Latest / Broken Brains with Bruce Parkman / Tatiana McCall Wimberly: The Legacy of Ray Ray. Fighting for Safer Youth Sports

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Tatiana McCall Wimberly: The Legacy of Ray Ray. Fighting for Safer Youth Sports · Broken Brains with Bruce Parkman

• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: Hey folks, welcome to another edition of Broken Brains with your host, Bruce Parkman, sponsored by the MAC Parkman Foundation, where we talk about the issue of repetitive brain trauma in the form of repetitive head impacts and how they affect the minds and mental health of our athletes and kids, and repetitive blast exposure and how it impacts the brains of our veterans.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: And we bring on parents and coaches and researchers, doctors, authors, in order to give you that 360-degree look at this problem because this is not taught in our nursing, athletic training, psychological, medical, or suicide prevention courses.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: And we as a society are pretty ill illiterate when it comes to this problem.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: So it's up to you to become informed so you can make those decisions necessary for the people you love.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_01: Our guest today is another amazing guest to come on the show.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: Not only is she a guest, she's a friend, and she runs an amazing foundation that you all need to be aware of.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: Tatiana Renee McCall Wimberly, business leader, education and brain health advocate.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: She is a seasoned business leader, educator, and passionate advocate for brain health and youth football safety.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: As the owner of McCall Diversified Enterprises, she brings over 20 years of experience in business management, marketing, public relations, and event consulting, overseeing projects across corporate, nonprofit, and government centers.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: She also manages the National Black Professional Lobby Association Annual Conference and serves as a senior public relations representative at North of Grumman.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: She is also, unfortunately, the co-founder and president of the RL3 Foundation, created in honor of her late son, Ray Lewis III, who was posthumously diagnosed with stage two CTE.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: Through the foundation, she channels her grief into purpose, advocating for youth football safety, brain health awareness, and meaningful change to how contact sports protect their players.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: Miss McCall or Tatiana, welcome to the show and thank you so much for coming on.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Good afternoon, Bruce.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: You had my whole name, my my first, middle, last, and married name.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: You covered it all.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, but thank you so much for having me.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's um privilege to be able to be here and have this conversation and share information that is much needed with the world.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's unfortunate that uh you and I are having to speak from a place of experience.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, we are doing a good thing in memory of our sons.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so I just I appreciate the opportunity.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: Tadiana, there is no more powerful presence I know in this space than a mom.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's you speaking or you know, Karen talking about, you know, her boy or my wife speaking, it's just so powerful for our audience to understand this this from a mom's perspective.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: But while we're also unfortunately here, we are celebrating two amazing young men.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: World to know more about Ray Ray III.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: So why don't you talk talk to us about talk to us about Ray?
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us about this young man.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: Because every time he tells stories about him, I just giggle inside, man.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's amazing.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: Well, well, Ray Ray, as we affectionately called him, he was Ray Anthony Lewis III, named after his father.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: And he was truly one of a kind.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: And some of the stories that I tell are the abs, I mean, they are the absolute truth.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: And to know Ray Ray, you would take me to understand that his personality was just bar none.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: He managed to have all of the positive traits of both his father and I.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so he didn't meet a stranger.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: He was a friend to all.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: He was not a respecter of persons, so he didn't discriminate.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: That was one of, I think, his superpowers, you know, one of his gifts, that it didn't matter their ethnicity, their nationality, their socioeconomic status, um, their religion, their political affiliation.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: None of that mattered to Ray Ray.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: He always saw the best in everybody and he had a way of bridging those people with their differences and having a positive impact.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_00: So that was definitely what I, you know, call his superpower.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: He just didn't discriminate.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: It could be a homeless person on the street, or it could be someone, you know, that he encountered, you know, in Canton, you know, celebrating, you know, his dad's Hall of Fame, you know, accomplishments.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: He just treated everybody the same.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: He's truly missed.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he was just such a large presence that they left such a huge void.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he was the loudest thing in the room always.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: You would hear him before you saw him coming.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he was going to challenge you on every thought.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: He was gonna make you, you know, explain why you believed what you believed on anything down from who was the best out of Kobe and LeBron.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like he was just that type of presence.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: He was kind of in your face and, you know, just challenged you to stand up for what you believe.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: And he was definitely strong in his beliefs and convictions, and he let you know it, you know.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: But he was a lover of people, a lover of life, and he just loved kids, he loved football, and he loved music.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, those were the three things in life he was most passionate about.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: His last like corporate kind of job was he was working in Oklahoma at a behavioral center as a behavior text with uh students with behavioral problems, behavioral issues.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and he just loved it.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he loved, you know, just kind of being there with them, students um as well that had special needs.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it was it was his gift.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: Children gravitated to him, and he just kind of had a way with them, you know.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: That sounds I I wish I could have met him, man.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I just um, you know, as you as, you know, you talk about your boy, you know, the pride of a mom, the things that drove us crazy when they were here, and now they're like our fondest memories, you know.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: I could just so yes, one more time.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: One more time.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_01: So um, you know, with you know, I I I just want to make sure that our audience understands that this is the the famous Ray Lewis, the the linebacker for the Baltimore Ravens that was Ray's father and your and your partner.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: And and and how did that I mean, obviously you're a football family.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, from the get-go, right?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we're very much a football family.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Ray and I met at the University of Miami.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: He was playing.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: I tutored athletes, so I engaged with quite a few of them.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: I also worked in the sports information department at the University of Miami, where I ran stats and pushed a lot of them for a lot of the awards, the Lombardy Award with uh Warren Sapp and the Butkness Award for Ray and different things of that nature.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: So I was around the industry from an academic standpoint and from a professional, you know, standpoint in terms of my student work aspirations.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: So we became friends and and the, you know, end up having one, two, three sons together over the course of our uh 14-year relationship and had some great times as he uh progressed in his career with the NFL and made his accomplishments.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, ultimately finding that we were, you know, better co-parents and friends than we were partners in life.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: However, we have a great relationship still for our children and our grandchildren.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: We have two beautiful granddaughters now that we are very proud of.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, Ray and Ray Ray had a unique relationship, you know, with that whole namesake.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so there were challenges that came for, you know, with Ray Ray for that.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, everybody was always making that comparison, especially when Ray Ray went to the University of Miami as well, where we both attended.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, those were some things that kind of chartered some of the course in the waters as well.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: So when uh so that means, I mean, your your boys grew up like a dad, you know, at their father's, you know, football games.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: And what what was it like being an NFL spouse?
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I mean or a partner, but uh, but still, you know, being there, I mean, it must have been just an exciting time.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you know, there were definitely exciting moments.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like so we had a, we, we had kids pretty quickly because like Ray Ray was born when we were at the University of Miami while we were in college.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: So he was truly, you know, bled orange and green, you know, and so they were around football their whole lives.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: They didn't know anything but that, you know.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: So in terms of rearing the children, we commuted back and forth uh between because we're from Florida as well, Ray and I, and um, but he was, you know, drafted to the Ravens.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: So we commuted back and forth.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: We raised the kids in Florida.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so there were, you know, the exciting parts on game day, you know, and you know, we're out there and definitely, you know, football fanatics, and I'm yelling, I'm screaming, and I'm getting it when what have you.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: But then there were also those regular everyday family, you know, struggles and challenges that you encounter, especially with distance, you know, and wearing children, um, and then just kind of all that comes with the NFL.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: So it was a blessing it afforded us, you know, a very, you know, blessed, you know, life and and so forth.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it didn't come without its challenges, you know.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, no, no doubt.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, when did uh like the boys, they probably never thought about any other sport in the world than football, huh?
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, to be honest, so they they were tri athletes.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: They played football, basketball, and they ran tracks.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: They were doing something year-round because Ray believed in the cross-training, you know, and the different skills that each of those sports kind of brought to football.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and they actually uh wrestled, Ray Ray wrestled for a while as well because Ray was a state wrestling champion uh at Kathleen High School.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: So he truly believed in the aspect of wrestling as well.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that, but he was a state champion, wrestler.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, yeah.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: So the boys wrestled, they ran track, they played football, and they played basketball.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: When they got to high school, he kind of made them choose.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you have to now kind of find a lane that you're gonna, you know, put all of your time, energy, and you know, effort into.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, track was always a cross-training type, you know, thing for their.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: He would have them do hurdles to open their hips and for speed and agility and those type of things.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: But two of them, the oldest two, Ray Ray and Rashad, they did choose football initially.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: And Rasan, our youngest, he actually chose basketball and had been recruited for basketball.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: So he ended up in high school going to a different school that focused on basketball rather than football.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: But senior year, as the bug would come fight him, the athletic director's like, just come out and play, you know, football.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's your senior year of high school.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: Just have some fun.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: So he was like, you know, mom, can I please play?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Your dad is probably gonna have a fit, you know, because he had chosen basketball.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: He was in AAU, he was on the circuits, we were on the West Coast, but you know, AAU teams, you know, in Vegas, we were all over, you know, all in AAU, and he had had a bad injury his sophomore year.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, Ray didn't want him to overextend and overuse his body.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: But long story short, he went and played senior year, took his team to the state championship.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: They lost, but then he got football football offers and ended up at UCF.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: And uh yeah, and so what time how old were the boys when they started playing?
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: They were young.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: So they were about five or six, as soon as they could, as soon as they came of age, and we didn't play flag.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: We mine never played flag.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: They went right to tackle football.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: So we started in Pop Warner.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Ray Ray did, and you know, one of the things that, you know, they had that older lighter kind of thing, you know, because Ray Ray was always solid.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: So he always ended up having to play up because of his weight.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I think those were additional challenges.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: He was playing with older, bigger boys, you know, um, having to, you know, not being able to, you know, with the with the weight limits and things that are included in it.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: So that's um, yeah.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I know that when my son was growing up, he had to wrestle up because he was a bigger boy.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_01: And these guys would cream him.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they were, you know, they they was like, come here, marshmallow, you know, and he's just a big boy, just wanted to help, you know, he and he wanted to learn.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: He did.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: He got he got learnt pretty hard.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's one of the things where we do allow our kids due to their size or as some guy said earlier, huskiness.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: My son was a husky boy growing up.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like we we we think that putting them up against bigger players or is is okay.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: This this the speed and their experience, you know, they tend to to hurt the little guys, man.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: I mean uh so in your in your journey here, I mean I mean, your boys played as long as my son.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: I know that my son started like when it came to like apathy, like the evidence of his struggles, it really didn't happen until about the year before, you know, this eleventh grade, you know, he he died as a senior.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Was there any evidence that Ray Ray was struggling at all that you could say I mean, other than all right, hey, you're a fine young man, that's you know, there's you know, because I looked at my boys like, well, you're getting ready to join the army, you don't want to spend a lot of time with them.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you come up with all these reasons not to see it, you know, and and whether you you know, and then of course, you know, now you look back and like, you know, gosh.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Was there any any indication that Ray might have been having some challenges?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: He just didn't want to tell his mom.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's hard to say because, you know, in addition to, you know, some of the things that I'm gonna look back and, you know, try to figure out was this a sign or an indication, like I say, Ray Ray also had that struggle of, you know, trying to find himself and his identity, trying to find his own place independent of, you know, um, his dad, you know.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and going to the University of Miami to college, there was additional pressures and stress on him.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: So his coping mechanisms, you know, varied, you know, as he was trying to, you know, find a place, you know, with the team, and the team, some of them not feeling like he quote unquote belonged because they came from a different place, different neighborhood, different side of the tracks, you know, and feeling like, you know, he didn't have the same struggle or experience or the same level of commitment or passion, you know, and just not knowing his story.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: So there were different things that, you know, he found himself doing in places.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, so I wonder if if it was, you know, symptoms and signs of the CTE that early, or if it was just him just trying to find his place in the world.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: But when it became really evident, he articulated it.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: He would just outright say, you know, mom, something's not right with my head.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'm having headaches.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: And my mother was a critical care nurse.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: And so he would, you know, let us know that his he would have headaches that we couldn't get rid of with simple things like Tylenol or ibuprofen.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: He would sleep a lot.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: So um there were memory issues.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: He left everything everywhere.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: I just stopped giving him house keys because the whole neighborhood was gonna have keys to my house that they found a key and it was gonna belong to my house.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he just he couldn't keep a house key, couldn't keep a wallet, he couldn't keep a driver's license, he could not keep a cell phone, you know.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think that was one of the last things I did is I took him off my cell phone plan because every time I turned around, he was filing a claim for$200 to get a new cell phone because he was losing it.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: I said, this is not right.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, so I had to kind of trying to show a little bit of tough love, not really knowing, you know, what all was kind of going into it.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: But I was like, no, you go get your own plan and you pay your own bills.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_00: So when you start keep losing this phone, you understand, you know, what that means, you know.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: But my mom ended up putting him on hers.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: Of course she did.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: Your mom is a beautiful angel, by the way, man.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, thank you.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: We love her.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: She's a blessing.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, for our audience out there, let's talk about the peer pressure.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: Because a lot my son ended up playing football because his buddies said, Hey, you know, hey, Mac, why don't you come play with us, you know?
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: And and and he's like, All right, yeah, hey dad, can I play?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, Yeah, yeah, of course you can play, you know, but why do you want to play?
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, ah, it sounds like fun, right?
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: All my buddies are playing, right?
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: And parents, you know, they're, you know, hopefully after listening to us, are a lot more knowledgeable about the impact that these sports can have on their brains.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: But still, there's going to be enormous peer pressure on their children to play whatever.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, having watched your boys go through it, not only just from you know being from a different background, but also having, you know, like a father that everybody knows in the country, like everybody knows who this guy is, right?
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: There's a there's pressure there.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, you can and then of course there's the pressure to play for my team or whatever.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any recommendations for parents to, you know, kind of help their kids, you know, through these challenges and um, you know, to help them cope with this because it it is all over the place right now with these children.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: My biggest, I think, advice would be let them be kids.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there are enough things in this world that are going to make them grow up and mature faster than they need to.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um, it is a blessing if you have a child that acts their age.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, let them be the age that they are.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: Don't try to live vicariously through them, you know, putting them out there, pushing them into these forts and things, you know, before they're ready, because, you know, we are the ones that introduce these things to our children.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_00: They are a product of their environment, the things that we introduce them to, that we expose them to, that we inform them of.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, we have the power, you know, to influence certain things.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now, sure, there are some kids that they see things and they they kind of have their their their things that they're like, that they like, their hobbies, and but give them a chance to come express to you an interest sometimes.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: We're so quick to try to introduce them to everything.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: I am truly guilty of it.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'm like say they were playing sports basketball, you could play at three.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: So Rasan, my youngest son, he started playing basketball at three years old.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: Three years old.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: I have home three.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: I have home videos that we still watch where he was running down the court, dribbling, playing basketball at three.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so and what did he really know about basketball at three?
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, except for what we showed him, what we exposed him to, you know.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that would be my advice.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: There's time.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, for all of these families that feel like their children are the way out, they're gonna be the savior to their family, that that, you know, if they can just get this opportunity to play sports and they'll have a better life.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: If they do, you know, to a degree, but at what cost?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so you just want to do all the things that you're supposed to do.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: Take the preventative measures, wait till they're 14.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: Do you put them in a contact or collision sport?
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: If they get an injury, a concussion, make them sit out and heal.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: If you break an arm or a leg, you're not gonna throw your kid back out there with a broken arm or broken leg and tell them to keep playing.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: So if they have an injury to their brain, you gotta let it heal.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so just be smart, you know, be smart and don't be so anxious to grow them up, to live through them, and to make them pave the way for you.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, Tadiana, what you just said, a lot of parents need to kind of, you know, look at themselves and go, am I guilty of that?
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because we, you know, the the the you know, I you know my son wanted to play rugby because daddy played rugby.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: I showed him, I always said, look, you got to be active.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I always told my son one thing, you know, I said, Look, you're gonna be an adult forever.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: So don't grow up too fast, man.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: Be a boy.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: All right, you are gonna be an adult forever.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I meet so many parents that, I mean, our you know, we had very good friends, and and they just kept pushing their children.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: And my son wanted to be part of the car.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_01: Next thing you know, he wants to play all these sports.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, all right, but and I never even second, you know, if I would have understood part of what you and I now know, and what every parent should know about the risks of these sports, there is absolutely no way in uh on earth that my son would have been playing more than one of those crazy sports that he'd do because I would have known the risk.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: And your your you know, you know, your whole thing about, you know, uh we had a British guy come over from the Head Smart campaign, and he said, I have never met more crazy parents than American parents on what they do with their children.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: They're the pressure that they just put on them all by themselves to play sports.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: And and we're all, you know, we're all guilty of it to a certain extent, but there are those parents that will not listen, and they will even go further.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: We've had, you know, cops like I don't care what you say.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm uh my kids playing ball or whatever.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: And your point about, you know, your way out.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we deal with the manatee PAL here, and they deal with, you know, economically challenged parents.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, folks from all colors that can't get the bus ride to the white side, the the west side where the flag football costs 300 bucks a year or whatever.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: And when they made the move to go to flag football, the parents freaked out.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, what are you doing to my child?
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's you know, that's my you know, my ticket.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: My whatever's like, no, no.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: Your kid has a better chance of being a doctor or an architect or you know, or or you know, p engineer, whatever, than he does playing the NFL.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let's let's roll these odds and and get that out.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's one percent.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, one percent.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: And if you just think about in the state of Florida alone, all the colleges that we have, you know, at the Division I, Division II, you know, NAIA, you know, HBCUs, you know, all the universities we have just in this one state of Florida.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: And you think about, you know, how many rounds are in the draft.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: You got seven rounds in the draft, you got 33, you know, so or so teams, you know, you do the math about how many are going to get picked in that draft, you know, and we're just the one state of Florida.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: You talk about all the other universities, colleges and all the other states and you know, throughout the country, and it's just such a such a slim chance.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: Now, and I don't say that to kill anybody's dreams.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I don't say that to minimize, you know, people's struggles and realities.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what I'm just saying is that you just gotta, your children are priceless and no one ever thinks it's gonna happen to them.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: They listen to us, you know, Bruce, and they say, and they feel sorry for us, they empathize for us, you know, but they don't ever think it'll be them.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_01: No, and and and uh it, you know, it's just, you know, I you know, like you said, I mean, if you're I always tell people, look, if your son's gonna make it in the NFL or the NHL or any L out there, they're gonna be showing stuff in high school that nobody else can do.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_01: They're gonna have the genes or whatever, you know, and we talked to all these high school coaches, and they're like, man, I would hope they would start in high school because I get these kids with injuries, I get them with bad habits, I get them, you know, and they and and he's like, and they're like, well, I wish they would start in high school.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_01: And and so your point on 14, you know, being a a good age to begin is is is more than apropos when we start talking about, you know, parents and kids.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so my husband, Marcus Wimberley, he is a high school coach.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: Since you're bringing up high school coaches and his their perspectives, and Ray Ray's passing has also been mind-boggling, you know, and life-changing for him and how he coaches and how he runs his practices and how he responds to any potential, you know, concussions or injuries.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, his conversations with his trainers on his staff, on his staff, and with his position coaches, it has had an impact on how he coaches, and he's been a head football coach for over 20 years.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so, and that's what we have to have.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: We have to have these conversations with the people in the positions to do something differently, to, to change the way the game is played so it's played more safely.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: Because as you mentioned, I'm a foot more football family.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: I've got three sons with Ray Lewis.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm married to a head football coach who also played in the NFL.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: And so, as a football family, you know, we just want to play it safely.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: We don't want to eradicate it.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: We don't want to get rid of the sport.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: We just want to save lives so that other people don't have to know this reality, you know, 10, 20 years down the road because you thought it was cute and fun, just like I did, you know, and it never ever crossed my mind that I'd be burying my son 22 years later because of it.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: No, ma'am.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where, like you said, these hard conversations and thank you for your husband's response, you know, in terms of protecting these other children, because I mean, we we're just finding out that 80% of the damage that these kids are taking are in practice.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: And yet, all right, I mean, sports ain't uh is not just about W's wins and losses, right?
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's about sport.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: Sport shouldn't hurt.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, when we look at, you know, the CTE Brain Bank and all the sports that are up there, wrestlers, lacrosse players, rugby players, soccer players, football players, hockey players.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, and then you look at what's not there baseball players, basketball players, track stars, golfers, tennis players, swimmers, whatever other sports there are.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: It is so obvious that involving the head in sport is not healthy.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yet we nobody wants sports to go away.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I, you know, I they well, now we know that the NFL really doesn't do contact practice during the week, during the season.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, it would be great to see, you know, I mean, your husband's ability to reduce contact in sports.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: They had the same thing happen at my son's school.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: They went and got, you know, guarding casts, they they learned they brought in a rugby tackling coach, which is all great.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: But more importantly, they cut practice down to two days a week from five.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_01: That's you know, that's a 60% reduction in exposure.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, and uh and I think that, you know, we're you know, we're we're looking at a future where I think we're gonna understand this and be able to do a much better job at um at protecting our kids.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's those small yet very important things, those changes that can be made that can provide that additional level of safety protection, reduce that risk for our kids.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: The education piece is going to really continue to play a major role.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_00: So organizations, foundations like your, um, like mine, the events that we do, your international summit, the RL3 motivation weekend, getting people to come out and engage in those types of activities to get the education, to have a chance to ask questions.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's that's my thing.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: I just try to create a platform, a space, a safe space where people can come and ask questions.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_00: No question is dumb.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: Get an understanding, engage so that you can then take that information and make informed decisions on how you want to navigate your children and other loved ones that may be in your sphere of influence.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, hopefully people will continue to connect with, you know, both organizations, reach out, ask questions to get information, join us in our effort to try to save lives, you know, one at a time.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, you're and you're spot on because education is so important.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: So let's talk about that little bill that we got going on here in Florida.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, let's talk about that a little bit because it is all about education.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: So um, you want to talk a little bit about that, Bill?
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, Bruce, this is really all you.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I was just end up kind of being a conduit, you know, here in the 11th hour to try to help, you know, do what I could do from my my perspective.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, kudos to you, you know, for drafting the bill, for having the vision, you know, for the importance of having informed consent here in the state of Florida and the various elements that kind of come along with that, making sure that parents are informed, that they are educated, just like when they're, you know, registering their children to play, you know, and they have to sign paperwork for concussions or for sickle cell, you know, for heat-related illnesses, having this opportunity to have the informed consent about repetitive head impacts and the risks that they take, I think will make a difference.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: So you did a phenomenal job, you know, with it.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: I thank you for um allowing the RL3 Foundation to be a part of it.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: And shout out to Representative Kimberly Daniels for believing in our vision and for understanding because she had a son that played the NFL herself, who she, you know, feels, you know, she can kind of relate in some aspects to some of the symptoms and the concussions that he has experienced.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: So she's passionate about this as well.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: So appreciative and grateful for her to wanting to support and back this bill.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: And hopefully, as Florida has been doing great things in terms of trying to protect youth.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they have the HDM, the hypertrophic cardiomyopathy bill that they kind of put into place.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's called the Second Chance Act with uh who we play for.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_00: So that takes effect next year, July 1, I think, 2026, which will require students to get those EKGs so we can try to minimize this sudden death.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, of these players from unknown heart conditions that they have.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully they see the value and the importance in the brain health aspect as well, just like we're trying to protect their hearts, that they see the value in protecting their brains as well, and that we're able to make some progress and get this bill passed on both sides of Congress.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, and Tatiana, again, to the audience, it's all about, you know, knowing what we didn't know.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you're you're you know you're listening to two parents here that are, you know, going through the worst pain that you can imagine because of something that was preventable.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, and I I'll tell you, you know, uh I'm I'm I don't I'm sure you feel the same way, but my son would not play contact sports if I had another chat.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, I'd you know, maybe wait till high school if he really wanted to, but again, you know, not knowing what I know now and and what you know, that's the whole purpose of the bill is if you're gonna make a decision about your priceless treasure that you you know love with it more than anything in this world that you'll die for, you then you need to be informed.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that and that goes to another point, Tatiana, is you know, you know, what happened to us takes place thousands of times a year in this country.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And we meet so many parents that just can't keep going.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and for you to keep going, I don't know what drives you.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_01: I know what drives me is I'm gonna see that boy again.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I better put a smile on his face.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: I want to I want to make him proud.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you know, but you know, the fact that you're on your feet swinging like this is such a testimony to your strength.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: And it's so sorely needed because without parents that can tell this story, we don't have people that can learn.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: And um it's uh I want to thank you for your just your resolution, your commitment, you know, to to your son.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_01: But not only that, to the sport that that you are determined to make a sport just like I am, that you know, and and my myself that harmed our children, we're we're here to make it safer.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody's talking about football going away.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we all we all know what it means to so many people, but it can be done differently.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: And it can be done more safely, and it so needs passionate, powerful women like you out there.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I just want you to know that I recognize from the bottom of my heart your profound sense of love for your child, and I am so grateful that you're able to come on this show.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_01: And you are my partner.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_01: Your foundation, your coin that you gave me is my most treasured coin.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I have about 300 of darn things, but I love that coin.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: And um and you are gonna be part of everything we do.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: And uh and so, you know, as we you know, as we get ready to close, why don't you please promote your foundation, yourself, your son?
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_01: Well, how do people find you?
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_01: How do people uh get a hold of the foundation?
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us about that amazing weekend that you have every year.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: I was so like I was heartbroken.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: I missed it this year.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: But uh tell us, tell us all about yourself and Ray Ray III.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you for those kind words, uh, Bruce.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: I just have to give all honor and glory to God.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: He gives me the portion of strength that I need to get through each day because it's definitely not my own strength that carries me.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: It is the love for my child that I lost and the love for my other children that are still here that push and motivate me to try to help others to not know this fate.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_00: So they have the opportunity to reach out to the RL3 Foundation, and that's the RL the number three foundation.com to find out more information about what it is that we do.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: But essentially, we are supporting to provide um safer youth sports education regarding CTE and his mental health um related issues, you know, related to CTE.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_00: We do an annual event called Motivation Weekend.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: It is the first weekend in June every year.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_00: So we are going into year three for 2026.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: So we are continuing to grow the event each year, but it includes the CTE ball.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: We've done brunch, but it's it's turned into a sneaker ball.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: That seems to have been the most popular event.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: People come out in their dresses, their suits with their sneakers, their favorite, you know, sneakers on, and they are engaged in a great meal, but with great speakers, great doctors, families like ours who are able to tell stories based off of their experiences.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_00: They have an opportunity to ask questions and to engage with the speakers.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_00: So that is a great informative awareness event on CTE that we open with on Friday evening of the event.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: On Saturday, we do have football-related events, but they are non-contact.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: We have elementary, middle school age kids.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's a football camp where they learn agility and speed and work and you know, hand-eye coordination, things that they can do that don't require contact in terms of helping to develop those skills until they are 14 and of age or old enough to try to play contact.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_00: And then we also have our seven-on-seven tournament, which is for the high school's team football teams.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_00: And we provide uh CTE prevention grants to those high school programs, as you mentioned.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: My husband is a high school football coach, and a lot of these programs are underfunded.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so, because they're underfunded, they don't have necessary supplies and equipment that they need.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: Some of these schools are sharing helmets.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: Helmets are supposed to be reconditioned every year.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: There should be guardian caps that they can get, you know, for those types of things during practice.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_00: So we provide that CTE prevention grant to both the winner and the runner-up of the seven-on-seven tournament so that they can use for those CTE eligible related purchases to help, you know, improve their football programs.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: So that's Saturday, all the football stuff.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then on Sunday, we closed with a music festival because as I mentioned, Ray Ray loved music, he loved football, and he loved kids.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: And music was his therapy.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when he couldn't always deal with the symptoms he was experiencing, the memory loss, the confusion, that some of the erratic behaviors and what have you.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: Music was his way out.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_00: He could get a pad, he would write lyrics, he would perform.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so that was his therapy.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_00: So we used the music festival to bring everybody together as Ray Ray did in life from every walk of life.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's all different genres of music.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's gospel, it's country, it's RB, it's hip hop, and there are bounce houses for the kids.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's food trucks, um, there are different games that can be played.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so we come out and we celebrate life.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_00: We celebrate what Ray Ray represented.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_00: We provide education information with the vendors.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_00: We provide free Narcan.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: We have Narcan distribution out there.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: We have the fire departments, we partner with the police departments, we have different health organizations out there sharing information about mental health and saving, you know, trying to save our children and our young people through music.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: So um it's a great time.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: So people can get information on the website.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we are in that phase now of soliciting sponsors for next year's event.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: So, anyone interested in getting involved, if you're related in that mental health space and you want to provide exposure to your to your products or service, then we are open to those um those calls right now as well.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: So hopefully we will continue, Bruce, you and I doing the things that we do.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know that you have a partner in me for life.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: However, um, I can support, you just you just need only call, you just need only ask.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_00: We will continue to lift each other through this this this unfortunate bond that we have been brought together with, but we will continue to make both Mac and Ray Ray proud.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_01: Ma'am, thank you so much.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_01: And we will.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_01: And we are joined at the hip and we will keep moving.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_01: I would love, we just came up with an idea of creating a brain-safe protocol for contact sports.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: Would love to sit down with your husband to see what his interpretation that might be, you know, and it's all about as long as we can reduce pro you know contact and not allow kids and tell kids don't play back-to-back concussive sports.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: Do what Ray actually told your kids to do, right?
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: Play that track, go play that basketball, right?
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_01: We can, oh gosh, if we could change the way we continue brain health, we could change so much in this country.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_01: And uh and um, yeah, I mean, hats off to you and the foundation.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: We will do everything and anything.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna be a big part of your event next week.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: I've been talking to Sue right now.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_01: And again, don't forget, we got don't forget we got Baltimore Raven Stadia up December 13th.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_01: RL3's got its own booth up there.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_01: If you want to come up, you know, we'd love to wonderful.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: And make sure I get that information because, you know, because I we mentioned my day job is with North of Grumman, and we do a lot with veterans.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: We have a lot of veterans that work there.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_00: We have a veterans employee resource group called Veritas that I have to share information with.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I will make sure that I share all of that with all of them as well.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: And they do feature different organizations.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I make sure that I'm continuing to put the Mac Parkman Foundation at the forefront there because I work with a whole lot of veterans at North of Bremen.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_01: I bet you do.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we'll get to them.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for thinking of us.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: And uh can't we can't wait to start pounding the doors in Tallahassee with you.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if they're ready.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_01: I know one door in particular that I think we both need to knock on, but we're on it, man.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_01: I can't, yeah.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_01: We're spreading the word here.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_01: And uh thank you so much, man.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_01: Teddyana, anything we can do, please let us know.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_01: God bless you.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: God bless your family and your mission.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_01: And uh we will talk.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for all that you do, Bruce.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_01: All right, thank you, ma'am.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: Folks, another great episode and a very powerful one.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Probably to date my most favorite of this uh podcast, unfortunately.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, please reach out to the RL3 Foundation.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_01: And for all of you out there, you're talking to two parents that will answer cell phones.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: If you've got a question about your kids, or maybe your husband or wife is a little bit too crazy about these contact sports.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_01: I've got a free book on my website.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: Tadiana's got all kinds of information.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_01: Reach out to our foundations and we'll help fill your magazines for that fight because that is the fight of your life right now to protect your children.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: So please reach out to us.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_01: Don't forget about our app on the uh app and the HeadSafe app, uh, Head Smart app on the uh Google and Apple store.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_01: Uh the the the uh Army Gaming Games coming up December 13th.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: 100% of the money's raised goes towards veterans' mental health and suicide prevention programs.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: We have fuel.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we might have an ACDC cover band coming up if they get their act together.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know how those con those bands are.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: And it's all you can eat, all you can drink, great network.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: A bunch of awesome foundations like RL3 will be there.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_01: We look forward to coming to you.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: So like us, subscribe us, push us out there, support our foundations.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_01: And remember, your kids only have one melon.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: Take care of that puppy, all right?
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_01: All right, God bless you all.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you next time on Broken Brains with Bruce Parker.