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I'm Feeling Love Bombed & When Flirting Turns into an Emotional Affair · Therapy Thursday with Ellen K

0:00
Speaker 1: It's a therapy Thursday. Anything on your mind troubling you,
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Speaker 1: Let's tackle your troubles. I'm Ellen kay Hi, I'm Ryan Mano,
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Speaker 1: and I'm Sarah Dash three friends who have come together
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Speaker 1: for you. And it's all about, you know, finding out
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Speaker 1: what's on your mind, what's bothering you. We have our
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Speaker 1: licensed therapist Sarah here, and then somehow we'll come to
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Speaker 1: some kind of I don't know help, right, that's how
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Speaker 1: it works.
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Speaker 2: All right.
0:26
Speaker 1: We got a letter from Francis, and Francis just moved
0:29
Speaker 1: here for her outdoor advertising job. She found her new people,
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Speaker 1: Like you know, when you move to a new place,
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Speaker 1: you need You need your hair person, you need your facialist,
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Speaker 1: you need all your people. Sure, she found a dentist
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Speaker 1: and he's pretty incredible. They started dating too. The dentist
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Speaker 1: is Eddie, So Eddie has three grown daughters who adore him.
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Speaker 1: He's on friendly terms with his ex for a decade now,
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Speaker 1: all right, and she's feeling love bombed. Okay, thank he's
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Speaker 1: too much, too soon, and he's sending her a lot
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Speaker 1: of texts when she wakes up in the morning, flowers
1:04
Speaker 1: every day, and she's just feeling like it's way too much, said,
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Speaker 1: Is this love bombing or is this just what it
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Speaker 1: looks like when a decisive man knows what he wants
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Speaker 1: love Francis, there's more too.
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Speaker 3: I mean, the trap already wants to take her to Alaska,
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Speaker 3: he said, I'm willing to block off a week of patients.
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Speaker 3: I want to take you to Passel Robles for you know,
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Speaker 3: wine tasting, you know, surprise lunch drops. I don't know
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Speaker 3: if you said that already, Ellen, but I mean there's.
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Speaker 1: A lot, Yeah, there's a lot. But she used the
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Speaker 1: words love bombed.
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Speaker 4: Okay, I think that love bomb is a little overused,
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Speaker 4: and I don't know that it's used in the way
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Speaker 4: that it technically is indicative of something unhealthy. I mean,
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Speaker 4: this could just be enthusiasm. He could be decisive. It
1:54
Speaker 4: sounds like, you know, he has a wonderful relationship with
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Speaker 4: his ex and that boats really, really well. I am
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Speaker 4: hearing that there's some overwhelm, and that usually means that
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Speaker 4: there's like a pacing mismatch.
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Speaker 1: Okay, but what about this is Francis just being a
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Speaker 1: spoiled brat. A lot of women would die for someone
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Speaker 1: to be this attentive and into you, right right, and
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Speaker 1: but yet she's feeling like, I hear what you're saying, Sarah.
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Speaker 1: If it's not right for both people, then it's not right.
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Speaker 4: Correct. She mentions that in the past she's dealt with,
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Speaker 4: you know, men who are largely emotionally unavailable. They were
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Speaker 4: ambiguous about their intentions. So now she's with somebody who
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Speaker 4: is pursuing her. They're decisive, and I think that that
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Speaker 4: may be part of the overwhelm.
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Speaker 1: I would love a decisive man.
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Speaker 4: Yeah, when we hear about love bombing, there are a
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Speaker 4: couple of integral pieces to that, and some of them
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Speaker 4: would be pushing her toward isolation. And I always like
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Speaker 4: to ask somebody if they feel like they're being integrated
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Speaker 4: into somebody's life and at the same time the person
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Speaker 4: is enthusiastic about their life, their friends, their family. With
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Speaker 4: love bombing, a lot of times you'll see that isolation.
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Speaker 4: And the thing about love bombing is it's always temporary,
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Speaker 4: So you don't talk to somebody in tenures into a relationship.
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Speaker 4: They're feeling overwhelmed, right right, with spousal affection and devotion.
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Speaker 1: Right right.
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Speaker 3: I think even Sarah like this. Honestly, I'm holding my
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Speaker 3: tongue here. But this letter drives me absolutely crazy.
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Speaker 5: It drives me nuts.
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Speaker 4: Tell me what drives you crazy about?
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Speaker 5: Because this is this. I love to love.
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Speaker 3: I love to show love in various ways, and I
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Speaker 3: love to make that person understand, like, just feel like
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Speaker 3: they're they're the center of my universe.
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Speaker 4: That's right, that's beautiful.
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Speaker 3: And so for her to complain about these things, I
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Speaker 3: know so many single women who would love to have
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Speaker 3: even like Ellen said, just a fraction of what she's
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Speaker 3: written about here. So it drives me crazy that she's complaining.
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Speaker 3: I I just feel like men can't win, right, I
4:17
Speaker 3: feel like men can't win, and that's what's bothering me.
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Speaker 4: Well, this dentist, I'm just calling the dentists, Okay. May
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Speaker 4: not be able to win with Francis is a problem.
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Speaker 4: It doesn't mean that his gestures, his enthusiasm for the
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Speaker 4: relationship wouldn't be welcomed and cherished by somebody else. So
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Speaker 4: she just may not be the right person for him.
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Speaker 4: If she finds herself feeling overwhelmed and uncomfortable when she
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Speaker 4: gets something that it sounds like she was complaining about
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Speaker 4: not having prior, then that's something for her to look at.
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Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, it's been nine months too.
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Speaker 5: That's another thing that drives me crazy. It's been nine months.
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Speaker 3: It's not like this is a two week thing, right,
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Speaker 3: If there were two weeks, I could go, Okay, maybe
5:01
Speaker 3: that's a little weird.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, nine months? Nine months? Well, I mean she
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Speaker 1: moved here nine months ago, she met him pretty soon on,
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Speaker 1: and then he came on strung right away.
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Speaker 5: Okay, let's even say six months.
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Speaker 1: Okay, but if someone is doesn't even know you as
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Speaker 1: a person and they're already that into you, that is
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Speaker 1: I think that is something to Sorry, Ryan, I just
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Speaker 1: think that Francis is right to feel a little repelled.
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Speaker 1: It's like if you're with someone they know you don't
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Speaker 1: eat meat, and they say would you like a ham sandwich?
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Speaker 1: It's like, well, you just don't even know me at all.
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Speaker 4: What I heard is that she did try to she
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Speaker 4: did try to establish like a soft boundary by saying,
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Speaker 4: you know, this is moving a little fast, and he
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Speaker 4: started talking about summer plans. My take on that is
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Speaker 4: that he's trying so hard to please. He's taking her
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Speaker 4: very literally, is being like, okay, a trip next month
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Speaker 4: is too soon, Okay, so maybe we can go on
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Speaker 4: a trip this summer. So I think he's really like
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Speaker 4: trying to please, trying to adhere to her boundaries, and
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Speaker 4: this is really going to come down to communication. And
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Speaker 4: one of the things about love bombing that I think
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Speaker 4: is critical that I didn't mention before, is you look
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Speaker 4: at how somebody reacts when you impose a boundary. Do
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Speaker 4: they become angry? Do they sulk? Or do they try
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Speaker 4: to match your pacing?
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Speaker 1: Okay, so if any of those, if they become angry,
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Speaker 1: you know you're being love bombed because it's not working.
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Speaker 4: It's telling you some pretty, it's giving you some pretty
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Speaker 4: important to Adam.
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Speaker 3: But why would you push this guy away, a successful
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Speaker 3: fit dentist who wants to love you and take care
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Speaker 3: of you.
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Speaker 5: Why would you push him away?
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Speaker 1: Because, as Sarah was saying, he's not right for her.
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Speaker 4: And at some point he has to ask himself why
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Speaker 4: he's pursuing a woman who doesn't share his level of interest.
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Speaker 1: That's the psycho part. Yes, I didn't know it's psychotic
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Speaker 1: on him. No, No, it is the definition, and correct
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Speaker 1: me if I'm wrong, Sarah. Insanity is doing the same
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Speaker 1: thing over and over and over again and getting the
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Speaker 1: same revolt result when you expect another. Right, that is insanity.
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Speaker 1: So he's trying to push push, push, push, and she
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Speaker 1: just keeps on pulling away.
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Speaker 5: Okay, then why is she in so many failed relationships?
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Speaker 6: Right?
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Speaker 1: Well, she did say she's in a lot of failed relationships.
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Speaker 1: She says she's had a few. Okay, let's go to Laura. Laura,
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Speaker 1: you're hot about it.
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Speaker 6: This is insane. How can she even think this guy
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Speaker 6: is good with his children, friendly and amicable relationship with
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Speaker 6: his ex. She doesn't know what she wants. I mean,
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Speaker 6: I'm been single for five years and I could only
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Speaker 6: wish that this could happen. You know, the guy's being nice.
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Speaker 6: Maybe on his side, he found somebody that he really
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Speaker 6: really likes or likes it, possibly sees the future in
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Speaker 6: and he's showing it. That's all he's doing. He's not
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Speaker 6: doing anything. Creepy would be him showing up at the
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Speaker 6: door all of a sudden or at work surprise lunches.
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Speaker 6: Oh my god, poor baby boohoo.
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Speaker 1: You know what, I wish that we just didn't have
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Speaker 1: to overthink everything all the time. I think people think
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Speaker 1: before they feel sometimes.
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Speaker 6: Okay, I gotta tell you something. Ryan is one hundred percent.
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Speaker 6: Men can't win for losing. If you show up at
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Speaker 6: the door, you're a creep. If you don't buy flowers,
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Speaker 6: you're a jerk. What do you do? What do we want?
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Speaker 7: What do we want?
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Speaker 1: What do we want?
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Speaker 4: We want someone who sees us. We want to feel
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Speaker 4: chosen but not claimed.
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Speaker 1: Oh, chose but not.
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Speaker 3: God.
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Speaker 1: That is incredible. Okay, Saradish, chosen not claimed. Dana wants
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Speaker 1: to talk Dana, thank you for calling into therapy Thursday.
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Speaker 1: How do you feel about this?
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Speaker 8: I'm not a big fan of love bombing, allan. There's
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Speaker 8: a big difference between attention, positive attention, and love bombing
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Speaker 8: that borders on obsession for me. Okay, so I might
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Speaker 8: have to check out. I'm not super into the love
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Speaker 8: bombing thing.
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Speaker 1: And you think this is definitely love bombing, surprise lunches,
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Speaker 1: flowers daily, text before you wake up saying good morning.
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Speaker 8: Definitely, he's way too consumed by the thought of her.
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Speaker 8: It seems that he's got like nothing else going on,
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Speaker 8: and that makes me extremely uncomfortable. Definitely.
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Speaker 1: Okay. Have you ever been loved bombed?
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Speaker 8: I have been love bombed, and if I'm gonna be
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Speaker 8: honest with you, it was the demise of our relationship.
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Speaker 8: It was a total turnoff for me.
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Speaker 5: Okay, how do you prefer to be loved?
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Speaker 3: Would you rather the guy not say good morning or
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Speaker 3: you know, just show like what makes you happy?
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Speaker 8: I super loved the good morning. Like I said, the
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Speaker 8: positive attention is amazing, but the constant twenty four to
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Speaker 8: seven is alarming. I love the good morning, I love flowers.
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Speaker 8: I'm not so much super into like multiple surprise visits
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Speaker 8: or anything like that.
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Speaker 5: Going to travel it just right.
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Speaker 1: Ryan is very upset by this.
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Speaker 5: I mean, so far, this this guy sounds perfect for you.
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Speaker 5: I don't know. I'm just I don't know.
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Speaker 1: Your face has been read all day.
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Speaker 5: Love you a.
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Speaker 1: Lot, we love you every day.
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Speaker 8: Yeah, yeah, there's a fine line, but it sounds like
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Speaker 8: this guy's just totally overdoing it at please love us back. Yeah,
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Speaker 8: I do love you guys very much.
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Speaker 1: Oh, thank you for coming on therapy Thursday. Ryan. I'm
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Speaker 1: so sorry.
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Speaker 3: It's fine, But Sarah, you made a great point when
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Speaker 3: we came on this this episode started. Your point at
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Speaker 3: the very beginning was so good. You said love bombing
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Speaker 3: is overused or used in the wrong context. Right, and
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Speaker 3: if and as I look at this letter, she goes,
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Speaker 3: is this love bombing? What if we cross out the
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Speaker 3: word bombing?
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Speaker 5: Is this love? It may be? I don't hear the
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Speaker 5: word bombing.
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Speaker 4: I don't hear anything pathological in this. I here an
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Speaker 4: enthusiastic man who maybe has a mismatch. I can't say
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Speaker 4: that word has a mismatch with somebody who's not on
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Speaker 4: the same page with him.
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Speaker 1: Okay, so this is doomed.
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Speaker 4: It's not necessarily doomed if she can address what her
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Speaker 4: overwhelm is really about. Once she gets the clarity whether
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Speaker 4: this is and it could be love bombing, I shouldn't
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Speaker 4: say it's certainly not. But once she can determine whether
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Speaker 4: the relationship has longevity and validity for her, then they'll
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Speaker 4: both know how to go forward. And that's also a
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Speaker 4: decision that he'll need to make to.
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Speaker 3: But why would he want to make that decision for
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Speaker 3: someone that's that's not even recognizing how grateful, how good,
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Speaker 3: how lucky are we, and how lucky are we.
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Speaker 1: Let's get to Steve. We have a lot of women
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Speaker 1: calling Steve. You're a man. What are your thoughts?
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Speaker 2: From my perspective, I think it's something that's wrong with
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Speaker 2: that's something that she's mirroring that she's afraid, okay, that
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Speaker 2: she's not enough.
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Speaker 1: Oh, Eddie is so good, She's not good enough for Eddie?
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Speaker 2: Correct? And then she's she's doubting herself, but she's putting
12:01
Speaker 2: it up though this guy's too much. But then she's
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Speaker 2: thinking she's too little.
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Speaker 1: Got it? Wow, that's a really good insightful view.
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Speaker 2: Thank you, got a problem. You guys, have a great day.
12:12
Speaker 2: I always enjoyed this with you, guys.
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Speaker 1: Have you ever heard of that Sarah like, maybe she's
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Speaker 1: not enough for him?
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Speaker 4: What I hear in her letter is that she's somebody
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Speaker 4: who's used to a scarcity mentality and now she's in
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Speaker 4: an abundance situation with man. And it feels very just.
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Speaker 1: Regulating, Okay, justsregulating. I've learned so many words from you.
12:38
Speaker 1: Carrie left us this talk back.
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Speaker 9: She's going to be the same person in two months
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Speaker 9: that calls and says she can't find anybody, and why
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Speaker 9: is there nobody out here? And she can't date anybody.
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Speaker 9: It sounds like she's already done with the relationship, so
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Speaker 9: she she'll walk away and let him find somebody else.
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Speaker 1: Okay, Hm, that's fair to say. Do you think so, Sarah, It's.
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Speaker 4: Really possible if he feels unappreciated, if he takes this
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Speaker 4: as a type of rejection, then he likely will move
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Speaker 4: on to somebody else, And maybe there's somebody else that
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Speaker 4: he's better suited for.
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Speaker 1: And I don't feel that Francis is going to think
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Speaker 1: he's the one who got away.
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Speaker 5: You don't know.
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Speaker 1: I don't. He's not right for her, so why would
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Speaker 1: he be the one who got away if she was
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Speaker 1: in love with him. There's nothing in here about how
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Speaker 1: he makes her feel good. It's all this is too much,
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Speaker 1: and that's too much. And Ryan, I understand where you're
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Speaker 1: coming from, because you think she's a spoiler.
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Speaker 3: She literally writes he's friendly with his ex with which
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Speaker 3: I think is mature and healthy. On paper, he seems
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Speaker 3: emotionally evolved, stable Ready, I mean, she's listing off these
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Speaker 3: traits that take him off paper. She's gonna wish and
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Speaker 3: see that these were real traits and she's going to
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Speaker 3: miss them.
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Speaker 5: He will be the one.
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Speaker 1: That she's not attracted to him.
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Speaker 4: That's exactly what I was about to say. Maybe there's
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Speaker 4: a lack of attraction.
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Speaker 1: Yes, she feels toward her, She's not attracted to him.
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Speaker 1: And if you like someone, you like everything they do.
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Speaker 1: If you don't like a person or you're I'm not
14:00
Speaker 1: sparking with that person, then there's nothing there.
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Speaker 4: No. I think that's a really really good point. I
14:04
Speaker 4: was thinking the exact same thing as you were saying it.
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Speaker 4: Maybe there's just not the chemistry.
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Speaker 1: Right, I think you need to go with Eddie.
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Speaker 5: Dude, take me to Dude.
14:13
Speaker 3: I got nothing going on this summer, we're traveling.
14:20
Speaker 1: It is therapy Thursday. Thank you for joining us, so
14:23
Speaker 1: we always love having you come on in. We've got
14:25
Speaker 1: our licensed therapist here, it's Sarah ash Hello. Hey Sarah,
14:29
Speaker 1: I'm Ellen Kay. I'm Ryan Mano, and we meet every
14:32
Speaker 1: Thursday to you know, talk about your problems, what's troubling you.
14:35
Speaker 1: And that's why we have a licensed therapist because Ryan,
14:38
Speaker 1: you and I we don't we don't have the professional slant.
14:43
Speaker 1: And we're joined today by Angel.
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Speaker 7: Angel.
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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming on to therapy Thursday.
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Speaker 1: What is happening with you?
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Speaker 7: Thanks for having me here. So I've been married for
14:58
Speaker 7: eight years and I love my wife. We have two
15:01
Speaker 7: beautiful kids. We built a whole, great, awesome life together
15:06
Speaker 7: and I would never blow that up. But something is
15:09
Speaker 7: happening at work, and I don't know if I'm crossing
15:12
Speaker 7: a line or just enjoying harmless attention.
15:18
Speaker 1: What's the harmless attention?
15:22
Speaker 7: Stephanie.
15:24
Speaker 1: Oh, it's a girl.
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Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, she's married to And at first it was
15:32
Speaker 7: just joking around in meetings. Then it became inside jokes, compliments,
15:37
Speaker 7: and then she starts saying things to me like if
15:40
Speaker 7: I met you first, then like giggle. She touches my
15:45
Speaker 7: arm when she talks, and she says she says they
15:48
Speaker 7: smell good too, which is, you know, awesome. I'd be
15:54
Speaker 7: lying if I if I said I don't know how
15:58
Speaker 7: love feels. I mean at home, my wife and I
16:05
Speaker 7: are like teammates. At works, definitely, it just feels I
16:10
Speaker 7: feel noticed, interesting and attractive, you know what I'm saying.
16:15
Speaker 7: And I'm not proud of it. And so we've been
16:18
Speaker 7: starting to text outside of work, looking crazy, just you know, memes, jokes,
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Speaker 7: playing about our spouse and sometimes and you know, can't
16:25
Speaker 7: wait to see you tomorrow. And we just scheduled a
16:28
Speaker 7: lunch with just the two of us. We told the
16:31
Speaker 7: office's about a project. I mean, it is kind of
16:34
Speaker 7: but you know.
16:36
Speaker 4: Okay, wait, hang on, So Angel, Okay, this isn't flirting.
16:41
Speaker 4: This is an emotional affair.
16:43
Speaker 5: Oh okay, do you would you even call it flirting? Angel?
16:47
Speaker 1: Like?
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Speaker 5: How where? What do you define this as right now?
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Speaker 7: I mean, I don't know if it's like out that
16:55
Speaker 7: that's strong words like emotional affair just the war affair
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Speaker 7: in it.
16:59
Speaker 1: You don't like that, you don't like that, But Angel,
17:01
Speaker 1: but you're keeping it from your wife. So I believe
17:05
Speaker 1: that anything that you can do in front of your
17:07
Speaker 1: partner is the right thing to do. And if you're
17:10
Speaker 1: hiding it, then you're then you're the secrecy right, Sarah,
17:13
Speaker 1: I don't know.
17:14
Speaker 4: Is this so that's generally the litmus test in terms
17:17
Speaker 4: of boundaries. If your partner would be uncomfortable with it,
17:21
Speaker 4: you're crossing a boundary.
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Speaker 1: M So, but Angel, you don't like to be told
17:27
Speaker 1: that this is an emotional affair.
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Speaker 7: I mean, I don't know. I don't know how I'm
17:32
Speaker 7: feeling right now, you know, so this is very like
17:37
Speaker 7: complicated for me, you know, like I don't want to
17:39
Speaker 7: like tell my wife because I don't want her to
17:42
Speaker 7: think things like that and jump to that sort of conclusion.
17:46
Speaker 7: Because but you're already there.
17:48
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm hearing that you're jumping to that conclusion and
17:51
Speaker 4: that this woman likely is too. I mean, I hear
17:55
Speaker 4: these as overtours, not harmless compliments. When somebody's saying that
18:01
Speaker 4: they prefer you to their spouse, that's a pretty significant statement,
18:06
Speaker 4: even if it's said in jest.
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Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, that is a big one. I mean, yeah, yeah, would.
18:11
Speaker 3: You want to know if she was having the same
18:15
Speaker 3: sort of feeling for somebody else in this kind of
18:18
Speaker 3: you know, flitter in her heart?
18:22
Speaker 7: I mean, obviously, but also like you know, I don't
18:25
Speaker 7: know how to feel right now, I'm not in that situa.
18:29
Speaker 7: I mean it is different, you know, like I'm not
18:32
Speaker 7: my wife, so I don't.
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Speaker 5: Know how is it different?
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Speaker 3: No, I just answer the question, would you would it
18:36
Speaker 3: feel good to you to know that she was doing
18:37
Speaker 3: this with someone at work?
18:40
Speaker 7: But I don't know what.
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Speaker 1: I'm not doing anything but Angel, But Angel, you are
18:45
Speaker 1: you're going to have lunch alone with this person? What
18:48
Speaker 1: do you hope? Like do you want to kiss her?
18:53
Speaker 7: I mean like, I mean, these are feelings, but these
18:56
Speaker 7: are not things I'm going to act on. And also, like,
18:58
Speaker 7: what's wrong with having lunch with someone like you know,
19:02
Speaker 7: you like or you close to.
19:04
Speaker 1: But Sarah, isn't that what people who are having emotional
19:06
Speaker 1: affairs do to reason it away?
19:08
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's absolutely a slippery slope. And Angel, I would
19:11
Speaker 4: be really curious as to how you feel when you're
19:15
Speaker 4: around Stephanie. A lot of times when we find ourselves
19:18
Speaker 4: in these situations, it can be less about the person
19:21
Speaker 4: and more about who we are when we're with the person.
19:23
Speaker 4: How do we feel about ourselves?
19:25
Speaker 7: Yes? I mean, like I said, I feel noticed, and
19:29
Speaker 7: you know, I feel like I feel like I'm I
19:31
Speaker 7: feel like she listens to me and she like really
19:33
Speaker 7: digs me, you know. And well, then.
19:35
Speaker 4: That's telling me some things that are maybe missing in
19:39
Speaker 4: your marriage at this time, and that's where the focus
19:42
Speaker 4: needs to be. That's what the priority is. If you're
19:45
Speaker 4: if certain things aren't being fulfilled for you within the marriage,
19:49
Speaker 4: then it's time to take a look at how that
19:52
Speaker 4: can start working for you at home, not with a colleague.
19:57
Speaker 1: Angel, No, Angel, do.
20:01
Speaker 5: You do you feel like you're cheating?
20:05
Speaker 7: No? No, I'm not cheating. Okay, That's why I'm here
20:08
Speaker 7: talking to you guys and asking for your help, Like
20:11
Speaker 7: I'm not.
20:12
Speaker 5: So is flirting.
20:13
Speaker 1: Flirting is not cheating in your eyes, or emotional affairs
20:16
Speaker 1: aren't real affairs.
20:18
Speaker 7: I think what you're saying, saying emotional affairs is just
20:21
Speaker 7: strong right now. And I mean this is like I
20:26
Speaker 7: don't know what to say. This is like, uh, it's it's,
20:30
Speaker 7: it's it's it's, it's it's it's like it's a it's
20:33
Speaker 7: a crush, you know.
20:34
Speaker 5: Okay, then why are you going to lunch with her?
20:36
Speaker 3: Why are you putting her It's almost like putting the
20:37
Speaker 3: bullet in the gun right, don't do it right, don't
20:40
Speaker 3: do it, don't spend time with her, don't seek the attention.
20:42
Speaker 3: And and sir, sorry, I'm sorry, you're the therapist.
20:45
Speaker 4: Angel. Attraction, it does happen, But nurturing that attraction, that's
20:50
Speaker 4: a choice. And that's what I hear that you're starting
20:54
Speaker 4: to do with the memes, the jokes and now the
20:57
Speaker 4: lunch that you're not comfortable sharing not only with your person,
21:02
Speaker 4: your partner, but you're not sharing it with your coworkers.
21:06
Speaker 1: Do you guys have nicknames for each other? Angel? Like
21:08
Speaker 1: are you you know? Angel? And Steph?
21:14
Speaker 7: I mean I don't know. I mean like that everyone
21:16
Speaker 7: has a nickname in the office.
21:17
Speaker 4: So so okay, all right, Angel, you're nurturing this attraction,
21:23
Speaker 4: and I'm concerned about what this is going to look
21:26
Speaker 4: like a month from now if you continue down this path.
21:29
Speaker 1: Does your wife ignore you?
21:34
Speaker 7: No? I mean it's just different because you're working with
21:37
Speaker 7: somebody like and you around them all the time, you
21:39
Speaker 7: know what I'm saying.
21:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just thought it was interesting that you said
21:42
Speaker 1: to you know, your wife feels like your teammate or
21:44
Speaker 1: your roommate, right right.
21:45
Speaker 3: So taking what Ellen just asked you, Okay, when it's
21:48
Speaker 3: the last time your wife excited you, I.
21:52
Speaker 7: Mean she always excites me. You know what do you
21:54
Speaker 7: mean by that?
21:54
Speaker 6: No?
21:55
Speaker 3: No, No, I mean you tell me what's the last
21:56
Speaker 3: thing she did for you that made you feel special
22:00
Speaker 3: scene loved?
22:03
Speaker 7: Like when she makes food for me, like every day.
22:05
Speaker 7: You know what I'm saying.
22:06
Speaker 4: What you're talking about, Angel, do you feel like there
22:09
Speaker 4: is an erotic dimension that is no longer a part
22:12
Speaker 4: of your marriage?
22:16
Speaker 7: I mean, I mean again, when you've been married for
22:18
Speaker 7: a minute, it's for a long time.
22:21
Speaker 1: Like do you think of Stephanie when you're making love
22:24
Speaker 1: to your wife?
22:27
Speaker 7: I mean, I mean, what do you mean by that?
22:29
Speaker 5: What do you mean what do we mean?
22:31
Speaker 3: It's a pretty straight question. Have you thought of this
22:34
Speaker 3: woman while whilst with your wife?
22:36
Speaker 6: Yes? Or no?
22:38
Speaker 7: Well?
22:38
Speaker 1: No, okay, okay, okay, all right.
22:41
Speaker 7: I mean I'm kind of offended by that.
22:43
Speaker 1: I'm sorry you want to offend you. You know, we
22:45
Speaker 1: just want to help you.
22:49
Speaker 7: I mean, I don't know. I mean, I don't know.
22:51
Speaker 7: I mean I'm feeling like I'm like I'm being the
22:53
Speaker 7: bad guy here, but like I work with her like
22:55
Speaker 7: this every day. You know, when people say they have
22:57
Speaker 7: a work husband or a work wife, the emotionally cheating.
23:02
Speaker 4: I mean, I think you're saying something different. You're talking
23:04
Speaker 4: about an attraction. You're talking about spending time with her
23:07
Speaker 4: outside of work. She's telling you that she prefers you
23:11
Speaker 4: to her husband. This is more than just when people
23:14
Speaker 4: you know are playing and they say a work husband
23:17
Speaker 4: or work wife. That's usually an indication of literally how
23:20
Speaker 4: much time they spend with the person. It's not indicative
23:22
Speaker 4: of how they feel about the person that they're spending
23:25
Speaker 4: time with at work.
23:28
Speaker 7: I don't know. I mean, like, you know, look like
23:33
Speaker 7: I'm not trying to hurt anybody here, you know what
23:35
Speaker 7: I'm saying, Like it's not to me. It's just like
23:36
Speaker 7: you're just having lunch. I'm just saying, like this looks bad.
23:39
Speaker 7: But does this look bad to you guys? Maybe?
23:41
Speaker 4: Maybe?
23:41
Speaker 1: Well you asked us, I mean you wrote to us
23:44
Speaker 1: and you contacted us and said, you know, is flirting cheating?
23:48
Speaker 1: And in this case, I think, Sarah, you're saying that
23:50
Speaker 1: this seems like more than flirting.
23:52
Speaker 4: It sounds flirting sounds.
23:54
Speaker 1: Much more than flirting.
23:55
Speaker 4: Correct. Flirting is looking forward to the FedEx delivery person
24:00
Speaker 4: then and them telling you that you're their favorite. You know,
24:03
Speaker 4: they get excited when they see you on the rape.
24:05
Speaker 4: That's flirting. Flirting is your ninety year old year old
24:08
Speaker 4: neighbor saying, oh if i'd only met you seventy years before,
24:11
Speaker 4: that's harmless flirting. That can be a steam building. Sure,
24:15
Speaker 4: this is a lot more than that. Yeah, it's the
24:18
Speaker 4: hidden stuff that does it for me.
24:20
Speaker 1: Angel I mean, I don't know.
24:24
Speaker 7: I just like I said, yeah, like the people might work. No,
24:28
Speaker 7: we're going out for like a lunch for it, like
24:30
Speaker 7: we probably to talk about work stuff. You know what
24:32
Speaker 7: I'm saying. It's not like a big deal.
24:34
Speaker 4: Like I don't I think if it wasn't a big deal.
24:39
Speaker 4: You wouldn't have reached out for help with this.
24:42
Speaker 1: I think you feel guilty a.
24:43
Speaker 5: Little bit lot bit. Just do us a favorite angel.
24:49
Speaker 3: Just just just keep your wife, you know, front of mine,
24:53
Speaker 3: front of mine.
24:54
Speaker 5: So go have your lunch.
24:56
Speaker 3: But remember what she looked like when you said I do,
24:59
Speaker 3: and and you know, just just don't lose sight of that.
25:03
Speaker 3: If you're going to go have this lunch, have the lunch.
25:07
Speaker 5: Have your wife?
25:08
Speaker 7: You guys a question?
25:09
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Sarah's right here.
25:11
Speaker 7: Have you all had this situation before? Like would you
25:14
Speaker 7: like you know, you know what I'm saying, like, well,
25:16
Speaker 7: like a work like like someone you're close at work with,
25:19
Speaker 7: maybe the opposite and then you have a yes.
25:21
Speaker 5: Yes, that's why I think we're recognizing what this is.
25:25
Speaker 1: Like Ryan, you're my work husband.
25:27
Speaker 5: And your mind.
25:27
Speaker 3: But I also listen, my other actual wife worked down
25:30
Speaker 3: the hall.
25:31
Speaker 1: Yes, and also my husband loves Ryan, so we're I mean,
25:34
Speaker 1: we don't. I leave my phone on the table and
25:37
Speaker 1: I don't care if Ryan could text me all day long.
25:39
Speaker 1: My husband can read it. And yes, there's nothing to.
25:41
Speaker 4: Happen because you're not violating a boundary at all.
25:44
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, and when I say to Ellen, I love
25:46
Speaker 3: you so much whatever, like we say.
25:48
Speaker 1: That, yeah, yeah, like yes, and Ryan you say to Sarah,
25:51
Speaker 1: I mean it's a there's a difference. There's a difference,
25:54
Speaker 1: I think, and and really to me and I don't know, Sarah,
25:57
Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong. It's it's all in the
25:59
Speaker 1: hidden and it has to be hidden. It just doesn't
26:02
Speaker 1: feel right. And we just want you to feel good. Angel.
26:04
Speaker 1: We don't want you to be in this gray area.
26:06
Speaker 1: What's it called the upside down on stranger things?
26:09
Speaker 4: Right?
26:12
Speaker 1: Are you there?
26:14
Speaker 6: Yeah?
26:14
Speaker 7: I am here. You know, I'm just thinking a lot,
26:16
Speaker 7: you know what I'm saying.
26:18
Speaker 1: Well, okay, keep thinking. We're going to take a quickie
26:22
Speaker 1: and we'll be right back, all right. Angel bailed, Guys, Okay,
26:28
Speaker 1: Angel bailed. We are therapy Thursday and Angel was with us.
26:34
Speaker 1: He's flirting with his work wife. Sarah. You called it
26:37
Speaker 1: emotional cheating.
26:39
Speaker 5: Do you find that a lot, Sarah?
26:40
Speaker 4: Like?
26:40
Speaker 3: Do people come to you? Obviously, anyone that goes to
26:43
Speaker 3: see you is looking for help, But when you give
26:46
Speaker 3: them things they do they don't want, do they get upset?
26:51
Speaker 4: Depends on why they're coming to me. If they're coming
26:53
Speaker 4: to me to validate their decisions and opinions. If I
26:57
Speaker 4: give them any pushback at all, they're not going.
27:00
Speaker 1: To like it because they're not there for your true opinion.
27:03
Speaker 1: They're there for you to make them feel good about
27:05
Speaker 1: what they're doing, exactly for me to Or.
27:10
Speaker 4: If somebody comes from a place of being a victim,
27:14
Speaker 4: they are not looking to be empowered. They're not looking
27:17
Speaker 4: for clarity. They can be looking for that reinforcement which
27:22
Speaker 4: they can get then use as an excuse for things
27:26
Speaker 4: that they don't really feel or in alignment with their values.
27:30
Speaker 3: Do you ever find yourself because I loved again when
27:32
Speaker 3: we first started talking with him, you said, straight away,
27:35
Speaker 3: you hit him right with it, like out the gate,
27:36
Speaker 3: you said, this is this is an emotional affair. Do
27:39
Speaker 3: you ever temper that like and not say that straight away.
27:43
Speaker 4: That I would possibly temper if I was talking to
27:48
Speaker 4: somebody for the first time, like if he came into
27:51
Speaker 4: my office and we were having a conversation, I would
27:54
Speaker 4: probably explore more about how he feels when he's with
27:58
Speaker 4: or what he's looking for. I would usually probably go
28:01
Speaker 4: that route rather than just being you know, let's call
28:04
Speaker 4: this what it is. Let's be direct about what's going on?
28:07
Speaker 4: And go from there?
28:08
Speaker 1: What do you what do you guys think? Did he this?
28:11
Speaker 1: Can I start? Yeah, he wants to sleep with her
28:15
Speaker 1: so bad he can't see straight and he cannot wait
28:19
Speaker 1: to be alone with her. She feels the same way,
28:23
Speaker 1: and he wants to have his cake and eat it too.
28:26
Speaker 4: He does.
28:26
Speaker 1: He wants to keep his home life because he's comfortable.
28:28
Speaker 4: And he said he likes the food. He's like, I
28:31
Speaker 4: mean he means. I'm not saying there's nothing wrong with
28:33
Speaker 4: like liking what somebody gets. When you say, well, I
28:36
Speaker 4: like that they cook for me. It's like he likes
28:38
Speaker 4: what his wife does for him, not what he brings
28:42
Speaker 4: to the relationship, what they create together.
28:45
Speaker 3: And you better believe Sarah, when I asked him, when's
28:47
Speaker 3: the last time your wife excited you? Yeah, that wasn't
28:50
Speaker 3: what I meant.
28:50
Speaker 5: I didn't mean.
28:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, what did you mean, Ryan?
28:57
Speaker 7: I met?
28:57
Speaker 3: When was the last time he had that same like
29:00
Speaker 3: want to that lustful excited feeling about his wife?
29:04
Speaker 1: Analogy here it goes, he wants to dive into that
29:09
Speaker 1: pool deep yes, yeah, versus sitting on the bench because
29:14
Speaker 1: the water's too cold, and oh, I just don't want
29:16
Speaker 1: to take my towel off, and I don't want to
29:17
Speaker 1: get in he is, he's in that water and he
29:21
Speaker 1: is swimming, and.
29:22
Speaker 4: What he wants to hear is there's nothing wrong with
29:25
Speaker 4: having a friend, right, And it's like, there can be
29:30
Speaker 4: a great deal wrong with having a friend if you
29:32
Speaker 4: want to sleep with them.
29:35
Speaker 1: And it's happening all the time everywhere.
29:38
Speaker 3: So consensus in the room, Sarah, maybe this is out
29:41
Speaker 3: of bounds for you as a as a.
29:45
Speaker 5: Is angel going to sleep with this woman.
29:48
Speaker 4: I think if she was receptive what she has indicated
29:51
Speaker 4: she is, this could likely turn from, despite his protests,
29:54
Speaker 4: what is already an emotional affair, into a physical affair.
29:57
Speaker 1: It's such a therapistsw Ryane said it up for her
30:01
Speaker 1: and then she's like, well, he's likely.
30:03
Speaker 4: He's like, okay, okay, let's do you yes, yes, yes,
30:08
Speaker 4: that's three yeses. Yes we turned absolutely the marriage is over. Okay,