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What If Your Darkest Moment Is A Calling with Clarence Langston · The Elsa Kurt Show

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Our guest today has lived a story many people would have written off before it ever reached Chapter 2.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: From grief, rejection, homelessness, and life on the streets of Detroit to leading thousands in ministry, his journey is one of surrender, redemption, and God's ability to take broken places and build purpose from them.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: Today we're talking about his new book, Embracing God's Power in Our Weakness.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: Please welcome Apostle Clarence Langston.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_03: Clarence, it's so nice to meet you.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you for joining me today.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_04: Well, thank you, Elsa, for having me.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_04: I'm excited to be here with you today.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_03: We are going to have such a fun conversation.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_03: This is literally my favorite thing to talk about in the whole wide world.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you very much.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_04: Well, thank you.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_04: It's also my favorite thing to talk about as well.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so let's let's kind of we're gonna go backwards and and move our way forward.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um, people see you today.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_03: They see a pastor, a leader, a husband, a mentor, an author.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, tell me about Clarence before all of this.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_04: Quite interesting.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_04: Um the the young man that I was, the little boy uh who had a very hard journey through life uh because of um some experiences that happened early on in my life with the murder of my birth mother.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, didn't know uh that my birth mother was murdered.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_04: I was raised uh by her sister, who was my aunt, but that's the only woman that I've ever known to be my mother.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_04: She raised me and uh all of those wonderful things.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_04: But it was at uh around eight or nine years old that I was at a family event, and I happened to be uh back then they put everything in a photo album.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_04: My grandmother had everything in a photo album, and I was flipping through the photo album at one of our family events, and I come across um this uh news clipping, and it was talking about this uh woman who had been viciously murdered and that she had a child, and his name was the same as my name.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_04: And so I I can't even tell you uh what it felt like in that moment, uh, but it was like things that I believed to be one way in my life, uh slowly, it was everything was like a slow motion, Elsa.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_04: It was like things were just uh as though I was falling in a deep dark black hole as I was reading this because I it wasn't making sense to me.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_04: And uh as I continued to flip to the back of the photo album, um, she had some um uh uh some of the uh flyers from uh a funeral.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_04: Uh what do you call those flyers?
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_03: The um Oh, uh I I do know what you mean.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_04: Obituary.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_04: It was obituary.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and so I saw the obituary, I read the obituary, and it had my name in there again, said that uh I was her son.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_04: Now I remember this woman uh when I was younger, but I remembered her being a part of my life, but as an aunt.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_04: So it was really reversal in roles.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_04: The woman I thought was my aunt was really my mom.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_04: And the woman who raised me um that I know is mom was really my aunt.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_04: And so um I remember being in that bathroom, everything started spinning out of control.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't know then that I had a mental breakdown.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I all of a sudden I heard a voice in the bathroom, and this voice began to tell me, um, you know, your mom is not your mom, your brother's not your brother, your sister is not your sister.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I didn't know then how Satan works.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but he began to dismantle uh all of the foundations in my life that gave me security.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_04: And uh I remember me, I don't know how long I was in the bathroom, but after after a while, uh all of my family was outside of the bathroom trying to get me to come out of the restroom.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_04: And so by the time I opened the door, I didn't believe um anyone that was on the other side of that door.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_04: I believed everyone had a part of it.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_04: It was like it was a conspiracy.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_04: I had anger, uh, I had resentment.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_04: And then as I read the uh newspaper article, uh it talked about how she was viciously uh murdered.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_04: And so it I didn't know at that time, you know, looking back now in hindsight, and God had to reveal it to me as I went through my healing that um a spirit of murder tried to come into my life.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_04: Uh when I came out of the bathroom, I had anger, um, I had resentment.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_04: I believed all of the teachers at my school knew.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I began not to do my class uh work, I began to not uh function mentally.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_04: Um as a child would normally function, I began to have outbursts and uh I wanted to fight a lot, uh, but I didn't know I had all of these anguishes and things that were going on in me.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_04: So when I look back over my life, who I was then to who I am now, because by the time I became a teenager, um, I was connecting myself to uh the wrong group of uh young people, ended up getting caught up in the streets of Detroit selling drugs.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_04: Uh my father was a drug dealer, and um I ended up selling drugs with my own father and then just connecting with the wrong group.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_04: And by the time everything was over, I had uh contracts out of my life where people were literally uh trying to kill me, looking for me to take my life.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_04: And from there, you know, of course, my mom tried to move me out of the state.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't want to move.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um I wanted to stay with my friends.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_04: They said that they would protect me, and you know, when you're younger, you feel like you're invincible.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_04: And uh so my mom said, Well, you know, you're putting the family in jeopardy.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_04: So I had to ended up m moving out of her home.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_04: And before it was all over with, to make a long story short, I ended up homeless.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_04: Wow.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_04: And um yeah, didn't know how I was gonna eat, didn't know how I was gonna live.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_04: And so I just really didn't believe that I would ever see the age of uh 19 because most of my family members would say the direction that he's going in, you know, he probably won't see 19 years old.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_04: So that was the old clearance.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_03: You looking back on that yourself, it it must feel like a completely different person in in so many ways, right?
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_04: When I'm sharing the story, it's unbelievable to me.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_03: I just picture you as this eight-year-old child.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: I think about myself as an eight-year-old child, and and life in the world is so confusing already in the best of circumstances.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: And we misunderstand and misinterpret so much as a child that when we see it through adult eyes, it's so different, right?
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_03: It's so totally to experience what you experienced.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, it it's no wonder it it took you down such that that Satan was was able to just slip right in and and you know, lie to you and deceive you and get you to just follow and walk down this path that was not intended for you at all.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but you know, the flip side of that is had you not gone through those things, would you be the man that you are today, right?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_03: With like you know, you you went through you went through the fire and then here you are on the uh on the other side.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um tell me, so I mean you battled grief and feeling rejection and self-destruction, like you went through every bit of it and anger, you know, like you say, resentment.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_03: Was there a pivotal moment or was there, was it like quiet little things?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_03: Was it a big moment or a little moment that changed your life?
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it it you know, it's interesting that you put it that way because I remember uh walking down the street one day, you know, I was hungry and um I was frustrated, um, I was sad, I had a spirit of anguish.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_04: I had gotten to a place that I wanted to commit suicide.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_04: I wanted it, I wanted it to end.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_04: It had gotten to the place that everything around me was so dark.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_04: Um the mind battles, um, I mean, you know, it's it's crazy when I look back in hindsight and I think about all the different um spirits, demonic spirits, demons that I had to conquer, that I had to overcome.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_04: There's really no way I should be the person I am today.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_04: I I really shouldn't even be here.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_04: And if I were to still be here in that state of mind, I should be crazy.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I should not be mentally stable.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_04: I shouldn't have the joy of the Lord, which I do.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I couldn't even smile back then.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't know how to smile.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_04: I had no joy.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_04: But anyway, going back to the question, um, I remember being out on the street and I remember putting a gun to my head one day.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_04: Uh because then, now, which I understand now, the voices wouldn't stop.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_04: And and it was turning up.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_04: It was like somebody was controlling the volume, and the voice was saying, Nobody loves you.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_04: Um, nobody sees you.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_04: Um, that's why nobody's looking for you now.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_04: If you ended your life, nobody would miss you.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_04: And and where do you go from here?
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_04: And he just kept turning up.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_04: You don't have a home, you don't have a car, you don't have a job.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_04: A voice was reminding me of everything that I did not have and everything that I wasn't.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_04: And I just wanted to cut off.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_04: And so I can relate to so many people who experience wanting to take their life.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_04: It's the voice, Elsa, it's the voice.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_04: And so um, I remember putting a gun in my head and uh pulling the trigger.
• 8:45
  unknown: Wow.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_04: And uh the gun didn't go off.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember moving the gun, I was so angry and I said, I can't even do this right.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_04: And the gun goes off.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_04: But this time, when it goes off, it was like it awakens something in me.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember beginning to cry because I really didn't want to die.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_04: I just wanted the voice to stop.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_04: And um I remember when that gun went off, and you know, I just began to cry out to God, you know, Lord, feed me.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I'm hungry.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_04: And it's so funny because, you know, he was speaking to me from the word of God, and I heard the scripture before, but I really didn't understand the parallel in the moment.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_04: And I heard a voice say, Clarence, will you feed my sheep?
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_04: Now that was that was so confusing to me because in the in that very moment I'm asking to be fed.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_04: And here and now I look back in hindsight, God is talking to me about my purpose.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, God is talking to me about the call of God that He has on my life, that He's calling me to in the future I haven't tapped into yet when I was just trying to end my life because it looked like I had no future.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_04: And that was that, yeah, that was a remarkable moment in my life.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_04: I I'll never forget that.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_02: My goodness.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_02: And boy, did he put a calling on your life, didn't he?
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_04: Praise God, yes.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, the capacity that I have to love, it's it's really incredible to me.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_04: I just love people.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_04: I want to see, I want to see everybody free because I know what that's like.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_04: You know, know that for me.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_03: That must mean so much to the people that you minister to, to be in those depths.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I'm so blessed to say that I've never experienced that.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_03: So to hear it is is both heartbreaking and um it also fills you with a sense of um joy because you can I'm looking at somebody who has been on the other side of all of that and is living, walking proof of the goodness that there is to come if you if you can get yourself to be open to it and be receptive to it and just allow allow God, allow Jesus into your heart, which is um, oh my goodness, so transformative.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: I I I'm so amazed by by your journey.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um now you grew up in Detroit in Detroit.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: How much do you think that environment shaped you?
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_03: Or it was it more of the internal?
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_03: Like if the internal wasn't struggling so hard.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_04: That's a that's a great question because you know, during um my teen years in the 80s, uh the drug epidemic, the crack epidemic was really huge in the inner cities as you know it around the country.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_04: And uh Detroit was uh one of the uh main inner cities that was uh really prominent during that time.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_04: And so with my father and my father's side of the family, um being street people and being around the streets and coming up in the projects, um, that influence also uh shaped my life because I ran when I spiraled into that that deep dark hole I felt like I was um falling into, I was attracted to the darkness.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_04: So I ran, you know, because of rebellion, because my mom, very, I mean, very uh um studious woman, very smart, um educated, love God.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_04: She, my mother's side of my family was Jehovah's Witness.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_04: They all grew up Jehovah's Witness.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_04: And so from the time that I was probably nine years old, shortly after I had that encounter, um, uh she was she was trying her best to help me.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_04: And I had Bible studies once a week with the elders from the kingdom hall.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_04: And so I would meet with them and we would go over uh lessons um from the Bible that they would want me to study.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_04: And then when they would come over, they wanted to know what I would receive or what I got out of that particular scripture that we were studying.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember one day I I thought that they were, you know, uh, I thought I was in trouble because he asked me, who helped me study?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_04: And I said, um, and I said, Well, you know, no one, because I hadn't even studied.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, wow.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_04: And uh he said to me, um, this really comes easy to you.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_04: And you make it make sense.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_04: If I asked your mom if you could come over to my home and have a Bible study with me and my children, would you be open to that?
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_04: Because I believe my children, you could help them better understand on their level than I could.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_04: And so it's interesting.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_03: And you were how old?
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sorry, at that point you were like nine?
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, about nine or ten.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_04: And um, that was the first time that I had felt any real worth in a long time.
• 13:18
  unknown: Wow.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_04: Because what happened was when he came and picked me up when I came to his home, I'll never forget it.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_04: He had a, you know, and I grew up in a in a in a single family uh home.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_04: My mom, uh, my mom was divorced.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_04: And so, you know, of course, my um uh my my uh father, who was married to my birth mother that was murdered, um, you know, they had they really didn't have any um connection.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_04: She tried to keep me away from that side of the family because she knew, you know, how they were.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_04: And so she was raising me up this particular way.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_04: And so um, when he took me to his home, his wife was there, and so I saw this family unit I wasn't accustomed to seeing.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_04: And so when we sat at the table, uh elsewhere, it was a spread.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I mean, they they they they had the linens were out on the table, they had the food out on the table, and he sat at one end of the table, and his wife sat next to him, and his children were on the sides of the table, and he asked me to sit at the other end of the table.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_04: Man, I I can't tell you how I felt.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it felt special, you know.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_04: It's amazing when I look back in hindsight how God gave me moments.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it was like, and so that was a moment, you know, um, that I remember.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_04: But again, the crazy thing is I ended up uh in the streets, being attracted to the streets, uh, wanting to wanting to hurt my family.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_04: There was something in me, I didn't want to physically hurt them, but emotionally I wanted to hurt them because the enemy made me believe that they hurt me.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_04: He made me believe that they didn't really love me, that my mom didn't love me, my grandparents didn't love me, uh, my siblings didn't love me.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_04: He made me feel like I was in a world all by myself.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_04: So I could be in a room full of people and be empty and and be sad and be angry and hearing these voices.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_04: Because I would walk in a room and because I had a spirit, I didn't know I had a spirit of murder on me, Elsa, uh, because when I found out how that my mom was murdered, um this voice began to talk to me about revenge, about getting uh the individuals back that had murdered my mother.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_04: And so uh he he would plant all of these ideas on how I could torture them, how yeah, how I would I would let them, I would torture them before I just killed them because that's what they did to her.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_04: And so the enemy had planted that seed in me.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_04: So, you know, when I would walk into a movie theater or a restaurant, I would always be thinking, if somebody did something to me right now, how how could I how could I hurt them?
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_04: How could I kill them?
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_04: Now, could you imagine a teenager and a kid is thinking this way?
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, I would grab a fork.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I had violence.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_04: It was a lot of violence in my head.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_04: And so that's why I say when I look back and I see how I am now in my right mind and loving and caring and gentle, and I love hugs.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_04: I'm a hugger.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_05: I love hugging.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_04: I I mean, I have I have two, I have uh twin boys, and I have a 22-year-old daughter.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_04: She just graduates from college this weekend, and I I literally hug them at least 10 to 15 times a day.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I I want to embrace them, I want to kiss them, I I want to rub my hands through their hair.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_04: I I want to, you know, everything that I didn't receive.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_04: Yes, it's amazing that I give that now.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, and it's it's so beautiful because you hear so many stories, sadly, that don't and like you know, that don't turn out that way, that they hold on to all of that.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_03: And then um, it's gonna be especially hard for you because you know, you know what it feels like to to give into the goodness, right?
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_03: To just lean into that instead of uh leaning into the darkness, um, you know, to to for anyone to discover, to learn that there's another way is is so profound.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_03: And for you to be um taking the the the gift, you know, uh 1 Peter 4, 10 is is is my favorite verse, and each of you should use whatever gift you receive in order to serve others as faithful stewards of God's grace.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: And and when I get to witness somebody who lives that and does that, it's such an honor.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_03: So um it's amazing, you know.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_03: And funny enough, I was gonna say to you, if there was a person that believed in you before you believed in yourself, and I feel like you may have answered it, but I want to know if there's somebody else that you you want to pinpoint.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like it was maybe the the elder from the Jehovah's Witness um teaching.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, was that like the first person that you feel like said to you, like, I see something more in you than what you think there is?
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, absolutely.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_04: Because um, yeah, the place that I was in when I come out of the that bathroom, um, I stopped functioning.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_04: So I was sitting in a classroom and wouldn't do the work.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_04: I wouldn't, I couldn't, you know, the comprehension wasn't working.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I didn't want to read.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't trust teachers.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I I was full of anger to the place that they they told my mom that I couldn't comprehend and that they needed to put me, in order to help me, they needed to put me in a learning disability class.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_04: So I remember as a child going into the classroom, and there, you know, it was like maybe six or seven students in that classroom.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_04: And all of them, you know, looking back now, they they had some type of visible um hindrance that was um physically and mentally hindering them from being able to comprehend and being able to what we would consider be a regular student, they needed a lot of help.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_04: And so um I really did not have that problem.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't realize it because when I got around them, I thrived because I wanted to help them, right?
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_04: I wanted to help them so I would finish my work so I could help them because my heart would go out um to them.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_04: You know, people would come to the classroom window and tease them.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_04: So because I was put in that environment, I would have to ride that the short bus with them.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_04: Some of them were taxied home.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_04: And so people made fun of, he made fun of us.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_04: But I mean, I I was like I said, I was a pretty tough kid.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I'm dealing with all this anger and resentment.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_04: I became like a bodyguard to them as well.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I'm protecting them.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_04: I'm I'm everybody, you know, I'm making everybody scared of me and so they wouldn't mess with them.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_04: And so, but I was still with them.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_04: And so I've I also picked up um that another layer of insecurity because now I'm feeling as though that I'm incapable of learning.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_04: I'm starting to believe what I'm a part of, I really am.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_04: And so it wasn't until uh my ninth grade year that uh one of the teachers had a meeting with the principal called my mom in the office and said, uh, this young man should not be um in my classroom.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_04: And I wasn't, so I was probably in a learning disability class maybe three or four years before somebody identified that I shouldn't be there.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_04: So there's so many layers, Elsa.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_03: All right, there are so many layers.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: And it's so wild because there's so many of them, right?
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, there's so there's so many of them that that would convince you that you can't succeed.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_03: But then woven into that, it's like there's so many moments of of like you're something more than than what the devil's trying to tell you, what's that he's trying to tell you, and it's it's just so incredible.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_03: And of course, we know that you know he's a liar and he's a thief and he's a thief of joy and he's a thief of potential and and all of those things.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, it makes me think about how so many believers um they struggle because they think that once they come to Christ, that everything should suddenly become easy.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_03: And you're probably a really great testament of that.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_03: It's not that it comes easy, right?
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's like talk a little bit uh about that.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_03: Like when you had this moment, whether it was an epiphany or if it was, you know, a slowly coming two.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_03: Um tell me about like that that struggle.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, because it had to be there, right?
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_04: The transition was, you know, the transition was really interesting because again, I'm you know, I'm in the streets, I'm rebelling, I'm dealing with anger, resentment.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_04: At this time, you know, I'm homeless, but I come from the I come from the kingdom hall, so of Jehovah's Witness.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm raised against the church, right?
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_04: Um, they teach us not to believe in the church.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_04: So I don't want anything growing up.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_04: I already know, you know, if if I'm gonna be a part of any religious group, it's not gonna be the church.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_04: I'm going back to the kingdom hall.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_04: And so this is the mindset, right?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_04: Church is not even in my future.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_04: And uh on the journey, God speaks to me, Elsa, in a strange way, about going to visit a friend of mine whose father was a pastor.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_04: And he says, I want you, I want you to go.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_04: I'm hearing this voice just as clear.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_04: I want you to go to church and see Ronnie.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_04: That was my friend's name.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_04: And so I I I, you know, when you're in a broken place, you're trying to get you're trying to get help from anywhere that you can get it.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_04: Whether you realize it or not, you know, and so I never I I never Forget going and it was a small church, a little storefront church.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_04: And Ronnie, who was my friend, wasn't there, so I was going to leave.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_04: And then I hear, you know, the voice again.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_04: Now I realize the Holy Spirit.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_04: And the Holy Spirit said, no, stay and listen to the I want you to hear the message.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_04: So the youth pastor was ministering.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_04: So he ministered.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_04: And it really touched my heart, things that he was talking about, because I was experiencing all of those things.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_04: It was a traditional Baptist church.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_04: I'll never forget the pastor got up and they traditionally put a chair in the aisle and they began to sing the song Come to Jesus.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_04: And I love the song.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_04: It made me cry.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't know what the chair was for.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_04: But I knew what he was saying and singing, I wanted.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_04: I needed it.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_04: I had to have it.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_04: And so I knew his father, not as a pastor, but I kind of we grew up together playing.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_04: I grew up in their home.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_04: And so I walked up to him and I said, you know, I don't know what you're doing.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_04: I said, but I want it.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_04: And then that's how I ended up, you know, joining the church.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_04: And uh, you know, I had that church joy for a season.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I thought every everything is about to be perfect now.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_04: You know, everything is about to be good.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_04: And um I started amazingly, right shortly after after I um joined, um, I would, you know, I would start talking to people on the street about God.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_04: I was just on fire also.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_04: I was like, I was so excited about what was happening in my life.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_04: I started um just talking to people on the street and meeting people, you know.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_04: I grew up to have a witness.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_04: So, you know, we were trained to go door to door, you know.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_04: One thing I was trained in is to witness.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_04: And so I had this, you know, this moment in my life, you know, and I just come out of homelessness, people trying to kill me, me wanting to kill myself.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_04: And so I have this excitement and I have this zeal.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm telling everybody about this church and how it's gonna change your life.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_04: So this little storefront that probably sat 25 chairs in it, yeah, would have start having people standing on the wall on Sunday.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and so I remember the uh pastor asked me one day, he says, Um, he says, What are you doing?
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_04: What do you, you know, and I said, I'm I'm just sharing, I'm just sharing.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_04: And he said, Well, on Tuesday night, our Bible study, I want you to get up for 10 to 15 minutes and share with the congregation what you're doing so the rest of us can do what you're doing.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_04: And so I told him, I said, I said, No, I, you know, I don't want to do that because I had so many insecurities.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't want to stand in front of people.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't know how, I didn't I didn't know how to flow like that.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_04: I was very comfortable talking on the streets, you know, to a person.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but I wasn't comfortable um standing in front of an audience.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_04: And so, you know, he said, No, you know, you can do it.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_04: And so he, you know, he he pushed me to do it.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_04: And um shortly after that, um, you know, there were some things that rose up, spirit of envy and jealousy.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_04: And man, I ended up getting crushed in that church.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_04: And um, you know, it was quite interesting because the enemy started talking to me about everything I was taught about the church, and now you can't go back to your family.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_04: Because my family, it's crazy.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_04: They gave me a harder time going to church than they did when I sold drugs.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_02: Wow, wow.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_04: You know, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's gotta be so had to have been so disheartening.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, yeah, it was.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_04: And so by the time I was hurt um by this church, I remember when I left out, I was sitting in my vehicle.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_04: And I I mean, I was crying so bad, I couldn't even see out my windshield.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_04: I had to pull over because the pain was so intense, because I felt the same old pain.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_04: It's like it never left.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_04: And it liked it in that moment, it came back in a greater measure because I already I had already been rejected by my family.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_04: Because by now, you have to understand they still haven't received me back.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I go from selling drugs to homelessness to now I'm in church, and they real, it seems like they matter about the church thing, you know.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_04: And so now, you know, the enemy is telling me they were right.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_04: And so I'm going through this process.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_04: But I was working, I had gotten this job as an intern at this engineering firm at the time.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_04: And it was a guy there, and he was going to a revival.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_04: And um that following that happened on a Sunday night, that Monday, he invited me to go um to this meeting.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_04: Everything in me, I didn't want to go, but I wanted to go because I had fell in love with God again.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_04: And I didn't know what to do or where I would go, uh, because that was the only church that I knew.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_04: So when he invited me to this revival, you know, I went and um uh man, you're talking about, I thought this stuff is radical, man.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it was packed, it was a lot of people, and these and they were doing something called prophecy, prophesying to people saying, This is what God is saying and this is what's going on.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_04: And so I laughed at it.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_04: I said, I saw people falling out.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_04: I said, This stuff is not real, you know.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_04: I said, This is this is this is funny.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_04: They were dressed in real fine suits.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_04: I said, Man, they reminded me of my father, right?
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_04: Of course, and he was a real dude.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_04: So um, you know, I laughed.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_04: I said, if this is real, God, if this is real, because you gotta remember, I'm coming now from Jehovah's Witness streets.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_04: I go to church, but I'm in a little storefront church.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_04: Everybody's kind of broken in there.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_04: Now I'm around people, and and you see, you know, every bright lights and cameras.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_04: And so I say, if it's real, have them have them come get me.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_04: If it's real.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_04: They walked right up that aisle.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_04: It had to be, it had to be at least 800 people in that room.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_04: They walked right up to the aisle that I was in.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_04: So, you know, of course, I started looking the other way now.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_04: I'm nervous.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_04: And uh they say, young man, can I minister to you?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_04: And so I'm I'm trying, I'm acting like, you know, they can't be talking to me.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_04: Somebody tapped me on the shoulder, and of course they were talking to me.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, as I as we were going down this aisle, I kept saying to myself, I wish I would fall out on the floor.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_04: I wish I would.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_04: And when we got down there, I'll never forget the words.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_04: He says, God has God has this dual calling on your life.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_04: He said, From your mother's womb, you were chosen.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_04: God's gonna use you mightily.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_04: Now you have to remember all of what I've been through.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm laughing.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_04: This is this is funny to me.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_04: I see you.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um, he doesn't know I, you know, I'm I've just come out of homelessness.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I'm living with my grandma now, and he says, I see you with this beautiful home in the suburbs.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_04: God is going to bless you with businesses.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_04: I see cars not just in your garage, but coming out, right?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_04: I, you know, I got a little hoopty.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_04: I'm driving a little outside.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_04: And so he's talking about all these fabulous things, and then he gets to the to the nitty-gritty, and he says, You were dropped, you were crushed, your birth mother was murdered.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_04: I'm on the floor.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, yeah.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_04: My legs, it was like I had no legs.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_04: I couldn't make this stuff up.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_04: Wow.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I couldn't receive any any other thing he was saying.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_04: And so that has really also formed me in ministry today because when I minister, I'm also making sure that I get to the nitty-gritty.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_04: That it's not, you know, form and fashion and just success and cars and things and stuff.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_04: Because when he was saying that stuff to me, that stuff meant nothing to me else.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I was, you know, I'm like, I'm dealing with some deeper stuff.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_04: And uh, but when he hit it, you know, I hit the I hit the floor and uh I never forget it, you know, life changing.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_04: From then on, I ended up joining that ministry and I started going to morning prayer um every morning at 6 a.m.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_04: with the women.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_04: It would be about six older women there praying.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_04: And that's where I began to have my epiphany and that spiritual encounter with Jesus in such a way, it changed my life because it was during a time of prayer and fasting um that he took me on a journey.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_04: I'll never forget.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_04: He grabbed my hand and he said to me, He said, Clarence, I'm gonna show you some things.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_04: I probably was on the 25th day of my fast and he took me back to my past.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_04: Guess where he took me, Elsa?
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_04: I was he took me back to the bathroom.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, come on.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_04: When I was in the bathroom with him, and I just knew you and it's amazing.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_04: When you're in the when you're in this, you know, I've had several um out of bodies experiences now where I went to heaven and where I've seen Jesus.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_04: When you see him, you don't see him.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_04: You just there's annoying.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_04: In heaven, everything is annoying.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_04: So even even even when he when when when he spoke to me, there was no face.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_04: There was so you just knew.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_04: And so there was no, there was no mouth moving.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_04: There was a knowing, right?
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_04: So he said, Clarence, I'm gonna show you something.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_04: And I was sitting on the toilet as a little boy, and it was a dark cloud over my head that looked like a monster.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_04: And that dark cloud came, started speaking to me, and as I was receiving from that cloud, that cloud came down and wrapped his arms around me until he became one with me.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_04: That's when that demon came in.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_04: And then in that moment, that moment, he said, he was able to come in because you gave him access through anger, through unforgiveness, through bitterness.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_04: And he said, Today you have to let all that go.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_04: And it began to come out in layers.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_04: I'll never forget it.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_04: Right it right in my bedroom, and it changed my life forever.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_04: And one thing I learned, many people are trying to move forward without dealing with things that are behind them.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my, you said so many important things there, Clarence.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my goodness.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: And and I think, you know, something that people should really be paying attention to, and what you said, everything, of course, but um that when you allow, when you open yourself up, you know, with uh carrying anger, carrying resentment, carrying all of those things, those are inlets, right?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_03: For for Satan just to to come in and just to rehab, right?
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_03: And boy, oh boy, uh he didn't he didn't know who who you had on your side, did he?
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_03: He must have been a pool of out.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_04: Oh my goodness.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_04: I think God, Elsa.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_04: And it's crazy because as a child, I was a very loving child.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_04: You know, the hugs I give out now, I used to do that when I was a child until that didn't happen.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_03: It's like he returned you to the real you, right?
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_03: He brought you back to the real you, and you have this beautiful, beautiful family that gets to reap all of the rewards of them.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_03: What a blessing.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my goodness.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so talk to me um a little bit about you know, I I guess the term we use for it is like imposter syndrome.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_03: And I and I'm just wondering.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_03: So as somebody who came to faith very late in life, we're talking about within the past five years, um, and then because of my social media, um, I was uh similar to you, not nearly as gifted as you by any means, um, as far as um, you know, sharing your your testimony to people and all of them.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_03: But I was like you in that I was so excited that I just wanted to share with everyone uh what I discovered, you know, this new invention that I discovered.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_03: Um of course I'm joking when I say I discovered.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_04: No, no, no, I get it.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_04: It's a new discovery for us.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: Exactly.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, and I felt that they still do feel that same joy and excitement.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but there was also this awkwardness and this um fear of because I don't know enough, because I haven't been doing this forever, and the deni, and because I don't know the Bible inside out.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_03: Who am I to think that I have the audacity to talk to people about God and about Jesus and about faith and all these like and it's that imposter syndrome.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_03: Did you ever um, as part of your journey, did you deal with that at all?
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_03: Were you or were you just so convicted that you were able to stay the course?
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I um I had such uh I I think mine came from an authentic desire to want to see other people free because I was, oh my goodness.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like crying right now.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: Just you make me cry, don't do it, I'll cry too.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it felt when you've gone through that darkness for so long and you feel like you're unlovable, and you feel like you're in the world all by yourself.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_04: And one of the things that I experienced when I was uh on the streets of Detroit, homeless, is I met a lot of other people that were broken, good people.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, sometimes just sitting at the bus stop with them because we didn't have anywhere else to sit, um sharing something, um, to eat.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_04: So my desire was always to run to the street and minister to people.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and so I did it, I did it from several places.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_04: I did it from a heart of compassion.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I did it from a place of remembrance, you know, always had to remember where God brought us from.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_04: And I love that and then I did it from a place of wanting to see people delivered and healed, like I had gotten my breakthrough.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_04: Because when I was in it, I didn't believe it was possible.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_04: So I love convincing people, especially broken people, that it's that it's a possibility.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_04: And so I would uh go out and minister to the homeless people and I minister to prostitutes.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_04: And a lot of times I would feed them before I would minister to them because I knew that they were physically hungry.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_04: And that we would sit and we would fellowship and I would see people get healed and delivered.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_04: And they didn't, they didn't need they didn't need theology.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um they didn't need religion.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_04: I couldn't offer them theology at the time because I didn't know the Bible like like that.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I couldn't offer them religion, the church, Christian religion that I was new in because I didn't know it like that.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_04: But this one thing I did know was my experience with Jesus.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_04: And that's one thing when it's authentic, can't anybody take away from you.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_04: And um in my experience with that, you know, it's really interesting because I wanted to, I felt inadequate at times as I as I as I would go to church.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_04: In church, I felt inadequate.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_04: In in the world ministering people, I didn't feel inadequate.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's so interesting.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_04: And so and so I said, you know, I said, well, you know, God, you know, if you if you want me to minister, you know, witness to people, I say, you know, I say, I'm gonna go, you know, I'm gonna go to school.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_04: And I'll never forget the Lord put on my heart and says, I don't want you to go to school right now.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_04: I want I want you to help at the ministry.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_04: So literally I cleaned toilets at the ministry, I vacuumed the carpet at the ministry, I picked the paper.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_04: I did things that most people didn't want to do, even if they were asked to do it.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_04: And uh I'll never forget, and and that was for about two or three years.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_04: And after, I think it was about the third year, God says, Okay, son, you know, your desire is to go to school, you can go to ministry school.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_04: I never forget.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I got in school and I started going um uh to the to the classes that we had to attend.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember for a season being detached because it was more mechanical than it was what I was accustomed to experiencing.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_04: Because I've been going to prayer now, you know, almost three straight years, 6 a.m.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_04: morning prayer, five days a week with these older women.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm praying, I'm fasting, I'm I'm in the you know, I'm experiencing the presence of God, I'm witnessing the real people in the street, and now I'm learning the mechanics of ministry and the mechanics of the word, which is what you need, you know, as you mature and understand to be able to articulate and and uh um exege the text and do all of those wonderful things that people think are so wonderful.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_04: And they have explains.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not knocking it, but the core of it is what I got on the street when I got delivered when I had an experience with Jesus.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_04: And so now I give people the experience with Jesus, even though I can exege the text.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_04: That makes sense.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_03: It makes perfect sense.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_03: And and I, you know, and I love what you said about um that you were willing to, you know, clean the bathrooms and then take out the garbage and do all of those things because I I it was instilled on me uh early on in going to church in our pastor.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_03: I remember him saying, like, if if you're not willing to serve in the smallest ways, how is God gonna why would God trust you to serve in the biggest, you know, ways?
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_03: And so if you're not willing to do the little things, the things, you know, if you think things are beneath you, yeah, you know.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I I love that you you had a heart for that and and just an inherent understanding of that.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's just amazing to me because I think, like you said, a lot of people, you know, they don't want to do those jobs.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_03: They can be picked for those.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_03: They want to do the big things, not the little things.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_04: And you know the horrible thing about that, Elsa?
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_04: The horrible thing is I was attacked in church by other by leaders who would laugh at me and talk about me and would be funny and go get the mop and hand me the mop.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_04: And yeah, so I had to deal with that level of battles after I had already battled the streets, after I had already had battles with my family.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_04: Oh my god.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_04: You know, then I was put out of the one church.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and now I'm dealing with people ridiculing me for cleaning the toilet, though they don't want to clean the toilet.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so it it the journey was not easy, but it was so worth it.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_04: Um, there was a saying that the Lord would whisper in my ear that I have a song now.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_04: Matter of fact, we're about to we're about to uh release the song pretty soon, but it's called Only Believe.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_04: And that's what he would say to me.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_04: At moments of wanting to throw in the towel, give up.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_04: I would hear him say, Clarence, only believe.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_04: Ohly believe.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_04: So anyway, I meant yeah, I have a whole song on it now.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_03: I'm already, I'm already starting.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, keep going, keep going.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's so exciting.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_03: So oh my goodness.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_03: Um talk to me about.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_03: Let's talk about a little bit about the book.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_03: Because, you know, that might be a nice idea.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I can I can listen to your story.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_03: I can all demand.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_03: I I would not do that to you.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's so amazing.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um talk about so let's talk about the title first of all.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um embracing God's power in our weakness.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_03: And and the title alone is so powerful because um we all uh we all feel weak.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_03: We all feel, you know, not good enough, not ready enough, not not anything.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_03: So talk to us about uh embracing God's power in our weakness.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_04: You know, um, like you said a moment ago, as I shared my story and my journey, and you shared a little bit about yours, uh, when we look back uh from where from whence we've come and where we are, we realize now that it was all God.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_04: Even areas where we felt weak.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_04: And then there's areas in our lives where we where we felt strong, but we failed.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_04: We failed in the very thing that we felt strong in.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_04: And yet God uses our weaknesses to cause us, cause us and use us to be able to do great things in our future.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_04: And then he turns around and takes our failures to teach you that we need his strength.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_04: So in Zechariah, when it says it's not by might, nor is it by power, but it's by my spirit, saith the Lord.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_04: And so that's the ingredient that I use to bake this cake in this book, embracing God's power and our weakness.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_04: Because when we all think of our story, we all have different stories, you know, and some are not, you know, as um as uh uh uh uh mine or as yours.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_04: Um but we all have situations, we all have a testimony.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um but when we look back over our lives, we can see, and that's another thing that this book will help with that God has helped me.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_04: He's given me a gift and the ability to help people see how God has been with them, even before they knew that there was such a God.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_04: So when I look back over my life now, I I can see God, you were there, God, you were there.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_04: When there was times I felt like God wasn't there.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_04: You know, think about Daniel going into the lion's den, right?
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_04: In his moment of weakness, he has no control over what's about to happen, but he does what he knows to do.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_04: The Bible says that he goes and prays, that he goes and worships.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_04: And so one of the structures and ingredients that I love about um this book, embracing God's power, how can I do that without being in his presence?
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_04: So the prayer, right?
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_04: Our time of prayer, our time of communing with God, our our worship life, knowing his worth, his worth is what makes me who I am.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_04: So now that humility of knowing that my strength comes from him, that that takes humility.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_04: So the book talks about humility.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_04: Humility is being able to identify no matter how smart I think I am, God gave me the brain, right?
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_04: No matter how much I think I have.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_04: The Bible says God is the giver of gifts to men, no matter my abilities.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_04: So I start identifying that it's all God.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_04: Once I identify that it's all God, I don't walk in pride.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_04: Now, now I I I pride myself in what he has done, not in what I have done.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_04: And now embracing that gives me a supernatural ability and a supernatural power to know that nothing can stop me or hinder me unless I allow pride to come in and I begin to self-elevate.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_04: But as long as I elevate the name of Jesus, as long as I give him praise, the Father said, if you remember me, I'll remember you.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_03: That's such a beautiful redirection from our own destructive thoughts, you know, which is pride.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_03: Pride is a destructive, you know, mindset.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I I respond to that so much because I always remind myself to do everything in humility with you know with a humble mindset.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_03: And anytime I might start doing the yay me, it's like, no, it's not yay me.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't, you know, it's it's this isn't about me.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, and and I love that because I feel like um now, so correct me if I need to be corrected.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_03: Do you feel is weakness something that we should overcome or is it something that we're surrendering to?
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_03: Does that make sense?
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_04: Like, yes, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_04: No, I think it's something when we're trusting God, we can surrender to it because we already know that God is our strength.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_04: Again, you know, in Zechariah 4, 6, it says it's not by might nor is it by power, but it's by his spirit.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_04: So going back to that question, which is a great question, it made me think about David, right?
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_04: Here he is, he's a shepherd's boy, right?
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so this is the weakness.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_04: He's young, right?
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_04: He's not, he's not a mature man yet.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_04: He doesn't have the physical strength of a mature man.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_04: But the Bible says he's had several battles while he's watching over his father's sheep, right?
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_04: The lion comes, the bear comes, and he has he has what would be considered he doesn't have a spear, he doesn't have a gun.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_04: Uh he's a shepherd boy with a few rocks and a bag and a slingshot.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_04: So it represents weakness, right?
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_04: But because he was a worshiper, right?
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_04: Even when he stood behind Goliath, he used his same weapon because when he tried to change his weapon, century uh when the king king saw wanted to give him his his shield right and his sword and and those he he to to show how he was really a boy he couldn't even fit he couldn't even fit the the armor of saul he couldn't even carry the sword the sword was too big it was too heavy but it shows something insignificant which would be a sign or an image of weakness you know goliath looks at it and it's a joke it's like who's this little boy right yeah you come in with a few pebbles and a slingshot that's not gonna do nothing to me but it was the power of God oh my goodness is the shield yeah even in the appearance of weakness strength was there and so I've learned you know when when God tells us the scripture he says listen pray for them that spitefully use you right and I used to wonder God how can you do that right how much does that make right because that gives the appearance of weakness okay I'm embracing my enemy right I'm looking I want better for my enemy when they want my demise and the Lord is showing me right he's showing us that his ways are our ways and so if we can change the image of weakness to meekness right we can see the power of God because now we give God room to come in.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_04: That's why he said vengeance is mine.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_04: They're gonna get it I just don't want you to participate in it.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yes yes can we go back for one minute I just want to repeat I want to repeat something that you just said trade your weakness for meekness.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_03: Yes I love that I feel like Clarence we have to put that on on a shirt on merchandise like I hate I hate to go commercial on you like that that's so you know we're talking about something so big and so beautiful I just went commercial but trade your your weakness for meekness.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_03: That was phenomenal phenomenal and yeah vengeance is mine has been like something that I have had to mutter to myself many many times to like remind myself like it's not on me not on me.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_04: Don't do it don't do it you know and I know I speak for so many people I mean we all we all experience you know those those desires for um vengeance uh in our own hands and and all of that and you know your book is such a it's such a peace bringer like to be able to you know to be able to give over um all of those burdens and all of those things and put it into God's very capable hands um what a relief that is and I love that your book um defines that and explains that and shows that no thank you um who would you say you know you got five people standing in front of your book who who is your book for oh man well I mean I've ever I would generalize I would generalize it first and say of course everybody because everybody can it can it can it can reach corporate all the way down to um uh uh the homeless to you know somebody's dealing with a drug addiction somebody's dealing with you know um uh uh mental battles uh because I've dealt with all these things and in the book we're dealing with so so many different uh sides to it from David dealing with Goliaths from Daniel going into a lion's den um from Moses you know being a little baby being sent down the river in a basket you know not knowing the outcome and what it looks like um uh the downtrodden uh people who are ready to throw in the towel people who uh believe they can't go any further from where they are now you know um I love the fact that when we started uh having this conversation at the beginning as you asked me questions about myself and my journey I want people to understand all of that comes out in this book my purpose for writing this book embracing God's power uh and our weakness because I was once angry you know I I I once dealt with insecurity um I I once wanted to commit suicide so those are three groupings of people that we can reach right there.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_04: Um I didn't think I was intelligent enough.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um I was placed in a learning disability class so I was counted out so this is for those that are counted out you know when when when when when I did the book I did it from the perspective of you know I'm a pastor and so um my reach you know is is limited uh to those four walls unless I come come out of them sure and and so you know my grace I mean you gotta remember my grace is outside of the walls Elsa right right building kind of person you know as I've grown um in my relationship with God in the call of God that that that that individual I told you that that minister who administered to me was saying calling me about this dual anointing that he saw all my life which makes sense because now this this the apostolic calling the missionary calling that was always there right from a little boy being groomed uh to where I am now wanting to just you know that's why people like um um that I favor that I study Dr.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_04: Martin Luther King Jr.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_04: Gandhi um uh uh uh um Mother Teresa right these are people who who who had a heart for the people who cared right who didn't want to give them religion they wanted to give them God they wanted to give them Jesus the father loved us so much that he gave his only begotten son right and so this is why this is why I wrote the book because the book can go further right yeah can be deeper right it's such a heap greater yeah absolutely never never wanted notoriety never look for attention right you're talking about somebody that's just happy to be in the room oh yeah oh I feel that I feel that um you know and because it is such a deeply personal book you I mean you're you're pouring your life and your heart and your experiences into it was there a a chapter or a part that was especially difficult for you to write or were you already in a place where yeah honestly yeah I'm man I'm in a I'm in a good place Elsa I'm in a blessed yeah it it if you notice when I when I talk about my story I come alive yeah you do you do it used to be a time I was embarrassed you know I would never share these things it was embarrassing to say I was adopted or it was embarrassing to say my mother was murdered it was embarrassing to say I had these anger issues it was embarrassing to say I was in a learning disability class no this is all part of the foundation God took what the enemy meant for evil that's why one of my favorite scriptures of Jeremiah 2911 God says I know the plan I know the purpose I know the future that I have for you so when I tell him in his book Embracing God's power and I give all these different illustrations whether it's Daniel whether it's David whether it's Abraham whether it's Moses these these men and women in this book had had in had inadequacies they they had weaknesses all of them ran from Jesus himself got into the Garden of Gethsemane and when he saw what he was going to have to go through next he was like whoa wait a minute he said father let this assignment let this cup pass by me right yeah but then he said nevertheless my assignment that I do now it's not it's not easy it's a it's a life of sacrifice but it's worth it so worth it because everybody don't get it right I have people I have people that's so hurt that they they reject the help I have people that's so hurt that they put me in the category of other people that have hurt them.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah yeah right I get that yeah okay yeah go ahead I'm sorry y'all no no no wait no you're uh it just yes I I hear it and I see it and I see it in comments and I and I see and you and I I love your understanding that where they're coming from you know instead of being defensive and and angry which is which is a natural reaction and I think a lot of people go right there like you know how dare you or you know no you're wrong um you come from such a place of uh compassion and understanding for their hurt and and it it does take somebody who has had the deepest kinds of hurt uh as part of their life experience to be able to um have that level of compassion and just to go ahead.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_04: No I was gonna say if if they're healed.
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_04: If they're healed yeah because there are there are a lot of people that have the same conversation even in the church Elsa that that preach teach pastor people who have great stories but the trauma's still there.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah they're not healed.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_04: They're not happening is hurting people hurt people.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_04: So true when we hear these stories about because it doesn't matter the title of a person right it can be a governor or president it could be a mayor could be a bishop an apostle a prop titles are titles right and sometimes titles bring entitlement yeah but it doesn't necessarily mean what I'm sharing I've been delivered from so what I hear you sharing is is that I'm healed.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yes that is so so true.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_03: I know in my experience and I you can probably relate to it triple time um you know I I I find that any of the negative and mean nasty rotten whatever things that people hostile things that people can say and on the internet they certainly say it.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yes I'm sure right I have found that I'm so unfazed and and that's the part that actually amazes me that I'm unfazed.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like this should bother me this should make me angry this should make me healed yeah I like I'm I'm so healed like I already know I know who's I am and and when you when you know your actual identity of of who you belong to that's who says who you are not somebody on the internet or see you know what I mean so I love that I love the way that you've said that that it's because um because you're healed because I'm healed and that's so powerful so so powerful and don't you just want that for everyone what a beautiful yeah what an amazing world we would have if we could all just be you know accept healing uh and allow that into our life and and I love that your book um has the tools so to speak in it to help people find that because I think it's what exudes from you uh as a person and not just when you speak but of course your your words in print um to read that and to hear and to know uh and to get that rounded experience of somebody who's been through the fire so to speak right um and and can say listen I'm not just saying it because my life is completely good you know it's been it's been hard as heck and then some right they thank God for the reward elsewhere.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yes yes oh my goodness but you you just give so much hope and you and like I said you just exude uh just this this tremendous joy and and I'm so excited for people to to listen to you and to hear you and of course to read your book and I would be remiss to not mention um that you are uh a pro prolific author author you have multiple books out so there there's three correct this is excellent and there's going to be a song out soon as well yeah like December yes so excited for that yes by December yes yes that's the that's the by date right maybe before would you even meet later um will you tell everyone where they can find you your books if you're doing appearances um anywhere where they can find you and of course guys before he tells you I will have it in the show notes so don't worry it'll be in there you'll be able to click it but go ahead and tell everybody where they can find you yes you can uh find me on Clarence Langston um uh that's my uh website that me on Amazon Barnes and Nobles uh just to name a few you'll be able to find um the uh books as well and um clarencelangston.com that's the website beautiful yes oh my goodness this was such a joy I literally I've already over over time your I've enjoyed it I was I was gonna say hey Elsa I was gonna say hey we we need to do this again look yes yeah I could listen to you all day I honestly could I it it's such a joy to hear your experiences and your your willingness to to share and not only share but share for the the betterment of other people it's a beautiful gift you have and Elsa before you uh close out can I share one thing that I think is important please do is is you know the outcome of the story when I look at my life now and um I look at my my beautiful wife I married an attorney um just beautiful inside out she helps me in ministry now uh my daughter just graduated from uh an Ivy Lee school she's on her way she's just been accepted at Columbia she's been accepted at um Georgetown she's she's going to medical school um my sons are twins both of them are uh in one of the uh most prestigious um Catholic high schools here um in the state of Michigan uh my ministry I have a campus with a gymnasium a full school administration building two football fields baseball diamonds author of a book um uh entrepreneur um uh uh I mean I can go on and on how God has blessed me uh beautiful home beautiful life that's what the story looks like now yeah touching people all around the world you know and it's a story you never could have imagined no way there's no way no way no way oh so beautiful and so uh reassuring for anyone who is in the darkest places of their life right now that this is not where you have to stay and God has a bigger plan and you're a living testament of that so thank you for sharing all of that you're quite welcome thank you for having me Elsa absolutely all right my friends thank you so much for joining us today we'll have all of those links in the show notes for you and we will see you in the next episode.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_03: Take care.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_00: You've got a story worth sharing.
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's time to tell it well whether you're an author entrepreneur influencer or podcast guest stepping in front of the camera or microphone can feel overwhelming.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_00: On the other side of the mic is your practical encouraging guide to becoming a confident authentic and engaging interviewee written by media personality and best selling author Elsa Kurt this book blends real world wisdom from hundreds of interviews with a touch of humor, grace and heart.
• 58:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's more than a how to it's a roadmap to presence, professionalism and peace in every conversation