Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Three arrests in Mom Crystal Rogers Death, but WHERE IS CRYSTAL?

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Three arrests in Mom Crystal Rogers Death, but WHERE IS CRYSTAL? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A gorgeous young mom goes
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: missing and it took years before her boyfriend, the father
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: of one of her children, is finally arrested for murder.
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  Speaker 1: In the last hours, two major rulings in the Crystal
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Rogers case, Kentucky's highest courts rule against the boyfriend, Brooks Hawk.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thanks for being
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: with us here at Crime Stories and Sirius xem one eleven.
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  Speaker 1: In the last days, a pair of appellate court decisions
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  Speaker 1: go against Brooks Hawk, charged with the murder of Crystal Rogers.
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  Speaker 1: This beautiful Bardstown mom of five reported missing July twenty fifteen.
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  Speaker 1: How the last one to see her alive, claiming he
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  Speaker 1: fell asleep beside her in bed and woke up in
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  Speaker 1: poof she was gone. Did anybody really believe that? In
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  Speaker 1: the last days of Kentucky appeals court rules how it
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  Speaker 1: will stay in jail on a ten million dollar bond
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  Speaker 1: and that's just where he needs to be. I agree
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  Speaker 1: with the court. His lawyers filed an appeal just hours
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  Speaker 1: after Howke's judge said the bond was reasonable to assure
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  Speaker 1: he would not flee The court of Appeals reviewed the
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  Speaker 1: ruling and affirmed it. But why what are the facts
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: surrounding this case? With me right now? Investigative Journalists podcast
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  Speaker 1: producer Jessica Nol With Me investigative reporter with whas n Louisville.
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  Speaker 1: They are responsible for Bardstown Podcast. You can find it
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  Speaker 1: at www dot Bartstown podcast dot com. To you, Jessica,
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  Speaker 1: tell me about Crystal Rogers? Who is she? Who was she?
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  Speaker 2: Well?
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  Speaker 3: Crystal Rogers was a thirty five year old mother of five.
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  Speaker 3: She had lived and grown up in Bartstown her whole life,
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  Speaker 3: and she was dating a man by the name of Brooks.
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  Speaker 3: How they had a child together, and she seemingly vanished
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  Speaker 3: July third, twenty fifteen, and her car was found on
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  Speaker 3: the popular roadway through Kentucky Bluegrass Parkway a couple of
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  Speaker 3: days later, and her purse, her cell phone, everything that
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: a woman would keep with her was found in her car,
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  Speaker 3: her unlocked car. And she's not been seen since.
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  Speaker 1: And as of right now, we don't know what has
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  Speaker 1: become of Crystal Rogers. If she's did, we don't know
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: her mode of death or cause of death. Take a
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: listen to this.
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  Speaker 4: You had a little fire, when was that? After you
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  Speaker 4: took your walk or before you took your walk.
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  Speaker 5: I know we fed the call spins, because I want
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  Speaker 5: to do that as quickly while we had still plenty
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  Speaker 5: of day when I don't know if I lift the
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  Speaker 5: fire before we walked back here right when I got back,
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  Speaker 5: I could have done it either or I don't remember.
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  Speaker 6: After the fire and with their toddler in tow, Brookes
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  Speaker 6: says he and Crystal take a walk.
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  Speaker 4: Did you go straight home on Friday night or did
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  Speaker 4: y'all stop somewhere or because I'm thinking if that's their
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  Speaker 4: normal seven eight o'clock in the evening, it might be
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  Speaker 4: dinner time. Did you stop and eat something or did
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  Speaker 4: you go straight home?
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  Speaker 7: And we did not eat anything.
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  Speaker 4: I went straight home.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, you're hearing the boyfriend Brooks hout and he's speaking
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: to Detective Snow. Now, let me understand something. To Shay McCallister,
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: investigative reporter with wh AS in Louisville, the boyfriend says
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  Speaker 1: he goes for a walk with Crystal and the little
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  Speaker 1: baby at midnight.
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  Speaker 2: That's what he did, tells police.
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  Speaker 8: He says they went down to feed the cows.
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  Speaker 2: But Sherry Ballard, Crystal's mom.
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  Speaker 8: Has had a big problem with this since the beginning.
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  Speaker 8: She says that it was very rainy that night, and
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  Speaker 8: there's just no way Crystal would have wanted to be
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  Speaker 8: walking around the farm, much less with her baby.
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  Speaker 1: Whose farm was it?
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  Speaker 8: It was Hauke's mom's farm. So brooks Houke's mom, Rosemary Hauke,
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  Speaker 8: has a huge farm on the outskirts of Bardstown and
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  Speaker 8: that's where they say they were.
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  Speaker 1: So did brooks Houke's mother see Crystal there with the
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  Speaker 1: baby that night?
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  Speaker 8: We don't have any kind of recordings of her police interviews,
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  Speaker 8: and she has never given us an interview. I don't know.
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  Speaker 1: Have you tried Have you tried to talk to her?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, we have tried to talk to her.
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  Speaker 8: We've seen her in court multiple times over the years.
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  Speaker 8: She's always there when Brooks is in court or at
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  Speaker 8: custody hearings for that little boy, and we have definitely
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  Speaker 8: tried to talk to her.
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  Speaker 1: Very interesting. So she's on a date I guess you
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  Speaker 1: could call it with her boyfriend and he thinks it's
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  Speaker 1: a good thing to take her to feed the cows
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  Speaker 1: at midnight with the baby. Do I am I understanding
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  Speaker 1: this correctly? Jessica know that is correct.
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  Speaker 3: But I what's interesting about the clip that you just ran,
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  Speaker 3: And someone pointed out that he actually says in that clip,
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  Speaker 3: I went home. He doesn't say we, which I thought
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  Speaker 3: was kind of interesting for someone to hear when they
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  Speaker 3: were listening to that, because I didn't pick that up.
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  Speaker 3: He says we didn't get anything to eat. But then
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  Speaker 3: he says I went home.
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  Speaker 1: Take a listen to Brooks how a detective snow.
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  Speaker 4: I probably I probably woke.
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  Speaker 9: Up around you know, in between that time NYT six
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  Speaker 9: or seven o'clock and then I left. You know, I
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  Speaker 9: got did my normal thing to you know, change my clothes,
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  Speaker 9: put my clothes.
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  Speaker 7: On, and and and headed out, you know, shortly after that.
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  Speaker 4: You know, So you get up between six and seven,
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  Speaker 4: and where's he at? When you wake up? He's next
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  Speaker 4: to me. He's in the bed with you. Okay, so
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  Speaker 4: you get up? Does he get up with you?
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  Speaker 7: He's still he's still asleep on ever eye whenever I
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  Speaker 7: get up. But I go to uh, you know, the
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  Speaker 7: bathroom and all that kind of stuff, and he's still sleeping, uh,
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  Speaker 7: sleeping there on the bed.
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  Speaker 2: But Crystal isn't there when he gets up.
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  Speaker 5: Yes, I noticed, I mean I noticed that she wasn't there,
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  Speaker 5: and I didn't know what was I didn't know exactly
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  Speaker 5: what to.
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  Speaker 10: I don't know what time I called her.
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  Speaker 11: Yes, I called her that morning.
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  Speaker 6: Brooks takes his son to the farm, but his lack
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  Speaker 6: of concern for Crystal's whereabouts gives the detective pause, and
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  Speaker 6: he probes, if I.
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  Speaker 12: Woke up on a Saturday morning and my wife wasn't
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  Speaker 12: with me in the.
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  Speaker 4: Bed as is normal, if she were not, probably the
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  Speaker 4: first thing I would do would be to call her
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  Speaker 4: to find out where she was.
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  Speaker 1: Interesting, you are hearing Brooks, how the boyfriend of Crystal Rogers,
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  Speaker 1: the father of their child, and Detective snow speaking. I'm
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  Speaker 1: gonna circle back to what we were just listening to,
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  Speaker 1: but take a listen to our friends. Is w d
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  Speaker 1: r B.
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  Speaker 10: Another Crystal Rogers went missing and still no answers books Houk.
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  Speaker 7: Was named the number one suspect of my daughter's disappearance,
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  Speaker 7: and it makes me feel good to think that people
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  Speaker 7: out there believe the same thing that I do.
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  Speaker 13: It refers to a statement Brooks help made to w
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  Speaker 13: d r B.
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  Speaker 14: You know to day.
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  Speaker 10: That's what I've done, and they know in their.
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  Speaker 15: Heart what happened.
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  Speaker 1: That's where our friends at w D r B. Jackie,
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  Speaker 1: could you play cut three one more time?
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  Speaker 9: I probably I probably woke up around you know, in
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  Speaker 9: between that time they six or seven o'clock and then
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  Speaker 9: I left. You know, I got did my normal thing
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  Speaker 9: because you know, change my clothes, put my clothes on,
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  Speaker 9: and and uh and.
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  Speaker 7: Headed out, you know, shortly after that.
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  Speaker 4: You know, So you get up between six and heaven
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  Speaker 4: and where's Eli at When you wake up? He's next
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  Speaker 4: to me. He's in the bed with you. Okay, so
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  Speaker 4: you get up? Does he get up with you?
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  Speaker 7: He's still he's still asleep on ever I whenever I
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  Speaker 7: get up, but I go to uh, you know, the
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  Speaker 7: bathroom and all that kind of stuff, and he's still sleeping, uh,
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  Speaker 7: sleeping there on the bed.
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  Speaker 2: But Crystal isn't there when he gets out.
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  Speaker 5: Yes, I noticed, I mean I noticed that she wasn't there.
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  Speaker 5: I didn't know what was I didn't know exactly what
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  Speaker 5: to I don't know what time I called her. Yes,
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  Speaker 5: I called her that morning.
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  Speaker 6: Brooks takes his son to the farm, but his lack
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  Speaker 6: of concern.
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  Speaker 2: For Crystal's whereabouts gives the detective pause.
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  Speaker 12: If I woke up on a Saturday morning and my
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  Speaker 12: wife wasn't with me in the bed as is normal.
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  Speaker 4: If she were not, probably the first thing I would
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  Speaker 4: do would be to call her to find out where
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  Speaker 4: she was.
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  Speaker 1: See McAllister, I'm hearing them talking about the Hawk brothers.
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  Speaker 1: There's more than one of them.
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  Speaker 13: Yes, there is.
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  Speaker 8: There are two Help brothers. There's Nick Help, older of
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  Speaker 8: the two. He was a Bardstown police officer when Crystal
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  Speaker 8: went missing, and then his younger brother, Brooks Hawk with
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  Speaker 8: Crystal's boyfriend.
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  Speaker 1: So is he is the brother still with the police force.
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  Speaker 8: He is not. He was fired just a few months
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  Speaker 8: after Crystal went missing. Nick interfered with the investigation. He
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  Speaker 8: actually called his brother Brooks while he was in an
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  Speaker 8: interrogation room with police.
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  Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, take a listen to this.
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  Speaker 6: The interview is interrupted when Brooks gets a call from
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  Speaker 6: his older brother, Nick Hawk, the Bardstown police officer.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm up here. I don't know that you didn't know.
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  Speaker 11: I'm up here in this interview with the detective. Detective Snow.
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  Speaker 11: I've been up here a good little while. I'm feeling
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  Speaker 11: out this this statement here and everything you know, you
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  Speaker 11: tell me that's there. He tell me that's what I
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  Speaker 11: need to do.
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  Speaker 4: I know, I know, I don't.
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  Speaker 16: I know, I'm not I know that.
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  Speaker 7: But the one is that I look at it is
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  Speaker 7: that I'm innocent.
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  Speaker 4: I ain't done nothing wrong.
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  Speaker 7: Well, you know, I know you've told me innocent. People
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  Speaker 7: have got jammed up. But if you're telling me to leave,
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  Speaker 7: I'll get up and leave if you want me to,
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  Speaker 7: if you want me to. I know I'm gonna through
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  Speaker 7: a lot, but I'm trying to get this guy to
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  Speaker 7: help me.
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  Speaker 10: I don't think.
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  Speaker 11: I don't think she's ran off with some other guy.
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  Speaker 17: I don't.
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  Speaker 4: I don't believe that. You can't make me think that. Yeah,
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  Speaker 4: I mean, I mean, I mean, so do.
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  Speaker 7: I'll do exactly what you're telling me to do.
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  Speaker 4: Right now.
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  Speaker 7: Do you want me to get up and leave?
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  Speaker 1: Well, that's exactly what he did. That's Brooks how the boyfriend,
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  Speaker 1: the lover of Crystal Rogers now missing with Detective Snow
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  Speaker 1: And as a matter of fact, he did get up
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  Speaker 1: and leave. Mm hmmmmmmmm. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. You know,
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: a lot of people thought, since Hawk had seemingly gotten
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: away with the murder since twenty fifteen, that he would
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  Speaker 1: be out of jail in no time, and no bond
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  Speaker 1: could hold him. Hold on just a moment. He's sitting
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  Speaker 1: tight in jail at Kentake Appeals Court has ruled against him,
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  Speaker 1: affirming his ten million dollar bond. The facts behind this
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  Speaker 1: case so upsetting. Officer Howk calls his brother and tells
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  Speaker 1: him to leave. After that, Nick Hawk's boss, the police chief,
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  Speaker 1: orders him to talk to detectives, and according to an
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  Speaker 1: FBI polygraph examiner who tells Nick Hawk in a police
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  Speaker 1: interrogation video quote, it's pretty clear you haven't told me
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  Speaker 1: the complete truth, and the questions you're having problems with
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  Speaker 1: are questions about Crystal, in particular whether or not you
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: know where she is right now. Explain that to me,
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: jessicall what happened?
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  Speaker 3: So, the FBI polygraph examiner tells Nick how the police
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  Speaker 3: officer at that time, that he is not being truthful
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  Speaker 3: with him, and that whole interaction just really begins to escalate,
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  Speaker 3: and he at one point asks him as Nick is
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  Speaker 3: getting audibly frustrated with him because he's calling him a
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  Speaker 3: liar essentially, at one point, the FBI polygraph examiner says,
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  Speaker 3: is this how you acted towards Crystal? And he obviously
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: begins yelling at that point. So there is something, and
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  Speaker 3: you know better than us that polygraphic examiners aren't always
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: one hundred percent, but there was something.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: There was enough.
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  Speaker 3: Of not telling the truth that set off their radar,
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  Speaker 3: and that he was not being truthful when he was
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: talking about Crystal, about her disappearance, about Brooks possibly telling
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: him something about him having any involvement, he was not
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  Speaker 3: being truthful according to their examination.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to this.
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  Speaker 4: Well, Nick, I've had a chance to review your charts
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  Speaker 4: on that test.
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  Speaker 16: That first test you I did not pass the test.
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  Speaker 17: And it's pretty clear to.
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  Speaker 10: Me that you have complete truth.
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  Speaker 4: Is that the question you're having a problem with.
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  Speaker 16: Her question is about christ and in particular one about
• 13:46
  Speaker 16: whether or not you know where she's right now, And
• 13:50
  Speaker 16: I don't know. I treat police officers in these circumstances
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  Speaker 16: so like I would myself, so when I can go
• 13:55
  Speaker 16: through all the interview, interrogation, no sense.
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: That you are in the same page.
• 14:00
  Speaker 16: But again, I'm also continue to complete truth be cause
• 14:03
  Speaker 16: we're sitting here and it's no longer a matter of
• 14:06
  Speaker 16: wondering do you know anything about what happened?
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: We're past that now.
• 14:10
  Speaker 16: I mean, I got a crystal player with you. I
• 14:12
  Speaker 16: give everybody a good fair test. I'm no longer asking
• 14:16
  Speaker 16: you if you know you do Now what you wanna
• 14:19
  Speaker 16: do with that is entirely.
• 14:20
  Speaker 17: Up to you.
• 14:21
  Speaker 16: Yell, it's a great match you and get the sick
• 14:23
  Speaker 16: wot's phone book and all that I'm talking to your
• 14:25
  Speaker 16: man demand is the follow on force snobs or uh
• 14:28
  Speaker 16: that the time has come for you to think real
• 14:30
  Speaker 16: hard about the rest of your life.
• 14:34
  Speaker 10: This is you.
• 14:34
  Speaker 16: I'm I talk about Brook to everybody else.
• 14:36
  Speaker 17: Uh, And I'm telling you facts life.
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  Speaker 10: I'm an old guy and I'm trying to be a
• 14:39
  Speaker 10: positive figure here.
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  Speaker 16: But I'll tell you doing this for twenty five years
• 14:43
  Speaker 16: the way that this pans out. But the FBI that
• 14:46
  Speaker 16: gets involved in this investigation, if you're listening one time,
• 14:49
  Speaker 16: you don't have to say anything to me.
• 14:50
  Speaker 4: You do whatever you wanna do.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: As I said, we you may never even.
• 14:55
  Speaker 16: Be an FBI agent, all right, But once you get
• 14:57
  Speaker 16: on the radar, we don't go away unless there are
• 15:00
  Speaker 16: a reason too. I thought there would be Yan passes.
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: And there's some other information there as well, So.
• 15:07
  Speaker 12: I guarantee when not going a lot.
• 15:09
  Speaker 16: All right, The FBI has unlimited resources in terms of
• 15:13
  Speaker 16: forensic information, electronic information. Many bodies who want to ploorative
• 15:20
  Speaker 16: surveillance and look at everything that's ever done on so
• 15:23
  Speaker 16: we'll find crystals.
• 15:25
  Speaker 10: Zer wrote out about that.
• 15:26
  Speaker 6: On July fifteenth, twenty fifteen. Detectives also revealed to Nick
• 15:30
  Speaker 6: they found bodily fluids inside his police cruiser the day
• 15:34
  Speaker 6: after he and Brooks leave the station together and drive
• 15:37
  Speaker 6: to their mom's farm.
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: Have you ever heard of illuminol?
• 15:41
  Speaker 13: A kind of investigation?
• 15:42
  Speaker 9: All right?
• 15:43
  Speaker 10: You know what.
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: Illuminol's used for? Fine blood?
• 15:46
  Speaker 14: Okay?
• 15:46
  Speaker 10: Or other.
• 15:49
  Speaker 13: Fluid?
• 15:50
  Speaker 5: Okay?
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: So we always screed bodily fluids.
• 15:54
  Speaker 10: With you know, vomit anything, you know, a saliva.
• 15:58
  Speaker 18: All that is is what would floor s?
• 16:01
  Speaker 16: Why would why would your trump look like a smurf
• 16:03
  Speaker 16: if they sprayed it?
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: Why would it flor s?
• 16:06
  Speaker 16: Many of you look like the novel?
• 16:09
  Speaker 18: There's no spots in the Trump, in that blanket, I
• 16:11
  Speaker 18: mean just live up like Gernobyl?
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: Why would that?
• 16:14
  Speaker 7: There's not one to be any blood in the Trump?
• 16:16
  Speaker 17: Okay?
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: What and I say blood, I'm talking about.
• 16:18
  Speaker 18: Other bodily fluids.
• 16:19
  Speaker 7: I don't have you other there shouldn't There shouldn't be
• 16:22
  Speaker 7: anybody bodily floods in the trunk.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: WHOA, it's not gonna be any blood. Well, that tells
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: me right there that there's a strong possibility she was asphyxiated.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: She's not going to be any blood, that's the first
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: thing he said. And again everyone has said they're not guilty,
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: that they're innocent in this case, and they have a
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: right to a trial by jury, you know, in many
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: big jurisdictions, and I assume this is true and small
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: as well. Cars are cleaned out at the end of
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: every patrol with cleaner. Let me ask you something to
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: Jessica Nole Investigative Journalists podcast produce Sean McCallister Investigatory Report
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: with w h A S Louisville. Were the fluids left
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: in the patrol car tested and if so, did they
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: match Crystal Rogers.
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: Again, Nancy, a really great question. What we know is
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: what we have heard in these recordings with police. The police,
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: the KSP, I believe the testing may have been done
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: by the FBI, are being very tight lipped about what
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: they have found both in the car in the searches
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: they've done, which you'll hear about this week. They're not
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: telling us what they found or any test results that
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: have come back.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: Wow. Okay, question to Shane McCallister. So, according to the boyfriend, okay,
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: how Crystal, Rogers and the baby are there at his
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: mom's farm that evening. He takes them at midnight to
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: walk down to the cow barn and take care of
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: the cows. They come, He goes, I come home, and
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: then he says the next morning Crystal is gone. When
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: did he report her missing?
• 18:09
  Speaker 8: Brooks Hawk never reports her missing. Actually, her mom reports
• 18:15
  Speaker 8: her missing a few days later when she's had trouble
• 18:20
  Speaker 8: reaching her over the phone, and when she actually runs
• 18:24
  Speaker 8: into Brooks how in town, she asks Brooks, hey, have
• 18:28
  Speaker 8: you seen Crystal?
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: Where do you think she is?
• 18:31
  Speaker 8: And Brooks said, no, I haven't seen her. And Sherry says, well,
• 18:36
  Speaker 8: then I'm going to go report her missing. And Brooks says, yeah,
• 18:40
  Speaker 8: I think you should do that.
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to Brooks house speaking to Detective Snow
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: on this very issue.
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: Brooks runs into Cristel's mom.
• 18:49
  Speaker 7: I met her mother at the gas station somewhere one
• 18:52
  Speaker 7: of these days, her.
• 18:54
  Speaker 11: Mother, Sherry.
• 18:56
  Speaker 7: Cristel's mother, Sherry came up her my window and asked
• 19:01
  Speaker 7: me if I had seen Crystal.
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: And when you told her what, I haven't seen her,
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: don't know where she is, and she just said okay
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: and asked him no.
• 19:11
  Speaker 7: She thought that she thought that the wisest thing for
• 19:14
  Speaker 7: us to do was she said she's going to go
• 19:16
  Speaker 7: to the police station, and then I went home.
• 19:20
  Speaker 6: Meanwhile, Crystal's mom files a missing person's report at the
• 19:24
  Speaker 6: Nelson County Sheriff's office around three pm. Two hours later,
• 19:28
  Speaker 6: her father, Tommy, gets a call Crystal's car has been
• 19:31
  Speaker 6: found along the Bluegrass Parkway. Tommy goes and uncovers her keys, phone,
• 19:37
  Speaker 6: and purse inside. Brooks tells Detective Snow that he wasn't
• 19:41
  Speaker 6: concerned until Sunday because she'd quote done this before.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: Welcome back in the last hours, a guy that seemingly
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: got away with the murder of a mom of five,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers, will stay behind bars. According to a High
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: court in Kentucky, take a listen to this.
• 20:02
  Speaker 19: It's an interest that has everyone's attention. Brooks Hounk, Crystal
• 20:06
  Speaker 19: Roger's boyfriend and the main suspect in her disappearance, charged
• 20:09
  Speaker 19: with her murder and tempering with physical evidence. According to
• 20:13
  Speaker 19: the indictment. The charge of stem from an incident July
• 20:16
  Speaker 19: fourth weekend of twenty fifteen, just days before Crystal's car
• 20:20
  Speaker 19: was found abandoned on the side of the Bluegrass Parkway
• 20:23
  Speaker 19: with her keys, phone, and purse inside. He was named
• 20:27
  Speaker 19: the main suspect within three months, but never charged until today.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: Why so long? You were just hearing our friends at
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: whas it's been a long time coming. And you know
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: what's so irritating? You know, Cheryl mccoum is joining me,
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: director of the Cold Case Research Institute and star of
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: a Hitney series Zone Seven. When I hear and I've
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: heard it over and over countless case is Cheryl McCollum
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: quote everybody needs. I mean, since day one, everyone said, Brooks,
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: how is the killer? Why did it take so long? Auntie?
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: You Cheryl McCollum, have you ever had those cases? And
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: you have to tell every single witness It doesn't matter
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: what everybody says, because very often what everybody says is
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: not true. That's not the killer. It turns out to
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: be someone completely different. But in this case, it's true.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Since the whole thing went down, he has been suspect
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: number one.
• 21:35
  Speaker 15: He's been suspect only one. There hasn't been anybody else.
• 21:39
  Speaker 15: But it's one of those situations what you know and
• 21:41
  Speaker 15: what you can prove is not the same thing. So
• 21:44
  Speaker 15: they had to be patient. They had to work this
• 21:46
  Speaker 15: case from every angle, which is what they did. They
• 21:49
  Speaker 15: got him once for theft, they got people that were
• 21:53
  Speaker 15: close to him for perjury. They even Prance grandma so
• 21:57
  Speaker 15: hard she invoked her Fifth Amendment. So they have worked
• 22:01
  Speaker 15: this thing beautifully. Yeah, as long as they possibly could.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: Cheryl McCollum, you gotta give them credit. It takes a
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: lot of doing to come down so hard on a granny.
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: She takes the fifth right, Okay, that is some serious,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: serious questioning.
• 22:18
  Speaker 15: Straight up the police work.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the so called boyfriend of Crystal Rogers has been arrested,
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: and it has been a long time coming. Take a
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: listen to whas eleven.
• 22:31
  Speaker 19: Federal investigators accused help of intentionally causing the death of
• 22:34
  Speaker 19: Crystal Runchers and destroying, concealing, mutilating, or removing physical evidence
• 22:40
  Speaker 19: and connection to the crime. He was arrested without incident
• 22:43
  Speaker 19: while on a job site outside of Bardstown.
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: Joining me right now anchor wd RB out of Louisville,
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: Falling Glick, thank you for being with us. Fallon, tell
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: me about the arrest well.
• 22:56
  Speaker 13: Brook Chalk, her former boyfriend. He was arrested at a
• 22:59
  Speaker 13: work site and then he was then taken to the
• 23:02
  Speaker 13: Nelson County Jail. We have video of him and handcuffed
• 23:05
  Speaker 13: walking into the jail. Was taken to another county jail
• 23:09
  Speaker 13: called the Harding County Jail, and that is where he
• 23:12
  Speaker 13: is staying currently. And he's not going to get out
• 23:15
  Speaker 13: unless you posts that ten million dollar cash only bond.
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: Okay, ten million dollar cash bond, James shell Nut. That's
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: unlike a lot of bonds where you can put, for instance,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: your house down is collateral. You get one hundred thousand
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: dollars bond. You got to come up with ten thousand
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: dollars money or collateral like a home. But a ten
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: million dollar bond, that's not going to happen anytime soon.
• 23:43
  Speaker 10: No, it's not going to happen anytime soon.
• 23:45
  Speaker 13: Then.
• 23:45
  Speaker 10: You know a lot of times with severe cases you
• 23:47
  Speaker 10: do see a cash bar but even with a cash bond,
• 23:51
  Speaker 10: that's a pretty high cash bond. They must feel pretty
• 23:53
  Speaker 10: confident in the case that they've got against him, and
• 23:56
  Speaker 10: so much the judge to set the bond that high.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: I mean, get real, shell Nut. But if the guy
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: has managed to outsmart police for this many years and
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: the disappearance and death of his girlfriend, Crystal Rogers, I
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: wouldn't let him set one toe outside of that jail
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: house because he could very likely slip away.
• 24:16
  Speaker 10: I wouldn't let him set outside the jail either. You know,
• 24:19
  Speaker 10: this guy has sat and committed potentially a crime against
• 24:25
  Speaker 10: the mother of five children. He's covered it up, He's
• 24:29
  Speaker 10: played games, and this guy's shown he's dangerous and he's
• 24:32
  Speaker 10: a danger to the community.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: And a danger to any potential witnesses. Is why I
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: would let him out on bond. And you said the
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: case is so severe it calls for a high cash bond.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: What do you mean by that? And what is a
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: cash bond as supposed to a regular bondshell Nut.
• 24:46
  Speaker 10: Well, it's severe because he's accused of murdering a mother
• 24:50
  Speaker 10: of five, of potentially covering this murder up taking steps
• 24:55
  Speaker 10: you know. Additionally, you know, we've got some implications as
• 24:58
  Speaker 10: to involvement in some other situation as well. And the
• 25:02
  Speaker 10: cash bond is set so that the judge can ensure that. Yeah,
• 25:06
  Speaker 10: I'm not giving him a no bond. So I'm going
• 25:07
  Speaker 10: to meet the basic constitutional requirements of providing bail. But
• 25:12
  Speaker 10: I will tell you this, if you're going to get out,
• 25:14
  Speaker 10: we're going to be pretty sure that you're coming back.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: Okay, let me Q and A with myself for just
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: a moment. James shell Nutt was asked what's the difference
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: in a cash.
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: Bond and regular bond?
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: Again, in regular bond you can put up collateral like
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: the value of your home. You can put up, for instance,
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: real estate. And a cash bond you got to have cold,
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: hard cash. Everything else shell nut said was dead on. Guys,
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: this has been one long drawn out investigation. I want
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: you to take a listen to Montica parkins WDRB.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: We saw the car pull in through the fence.
• 25:51
  Speaker 19: As he got out of the car, I asked, where
• 25:54
  Speaker 19: is Crystal Rogers.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: He didn't say anything.
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: As he entered the back of the jail.
• 25:58
  Speaker 19: The Nelson County Jail was also on hand.
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: You know, Falling Glick joining me anchor WDRB. Why did
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: the FBI have to be brought in to solve this case?
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: What about local law enforcement? What's the problem, Falling Blick.
• 26:16
  Speaker 13: Well, local law Enforcement, the Sheriff's office. They have been
• 26:20
  Speaker 13: on this since day one, and I think they just
• 26:23
  Speaker 13: didn't have enough resources to pull this case together. And
• 26:28
  Speaker 13: we know Sherry Ballor, the mother of Crystal Rogers, she
• 26:31
  Speaker 13: has been the true champion for her daughter's case, keeping
• 26:35
  Speaker 13: it in the spotlight. And you know, very soon after
• 26:38
  Speaker 13: her daughter disappeared, she asked the FBI to come in,
• 26:41
  Speaker 13: please take over this case, and that didn't happen until
• 26:46
  Speaker 13: five years later. So the FBI, they've been on the
• 26:48
  Speaker 13: case now for three years, and when they come in
• 26:51
  Speaker 13: that late, they have more work to do because they
• 26:55
  Speaker 13: weren't there from day one, and so it has taken
• 26:58
  Speaker 13: a lot of time to pull all this evidence together.
• 27:00
  Speaker 8: Because we know they've.
• 27:02
  Speaker 13: Executed so many surge warrants at the Hawk family properties,
• 27:06
  Speaker 13: the Hawk family farm, you know, that's the three hundred
• 27:09
  Speaker 13: acre farm, so they have been there several times. And
• 27:12
  Speaker 13: then not too long ago, they were at a home
• 27:15
  Speaker 13: that Brooks House has built and they dug up the
• 27:18
  Speaker 13: driveway collected a ton of evidence there. So the evidence
• 27:22
  Speaker 13: that the FBI has had to sort through is unimaginable.
• 27:26
  Speaker 13: I know the prosecutor is saying that they have to
• 27:31
  Speaker 13: turn over two terabytes worth of information in this case,
• 27:35
  Speaker 13: so just a lot to go through here. We don't
• 27:38
  Speaker 13: know what any of that evidence is, but two terabytes
• 27:40
  Speaker 13: were its.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: It's a lot. Back to the question, Cheryl McCollum joining
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: us from Zone seven, Cheryl McCollum, I was asking why
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: the FEDS had to be brought in. That was the question. Now,
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong, Cheryl McCollum. But didn't the
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: boyfriend have relatives and or friends on the local police force?
• 28:02
  Speaker 15: Correct, Nick Hout, And he was fired actually for interfering
• 28:06
  Speaker 15: with a police investigation.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: This investigation, this investigation absolutely so bringing the FBI, I
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: think was the right call for a multitude of reason.
• 28:15
  Speaker 15: It appeared we have a kidnapping because her car was
• 28:18
  Speaker 15: found somewhere else with the keys and cell phone in purse.
• 28:21
  Speaker 15: So you know, they can do things rapidly that some
• 28:25
  Speaker 15: local law enforcement maybe cannot do. But in this situation,
• 28:28
  Speaker 15: you have someone that was the boyfriend who was the
• 28:32
  Speaker 15: last person to be seen with her alive. He was
• 28:36
  Speaker 15: visiting his family farm with her at the time.
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan joining me, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon at star
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: of a hit series Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: Joe Scott. When you have a police officer on your
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: force that is related to or connected to the suspect,
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: the defendant, the person of interest, any of that, and
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: that person has the opportunity, has been given the opportunity
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: to tamper with evidence or impede the investigation in any way,
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: you screwed up. The whole kit and kaboodle has screwed
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: up if you have allowed an officer access to information,
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: access to evidence, access or opportunity to pull strings behind
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: the scenes. Oh hgwln Oh that's why you got to
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: have the FBI in Forget about the cars found in
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: another location, yes, which means a kidnapping, yes, which is
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: under FBI jurisdiction. But still you had a cohort of
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: the defendant on the police force pulling strings. It stinks, Morgan,
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: It stinks.
• 29:57
  Speaker 18: Yes, it does. And here's the thing when you think
• 29:59
  Speaker 18: about investigative team, like in this particular case, where you
• 30:03
  Speaker 18: have the locals there within a bubble, there within their
• 30:07
  Speaker 18: own investigative bubble, and it's kind of a closed loop
• 30:10
  Speaker 18: where that information kind of circles around within that environment.
• 30:13
  Speaker 18: You got the prosecutor and everybody else's in there. When
• 30:16
  Speaker 18: you bring in the FBI, they're outside of that bubble.
• 30:19
  Speaker 18: But that's a good thing because their investigation is running parallel.
• 30:23
  Speaker 18: And think about the FBI is this Having worked in
• 30:26
  Speaker 18: many cases with them, they like to get information, but
• 30:30
  Speaker 18: not a lot flows back out of them because they
• 30:32
  Speaker 18: keep their own closed loop.
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: Can I boil that down for you, Joe Scott. They
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: don't give a flying fig what anybody in town thinks.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: Who's second cousin related to mama's sass and blah blah blah.
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: They don't care. Prime stories with Nancy Grace. Boyfriend Lover
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: Brooks Holck will stay behind bars on a ten million
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: dollar bond, now charged in the murder of his girlfriend,
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: the mother of five beautiful Crystal Rogers. Take a listen
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: to this.
• 31:23
  Speaker 20: Chrystl Rogers, a mother of five, disappeared in July twenty fifteen.
• 31:27
  Speaker 20: In October of that year, the Nelson County Sheriff's office
• 31:30
  Speaker 20: named for boyfriend Brooks Hawk. The main suspect, was never
• 31:33
  Speaker 20: arrested or charged. The FBI ripped up the driveway of
• 31:36
  Speaker 20: a home how built. And just last year, the FBI
• 31:39
  Speaker 20: was back of the Halk farm for a five day search.
• 31:42
  Speaker 20: On June twenty first of this year, another man, Joseph Lawson,
• 31:46
  Speaker 20: was indicted for tampering with physical evidence in the Rogers case.
• 31:49
  Speaker 20: On July twenty fourth, Lawson was indicted on a conspiracy
• 31:52
  Speaker 20: to commit murder charge. We have learned Lawson's dad worked
• 31:56
  Speaker 20: for Hawck. On September seventh, Lawson pleaded not guilty.
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: And since circuit court you were hearing our friends at
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: w d r B. Who is the co defendant Joseph
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: Lawson back to falling Glick and what do we believe
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: his involvement is.
• 32:13
  Speaker 13: Well, it's really still unclear what exactly his involvement was,
• 32:17
  Speaker 13: but we know his father, Steve Lawson, had called Brooks
• 32:23
  Speaker 13: how the night Crystal Crystal disappeared, and that phone call
• 32:30
  Speaker 13: Brooks hougue Is asked about that phone call during his
• 32:32
  Speaker 13: police interrogation and he didn't really seem to remember what
• 32:36
  Speaker 13: it was about. So he called Steve Lawson and said, hey,
• 32:40
  Speaker 13: do you remember what I was calling you about that night?
• 32:43
  Speaker 13: And he goes, oh, sure. He wanted a number for
• 32:45
  Speaker 13: a house because he builds homes and he has all
• 32:50
  Speaker 13: these rental properties, and so it was a late night
• 32:53
  Speaker 13: phone call, only lasted several seconds, and mister Lawson had
• 32:57
  Speaker 13: said he needed something from Crystal. And then the detective asked, well,
• 33:01
  Speaker 13: if Crystal was right with you in the truck, why
• 33:03
  Speaker 13: didn't you just ask her then? And he said, oh,
• 33:05
  Speaker 13: you just figure out on Monday what he wanted. So
• 33:09
  Speaker 13: it was a suspicious phone call.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: And now that father, Stephen Lawson, has been arrested as well.
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: He has been indanted by a grand jury with criminal
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: conspiracy to commit murder and tampering with physical evidence. To
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: doctor Jeff Kalshewski, forensic psychologist and author of Dark Side Way.
• 33:26
  Speaker 17: In so, one of the things when people are trying
• 33:30
  Speaker 17: to recollect and experience or an incident, when you are
• 33:36
  Speaker 17: trying to fabricate it in your mind in the moment,
• 33:40
  Speaker 17: in other words, you're trying to create the lies during
• 33:42
  Speaker 17: the moment, you're going to miss things. You're going to
• 33:46
  Speaker 17: have these blocks of times. You may have went into
• 33:49
  Speaker 17: that interview already having your lie planned out in your head,
• 33:53
  Speaker 17: but once you're under in police police interrogation, they're going
• 33:56
  Speaker 17: to ask you questions you didn't anticipate and that you
• 33:59
  Speaker 17: had not created the false answer for So it's great
• 34:04
  Speaker 17: hallmark when a suspect is in an interrogation and they
• 34:10
  Speaker 17: are guilty, they're not going to know how to answer
• 34:13
  Speaker 17: many of these questions. They're going to show blocks of times,
• 34:16
  Speaker 17: they're going to have incomplete answers and sometimes even contradict themselves.
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: I also question brook Hawk about his reaction when Crystalton
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: didn't show up to a get together a July fourth
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: get together is let me just say, nonchalant, and that's
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: certainly putting perfume on the pig Listen Brooks, did you
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: go on to the July the fourth get together that day?
• 34:41
  Speaker 8: Yes?
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: I did, even though you didn't know where she was.
• 34:44
  Speaker 14: Well, I was expecting I'm putting in a phone call
• 34:49
  Speaker 14: that morning and then around lunch and usually the maximum
• 34:54
  Speaker 14: period of time that she has stayed gone that it
• 34:57
  Speaker 14: has only been like a day to the day and
• 34:59
  Speaker 14: a half the most. And as a result of that,
• 35:02
  Speaker 14: I thought that she would.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: Did you try to call her?
• 35:07
  Speaker 14: I'm sorry I didn't hear you, ma'am.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: Did you try to call her during that time?
• 35:13
  Speaker 12: Not?
• 35:13
  Speaker 14: While I was there there at the at the fourth
• 35:18
  Speaker 14: and I called her prior to leaving the head in
• 35:21
  Speaker 14: that direction, yes, ma'am.
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: So when she doesn't show up to a party, a
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: big party that Crystal was supposed to attend, but she
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: doesn't show up, he does nothing.
• 35:33
  Speaker 15: On an investigation, Nancy, I usually keep two lists, what
• 35:36
  Speaker 15: they did and what they didn't do. This list of
• 35:39
  Speaker 15: what he did not do. He didn't report her missing.
• 35:42
  Speaker 15: Her mama did.
• 35:44
  Speaker 21: He doesn't call around her family and everybody else saying, hey,
• 35:47
  Speaker 21: where is she?
• 35:48
  Speaker 15: We got these five kids somebody needs to help me
• 35:50
  Speaker 15: take care of He didn't do that. He don't search
• 35:53
  Speaker 15: for her. He don't demand that the police helped find her.
• 35:58
  Speaker 21: He doesn't even today demand the police find the real killer.
• 36:01
  Speaker 21: He's not making a plea right now saying, y'all got
• 36:04
  Speaker 21: the rolled person.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Who called nine one one in this case, Fellen Glick,
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: WDRB who called to report her missing.
• 36:12
  Speaker 13: Oh, it was the mom ary valor. She called her
• 36:15
  Speaker 13: and reported her missing. And that same day she saw
• 36:19
  Speaker 13: Brooks how kind a parking lot somewhere because they just
• 36:22
  Speaker 13: always seemed to run into each other. It's a small town,
• 36:25
  Speaker 13: and he just seemed very unconcerned that she was in
• 36:29
  Speaker 13: fact missing. And I want to point out too, when
• 36:32
  Speaker 13: you're kind of talking about it, just not answering questions
• 36:35
  Speaker 13: during the interrogation. And police have said about him and
• 36:39
  Speaker 13: his brother, they both had convenient cases of amnesia because
• 36:44
  Speaker 13: whenever they asked about something unrelated to Crystal, they gave
• 36:48
  Speaker 13: very detailed answers.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, anytime they could trash Crystal, you mean, anytime they
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: could say something bad about her, they would. They had
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: all that memorize, all of her movements were memorized, but
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: they couldn't say a thing about their movements were during
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: their lapses of memory. Is the death of Crystal Rogers
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: connected to a bigger picture? Take a list to our
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: cut two one two whas eleven.
• 37:15
  Speaker 19: They are three of Kentucky's most high profile unsolved cases,
• 37:19
  Speaker 19: the ambush killing of Birdstown police officer Jason Ellis, disappearance
• 37:24
  Speaker 19: of mother of five, Crystal Rogers, and fatal shooting of
• 37:27
  Speaker 19: Rogers dad Tommy Baller. The FBI previously made it clear
• 37:31
  Speaker 19: they are the lead on the Rogers case, but investigating
• 37:35
  Speaker 19: all three, saying this in a one on one interview
• 37:38
  Speaker 19: back in twenty twenty, it is.
• 37:40
  Speaker 18: Very rare to have all of these types of cases
• 37:44
  Speaker 18: which are potentially connected in a small community.
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: To Cheryl McCollum, what would the connection of the other
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: cases be two Crystal Rogers.
• 37:55
  Speaker 15: Nante Again, I think we have to look at all
• 37:58
  Speaker 15: of these people that are connected. You got Brookes, You've
• 38:00
  Speaker 15: got his brother, You've got the coworker and his father.
• 38:03
  Speaker 15: You've got grandma, You've got Singleton. All of these people
• 38:06
  Speaker 15: have things in common, whether it's making phone calls, the perjury,
• 38:10
  Speaker 15: the theft, the lion, you know, the keeping these secrets
• 38:15
  Speaker 15: since two thoy fifteen. So you have to wonder why
• 38:19
  Speaker 15: would Singleton get.
• 38:21
  Speaker 21: Thirty eight charges of perjury? Why would this coworker accept
• 38:26
  Speaker 21: these phone calls but then not tell anybody? Why are
• 38:29
  Speaker 21: they talking about these rental properties? So all of these dots,
• 38:32
  Speaker 21: you're going to have to connect with these people that
• 38:35
  Speaker 21: chose for eight years.
• 38:38
  Speaker 15: To not come forward, not tell what they know, but
• 38:41
  Speaker 15: dig themselves into a deeper hole.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: To you Fan and Blick, what is the possible connection
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: between Crystal Rogers case and the other murders.
• 38:52
  Speaker 13: So family and a lot of the community, they believe
• 38:55
  Speaker 13: that Tommy ballor Crystal's dad, was so involved in trying
• 38:59
  Speaker 13: to find Crystal and doing his own interrogation and investigation
• 39:04
  Speaker 13: to find his daughter. They believe that Tommy Ballard probably
• 39:08
  Speaker 13: would have figured it out himself, and they believe that
• 39:12
  Speaker 13: he was killed because maybe he was getting close to
• 39:16
  Speaker 13: finding something out that he shouldn't have. And then the
• 39:19
  Speaker 13: days leading up to his death, Sherry Ballard, his wife,
• 39:23
  Speaker 13: said he felt like he was being followed.
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: And what about the law enforcement officer, sure Nick how.
• 39:29
  Speaker 13: Who he talked about, who got fired by the police chief.
• 39:33
  Speaker 13: He worked the same shift as Jason Ellis who was
• 39:38
  Speaker 13: ambushed and killed on his drive home from work one
• 39:41
  Speaker 13: night when he saw some debris on the road, got
• 39:44
  Speaker 13: out to move these tree limbs off the road and
• 39:47
  Speaker 13: that's when he got shot multiple times.
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: And killed execution style.
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: And he worked on the same shift with the definite
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: boyfriend's brother on the force. Wonder what he knew from
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: working that shift. Wonder what if anything he knew. We
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: wait as all of these facts unfold. Goodbye, Find