Latest / Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast) / Zara Saleem started her Ayurvedic inspired skincare business, Delhicious, with £250 at her kitchen table, now she’s got a 50,000 person waitlist (part 1)

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Zara Saleem started her Ayurvedic inspired skincare business, Delhicious, with £250 at her kitchen table, now she’s got a 50,000 person waitlist (part 1) · Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast)

• 0:00
  This is Zara Saleem for Female Startup Club. Hi, welcome back to the show. It's Dune here, your host and hype girl.
• 0:18
  Today on the show, we're learning from Zahra Saleem, the founder of Delicious, a 100% natural Ayurvedic inspired skincare brand that started in her kitchen while she was on mat leave. And there are so many important insights and learnings packed into this episode. For Zahra, it was a really slow start, but at some point the TikTok gods kicked in and changed everything for her.
• 0:47
  We also talk about how hard the challenges of building a business really are, especially when we see the highlights splashed across social media. I really loved this episode and I felt like we can all relate to the ups and downs of building a business and what it truly means.
• 1:05
  And remember to pop your details onto our waitlist ahead of our upcoming announcement, go to femalestartupclub.com forward slash waitlist, and I will see you there. For now, let's get into this episode. This is Zara for Female Startup Club.
• 1:21
  Zara, hi. Welcome to the Female Startup Club podcast. Hi, thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be on. Me too. I feel like this has been in the works for a while. I've been stalking you on LinkedIn for such a long time, reading your updates, cheering for you on the sidelines. Gosh, I'm happy to be here. Thank you. Thank you. It's really kind of you to say. I know it's been such a great, I think from the first time,
• 1:45
  like month that you reached out. It's been a while, isn't it? Since we've been able to like have the time. So it's really nice to be here. It has been a while. Let's get straight into it and give us a little bit of an introduction to who you are and what your business is.
• 2:02
  Sure. So my name is Zara and my business is a Indian inspired skincare brand, which I started with my husband. So I'm the co-founder. And yeah, it's it's been a very organic start, a very organic story of how we started.
• 2:18
  But yeah, the gist of it is that we make Asian inspired skincare and it's very much inspired by Ayurveda. And if people don't know what Ayurveda is, it's a system of medicine. So it's one of the oldest healing systems in the world. And it's very much inspired by that. And it's inspired by our South Asian roots. So amazing. Gosh, I'd love to understand kind of.
• 2:40
  Why you were thinking about starting this business? Where does the story begin? Where does that light bulb moment happen for you? And how did you go from kind of, you know, I read that you're a teacher before teacher to entrepreneur?
• 2:54
  Yeah, I mean, it's quite, it's just such a crazy, it's a crazy story because I think initially I didn't think that I would end up where I am today. So, yeah, I was, I mean, I graduated from uni, didn't really know what to do and kind of fell into teaching. More so because I had, I had a passion of I wanted to help people. And that was my main thing. I was like, I just want to go into a field where, you know, I'm working with people and I'm able to make somewhat of a difference.
• 3:19
  So it was kind of like an easy, just an easy career choice in that sense. But the way the business started, it's quite a it's a bit of a strange story because in the sense that it wasn't an intentional decision to start a business. So I was actually pregnant with my daughter and I was on maternity leave at the time and I developed a really painful dry skin condition.
• 3:40
  So it was because I was pregnant, I didn't want to use any of the creams that the doctors were prescribing at the time, which is mainly steroid creams. They go straight for steroids, obviously being pregnant, didn't want to use those. Because I'm from a South Asian background, I've kind of grown up. And I think a lot of people would a lot of South Asian people experience this where you grow up using natural ingredients, which you're like grandma or your mom has passed down to you.
• 4:03
  For any kind of ailment, and that's whether you've got a problem with your hair or it's a problem with your skin, there's always a natural ingredient solution for it.
• 4:11
  So I come from a background of Ayurveda in the sense that my grandma used to create loads of different recipes. And she was kind of known as a healer. And she had these incredible formulations and incredible recipes, which I guess I kind of grew up with, not knowing actually how amazing they were. Because it's so ingrained in our culture, which is like our go-to to use these kind of ingredients. I started experimenting and formulating with my husband. And we came across an ingredient which was black SMT. And I started using it as a topical body scrub.
• 4:40
  And literally like my skin transformed within within the week. It was just it was completely different.
• 4:46
  And then I think at that point where we're like, this is actually amazing. Could we start a business off the back of this? Like, is this something that people would want? And it was more again, it came from the helping perspective, which was like, I want to be able to give this other pregnant women. Like I wanted to be able to help other women who are suffering from this kind of thing, who might be looking for a natural solution. And at the time, there was no product out there that was using this ingredient. Like nobody was using Indian black SMT, which is sourced from India. And it has such incredible skin benefits.
• 5:13
  So it was just kind of like, do we start with just this one product and see how it goes? And that's literally it. Like we just started off the back of that, formulated, you know, got clued up on all the legals and launched the business. I think it was like within three months. I was still on maternity leave, like when we launched it. So it was so crazy. It was like my second daughter as well. And it was just like, it was just such a crazy time. But yeah, it was like such an unintentional start, just kind of discovering something amazing.
• 5:38
  Wow. I love that. Gosh, your grandma must be so proud of you. That's just so amazing. Gosh. Yeah. I mean, it's just insane. Like, um,
• 5:49
  It just kind of happened off the back. And yeah, we launched with one product. And I think that's a misconception a lot of people have, that you need to have a big range. When you're stepping into a skincare market, which is such a heavily saturated market as it is, I think people have the idea of you need to have 10 products and you need to have a whole range of, and it wasn't the case. We started with one product and now we still have a small range, but it's growing. We have five or six products now and we're slowly developing that. But I think it goes to show that you can just start
• 6:18
  with one thing and just see how it goes.
• 6:21
  That really resonates with me. I used to have a jewelry brand and there were just so many different products and so much newness. And it became actually really difficult to market because if you have one product, you can stack your marketing really clearly across all your channels. You can continue to build on ads. You can continue to have the same creative, like all those kinds of things stack on top of each other. But when you have 50 different products, it becomes quite
• 6:51
  launch. And I think it's actually a really smart decision if that's the kind of offering that you can have. I'd love to kind of talk a bit more about how you got started, you know, what you were doing in those early days to get ready to launch and bring this brand out into the world.
• 7:07
  You know, I think, again, people have the idea of age being a factor when you're launching, because I think people think, oh, you know, you have to be really young and have all the time in the world. I had a toddler. She was one. She's one and a bit, one and a half, and a newborn at the time. So for me, I was so stretched. I mean, not even just having to deal with kind of starting the business and understanding all of that. It was just kind of getting to grips with juggling two small children, and,
• 7:36
  So I think it was really messy. It was such a messy start. I think there was no like there was no actual workspace. We did it. You know, we were at home. I didn't have an office space. It was very much like me and my laptop when I could find those pockets of time in the day to just research and get my head around what needed to be done.
• 7:56
  And of course, I had my husband who was incredible. He was working full time. And I was still on that leave at the time. So I think we were in such a such a chaotic season of our life. So it's hard even when people say it to me, like how like, how did you start? It was kind of like, I mean, it was a lot of like, we were just exhausted. We were just so exhausted, because we're just trying to juggle our family life. Yeah, just trying to get by. And then to think about Yeah, then to think about branding and like,
• 8:22
  you know, thinking of your name and, you know, getting trademarks done and all of the other bits that we were learning as we went. I had zero experience in the cosmetic industry and neither did my husband, but I had a passion for it. And I just and I loved it. I loved the product. I knew that with the right branding, with the right, you know, getting my story out there because it was so authentic.
• 8:39
  I think that's what I was concentrating on. But it's so hard to say. Like, it was so messy. It was so messy. There was no, like, set hours. It was just as and when I could. Love it. That's the only way I could describe it. Scrappy start. Literally, it was so scrappy. Are you, like, making these products in your kitchen and kind of making a batch that's ready to go? Or are you starting to market and then getting orders and making it on demand? What's the kind of model in the early days?
• 9:07
  So we were hand-making. Yeah, we were hand-making in our kitchen, literally making small batches. And even our packaging wasn't printed. It was just stickers. Like we printed stickers, slapping those on, heat sealing ourselves. And Instagram, I think, was like my main place to start. I had no idea. I didn't even know where to start. I think a lot of people think you turn your website on, you're going to get those orders.
• 9:31
  It just doesn't happen. I think our first order would have maybe came like a couple of months after we launched just because we were like sitting in this market that, again, is so saturated. And I had no clue about marketing. I had no idea how to get the product out there. I think we started like I just started our Instagram page and we got lucky in the sense that we end up getting a lot of press quite early on when we launched. And that was just off the basis of, again, Instagram and kind of just reaching out to other kind of South Asian branded pages who then started reposting about us.
• 10:01
  And that was great. That was a really great start for us because it got the attention of the BBC. The BBC got in touch and said, do you want to come on the radio? Oh, my gosh. Wow. Yeah. So I think it was such an organic. We didn't spend a penny. We did not spend a penny on ads just because I think there's a lot of fear behind spending money on something that's so new. You just think, OK, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to run ads. So a lot of it was just organic, kind of reaching out. The same with them. We got a feature in Harper's Bazaar, but I was just hounding the journalists like, oh,
• 10:29
  just hounding her, like just sending her emails, sending her DMs on Instagram. And then she was like, okay, I'll try it. And she loved it. And then she wrote an article about it. What were you saying in those emails and messages? Like, how were you talking to her? I was just kind of like, I think I was...
• 10:44
  For me, it was like I was just kind of telling her my story and saying, you know, we formulate this amazing product. Do you want to try it? It was just as simple as that. And of course, a lot of the time with journalists, you won't get a response. But my main strategy was to get myself out there without spending a lot of money and just getting that press. For us, I think we kind of said press was a really important thing for us because we thought it would give us some legitimacy in the market.
• 11:09
  And I think that's just how we got our start. A lot of it was just hounding people, chasing. We didn't put a lot of money into it. And then just off the back of that, it grew. But it was a slow start. I mean, like I said, my husband was still working full time and I was at home with the kids. So it was a slow start. We had one product. I had Instagram and I was just hounding journalism. That was literally how we started. What kind of money did you need to get yourself ready to launch? What was your investment to start this business?
• 11:38
  So I think with something like skincare, it's quite a low financial startup cost. It's literally down to, you know, packaging, getting a few of your legal sorted. So it was like under £1,000. We started with under £1,000, like well under. I'd say it was like around between £200 to £500.
• 11:56
  just to get our product with a website and ready to go. And that was enough for us to begin with. Again, I think we just kind of thought, let's just wing it and see how far we can go. So we didn't want to invest too much to begin with, which I think can work for some people. And obviously for others, it isn't. It's probably, you know, they want to start the brand and they want to come out with a bang, but it's totally doable. It's totally doable with like under 500 pounds to start a business. Absolutely.
• 12:23
  Gosh, I love that. What a great message to send to everyone who's kind of sitting in their jobs right now being like, I'm dreaming of starting this thing. I have this thing tucked into my back pocket that I want to get started, but they're thinking I need thousands or tens of thousands of dollars. You really can start small and scrappy and like you said, just go slow and prove out the concept and work.
• 12:45
  start there. Definitely, definitely. I mean, sometimes I speak to quite a lot of other small business owners. I love it. I love the small business, especially the female community. And then when I hear them say things like, oh, I'm thinking of sourcing out my social media, or I'm just going to get a fulfillment center. I'm like, don't do it. What you can do, do it yourself to save that money. Because if you spend too much too early and the idea isn't a proven concept and it doesn't, it's not successful, then,
• 13:12
  You will feel that. And then more so emotionally, you're going to feel that loss that you failed at something. So I always say, you know, as much as you can save and do things yourself before letting go, especially early stages. Like we just did everything. You know, we did everything to begin with. And it's hard. But I think everybody knows that running a business is hard work. And if you're passionate about it, you can totally pull yourself, push yourself through it.
• 13:35
  Absolutely. Gosh, I want to go kind of talking around this time. I think we're in 2018 now at the moment, right? Where you've spent a few months, you're easing into it, you're starting to get press, things are starting to kind of move along. What happens next? How do you kind of take the brand to the next level? And when do things start to snowball?
• 13:57
  Yeah. So we, so again, we were kind of in that slow burner stage and it was okay for me physically and emotionally, mentally, I think it was a good stage to be in because I was coping with a lot with the girls at home and, um,
• 14:09
  And then we had Glossybox reach out. And Glossybox is the UK's biggest beauty subscription service. They reached out and they said, oh, you know, we really like the look of it. We like the look of your product. Can we have some for our box? We were like, oh my gosh, this sounds amazing. How many do you need? And remember at this stage, we're still hand-making batches at home. They placed an order for 110,000 units. And we were like,
• 14:39
  What? We don't have staff. We don't have a factory.
• 14:45
  We took the order on. What? 110,000 units. Oh, my gosh. We did 110,000 units. We took the order on. And the reason we took it on, we did weigh it out. And I think it's one of those things where we just thought, you know what? This is the opportunity for us to just get our product into 110,000 people's hands. And we just went with it. We said, yep, we can do it. Okay. So how do you do that?
• 15:12
  We turned our house into a factory, essentially. Oh my God, you did it yourself. What? We did it ourselves. Because the thing, the way that beauty subscription models work is because they have a certain amount of products that they have to fulfill in a box, it's not the same as when you go to a retailer. So we didn't have an option to go to a manufacturer. And also, I think we were just at that stage where we thought, you know, we can do it. Like handmade product is always, we had that control and we weren't ready to let go of that control.
• 15:42
  So literally, we moved our furniture out of our living room. We got industrial machines in. We had a marquee in our garden. Thankfully, it was summertime. So we ran out of storage pretty fast. Our whole like our shed at the back was full. It was like a three to four month project. And when I say that order nearly killed us, it literally nearly killed us. Like we were...
• 16:05
  Just making, filling, heat. Like one room was like a heat seething room. Bearing in mind, I have two very little girls. Like my family and like all of our family and friends were amazing. Like my mom just took the girls. She was like, I'll just take them and you just need to get on. And oh my God, like when I, like we had like pallets on our driveway. We had like huge delivery vans coming with like, like all of our wholesale ingredients and our packaging. And it was just insane. Like that summer was so difficult, but we did it.
• 16:32
  What was your like, how did you fund that? Because obviously that requires working capital. You need to buy all of the ingredients. You need to buy all of the packaging. That sounds like a big investment. Definitely. We had, that was, I think that was our point where we thought we now need to invest some of our own money into this.
• 16:50
  And we did. Like we didn't we thankfully we didn't need any loans. We didn't actually get any investment. We invested our money into it. And of course, we were still getting paid for the order. So we invested a chunk of our money in knowing that it's going to come back in a roundabout way. It'll come back to us at some point. But it was an investment. But the best thing about that order was it enabled us to up level our packaging because it's.
• 17:12
  When you're buying at large volumes, it means that your costs can come down. So we thought this is our time to really invest in some good packaging, really invest in wholesale ingredients and get our prices down to get our costs down. So it was a good. So we weighed the pros and cons of it and thought we need to go for it because we're at such an early stage. We're pretty much nobodies. And this massive beauty giant has come and said, you know, we can put your product in people's hands. And we thought whatever it takes, we need to get it. We need to do it.
• 17:40
  And whether that's investing in it financially, whether it was literally like blood, sweat and tears, like our backs were broken, like literally broken backs, like lifting boxes. Our entire house was not a house. Like we didn't have a dining room. We didn't have a living room. It was just our factory for those three to four months where we just fulfilled that order. And the day that that order went out, I think we were in the September or October glossy box. I think it was August delivery that August. We had like 15 pallets being collected from our driver.
• 18:10
  Is this like living hell over? Because it was so difficult. We were hand-making and we did 110,000 units. I am in shock. That is insane stuff. It was just... Whoa. Oh, my God. It was insane.
• 18:25
  But it really goes out there. You hand packed 110,000 units. That's like, I just can't even wrap my head around what that looks like. That's crazy. Also, during that three months, are you still marketing as well? Or are you kind of like, hey, I'm just going to focus specifically on this. I'm not going to kind of like push every day to market.
• 18:44
  Exactly. I fully, I think everything was paused. We paused everything. Our socials just went quiet because there was just not enough hours in the day. So everything was going into this order. So we knew we were like, no, pause it and just deliver the order. And then we see, then we'll see how it's received. And it was great. Like Gossip Box were amazing. There was such a wonderful, wonderful team. And even for them to work with us was such a big deal because they work with huge brands, you know, like,
• 19:08
  They have like L'Oreal and like Colgate and all these massive brands that contribute to their boxes. And then there was us like this, like literally husband and wife team, like.
• 19:16
  but we'd love to be in your box. And they were like, yes, what can we do to help you to make it happen? And they're amazing. Oh, I love that. Gosh. Yeah, they were so amazing and so supportive. And literally, it was like, I think that for us felt like the start of our business, because off the back of the Glossy Box order, we then were able to expand into three different body scrubs. So now we're like, okay, we've got a range now. We have a range of body scrubs. And people knew us. People would say, oh, I tried this in my Glossy Box. I loved it. And we had so many great reviews. I think even now on their website, they probably have like 2,000,
• 19:46
  500 close to five star reviews on the product and it really gave us that boost yeah it was like we knew the product was great and we knew that if it gets we just need to get into people's hands so it was a lot of blood sweat and tears but we got there and off the back of that we managed to get like really nice upgrade on our packaging and we had a whole range and then that was it like that was
• 20:06
  really the start of Delicious for us where we thought oh my gosh like we're an actual brand now because we're sitting in this beauty box with all these other really lovely brands and people are saying wow I love the packaging I love the name you know I love the story behind it and it was so nice it really made me feel like yep like this is it now but no it was it was really intense it was just such a it was a crazy oh my gosh
• 20:25
  I read that at some point you decided to jump on TikTok. And I feel like this was the next big thing that happened for you. Can we talk about your TikTok journey?
• 20:39
  Yep, definitely. So I think after the Glossy Box order, and I think that was like pandemic time, pandemic hit. And so I guess it was 2020 when we joined TikTok. So I speak to a lot of small business founders and I have this friend who she has a tanning brand. So she had joined TikTok. And of course, TikTok was very new at the time. And to me, it felt like, oh, God, I don't really want to like manage another social media platform. Like that's just such a headache. I don't want to do that.
• 21:06
  But she was seeing some really good success off the back of it. And she kind of messaged me to be like, you need to join TikTok. Like, it's the place to be for small businesses right now. Okay, like, let's just see. Let's just try it, you know, and see how it goes. Started posting a few videos. I don't think I got anywhere, actually, for the first couple of videos, still trying to, like, find a way to work it out. I remember I was asking, like, my husband's nieces who were, like, teenagers. I was like, so how do you post? How do you add, like, text? Like, I had no idea how to do it.
• 21:35
  test it and see what it is that your your particular audience wants and I think when I started talking about my first video that went viral was I did a video about how I used to bleach my skin as a South Asian woman and skin whitening and how toxic it is and how toxic the culture is that promotes skin whitening and I think that blew up where people were like oh my god yes you know that's so true like skin whitening in the Asian culture
• 22:03
  So toxic. And I think that was like, OK, wow, like people really resonated with that message. And then I started posting. So at that point in the pandemic, we'd formulated some body balms again, formulated for super dry skin, a really unique formulation, really like they were brand new. We launched them in like October time. We joined TikTok around January, Feb.
• 22:22
  And they're pretty new. And at this point, I was kind of hounding retailers or hounding people to try the bombs. They're amazing. And not really getting anywhere with them. Started posting about them on TikTok. And it just blew up. Like, it was incredible. I think I had one customer who had shared it with a magazine, how much it helped her psoriasis.
• 22:41
  And I posted that on TikTok and it just blew up. Like people were like, oh my God, if this works, I want to try it. And then people started buying. At that point, we were hand-making the balms. We were probably doing about 100 a week, hand-making 100 a week. And then...
• 22:56
  the more that people bought on from the back of TikTok, the more success they were getting. And then I was getting, I literally was getting DM'd like hundreds of before and after shots of people's skin. So anybody that was trying the balm was like, oh my God, look at my, look at it. And I was sharing that. And then every single video was going viral because people were like, what is this like magical moisturizer?
• 23:17
  And we were just, all we were doing was all day long, me and my husband make hand-making balms, hand-making balms and shifting them because of the back of TikTok. The video is going viral. And the fact that people were like, oh my God, the product works. People are commenting on TikTok. I bought it, it works, you know? And it was just insane. Like at that point then, you know,
• 23:34
  We'd only bought like a couple of thousand like bits of enough to make the ingredients enough to. And then we were just selling out, constantly selling out every single video going viral, like getting viral. It was just insane. I think it was just because the product worked. Like people were like, oh, my God, it actually works. Look at my eczema results. Look at my psoriasis. Look at this. Look at that. And it was just like TikTok just blew up. I think we went from zero followers to like 50K in a couple of months. And now I think we're like close to 250.
• 24:02
  It was insane, like just off the back of TikTok. I think it really speaks to the power of and the testament to when you actually solve a problem and when you actually have something that you can visually see the results, you can see the change. The power is so real, especially on a platform like TikTok with, you know, video content and being able to show and explain and kind of talk through it, that the opportunity is just crazy there.
• 24:30
  It really is. I think, you know, I think we joined at a good time. You know, it was still quite early days. A lot of small businesses were getting a lot of promo. And it was just a good time to be on something that was so new to people. It's still a good time to join. I always encourage people, I'm like, get on TikTok, like, invest your invest time in one platform and see how it goes. Like, whether you think, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna invest in Instagram, and I'm gonna post out those reels every day, just invest that time in it. And you will see a result. Like I have lots of people that will message and say, I haven't gone viral yet. It's like,
• 24:58
  Just be consistent. And if you believe in your products, your products work or whatever it is that you're selling, you will get there. Like, just be consistent with one platform. And that's what we did. Like, Instagram was always great. It was that kind of curated, pretty side of our brand. And I think people like that, like the pastel colors. And it was all about the brand aesthetic.
• 25:15
  but TikTok was our real behind the scenes. It was just us, our hands making product, talking about our product. It was just, and I would literally make videos in a couple of minutes at a time because I wanted them to be really real and authentic. I didn't want to spend like hours creating content. I think a lot of people think you need that, you need to do that, but you really don't. Just keep it really authentic, get that content out there and just see how, just test it out and see how people respond. How many times a day were you posting? Like what was your posting schedule on TikTok?
• 25:43
  Like I literally didn't even have, I did not even have a schedule. I was like, again, because I'm just so like mum life, you know, I was trying to aim for like daily. I was like, I'll try and do like one post a day, but I'm not going to be religious about it. I'm just going to see how it goes. Like there's no, I feel like people will be like post two times a day, post it. It's like.
• 25:59
  Just go with what is like doable for you, because if your content is good, it's still going to get those views. I think people thought they had to crack a code. You know, you have to like post every every day at this time. And it's really not like that. I think if you use the right kind of hashtag, you know, your content is good. It will get seen regardless. People are going to engage with it. They're going to engage with it. Absolutely. I read that you garnered a wait list of 50,000 people. How did this happen? What happened?
• 26:30
  it was, oh my gosh. So that was, that was TikTok. That was all TikTok. We were selling out so quickly and the results were coming in so quickly that people were just, people were ending up buying like three, four at a time. And then we ran out of everything, you know, and then there was delays in like shipping with our tea because it comes from like India. So at this, and at this point we were still hand-making. So we were just thinking like, how can we, we can't, like we're fulfilled, we're packing orders, we're hand-making balms and,
• 26:59
  It was just so intense that I was like, you know what, we were like, we just need to put ourselves out of stock because we can't fulfill the demand. And then we thought, OK, let's just put a waiting list and see how it goes. And every single day that way just went up and up and up. And it was just amazing. It was just like, oh, my gosh, I can't believe this many people have signed up for alerts. It was literally 50,000 people were waiting.
• 27:21
  And that in itself was scary because there was no way we were going to fulfill a demand of 50,000. Even just to invest that much to be able to fulfill 50,000 is just insane. So we were still taking it slow, still ordering small amounts at a time and still hand-making. And at one point, I think we would like maybe put out 2,000 bombs because we're like, okay, we've done 2,000. It's taken us days. We've done it. And they would go because people were just waiting. But it was insane. Like I still...
• 27:47
  Can't even believe it. You know, it's so insane. And what happened there, though? Like, did you think, okay, we've got to stop hand-making these balms. We've got to find, you know, a factory and fulfill these in a different way. Like, we need to level up here. What's that kind of next phase of your business? Exactly.
• 28:05
  When you're hand-making product, I think, and you realize that there is a big demand for it, it is, you have to let go. And I think for us, that was really difficult to do because we were perfectionists when it came to the production of it. We didn't want to let it go. And equally, it's such a delicate process. It's such a delicate process that we had to find the right manufacturer. And that took us a really long time. So we were still hand-making balms, letting them go, like putting them online, just a little bit at a time, a couple of like
• 28:30
  a couple of thousand here and there. Hopefully that would satisfy the demand. We had to limit it to one per person because people were buying so many at a time. And then we were in the background still working on finding a manufacturer. So we had to. We had to outsource that, went to visit a few people, but we knew we wanted to keep it in the UK so we can still have that control. We can still go visit. But yeah, eventually we did. We had to give it to a manufacturer because we're
• 28:53
  We couldn't be hand-making and marketing and doing everything that came with doing the brand when you're still kind of bogged down in the practical side of it. And as much as we love the practical side, it actually wasn't realistic. So, yeah, we then ended up saying, OK, look, the demand is there. Now we're going to, you know, scale up. And we did. We just went to a manufacturer. So we no longer are making them. And, yeah, just a way to satisfy the demand, really. Yeah.
• 29:20
  Did this change the way that you were thinking about capital and whether you needed to raise? Obviously, in consumer-based businesses, consumer product-based businesses, you do need that capital to invest in bigger orders. And I'm sure when you start working with the factory, you have to kind of explore what those avenues are. Did it change your approach in how you were thinking about money and loans and fundraising and things like that?
• 29:44
  Yes, I think so. I think I think that was a time when we thought, you know what, we is there a way for us to kind of raise some kind of investment? And we looked at crowdfunding. Initially, we looked at crowdfunding and I think that is still a great option. We didn't end up going for it. And thankfully, we ended up not having to take loans and we ended up we scaled so slowly. And I think.
• 30:06
  when people look at us from the outside, they think, oh my gosh, you blew up so quickly. How did you manage? We took it really slow because we knew that raising investment is not always easy. And there's a lot of complications, I think, that come with it and a lot more pressure as well. I think when you have an investor on board, you now have somebody else who's kind of asking you and questioning your business. And I think we probably weren't
• 30:31
  We weren't really sure in what way to go. But thankfully, because we had so many orders that we had enough and we took it so slow, we didn't actually end up having to get any external investment. But I think it was around that time when I was also approached by Dragon's Den.
• 30:47
  So for anybody that doesn't know BBC Dragons Den, it's like an investment show. You go on, you pitch and you're pitching to essentially these dragons who are millionaires. And I think we thought, OK, you know, we've got something really good here. We know we're really small. It's just us. But potentially this could be a good route to getting investment.
• 31:07
  So we entertained that idea as well. But I think because we took it so slow, we didn't actually have to exhaust too many external avenues, if that makes sense. But I think that was the best way for us to grow, to do it slowly. Did you go on Dragon's Den? I did go on Dragon's Den, yes. How did it go? Not so great. I mean, it's kind of like...
• 31:29
  traumatic talking about it now so it was filmed last year june i think i'm now in a place where i can actually like talk about it and be like yeah i can't believe i actually went on it so um yeah so when they approached me we were like okay like we need to do this like let's just see how it goes when filmed in the den and obviously the episode is now live so i can say it but i didn't get the investment and um
• 31:48
  I think a lot of that always comes down to me feeling like, you know, I maybe I didn't pitch right or maybe they didn't believe my idea. But there's a lot of rules and regulations around the den. Like, for example, I wasn't allowed to show my before and after pictures of skin transformations. And that is a really it's a really big part of our brand. Yeah, I wasn't allowed. It was just it's just like BBC guidelines. You know, you're not allowed to. I think it was probably around consent and things like that. I'm not I'm not even 100 percent sure. I did ask the question. They're like, no, sorry, you wouldn't be allowed.
• 32:17
  So there's a lot that I couldn't actually maybe express. And it's also a very high pressure, very high pressure situation. You know, you're in a room with like 50 cameras and, you know, you're pitching to these people that are like TV stars, essentially. So I didn't get the investment. And at the time, I was so bummed. I was just like, oh, my God, like they didn't believe in my brand, which means that
• 32:35
  it's obviously not that good. Maybe I thought it was better than it really took a massive knock on my confidence. And my husband was amazing. He was like, no, you don't need to listen to me. You were great. But I fully felt like I had let the business down. I'd let the brand down because I'd gone on as the spokesperson for it. And then, I mean, we carried on. I did think they didn't believe me. I think they didn't believe how great it was. And
• 32:58
  how much it was working and how much it was helping people's skin. And I just don't think they got it. And maybe also like me being like an ex teacher and kind of standing there like I started this with zero experience. Like, what do you think? You know, like they're like, yeah, nah, we don't we don't trust you. We don't know. We don't think you know what you're doing. But yeah.
• 33:14
  Then Dragon's Den happened and we didn't get the investment. But thankfully, we actually didn't need it. The business carried on, you know, and by the time the episode had aired, I think a lot of people were like, I'm really shocked you didn't get it because clearly, you know, the brand has gone from strength to strength. But obviously at the time, I just thought it was such a it was awful. You know, it really I took it. I really took it to heart that they didn't want to invest in.
• 33:37
  I think sometimes in those situations, it can be a silver lining that you go through the experience and you don't take investment or you don't get given the opportunity to get investment. And in hindsight, it might be for the better that you didn't take money, you know, too early on, you know.
• 33:54
  Yes. Yeah. And also like give a part of our business away, you know, like you're giving you're giving a big part of your business away. And also, I think it's important for people to remember it's just a TV show. I don't think that it's, you know, how real investment circles and how you actually raise investment. If you were to pitch for an investment, I actually don't think that that's how it would go. Like essentially, they say a lot of things for entertainment. And when people watch that and they think that's how you have to raise investment, I don't think that's the case. I think that people are a lot kinder in the real world.
• 34:23
  Because they're not kind of trying to do it for entertainment. And it is an entertainment show. But it was an experience. And I'm glad I did it, I think. I think after I'd seen the episode, I was like, yeah, I'm glad. It was great. Of course. It's a great experience to go through. It's a learning curve, for sure. Definitely. I think it just made me stronger. Definitely. Definitely.
• 34:45
  I feel like we've spoken a lot about like, you know, the success of your brand and all these kind of amazing things that have happened for you when it comes to the wait list and Glossybox. What are some of the challenging things that you're going through as a business owner that we don't see on social media that other business owners might be sitting there being like, oh, it feels really hard. Like I'm struggling a lot. Oh, my gosh. Yeah.
• 35:10
  Like everything, everything is hard. Everything is hard. Like I think people and this is what I it shocks me when I hear the successes being listed, because to me, the negatives feel more because I do think it's difficult. Like I just think everything can be a challenge, like your time, you know, your effort and everything.
• 35:32
  feeling like you are quite literally just saturated in all these businesses, trying to make your mark, and you're not getting anywhere with it. And that's how we feel. I think the biggest challenge for us has been kind of figuring out our next steps each time, on every stage. It's just kind of like, okay, so where do we go from here? And the multiple amount of rejections, like we have been rejected constantly from buyers. I think whenever you get like a...
• 36:00
  Whenever you get into a retailer, I think people are like, oh, my gosh, wow, you're in a retailer. It's like, yeah, but you don't know how many doors were shut before we got the yes. The amount of rejections, the amount of emails are ghosted. And it really does make you just feel so low. You just think, OK, what am I doing? Why am I even doing this? If they don't see potential in this brand, does this brand even have potential? You question everything. And I think emotionally, it's really difficult. I think emotionally, it's so difficult running a business.
• 36:29
  And especially if you're doing it by yourself, like, I think that's even harder. I just think everything is a challenge, honestly. Like, that's the only way I can, I mean, I hope that it's not like super negative to say that, but it is really hard. And I think it's very easy for people to share their wins. But I just think the reason they're doing that is because that win was so important because it probably took them so many no's. Like, we were like rejected by a major retailer.
• 36:54
  in like January before the bombs went viral. And then people kept asking us, why are you not stuck there? And I was like, they rejected us. Like, that's why, like, everything is always a no. Like you, I feel like brands and businesses always hear a no first before you get your yes. But they don't show the no's. But I have to, yeah, we've been, we've had multiple rejections. And I mean, I think Dragos Den is a very big thing, part of that. Like that for me was I'm being fully like rejected in front of the nation. Like that was really tough. Yeah.
• 37:24
  I just think there's just so many like conceived failures when you're a business person that when people share your positives, you're like, yeah, but that's because there's been so many negatives. Yeah, I just think everything. Honestly, I wish I could like. It sounds it sounds really dark, but entrepreneurship is just a series of no's.
• 37:43
  And rejection. I actually posted that once on my Twitter after I'd had like some, I don't know, something that I was excited about fall through. And someone was like, this is a really negative view. And I was like, is it negative or is it realistic? Literally, like it's, it's so it's so many no's. It's so many no's. It's so many rejections. And there's so many things that can just go wrong in a day. And you just think,
• 38:08
  And the other thing is, I think people think that these positives, I feel like sometimes are very short lived, like, for example, like going viral on social media, like what happens then is you build up that pressure on yourself where you think, okay, like my videos are done. Now I need to make another one. And if you get low views, you're like, oh no, what have I done wrong? Like, is there something wrong? You know, like there's a lot, it's very up and down. It's such an emotional rollercoaster and like...
• 38:29
  It's very cliche to say that, but success does not come that easily and that quickly. It is such a struggle. Like every day is a struggle because you're essentially just kind of winging it a lot of the time. You know, you like you'd actually like for me, especially that I had no experience in the business or running a business. But yeah, like I just think it's so hard. I don't think people probably realize how hard it is. Yeah, it's that thing of like.
• 38:50
  If you had known how hard it is, would you have ever gotten started? You need to kind of go in with a naive sort of, you know, rosy glasses on to be like, yeah, like this is amazing. It's going to be amazing. And then as you kind of go through these challenges, you're like, wow, like I didn't expect it to be this difficult because, of course, people don't really talk about it.
• 39:10
  Yeah, definitely. Definitely. And I think a lot of the time it is that positive real, isn't it? People showing a positive view of their life and their business. And it's like, no, like, for example, like we recently got a like office space now, like our own warehouse space. People are like, oh, my God, that's amazing. Like, do you realize that we were in our house, like literally working in our house for so long, like boxes everywhere?
• 39:31
  For them, for people to think, oh, we've gotten that, you know, and it's like, wow, you've got yours. But it's like, yeah, but we didn't have this for so long, you know, like it's been so hard to get to this stage. Like it's been literal blood, sweat and tears. Like literally, it's so hard. I think every day is hard. Keeping that all in mind, what is your kind of best piece of advice for founders who are out there listening, just getting started? I would say.
• 39:58
  to not, I mean, again, it's really cliche to say these kinds of things, but I just feel like you need to believe that you can do it and have the energy and the passion to just keep going and not let your failures define you. Um, I think I did that when I, when I didn't get the investment on Dragon's Den, I felt like for a good couple of weeks, I was just like, oh my God, this is just awful. I feel so low. And like, I let that failure define me.
• 40:26
  And I think it's so important for founders to not let your failures define you. Not even failures, just maybe when the door has been closed. Because you put so much of yourself in a business, like it's literally so much of you goes into it that it can feel really personal. Like, don't take it personal. It's a business decision. There's a lot of factors that have led to that decision. And you move on, you know, because if it's a no today, you will get a yes somewhere else. But, yeah, I hope it's such a hard one to say, isn't it? I mean...
• 40:55
  I just think people don't realize how hard it is, but they shouldn't let it just really take over their mood because I think that's what I let myself, I think that's what happened to me as well. Yeah, you have to work hard to keep it separate. Easier said than done. Definitely. And, you know, I think a lot of founders, especially if you're working from home,
• 41:13
  that is really difficult because it feels like you can't separate your business from you. Like you are literally one entity. And having that separation is, it is important for your own mental health, because otherwise, if you're physically in your business, you're mentally and you're emotionally in your business, it's going to take its toll and it's really unhealthy. And I think it took, like, it took us a while to even realize that it's the minute we took the business out of the house, even it was like, wow, like this feels like a weight it's been lifted. Like, I just don't like, I think a lot of founders, we don't switch off.
• 41:43
  But it's so important to just kind of step back and think and realize it's not personal. You know, don't take it personally. But yeah, hopefully that's some of some help.
• 41:57
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 42:22
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 42:44
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that.
• 43:00
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 43:24
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 43:47
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that.