Latest / Becker’s Healthcare - Clinical Leadership Podcast / Michael J. Curren Jr., MD, MS, Clinical Assistant Professor of Medicine; eRecord Medical Director Provider Documentation and EHR Optimization; and Section Chief, Division Cardiology at UPMC

Transcript

Michael J. Curren Jr., MD, MS, Clinical Assistant Professor of Medicine; eRecord Medical Director Provider Documentation and EHR Optimization; and Section Chief, Division Cardiology at UPMC · Becker’s Healthcare - Clinical Leadership Podcast

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  Would you like to exchange best practices and ideas to improve care,
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  enhance operational efficiency,
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  and address financial challenges with your peers?
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  Becker's Healthcare is facilitating these conversations at their eighth annual
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  You can check your eligibility for complimentary attendance at the link in the
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  description. We are excited to welcome you in October.
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  This is Laura Dedo with the Becker's Healthcare Podcast.
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  I'm thrilled today to be joined by Dr. Mike Curran,
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  clinical assistant professor of medicine and eRecord medical director,
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  provider documentation, and E H R optimization.
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  And well as section chief of the division of cardiology at U P M C St. Margaret.
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  Dr. Kran, it's a pleasure to have you on the podcast today.
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  It's a pleasure to be here, and thank you for having me.
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  Now, I know we've got a lot to talk about.
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  There's so much happening in healthcare and really a lot changing with
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  technology and, um, how fast that is moving and evolving.
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  But before we dive into my questions,
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  can you tell us a little bit more about yourself and your background?
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  Sure. Um, well, first and foremost, I am a, a non-invasive cardiologist.
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  I practice on a daily basis seeing patients
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  across every venue of care. I do some minor procedures.
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  I spend time in the office and I see patients in the hospital.
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  So I do a little bit of everything. Um, at the same time,
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  I have a lot of responsibilities related to our electronic health record at U P
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  M C,
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  which has really evolved out of an interest in making processes better and has
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  developed into being involved in some of our strategic decision making and, um,
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  how we interact with both our end users and our patients at our organization.
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  Absolutely. I love that. And, you know, when you think about those two roles,
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  both on the technology side as well as the clinical side,
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  how have you been able to make them work together?
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  Has it really seemed pretty seamless to you? Or do you,
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  have you built over time strategies to really be effective at both?
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  Uh, that's a great question. Uh, I, I think for me, the,
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  the biggest value that I bring to, to what I do is that I'm,
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  that I'm doing both things simultaneously almost all of the time.
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  So when I'm delivering care to my patients,
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  I'm using the functionality and asking myself the question of, does this work?
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  Doesn't this work? What, what can be done better?
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  Or why does this work this way?
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  And I then take that back to technical teams and say, Hey, I noticed this today.
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  What's happening here? And we,
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  we discover things about something that we may have built a long time ago and we
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  can optimize,
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  or it leads us down a discovery path for doing something differently. Um, it it,
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  at the same time,
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  when I go to my colleagues and I'm talking to them about new functionality or
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  changes,
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  I have a lot of credibility with them because I'm delivering care every day with
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  them in some fashion. And so when I'm talking to them about,
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  this is why we're doing this, or I need you to do this, they,
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  they listen to me because they understand that I am there with them, um,
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  and part of the caregiving team. And it really, it really makes for a, a,
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  a successful partnership across our organization between me as an informatics
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  physician delivering care and working with our IT teams to,
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  to deliver a great experience for our patients and our, our physician staff.
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  Absolutely. I love that. I think, you know,
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  it's just so impactful to have both of those backgrounds and,
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  and that expertise front and center. So, you know, when you think about that,
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  um,
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  very unique place you're sitting at between the clinical care and the technology
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  teams that you work with,
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  what are some of the big opportunities that you have your eyes on right now as
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  well as the headwinds that are emerging?
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  Uh, I think the opportunities, I mean, it, it,
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  if possible not to talk about artificial intelligence is the opportunities. Um,
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  uh, it is very real. Um, and, and it is here. Um, and, and you know,
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  those are the things that I,
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  I'm certainly laser focused on to try to deliver some, uh,
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  opportunities for our providers to be more efficient in how they deliver care,
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  um, to have, uh, you know,
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  tools available to them to truly deliver care to their patients,
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  give themselves some time back. I,
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  I think that anyone who's asked that question is probably gonna give a very,
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  very similar answer based on the exciting times that we're living in right now
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  related to ai. Um, the headwinds, uh, I think are, are,
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  are an interesting question. It's with AI and with technology, it's,
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  it's the challenges of just the constant change that has occurred as we've come
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  out of the pandemic. It's been, it was a draining time. You know, I just, uh,
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  just thinking back on the, the,
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  the several years going through it and the impact that that had on, uh,
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  so many people, both, uh, caregivers, our IT staff, uh,
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  you know,
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  our patients and all the work that we had to do and the things we had to change
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  as a result of that. And then as we continue,
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  have continued to evolve from that as a, as a society and a,
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  and a healthcare organization, you know, and we talk about things like ai,
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  that's a headwind. Talking about the change that comes with that. Um, you know,
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  a lot of things have come out of that, uh,
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  the pandemic as well related to just our ability to staff our hospitals,
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  our clinics, um,
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  and some of the challenges that we've had with our patients accessing our care,
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  um, uh, to, to come back and, and,
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  and feel comfortable receiving care in an environment that many people are still
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  a little bit wary of because of the impact that the pandemic has had on them
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  personally. Um, I think all of those are, um,
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  things that will be overcome, but they're, they're, they're real headwinds.
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  It's, they've been real challenges to us.
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  Absolutely. I think that's such a great point.
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  And certainly looking at all the different changes that have happened over the
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  past two years during the pandemic and then, you know,
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  the continued aftermath of what we're seeing both economically on a large scale
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  and then in healthcare with, as you mentioned, the staffing challenges.
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  I can imagine there's, there's always a, a new, uh,
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  new thing you need to troubleshoot or a new issue that you're working on. So,
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  um, uh, and I love your your focus on AI too,
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  because I think certainly it's been around for a long time,
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  but really in the last few months here, um,
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  ha has emerged in the big way on the national stage as well as in healthcare.
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  Uh, from your vantage point, you know,
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  what are those conversations like when you're talking about ai,
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  when you're talking about where it can be most useful, uh,
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  for the hospital and the health system in general? What are you thinking about?
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  What factors are you thinking through in, in, where do you see it headed?
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  Um, so, so I, you know, my, my main focus is related to direct care delivery,
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  so that's, that's how I think about it. Um, uh,
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  so that's how my answer's gonna be phrased around that. I, I think that the,
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  some of the automation tools to do mundane tasks for physicians,
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  for nurses, um, leveraging AI to do that,
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  th there are very real opportunities. Um, I, you know, I,
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  I'm incredibly excited and just seeing some of the,
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  the things that are out there currently, um, and,
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  and that are still in their infancy,
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  but just the potential that they already and, and the, the,
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  the real outcomes that they already deliver are just incredible. Um, you know,
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  I, I just was talking to a colleague yesterday and, and,
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  and talking to them about some,
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  a pilot with an AI project that we're going to be doing with some folks and
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  using the, the term, you know, the kind of the,
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  the mind blowing moment when you see it in real use. And it's,
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  it's incredible to see and visualize and then think about the potential of what
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  that can do to my ability to care for a patient, to talk to a patient,
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  and then do all of the work that comes with that around me, have it, uh,
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  much more automated than it is currently. It's a time saver.
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  It gives me ability to see more patients, um, uh, in a more meaningful way.
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  It's a more meaningful interaction when it occurs,
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  and I feel better at the end of the day because I have a lot of those tasks that
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  have really caused the burden on physicians and nurses. Um, you know,
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  I'm sure you're familiar with the burnout conversation that is ongoing that,
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  that really assists to, to reduce those things. I, I, it's just,
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  it's incredibly, um, uh, exciting to me in terms of, uh,
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  the next steps related to ai.
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  That's great to hear. Now, overall,
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  how are you thinking about growth and adding value to the hospital?
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  What does that look like for you?
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  Especially as I know we've talked through some of the,
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  the current challenges and, and headwinds. I.
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  I think, um, growth is a, is a challenging question,
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  particularly for someone like me. Um, but I,
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  I do think that there are many opportunities to think about how to grow as an
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  organization for us. Um, I, I think one of the, the things that,
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  that we really can focus on is how to better deliver care outside of the
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  traditional walls of the hospital or the, the, the,
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  the office or the imaging center or wherever. Um, I, I, there's,
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  there's a ton of opportunity that,
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  particularly as technology has evolved to deliver care, um,
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  in non-traditional settings in asynchronous ways, um, you know, we've,
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  we've learned a lot of that through, through, as we've come out of the pandemic.
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  You apply that with some of the, the,
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  the technology that has been in being developed,
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  and we continue to connect all of those pieces. I think there's a,
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  a huge opportunity to partner with vendors who have done that to,
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  to get more into a bigger opportunity with patients to care for. Um,
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  I also think that there is a quite a bit of duplicative work that's completed
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  within some of the traditional healthcare environments that if you can reduce
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  that, you can free time and deliver potentially more care, more,
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  more diagnostics, more communication with patients, and that, that truly,
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  that's an opportunity for,
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  for organic growth within an organization if you can do that. Um,
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  I think if those two things are focused on,
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  there are many other opportunities for growth,
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  but that's the way that I view it as someone with the background that I've
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  mentioned, um, thinks through growth for our, for our healthcare organization.
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  Absolutely. I, I love that. And I think that makes so much sense,
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  just especially given, um,
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  your role in really where you can be most impactful for that direct patient
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  care. Um, and you know, I was wondering too,
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  obviously right now is a, a time of lots of different challenges,
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  both financially as well as resource-wise with staffing shortages, shortages,
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  as we've talked about. So every dollar and minute is precious in healthcare,
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  but you know,
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  if there's a space where you feel like it's still an important area to invest in
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  or a risk to take right now, um, to set yourself up for success in the future,
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  what would that be?
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  Um, again, a great question. Um, it it's, it's picking the right partner, um,
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  whether that be a clinical partner or a technology partner, speci,
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  I would say specifically related to artificial intelligence. I think that,
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  that the risks, um, are definitely worth taking with partnering with,
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  with AI vendors to, to better yourself as an organization. I, I,
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  I,
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  I think that not getting into that space is, uh,
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  will be a mistake for organizations if they are unwilling to think about, um,
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  the future of AI as a healthcare delivery partner for them. And I,
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  I think that people are, they are doing that as you, you know,
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  everything that you read about AI every day in healthcare, it's,
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  it's a scary concept, but, um, um, I think it, it,
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  it is absolutely worth the risk to take moving forward.
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  That makes a lot of sense. And you know, I know it was still very,
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  very early on in this, but when you think about, uh,
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  what an ideal partner would look like,
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  is it similar to the other vendor partnerships that you have or are there
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  certain aspects of, um, artificial intelligence and just the gravity of,
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  of what that brings to a,
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  to a hospital or health system that are really unique to think about?
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  Um,
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  I don't know that anybody can answer that question because of the infancy that
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  we are in with this. Um, uh, I, I think, um,
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  it's having a measured approach to partnership, uh, when,
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  when selecting a, a, a vendor, if you have existing relationships with,
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  with, um, companies that are getting into that, that, I mean,
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  like everyone is involved with the artificial intelligence, then you, uh,
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  trust that that organization and you have some of the infrastructure already in
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  place, it might be easier for you to go with,
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  with that partnership because of the relationship that's already there.
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  There's always the flip side of a, of a, you know,
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  a small developing company and working with them,
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  potentially even investing in them to develop,
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  making part of your healthcare organization.
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  I really think that's going to be a, a,
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  an organization by organization decision based upon their existing relationships
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  and where they are as an organization to, to, to
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  make those types of decisions.
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  Got it. That makes a lot of sense. Uh, before we wrap up our conversation today,
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  I'm wondering where do you see some of the best opportunities for growth and
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  development in the future,
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  both for yourself as well as the teams that you work with?
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  Oh, um, you know, it for, for, for me personally, for growth, um,
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  the opportunities,
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  it's really just continuing to think outside their traditional, um,
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  healthcare delivery system. Uh, you know, the, the, the walls of the hospital,
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  the walls of the office. I think, um,
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  we have to think differently in the world that we are now living in and
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  will be living in, in 10 years from now in the world that my kids will live in.
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  Uh, I, I think that the opportunity there is just is,
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  is still very much, uh, untapped. Um,
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  so I, I think personally that's a huge opportunity, um,
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  as well as for our organization and, and the folks that I work with. Um,
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  at the same time there, there's, there's,
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  there's also personal growth and just continuing to build those
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  relationships with, with team members. Um, you know, that's a,
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  that's a different type of growth. Um,
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  I think we lost a lot of personal relationships with the pandemic, uh,
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  because we all are now behind screens all of the time,
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  and it's been great personally for growth, uh,
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  to watch teams come back together and work together and be productive and real,
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  remember what it's like to do those things. There's clearly a space for, um,
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  doing remote work, but I think that the value of the,
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  of being part of a team in place, uh, is, is, uh,
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  being realized again because people are doing it more and more. And I,
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  I think there's, there's professional growth related to that, not necessarily,
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  um, uh, directedly translating into financial growth,
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  but I think that's a critical, uh, part of being part of a team and developing,
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  um, uh,
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  care models and technology and everything related to healthcare that we do.
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  I'm really glad you mentioned that because it is so important to have that
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  personal connection and,
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  and that ability to work with the teams and the teams to work well together in
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  order to, um,
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  have great patient care and then that ultimately fuels everything else about the
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  health system. So I think that's such an important point. And, you know,
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  given as we emerge from the pandemic and everything that went with that,
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  you know, are,
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  are you seeing anything that's different about forging those types of
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  relationships with your teams, with the other care providers? Um,
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  how do you go about really kind of personalizing that relationship
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  in this post pandemic era?
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  Um, it's, it's just, it's different than it used to be. Uh,
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  that's for certain. Um, but it still comes down to, um,
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  having good interpersonal skills and communicating and, um,
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  you know, holding people,
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  committing to people that you will be present and accountable and asking them to
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  do the same. Um, uh,
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  recognizing that you have to be a little bit more flexible probably than you,
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  we were five years ago because of what we've afforded people, um,
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  and how people have become more flexible and comfortable with working remotely.
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  You know, it, I love the turn your cameras on for meetings, uh, um,
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  mantra that a lot of people have put into place. If you're gonna be on the call,
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  you need to have your camera on.
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  I think that helps for those people that are remote to, to be more engaged, uh,
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  when they, when we need to be. But I still think, um, you know,
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  it just comes down to how you treat people and, uh, how you, um, uh,
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  want them to treat you.
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  There's just so much of interpersonal relationships that you just try
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  to lead by example, um,
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  and help other people to get there when they're struggling.
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  Dr. Curran, thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today.
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  This has been such an interesting and fantastic conversation and I look forward
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  to connecting with you again soon.
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  I really appreciate you having me today. It's been fun.
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  Absolutely.
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  And I'm looking forward to meeting you in person as well at our Health IT
• 16:07
  Digital Health and Revenue Cycle event this fall in October.
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  I think a lot of these things that we talked about are really gonna be front and
• 16:14
  center, um, as part of the discussions at the event.
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  And so I am really excited to meet you and learn from you.
• 16:20
  Absolutely. Thank you. I'm looking forward to it as well.
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