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Accused Killer Brian Kohberger Back in Court, After Waiving Speedy Trial · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grease.
0:14
Speaker 2: Brian Coberger heading back to court in about forty eight hours.
0:19
Speaker 2: What will happen when he once again is face to
0:22
Speaker 2: face with a judge. Will victim's families show up? Many
0:26
Speaker 2: important details leading up to this moment. We now know
0:31
Speaker 2: that Coburger's lawyer and Taylor, has waived her right to
0:37
Speaker 2: a speedy trial. After all this, all this whining and
0:41
Speaker 2: moaning and complaining about a speedy trial demand and now
0:46
Speaker 2: they wave it. It was all just a game. It
0:51
Speaker 2: was all just a ruse. This as they contested DNA
0:56
Speaker 2: and they are questioning three unknown male DNA found at
1:01
Speaker 2: the scene of this home where multiple co eds had lived.
1:06
Speaker 2: People were in and out all the time. It was
1:08
Speaker 2: the real party house. That could have been anybody. So
1:12
Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure out which way the defense is headed,
1:16
Speaker 2: because I guarantee you they're going to claim that they
1:20
Speaker 2: had to waive their right to a speedy trial because
1:24
Speaker 2: they didn't have enough time to review the state's DNA
1:28
Speaker 2: evidence b S. That's total BS, the state has said,
1:34
Speaker 2: and this can be confirmed that the crime lab hasn't
1:38
Speaker 2: finished all the DNA analysis, so how can they turn
1:42
Speaker 2: over what they don't have. I mean, as he Grace,
1:46
Speaker 2: thanks for being with us. Joining me right now, two
1:49
Speaker 2: special guests that are intimately familiar with the legal aspects
1:54
Speaker 2: and the factual aspects of the Coburger prosecution. Deal Carson
1:58
Speaker 2: is joining me. High profile lawyer out of Jacksonville, former
2:02
Speaker 2: FBI agent, former cop in Miami Dade, author of Arrest
2:06
Speaker 2: Proof Yourself. You can find him at Delcarsonlaw dot com.
2:10
Speaker 2: He's been studying the legal angles, says this first broke
2:14
Speaker 2: and I mean when the murders occurred. He's been on
2:18
Speaker 2: the case also with me. Chris McDonough, you know him well.
2:22
Speaker 2: He is the director of the Cold Case Foundation, former
2:25
Speaker 2: homicide detective with around three hundred homicides under his belt,
2:32
Speaker 2: twenty five years in law enforcement. I found him on
2:35
Speaker 2: the YouTube channel, the Interview Room, when he was doing
2:39
Speaker 2: a very slow drive through all around the King Road
2:45
Speaker 2: murder scene. That's when I found Chris McDonough. Deal Carson.
2:49
Speaker 2: Chris McDonough, thank you for being with us. First of all,
2:54
Speaker 2: Deal Carson. How many times have defense attorneys file, including you,
3:00
Speaker 2: filed speedy trial demands when you know more than the
3:05
Speaker 2: man of the moon intend to take the case to
3:08
Speaker 2: trial within six months total.
3:09
Speaker 3: Bs is But the reason ostensibly is that the defense
3:17
Speaker 3: hasn't had an opportunity to fully prepare for the case
3:19
Speaker 3: as the prosecution already has. The prosecution has all the evidence,
3:24
Speaker 3: right but.
3:28
Speaker 2: In the first two minutes. But no, the state has
3:32
Speaker 2: handed over all the evidence. It's not like they're hoarding
3:36
Speaker 2: it or hiding it. Agreed, let me tell you a story.
3:39
Speaker 2: I almost said a funny story, but it wasn't funny
3:41
Speaker 2: to me. Dale and Chris, you know only too well
3:44
Speaker 2: from being on the stand. I was preparing a death
3:47
Speaker 2: penalty case where infants, several infants in their baby beds
3:58
Speaker 2: were killed because of arrival. It was called Set Set
4:03
Speaker 2: Set gang. All right, what this means is that the
4:08
Speaker 2: women that were the girlfriends of the gang members got
4:12
Speaker 2: into an argument with the women that were girlfriends of
4:16
Speaker 2: the other gang members. I seem to call over some clothes. Yeah,
4:23
Speaker 2: so one gang throws a Molotov cocktail into the home
4:31
Speaker 2: of the victims and says, let's fry them babies, and
4:39
Speaker 2: they did. The babies were burned to death instantly. Yeah.
4:44
Speaker 2: Now that's not a up on the case. I don't
4:46
Speaker 2: know what it is, but my point is leading up
4:49
Speaker 2: to it is that the defense kept saying and the
4:53
Speaker 2: trial there was no speedy child a mand This trial
4:55
Speaker 2: was long, long down the road. I'm talking at lea
5:00
Speaker 2: another year. They said I did not hand over a file,
5:04
Speaker 2: and I said, I've given you every single thing I've got.
5:09
Speaker 2: So I finally handed my whole file everything I had
5:13
Speaker 2: to the judge. Guess what it was. They were right,
5:17
Speaker 2: and I was right. There was one thin file that
5:22
Speaker 2: the homicide cops, for whatever reason, inadvertently I don't know,
5:27
Speaker 2: had not given to me. So there was a stack
5:30
Speaker 2: of I think about twenty pages the defense didn't have
5:34
Speaker 2: and I didn't have. So I remember taking the stand
5:38
Speaker 2: and saying, I've handed over everything I've got. It went
5:43
Speaker 2: that far. I actually had to take the stand, and
5:45
Speaker 2: then we found out where the missing pages were, and
5:52
Speaker 2: that was a real blow to me to be accused
5:55
Speaker 2: of withholding information. I want to win, but I want
5:59
Speaker 2: to win fair, and I want to right people behind bars,
6:02
Speaker 2: and I want to win the fair way because to me,
6:07
Speaker 2: prosecutors have the duty not only to seek justice, but
6:11
Speaker 2: to do it ethically.
6:14
Speaker 4: Yep.
6:15
Speaker 2: The defense is not bound by that. So when you say,
6:19
Speaker 2: y'all Carson and the state's got it. They've had it
6:21
Speaker 2: all this time. I don't know that they've had it
6:23
Speaker 2: all this time. There's still DNA results the state doesn't have.
6:26
Speaker 3: Well, they collected it, and it's an opportunity for the defense.
6:29
Speaker 2: You mean the cops collected it and hand it in
6:33
Speaker 2: the evidence. The prosecutors did not collect any evidence.
6:37
Speaker 3: Well, no, not directly, not correctly. That's what I was
6:41
Speaker 3: going to tell you, is said, Look, in a case
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Speaker 3: like this where the defense is not entered a plea,
6:47
Speaker 3: of course, plea for the defense. And what that means
6:51
Speaker 3: is there's no reciprocity. The government has to turn over
6:54
Speaker 3: everything it's god, but the defendant does not. So that's
6:59
Speaker 3: an interesting wants to what's going on here.
7:02
Speaker 2: Well, let's talk about that for just one moment. And
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Speaker 2: Chris mcdonnah, you got to hear this, because one thing
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Speaker 2: the defense does have to hand over is notice of alibi.
7:14
Speaker 2: Because in our jurisprudence system, which was brought over from
7:19
Speaker 2: the common law of Great Britain, it's not trial by
7:23
Speaker 2: ambush forever, the state has to hand over the evidence
7:29
Speaker 2: to the defense. Not always true the other way around.
7:33
Speaker 2: The defense doesn't always have to hand over everything to
7:35
Speaker 2: the state. But if there's an alibi, the defense does
7:41
Speaker 2: have to hand that over, so the state has a
7:43
Speaker 2: right to investigate it to find out if it's a big,
7:46
Speaker 2: fat lie. So get this, Chris mcdonnah Brian Coiberger's defense
7:52
Speaker 2: hands over an alibi, but they won't say what the
7:55
Speaker 2: alibi is. All they say is he likes to go
7:59
Speaker 2: driving around eight at night alone. If that's not pervy enough,
8:06
Speaker 2: what looking at everybody's windows? How many times did he
8:10
Speaker 2: drive by the King Road murder scene that night according
8:15
Speaker 2: to his cell phone or in the past according to
8:18
Speaker 2: his cell phone conveely that night. I think he had
8:20
Speaker 2: a cell phone on airplane motor turned off at the
8:24
Speaker 2: time of the murders, but then it was quickly turned
8:28
Speaker 2: back on for his circuitous route home. What kind of
8:31
Speaker 2: an alibi is that, Chris McDonough speaking of having to
8:35
Speaker 2: hand over evidence that you like to drive around late
8:39
Speaker 2: at night by yourself.
8:40
Speaker 4: Well that and Nancy, you've been on this from day
8:43
Speaker 4: one in terms of really inside this guy's head. And
8:46
Speaker 4: then the defense's positioning here that alibi in of itself
8:51
Speaker 4: is going to be very problematic for them because I
8:54
Speaker 4: think any you know, if we just applied common sense,
8:58
Speaker 4: you know the fact that he now you know, presents
9:01
Speaker 4: this alibi of well, you know, he's just out for
9:04
Speaker 4: a nightly straw in his car. You know, of course
9:07
Speaker 4: we all do that right at you know, three o'clock
9:11
Speaker 4: in the morning, and he just happened to be driving
9:15
Speaker 4: by that house twelve shepherd times, which.
9:17
Speaker 2: I'll tell you what, Prince, if my husband, David Lynch
9:20
Speaker 2: got up out of the bed and went for a
9:21
Speaker 2: drive by himself at three am, I think my head
9:25
Speaker 2: would blow off.
9:28
Speaker 4: I agree.
9:29
Speaker 2: My guess would be to begin up at five o'clock
9:31
Speaker 2: in the morning and start feeding guinea pigs and cats
9:34
Speaker 2: and dogs and grandmammies and twins and get everybody to
9:38
Speaker 2: school in Oh he is not going for a drive
9:42
Speaker 2: at three am and breathing in the fresh air. No, No,
9:47
Speaker 2: go ahead, Yeah, I mean have do you go driving
9:50
Speaker 2: in the middle of the night, Chris mcconno, because I'm
9:52
Speaker 2: sure your wife would like to hear about that, do you.
9:55
Speaker 4: Yeah, My wife would kill me. Literally. I would be
9:58
Speaker 4: on the opposite side out a car.
10:00
Speaker 2: Some you go driving around at three am in the morning,
10:04
Speaker 2: what to get some nice freezing fresh air.
10:06
Speaker 3: Well, that's an strange alibi because it's not.
10:09
Speaker 4: Really an alibi.
10:10
Speaker 3: All he's saying is I don't really know where I was,
10:14
Speaker 3: which is not an alibi.
10:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right. An alibi is I was here at
10:17
Speaker 2: this time, and these are the witnesses. So it's totally yes.
10:33
Speaker 1: Time stories with Nancy Greece.
10:36
Speaker 2: Chris McDonough, you and I have gone to the scene
10:42
Speaker 2: many many times. It's freezing cold, cold, The roads are treacherous.
10:48
Speaker 2: Their home was on an elevated slant and very tricky.
10:53
Speaker 2: You know, the streets leading up to their home, the apartment,
10:58
Speaker 2: saw the student apartments, barely two cars can cross and
11:02
Speaker 2: they're going up these slick streets with covered in ice.
11:07
Speaker 2: So why is he driving around in sub zero tempts
11:12
Speaker 2: at three o'clock in the morning on a treacherous road.
11:16
Speaker 3: But he can't Ernie right, So he's got no money.
11:19
Speaker 3: Where's he got the money for gas?
11:21
Speaker 4: Yeah, And to dovetail into what you're thinking, Nancy, the
11:25
Speaker 4: only thing I can think, and this is, you know,
11:28
Speaker 4: obviously just my opinion is either A they're going to
11:31
Speaker 4: come up with some type of medical insomnia, you know,
11:35
Speaker 4: connection through all the snow, problem.
11:38
Speaker 2: Hold on, I got to write this down. Hold On,
11:40
Speaker 2: I can see it coming that. Okay, okay, now what
11:44
Speaker 2: did you say? Insomnia and what you know?
11:47
Speaker 4: And they're going to connect it back to his condition,
11:49
Speaker 4: uh you know, is the snow you know problem that
11:54
Speaker 4: he was having, you know, a medical condition there, And
11:57
Speaker 4: of course that opens up the timeline for the earlier
12:01
Speaker 4: videos that have been floating around, you know, about an
12:05
Speaker 4: hour before what the authorities have shed they believe is
12:11
Speaker 4: the exact time the homicides go down.
12:14
Speaker 2: Wait, wait, wait, wait you know. Hold on, Chris mcdona,
12:19
Speaker 2: I know you've got three hundred homicides under your belt
12:21
Speaker 2: and you're the star of the interview room and Del Carson,
12:24
Speaker 2: I know your former FBI and you've written a book
12:26
Speaker 2: and your high profile, all your blah blah blah. But
12:29
Speaker 2: Jackie is waving in Sydney or waving a sign visual snow.
12:34
Speaker 2: There it is the condition visual snow. So he's about driving, guys.
12:41
Speaker 2: I feel a little bit guilty as I've recounted the
12:42
Speaker 2: story they're going to sleep in here because I know
12:45
Speaker 2: what I'm about to say. Oh here she goes again.
12:47
Speaker 2: But when I drove that route, I swear and you
12:51
Speaker 2: can ask I think I had Kelly with me. Illy,
12:55
Speaker 2: I don't know if you were with me or not.
12:57
Speaker 2: The night we drove that route that he took and
13:00
Speaker 2: the oh, you couldn't see a thing. When a Simmy
13:06
Speaker 2: would come toward me, I would have to just pull
13:08
Speaker 2: off the road because I could not see anything. I've
13:12
Speaker 2: got twenty twenty and twenty eighteen, and it was so dark.
13:16
Speaker 2: All I could see were big lights coming straight at
13:19
Speaker 2: the car. So I just pull off and wait. And
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Speaker 2: I'm usually a much more aggressive driver that said, Chris,
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Speaker 2: did I interrupt you? Or did I interrupt deal? Carson?
13:29
Speaker 2: Is there?
13:29
Speaker 4: No, You're fine, Nancia, And you know we're always honored
13:32
Speaker 4: to be here as your guest, and you were so
13:36
Speaker 4: right on target here right. One of the things I've
13:38
Speaker 4: been thinking about, you know, knowing that both you and
13:42
Speaker 4: I have driven it, and this idea of Okay, why
13:46
Speaker 4: are they going so far to say in the motion
13:51
Speaker 4: that well, we'll figure out this alibi on the state's
13:54
Speaker 4: witnesses through questioning right? Well, I'm thinking, well, how is
13:59
Speaker 4: that them to play here? And the only thing I
14:02
Speaker 4: can think of is this medical condition. But I could
14:05
Speaker 4: be one hundred percent wrong.
14:06
Speaker 2: However, that are you talking about insomnia? Because what the
14:11
Speaker 2: perfect cure for insomnia you can't go to sleep is
14:13
Speaker 2: to go out in the sub zero call Champs with
14:16
Speaker 2: your windows down and the snow that's supposed to get
14:19
Speaker 2: you sleepy.
14:19
Speaker 4: Exactly. Yeah, that's kind of where I'm going in my head.
14:24
Speaker 4: But that in of itself, if you take that night
14:29
Speaker 4: for an example of all the activity, you know, just
14:32
Speaker 4: hours before this tragedy goes down, there are kids everywhere
14:37
Speaker 4: from the college. I mean, we know about the police
14:39
Speaker 4: contact with the alcohol and that, and then there's these
14:43
Speaker 4: videos that have surfaced where they're showing the cars, you know,
14:47
Speaker 4: various cars pulling up and some people believing that's them.
14:52
Speaker 4: The authorities haven't released that yet, but what that does
14:55
Speaker 4: is it opens up a narrative, and you know this
14:58
Speaker 4: more than anybody, for the fence to start saying some
15:01
Speaker 4: other dude, some.
15:03
Speaker 2: Others saw defense, some other dude did it, oh.
15:08
Speaker 4: Yep, And then they create their theme around it and
15:12
Speaker 4: they start projecting it into the public through these motions
15:16
Speaker 4: and see what sticks. I think that's what's been going
15:20
Speaker 4: on here. And you've been on top of this, you know,
15:24
Speaker 4: from the from the beginning. We've talked about this multiple times.
15:27
Speaker 2: Dale, Carson, Chris mc donna, and I are dragging you
15:30
Speaker 2: by your toenails. You can bring your wife, just bring everybody,
15:32
Speaker 2: the cat, the dog, to everybody. You've got to go
15:36
Speaker 2: out there and you've got to wait like we did
15:39
Speaker 2: around midnight and take that route that he took about
15:43
Speaker 2: a fortese of sid Wasn't it a forty five minute
15:45
Speaker 2: route from the murder scene to his apartment and it's
15:51
Speaker 2: actually about a nine to twelve minute drive. He was
15:55
Speaker 2: out on this long, circuitous route getting himself as far
15:59
Speaker 2: away from the murder scene as possible home. It was
16:02
Speaker 2: like his how his apartment at Pullman is here, the
16:05
Speaker 2: murder scene is here, So he goes all the way
16:10
Speaker 2: around in the dark, no street lights to right here
16:13
Speaker 2: instead of going boop, That's that's what happened. Now right there.
16:18
Speaker 2: A jury is going to say, no way.
16:20
Speaker 3: That's exactly right, that's exactly right, Nancia. Jury is going
16:25
Speaker 3: to begin with this case with him surveilling in some
16:29
Speaker 3: way or another that house where these young gals lived,
16:33
Speaker 3: and then they're going to bring it right up to
16:35
Speaker 3: the very end. Where is that sheet for the knife?
16:39
Speaker 3: Is found with his DNA on it and a reasonable
16:42
Speaker 3: jury is going to find him guilty. Clearly, they want
16:46
Speaker 3: to postpone this trial as long as they can in
16:50
Speaker 3: order for the hubbub if you will, to die down,
16:53
Speaker 3: which it's not gonna because this is such a massive
16:56
Speaker 3: killing in a rural area. There are forty four counties
17:00
Speaker 3: in Idaho. They don't even have a public defender's office
17:03
Speaker 3: per se. What they do is they engage the services
17:07
Speaker 3: of attorneys who are in the areas because it's so
17:11
Speaker 3: rural and there are different rules for every one of
17:15
Speaker 3: those counties, so they don't have to have depositions day
17:18
Speaker 3: they can.
17:19
Speaker 2: Now, before you go off on depositions, isn't it true?
17:22
Speaker 2: They never planned to try this case within this speedy
17:27
Speaker 2: trial period at all. This is just to acrue to
17:31
Speaker 2: drive this take crazy because I can tell you this much, Dale,
17:34
Speaker 2: And I don't know if this happened to you, Chris,
17:35
Speaker 2: when you would be a witness on the stand as
17:37
Speaker 2: homicide detective. But I don't care if it was a shoplifting,
17:41
Speaker 2: I don't care if it's a theft by receiving, if
17:44
Speaker 2: somebody hit me with a speedy they're going out first.
17:49
Speaker 2: I mean Monday morning, as quickly as I can put
17:52
Speaker 2: that case together. And then when I do get a conviction,
17:56
Speaker 2: I'm lucky enough to get a conviction, then they're getting
17:59
Speaker 2: the max because.
18:01
Speaker 3: Look, but speedy trial issue, at least from the public
18:05
Speaker 3: the defense side, is this, you set it for speedy
18:08
Speaker 3: trial when you know the state has to change its
18:12
Speaker 3: behavior in order to give you a reduced sentence. That
18:15
Speaker 3: was never going to happen in this case. And so
18:19
Speaker 3: when you request speedy the government knows that you think
18:23
Speaker 3: your client is provably innocent, and that's never been the
18:27
Speaker 3: case here. So you know it was a tool.
18:30
Speaker 2: Just a way to screw with the state. Yeah, they
18:32
Speaker 2: never intended. And the outcome is if the state didn't
18:36
Speaker 2: try it on time, there would be an automatic acquittal
18:39
Speaker 2: and there is no retrial that jeopardy attaches.
18:47
Speaker 3: Yeah, but if the jury panels not born in jeopardy
18:51
Speaker 3: doesn't attach.
18:52
Speaker 2: Guys, I was just handed this. It's highly complicated and
18:56
Speaker 2: it's very tech oriented. It's perfect. Sidney drew this, Okay,
19:01
Speaker 2: ten minutes. I love holding up any type of a
19:05
Speaker 2: visual apartment to house. As I mentioned earlier, I thought
19:11
Speaker 2: it was not it's ten minutes from the apartment to
19:12
Speaker 2: the house. But the route he took that night is
19:16
Speaker 2: from the house twenty minutes this way, twenty minutes that way.
19:19
Speaker 2: In twenty minutes. It wasn't forty five sending your right,
19:22
Speaker 2: It was more like an hour. He goes for an
19:25
Speaker 2: hour drive. And how is he going to explain that
19:28
Speaker 2: to a jury? I mean that just starts with Now, okay,
19:33
Speaker 2: let's talk about what's going to happen to court. And again,
19:35
Speaker 2: Chris mcdonnet dale please jump in.
19:38
Speaker 4: Hey, Nancy, can we talk want to just go back
19:41
Speaker 4: just for a second on the drive.
19:43
Speaker 2: Yes, didn't he.
19:44
Speaker 4: Show up that morning as well?
19:47
Speaker 3: Yes?
19:47
Speaker 4: Isn't there wasn't there evidence that they believed he potentially
19:52
Speaker 4: went back, and there was reports of his vehicle in
19:56
Speaker 4: the area that morning.
19:57
Speaker 2: That's right, he went back, and it reminds you of
19:59
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson going back after he murdered Lacy, his wife
20:05
Speaker 2: and unborn child Connor. But go back and look out
20:08
Speaker 2: of the San Francisco Bay and just look at it,
20:11
Speaker 2: because there was a GPS tracker on his car, so
20:14
Speaker 2: we know he went back over and over to look
20:16
Speaker 2: out there. What was he looking to see? Her body
20:18
Speaker 2: was going to pop up. But that's really common amongst
20:21
Speaker 2: defendants is they go back to the scene to just
20:24
Speaker 2: see what's going on.
20:25
Speaker 3: They want to order you to live. It didn't mean
20:27
Speaker 3: that's part of their conduct.
20:30
Speaker 4: Typically, right, So how is this going to play into
20:33
Speaker 4: the end?
20:34
Speaker 3: Bundy did that. All of the major serial killers have
20:40
Speaker 3: done that. And although we don't know that he is
20:42
Speaker 3: a serial in the sense of having clearly click killed
20:45
Speaker 3: other people previously, we do know that with a quad murder,
20:49
Speaker 3: he certainly is a serial killer and he has all
20:53
Speaker 3: of the we'll think about it. He is so in
20:56
Speaker 3: the law enforcement that he tries to be a police officer,
21:00
Speaker 3: to be a really well known, if you will, graduate
21:04
Speaker 3: student in criminal justice. I mean, what other indications are
21:08
Speaker 3: there that somebody's just involved terribly in law enforcement.
21:14
Speaker 4: Yet he can't get into it.
21:16
Speaker 3: Thank God.
21:30
Speaker 1: Time stories with Nancy Grace.
21:34
Speaker 2: There hasn't been a lot of discussion about this and
21:36
Speaker 2: all because everyone is focused on the challenge to the
21:39
Speaker 2: DNA on the knife sheath. And one thing I want
21:43
Speaker 2: to point out, and I think you and I the
21:46
Speaker 2: three of us have talked about this, maybe off camera.
21:50
Speaker 2: They've got to have a way to fight that DNA.
21:53
Speaker 2: It's his DNA on the knife sheath that he left
21:56
Speaker 2: under the body of Maddie Mogen. His DNA, we believe,
22:02
Speaker 2: is on the buckle the snap of that knife sheath.
22:06
Speaker 2: Now they've got to come up with the way. They're
22:09
Speaker 2: either going to say the DNA science is flawed, that
22:14
Speaker 2: his DNA was there incidentally or accidentally, maybe he went
22:19
Speaker 2: to a gun and knife show and opened up that
22:21
Speaker 2: knife and left his DNA, or he can claim it
22:27
Speaker 2: was planted. But think about it. The knife sheath was
22:35
Speaker 2: collected from under Maddie's body before Brian Coburger became a suspect.
22:45
Speaker 2: What I mean by that is significance. The knife sheath
22:48
Speaker 2: was taken and handed over to the crime lab to
22:51
Speaker 2: the scientists to try to find DNA or fingerprints, and
22:55
Speaker 2: it was only weeks and weeks later that Brian Coburger
22:59
Speaker 2: was ID So how could they have planted the DNA?
23:03
Speaker 2: And it's very likely that some of the cops in
23:06
Speaker 2: there processing the scene had on a shoulder camera body cam,
23:11
Speaker 2: so there may even be video of when the knife
23:15
Speaker 2: sheath was found. So just follow this through to its
23:18
Speaker 2: logical conclusion. That means that someone would have to after
23:22
Speaker 2: Coberger is named as a suspect, get his DNA, not
23:27
Speaker 2: his father's DNA, but his DNA, and go to the
23:31
Speaker 2: crime lab, get in to where they're holding all the evidence,
23:37
Speaker 2: probably get someone to conspire with them and plant his
23:43
Speaker 2: DNA Coburg's DNA on the knife sheet.
23:45
Speaker 3: Nancy, that narrative is why you were a good prosecutor,
23:49
Speaker 3: because that's exactly he's gonna tell the jury.
23:54
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, people love to hear about, oh, the
23:57
Speaker 2: evidence was planted, but think about what it would have
24:00
Speaker 2: required to plant his Coburger's DNA on that snap on
24:07
Speaker 2: that sheet. That did not happen. Okay, so they got
24:11
Speaker 2: to fall back on the other three attacks on the DNA.
24:14
Speaker 2: But Jackie was holding up a sign and I agree,
24:17
Speaker 2: because we're all focusing on the DNA and the unknown
24:20
Speaker 2: male DNA that was found somewhere in the house. I
24:23
Speaker 2: don't know it was in the kitchen, was it on
24:25
Speaker 2: a doorknob, was it in a bathroom? Where was it?
24:28
Speaker 2: Don't know? But they haven't been able to match that
24:32
Speaker 2: other DNA to a single person. And we don't know
24:35
Speaker 2: of any male DNA that was in the girl's bedrooms.
24:39
Speaker 2: That said. No, one's been talking about the fact that
24:42
Speaker 2: Coburger is fighting tooth and nail to keep cameras out
24:46
Speaker 2: of the courtroom. To you, Chris McDonough, why do you
24:50
Speaker 2: think Coburger doesn't want a camera in the courtroom?
24:53
Speaker 4: Well, I think for him it's quite Frankly, I think
24:59
Speaker 4: it's more about attorneys than it is for him. I
25:01
Speaker 4: think he he probably wants them in there, but the
25:05
Speaker 4: attorneys don't want them in there because they know that
25:08
Speaker 4: the public will see what he is about through his
25:13
Speaker 4: body language, not only how he reacts, you know, I
25:17
Speaker 4: mean you you know, I can only imagine when you
25:20
Speaker 4: would ask questions to a witness, to watch the defendant's reaction.
25:26
Speaker 4: You know, Jerry's pay attention to that very closely, as
25:29
Speaker 4: we all know. And you know, just to jump real
25:32
Speaker 4: fast back to the DNA gap, I E. You know,
25:36
Speaker 4: somebody planted it, i e. Law enforcement and or the government.
25:41
Speaker 4: But it also if we were to try to think
25:44
Speaker 4: through this a little bit deeper with the some other
25:47
Speaker 4: dude theory, then they would have to find somebody that
25:51
Speaker 4: had a direct correlated link to Covert somehow put that
25:58
Speaker 4: sheet in his hand and during that time of that relationship,
26:04
Speaker 4: and then of course that individual would be the suspect
26:06
Speaker 4: who planted it up into that bedroom. And what's interesting
26:12
Speaker 4: here is the fact that it's in the bedroom, and
26:17
Speaker 4: that is a very personal approach. And Coberger would be
26:23
Speaker 4: the most logical individual through his personality type and through
26:28
Speaker 4: obviously all of the forensic diagnosis of this guy psychological. Yeah,
26:34
Speaker 4: go ahead, remember following on that, Remember they were killed
26:38
Speaker 4: with a.
26:38
Speaker 3: Knife, a seat knife.
26:40
Speaker 4: Probably, Yeah, well, and that's a very personal instrument, right, dell.
26:44
Speaker 2: Y Again, Sydney and Jackie are waving frantically at me,
26:49
Speaker 2: and they're right again. There is Coburgers and the state
26:54
Speaker 2: has this purchase of the night a knife and a
26:58
Speaker 2: sheep exactly like the one the sheet that was found.
27:02
Speaker 2: They goes with the knife seven months before the murders.
27:07
Speaker 2: He buys a knife and a sheath and it looks
27:11
Speaker 2: just like the sheath found there with the matching knife.
27:13
Speaker 2: The knife has never been recovered. So my question would be,
27:17
Speaker 2: so where's that knife and that knife sheath? If this
27:20
Speaker 2: isn't it, then where is it exactly?
27:23
Speaker 4: And that's a very high bar that they're going to
27:25
Speaker 4: have to try to get over just that piece alone.
27:28
Speaker 2: Hey, listen to this, guys, the defense is I bet
27:33
Speaker 2: they don't. They do not like cameras exclusively looking at
27:39
Speaker 2: their client. And I just want to remind everybody of something.
27:42
Speaker 2: And we went round and round about this when I
27:45
Speaker 2: took a job at Court TV with the late great
27:48
Speaker 2: Johnny Cochrane, God rest his soul. I didn't agree with
27:52
Speaker 2: the thing he ever said, But man, he could win
27:55
Speaker 2: a case. Jerry's love him, and I can see why,
28:00
Speaker 2: just you know that kind of person. They walk in
28:02
Speaker 2: the room and everybody wants to be with them. They's just,
28:05
Speaker 2: you know, charismatic. Always with every case the defense did
28:11
Speaker 2: not want cameras in the courtroom. Well, the majority of
28:14
Speaker 2: the case is why and why did Court TV think
28:18
Speaker 2: there should be cameras in the courtroom? And our Constitution,
28:23
Speaker 2: the Founding Fathers there's something called the minutes. The minutes
28:28
Speaker 2: are what's being said say on the floor in the
28:32
Speaker 2: room when statutes are being passed, and our Constitution calls
28:38
Speaker 2: for open courtrooms. And in the minutes, the Founding Fathers said,
28:46
Speaker 2: we want the courthouses to be as big as it
28:48
Speaker 2: takes for the whole community to watch a trial. We
28:52
Speaker 2: are not Russia, we are not China, where proceedings happen
28:57
Speaker 2: in secret. We're not being run by the Taliban, who
29:02
Speaker 2: are jury, judge and executioner. Our proceedings are in the
29:09
Speaker 2: open and in our world. That means we all see
29:16
Speaker 2: justice unfold. Here, where Del Carson is, where Chris McDonough is,
29:26
Speaker 2: we can watch justice unfold. That's what the founding fathers said.
29:33
Speaker 2: And if the defense doesn't like it, well they shouldn't
29:37
Speaker 2: done the crime.
29:38
Speaker 3: Well. Listen, when you look at Brian Colbert's photographs lately,
29:42
Speaker 3: he's been smiling. Now, what person charged with a quadrupful
29:47
Speaker 3: homicide would be smiling in any event during the course
29:51
Speaker 3: of any court appearance. You'd be absolutely mortified. But not
29:57
Speaker 3: Brian Coberger. Why is that? And that's a question for
30:01
Speaker 3: the psychologists, But I suspect it's because he's enjoying himself.
30:08
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I asked the psychologist that same question Dale,
30:12
Speaker 4: and his answer was because he's the punisher.
30:15
Speaker 3: Yeah. All right, fair enough, guys.
30:17
Speaker 2: We have our eyes on the courtroom as these proceedings
30:22
Speaker 2: go forward, and we pray for justice. Dale Carson, high
30:28
Speaker 2: profile lawyer joining that out of Jacksonville, former FBI, former cop,
30:33
Speaker 2: Chris McDonough, former homicide detective director Cole case Foundation, star
30:39
Speaker 2: of YouTube's The Interview Room. You know we're laughing at
30:44
Speaker 2: certain points, but I can tell you some people that
30:47
Speaker 2: aren't laughing. The families of Ethan Chapin, Xana Kernodle, Madison
30:55
Speaker 2: Mogan aka Maddie, and Kelley gonsold Us because they will
31:03
Speaker 2: never be at home for another Christmas, another party, another birthday,
31:12
Speaker 2: another mother's day. It's all over. They are never to
31:19
Speaker 2: be seen on this earth again, and their killer must
31:25
Speaker 2: be brought to justice. Goodbye, Sai