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Cryonics: Could You Freeze Yourself and Wake Up in the Future? · The Infographics Show Podcast

• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Welcome back everyone, to beyond infographics.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Yes, welcome back.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: You know, we always try to go beyond those you know,
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: quick hits.
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: Of information and the surface level stuff.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and today we have a really interesting topic one
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: that kind of, I think it's safe to say, captures
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: a lot of people's imagination.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: It's definitely a thought provoking one.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: It is. It's chronics and specifically we're going to be
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: taking a look at the time Ship project, which is
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  Speaker 1: down in Texas.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a really fascinating project that's going on
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  Speaker 2: down there.
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  Speaker 1: It's it's ambitious.
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  Speaker 2: Ambitious is a good word for it. Yeah, it's it's
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  Speaker 2: really pushing the boundaries of what we think about in
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: terms of you know, life and death and the future exactly.
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  Speaker 1: So you know, you might have heard of the idea
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  Speaker 1: of you know, freezing people to preserve them with this
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  Speaker 1: hope that maybe someday in the future technology will have
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  Speaker 1: advanced to the point where they could be revived.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the that's the basic premise, that's.
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  Speaker 1: That's the headline. Yeah, but we're going to go way beyond.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: That, much deeper. That's what we do here.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. So we've gone through a lot of material a
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  Speaker 1: lot of a lot of sources.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: A lot of information out there, a lot.
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Of information, and we're bringing you what we think are
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: some of the most fascinating takeaways.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, the key insights, the things that you really need
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  Speaker 2: to know.
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  Speaker 1: So think about it like this, Could this really work?
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  Speaker 2: That's the big question.
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  Speaker 1: Is it possible to actually, you know, pause life and
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  Speaker 1: then restart it down the line?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah? Could someone truly come back to life after being frozen?
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  Speaker 1: Right?
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  Speaker 2: It's a question that's been around for a long time.
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  Speaker 2: I mean we've always been fascinated with the idea of
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  Speaker 2: cheating death right, Right.
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  Speaker 1: It's like our version of time travel in a way exactly.
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  Speaker 2: Instead of trying to you know, bend the laws of
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  Speaker 2: physics and travel through time, we're trying to manipulate biological time. Yeah,
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  Speaker 2: and the Time Project is right at the heart of that.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, so let's talk about the Timesheet Project. Right. It's
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  Speaker 1: in Comfort, Texas. Comfort Texas kind of ironic a little.
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  Speaker 2: Bit, Yeah, given that we're talking about, you know, a
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  Speaker 2: place where people are hoping to be frozen for an
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  Speaker 2: indefinite amount of time.
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  Speaker 1: Right, But the name Timeship, I mean it's pretty clear
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  Speaker 1: what they're going.
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  Speaker 2: For, right, Yeah, it's a vehicle to another time in the.
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  Speaker 1: Future, a vessel to transport people to a different era.
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  Speaker 2: And the man behind this is Stephen Valentine.
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  Speaker 1: Right, he's the director and the principal architect of the
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: whole project.
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  Speaker 2: And this is not a small operation.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, this is a massive undertaker.
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  Speaker 2: We're talking multi million.
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  Speaker 1: Dollar, multi million dollar project funded by anonymous donors. Wow,
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  Speaker 1: that's right. They're really serious about this.
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  Speaker 2: So they really want to create this sort of what
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  Speaker 2: they call a mecca for chronics.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're envisioning it as a hub, a central location
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  Speaker 1: for everything related to cryonics and life extension.
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  Speaker 2: So it's not just about preserving people.
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  Speaker 1: No, it's much broader than that.
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  Speaker 2: Right, They're talking about storing organs, stem cells, embryos.
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  Speaker 1: Even DNA from endangered species. Oh wow, it's like a
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  Speaker 1: Noah's Ark for the future.
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  Speaker 2: It's like this this huge biobank.
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  Speaker 1: Exactly preserving the building blocks of life.
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  Speaker 2: And they're also planning to have the world's largest life
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  Speaker 2: extension research center there. That's right, the Stasis Research Bark.
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  Speaker 1: So it's not just about you know, putting things on ice.
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  Speaker 2: No, they're actively pushing the boundaries of research in this field.
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  Speaker 1: They're really trying to make this happen.
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  Speaker 2: They're committed.
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  Speaker 1: Now. You mentioned something earlier about you know, them being
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: serious about this, and you know they've they've picked this
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  Speaker 1: location very carefully, haven't they.
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  Speaker 2: Oh? Absolutely, they wanted to minimize risk as much as possible.
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  Speaker 1: So we're talking about.
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  Speaker 2: Avoiding natural disasters, staying away from military bases and nuclear
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  Speaker 2: power plants.
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  Speaker 1: Oh wow.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, they've even taken into account the possibility of a
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  Speaker 2: nuclear attack. Really, they've consulted on the facility's ability to
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  Speaker 2: withstand a two megaton nuclear blast nearby.
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  Speaker 1: So it's this disincredible fortress.
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  Speaker 2: Ye, it's designed to last.
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  Speaker 1: And the design of the time ship itself is really striking.
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  Speaker 2: It's something else.
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  Speaker 1: They call it like a space ship castle hybrid.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, thick, low circular walls with a central chamber that's
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  Speaker 2: kind of like a tomb almost.
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  Speaker 1: Oh wow.
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  Speaker 2: Very secure.
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  Speaker 1: Now in terms of the actual freezing process, I mean,
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  Speaker 1: what do we know about how that works?
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  Speaker 2: Well, they haven't released all the specifics, but the general
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  Speaker 2: idea is to replace bodily fluids with a cryoprotected solution.
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  Speaker 1: And what does that do.
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  Speaker 2: It's all about preventing ice crystals from forming, because when
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  Speaker 2: water freezes, it expands, and those ice crystals can cause
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  Speaker 2: serious damage to cells. Right, So the cryer protectant basically
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  Speaker 2: acts like an anti freeze. Okay, it helps to protect
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  Speaker 2: the cells from that kind.
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  Speaker 1: Of damage, and then they use liquid nitrogen to keep
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: things really cold.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, they're aiming for a temperature of around minus one
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  Speaker 2: hundred and thirty degrees celsius.
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  Speaker 1: That's incredibly cold, it is, and they say that the
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  Speaker 1: pods that they're using could maintain that temperature for up
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  Speaker 1: to six months.
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  Speaker 2: Without any power or maintenance.
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  Speaker 1: That's amazing.
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  Speaker 2: It is a testament to the engineering that's going into this.
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  Speaker 1: Yes, it's not like they're just throwing people in a freezer.
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  Speaker 2: No, this is a very sophisticated process, and.
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  Speaker 1: They're doing testing on prototype pods.
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  Speaker 2: Of course, they want to make sure everything works perfectly
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  Speaker 2: before they start storing people for real.
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  Speaker 1: Now, let's take a step back for a moment and
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  Speaker 1: look at the history of this idea of freezing people. Right,
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  Speaker 1: this isn't a brand new concept, is it.
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  Speaker 2: No, it's actually been around for a while.
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  Speaker 1: So how far back does this go.
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  Speaker 2: Well, the first person to be cryogenically frozen was a
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  Speaker 2: guy named James Bedford. Okay, and this was back in
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  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty seven.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, and his body is still in storage today, that's right.
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  Speaker 1: So these early attempts at cryonics were pretty different from
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  Speaker 1: what's being done today.
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  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the technology has come a long way.
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  Speaker 1: So what are some of the key advancements.
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  Speaker 2: Well, one of the biggest is vitrification. Vitrification, it's a
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  Speaker 2: process that allows you to freeze biological material without forming
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  Speaker 2: ice cris so.
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  Speaker 1: That damage that we were talking about earlier.
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  Speaker 2: Right, you can avoid that completely.
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  Speaker 1: And this has been really successful in preserving things like
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  Speaker 1: stem cells and embryos exactly.
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  Speaker 2: It's already being used in medicine and research.
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  Speaker 1: And there have been some really interesting experiments with vetrification
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  Speaker 1: and organ preservation.
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  Speaker 2: Like the rabbit kidney.
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  Speaker 1: Right, A whole rabbit kidney was successfully cryopreserved, thought and
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  Speaker 1: then transplanted back into the donor.
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  Speaker 2: Animal and it functioned normally.
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  Speaker 1: That's incredible, it is. And there's also been work done
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  Speaker 1: on preserving brains.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, there was a claim from a company called twenty
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  Speaker 2: first Century Medicine that they had successfully preserved pig and
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  Speaker 2: rabbit brains using a new vitrification.
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  Speaker 1: Technique, and these brains showed no visible signs.
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  Speaker 2: Of damage, that's what they claimed.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, so this really gives some credence to the idea
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  Speaker 1: that maybe someday we could preserve a whole human brain
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  Speaker 1: and all.
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  Speaker 2: The memories and personality that go with it.
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  Speaker 1: Now, the cryonics community also points to some research on
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  Speaker 1: microscopic worms that were frozen in thought, and.
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  Speaker 2: Those worms retain memories they had learned before being frozen.
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  Speaker 1: That's wild.
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  Speaker 2: It suggests that even very complex biological processes like memory
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  Speaker 2: formation could potentially survive the freezing and thawing process.
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  Speaker 1: So for proposedness to cryonics, this is really encouraging.
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  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it supports their belief that with the right
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  Speaker 2: technology we could preserve not just bodies but also minds.
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  Speaker 1: But there's a big elephant in the room here, isn't there?
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  Speaker 2: There is?
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  Speaker 1: The whole concept of cryonics as it stands today relies
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  Speaker 1: on the idea that will eventually be able to revive.
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  Speaker 2: People and not only revive them, but also cure whatever
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  Speaker 2: killed them in the first place.
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  Speaker 1: Right, I mean, right now the people who are being
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  Speaker 1: frozen are legally dead, that's right. So we're not just
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  Speaker 1: talking about thawing them out.
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  Speaker 2: We're talking about reversing.
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  Speaker 1: Death, which is something we can't do.
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  Speaker 2: Not yet anyway, and that's the biggest challenge for cryonics.
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  Speaker 1: Professor Brian Grout from the Society for Low Temperature Biology,
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  Speaker 1: he makes this point very clearly.
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  Speaker 2: He says, the biggest difficulty is not whether it's possible
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  Speaker 2: to recover a whole person from ultra low temperatures. It
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  Speaker 2: is the fact that they will be dead. If they
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  Speaker 2: were dead when they were frozen, they will still very
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  Speaker 2: much be dead when you thaw them out.
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  Speaker 1: So he's not saying it's impossible to revive someone from
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  Speaker 1: cryo preservation, no, but he is saying that we need
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  Speaker 1: to figure out how to reverse death.
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  Speaker 2: First, which is a pretty tall order.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Now, Professor Grank does suggest that maybe this
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  Speaker 1: technology could be used for something.
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  Speaker 2: Else, like suspended animation for space travel.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, he thinks that might be a more realistic goal
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  Speaker 1: in the near.
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  Speaker 2: Term, inducing a temporary state of metabolic arrest in a
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  Speaker 2: living person, right as opposed to trying to revive someone
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  Speaker 2: who's already dead.
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  Speaker 1: But Stephen Valentine and the Timeship Project, they really focus
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  Speaker 1: on the post mortem aspect of cryonics. They are, they're
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  Speaker 1: not really talking about freezing living people.
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  Speaker 2: No. Valentine has said that he doesn't want to get
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  Speaker 2: into that because it raises a whole bunch of ethical
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  Speaker 2: and legal issues.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a whole other can of worms, it is.
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  Speaker 1: So the focus for now is on preserving people after
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: they've died, in the hope that someday they can be
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: brought back.
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  Speaker 2: And the hope is that future technologies like gene editing
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: and nanotechnology might make that possible.
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the idea is that we might be able to
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: repair damage at the cellular level and even reverse aging.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: And some people even talk about mind uploading as a
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: way to achieve a kind of immortality.
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  Speaker 1: So it's really blurring the lines between science and science fiction,
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  Speaker 1: it is. Now, let's talk about some of the more
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: practical considerations surrounding cronics, like the cost, Yeah, so much.
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  Speaker 1: We're talking tens of thousands of dollars, at.
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  Speaker 2: Least thirty thousand dollars just for the initial preservation.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: And then there's the ongoing cost of storage.
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  Speaker 2: And the potential cost of revival if that ever becomes possible.
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  Speaker 1: So this is really only an option for the wealthy
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: for now. Any rate, And then there are the ethical
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: and social implications to consider.
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  Speaker 2: Like what happens to your finances and your legal identity
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  Speaker 2: when you're frozen?
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Do you still in your house? You still have
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: a bank account?
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  Speaker 2: And what about your relationships?
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah? What happens when you wake up one hundred years
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  Speaker 1: from now and everyone you know is gone?
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  Speaker 2: Lot to think about.
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: There was a really interesting case in the UK a
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  Speaker 1: few years ago involving a fourteen year old girl who
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: wanted to be cryo.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: Preserved, the case of JS.
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah. She had terminal cancer and she wanted to be
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: frozen in the hope that she could be cured and
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: revived in the future.
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: And her parents were divorced and her father didn't want
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: her to be frozen.
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: So it went to court, Yeah, and the.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: Judge ruled in the girl's favor.
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  Speaker 1: So she was cryo preserved.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: It was a landmark case.
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  Speaker 1: It really highlighted the complexity of these issues it did.
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: Now Stephen Valentine, he has an interesting take on all
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: of this. What's that He says that a lot of
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: these concerns are based on our current understanding of the world.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Which might be completely different one hundred years from now.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: Right he says, maybe we'll be living on other planets,
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: or we'll have modified ourselves to the point where these
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: things aren't even issues anymore.
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  Speaker 2: It's a possibility.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: So he's saying we shouldn't get too bogged down in
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: the details.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: We should focus on the bigger picture.
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  Speaker 1: The possibility of extending.
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  Speaker 2: Life and conquering death.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: Now, one thing that I find really interesting is that
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: Valentine himself isn't signed up for cryo preservation really. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: He says he doesn't want to be a distraction.
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: He wants to focus on his work.
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he doesn't want people to think that he's just
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: doing this for himself, which is understandable, but it also
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: kind of highlights the fact that this is still a
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: very experimental field. There's no guarantee that it's going to work.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: So the big question is will cryonics be a success.
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  Speaker 2: Will it be the key to immortality, or.
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  Speaker 1: Will it just be a really expensive way to delay
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: the inevitable.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: I guess only time will tell.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: So there you have it, folks. A deep dive into
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: cryonics and the Timeship project.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: A fascinating topic.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: It's a blend of cutting edge science and profound philosophical questions.
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: What does it mean to be alive?
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: What are the limits of technology?
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: And what would you do if you had the chance
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: to live forever?
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: These are questions that we all need to be thinking about.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: We hope this deep dive has given you some food
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: for thought, and.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: If you enjoyed it, please don't forget to give us
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: a five star rating.
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: It really helps other people find this show.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: And join us next time for another deep drive into
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: beyond infographics.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: We'll be exploring another fascinating.
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  Speaker 1: Topic, and remember to give us five stars.
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• 12:10
  Speaker 1: See you next time.