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The Man Who Made Pitt Basketball Relevant · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Hello, and welcome to another exciting episode of Pittsburgh Sports Memories.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: As usual, I'm your uh host, uh Steve Wirt, and I'm with my uh regular co-host.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_02: I am Tim Hannon.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: And uh today we're gonna be covering on this episode, we're gonna be covering Jamie Dixon.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: And uh yeah, I'm sure everybody remembers him.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's only been since 2016.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: So what is that?
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: At this point, was that six years, five years, six years, somewhere in there?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: He made pit basketball relevant.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: So um, you know, he either you know he was a childhood actor, but uh he was unlike Todd Britches, Todd Bridges or Danny Bonaducci.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: He actually made a career for himself, but not as an actor, but as a basketball coach.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: He kind of came out of nowhere.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: He was an unknown coach at the uh at uh UCSB, I guess the University of Cal State Berkeley.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then he got uh he was at Hawaii for like a little bit, and then uh Ben Holland brought him in the pit, and that's kind of when his career really uh came to prominence.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_02: So a little uh background on uh Jamie Dixon.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um he was born in Burbank.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um he was actually recruited by Ben Howland in college.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: I did not realize Ben Holland was that much older than him.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_02: Did did you realize that too?
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: No, no, I didn't.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, they both kind of came to prominence around the same time, so I just kind of assumed they were.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_03: I knew Jamie Dixon was younger, but not that much younger.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: And uh I mean, one of the you know few recruiting battles Ben Holland lost out on, he actually lost out on him and uh he went to TCU in which is kind of weird because he grew up in LA, but I guess LA to Texas isn't that far.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's Dallas, you know, Los Angeles to Dallas.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: So and he attended uh TCU and he had a very successful college career.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um he played uh point guard, but he came off the bench a lot, and um he earned some uh all conference honors.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what conference it might have been the Southwest Conference back then.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: That that old conference, what would they have?
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: Arkansas and Texas AM and like the old the old Southwest conference.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like Texas and Oklahoma and all those those um I was Oklahoma in that conference, or were they in the big eight big eight with Nebraska and those guys?
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think they might sure, yeah.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and Colorado, yeah.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: Because the Southwest was like Arkansas was it.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: I remember that was like one of the that was one of the early like when conference alignment came in.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: So that won't be the last time we talk about conference alignment in this uh podcast.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_02: So um he actually there's a uh highlight of him hitting a shot with two seconds left to beat the University of Texas.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I imagine TCU in Texas, that's a big rivalry down there in Texas land.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: So um ironically enough, he became a pro basketball player in the CBA, and then he went and played New Zealand after he played for a team in lacrosse, Wisconsin for the at the what that was at lower level of the like the minor league of college basketball for like a minute before they went under.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_02: And then he went and played New Zealand, which was ironic enough.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: And then uh he star he didn't start head coaching after he had some coaching experience in New Zealand, but then he went to that uh, like I said, UCSB.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess they were him and Ben Hallen were both at at that uh Cal Berkeley.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: So and and he we he became an uh an assistant at Pitt in ninety-nine with Ben Hallen.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_03: So Steve, that shoddy hit in college.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_03: I think isn't it called like the Jamie Dixon miracle?
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, it is.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_03: I actually have a link to it.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_03: We can attach that.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_03: I mean Yeah, we'll we'll post it on the web on the website, but like that was a big deal at the time.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_03: Like the the play actually had a name.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, he's like a legend down at TCU.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: So and that's another thing that's going to come into play.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_02: Spoilers.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_02: So he's a very it's like LeVance Fields or Brandon Knight or kind of like one of those players, you know.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: But for TCU, then that was Jamie Dixon.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: So um he was uh an assistant until 2003 with Pitt, and then he was promoted to head coach after Ben Hallen left after we did a podcast on it on that season.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: That was the game against Dwayne Wade Marquette.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: So it was kind of like a desperation hire.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: I think they just wanted to keep everything the same.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_02: And Pitt might have been in-between athletic directors at that time, between Steve Peterson and Jeff Long.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not I don't remember the timing there, but it was kind of like just like, well, this guy's been coaching the team, kind of, let's just stick with him.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: And they kept all the other assistants, most importantly, a guy named Barry Roarsen, who could really recruit New York.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_02: So what had been going on at Pitt Basketball?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Well, they did not have very much success.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: Pitt was definitely solidly a football school for most of existence until I would say 1999, or well, not even ninety nine, I would say like 2000s when Howland started winning.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um they had made a final four in 1941, but it really it wasn't it wasn't the NCAA, which was weird.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: It was like some other athletic conference, which was just like athletic, what would I call it, association.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: I I don't I don't know how to describe it.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't the NCAA.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_02: And then they did when they were in the NCAA in 1974, they made an Elite Eight, but um not really much success sustained success.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: They had a little run with um it was a I think it was Charles Smith in the eighties, the Barry Gean game.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember they made they played Utah in like '93, and Jerry Tarkadian was coaching Utah at that point, and they they lost.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: And they they were like and they weren't in the tournament for like my goodness, they for like seven or eight years after that.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: They just were not in the NCW tour, and they weren't even close.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_02: Uh it wasn't like they were just missing.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_02: They they're just a very mediocre to bad basketball program.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we talked about um, you know, the the You're right, they had some good teams in the 80s, and then the 90s were really, really miserable.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_03: And then and then uh who was the coach?
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: Ralph Willard, the guy before that one.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: You know, he finally got this program in '98 to be like in a decent spot, and they had all these really big wins at the beginning of that season, and then they lost that Yukon game, the the uh call it alamine, jumped on the scorer table game, and and it just collapsed from there.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_03: And that was just that was pit basketball.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_03: Like, oh, maybe they're gonna be good, and then well, wow, wow, like it just wasn't they were just totally, totally irrelevant.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, pretty much.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: So um I pretty much sums it up for pit basketball.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so going over like some low points, like instead of just chronologically going through this, we'll kind of do like well, I know we did a good, the bad, and the ugly with pit, but this will be different.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: It'll be like more low points and high points.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: So um, bad, low points.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: We'll start with the bad.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: We'll get the bad out of the way, and we're just gonna get this out of the way early because this is really painful.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: In 2008-2009, they probably had their best team, and Scotty Reynolds for Villanova basically hit a shot with I forget how many seconds left on the clock, but it was basically they ran a hook and lateral.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: If you watch the play, it's a hook and lateral play from football.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like they inbound the ball, and for some reason LeVance Fields, like it's the old like like what Kentucky did with Duke, where they didn't put anybody on Grant Hill.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of the same situation where nobody was really guarding the inbounding pass, and then he passed it into a player who tipped it to Scottie Reynolds, who used like the guy tipping it as like a pick to rub off on I forget who who was guarding him, Jeron Brown or it was one of their good defenders, but then he just ran down the floor and hit a shot, and that was it.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: Pitt never made it to the final four, and that was probably I would say that was their second best, maybe that was their best.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think that was their best chance to make the final four, Tim?
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I mean they were they were in the final seconds of the Elite Eight.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_03: So I I feel like the game was tied, it wasn't they weren't leading.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_03: Right, but still, I mean that was that was if you want to talk about like the closest they got, like they're tied in the final seconds of an Elite Eight game.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean that was the farthest they got, and it was it their best team, I don't I don't know, but it was the it was the furthest they got.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_03: So they were they were right there, they were right on the cusp.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_03: And that that hurt, that was the year that the Stewart's won the Super Bowl and the and the Penguins won the Stanley Cup, and that happened right in between those two events.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: And man, wouldn't that have been like pit in the final four?
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: That would have been a heck of a sports year, and all like you said, all like happening like you know, February Super Bowl, well, March or April, you know, the Final Four, and then the Stanley Cup in like June.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: That would have been that would have been incredible.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: It would have been so um more like bad stuff.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: Uh losing to Pacific and Bradley, those are two different games in the tournament.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: That was pretty bad.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: They've I mean I know I think they were like eight and nine seeds that year.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean, they weren't like a high seed when they lost to those teams.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, I'm looking it up right now.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: Pacific, they were a nine seed.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: Bradley, they were a five seed, and Bradley was a thirteen.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think a five-thirteen is a huge upset in the tournament, but it's still like they probably should have won both those games.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: I all I remember about the Bradley game was that CBS on the broadcast, they had a little box like in the corner that showed the score, and they had it the the score was abbreviated B-R-A-D and then P-I-T-T.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_03: So and yeah, it just said Brad Pitt the whole game.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_03: Brad Pitt 64 to 62.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: I think that was I think that was the game too.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: Krauser hit somebody.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: He like totally cheap shotted somebody too.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: So that's a shocker.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: That guy was such a classy player, and what's not um another like not great moment for Pitt was uh they lost to Wisconsin in 2016.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: That was actually Jamie Dixon's last game, and they only scored 43 points, and they lost in the first round.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: Once again, I'm not sure what their seeding was.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: That would they were a 10 seed and Wisconsin was a seven seed, so Wisconsin was a higher seed, but I mean it would it would have been nice to score more than 43 points.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's just uh it was kind of a ug there.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean they lost to Wichita State in 2013 also, but I think Wichita State ended up going pretty far that year.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_02: So um they lost to Butler in 2010, and this is like I don't know like how like it's a bad loss, but at the same time, like Butler was a really good team.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like Butler almost won the national championship.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: That was their second year going to the national championship game, and they almost won both times.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm not I'm not sure like I necessarily chalk that up to oh this is just such a horrible loss.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_02: I think if I always thought if they would have had Duan Blair, he would have stayed an extra season.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: They beat this team, and probably this is the team that probably makes it to the Final Four.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: And this is a frustrating game because uh Gilbert Brown, they the game was tied, or no, Butler was up by one, and Gilbert Brown has the ball and is like driving, and like the guy from Butler fouls him for no reason.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_02: So all he has to do is hit two foul shots and pit wins, basically.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: So he hits I think he hits the first one and ties it.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: Or I can't remember, I think he may miss both.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember he missed both, but he hits one, and then on the second one, his second shot, the ball goes up in the air, and uh Nasir Robinson fouls this Matt Howard, who was like this big, I don't know, describe him, what was the derpy white guy who like seriously that was the guy if they would have had Dewan Blair, he would have ate him, like they almost beat, like they would have had no answer for Dewan Blair.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_02: That guy wouldn't have been a and DeWan Blair would have been the big NBA star, they would have got every call, they would have won this game, they just would have.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: And so all the guy had to do was hit one foul shot to win the game, which he did.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, so Gilbert Brown hit like one foul shot and missed the second, and then they literally foul him like it wasn't defensive, they were on the other's end of the court, so it's like why do you foul a guy like what a hundred two hundred feet from your own basket?
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: It just it was ridiculous.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_02: So he hits one shot and he purposely misses the second and Butler wins on the most insane ending.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember you remember that?
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think we covered that in our top twenty in-game mistakes podcast.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it was it was unbelievable.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it was just um and and the guy for Butler really made the mistake before that.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, fouling, yeah.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I mean it was it was like and and that kid, I f I did feel bad for him because I mean, you know, that was just rough.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, he just made a mistake and boy, it was a really big mistake.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_03: It lost lost him their season.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I really honestly always thought that team probably would have made it to the Final Four.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: Probably.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: And especially like especially if Duan Blair stays.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, if if Duan Blair was a and I mean, and he was an NBA player, so I understand why he wanted to go to the NBA.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_03: But um, you know, it it Butler was the team that made it out of that bracket.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: So you make it past Butler, and presumably you've taken out at that point the best team in the bracket.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, they they really would have had a good chance.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I guess that's enough crying about losing to Butler.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: They were a good team.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: So it's not like it's an embarrassing loss, like it's like, oh my gosh, you lost to like Bradley, who's Bradley or Pacific.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: Is it they were a good team?
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's just like they had them beat and they just couldn't hang on.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: So and probably like I say this is the worst loss, and this is probably the one that kind of I think everybody kind of lost like faith in Jamie Dixon after this.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess we'll just share it here.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: I'll I'll share it for your listening pleasure.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: Target by the wander maker with games, games like game line, on the screen.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Walker with seven.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Got a mismatch.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Walker on the game, with four.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: Kemba Walker.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Step back.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: Walker.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: Cardian.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Kemba.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: Does it again?
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yukon wins at the buzzer.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: so if you can't tell what happened was they had Brad Wanamaker, who is a really good defender, and he's guarding Kemba Walker, and that's probably the matchup you're right, you want, right, Tim?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: Well, would you say you don't want Gary McGee guarding Kemball Walker?
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_03: Is that who is guarding him?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I mean if you watch the Highland, we'll put another this link on there.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: Like Gary McGee is like a good center and a good big man, but like Kemball Walker is a really good guard.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: He actually he's in the NBA and really good in the NBA.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like, why like why did you switch there?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: Just let just stay on him.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: Like Wanamaker should have stayed on him, and that was just that was like the worst that now I don't know if you can blame Dixon for that or Gary McGee, but yeah, or Brad W you had you just cannot switch like that with that player.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: That was that was and I think like because I remember after that happened, everybody was really mad at JB Dixon for that, because that really is like kind of a coaching faux pas.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: And like if you when you listen to that replay, you can hear the guy calls it.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, Oh, they got a mitzvah mismatch on Walker, so I don't know.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: It wasn't Gary Gary McGee shouldn't have been guarding him.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that one hurt.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that was that was um those big East tournament games and the championship games.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you you always wanted to win those, especially Yukon.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: Like especially the in the UConn.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_03: I think that just always hurts.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: You know, watching Calhoun celebrate in that clip just makes me like clench my fists a little bit more.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and I I still think that's worse than the Butler, just I don't know why.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think maybe just because we like the Big East tournament so much and everything, but I I just always thought oh that well the Scotty Reynolds is probably worse than that one, but that one was just more infuriating.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like Scottie Reynolds was a good player, and Villanova's always really good at basketball.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_02: But it's just like uh that that one definitely hurt.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: So that's enough like crying about pit basketball losses.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_02: Let's go to the good.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: So the good stuff.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um that would be uh Jamie Dixon has a 328 all-time wins, and that would be second all-time at pit, believe it or not, which is hard to believe.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: I when I looked that up.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, he did that in 13 years.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now there's a coach named Doc Carlson.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_02: He has 366 wins.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: But can you can you guess how long it took him to do that, Tim?
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Doc Carlson, I I have no idea.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_02: Thirty years.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: Thirty years.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and he was like, they just like they took like basketball was such a joke to them.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I think he was actually in charge of like he's an actual doctor.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: And he was just like yeah, he was like in charge of like the student health or whatever, like whatever like the student health center or something, and it's like, hey, you want to coach some basketball games?
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_02: Alright, I like basketball.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a doctor.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_02: Anybody gets hurt, I can help them.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: But uh I think he was more that he actually did like have some offense and stuff, but still Pitt was obviously not taking basketball very seriously back then.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: But um so more good things that happened while Jamie Dixon was at Pitt.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: So 328.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: I would say Jamie Dixon's probably the best coach at Pitt.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I think that's hard to argue.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I agree.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: I mean even though he doesn't have the all-time wins, I I mean, come on.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_03: No, but that's that's yeah, like you said, that was like the the guy that was like standing around there like, hey, want to coach a basketball team?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: Oh sure, whatever.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: They can get some exercise, that's good for fitness.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_03: Like that was not that was not, you know, I mean, good for Doc Carlson.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_03: But yes, I I think Jamie Carl Jamie Dixon is definitely the the runaway winner there in terms of who has that distinction.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um you remember they beat Yukon twice when they are ranked number one?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_02: That was in the same season, too, because they beat him, got ranked one, and then they lost.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: I forget they lost to other ranked one, so they went down and they got to beat them again.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_02: I don't was that in the tournament that time, or but yeah, they they beat Yukon twice when they were number one.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and as I said earlier, the beating Yukon always is it always was the sweetest back then.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: And uh can you uh I would say I don't know about like wrestling or swimming or volleyball, but um I can say this for football and basketball.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um I don't know what the basketball stats are on Pitt playing number one, but I still think this is like one of the few times Pitt is in in either of the big sports be the number one ranked team.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: So they've never done it in football, and I can't uh I don't think they've done it in basketball more than this one time, so or twice.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: So so I mean that's something they'll always have.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: So um another big moment in Jamie Dixon coached moments there.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_02: We'll uh we'll play the audio from this one, too.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: One by two, out of timeouts, in a game that has featured more bumps and bruises and cuts and scrapes than you could count.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Pittsburgh toward the end of the clock, they like to run an open set to get a run-out ball screen.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_01: Here it comes.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: Involving Sam Young, who didn't get anything out of it.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: Now to seven seconds.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: Fields for three.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_02: So if you couldn't catch all what was going on there, Levan's Fields gets the ball and pulls a pulls his own Kemba Walker, but Against Duke this time and uh it fakes a guy out of his shoes and hits a three that beats uh Duke.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: Was that in a tournament game?
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like a not like an NCAA, but like a like a weird tournament, wasn't it?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was like the something, something classic or one of those like things that they hold.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was like the middle of the season, too.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't like like that beginning of the season, you know, when when they have.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_02: I think we watched this together, didn't we?
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: We may have, yeah.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: And that that that was a huge way, because everybody, you know, I everybody hates Duke.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: I I I mean I'm not that passionate about it, but I can understand why.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: I guess people just I don't know.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I I I was I'm one of the few people that didn't hate Duke.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_03: I used to always root for Duke back in the day.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um I was a fan of Coach K and and Christian Leitner and Grant Hill and all those guys back way back when, which, like you said, was not popular.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_03: Nobody loves like Duke and people just love to hate Duke.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_03: But it was a big deal because here we were beating Duke.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_03: Like there was a time when you wouldn't even like Pitt wouldn't even be in the in the conversation of schools like Duke or UNC or you know, there's there's big time college basketball schools.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like Pitt almost was like on another like almost like in another division of the sport, right?
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: And here they are not only playing schools like that, but beating schools like that, being ranked high in the AP pole, being number one seed in the tournament.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that was I I I I it's hard to put into words how unfathomable that would have been, you know, three, four, five years before Jamie Dixon, you know, became the coach.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah, definitely.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: Even in '99 when Hallen first came, I don't think they would have been able to pull it off.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: And they beat Duke.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: I think I remember when they joined the ACC, they were beaten.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_02: They did they beat, I think they beat Duke again with him.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_02: They were beating all kinds of teens in the ACC.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: Because I remember that was towards the end of Dixon, like Duke came up here, and like Pitt had a really good record that year in the ACC, and they they beat Pitt like, and it was like I've never seen like normally Coach K doesn't get that animated, and he was really animated, so I think like you know, it was like a hit, like the ACC got sick of Pitt just kind of coming down there.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: ACC basketball is like really the it's really big.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's always been more of a basketball conference than a football conference, but we'll get into that later.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um in staying with the good in 2004, beating Wisconsin.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_02: And just for full, I don't like Duke or North Carolina.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_02: When they play, I could care less.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_02: I if they could both lose, I would root for that.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: But anyway, that's neither here nor there.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_02: For some reason, Wisconsin keeps coming up in conversation, but um, they beat in 2004 they beat Wisconsin in Wisconsin in the tournament.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember that Carl Krauser came, drove into the lane with like you know, four fouls on him with like a couple seconds left and hit a big layup like under pressure while being guarded.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_02: It was a big win, and that was in the tournament against a pretty good Wisconsin team.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: So, I mean, and some of those other losses that we didn't cover, like they lost to like Oklahoma State when they were pretty good.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: They had, I forget who they had, that one port point guard.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: They lost to UCLA like with Holland when Holland had gone to UCLA, and like those two years, one of those two years when UCLA went to the championship game and lost to Florida.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_02: They they lost to another team, then they were number one seed.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: So like I don't count those as bad losses, it's just like okay, those teams were pretty good, and no, you couldn't pull off an upset, it would have been nice, but I don't know.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what to tell you on that one.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, off the field though, and this is this is like another thing that really like you know, when he left, like I really just really broke my heart.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_02: Was like, do you remember when Jamie Dixon pulled people out of a car wreck on I-279?
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember that, Tim?
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_03: No, I actually don't.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, he was driving home and on 279, I guess up where like channel 11 is, like where it makes that bend at the top of the hill, like a card flipped over, and he was driving home and he saw and he stopped and pulled over.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: And like people were trying to get he was like helping people, he like ripped the windshield off, and he got one person out.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: He couldn't get the other person out because they were stuck in their seatbelt.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_02: But like, yeah, he actually ended up cutting his hands a little bit.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: His wife was funny, made fun of him, called him a wuss.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: But he tried to like not even do any press conference on it, anything, and the news the news media went so nuts with it that they wouldn't let him.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like they pestered him till like I I think it happened like a Saturday night or something or Sunday, and Monday had to do a press conference on it.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_02: But just like a good person, he's a generally good person, and he really likes to be in Pittsburgh.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: And it just that's uh I think that's what made it hurt more, is like we've had so many coaches that didn't want to be here or were just sleaze bags or weren't the greatest of coaches, but this guy was a good coach, is still is a good coach, and wanted to be here and liked being here.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: So uh more good Dixon was named 2010-2011 Sporting News National Coach of the Year.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um there Pitt was Big East regular season champions 2004-2011.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's another thing they had never done that they did under Pitt.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um they that was regular season, then they run the conference in 2008, the conference tournament championship.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_02: So, I mean, just a lot of accolades for for him while they were there.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's a very successful you know tenure.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um we kind of started to debate it who who was who was his best player.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: So I I I Dewan Blair, I think, was the most successful in college.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_02: LeVance Fields was probably his best point guard, because I don't think he really he brandon Knight was more of a Howland guy.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: So he really didn't care.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he really didn't get to coach Brandon Knight.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_02: Steven Adams was the legit NBA talent, especially the fact that Steven Adams is still in the NBA.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_02: The only really one and done co player Pitt has ever recruited or had, and he literally didn't I mean he was okay.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: I I think he got voted ACC Rook rookie player of the year or something, but they didn't really he he didn't really make that much of an impact at Pitt, I always felt.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_03: Um I I feel like that happens in in football too.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_03: Like you've had some guys go to the NFL who've maybe even had some success at the NFL level, who you look back at their time at Pitt and it's like, eh, I mean they were decent, but they weren't, you know, they they weren't as good.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's it it's funny how that works, right?
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_03: So then you have the opposite where the guy's a superstar in college, but then they're not good at the pro.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_03: So it's funny how those things shake out.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's such a jump.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like I you know, I'm probably I'm sure I've said that before on our older podcast, like you know, from high school to the college is a big jump, and it's just a big jump from college to the pro.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: And that's football and basketball, I'm sure.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's just the talent is so much better, and only you know, there's so many players and so many colleges, and only you know, a small percentage of those people end up at you know a professional being professionals at the highest level.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, maybe you go to China or something or you know, somewhere overseas, but um remember Aaron Gray, the big he was over seven, yeah, seven feet.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_02: And he wasn't that great.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like he was like very in like they molded him.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_02: That was another great coaching job by uh Jamie Dixon, and he really grew into like a pretty good player.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: Although I think it was was he was on the Bradley team.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: I think he was on the team that lost to Bradley, I think.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_02: But he he was still pretty good.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um I Tim's favorite player, Carl Krauser.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a Carl Krauser fan.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_02: I'm probably like one of the few people.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: I think he was just one of the more competitive point guards.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: He wasn't like the greatest point guard to ever play a pit, but I put him top five, and I and he was really good and really competitive.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_02: And like I said, he hit the hit some big shots and won them some games.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: So had a very, very pushable face.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_02: He did have an attitude, but like sometimes you need that guy.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_02: Like you I mean, you need that guy with that attitude to take to dribble the ball down the lane with four fouls in the NCAA tournament.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_02: You just gotta have that guy, you know, that's not afraid to do that.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_02: So um, Sam Young, remember Sam Sam Young was like I I forget how how long he was in the NBA, but it seemed like there was a guy too, like I thought, oh, he'll be really good in the NBA, and he was like, eh, he was okay.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_02: Like you know, Brad Watamaker, that we talked about him.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_02: I think he's in, yeah, he's in the NBA.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean they did have their share share.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_02: I I left off Ronald Ramone.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: He was he was a nice three-point shooter.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: Ashton Gibbs was probably their best three-point shooter.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean it they I mean, who would you guess his who would you say?
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_02: I I think Dewan Blair was the most was his best all-around player that he had.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I can't I was just gonna say I can't really disagree with that.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, Dewan Blair was very good, and he was the one that you thought, and it's funny, his NBA career was not super long.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was a lot if I remember correctly, Steve, it might have been due to injuries, but his NBA career maybe only lasted like five years or something like that.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um and you would have thought it would have been longer.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, I think I think Dewan Blair you can put up there.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_03: Fields obviously, you know, was kind of like uh felt like he was like the leader of that team for a while, so um you could put him up there too.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_03: Anyone I've forgotten you can think of?
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_03: I don't I don't think I mean the rest of the guys that I can think of are Hallen players, and I can't even remember if they were still there after Hallen left, you know, like like Julius Page and guys like that.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_03: I think that they were all gone when Hallen left, but I don't I don't remember exactly.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_03: And if they if they were around one more year, like you said, they're really Howland guys, not Dixon guys.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, I mean I think Dwan Blair was the most successful player of that that era.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: And although Steven Adams definitely is the most talented, he just didn't have the impact that I thought that Dewan Blair had, and definitely didn't have the success they had.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_02: They definitely had more success on the court with Blair than they did with Adams.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: So go figure that.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_02: So moving on to more sad topics again.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_02: So why did why did Jamie Dixon leave?
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_02: Well, there's a lot of reasons, and um one of them was in let's set the way back you know machine, Mr.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: Peabody, for 2013.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: So we go back in time to 2013, and Pitt moved out of the Big East.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, it was announced in 2011, and it took them two years to move completely, and they actually paid like more money, I think, to leave earlier.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: They were supposed to leave like a couple years later, but they actually paid the Big East more money.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um the chancellor and the administration had changed, and a guy named Scott Barnes was in charge.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I think Scott Barnes was only athletic director of Pitt for like maybe two years.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: So he lowered Dixon's buyout, and supposedly Barnes was this big like college basketball guy, and he's supposed to be this big expert.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: I I'm not I'm not a Scott Barnes fan.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think he was pretty god-awful, and he was here two years.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_02: He literally destroyed the football program.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um so TCU came in and they wanted to rebuild their program, so they they bought out Jamie Dixon and Jamie Dixon, who I don't think he really wanted to leave, left.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_02: So another reason was the New York City connection.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like once Pitt left the Big East, they didn't have the recruiting pipeline in the New York like they used to.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: So they kind of had the the I mean Pitt wasn't gonna go down to like, you know, they're not a national program, they're still very regional, and they weren't gonna go down to, you know, I don't know, Virginia or something and recruit people or Texas or Chicago.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: I I just don't see them doing that on a regular basis, not like they did like back in the heydays of like the Dixon era, like it seemed like everybody was from somewhere in the five boroughs, and they they always did really well.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_02: They got some guys out of Philadelphia too.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I think Wanamaker was Wanamaker's thing from Philadelphia, I think.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_03: But but you're right, it was like Dixon was kind of set up to fail.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_03: He no, I don't that would have he had failed as badly as what happened after that, which I'm sure you're gonna get into.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_03: But um he he was kind of set up to fail by uh by them leaving the Big East.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um now they had they really had no choice when they left the Big East because the football conference had collapsed and they had to find a place in the Power Five or else they would have been, you know, in some football conference with the with the dregs of you know the the the college football world that that came to be.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well they'd be they've been with the what a yeah.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_03: Right, and and yeah, so so they they just they didn't want that, they wanted to still be in a power five conference.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_03: You can debate whether that was good or bad.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, you know, they're last year they they were able to win that conference, so you know, s say what you will there, but but for basketball, you know, them playing Duke in in in North Carolina and and those types of schools in basketball, you know, there really wasn't a good natural rivalry there.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_03: And then the recruiting, like you said, the recruiting, you know, that was kind of the end of the New York recruiting because that was the big deal.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_03: You could play in Madison Square Garden in the Big East in the Big East tournament.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_03: That was that was one of the big hooks of recruiting all those kids from New York.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_03: And and they just lost all that.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_03: So it it it stunk that it took out that way.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_03: It stunked that the football the college football thing drove college basketball to it the pit college basketball program to that point.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um the other thing I remember is you know the whole TCU thing, like you said, it was kind of like I don't know, I felt I felt like it was just forced like from all sides.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember a pit even, I remember Barnes even coming out and like you know, he had talked to TCU, and Barnes was just very publicly like, oh, oh, oh, if he doesn't want to be here, you know, forget him.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like, dude, it's like you just he wanted to hire his yeah.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_02: So this is ridiculous, it was ridiculous.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_02: And like Dixon found out the news about them leaving the big East for the ACC on text messages and through the news.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: They didn't even have like the balls to to call him and tell him, hey, we're changing conferences, you know, by the way, you know.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean I I just don't understand that.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: And then you know, so Scott Barnes moves the team, and it was like the only thing I compare it to is like like what other like serious basketball school like a Syracuse or UConn or I'm trying to think of like even Duke.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_02: Like, would Duke let some athletic director that and I'm sure I don't know about those other, but I'm sure Syracuse has had an athletic director that's been there for like five minutes, that's been there literally for a year fire Jim Beheim.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_02: Would any other school let that had like a legendary coach that's won all kinds of games, and you're just gonna let a guy that's been here five minutes, has no connection to the school, fire your legendary basketball coach?
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: That's still not fire, but just you know, not make any effort to keep him, like obviously be getting pushed him out the door.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: Because he didn't get fired, but like you said, he got pushed out the door, and like who would let that happen?
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_03: I mean Yeah, it's that's a good point.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's a good comparison.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_03: He he was here for five minutes, and and you're right, there's no way that would happen with like a Beheimer or Calhoun when he Yeah, Calhoun when he was in Yukon.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_03: Now now, granted, you know, you can't necessarily put Dixon in the same tier as a as a Sheshewski or a Calhoun, but for for Pitt's standards, I mean, he was that guy.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_03: And and it it's just there's a lot of there's always been a lot of dysfunction managing the the sports programs at the University of Pittsburgh, and and I think that was you know that was just part of it.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I've seen even in interviews where Dixon said, well, the management, the admin he didn't call me, he said the administration changed, and that's when you know his relationship changed.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so obviously when Norberg, not Norb, yeah, it was Norberg left, and who's a new Gallagher came in, and I think that just changed so much.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_02: It was just a shame because he like I said, you had a decent person who was a good recruiter, a clean recruiter, and was a good person and wanted to be here.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, like you know, I don't think Pitts ever had a coach like outside of Dave Wonstatt.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_02: I can't think of any other person that they've had like that, you know, and Dixon quite honestly won more than Wonstatt ever won.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, not ever, but you know, I I just it's frustrating, it just frustrates me to no end.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a lot of people that didn't like Dixon at the end, especially the Gary McGee thing and just you know not not winning enough.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: But so the aftermath, so now he's left.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_02: And also, like we were saying about like back then the ACC tournament was in Greensboro, North Carolina.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_02: Who the who wants to go to Greensboro, North Carolina?
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, nothing against Greensboro, I'm sure it's a fine town, but you're not wanting a major basketball tournament there.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you would think the ACC would at least have it have had it in Charlotte, you know, that's kind of like their major city, and it's still but now after all that they moved it to Brooklyn, which still they can't even sell that out.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like the worst of all worlds.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's like they're not really getting any bump for New York for like the pits and Syracuse of the world, but they're not getting the ACC crowd from like, you know, Virginia and the Carolinas.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: So I think I think it's like when you try and, you know, the old, you know, if you try and compromise, you kind of leave everybody dissatisfied.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: So they should and they can't have it at Madison Square Garden because that's where the Big East tournament is.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: So like they have it at this Brooklyn's almost as half-assed as Greensboro.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_02: They I think they'd be better doing it like Charlotte or I can't think of like I guess you can't have it in Atlanta, but I I even having it in Pittsburgh would be I think better than Brooklyn.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_02: I mean I I don't know.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: But it's neither here nor there.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's it's it's a shame.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's I mean the the those it's it's it feels like a distant memory now.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_03: That Pitt Pitt was like the number one team in the country, Pitt was the number one seed in the NCAA tournament.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_03: That it's almost like that didn't even happen.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_03: It's like so because because I it was just that was such a a mirage of like Again, that that was never Pitt.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_03: Our whole time growing up, that was you never even that wasn't even like in the in in like a a a space in your mind where you allowed a possibility of that because they they just they weren't that school.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_03: That wasn't even a remote possibility, and then it happened and they had their window there and and they unfortunately didn't didn't ever get to the final four.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_03: But but then it's like it's over.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I I think you're right.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_03: I mean that by the time that all went down, there were enough people that wanted Dixon gone anyway that it wasn't so so maybe that answers your question about how could you let an AED come in here and do that, because I think by that point people were just like, okay, Dixon's not not good anymore, and the recruiting's dried up, and we need to get new blood.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_03: There were enough people that had that opinion, and I think history maybe has shown that you know that wasn't the case.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_03: It was it was very you talked about Wansted.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_03: It was very similar to Wanstead.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_03: You know, by the time Wanstead was gone was he you know he was a guy that wanted to be here, sure, but then you know, he he kind of maxed out his potential and and was it better to get a new guy?
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_03: Well you know, the new guys didn't work out, and then same thing happened in basketball.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, you're leading nicely into the new guys.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_02: So they literally hired a coach worse than Jamie Dixon, like and it it wasn't it wasn't easy, like it wouldn't be easy to replace.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: Jamie Dixon, but there were like they could have got the Millers who hadn't done all the cheating yet, or a lot of other people.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_02: If they just would have paid some money, they probably could have got a lot of other people that, you know, at least bigger name or had a lot of success.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_02: But no, they hired Kevin Stallings because he was friends with you know uh Barnes, and they and the uh what they're that was always the scandal is the uh company they paid to do the search was like Barnes owned a stalk in or something or had some weird connection to.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like Pitt basically paid a million dollars for them to not really look for anybody.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: In Stallings, he was were had a worse record than Dixon and like did not have half the success.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_02: And then when he came here, he had no success.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_02: He was here, what, two years?
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_02: And the one year they went 0 and 18 in ACC play.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I think he's still getting paid.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_02: I he hasn't like he doesn't he hasn't coached anywhere since.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I swear he just took the job here because his son was in the minor leagues with the pirates, and he figured he could go and watch pirate games in the offseason and watch his son play.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_02: So and that literally did happen.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like there was a game in New York, and like I remember they showed Kevin Stallings in the stands.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_02: It was like that was before Stallings got traded from the Pirates, so I guess the joke was on him, but it's just like what what a uh it's just so finally they crack open the you know the piggy bank or whatever, and they hire Jeff Capold, who I thought at the time would be a good recruit.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_02: He seemed like a good recruiter at Duke, but he's just been a disaster at Pitt.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_02: He he he can't recruit.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_02: He's not much of an in-game coach, and it's just they've been terrible for the last you know, Dixon left in what 2016.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_02: They haven't even sniffed the tournament.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_02: Not even I don't know if they've won more than 15 games since then in a season.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_03: I mean so so I have I have here uh in front of me, because I I had this from a few years ago, in in 2018, the New York Post did an ACC tournament preview.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_03: So they they listed all the teams, uh their seeds, and then for each team they had a strength, a weakness, and then and then can win title if so that was for every team in the pit when they went in the O winless in ACC fight.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, they went O and 18 in the ACC.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_03: So here's here's what the New York Post had for Pitt that year.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_03: Strength was showing up on time for the next game.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_03: Well weakness, weakness was one word, basketball.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_03: Basketball.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_03: And can win title if uh was if every team dies laughing at the notion.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so that that's that was the um Kevin Stalling's era of pit basketball.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, you're right, his son eventually got traded because you know he was actually starting to get good, so the pirates had to had to do something about that.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_03: Um but but you know, Capel I was excited about Capel because I I mentioned earlier I was a Duke fan back in the back in the day, and Capel was one of the one of the great Duke players back in the nineties.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um one one of the best games I ever saw was the the ninety-five game against UNC where Cable hit just a miracle shot and I think it was double overtime to send it to a I think it was a triple overtime.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_03: So I I was a big Cable fan.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_03: I thought, you know, he was he was definitely like a Sheshevsky disciple, you know, might have been a guy that had he stuck around could have six six seceded Sheshewsky.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_03: So so you just you were excited about that get, and like you said, so far it has not really paid any kind of dividends.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_03: So unfortunately.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_02: He got fired at Oklahoma before he went back to Duke, too.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess the only time he had any success, and I mean it's always like chicken or the egg when you make this when he had a Blake Griffin at Oklahoma, he had success then.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: But I mean you can't have success without good players, but you have to be awake he hasn't recruited and then like the three players he had all hate like they all got in an argument over like somebody's girlfriend or something, and that's why they all transferred, and that I think that kind of killed his coaching, although like I said, he's not the greatest in-game coach, so like that I don't I'd have to look up their record, but I I doubt they've had more than 15 wins in any of the last three seasons.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I mean you got you gotta at least have like what 18 to 20 to have a chance to make the tournament, or even the NIT.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_02: I mean so I mean a final wrap up on this.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um Jamie Dixon, like what he was kind of a victim of his own success, and one article even says that he said I've raised expect expectations very much.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_02: So he raised it from like, oh my goodness, we made the tournament, to oh my goodness, why aren't we winning in the tournament?
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_02: Why aren't we making the final four?
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_02: You know?
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_02: And it just if ten years before they didn't make the tournament, nevertheless, I don't think they had won a tournament game since like the 70s.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: When when he got there, they made the tournament 14 out of the next 15 years, and they made the Elite Eight, and they they consistently made the Sweet 16 most years.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_02: So I I don't know what else people wanted out of Pitt.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe it just he got started to get stale.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: It would have been nice to see him have like a Jim Beheim kind of run here, but it wasn't to be.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_03: It's very similar to kind of Bill Cower's tenure with the Steelers, because when when Bill Cower came in and he won the division his first year after the just the miserable decade of the entire 1980s and and beginning of the nineties, you were just so thrilled, like, oh my gosh, we're a good team again.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: This is this is tremendous.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_03: And then it very quickly turned into we can't you know we're losing AFC championship games at home.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_03: But but Cower was kind of able to write that really nice ending to his tenure because he eventually won the Super Bowl there at the end, and it would have been nice for Dixon to have some kind of nice even if it would have been just making the Final Four, just to be able to write some kind of nice ending to that instead of just the way it went.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_03: So you're right, kind of like a a great time for pit basketball, but kind of sad to think back on it as well.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_02: And and Jamie Dixon's proved that he didn't forget how to coach because he's taken TCU, a program that I don't think they had won a tournament game in like 35 years.
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_02: They've won like one or two tournament games now since he's been there.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_02: So so he hasn't forgotten how to coach.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_02: He's a good coach, and it's just like I said, it's just a shame they he couldn't, you know, win a little bit more, like have the administration just kind of pull, like I said, like Syracuse or something, where you just you just tune out the critics and just say, whatever, we're sticking with our guy.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_02: As long as he's happy, we're happy, and he'll be here till he doesn't want to be here anymore.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: So well, that's the book on Jamie Dixon.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh hopefully Pit Basketball hires somebody that can turn it around, or maybe Cape will get lucky and find an NBA player under a rock somewhere.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um uh thanks for uh listening.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um keep giving us those likes on uh whatever service you listen to.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_02: Uh word of mouth is great.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: Uh check us out on Twitter or on the web.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_02: And uh thanks for tuning in.