  Speaker 4: with America's most notorious child sex trafficker. This really is
• 6:24
  Speaker 4: a giant deal. We need to know, what is that
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: hearsay Trump's worried about in the files? What is in there?
• 6:30
  Speaker 4: What do we not know about Trump's relationship? What other
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: steps have been taken to try to cover this up?
• 6:36
  Speaker 4: Have there been efforts to alter or destroy the records?
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  Speaker 4: What other government officials have hit it? Who else has
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  Speaker 4: been lied to? This is a big deal, and it
• 6:44
  Speaker 4: should be treated as a big deal, in my view.
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: Did you hear Mike Johnson say in an interview that,
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: we don't know. When we get the documents, the deep
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: state might have doctored the documents. Yes.
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: They put Trump's name in there, yes.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: That's the next thing, because the deep state did it.
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: Trump has been leading. He has been... This is one
• 7:01
  Speaker 4: of the clues that you and I took as evidence
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  Speaker 4: that Trump knew his name, or at least suspected his
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: name was the Epstein Files, was he kept saying, how
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: are we going to know the real? Maybe Comey and
• 7:09
  Speaker 4: Biden and whoever else doctored them to put his name
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: in there, right?
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: And now, so first of all, their initial reaction to
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: the story from Stephen Chung, the communications director at the
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: White House, was, oh, this is a fake, another fake
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: Wall Street Journal story. Then the journal reached out to,
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  Speaker 3: and I think the Times first, reached out to Bondi,
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  Speaker 3: and DOJ and they said, well, we just briefed the
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: president on what was in there and we didn't find
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: anything worthy of prosecution or further investigation, carefully chosen words.
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: That was the next explanation. They also had an explanation that, oh, well,
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: we knew his name was in there because in those
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  Speaker 3: binders that Pam Bondi handed out to all the right-wing
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  Speaker 3: crazies who came to the White House, that started this
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  Speaker 3: whole thing, you know, Donald Trump's phone number was in
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: there and everyone knew that. And it's like, okay, okay. Well,
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: if Trump's name's in the files and it's just completely benign,
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  Speaker 3: why not release it? Why did you have to lie
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  Speaker 3: about it?
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  Speaker 6: Right?
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  Speaker 3: If all that's in the files about Trump is what
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: is publicly known about Trump, which is that he used
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  Speaker 3: to party with Jeffrey Epstein and hung out with Jeffrey
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  Speaker 3: Epstein and And Jeffrey Epstein went to his first wedding
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: and there's pictures of them together. And we know that
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: he flew on his plane a bunch of times. If
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: it's just that, that's just verified in the documents. I mean,
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: it's not fun to have that come out, but it's
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: already known. So why cover it up?
• 8:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: I mean, the chain of events here is they were
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: planning to release the files. They were on Pam Bondi's desk.
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  Speaker 4: They released that first tranche that had his name in it.
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  Speaker 4: At that point, they did not say, we're not going
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  Speaker 4: to release more. Because after that went out, Pam Bonney said,
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: these are on my desk for review. She reviewed them,
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  Speaker 4: found something that she thought would be quite embarrassing to
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  Speaker 4: the president, and they changed their plan. And they've continued
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: to believe that the massive amount of political fault they've
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: been getting now for almost three weeks is preferable to
• 9:06
  Speaker 4: whatever they believe is in the files.
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: So, as you mentioned, Mike Johnson tried to bail him out.
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: by literally just like sending everyone home for the summer early.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: School's out. Everyone get out of here. No vote. They
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: were going to take a vote to try to compel
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: the DOJ to release more information.
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: Not even compel them. Just since you just said.
• 9:31
  Speaker 3: That was the unbinding one.
• 9:32
  Speaker 6: Right.
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  Speaker 4: A sense of Congress that it would be nice if
• 9:35
  Speaker 4: they released it. And they couldn't even do that.
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: And yet, yeah, and yet his gambit sort of failed
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: because the House Oversight Committee... found there were enough Republicans
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: on the House Oversight Committee, I believe three, voted with
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: all the Democrats to subpoena the Justice Department for the files,
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: and they took that vote just before they left town
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: in a move that surprised, I think, just about everyone.
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  Speaker 3: The committee also subpoenaed Epstein co-conspirator Ghislaine Maxwell to come
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: testify before Congress, though it seems like Trump's DOJ is
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: trying to get to her first. It's like a fucking
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: mob crime movie. Trump's personal lawyer-turned-deputy, Attorney General Todd Blanche
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: is visiting Maxwell in jail today, Thursday, and she reportedly,
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: according to her brother, has new evidence to share, and
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: wouldn't you know, Dan, she's also reportedly interested in a pardon. No, no, no. Amazing.
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: Two totally unrelated things.
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: So the co-conspirator of the child sex trafficker who's currently
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: serving 20 years in prison has probably a lot more
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: to say Because she was never interviewed by the Justice
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: Department on any of the Epstein files. And before she
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: can testify to Congress, she gets a visit from the
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: president's former personal lawyer turned deputy attorney general, who's going
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: to meet with her first, knowing that she wants a
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: pardon and that his boss, the president, has the power
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: to give that pardon. What do you think is going
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: to happen there? Is she going to be a straight shooter?
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: Seems totally above board. Like, if you can't trust a
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: convicted child sex trafficker, who can you trust, honestly? But, like,
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: you've nailed the exact problem here, why this is such
• 11:24
  Speaker 4: potential corruption, such a massive scandal, is that you have
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: Ghislaine Maxwell, a convicted child sex trafficker, who wants a pardon,
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: meeting with the Justice Department official who just happens to be,
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: by chance, Donald Trump's personal defense attorney. And we know
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: that Trump has dangled pardons before. The Mueller report concluded
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: that Trump's public communications about Roger Stone when Roger Stone
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: was being prosecuted for crimes related to the Russiagate was
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: consistent with the idea of dangling a pardon to try
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: to interfere with his cooperation. He specifically dangled, he almost
• 12:04
  Speaker 4: explicitly dangled a pardon in front of Paul Manafort when
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: Paul Manafort's plea deal fell apart. There is a report,
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: an unverified report, but a report nonetheless that In 2017,
• 12:13
  Speaker 4: Congressman Dana Rohrabacher went to meet with Julian Assange with
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: a pardon promise from Trump if Assange would say Russia
• 12:19
  Speaker 4: did not hack the election on Trump's behalf. So we
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: have seen this before, right? We don't have any evidence
• 12:23
  Speaker 4: that's what's happening here, but we have very real reason
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: to be suspicious. These people have lost all benefit of
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: the doubt.
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm waiting for Todd Blanch to come out of
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: that meeting and be like, oh, just found out from
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: Julian Maxwell that Donald Trump, he was actually the one
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: that said, Jeffrey, Jeffrey, enough with those girls. I'm going
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: to report you. Those girls look too young. And you
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: know who else was there and said, I don't care,
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: Bill Clinton.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: And that's what.
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: I'm waiting for. And when Obama was on Epstein Island,
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: he told them about the pending treason plan.
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: Yes. Yes, exactly. Yeah, he had it right in his pocket.
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: So I'm sure that Trump and Johnson are just hoping
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: this thing blows over by the time Congress comes back
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: in September, now that they've escaped early. What do you think?
• 13:09
  Speaker 4: It's hard to see how the fundamental political dynamics change here,
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: which is the overwhelming majority of American people want disclosure
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: of the Epstein files. The Republicans in Congress are caught
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: between wanting to be with not just the 80% of
• 13:22
  Speaker 4: Americans who want this, but the part of their base
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: who very strongly wants it and not getting on the
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: wrong side of Trump. Democrats are going to continue to
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: offer this amendment in the House Rules Committee. And if
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: they cannot pass a rule, they cannot pass a bill
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: because it's going to require– if you don't pass a rule,
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: then you have to– you need two-thirds– of the House
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: to pass the bill so that they can barely pass
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: it with 50% of the House. And so I don't
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: see how it fundamentally changes. Ultimately, they're going to have
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: to pass something or there's going to have to be
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: some promise of disclosure to make this political dynamic change.
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: Of course, there's going to be a million news cycles
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: between now and when the House gets back. And I'm
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: sure we won't be talking about the Epstein scandal every
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: pod from now until then.
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: Don't be so sure.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: But who knows? But like, I do think they're all
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: going to come back and you're right. Like it's, I
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: guess Maxwell's going to testify in August, right? So they'll
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: come back for that testimony. But like, I don't know.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: I don't see how they get past. I don't see
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: how they keep all the files at this point. Maybe
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: they just decide to, I mean, you know, these people lie,
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: break the law, cheat all the time. So who knows?
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: But they can fight the subpoena in court. I mean,
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: the DOJ has a long history of doing that, sometimes
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: for reasons that are legitimate because their fear that it would,
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: in a legitimate situation, mess up an ongoing investigation. That's
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: obviously not the case here. Eventually, they're going to have
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: to vote. Maybe they vote to compel, or the Republicans
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: are forced to vote a town and sort of eat
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: their spinach there.
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and again, and we've talked about this before, there
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: are good reasons, even in this case, for the withholding
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: of some information. There's videos of the victims. And also,
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: you know, there's rules about like you don't want to
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: release a ton of hearsay about people if they're not
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: incriminated in something. Now, I think you can also make
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: an exception for the current president of the United States
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: that might be implicated in something. So like there are
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: good reasons. I'm sure that there are courts to litigate
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: those reasons. But yeah, they can certainly of the however
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: many 400 gigabytes worth of material, they can probably release
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: a little bit more.
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: They can at least release the parts that mentioned Donald
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: Trump's name.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that'd be one thing. That'd be one thing, particularly
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: if there's nothing in there that he finds that's incriminating, right?
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: If there's no quote-unquote funny business, then what's the big deal?
• 15:39
  Speaker 8: Right.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: Did you see, by the way, that this old video
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: that's been circulating, I saw Midas Touch tweeted it out
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: from 2010, and it's from the Epstein deposition where he
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: gets asked about partying with Donald Trump?
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: Not only did I see it, John, I said it
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: to you. Ha ha ha ha!
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: I can't remember who sent me what anymore. Let's listen.
• 16:03
  Speaker 8: Have you ever had a personal relationship with Donald Trump?
• 16:09
  Speaker 5: What do you mean by personal relationships?
• 16:11
  Speaker 8: Have you socialized with him?
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, sir.
• 16:15
  Speaker 5: Yes?
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: Yes, sir.
• 16:16
  Speaker 8: Have you ever socialized with Donald Trump in the presence
• 16:21
  Speaker 8: of females under the age of 18?
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: Though I'd like to answer that question, at least today,
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: I'm going to have to assert my 5th, 6th, and
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: 14th Amendment right, sir.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: Is there just too much bullshit out there about Donald Trump,
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: too much scandal that this was out there and it
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: just wasn't a big deal at some point because everyone
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: just assumes that Donald Trump is a fucking predator?
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think there is this assumption that I mean,
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: this is a very, very gross way of looking at
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: the world, but because Donald Trump has survived politically amidst
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: all of the accusations, E.G. and Carol, the Access Hollywood tape,
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: all the reporting that came out right before the election
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: of the women he had sexually assaulted or involved with
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: sexual misconduct with, and he survived all of that, then
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: none of this stuff would matter. This video is such
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: an artifact of history because if you follow where Midas
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: Touch got it from, it's from a 2016 Daily Wire
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: blog post detailing Donald Trump's long, gross associations with Jeffrey Epstein.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Now Ben Shapiro, fully on board, fully on board.
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: Let's talk about the politics and what Democrats should do now.
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: Our friends at Data for Progress asked likely voters last
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: week what news story they'd heard and seen the most
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: about recently. The leading answer by a large margin was Epstein.
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: 37% said they'd heard, quote, a lot about the story.
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: That was up from 25% the week before. When asked
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: why they think Trump hasn't released the files, 46% said
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: it's because they contain information that could incriminate him, given
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: that and a lot of other polling that has not
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: been so good for Trump on the Epstein drama. How
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: do you think Dems should handle this issue over the
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: next few months?
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: I think our goal should be to keep the issue
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: in the news as much as possible without putting too
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: much spit on the ball. I've seen other testing which
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: shows that the most effective messaging and the most effective
• 18:22
  Speaker 4: online posts are not Democrats talking about it. It is
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: clips of Republicans or people who previously supported Trump, podcasters, influencers,
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: criticizing Trump for this. That's the most effective medium. So
• 18:35
  Speaker 4: when we think about how we– like if we are
• 18:37
  Speaker 4: messaging– if you're an elected official and you're thinking about
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: how to use your platforms, that's one way to do it.
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: If we're thinking about it in the context of how
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: all of us are messengers and people in our lives
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: and you're sharing things in your group chat, the better
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: thing to share is the clip of Andrew Schultz talking
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: about this on Flagrant than it is some– Democrat ranting
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: about this on MSNBC or Positive America or anywhere else, right?
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: It's like the thing about someone whose motivations are not
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: automatically questioned, even in an issue on this one where
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: they're quite sincere.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: I think it's also just a proof point that's worth
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: bringing up when making other arguments that are also true
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: about Trump, which is he's lying about this. What else
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: is he lying to you about? He promised transparency on
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: this and is not fulfilling that promise what other promises
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: has he broken to you he's protecting elites here what
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: what else is he doing that's protecting elites like there's
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: just everything that's bad about donald trump that donald trump
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: is doing to hurt people to let people down to
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: disappoint people to break the promises he made during the
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: campaign like it's all in here in this scandal and
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: i think as we go on to talk about other
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: issues reminding people that this happened and that he's lying
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: to them here and he's hiding stuff from them here.
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: and he's covering this up, it's just another good proof
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: point to drive the argument home.
• 19:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah. You have to do this without sounding like you
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: were created in a talking points lab.
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I know. Some of them it's already getting there.
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: The argument here, right? These are not the words to use, right?
• 20:06
  Speaker 4: But the argument we want to tie this to a
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: broader narrative is that Trump embodies a corrupt political system
• 20:14
  Speaker 4: that protects the politically connected and the rich and powerful.
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: Don't use those words like that, because that sounds like
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: it was... I'm sure that sentence tests fucking phenomenal, but
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: it's not how you.
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: I'm sure it's in a lot of press releases right now.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: But that's the point you want to make, right? Think
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: about it that way is.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: Just make it like a human. Make it like a human.
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: And then like it is connected to tax cuts for
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: rich paid for by cutting Medicaid and food assistance. But
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: how you make that connection should be like a little
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: more natural than trying to jam it into 240 characters, right?
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: For your ex post or whatever else.
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: I mean, it just fits in with everything he's done
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: in the last six months. It's like, The guy's fucking
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: accepting $ 400 million jets from the Qataris.
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: I forgot about the jet. I was going through all
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: the list of Trump things. I forgot about the jet,
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: the crypto scams.
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: We're talking here Thursday. He's off going. He's going to
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: go play fucking golf in his golf course in Scotland
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: this weekend. He's, uh, you know, he, He gives the
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: big tax cuts to the rich people. He's always around
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: his fucking rich friends. He's jacking up prices on everything
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: that everyone buys from overseas. The inflation's up. He doesn't
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: give a shit about people. He gives a shit about himself.
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: And if you're rich and you're one of his buddies,
• 21:28
  Speaker 3: he'll protect you. And if not, he won't. And he'll
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: probably go after you for some people.
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: I mean, Democrats have been trying to make this point
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: for a decade now because it's so obvious. The guy...
• 21:38
  Speaker 4: shit's on a gold toilet. He's not a man of
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: the people. There's a reason it is broken through here.
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: Because one, it's a violation against his own base as
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: opposed to a violation against liberal values. Too often we
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: attack Trump through our view of the world. And this
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: is one where he has violated something through his view
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: of the world. And then the other reason is conspiracy
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: theories are the currency of the internet. There's a reason
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: that Jeffrey Epstein's conspiracy theory is such a gigantic deal
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: because it's been living online for years now. And so
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: now you have the combination of a issue that already
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: had a lot of currency online being jacked up, combined
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: with real news breaking from traditional news sources and high
• 22:23
  Speaker 4: levels of engagement from across the political spectrum. And so
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: it is breaking through to people in a way that
• 22:27
  Speaker 4: a lot of our policy-based arguments have not because they
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: don't reach outside of that political news bubble that we
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: struggle to get out of.
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: I just think everyone has always known about Trump that
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: he is a rich celebrity and has been for a
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: long time. And the reason that a lot of people
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: still like him or view him as like, you know,
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: a hero of the working class is because they've seen
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: him as a traitor to his class. Right. He's a
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: he goes against the establishment that he used to be
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: part of. Right. And he's taken on that. He's taken
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: on the elites who he knows. And so that has
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: sort of protected him. against the fact that he just
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: shits in a gold toilet, like you said. But if
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: he's seen as actually, oh no, maybe he is part
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: of that establishment. Maybe when push comes to shove, he
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: does protect those elites that he hangs out with, because
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: he actually does care about them, or doesn't care about them,
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: but he cares about himself, and he's just part of
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: that culture. They don't want to think he's part of
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: that culture, but look what he's doing in the Epstein case.
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: Sure looks like he's protecting the establishment. So I do
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: think there's a story that makes sense to people, because
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: it's true.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: Positive America is brought to you by Mint Mobile. You
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• 25:36
  Speaker 3: So Trump, of course, realizes that if he wants a
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: change of the subject, he's got to make sure he
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: turns up the crazy to like an 11 or a 12.
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: Can't be just doing your standard issue conspiracies. You really
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: got to turn it up, which is why he spent
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: all week accusing his predecessor of a crime that's punishable
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: by death. Let's listen.
• 25:56
  Speaker 7: The leader of the gang was President Obama, Barack Hussein Obama.
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: Have you heard of him? This was treason. This was
• 26:04
  Speaker 5: every word you can think of.
• 26:06
  Speaker 7: And you should mention that every time they give you
• 26:08
  Speaker 7: a question that's not appropriate. Just say, oh, by the way,
• 26:12
  Speaker 7: Obama cheated on the election. I have great respect for
• 26:16
  Speaker 7: Tulsi and the documents they found on President Obama. Frankly,
• 26:21
  Speaker 7: it was an Obama thing, but it was the people
• 26:23
  Speaker 7: that worked under him also working with him.
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: So many, you wouldn't believe the documents they found on Obama.
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: They just, they were, they were, his pockets were stuffed
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: with them and they all said, Prison plan.
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: Step one.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: Step one. Here's how I'm going to do the coup.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: You might be wondering what the actual allegation is. Unfortunately,
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: the administration official who cooked it up can't really explain
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: it either. Here's Tulsi Gabbard not answering questions from CBS's
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: Ed O'Keefe about the years-old information she's trying to repackage
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: as a new scandal.
• 26:58
  Speaker 9: The Senate Intelligence Committee spent several years looking into this.
• 27:01
  Speaker 9: and unanimously agreed in a bipartisan fashion Secretary of State
• 27:05
  Speaker 9: Rubio was a member of that committee, that there was
• 27:07
  Speaker 9: no political interference. There was a years-long Justice Department investigation
• 27:11
  Speaker 9: into this.
• 27:12
  Speaker 5: As well that also concluded no political interference.
• 27:14
  Speaker 9: So help us from a 50,000-foot level explain, what do
• 27:19
  Speaker 9: you now have?
• 27:20
  Speaker 10: I'm not asking you to take my word for it.
• 27:22
  Speaker 10: I'm asking you and the media to conduct honest journalism
• 27:26
  Speaker 10: and the American people to see for yourself. President Obama
• 27:30
  Speaker 10: directed an intelligence community assessment to be created to further
• 27:36
  Speaker 10: this contrived false narrative that ultimately led to a years-long
• 27:40
  Speaker 10: coup to try to undermine President Trump's presidency.
• 27:42
  Speaker 5: And did you believe that.
• 27:43
  Speaker 9: Those two previous investigations missed that or covered it up?
• 27:47
  Speaker 10: I'm telling you to look at the evidence. Look at
• 27:50
  Speaker 10: the evidence and you will know the truth.
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: You think she has looked at the evidence?
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: I'm not so sure.
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: I don't think she can explain the evidence. I guess
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: the crime is the creation of a false narrative. I
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: didn't know that a false narrative could be a coup.
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: But there was even the creation of a false narrative.
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: I know. We can get into it. There's so many
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: steps that you have to get to. I mean, it's wild.
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: But anyway, Lindsey Graham and John Cornyn, they're also calling
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: for Trump's DOJ to appoint another special counsel to conduct
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: another investigation into Russiagate because apparently the several investigations conducted
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: by Trump's party and Trump's DOJ in Trump's first term
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: weren't enough. As for Obama, his spokesperson issued a statement
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: that said, quote, out of respect for the office of
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: the presidency, our office does not normally dignify the constant
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: nonsense and misinformation flowing out of this White House with
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: a response, but these claims are outrageous enough to merit one.
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: These bizarre allegations are ridiculous and a weak attempt at distraction.
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: What do you think, Dan? Do you think... Do you
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: think they can will this scandal into existence just by
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: repeating treasonous coup and false narrative and manipulated intelligence over
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: and over again?
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: I don't think we should call this a scandal. I
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: don't even know what else to call it, like a
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: crock of shit. A scandal suggests that there is an
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: allegation of something. There's at least a credible allegation of something.
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: They can't even explain the allegation. It makes no sense.
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: This is the most easily debunked thing in the world.
• 29:27
  Speaker 4: And the shortest way I would do that is, how
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: could it possibly be a scandal when, how could it
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: possibly be that Obama was trying to steal the election
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: from Trump when during the election, the FBI was investigating
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: Trump and told no one but the FBI instead announced
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: an investigation of Hillary Clinton three weeks before the election?
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: It's all part of the plan.
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: I mean it's so stupid. Can they get MAGA media
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: to report on this and talk about it and maybe
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: take some attention away from Epstein there?
• 29:57
  Speaker 8: Sure.
• 29:57
  Speaker 4: Can they get the base who wants to believe everything
• 29:59
  Speaker 4: Trump says to believe this?
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 30:01
  Speaker 4: Can they make anyone take it seriously other than that?
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: I don't think so.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think so either. It's wild. I mean,
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: I guess I'm not surprised that Tulsi would do this.
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: She doesn't seem like the brightest bulb. And obviously Trump
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: yells treason. It's not the first time Trump has accused
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: Barack Obama of treason. I don't know if anyone remembers.
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: He's done it multiple times before. Probably won't be the last.
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: He likes to do that when he, you know, that's
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: his card to play when things get really bad. You
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: got to go right for Obama. I don't think it's
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: the smartest move to accuse the most popular political figure
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: in the country of treason based on a concocted scandal
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: that no one can fucking understand. But, you know, he's trying.
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: It's funny. I was home and Emily was like, what
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: is the whole Obama thing? And I'm like, okay, well,
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: I go, it's bullshit, you know? And she's like, yeah,
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: but like, what are they trying to say? And I
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: started explaining it and within 10 seconds, she's like, I
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: don't know what you're fucking talking about. I can't, just
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: move on. And that is what is benefiting them is
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: that it is, once you start explaining it for like
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: 10 seconds, it becomes so fucking confusing because you have
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: to go back to season one and you have to
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: have everyone remember what happened with Russiagate and the hacking
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: of the DNC and the WikiLeaks and the disseminating of
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: the emails and all this bullshit. And it's just, and I,
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: just to explain this, to talk about it, to try
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: to rebut some of it on Twitter, have gone down
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: the rabbit hole and whew, it is like, it is PTSD, man.
• 31:42
  Speaker 4: I mean, just, it's worth, when I saw the tweet
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: this morning of John Cornyn, from Lindsey Graham saying that
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: he and John Cornyn were calling over a special counsel,
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: I was like, oh, this isn't a big deal. And
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: then it took me a minute to remember. that they
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: actually appointed a special counsel named John Durham to do
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: this exact thing. And he found, he basically affirmed the
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: conclusions of the Senate Intelligence Committee report and what the
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: Obama folks put out, and that there was no conspiracy
• 32:05
  Speaker 4: to hurt Trump in any way, shape, or form other
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: than some paperwork problems in the Carter page, a name
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: I totally forgot, FISA warrant.
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: Well, Tulsi's like, and there was a meeting then that
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: Obama called in December. And it's like, yeah, Everyone knows
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: about that meeting. That was a public meeting. As Ben
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: mentioned on Pod Save the World, he wrote about it
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: in his book, this meeting. And then in that meeting,
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: he directed his national security team to develop an intelligence
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: assessment that pulled together everything they knew about Russia and
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: then manufactured this narrative. And it's like, okay, so then
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: what did they find a month later? Well, a month later,
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: they find that Putin conducted an influence campaign aimed at
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: the election with the goal of undermining faith in the
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: democratic process and hurting Clinton's candidacy. her potential presidency the
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: dispute is so no one disputes that part right even
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: tulsi is in her stuff now is not disputing that
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: putin interfered in the election which it seemed like she
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: was at first but when you read the report and
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: now what you're saying they agree that putin interfered their
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: dispute is that putin didn't interfere to help trump that's
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: the conclusion that the Obama intelligence assessment came to that
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: they have a problem with. And they think that this conclusion,
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: that Putin didn't just interfere in the election, but he
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: interfered with the intent of helping Donald Trump win, that that,
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: that narrative, which is false, which Obama knew was false,
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: is what I guess led to Trump firing Comey, which
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: is what led to Mueller becoming the special counsel, which
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: is what led to the Mueller investigation. which is what
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: then led to no charges against Donald Trump and his
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: presidency continued on. I honestly don't know. And it's like, oh,
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: you know how we knew that Putin interfered not just
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: to undermine democracy, but because he wanted to help Donald Trump?
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: Because he fucking told us. He admitted it later. And
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: also they're like, well, some people in the intel community
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: weren't sure that Putin wanted to interfere to help Donald Trump.
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: And it's like, you know what I had forgotten about
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: until I read Glenn Thrush's excellent piece on this?
• 34:14
  Speaker 4: Please tell me this is the New York Times story.
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, it linked to another New York Times story
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: from 2019 that I hadn't even read. I was talking
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: to Tommy about. Apparently, the CIA, and this is just
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: a fun spy story, but the CIA decades ago cultivated
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: an asset in Russia that ended up working his way
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: up through the ranks of Russian officials until he was
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: a senior official. who regularly saw Putin. And so like
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: we had this guy, we had a CIA agent inside
• 34:47
  Speaker 3: the Kremlin that was seeing Putin regularly. And it was
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: so secret that apparently when Obama was president, and I
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: know this from the New York Times piece, I am not,
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: I didn't know this at the time. I didn't know
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: this until last night, but this was a 2019 New
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: York Times piece, that it was so secret, the existence
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: of this source in the Kremlin, that it didn't even
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: appear in Obama's intel briefings that Brennan sent it to
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: him separately in an envelope just to him to let
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: Obama know what was actually going on because they didn't
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: want anyone else to know. And this was the source
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: that first said, later confirmed by a million other pieces
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: of intelligence, which Tulsi leaves out, this was the source
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: that said that, oh yeah, Putin wants to help Trump.
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: He has a preference for Trump. So the idea that
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: some other asshole in the intel community is like, I
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: don't know if we have the evidence. Well, clearly they did.
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: Clearly they did. And by the way, the reason we
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: all know this now is because since we had to
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: have the intelligence assessment out there, all of a sudden
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: everyone got worried in the CIA that this guy was
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: going to get found out by Putin because Putin likes
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: to kill people who do that. And so they extracted
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: him from Russia. They brought him back here. And I
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: guess he's here somewhere in the United States. It's very
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: the American, Stan. I just thought it was a cool
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: side story for all this.
• 36:02
  Speaker 4: I don't have a source in the Kremlin. Now we
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: have none.
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: That was one of the problems. We lost our big
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: source in the Kremlin.
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: But the piece of evidence I have that Putin wanted
• 36:12
  Speaker 4: to help Trump was that he— Besides.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: Putin telling us later.
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: Well, that's one clue, if you will. But also, he
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: only hacked Hillary's campaign.
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: Well, there's that, too.
• 36:24
  Speaker 4: That was just like a— just if you're looking for clues.
• 36:27
  Speaker 8: Well, no, no.
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: Dan, you've got to go down the rabbit hole. According
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: to Tulsi, the reason he hacked Hillary's campaign is because
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: he decided that Hillary was definitely going to win, that
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: Trump wasn't, and so he was holding stuff back to
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: undermine Hillary's presidency. There's always another reason. And look, that's possible.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: He probably did want to undermine her presidency, and he
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: might have even thought that she was a shoo-in like
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: the rest of us did. But that doesn't mean that
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: he didn't want Trump to win. That didn't mean that
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: he didn't try to interfere to help Trump win.
• 36:57
  Speaker 4: Well, then he would have held the information back until
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: after the election.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: Well, he held some back. That's right. But he didn't. No,
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: he used it all. He didn't. And if we all remember,
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: what happened in the summer right before Russia, through WikiLeaks,
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: dumped all of the Clinton emails? Oh, I remember. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: Do you remember?
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: Did Trump stand before the world and call on Putin
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: to hack Hillary's email server? Did that happen? Yes, he did.
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: Specifically calling Russia to do that? He said that out loud.
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: Kids, you can Google that. You can look on the YouTubes.
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: You'll find some great clips from 2015, 2016 of Trump saying, Russia,
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: if you're listening, I love you to dump emails. And
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: guess what they did? In a short time after, they
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: dumped the emails that they hacked. It is so funny.
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: And then you get, of course, we watch Fox in
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: our office all day. And you get all these people
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: and they're like, Yes, but then Obama, they said that
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: he colluded and there was collusion. It's like, no, no, no, no, no.
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: This whole Obama treason coup thing, the intelligence assessment didn't
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: say anything about Trump's relationship or the Trump campaign's relationship
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: with anyone in Russia. There was nothing about collusion. There
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: was nothing about their relationship. That just wasn't in the
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: intelligence estimate, which none of these fucking MAGA influencers know.
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: because they're too stupid to look at the fucking information.
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: I have had this like weird fantasy over the last
• 38:24
  Speaker 3: couple of days.
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: I'm like, I cannot wait to hear what comes next.
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: I just want to, I am dying to debate one
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: of these people who is taking this seriously. Just anytime,
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: any place, come on pod, save America. I will go.
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: The only thing I won't do is do like a,
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: a three minute hit on Fox where like someone just
• 38:41
  Speaker 3: yells over me and then they cut the commercial. But
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: I would sit down on a podcast, with Matt Taibbi,
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: any of these, Megan Kelly, any of the jokers on Fox,
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: anyone in the administration, I guess, if they want, and
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: talk about this because this thing would fall apart in
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: five minutes. Five minutes.
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: Would you debate 20 Russia conspiracy-believing MAGA guys at the
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: same time?
• 39:07
  Speaker 3: This is my way of trying to get on, see,
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: Austin's smiling. He's so excited. This is my way of
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: trying to get on Jubilee. And look, I thought I
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: was debating Russiagate Suddenly, I got a bunch of Nazis
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: around me. Anyway, anyway, it's weird because look, the treasonous coup,
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: we've known about this and Trump says that the evidence
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: is overwhelming, that he's just guilty. It's been happening. It's
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: now been going on for a week, over a week.
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: They still haven't arrested Obama. What's going on? Where's the arrest?
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: I don't understand. You got the FBI? You got the
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: Department of Justice? Where's the warrants? Oh, the DOJ? DOJ
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: came up with a strike force? Ooh, put out a
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: press release. We're developing a strike force. Strike force is
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: going to look at the evidence. Okay, guys.
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: I just want to come back to the fact that
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: you just disclosed that you've been having this fantasy about
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: being on a podcast with Charlie Kirk.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 39:59
  Speaker 6: I know.
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: It's just so– I guess it's like I'm still– I
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: shouldn't be this naive this far into this. But it's
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: just wild watching them be like– they seem genuinely– like
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: outrage that this is such a scandal and they can't
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: believe this. And I'm like, did you read, did you
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: read the documents?
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: Did you even look at it? I'm the more cynical
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: of the two of us. Um, although you're rapidly catching up,
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: but not on, not in this exact moment, but I
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: just want you to know that if you do this,
• 40:25
  Speaker 4: there's not going to be a point where one of
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: these people just says, you know what, John, you're right.
• 40:28
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 40:29
  Speaker 7: I know.
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: I know, Dan. That's why that's usually when I move
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: on to the next thing.
• 40:34
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: Cause then I'm like, it's not gonna, I can say
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: whatever I want, but it's just not going to work,
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: but we'll see. What do you think of Obama's response?
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: Because I mean, like, I will say I'm like, OK,
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: I'm glad it didn't. I'm glad in response that sort
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: of standard and official like didn't come from him and
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: came from a spokesperson, because if he speaks about it,
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: I would like him to have some fun with this.
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: I know it's a serious topic, but I think he should.
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: It's not a serious topic.
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: Well, that's what I'm saying. Like, I'm sure everyone needs
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: to take it seriously because, you know, it's like Trump
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: is running the government and law enforcement and There's no
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: more independence. And so it's a real, it's live ammo here.
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: But I don't know. I think that Obama should mock
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: it because it is very mockable.
• 41:17
  Speaker 4: I think the best part of the response was the
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: last line, which is these findings were affirmed in a
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: 2020 report by the bipartisan Senate Intelligence Committee led by
• 41:24
  Speaker 4: then chairman Marco Rubio.
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: Who's been so quiet. So quiet, Dan. We have not
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: heard a word from Marco Rubio.
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: Marco Rubio, Secretary of State, last I checked, right?
• 41:35
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 41:35
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 41:36
  Speaker 3: And National Security Advisor.
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: Is he also head of the National Archives too?
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: And he's the archivist, yeah.
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: The archivist is the best part. But doesn't the State
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: Department do a briefing every single day?
• 41:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. They were busy at the briefing, also not
• 41:52
  Speaker 3: answering questions about why the guy convicted of triple homicide
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: in jail in Venezuela is now set free in America.
• 42:00
  Speaker 3: I don't know what Tammy Bruce is doing, the spokesperson
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: at those briefings, but certainly not answering questions about whether
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: the Secretary of State stands by the committee report that
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: he led that said Putin did interfere in the election
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: on behalf of Trump.
• 42:13
  Speaker 4: There's an entire group of people whose job it is
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: to go, who are reporters who go to work every
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: day at the Department of State. When Marco Rubio travels,
• 42:20
  Speaker 4: when he gets some time off from his archiving duties,
• 42:24
  Speaker 4: he travels with reporters. I assume at some point he's
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: going to have to answer this question.
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: I'm sure being the archivist, he has access to all
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: of that information.
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: Do you think he has access to the Epstein files?
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: Right. Marco's got it all. He's got it all. It's
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: just sitting there. Anyway, if anyone can find Marco Rubio
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: and ask him the question, get an answer out of him.
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: He's just deep in the stacks right now.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: Marco Rubio, if you're listening.
• 42:51
  Speaker 4: You can either answer this question or debate Jon Favreau
• 42:53
  Speaker 4: on a podcast. Your choice.
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• 44:23
  Speaker 3: Trump always needs villains to blame for his own failures.
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: This is why we're doing the treasonous coup right now.
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: But it's become a lot harder now that he controls everything.
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: So it's hard to find someone else to blame, which
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: is why he's been trying to pin inflation and high
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: prices on Fed Chair Jerome Powell. So we talked the
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: other day about how Trump seems to realize he can't
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: fire Powell unless it's for cause. That's what the law says,
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: at least. So his goons have been cooking up this
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: allegation that Powell has spent so much money renovating the
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: Fed building.
• 45:00
  Speaker 4: I can't do it with a straight face. It's so absurd.
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: All of this is the stupidest scandal that it might
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: be a crime or at least cause for him to
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: fire Powell. So I guess to get attention for this ploy,
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: Trump decided to visit the Fed headquarters today, Thursday, which
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: presidents don't usually do. And it's all under construction. And
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: it was just on before we started recording this. And
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: so there's this live shot of Trump and Jerome Powell,
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: and Tim Scott, because I guess he's on the relevant committee.
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: And they all got helmets on. They all got construction
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: hats on. And they stopped to talk to reporters. And
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: the reporters were all sycophants, apparently. I don't think there
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: was a real reporter in the pool. We can get
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: into this.
• 45:44
  Speaker 4: Apparently not.
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: But the first question is like, no, Mr. President, aren't
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: there so many budget problems and And hasn't the Fed
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: spent too much money on this renovation project, blah, blah, blah?
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: And then this is what happens on live TV.
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: Let's listen.
• 45:58
  Speaker 7: It looks like it's about $ 3. 1 billion.
• 46:00
  Speaker 10: It went up a little bit.
• 46:01
  Speaker 8: Or a lot.
• 46:03
  Speaker 7: So the $ 2. 7 is now $ 3. 1. I'm not aware of that. Yeah,
• 46:08
  Speaker 7: it just came out.
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: I haven't heard that from anybody at the Fed. You
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: just added in a third building is what that is.
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: That's a third building.
• 46:17
  Speaker 5: It's a building that's being built.
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: It was built five years ago.
• 46:21
  Speaker 4: Are there things the chairman can say to you today
• 46:23
  Speaker 4: that would make you back off some of the earlier criticism?
• 46:26
  Speaker 5: Well, I'd love him to lower interest rates. Other than that,
• 46:30
  Speaker 5: what can I tell you?
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: You are Jerome Powell. You are the chairman of the
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: Federal Reserve. You are responsible for setting the interest rates.
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: for the country, for our monetary policy, and you are
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: in the middle of a construction site arguing with the
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: President of the United States over line items in a building, Reno.
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: I just... And had to correct him. Oh, sir, the
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: number that you're saying there, that's a building that's already
• 47:04
  Speaker 3: been built. Trump's like, I don't know, what are you saying?
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: Like, what the fuck?
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: It is so... Stupid. It's like ham-handed jawboning of him
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: and Trump feels like he's in his element because he's
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: at a construction site and he's kind of somewhat incoherently
• 47:23
  Speaker 4: talking about how buildings are built and basements and reverse bathtubs.
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: There's like a lot of discussion in there about this stuff.
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: And the one thing you can take away from this
• 47:33
  Speaker 4: is that Jerome Powell thinks that Donald Trump is the
• 47:36
  Speaker 4: dumbest person who's ever walked the face of the planet.
• 47:38
  Speaker 4: And he cannot hide that sentiment for one second.
• 47:42
  Speaker 5: No.
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: And he was, he was through most of it. He's
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: like trying to look up. Like, I don't know. I
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: think it was hoping someone would like extract him from
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: the situation.
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: Like one of those overpriced beams would fall on his head.
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: That was the look on his face. Like, what am I,
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: how did I get here? What am I doing here?
• 48:00
  Speaker 4: Did he just, I mean, I don't, I'd be curious
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: about how he ended up there. Did he decide he
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: had to go because Trump was coming? Did Trump invite
• 48:08
  Speaker 4: him and he didn't want to say no? I mean,
• 48:10
  Speaker 4: I'm glad he was there to correct the record on
• 48:12
  Speaker 4: the rain. It was a great thing that Trump had
• 48:14
  Speaker 4: it on a piece of paper in his pocket so
• 48:16
  Speaker 4: that Jerome Powell could then look at it on live
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: television and tell him he's an idiot.
• 48:19
  Speaker 3: I know I was, I was worried for Powell for
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: a minute. Cause I'm like, who knows what this paper
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: says or where Trump got it? Like how, if I
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: was Jerome Powell, like he presents you with the paper
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: with a random number on it, you're going to be like,
• 48:29
  Speaker 3: I don't know. But, but clearly Jerome Powell knew that
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: it was, he knew what the money was.
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: It was a five-year-old building.
• 48:35
  Speaker 10: Yeah.
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: Also to your point about trump with the construction hat
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: and how he's the the the fox people uh as
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: they were cutting to uh him arguing with powell they're
• 48:46
  Speaker 3: like and there he is with that he is in
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: his elements with that construction hat on he is a
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: builder folks he is always he's been a builder he's
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: confident there this is what he does this is who
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: he is now let's listen um So anyway, yeah, so he,
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: you know, in front of the Fed chair, he's yelling
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: about interest rates. He also said later, so later at
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: some point they get back to Trump. They ask him
• 49:12
  Speaker 3: more questions. Powell has left at this point. Trump says
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: he doesn't think he's going to, he's not going to
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: fire Powell now because he thinks it would be too much.
• 49:21
  Speaker 3: It would be too big of a move, too much turmoil.
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: He says he has two or three other people in
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: mind for the job when Powell's term ends. And then
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: they shout a couple other questions at him. Of course,
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: they shout a question about Obama's treason. We heard that
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: clip when he said that they found all sorts of
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: documents on Obama in the imaginary search. And not a
• 49:43
  Speaker 3: single question about Donald Trump being in the Epstein files.
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: Not one question, Dan.
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: Truly insane. I know no one cares about this, but
• 49:54
  Speaker 4: this is the moment when it matters that the White
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: House now picks, handpicks the reporters who travel with the president.
• 50:01
  Speaker 4: Because I don't know who was in this pool. I
• 50:04
  Speaker 4: But it appears to be either– it appears to have
• 50:08
  Speaker 4: only been pro-Trump reporters, right? Because we know the wires
• 50:13
  Speaker 4: of services aren't in there anymore because the AP is banned.
• 50:15
  Speaker 4: And they just got rid of all the wire services
• 50:16
  Speaker 4: as a way to get around the AP ban. We
• 50:19
  Speaker 4: know that the Wall Street Journal is not in there
• 50:20
  Speaker 4: because they've been banned from the press pool for the
• 50:22
  Speaker 4: temerity to report on the president of the United States.
• 50:25
  Speaker 4: And so I assume that– because all the questions were
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: all friendly. And there was like a whole bunch of
• 50:28
  Speaker 4: questions about the renovations. like a lot of them. Like,
• 50:31
  Speaker 4: did you see anything when you walked through, did you
• 50:33
  Speaker 4: see anything that seemed overpriced?
• 50:37
  Speaker 3: Did you see any crimes? When you were walking with
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: the chairman, did he happen to commit any crimes while
• 50:45
  Speaker 3: you were walking?
• 50:46
  Speaker 4: Like how, the biggest story as you see, not just
• 50:49
  Speaker 4: like in politics, but in the country is Donald Trump
• 50:52
  Speaker 4: being in the Epstein files. He's in front of the
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: press for an extended period of time and no one
• 50:56
  Speaker 4: asked him about it?
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: Even, I was thinking, even if you had a bunch
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: of like MAGA media influencers who have been talking for
• 51:04
  Speaker 3: years about wanting to see the Epstein files, you'd think
• 51:07
  Speaker 3: that maybe one of them would have asked a question
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: about it.
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: They wanted, no one wants to kick you down the pool.
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: Well, hope they had a good time. Okay, we got
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: a few developments on Trump's increasingly unpopular deportation regime. Two
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: federal judges ruled on Wednesday that Kilmer Obrego Garcia must
• 51:23
  Speaker 3: be set free while awaiting trial on questionable, to put
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: it generously, human smuggling charges in Tennessee and and that
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: ICE couldn't just grab him and deport him during that
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: time when he was free-waiting trial. DHS spokesperson Tricia McLaughlin
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: called those rulings, quote, lawless and insane, before reiterating the
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: government's position that Abrego-Garcia will, quote, never walk America's streets again.
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: His attorneys are taking that promise seriously, which is why
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: they supported the government's request to keep their own client
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: locked up for another 30 days, because under the Trump regime,
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: an immigrant like Abrego-Garcia is safer in jail than on
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: the streets where ICE can disappear him. And yet one
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: person the Trump regime apparently has no problem letting walk
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: the streets is a dual Venezuelan-American citizen who had been
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: serving 30 years in prison in Venezuela for committing a
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: brutal triple murder in Spain. This guy was one of
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: the 10 prisoners that the Maduro regime released in exchange
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: for the 250 or so Venezuelan immigrants Trump disappeared from.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: to an El Salvador prison without due process, where some
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: now say they were tortured and abused for 125 days.
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: Many of them had come to the U.S. legally, had
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: no criminal record, and were accused without evidence of being
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: gang members. Meanwhile, the State Department has so far refused
• 52:46
  Speaker 3: to answer questions on the whereabouts of the triple murderer
• 52:49
  Speaker 3: we traded them for. They've only said, through a Rubio statement,
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: that he's somewhere in America right now. That's all we know.
• 52:57
  Speaker 3: So much for getting rid of the worst of the worst, huh, Dan?
• 53:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah. I imagine that there is no legal basis to
• 53:07
  Speaker 4: do anything with him other than set him free. He's
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: not convicted of a crime in the United States. But
• 53:12
  Speaker 4: the disparity between how Comarberger Garcia is treated, how people
• 53:18
  Speaker 4: walking the streets of America are treated by these masked
• 53:21
  Speaker 4: ICE agents and this individual just uncovers the fundamental lie
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: at the core of Trump's immigration policy, which is It
• 53:30
  Speaker 4: is not about crime. It's not about keeping America safe
• 53:33
  Speaker 4: from criminals. It's not about getting the criminals out of here.
• 53:36
  Speaker 4: It's about getting the immigrants out of here. Undocumented, documented,
• 53:40
  Speaker 4: naturalized citizens. It is very clearly about trying to change
• 53:45
  Speaker 4: the composition of what America is to make it less diverse.
• 53:48
  Speaker 4: It's like, that is what Stephen Miller believes. That is
• 53:51
  Speaker 4: very clear. Because if you stand on stage and you say,
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: we're going to get all the gang members and the
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: killers out here, and then we just bring killers back,
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: While taking people who are law-abiding, hardworking people who have
• 54:04
  Speaker 4: been parts of their communities for years and disappearing them
• 54:07
  Speaker 4: to torture prisons and to Somalia and Libya and other
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: places around the world, which makes it very clear what
• 54:12
  Speaker 4: this is about.
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: And also, how much money, how many agents, how much
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: time is spent going after dreamers and farm workers and
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: people who are here legally and sometimes American citizens that
• 54:26
  Speaker 3: could be directed towards People who have criminal records, people
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: who've committed violent crimes, whether they are undocumented immigrants or
• 54:37
  Speaker 3: even other immigrants or American citizens or whoever, right? Like
• 54:41
  Speaker 3: there is a opportunity cost to what they are doing
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: in terms of keeping people safe. There was this whole
• 54:49
  Speaker 3: story about how a customs and border patrol officer was shot.
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: I guess they were off duty and it was an
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: undocumented immigrant shot them. And everyone was like, this is
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: Eric Adams' fault and Kathy Hochul and the policies of
• 55:03
  Speaker 3: New York. But I was like, well, why was that
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: undocumented immigrant that shot the CPB officer, why was that
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: person free on the streets? Why didn't you have more
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: resources and more manpower trying to get that person? Oh,
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: because you were shipping people without a criminal record to
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: fucking El Salvador to a prison where they got tortured?
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: Is that why? Because you were like running into farms
• 55:22
  Speaker 3: to grab farm workers and their kids and send them away?
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: Why don't you put resources where they belong and actually
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: going after violent criminals?
• 55:31
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: That's an idea. We now are learning more about the
• 55:35
  Speaker 3: torture and abuse in Seacott because of interviews with some
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: of the men detained there that were just published by.
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: There's one story in The Washington Post, one in The Atlantic.
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: They describe being beaten and taunted by guards, denied legal counsel.
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: Forced to spend days in a cell known as the
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: island where they were deprived of water and slept on
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: the floor in a nearly pitch black room. Like, you know,
• 55:59
  Speaker 3: we were talking about this this morning before on the
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: show and it's like, I don't, it's, it's a horrific story.
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: There's nothing we can do about it now because it's
• 56:08
  Speaker 3: already in the past. They are still going to ship
• 56:10
  Speaker 3: people to third countries, deport people to third countries. So
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: who knows if there are other sea cots in the future?
• 56:15
  Speaker 3: I don't know if they're going to, send people back
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: to Seacott or what, if that's over, or they're just
• 56:19
  Speaker 3: going to now do South Sudan or wherever. But like,
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: is there a world where the Trump administration officials responsible
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: for this face accountability?
• 56:28
  Speaker 4: I hope. I mean, everyone should read these accounts because
• 56:32
  Speaker 4: they are so horrifying and the idea that our country
• 56:35
  Speaker 4: chooses to send people to these conditions. This is not
• 56:39
  Speaker 4: deporting people and having them end up in those conditions.
• 56:42
  Speaker 4: We are cutting an agreement with a government to ensure
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: that the people that we kick out of our country
• 56:48
  Speaker 4: are tortured. That is a deal that Marco Rubio made and,
• 56:52
  Speaker 4: and has defended and is proud of. And America does
• 56:56
  Speaker 4: not have the most stellar human rights record, but we
• 57:00
  Speaker 4: should be better than this. I would hope that the,
• 57:03
  Speaker 4: that the people involved in this will be held to
• 57:06
  Speaker 4: account over the course of time, right? That they will be,
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: you know, be the scene as the, the, the immoral
• 57:14
  Speaker 4: villains that they are, that they will be pariahs in
• 57:17
  Speaker 4: public life, that they will spend the rest of their
• 57:19
  Speaker 4: time defending themselves and explaining themselves to their children, their grandchildren,
• 57:23
  Speaker 4: their neighbors, everyone else for what they did in this moment.
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: Do I think they're ever going to have any sort
• 57:30
  Speaker 4: of accountability that measures up to what they've done here? No,
• 57:33
  Speaker 4: I don't think that. The one thing I would say,
• 57:37
  Speaker 4: because it is so dark, but I just would And
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: there's not much solace here. But if you look at
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: the polling, the American people reject this. And they reject
• 57:50
  Speaker 4: it pretty strongly. Donald Trump's immigration approval rating has dropped
• 57:54
  Speaker 4: like 17 points since March. There was a CBS poll
• 57:58
  Speaker 4: out this weekend that asked people specifically about how Trump
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: was handling deportation facilities, which I think in people's minds
• 58:02
  Speaker 4: includes SECOT. And he's 16 points underwater. right? There are
• 58:09
  Speaker 4: way too many people in this country who are okay
• 58:10
  Speaker 4: with what is happening, and that should make us question
• 58:12
  Speaker 4: a lot about who we are as a society, but
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: it should make people feel a little tiny bit better
• 58:17
  Speaker 4: that the majority of Americans reject this.
• 58:20
  Speaker 3: And I will also say, when we started talking about this,
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: when this started happening, there were a number, maybe most,
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: elected Democrats and others, Democratic strategists, other people were saying,
• 58:31
  Speaker 3: this is This is another distraction. He wants us to
• 58:34
  Speaker 3: talk about immigration. He's baiting us into this. And I
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: get it. I get what the immigration polling was after
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: the election. I've been critical about the Biden administration and
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: how we handled immigration in the 2024 election. But I
• 58:49
  Speaker 3: would just say, if we head into the midterms, Democrats
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: should talk about this issue. Not only because, as you said,
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: it is now the politically smart thing to do, The
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: public is on our side here. Fundamentally, that's what polls
• 59:05
  Speaker 3: should tell us, that the public is on our side.
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: But it's also just... it's not just the morally right
• 59:11
  Speaker 3: thing to do. It's the morally right thing to do
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: because it is the foundation of what the country should
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: be about, right? That this is a place where you
• 59:21
  Speaker 3: get due process, where you are innocent until proven guilty,
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: where you are not tortured, where you're not sent to
• 59:27
  Speaker 3: a place to be tortured. There's one guy in the
• 59:30
  Speaker 3: Atlantic piece from Venezuela. He was like a DJ. He
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: came here and he gets caught up by ICE and
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: they're like, oh, you didn't complete your asylum application and blah, blah, blah.
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: And where would you like to be? We're going to
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: deport you. And he's like, I want to be deported
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: back to Venezuela. Like my family's back there and it
• 59:47
  Speaker 3: sucks that I'm being deported, but like, that's where I
• 59:48
  Speaker 3: want to go. All these people, all the Trump people,
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: all this and they wanted deportations. You think that that's
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: what they wanted, right? Okay. This guy was here. He
• 59:56
  Speaker 3: did the right, you know, he didn't do it the
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: right way. Didn't finish his asylum application. Send him back
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 3: to Venezuela. Put him on a plane. He tells his
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 3: family he's coming back to Venezuela. Put him on a plane.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 3: Shut the windows. Everything's dark. When the plane lands, he's
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: in El Salvador. That's the first time he knows he's
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 3: in El Salvador. And he's not even in El Salvador
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 3: and set free in a country he's never been to
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: and doesn't know. He's locked up in this prison and tortured.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 3: What is the fucking legal rationale for doing that? I
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: do not understand. It seems illegal. It seems unconstitutional. And
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: the people who perpetrated it should face legal accountability. I just,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 3: it's crazy. I just don't, I don't understand. Un-fucking-real. Stephen Miller. Good,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 3: good shit. All right, when we come back from the break,
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 3: you will hear Tommy's conversation with Senator Mark Warner about
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: the Obama accusations and what the intelligence community really found.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: But one quick thing before we do that, We got
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: a new episode out of our subscription show, Inside 2025.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 3: Our friends Kate Shaw, co-host of Strict Scrutiny, and Ian Bassin,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 3: head of Protect Democracy, former colleagues of ours from the
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: White House, talk about what it's really like to work
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: in the White House Counsel's Office. They're great lawyers, Kate
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: and Ian, kept us all out of trouble. Until now,
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: that we'll all face charges of treason. They get into
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: all the challenges government lawyers face and how Trump is
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 3: shredding norms at the Department of Justice. To hear the
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: full conversation, get bonus content, and support progressive media, head
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 3: to cricket.com slash friends or subscribe on Apple Podcasts. When
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 3: we come back, Senator Mark Warner.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: Positive America is brought to you by the NPR Politics Podcast. Man,
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• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: I'm here with Senator Mark Warner of Virginia. As the
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, he's been following
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard's wild claims that Barack
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: Obama is guilty of a, quote, treasonous conspiracy.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: Senator, thank you. Welcome to the show. Well, thanks, Tommy.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's a wild time, man. It's a wild time.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: It is very weird.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: So President Trump is clearly desperate to change the subject
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: from his cover-up of the Epstein files to literally anything else.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: That's why he's pressing the treason button. So that's why
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: he accused Obama of treason earlier this week.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: That's why they.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: Trotted out Tulsi Gabbard. to the White House briefing room
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: to claim that Obama twisted intelligence information to say that
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: Russia's interference in the 2016 election was designed in part
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: to help Donald Trump win. She claims that this is
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 1: proof of a treasonous conspiracy. Here's a quick clip from
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: Gabbard's bizarre briefing Wednesday.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 10: The implications of this are far reaching and have to
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 10: do with the integrity of our democratic republic. It has
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 10: to do with an outgoing president taking action to manufacture
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 10: intelligence to undermine and usurp the will of the American
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 10: people in that election and launch what would be a
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 10: years-long coup against the incoming president of the United States,
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 10: Donald Trump.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: Senator, let's just start big picture. What's your response to
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: Gabbard's claims there?
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 5: Bullshit. I mean, it's ludicrous. Remember, Tommy, and you know this,
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 5: and I, but the Senate Intelligence Committee, when I was
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 5: vice chair, it was run by Republicans. We did a
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 5: three and a half year investigation. We had people like
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 5: Tom Cotton on the committee. If there had been any
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 5: evidence that any of the things that Gabbard just said,
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 5: you don't think the Republicans would have blown up? We
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 5: had a bipartisan, unanimous report that said, you know what?
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 5: Russia got into some voter files, but didn't mess with
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 5: the vote count. But clearly, They had an influence campaign. Clearly,
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 5: they had a preference. I mean, Putin himself acknowledged in 2018. And,
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 5: you know, the irony of this, hypocrisy is beyond the word.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 5: There's this worldwide threat hearing where all the intelligence community,
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 5: once a year, public lays out. In Gabbard's own worldwide
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 5: threat analysis, it still said Russia still does malign foreign influence,
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 5: tries to reflect elections, and, you know, to try to
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 5: bring out kind of like the greatest hits from the
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 5: 2020 campaign. As I said, you said it's desperation on
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 5: trying to distract people from the Epstein files.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's exhausting.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, it just feels like we've done this over
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 1: and over again. You know, you mentioned this Senate Intelligence
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: Committee report.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 2: I mean, I was reading it this morning. It's like
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 2: a thousand pages long. It's comprehensive. It was developed over
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: the course of years.
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: Can you tell me about now Secretary of State and
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: National Security Advisor and seven other jobs? Marco Rubio's role
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: in putting together the Senate of the report. I believe
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 1: he was chairman of the committee during the production of
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: some of this work, right?
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 5: Well, this had been something that, you know, originally Richard
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 5: Burr was chairman. He had some issues, so he had
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 5: to step aside. But what was so, I thought, cool
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 5: about the report was it was so straight down the middle.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 5: You know, when people came to get interviewed, and we
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 5: interviewed everybody, you know, they didn't know who was a Democrat,
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 5: who was a Republican. It was researched extensively. No one
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 5: has contradicted its conclusions. Clearly, there was a major influence campaign.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 5: Russia does this historically. We should not be surprised. The irony,
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 5: and again, in many ways, was that the Trump intelligence
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 5: officials at that point in 2018, 2019, 2020, like Paul Nakasone,
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 5: you know, they set up major election monitoring groups. And
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 5: because of the Trump intelligence community, we were better protected
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 5: in 2020 than we were in 2016. And now Gabbard
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 5: trying to bring out this whole line of hits. And Tommy,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 5: that's the thing that I also want to raise. A
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 5: week ago, she'd made these accusations based upon a totally partisan,
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 5: you know, Devin Nunes, the former House chair. That was
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 5: bad enough. Yesterday, she took a report that was so
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 5: classified that in the first Trump administration, when people threatened
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 5: to release it, people like Bill Barr threatened to resign
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 5: because it would reveal sources and methods. And that's kind
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 5: of the holy grail We don't want folks who are
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 5: working with us to get exposed. She dropped this report
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 5: yesterday without any redactions. And I think it surprised the
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 5: heck out of the CIA because I think they were
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 5: going through a redaction process. And it just shows that,
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 5: you know, there's no regard. She has no regard for
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 5: the integrity of the workforce of the IC. And on
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 5: top of that, she has no regard for our ability
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 5: to work with allies around the world because who in
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 5: the hell is going to work with us? This on
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 5: top of the Signalgate scam, And it just this is
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 5: long term damage that you can't just say, oops, we
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 5: made a mistake.
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to ask you a little bit more
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: about that House Intel report that she dumped out yesterday
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 1: in a minute, but just a little context for listeners.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: Like so one important reform the intelligence community made after
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: the Iraq war debacle was reports no longer just say
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: the CIA believes X or Y now says how confident
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: they are in that assessment. So a low confidence assessment
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: could be something like, you know, we we We have
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: fragmentary or, you know, not fully vetted information, whereas a
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: high confidence assessment could be something like we believe X
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: foreign leader thinks Y because the NSA intercepted a phone
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: call where this person said as much, right? So given
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: that context, like what is the ICs in your level
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: of confidence that Putin directed the 2016 election interference and
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: did so in part because he wanted Trump to win?
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 5: My confidence is extraordinarily high. I mean, but remember, this
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 5: should not be a high hurdle. Remember Donald Trump in
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 5: the campaign saying, gosh, if the Russians have got the
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 5: WikiLeaks stuff, leak it. If the Russians have got bad
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 5: stuff on Hillary, leak it. I don't think there was,
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 5: we ever reached a conclusion that there was actual collusion
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 5: between the two, but the idea that there was an
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 5: effort and that Putin had a clear choice and had a,
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 5: as you know, Tommy, a long-term animosity against Hillary Clinton
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 5: because she'd actually spoke up for Russian democratic reforms in
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 5: the early like 2011, 2012 timeframe. So, and the irony
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: is that factual basis of what we determined, not about
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 5: my Republican colleagues have said, well, you know, I've now
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 5: come to the conclusion that's not true.
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: And some of it is just so, glaringly obvious. I mean,
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: the GRU, Russian intelligence, they hacked the DNC and then
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 1: they dumped those emails out through a carve out. They
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 1: hacked a top Clinton aide named John Podesta. They dumped
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: his emails out too. They gave stuff to WikiLeaks around
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 1: the Access Hollywood tape release to distract from that. I mean,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: the Senate Intel Committee report found that no single group
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: of Americans were targeted by the IRA's social media campaigns. More,
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: that was the Russian sort of group based in St. Petersburg,
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: Russia that did a bunch of, you know, online bots
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: and things They were targeting African-Americans. Obviously, those are the
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: heart and soul of the Democratic Party's base. The two
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: top performing intentionally false reports on Facebook were Pope Francis
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: endorsement of Donald Trump for president and WikiLeaks confirmation of
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton's sale of weapons to ISIS. I mean, it's
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: like pretty obvious here who they wanted to win based
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 1: on just that fact pattern.
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 5: Remember as well, they had a fake Black Lives Matter site. Subsequently,
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 5: they had You know, there was the one that was
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 5: kind of, I thought, almost funny. They had a site
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 5: that said Tennessee Republican Party, but it was just, I think,
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 5: T-E-N instead of T-E-N-N. And it had more followers than
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 5: the actual Tennessee Republican Party's official site. So, you know,
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 5: the GRU's sophisticated. They took advantage of kind of our openness.
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 5: The fact that this is being relitigated at all at
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 5: this point, and Gabbard is making even more outrageous claims,
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 5: I mean, there's never been a director of national intelligence
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 5: that has politicized intelligence product. Again, share with your audience.
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 5: She actually had her henchmen fire some of the most
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 5: senior intelligence professionals because they wouldn't bend the knee and
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 5: change the report about the Venezuelan gang trying to hold on. Now,
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 5: these are bad guy gang, the Maduro government's bad guys.
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 5: But this notion that they were completely all connected, the
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 5: IC told truth. And then they fired people. And then
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 5: she's tried to look at all of the personal chat
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 5: between everybody in the IC. You give up certain privacy
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 5: protections if you work for the IC. But do you
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 5: really want your personal chat looked at depending on how
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 5: loyal you are to Donald Trump? This has never happened before.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 5: She was like on the Charlie Kirk turning point convention
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 5: last Sunday, trashing the workforce. We are in such uncharted
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 5: grounds with her behavior that, you know, again, I don't
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 5: think her claims got much attention since, you know, subsequently
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 5: later in the day it came out that Trump's at
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 5: least in some of these Epstein files. And we don't
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 5: know what. I'm not saying it's bad, but it's, you know,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 5: the irony again is this is the guy who spent
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 5: his whole campaign saying we got to disclose this stuff.
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 5: And now it seems like he's, you know, trying to
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 5: hide and obfuscate every way he can.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the idea of taking all these sort of classified,
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 1: highly classified, like intra-CIA communications where, you know, CIA officers
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: are talking about like named assets and collection techniques and
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: sources and methods, and then creating a database of all
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: of that for Tulsi Gabbard, for the Russians, and for
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 1: the Chinese to directly target seems like the dumbest thing
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: I could imagine. It's also worth noting, I keep bringing
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: this up, Yevgeny Prigozhin, the guy who ran the Wagner Group,
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 1: this now deceased oligarch, because he decided to drive his
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: tanks at Moscow, which was a bad idea in Russia.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: In 2022, he confirmed that Russia interfered in our elections.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: He said, gentlemen, we have interfered, are interfering, and will interfere.
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: He was prosecuted. He was indicted by the Trump administration
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: in 2018. He was sanctioned by Trump's Treasury Department for
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: his connections to this Russian troll farm and Russian interference.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: So the Trump administration, the first time around, certainly thought
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 1: that Russia was interfering, and there was really no debate
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 1: over who they preferred in the election. But you mentioned
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: this House Intelligence Committee report.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 5: Tommy, could I just add one other thing?
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 5: And this is the, again, some of the irony. The
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 5: Trump intelligence officials, the head of the NSA, Paul Nakasone,
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 5: Gina Haspel at the CIA during that time, you know,
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 5: they worked very aggressively so that we had a more
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 5: secure system in 2020. And they knew and fully acknowledged
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 5: what the Russians had done. And do you remember this? It's, again,
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 5: a blast from the past. But this guy, Chris Krebs,
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 5: who ran the Cyber Information Security Agency, literally got fired
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 5: because he told the truth that our election was secure
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 5: in 2020. So, again, relitigating this now and trying to
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 5: bring Obama. That's absurd. With that, I could see new lows,
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 5: but it's pretty wild. But let's go back to the report, sir.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I mean, there is this House Intel Committee report.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: I think it was written by now FBI Director Kash
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: Patel back in, what, 2017 or something?
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: What is this report? How does it differ from the
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 2: Senate report you worked on?
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 5: Well, what happened was the House Intelligence Committee was, the
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 5: Democrats and Republicans didn't even talk to each other during
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 5: that time. And there was a guy, Devin Nunes, who
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 5: was the chair. He now runs one of Trump's business operations.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 5: And there was no attempt for any kind of unbiased.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 5: They literally went out and cherry picked individual items. The
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 5: reports had no credibility, but what they also did that
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 5: was so dangerous. And since the report is out, you know,
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 5: they literally, with names redacted, but still quotes of information
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 5: that if you were that GRU or FSB, the Russians got,
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 5: you know, a variety of intelligence, you could look back
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 5: and say, well, who would know that conversation? And you
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 5: could have people's lives in jeopardy. This is so beyond
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 5: the pale. And the proof point of that was, They
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 5: tried to release this report at the end of the
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 5: first Trump administration, and everybody pushed back to the point
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 5: that people threatened to resign. And now, with no forewarning
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 5: or effort to kind of redact and protect those sources
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 5: and methods, she dropped this like a bomb yesterday. And
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 5: the amazing thing is, I guess people are so jaded
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 5: that it's not gotten the attention I thought it would get.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 5: I have... tried to guilt my Republican colleagues on the
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 5: end of committee, like how much more of this stuff
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 5: are we going to put up with before we say,
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 5: you know, this has nothing to do with partisanship. It
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 5: has to do with the fact that we've got to
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 5: protect the men and women who work for us in
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 5: the intelligence community and those countries around the world that
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 5: share info with us.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: So is your concern that by releasing this report, the
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: FSB or the GRU could target individuals who in the
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: past provided the United States intelligence about Russian government thinking,
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: or could go after ongoing operations.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 5: I'm not, I actually believe that the reasons for classifications,
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 5: I'm going to talk about that, but I am going
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 5: to say this was such a dangerous report. Trump officials
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 5: in the first administration threatened to resign if it came out.
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: Fair enough.
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 5: And I think this is a clear violation of what
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 5: we call sources and methods. And you can, you know,
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 5: explain that to the audience, which does mean at the
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 5: end of the day, yeah, people's lives could be in jeopardy.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 1: So Tulsi Gabbard, like Tulsi, you know, she's an odd duck.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 1: Before Before she got the job, I sincerely believe she
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: was motivated by trying to keep the United States out
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 1: of wars in the Middle East because of her service
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: in Iraq and her experience there. And also concerned about
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 1: the United States intelligence community being weaponized or politicized. Now,
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: whether that was true or not, I do think it
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 1: was something she talked about a lot. Since this time,
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: since getting the job, she's now let Trump ignore her
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 1: claim that Iran had not decided to get a nuclear
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 1: weapon and then contorted her views to fit what Trump
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 1: wanted to do. And now she's clearly weaponizing the intelligence
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: community to punish Trump's enemies and help distract from the
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 1: Epstein story. What are the implications of her actions to
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: the IC, but also just like the United States?
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 5: Well, remember, Tommy, this is like, imagine you're a senior
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 5: spy at the CIA. Remember the whole way that Trump
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 5: came in and those first few weeks. So you imagine
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 5: if you've been doing that job for 30 years and
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 5: you suddenly said, we got a new president and here's
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 5: the plan. Russia's our friend, and Canada, Canada is the enemy.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 5: You go, that's wackadoodle, but that's where they came from.
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 5: And what happens, we hear almost daily from the intelligence
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 5: community about morale being low, the number of people that
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 5: have taken buyouts that you can't replace overnight. And I
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 5: just really worry as well, the signal gate, the Israelis
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 5: were saying, we don't want you having that kind of
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 5: secret information. And yesterday, the word came out that Hegs
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 5: F got the information from a secret document.
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 2: Obviously. I'm not surprised at that or not.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 3: Right, yeah.
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 5: But it makes people say, I'm going to think twice
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 5: before I share information. There's no official agreement where countries
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 5: sign a document that we're going to share intel. It's
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 5: based on trust.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 5: And I've had leaders of some of our biggest allies
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 5: in the intelligence world say, Warner, what's going on? These
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 5: people getting fired? I worry. I have no evidence of this.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 5: Let me be clear. But I worry that we might
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 5: not get intelligence shared. And now with this dropping of
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 5: this report yesterday, in the business, people's heads are exploding.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 5: And we will never know that this is like an
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 5: unknowable fact, though. If somebody doesn't share with you You
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 5: don't know. There's not a way you can trace that.
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 5: But I have heard huge concerns. That is the kind
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 5: of thing that, say we made a mistake, you still
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 5: burn trust.
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 8: Right.
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 5: And that's ultimately the coin of the realm in intelligence.
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and they're burning it fast.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: I mean, to your point, the Washington Post reported yesterday
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: that the Defense Department's inspector general now has evidence that
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 1: the information disseminated by Pete Hegseth in those signal chats,
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 1: which is a commercial app, it's not appropriate for classified information,
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 1: was clearly marked as classified. It was a designation called
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: secret no foreign, which is the secret level of classification,
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: and it cannot be shared with foreigners. HEGSF, the Pentagon,
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 1: they've denied this many times, but it was obvious to
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 1: anyone who's ever worked with the Pentagon or seen sort
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: of like military planning operations that those are always classified
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: at the secret level, especially if it's prospective, it's happening
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 1: in the future.
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: What does accountability look like?
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 5: Can I just add one thing or two, Tommy?
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 5: What was wild was And Gabbard was on that call
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 5: as well. Gabbard was actually in a foreign country and
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 5: didn't go to a skiff, which is a secure place
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 5: you could make a call. But I've challenged her and Hegstaff,
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 5: you don't believe this was important information, come down to
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 5: Norfolk or Virginia Beach. I've done town halls down there.
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 5: And 20% of the audience either knew someone or had
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 5: a family member that was on the USS Truman, the
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 5: Truman's ported, that's the aircraft carrier that launched the attack
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 5: against the Hooties. And it's home ported in Norfolk. I said,
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 5: come and explain to those friends and family that this
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 5: didn't put their loved ones in harm's way. People were,
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 5: you know, I've seen folks pissed before, but this was
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 5: a level of anger from people that I think have
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 5: been traditional, you know, Republican supporters.
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Last question for you.
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 1: So Tulsi Gabbard, the last question of her little press
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 1: briefing was she was asked whether she is aware of
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: any connections between Jeffrey Epstein and U.S. intelligence or any
• 1:20:58
  Speaker 1: foreign intelligence agencies. She said, quote, I haven't seen any
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 1: evidence or information that reflects that. End quote. That struck
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: me as odd because or odd phrasing because Tulsi is
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 1: one of the few people in the world who has
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: access to information that would allow her to say definitively
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: yes or definitively no, especially when.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 2: It comes to connections to U.S. intelligence like the CIA.
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you've seen this, but it is
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: taken as an article of faith in the kind of
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 1: MAGA media world that Epstein was running a blackmail operation against.
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 1: either for the CIA or more likely for the Mossad
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 1: or maybe both. Do you know anything about reporting about
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 1: potential Epstein ties to U.S. intelligence or Israeli intelligence?
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 5: I do not. But I've heard those rumors. And you
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 5: would have thought, as the director of national intelligence, since
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 5: she was coming up, she must have known she was
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 5: going to get asked that question. And you are right.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 5: She could ask the question and get a response quicker
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 5: than I could. And even I'm viewed as gang of eight,
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 5: which is supposed to get all the information because that's
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 5: the speaker and the ranking members and the Intel chair
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 5: and vice chairs. But yeah, it was again, odd in
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 5: my mind too, that she kind of seemed to punt
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 5: on that.
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 2: Very odd.
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: Well, Senator, thank you so much for helping us try
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: to debunk this thing. Like trying to explain to sort
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 1: of friends and acquaintances why what Trump is saying and
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: what Tulsi is alleging doesn't make sense.
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 2: Cause it just, it's so absurd.
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 1: You know, it's like their, their allegation is like, aha,
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: here's intelligence that says, The Russians didn't hack and change
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 1: vote totals. And then you're like, but Obama never said that.
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 4: None of us ever said that.
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 3: No one said that.
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 5: But the thing, and I know that what kind of
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 5: gets lost in all this and with the information coming
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 5: out that Trump is somewhere named, and we don't know
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 5: what that means, but the part that's making me a
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 5: little crazy is, again, this kind of dropping classified information
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 5: without regard to the consequences of disrespecting the workforce. 13
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 5: years ago, 14 years ago, I didn't know that much
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 5: about the intelligence community, but man, I've come to really
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 5: believe that they are non-political patriots. They just want to
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 5: try to do the right thing. And we know when
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 5: we try to cook the books, that's how we got
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 5: into Iraq. So I'm going to stay at it and
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 5: I hope you will as well, but thanks so much
• 1:23:16
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• 1:23:17
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• 1:23:23
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