Latest / Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast / IFH 787: From Ultraviolent Wrestling to Transformative Filmmaking: The Story of Matthew T. Burns

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IFH 787: From Ultraviolent Wrestling to Transformative Filmmaking: The Story of Matthew T. Burns · Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the ifh podcast Network. For more
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  Speaker 2: Welcome to the INDIEILM Muscle Podcast, Episode number seven eighty
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: seven Cinema Should Make You Forget.
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  Speaker 3: You're sitting in a theater, Roman Polanski.
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  Speaker 1: Broadcasting from the back alley in Hollywood. It's the Indie
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  Speaker 1: Film Hustle Podcast, where we show you how to survive
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  Speaker 1: and thrive as an indie filmmaker in the jungles of
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  Speaker 1: the film biz.
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  Speaker 4: And here's your host, Alex Ferrari.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Huscle podcast.
• 0:38
  Speaker 4: I am your humble host Alex Ferrari.
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  Speaker 3: Today's show is sponsored by Rise of the Film Entrepreneur
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  Speaker 3: How to turn your independent film into a profitable business.
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  Speaker 3: It's harder today than ever before for independent filmmakers to
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• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Enjoy today's episode with guest host Dave Bullis.
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: On this episode, We're going to talk to a guy
• 1:56
  Speaker 4: I've been meaning to talk to for a very long time,
• 1:59
  Speaker 4: and I actually have bumped into each other many times,
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: whether it be at a wrestling show while he's a
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: wrestler and I was in the audience when I was
• 2:06
  Speaker 4: into wrestling all those years ago, or even on social
• 2:09
  Speaker 4: media where we just keep bumping back and forth into
• 2:11
  Speaker 4: each other. This man has wrestled all over the Globe.
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: He has wrestled some of the biggest legends in wrestling,
• 2:19
  Speaker 4: and he has since retired and become a full time filmmaker,
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: and we're going to talk about all of that, and
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: we're also going to talk about his new film The Trade,
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: all that good stuff on this episode with guest Matthew T. Burns.
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: You know, you and I have actually met before. I
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: don't think you probably remember, but it was at a
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: CZW event and I actually one time, not only did
• 2:41
  Speaker 4: I hand you a chair during a match. I forget
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: who you were wrestling. I just remember handing you this chair,
• 2:48
  Speaker 4: but we actually talked afterwards after the show, and then
• 2:51
  Speaker 4: may Man Ponder came up to talk to both of us.
• 2:54
  Speaker 5: Oh Man, I had no idea. I mean, you and
• 2:57
  Speaker 5: I have talked. Do you remember the instant in which
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: your enemy of the chair? I'm trying to I wonder
• 3:02
  Speaker 5: if I'll recall this, Like, can you remember anything about.
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: That You were leaning over the rope, you were in
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: the ring, and you called for a chair and I
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: and I held I picked it up and I gave
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: it to you. It was already folded out, like it
• 3:13
  Speaker 4: wasn't folded up, it was it was it wasn't collapsed,
• 3:17
  Speaker 4: so I handed it up and you were in the
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: main event. It was a Champs Soccer arena in Soul,
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: New Jersey, and I can't remember who you were wrestling.
• 3:26
  Speaker 4: I want to say, maybe Rick Blade.
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: That's funny to hear that, man, I I can't quite
• 3:33
  Speaker 5: remember that. Man, we've got a history.
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, It's just it's a small world. And that's
• 3:39
  Speaker 4: why that was when I when I saw you were
• 3:41
  Speaker 4: in film, I was like, you know what, it's a
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: it's a it's a perfect chance to catch up and
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: and just talk about that. But that's that was just
• 3:47
  Speaker 4: that story I wanted to say because I was like, man,
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: I I just remember giving you that chair. And it
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: was funny too because I actually went with my manager
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: at who was my manager at a video game store
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: was working at and he went with me because he
• 4:00
  Speaker 4: was like so excited to see CCW and he was like, oh,
• 4:04
  Speaker 4: I hope I won't see anything that's going to like
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: make me get sick or anything. And I'm like, no,
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: I guess that's subjective, but I was like, I don't
• 4:13
  Speaker 4: think you will. And he ended up loving it, and
• 4:17
  Speaker 4: after that though, he never he just like his he
• 4:20
  Speaker 4: just really was one of those guys that he liked
• 4:22
  Speaker 4: the show, but he just his love affair of wrestling
• 4:25
  Speaker 4: was starting to sort of fade away. And I kind
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: of understand that because my love of wrestling started to
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: fade away around like two thousand and four, two thousand
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: and five, and then I just kind of stopped watching
• 4:37
  Speaker 4: all together. I mean, I mean, you know, I know
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: you retired in two thousand and three. You know, I'm sorry,
• 4:41
  Speaker 4: I'm getting way ahead of this interview. I'm just like,
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: I'm just coming all over the place here.
• 4:45
  Speaker 5: Well that this just confirms we got to talk. Man.
• 4:50
  Speaker 5: You mentioned that around two thousand and four two thousand
• 4:52
  Speaker 5: and five is when you kind of drifted away from wrestling,
• 4:55
  Speaker 5: and I retired in two thousand and three, and so
• 4:58
  Speaker 5: I had watched wrestling for a couple of years and
• 5:02
  Speaker 5: just tracked with everything that was going on. But I
• 5:05
  Speaker 5: came to realize, like it kind of needs to be
• 5:07
  Speaker 5: all in or all out for me, because I don't
• 5:09
  Speaker 5: always want to feel poled or tempted, you know, pulled
• 5:12
  Speaker 5: back towards the ring. But so it's just interesting it
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: seems like you kind of veered away from wrestling the
• 5:18
  Speaker 5: same time that I did and maybe started really pursuing
• 5:20
  Speaker 5: film just like I did.
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that was right around the time that. You know
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: what it was honestly meant was it was a combination
• 5:29
  Speaker 4: of all the independent promotions I liked, like ECW had folded,
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: which was like two thousand and one. You know, a
• 5:36
  Speaker 4: lot of the other independence I was watching. A lot
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: of my other friends weren't into it. The only thing
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: that was keeping my interest in wrestling was legitimately CCW
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: in Big Japan. If it wasn't for those two promotions,
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: I would have just stopped altogether because WW was awful
• 5:49
  Speaker 4: at that point, and I was like, you know, I
• 5:52
  Speaker 4: just don't really want to do this. You know, I
• 5:54
  Speaker 4: just don't want to follow this anymore. And it's funny
• 5:56
  Speaker 4: enough because right around that time was when I actually
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: started training to become a pro wrestler. And then I
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: I after that, I just really, after I got done
• 6:04
  Speaker 4: training as a pro wrestler, I really just stopped. That
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: was the end for me.
• 6:09
  Speaker 5: Who did you train with I didn't know that. I
• 6:11
  Speaker 5: didn't know you did that.
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, see that I saved all this, Matt, I saved
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: all this because I want to I wanted to actually,
• 6:17
  Speaker 4: uh talk about this on the podcast. So I trained
• 6:21
  Speaker 4: with a couple of different people. Uh, my main training
• 6:24
  Speaker 4: came with King Kong Bundy. Do you remember him?
• 6:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I was. I was on a couple of shows
• 6:31
  Speaker 5: with him. I remember I had a girlfriend who was
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: a wrestler and she brought a big batch of cookies
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: for everybody. This is this is my King Kong Bundy memory.
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: But all of a sudden, it's just like where did
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: all the cookies go? And you realize like he literally
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: ate all of them.
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: You know, it's funny because I actually we had to
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: go to me and this my best friend at the time.
• 6:53
  Speaker 4: I'm both training to be a wrestler at his school
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: and we had to go pick him up one time
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: to go to practice. Right, So we pick him up
• 7:00
  Speaker 4: at his house in Jersey and uh we we knock
• 7:03
  Speaker 4: on the door and Bundy's like, come on in, boys,
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: come on in. And you know, he's sitting there in
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: his big burke, a lounger recliner type deal, eating a
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: half gallon of ice cream, watching Hunter. He's nowhere near ready,
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: and we're like, you know, King, like we got to
• 7:18
  Speaker 4: get training, and like, you know, I don't know, half
• 7:20
  Speaker 4: an hour or so, and he goes. He goes that,
• 7:22
  Speaker 4: don't worry, they won't start without me.
• 7:27
  Speaker 5: This is just his way of dealing with the indies,
• 7:30
  Speaker 5: I suppose, after you know, bigger stages and just how
• 7:33
  Speaker 5: to how he's coping with the indies.
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: At least with Bundy, at least he was a lovable guy, like,
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know what you want to tell you
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: what my Matt, you know, my favorite Bundy story is,
• 7:47
  Speaker 4: and this has almost nothing to do with Bundy, was
• 7:49
  Speaker 4: the fact that there was a Chinese restaurant right from
• 7:53
  Speaker 4: right down from where we trained, and he one day
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: he orders a bunch of food and he says, you guys,
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: come delivered to me. He asked for King Kong Bundy.
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: So we're in the ring working out right, and the
• 8:06
  Speaker 4: delivery guy comes in through the front door and he
• 8:09
  Speaker 4: comes into the ring and he goes, I have a
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: delivery here for a ping pong rundy and everybody that's
• 8:17
  Speaker 4: dying and and uh, and Bundy comes out of his office.
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: He goes, that's me and he goes and we all
• 8:26
  Speaker 4: started calling a ping pong after that, and he goes,
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: he was so angry about that, and he's like he's
• 8:36
  Speaker 4: He's like, the next guy who calls me ping pong
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: is gonna be out in the street.
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: But but Bundy was such a cool guy sometimes, and
• 8:47
  Speaker 4: it was I know, I'm going off with King Kong
• 8:50
  Speaker 4: Bundy here, but I'll tell you this one, another funny
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: Bunny story because you get this because you're you know,
• 8:54
  Speaker 4: you grew up watching him and you're obviously you're a
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: professional wrestler. One time Bundy splat. It was an indie
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: show and he splashed the guy and the referee goes one,
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: two three, and Bundy goes five and the ref goes
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: one two three, and Bundy, at this family friendly indie
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: show yells out yo Pisa shit and he shows the
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: rest and the promoter was like, hey, Chris, he goes,
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: this is a family friendly show and you just yelled
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: ship in the middle of the ring in front of kids.
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: He goes, he goes, I'm sorry, He goes, I wanted
• 9:27
  Speaker 4: that five count, and he started counting over from one.
• 9:33
  Speaker 5: Oh man, I'm so glad you have some some indie
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: wrestling memories and stories, even though your your tenure was
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: kind of brief. I mean, those moments, they tend to
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: happen when you when you hang around any of the
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: former stars or the whole indie wrestling seat. So that
• 9:49
  Speaker 5: is classic.
• 9:51
  Speaker 4: It was. I was very fortunate, uh, Matt, because I
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: was in I was involved with pro wrestling for like
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: this little teeny tiny window.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: and now back to the show.
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: And I was just fortunate enough to be in the
• 10:12
  Speaker 4: right place at the right time and just sort of,
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: you know, do my thing. And actually it was funny enough.
• 10:17
  Speaker 4: I actually applied, uh, because I started talking to Andy
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: about going to CCW school back when it was like
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: run by like John Dahmer and Eddie Valentine and those guys,
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: and that I never actually went to a practice, but
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: I was talking to Andy about showing up, and then
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: I ended up trying to go to E. C. W
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: A's school, which was run by Mozart Fontaine, and then
• 10:37
  Speaker 4: then I started then I went to Bundy's school. But
• 10:39
  Speaker 4: you know enough about me, Matt. I'm sorry, I'm like
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: monopolizing this conversation. I'm so sorry. So I want to
• 10:44
  Speaker 4: talk about you, and I want to talk about you know,
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: your your whole career and everything so when you know,
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: you started off in professional wrestling, Now what drew you
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: to actually get into professional wrestling?
• 10:57
  Speaker 5: It was the same as same as you ECW. You
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: I was. That was a promotion that of course came
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: up out of the underground on East coast, United States
• 11:08
  Speaker 5: and had a little bit more edge to it, had
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: a little bit more risk taking, had at a little
• 11:12
  Speaker 5: bit more colorful characters and crowd involvement, and it was extreme.
• 11:17
  Speaker 5: And so that was that was what got me into
• 11:19
  Speaker 5: it as a teenager and what ultimately motivated me and
• 11:23
  Speaker 5: inspired me to pursue it once I my late teams.
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: So, and you grew up in Minnesota, correct.
• 11:32
  Speaker 5: I was born in Minnesota, but I grew up in Pennsylvania.
• 11:35
  Speaker 5: So so I was right there when when E CW
• 11:39
  Speaker 5: was you know, in uh in Pennsylvania and New Jersey
• 11:42
  Speaker 5: and Delaware and New York. And so I hit up
• 11:46
  Speaker 5: several of those shows a month time. I was going
• 11:48
  Speaker 5: all the time with my friends.
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: Oh that's awesome. So you were like really really close
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: to me because I you know, I'm from Philly, so
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: I'm actually you know, I went to a lot of
• 11:56
  Speaker 4: those shows as well. So what was your favorite one
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: of your favorite eac W moments actually going to those shows.
• 12:04
  Speaker 5: The first time I ever went to an ECW show,
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: I was fifteen and this kid that I knew from school,
• 12:11
  Speaker 5: his name was Phil. He said to me, do you
• 12:14
  Speaker 5: want to go to this pro wrestling show? And I
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: was like I don't know, and he's like, you can
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: bring weapons? And I said what and he's like yeah,
• 12:26
  Speaker 5: he's like, yeah, you bring weapons. I'm like, what do
• 12:27
  Speaker 5: you mean weapons? And he's like, just stuff in your
• 12:30
  Speaker 5: house that you know, you wanted to wrestlers to hit
• 12:32
  Speaker 5: each other with. And I didn't know what he was
• 12:33
  Speaker 5: talking about. So yeah, I've got bring some cookie sheets
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: or whatever. And I did. And this, like I said,
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: it was nineteen ninety five. This was before the Athletic
• 12:43
  Speaker 5: Commission really got involved. But every show, not all the wrestlers,
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: but a good number of them would brawl through the crowd,
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: just reach out whatever you hand to max the guy
• 12:52
  Speaker 5: with it to give it back to you. It was
• 12:55
  Speaker 5: very interactive, and oftentimes you get something handed back to
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: you with blood on it. And I couldn't believe this.
• 13:01
  Speaker 5: I just could could couldn't fathom. So that was what
• 13:04
  Speaker 5: hooked me initially. But you know, Paul Hayman with his booking,
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: he was also sure to get some real athleticism and
• 13:12
  Speaker 5: very very talented uh you know athletes on the shows
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: as well, and so it was just a very polished
• 13:18
  Speaker 5: and well rounded product. But that that was what really
• 13:22
  Speaker 5: caught my attention as a teenager.
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and I know what you mean, because it was
• 13:27
  Speaker 4: just so different. It had such an edge to it,
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: which you know, which is indicative because it was like
• 13:31
  Speaker 4: that that sort of backlash because I mean, you remember
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: wrestling in like the early nineties to mid nineties, they
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: had like characters like like Duke de Dumpster, Drosie and
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: Bashi and Booger and all those characters, and they were
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: just so cartoony. And then in WCW had like the
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: Dungeon of Doom and and and you know what was
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: going on there, and then all of a sudden ECW
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: comes in. It's a completely different product. It's a lot edgier,
• 13:53
  Speaker 4: a lot more in your face, a lot more hardcore,
• 13:56
  Speaker 4: and I mean, you know, you just saw it and
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: you were like, what the hell is this? You know,
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: you know, and some people once told me that, and
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: this really was what really I remember most about you know,
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: how how they branded themselves, and it was WF is fake,
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: WCW's fake, but this right here is real.
• 14:15
  Speaker 5: I can yeah, I can literally remember. At one point
• 14:18
  Speaker 5: I was wearing like five VSW shirts a week at
• 14:22
  Speaker 5: school in high school. Each stayed, I'd wear a different one.
• 14:24
  Speaker 5: I was. I was really a fanatic for a while,
• 14:27
  Speaker 5: And I remember giving school presentations. Yeah, you could talk
• 14:30
  Speaker 5: about whatever you wanted, and I gave a presentation on
• 14:34
  Speaker 5: how this wrestling was real. And at one point there
• 14:38
  Speaker 5: was some heat between uh, Cactus Jack and Sandman and
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: I kid you not. I was at a show I
• 14:45
  Speaker 5: think it was in jim Thorpe, Pennsylvania, but it was
• 14:49
  Speaker 5: sort of like a Battle Royal. A new wrestler comes
• 14:52
  Speaker 5: to the ring every I don't know, two minutes or
• 14:54
  Speaker 5: something like that, and Sandman comes out with a fresh
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: sing poor cane, which is like strands of bamboo, you know,
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: tied together, swings it hits Nick Foley Cactus Jack on
• 15:09
  Speaker 5: the side of the face, the cheekbone, and shatters the cane.
• 15:12
  Speaker 5: I'm not kidding. He swung it like a baseball bat
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: and pieces flew in the crowd, and I picked up
• 15:17
  Speaker 5: a piece of this cane and this is one of
• 15:19
  Speaker 5: the things I brought into school just to try and
• 15:21
  Speaker 5: convince people that this is real, real wrestling.
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: It's like it's like, it's like, hey, look look at
• 15:30
  Speaker 4: this teacher. It's it's a piece of cane that that
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: got some guy named Cactus Jacket of busted over his head,
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: and it's just did did teacher like freak out and
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: be like, what the hell?
• 15:41
  Speaker 5: It's funny because I think what spurred this on was
• 15:43
  Speaker 5: the teacher, I don't know, overheard me talking about this
• 15:48
  Speaker 5: wrestling and how it's real, and she's like, you know,
• 15:50
  Speaker 5: it's all just effects and they don't really get hurt
• 15:53
  Speaker 5: and the blood is fake. And I remember also bringing
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: in a cookie sheet that had blood just like crusty
• 15:58
  Speaker 5: blood dripped, dripped all the way. Doubt it, but I
• 16:01
  Speaker 5: remember telling the story and the teacher was just but
• 16:05
  Speaker 5: I have.
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: Hey, Matt, are you still there? So if you can
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: hear me, we were going good and all of a
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: sudden you cut out. There's like this whistling. Oh now
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: it's gone, it's back. Now there's like this whistling I
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: can hear. I don't know what that is.
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: It's kind of an open area. I passed through a valance.
• 16:40
  Speaker 5: But let me know, is the whistling still there?
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: No, it's gone.
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: Now.
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: I don't know what that was. It was weird, but
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry. So could you take it right from where
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: you had you said about the crusty blood coming down
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: the cookie sheet?
• 16:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so I think I think what caused the what
• 16:58
  Speaker 5: motivated this present patient was a teacher overhearing me talking
• 17:02
  Speaker 5: about the wrestling being real and saying that's not real.
• 17:06
  Speaker 5: That's you know, they're they're stunt men and the blood
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: is fake. And so I brought in this piece of
• 17:13
  Speaker 5: Singapore cane. I remember bringing in a cookie sheet that
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: had crusty blood on it, and that kind of silenced
• 17:20
  Speaker 5: the teacher. But half the students in the class are
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: just looking at me like what's with this dude? Like
• 17:25
  Speaker 5: why does he even want to talk about this stuff?
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: But I was riveted as a teenager.
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: You know, I was the same as you, Matt when
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: I was in high school because I had all the
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: wrestling T shirts and stuff. And I remember one time
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: I wore Yosha Heir ta Jerry t shirt and it
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: was all in Japanese and a friend of mine was like,
• 17:44
  Speaker 4: what the hell is this. He goes, you were Now
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: you don't even wearing shirts in English anymore. He's like,
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: it's all in Japanese. He's like, he's like, I don't
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: even know if this guy's even a wrestler or whatever.
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: And then I mean, I know you did this as well,
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: but you got involved in backyard wrestling. I did. I
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: did that as well. And it went from this, like
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: my league that I had, we were like, you know,
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: it was a fun little thing. Then all of a sudden,
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: it started getting more and more like violence, to the
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: point where our final our final time that we had
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: an event, if you want to call it an event.
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: What happened was the neighbors up at the top of
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: this hill could see down onto us, and they actually
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: called the comps on us because they were like, oh,
• 18:25
  Speaker 4: these kids are having a brawl down there. And it
• 18:28
  Speaker 4: was so weird how it happened, because this like one
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: bike cop shows up first, right, one Loan bike cop,
• 18:34
  Speaker 4: and he goes, hey, guys, what's going on? And we're
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: just like, because we were all just standing there, We're like, hey, dude,
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: you know, like, you know, we were just it wasn't
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: like a confrontation. It was like a friendly conversation, like
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: a bike cop randomly covering in my friend's backyard and
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: he pulled because he had a driveway let all the
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: way all the way down. It was really weird how
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: we had this set up. So the bike cop just
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: went down us that and he's like, well, he goes
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: we had a report that there's like a brawl or
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: a mob brawl or something going on. I'm like, well,
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: not here. Well, all of a sudden, all these other
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: cars sort of come, like police cars, sort of coming
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: down like, oh my god, are you guys or what
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: are you guys doing back hereh blah blah. Well, all
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: of a sudden, my friend's mom comes out of her
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: their house and she's drunk as shit, and she's trying
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: to like what are they doing out here now? And
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: I mean it was like it was like the worst
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: case anaria that could have happened. And it's just like afterwards,
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: the friends and I were like, I don't think we
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: should do this anymore, and and and everyone everyone kind
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: of agreed because see the guy, the guy. Obviously we
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: didn't get in trouble or anything. We're like, you know,
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: if something were going on, it would have been like terrible,
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: But I know you also did backyard wrestling too, right
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: right right, Matt.
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And it's funny here and you say that, it
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: just dawn on me. I think number one, we would
• 19:48
  Speaker 5: have been pretty good friends had been grown up together too.
• 19:51
  Speaker 5: We might have led to uh, some some I don't
• 19:54
  Speaker 5: know if i'd say jail time, but some trouble with
• 19:56
  Speaker 5: the law as well, because like whenever I had somebody
• 20:00
  Speaker 5: throw gas on the on the fire with me, like,
• 20:02
  Speaker 5: we ended up getting in trouble and that probably would
• 20:04
  Speaker 5: have been the case.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: and now back to the show.
• 20:15
  Speaker 5: But but yeah, we we dabbled in the backyard as well.
• 20:19
  Speaker 5: This was before that whole movement, but we would we
• 20:22
  Speaker 5: would just call it ninja battles. We'd play music, store
• 20:26
  Speaker 5: up a bunch of weapons and it was just unscripted chaos.
• 20:30
  Speaker 5: It was funny. Sometimes people got hurt, it was exciting.
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: But yeah, we did this, you know, at least once
• 20:35
  Speaker 5: a month, sometimes a couple of times a month, and
• 20:38
  Speaker 5: would end up limping around school with bruises and little
• 20:41
  Speaker 5: cuts and stuff. But yeah, that was that was a
• 20:43
  Speaker 5: big part of my teenage years as well.
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we would have been good friends, Matt, and
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: we probably we probably would have done jail time together
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: because you and I are are kind of close in age.
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: I'm thirty two and I know we're so we're kind
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: of close in age, and it would have been kind
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: of funny to go to school together. I you know.
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: But and be cause again you're you were right probably
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: right up the street from me, because I'm right here
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: in uh in Philly, So you're probably right, You're probably
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: growing up right down the street from me, and I
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: didn't even know it because we've had all these like
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: you know, cut meetings and stuff like that. But uh so,
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: you know, as you as you wanted, you know, gotten
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: and did all this backyard wrestling, you know a aka
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: ninja battles, at which point, you know, did you want
• 21:24
  Speaker 4: to go professional with this?
• 21:27
  Speaker 5: This was around the end of high school. I had
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: I was naturally gifted when it came to art. That
• 21:38
  Speaker 5: was something I just gravitated towards and and everybody assumed
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: I was going to go to art school. I was
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: going to pursue it, but I had a real bad
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: time with some of my teachers in high school. And
• 21:49
  Speaker 5: especially my senior year. And at the same time we
• 21:54
  Speaker 5: had a growing interest in this wrestling stuff, and so
• 21:58
  Speaker 5: with with some really frustrating things with teachers and getting
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: in trouble my senior year, which is when I was
• 22:03
  Speaker 5: trying to clean up my act, but I had some
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: unfortunate things happened. I've told this story before, but essentially
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: I designed our school's yearbook cover and I made a
• 22:13
  Speaker 5: really elaborate design, put some symbols on it that were
• 22:18
  Speaker 5: inspired by Greek mythology, and I can't remember what else.
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: But they printed the yearbooks, passed them out last minute.
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: I get accused of putting satanic symbols on the yearbook cover.
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: It was a huge deal. They weren't going to let
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: me graduate. They hired a special investigator to look into this.
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: He got back and he said, if anything, these are
• 22:40
  Speaker 5: more gang related, not satanic. But he said, this is
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: nothing to worry about. I was cleared of all charges,
• 22:47
  Speaker 5: but like I was so upset over this incident and
• 22:51
  Speaker 5: other bad experiences with some art teachers in high school
• 22:54
  Speaker 5: that I just said, screw it, I'm going to wrestling school. Yeah,
• 23:01
  Speaker 5: that was my senior year. It was just a growing
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: interest in ECW and I finally started putting some muscle
• 23:07
  Speaker 5: on working out, and I just said, you know what,
• 23:09
  Speaker 5: I think I could do this. This is what I'm
• 23:11
  Speaker 5: going to do. I knew it was going to be
• 23:12
  Speaker 5: short term, but it was I figured I'd take a
• 23:15
  Speaker 5: break and shake off all the school drama for a
• 23:18
  Speaker 5: while and just do something really wild.
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah. And and honestly, I think you dodged a bullet
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: not going to art school. I honestly, you know, listeners
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: of this podcast, No, man, I am against college. And
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: I know everybody immediately as soon as I say something
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: like that, everyone goes, what you know? But but I
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: am man, I've I've you know, I I have a
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: college education, I graduated from college. I have a huge
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: student loan debt. That degree has helped me not one iota.
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: And also I worked at the college I graduated from.
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: That was a terrible experience. And I can tell you man,
• 23:56
  Speaker 4: you know, but just it's just funny. You mentioned, you know,
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: just going back when you were talking about they had
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: a special investigator come in. You know, schools, it's it's unbelievable.
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: When schools want to spend money on something stupid, they
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: will always find thousands of dollars to spend money on
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: like an investigator to investigate stuff like this. But yet
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: when when when people were actually asking for money for
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: like real things, they're like, oh, sorry, we have nothing
• 24:21
  Speaker 4: to spend.
• 24:24
  Speaker 5: I can. I can remember looking the principle in the
• 24:27
  Speaker 5: eyes and I said, you listen to me. I said,
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: not only am I going to graduate, I'm not going
• 24:33
  Speaker 5: to serve one bit of punishment or anything for this,
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: I said, mark my words. Principal didn't know what to say,
• 24:40
  Speaker 5: but fortunately it ended up being being right. My dad
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: was out of the state or out of the country,
• 24:47
  Speaker 5: I can't remember at the time. He might have been
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: visiting my sister in Spain. She was going to college there.
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: But my dad called the school as well, and he said,
• 24:54
  Speaker 5: you guys are fortunate I'm not there right now if
• 24:56
  Speaker 5: you're going to do this to my son. And it
• 24:59
  Speaker 5: was just so absurd, like accusing me of being the
• 25:01
  Speaker 5: Satan worshiper and trying to put these symbols on your
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: book covers. So it was a small town I grew
• 25:07
  Speaker 5: up in. It was Lancaster, Pennsylvania. I was in Elkins
• 25:11
  Speaker 5: Park for a while, very close to you. But then
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: I was in Lancaster with you know, small country, small
• 25:18
  Speaker 5: town environment, so you know, people get freaked out over
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: that sort of thing and it's it's a witch hunt
• 25:24
  Speaker 5: and so unfortunately I went through that. But yeah, that
• 25:26
  Speaker 5: was that was rough.
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Lancaster is you know, probably about forty five minutes
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: fifty minutes away from me, and you know, I know
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: the small town in talking about you know, because I
• 25:36
  Speaker 4: actually had a friend of mine we actually shot a
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: movie in Birdsborough, Birdsborough, which I'm sure do you know
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: where that is?
• 25:44
  Speaker 5: Yes, I've heard of Birdsborough, Yes.
• 25:45
  Speaker 4: Okay, So we actually shot a movie there and it
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: was just funny because when he said that town name
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: and like, what the hell is? What the hell is Birdsborough?
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: Like it was just this little like burg and it's
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: just I've been up there, so I know, you know
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: that that mentality, you know what I mean, like he's
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: trying to you know, he's trying to trying to you know, uh,
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: you know, poison them all. He's saying with these sagitanic symbols,
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean. It's but but you know
• 26:09
  Speaker 4: when when you when you were talking about going to
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: college and you know, and you had a choice, been
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: going to college arrestling school. I honestly, you know, Matt,
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: I think you did the right right thing, not only
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: because we're talking have this conversation obviously, but with you know,
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: the decisions you made, but also because I honestly, most
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: people I know that go to college just aren't happy
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: at all.
• 26:29
  Speaker 5: You know, I agree with you, and I have heard
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: your previous podcasts and I know your stance on this,
• 26:35
  Speaker 5: and I'll say that I believe self motivation plays such
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: a big part of how well your college experience does
• 26:44
  Speaker 5: or doesn't go, because I can tell you I didn't
• 26:47
  Speaker 5: get all the film education I needed in college, but
• 26:50
  Speaker 5: I had a tight knit group of friends that we
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: just worked so hard on each other's shoots and that
• 26:56
  Speaker 5: was where we learned the most. And so as far
• 26:59
  Speaker 5: as what college did for me, it's just the schedule,
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: the discipline, having deadlines, and then learning how to work
• 27:07
  Speaker 5: with people, and you know, having projects that have to
• 27:10
  Speaker 5: be turned in, so the routine. So I will say, yes,
• 27:14
  Speaker 5: you can do all of that on your own, but
• 27:16
  Speaker 5: you have to be very motivated. And you know, you
• 27:18
  Speaker 5: can't say, oh, well, my job got in the way,
• 27:21
  Speaker 5: I can't go to college, or you can't say, oh,
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: my kids or my whatever, you know, are distracting me.
• 27:27
  Speaker 5: It's like, you have these deadlines you have to hit,
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: but I know exactly what you need. If you're not
• 27:32
  Speaker 5: self motivated, you're not going to learn what you need
• 27:35
  Speaker 5: to learn.
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And it's you know, just with college in general,
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: what I've noticed just when working in a college, actually
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: at several colleges, and also at attending a college is
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: you know, a lot of the kids who go there
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: are always told you have to go to college if
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: you want a good job. And I see a lot
• 27:55
  Speaker 4: of the people that go to certain colleges they're they're
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: just not there to learn and to get better. They
• 28:03
  Speaker 4: feel like it's just something where they have to do
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: to get that degree, and it's like, let's get let's
• 28:07
  Speaker 4: get this over as quick as possible. And I think
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: that's just bad as well, because it's just like it
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: shouldn't be something where you're like, all right, I gotta
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: do this if I want, if I gotta, you know,
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: go out and get this degree and whatever. I mean,
• 28:19
  Speaker 4: half of the where I worked at, mainly where I
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: worked at was one of those discounted college that you
• 28:23
  Speaker 4: always hear about. You know what, I mean where it's
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: just pure fluff. There's you know, nobody ever knows what's
• 28:28
  Speaker 4: going on. That was literally every every trope, every stereotype
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: you could think of of college was this college. It
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: was just a small little college right outside of Philly,
• 28:39
  Speaker 4: and it just you know, there was like really nothing
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: going on there, and half the kids there, or even
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: more than half the kids, had like no plan. It
• 28:47
  Speaker 4: was just like we're here, you know, just to sort
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: of pass the time or whatever, you know what I mean.
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: And I as we sort of talk about like education
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: in general, you know, you and I are big movie fans,
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: and you really don't need to go to college to
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: take a lot of move and to learn about to
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: learn about movies, or even your go to film school
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: or whatever, because that's a big topic obviously on this podcast,
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: is if film school's even worth it. And you know, now,
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: you know, if you want to, if you or I
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: even nowadays wanted to to gain more knowledge of film,
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: we could get a Netflix rental. I could go out
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: right now and buy a camera package and it would
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: be cheaper all of that, and I could even add
• 29:27
  Speaker 4: a lot more stuff to it then then it would
• 29:29
  Speaker 4: be cheaper than one even one semester of college.
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: It's absolutely true. And I feel like, you know, we
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: went through the season of Oh boy, like here come
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: the movies, like everybody can make a movie. But I
• 29:45
  Speaker 5: actually feel like it's slowly going to rebound where quality
• 29:48
  Speaker 5: is going to be necessary because it is so easy
• 29:51
  Speaker 5: to make a movie, or at least compared to what
• 29:53
  Speaker 5: it used to be.
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: and now back to the show.
• 30:04
  Speaker 5: But I'm actually that's kind of a different topic. But
• 30:07
  Speaker 5: like I'm hoping the industry is going to go in
• 30:10
  Speaker 5: that direction. I mean, the mainstream things are always going
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: to be a formula that you know, they know that
• 30:15
  Speaker 5: the masters want to see. But I'm just saying because
• 30:18
  Speaker 5: it's getting so easy and you can really educate yourself
• 30:21
  Speaker 5: and you know, create the product on your own. Like
• 30:23
  Speaker 5: I'm hoping that and I believe I'm starting to see it,
• 30:26
  Speaker 5: Like you have to be really really sharp at your
• 30:28
  Speaker 5: craft if you're gonna if you're going to cut through
• 30:30
  Speaker 5: all that, you know.
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's another thing that you know, we talk
• 30:35
  Speaker 4: a lot about this on the podcast, is that that
• 30:38
  Speaker 4: allure that everybody can make a movie and honestly, hand
• 30:41
  Speaker 4: to god, it is true. Everybody can make a movie,
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: you know, because we have our phones, we have camera
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: packages that are getting cheaper and cheaper. The the difference
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: is about making a quality movie. And I have been
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: on bad film sets. I've been on really good film sets,
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: and I can you know, and also I can see
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: what the the end product is going to be. Excuse
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: me and I and I can see, you know, as
• 31:04
  Speaker 4: we can sort of go through all the you know,
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: through all these different phases of of what we're doing
• 31:09
  Speaker 4: going with through now with film and distribution and marketing
• 31:13
  Speaker 4: and and all the new wonderful advancements and cameras, you
• 31:16
  Speaker 4: kind of start looking around and you go, wow, you know,
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: people are I had shown Baker on here who shot
• 31:23
  Speaker 4: Tangerine on his iPhone, and and it was you know,
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: I think it won sun Dance. Uh you know, I
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: had on somebody else who shot their film with a GoPro,
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: and you know, it's it's about how they I mean,
• 31:35
  Speaker 4: obviously there's a lot more to it than I'm what
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: I'm saying. It's so if anyone's listening to this, I
• 31:39
  Speaker 4: think it's just you know, picking up a phone and
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: you know, going out and filming, and that's not what
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: they did. They did a lot more to it. But
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: I think you're absolutely right, Matt. I think honestly, it's
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: going to bounce back through them later. And I think
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: it's because I think a lot of people are just
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: gonna make one movie and maybe sort of go away
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: from it, you know what I mean. They're gonna say, hey, listen,
• 31:56
  Speaker 4: I made my movie in my backyard with my friends,
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: and you know, maybe they like, they didn't like the
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: experience and that was sort of it for them. And
• 32:04
  Speaker 4: then then and then you know, they're gonna have to
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: realize because the quality that people are used to is
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: gonna always gonna be there, and especially now with YouTube
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: and Hulu and or not not not Hulua Vimeo. You see,
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: like people like like independent filmmakers and within the quality
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: that they can do, and it's just, you know, it
• 32:21
  Speaker 4: does raise the bar for you know what an indie
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: standard is.
• 32:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly right, And the two main questions are always
• 32:30
  Speaker 5: going to be there. Who's in it and what's it about?
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: You know, if you're sitting in the room and somebody says, oh, hey,
• 32:36
  Speaker 5: this movie is coming out this weekend, you know who's
• 32:39
  Speaker 5: in it? Oh, it's Tom Cruise. What's it about? He's
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: he's trying to stop this bomb that's that's gonna blow
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: off the Parliament building in London or whatever. You know.
• 32:49
  Speaker 5: But those questions, but especially the what's it about? You
• 32:53
  Speaker 5: have to have a really sharp hook and a really
• 32:55
  Speaker 5: sharp idea and notion. And I still think it's tough
• 32:59
  Speaker 5: to sell a really good film without a star in
• 33:01
  Speaker 5: it if you don't have the star in it. And
• 33:03
  Speaker 5: so I think they're gonna be weeding through, you know,
• 33:05
  Speaker 5: the top talent, and so because so many people are
• 33:09
  Speaker 5: gonna be coming at them with offers and with films nowadays,
• 33:13
  Speaker 5: that it's gonna have, it's gonna have to be a
• 33:15
  Speaker 5: rock solid concept. And so, you know, I'm optimistic that
• 33:18
  Speaker 5: it did. Like I say, it's it's going to start
• 33:20
  Speaker 5: to weed out the It's great that people are making
• 33:24
  Speaker 5: films with their iPhones and their go pros, but you
• 33:26
  Speaker 5: know that's not gonna work ninety nine times out of
• 33:30
  Speaker 5: one hundred, you know what I mean. It's like, you're
• 33:31
  Speaker 5: gonna have to be very very sharp at your skill
• 33:34
  Speaker 5: if you're gonna pull that off.
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And you know what I found to be most
• 33:39
  Speaker 4: true about all of this too, is you know, when
• 33:40
  Speaker 4: Netflix first started, I actually were I was actually, you know,
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: a pretty early subscriber on Netflix. And you know what's
• 33:47
  Speaker 4: funny was that they used to let you submit your
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: films to Netflix directly, like it wasn't a whole process,
• 33:53
  Speaker 4: Like there was literally a tab that said submit your
• 33:56
  Speaker 4: film to Netflix. I actually had friends who got their
• 33:59
  Speaker 4: movies into Netflix with like absolute Drek and they knew
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: it was Drek, and they were like, you know, they
• 34:06
  Speaker 4: were telling me like, hey, Netflix accepted my movie. And
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: I said what really? And I said wow, And then
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: I you know, it was basically like a kind of
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: like an all shoot at YouTube at that point then,
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: because I well, my perception of it, because I kept
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: I was like, wow, this this was like something with
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: a mini dvcam. Nowadays, it's like that obviously is long gone,
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: and now they you know, you have to have certain
• 34:27
  Speaker 4: even deliverable requirements to even get on Netflix even you
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: know what I mean, because they actually have the minimum
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: requirements listed on the website that say, though, this is
• 34:38
  Speaker 4: what you're going to have to have if you ever
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: want to see your movie on our website, and which
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: kind of sort of brings me what I wanted to
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: talk about with you is, you know, you got into filmmaking,
• 34:48
  Speaker 4: so you know, and and you know we're talking about
• 34:51
  Speaker 4: the film education. So when you were still pro wrestling,
• 34:54
  Speaker 4: you you actually you had a job at Blockbuster at
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: some point, right.
• 35:00
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And my first two years into film school, I
• 35:04
  Speaker 5: was still wrestling on the weekends and keeping out a
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: secret for those that don't know, I was involved in
• 35:13
  Speaker 5: some very violent wrestling beyond hardcore wrestling, the ultra violent
• 35:18
  Speaker 5: wrestling is what they were calling it at the time,
• 35:20
  Speaker 5: and which would leave me bruised, limping oftentimes with stitches.
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: And I wasn't telling anybody about this in art school.
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: I was trying to hide it. And so I used
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: to say, it was always like the movie Fight Club.
• 35:34
  Speaker 5: I'm just trying to make up an excuse of what
• 35:36
  Speaker 5: happened to me and live in this double life. But
• 35:39
  Speaker 5: anybody who's gone to college full time, and anybody who
• 35:43
  Speaker 5: thinks going to art school is easy, you like, it's
• 35:46
  Speaker 5: not real college, the man, is it ever hard work
• 35:48
  Speaker 5: everything that they dump on you. And so those first
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: two years were very very hard, you know, flying out
• 35:54
  Speaker 5: on the weekends, getting banged up, bruised up, cut up,
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: and then coming back and trying to make ptain a
• 36:00
  Speaker 5: full schedule at college. So so yeah, I was I
• 36:02
  Speaker 5: was juggling both for a while.
• 36:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, because I remember, I forget what it was,
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: but I saw a photo of you, uh, you know,
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: doing your your trademark hand gesture and you you're with
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: the Blockbuster shirt on, and I remember saying, oh, man,
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: you know, uh, you know your your wrestling name sick
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: Nick Mondo. I remember saying to myself, Oh, Mando works
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: at Blockbuster. That's freaking cool. Uh you know, because I
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: I imagine you know now as we're talking, you must
• 36:28
  Speaker 4: have been able to get a lot of free rentals
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: to get like a really cool uh you know, film school,
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: you know, rate your fingertips. We're actually watching movies, kind
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: of like what Quentin Tarantino did.
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: I really enjoyed working at Blockbuster for a long time,
• 36:41
  Speaker 5: and I'm like, they'd have the employee recommendation wall and
• 36:44
  Speaker 5: nobody cared about it, but I really did, and i'd
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: update it and just chat with customers. And we were
• 36:51
  Speaker 5: a smaller store, but my sales numbers were matching anybody
• 36:55
  Speaker 5: like in the bigger district stores. I'd sell the rewards
• 36:59
  Speaker 5: programs whatever else, because I if I believe in something,
• 37:02
  Speaker 5: I can sell it, you know. But I it was
• 37:04
  Speaker 5: really fun for a while, you know, for a few
• 37:06
  Speaker 5: years working there. But I did him a couple of times.
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: Like I said, I wasn't telling people I was wrestling.
• 37:11
  Speaker 5: And one time I was working and that the manager
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: was there and somebody came in and and he sees
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: me and he's like yo, he's like sick, Nick Mondo.
• 37:20
  Speaker 5: And I just kind of froze and I was just
• 37:22
  Speaker 5: like hi, and he's like, yeah, I saw you wrestling
• 37:26
  Speaker 5: the West Saint Paul Armory or something, so on and
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: so forth. And I noticed my manager's kind of watching,
• 37:30
  Speaker 5: like what. And then he came over afterwards and he's like, so,
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: what was that about? And reluctantly I told him. But
• 37:38
  Speaker 5: then I you know what I did. I walked over.
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: We had a video game you could rent. It was
• 37:43
  Speaker 5: Backyard Wrestling Too. There goes the Neighborhood. That's that's what
• 37:47
  Speaker 5: the game was called. And I was I was in
• 37:49
  Speaker 5: that game, and I was actually on the back cover
• 37:51
  Speaker 5: of it. Because he didn't believe me that I was
• 37:53
  Speaker 5: a wrestler, and I was like, yeah, that's something I
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: did for a while. I had just quit at the time, actually,
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: But it's just a weird class I was. I was
• 38:03
  Speaker 5: friends with Ken Kennedy and he was living in Minnesota
• 38:07
  Speaker 5: and so was I. And just one time, randomly, he
• 38:10
  Speaker 5: brought Matt Hardy into the store to meet me. I'm
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: working and just Ken walked and you know, brought him
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: in and I worked out laughing. I didn't mean to
• 38:18
  Speaker 5: when I saw Matt because it was just like the
• 38:19
  Speaker 5: funniest thing, Like I didn't expect Matt Hardy to come in,
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: but yeah, then we chatted for a while, and then
• 38:24
  Speaker 5: that was really cool. And uh then I got to
• 38:26
  Speaker 5: see them wrestle at the Target Center a couple of
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: days later or day later or something like that. But
• 38:32
  Speaker 5: but yeah, a weird, weird mix of worlds for sure.
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: So Matt, I can I just ask, is Ken Kennedy
• 38:39
  Speaker 4: a good guy in person?
• 38:41
  Speaker 5: Man? I I got along with him instantly, and yeah,
• 38:47
  Speaker 5: we're both living in Minnesota, and I know there's some
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: heat in WWE, some some clashes of people. I don't
• 38:55
  Speaker 5: even know the full story. That unfortunately led to him
• 38:57
  Speaker 5: not going as far as a lot of people expected
• 38:59
  Speaker 5: him to you there, but I don't quite know what happened,
• 39:03
  Speaker 5: but I'll just say, like I we loved that guy.
• 39:06
  Speaker 5: We brought him onto some film projects and my friends
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: everybody just was so entertained by him, and I always
• 39:13
  Speaker 5: enjoyed being around cat really really did you know?
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: I know, I'm sorry to sort of go on a
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: side topic here, Matt. I had a funny little Ken
• 39:22
  Speaker 4: Kennedy story. I was remember when he was in that
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: movie behind Emily Lines for Columbia.
• 39:28
  Speaker 5: Yep.
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: Well, I actually he was going to be in Philly
• 39:31
  Speaker 4: for a signing, so I said, you know what to
• 39:33
  Speaker 4: my friend, I said, you know, let's go down there.
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: I want to meet him just for shits and giggles.
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: And we both like, you know, we both we both
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: like movies. He me and his friend of mine, and
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: we both at the time were kind of iffy about wrestling,
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: but we knew who he was, so I said, you know,
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: let's just go down there. We walk in and this
• 39:51
  Speaker 4: woman is standing there and saying that we both need
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: to buy a copy of the movie for us to
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: meet him.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 40:04
  Speaker 3: And now back to the show.
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: So I said, okay, I said, all right. Then, so
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: I go to pick up a copy of the movie
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: and it's retail. They didn't even have it on sale.
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: It was like thirty five dollars or whatever for this
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: blu ray And I said, are you serious, You're really
• 40:20
  Speaker 4: going to charge us and not even like discount this thing.
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: And she goes, you get to go up there and
• 40:23
  Speaker 4: meet Ken Kennedy and blah blah blah this and that,
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: and my friend actually refused to do it, and it
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: ended up where we were he refused to buy a
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: copy of the movie, and then then this woman was
• 40:36
  Speaker 4: basically just goating us into a fight, and it was
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: just like finally we just left and we're like, oh, well,
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: but we never but we never got to meet Ken
• 40:43
  Speaker 4: Kennedy whatsoever. And it was just kind of weird that
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: we went only up there and we ended up just
• 40:49
  Speaker 4: getting turned away because like we wouldn't buy this movie
• 40:51
  Speaker 4: at like a full retail price, and my friend obviously
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: was just had a big problem about it. But it
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: was just I don't know, I just always think about
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: that every time Ken Kennedy. It's the first thing that
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: comes to my mind.
• 41:03
  Speaker 5: What a what a disappointing experience. I would imagine if
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: Ken knew about that, he wouldn't have had that at all.
• 41:10
  Speaker 5: I mean, I used to I used to be on
• 41:12
  Speaker 5: indie wrestling shows with him, and he was nothing, but
• 41:14
  Speaker 5: he was he was a loud now and he was
• 41:16
  Speaker 5: a heel. But he'd always take time for pictures and
• 41:19
  Speaker 5: signings and everything. So that's, yeah, that's unfortunate.
• 41:23
  Speaker 4: That that's so good to know. And and hopefully maybe
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: one day I can have Ken on the show because
• 41:27
  Speaker 4: he does he does do acting, he does do movies,
• 41:30
  Speaker 4: and uh, I would love to talk to him at
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: some points. But but you know, but sorry, Matt, sorry
• 41:36
  Speaker 4: to go on that little side note there, But but
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: so you retired from wrestling and right around like two thousand,
• 41:42
  Speaker 4: two thousand and three, two thousand and four, and the
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: reason was was were you just you just burned out
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: from from pro wrestling or was this always sort of
• 41:49
  Speaker 4: your plan to sort of, you know, retire for a
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: few years.
• 41:55
  Speaker 5: I got hurt pretty badly in my final performance. I
• 41:58
  Speaker 5: was a death match tournament. Death matches just basically a
• 42:01
  Speaker 5: match that involves weapons or extremely dangerous things in the ring.
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: I did three matches that night and won that tournament,
• 42:10
  Speaker 5: but I got hurt very badly in the second round. However,
• 42:16
  Speaker 5: my plan was always to wrestle for maybe one or
• 42:19
  Speaker 5: two years. When I started training, my goal was to
• 42:23
  Speaker 5: go to ECW, the company that we were talking about earlier,
• 42:27
  Speaker 5: but as you mentioned, they went bankrupt in two thousand
• 42:29
  Speaker 5: and one. This was right when I was starting to
• 42:31
  Speaker 5: develop a name for myself, and so I did wrestle
• 42:35
  Speaker 5: for a couple of years past that. It was about
• 42:37
  Speaker 5: four and a half years that I wrestled almost five
• 42:41
  Speaker 5: But no, I never I never planned on having a
• 42:44
  Speaker 5: long career, and so it was just a matter of
• 42:47
  Speaker 5: picking the right time to leave, and so so yeah,
• 42:52
  Speaker 5: that was I actually decided I was going to quit,
• 42:53
  Speaker 5: like three months before that performance. That was when I
• 42:56
  Speaker 5: decided that.
• 42:58
  Speaker 4: You know, I remember that that leap or I'm sorry,
• 43:01
  Speaker 4: not the leap, but I remember the the sort of
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: I think Zandi gave you the power bomb or or
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: a gorilla press slam off of the of was it
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: raxbar and billiards off of the roof through I think
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: three tables and in fact, he you know, you didn't
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: even hit a table, You just hit right to the concrete.
• 43:20
  Speaker 5: It was. It was terrible. I was knocked out cold.
• 43:24
  Speaker 5: I severed an artery in my spine, or not in
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: my spine, but to the side of my back. There
• 43:29
  Speaker 5: was a there was an artery. I didn't even know
• 43:30
  Speaker 5: I was bleeding that bad, and I had never been
• 43:33
  Speaker 5: rattled like that in my life. I when I woke up,
• 43:35
  Speaker 5: I couldn't move any limbs. It took me a while
• 43:39
  Speaker 5: to even get any movement back in my limbs, and
• 43:41
  Speaker 5: so in bad concussion and probably all sorts of fractured
• 43:46
  Speaker 5: bones from that. I actually didn't go and get xtraight,
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: but but I was. I was hurt very badly from that.
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: And but then you still went on the wrestle again
• 43:55
  Speaker 4: later that night, again against Ian Rotten in the finals.
• 43:59
  Speaker 5: I'm tlod people. Oftentimes the referee will reach down and
• 44:04
  Speaker 5: like put two fingers in your hand, and he'll say,
• 44:07
  Speaker 5: if you're okay, squeeze my fingers. And I remember it
• 44:10
  Speaker 5: was like, right after I got the movement back in
• 44:12
  Speaker 5: my limbs, he did that, and I squeezed his fingers.
• 44:16
  Speaker 5: But when I tried to sit up and I could
• 44:17
  Speaker 5: feel how hurt I was, it was. It was the
• 44:19
  Speaker 5: first time I ever thought like I shouldn't have squeezed
• 44:22
  Speaker 5: his fingers, like I have hurt that bad. But the
• 44:25
  Speaker 5: plan was for me to win that match and go
• 44:27
  Speaker 5: on to the finals, and so so I did. But
• 44:30
  Speaker 5: I was in awful shape.
• 44:33
  Speaker 4: So you know, so, Matt, So what point did you
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: know after you you won the tournament did you even
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: think about maybe going to the hospital after that and
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: just saying, you know what, I think I'm just too
• 44:44
  Speaker 4: banged up. I think it should go to the.
• 44:46
  Speaker 5: Hospital between matches. Before I went out from my final
• 44:50
  Speaker 5: match that night, I was really out of it. I
• 44:53
  Speaker 5: can only remember about half of it. I had a
• 44:55
  Speaker 5: terrible concussion. But when a nurse pulled a piece of
• 44:59
  Speaker 5: glass out of my back, I started gushing blood like profusely.
• 45:03
  Speaker 5: They couldn't get it to stop. They were actually going
• 45:05
  Speaker 5: to call an ambulance. They said, call an ambulance, but
• 45:10
  Speaker 5: I still hadn't told hardly anybody. But because I knew
• 45:14
  Speaker 5: that I wanted to finish my last match and then
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: be done, I said, no, just wrap me up, let
• 45:19
  Speaker 5: me finish this. I needed to go to the hospital.
• 45:23
  Speaker 5: But I was at that point, I was so done
• 45:25
  Speaker 5: with wrestling, just because I was carrying a lot of stress,
• 45:28
  Speaker 5: and I was really banged up. I was really beat up.
• 45:30
  Speaker 5: I already had the broken wrist coming into that tournament,
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: and I was just fed up with it. And then
• 45:35
  Speaker 5: I got hurt really bad there, and I couldn't stand
• 45:38
  Speaker 5: the thought of having to come back and do the finals, like,
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: you know, a month later, and so I said, just
• 45:42
  Speaker 5: let me finish this. You know, I'm I'm not sure
• 45:45
  Speaker 5: that was the best decision, but it was what I
• 45:47
  Speaker 5: what I chose at the time.
• 45:50
  Speaker 4: And I mean, you know, for everyone listening to this
• 45:53
  Speaker 4: and then wondering, like, my god, how do you how
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: do you come back from something like that? Just I'm
• 45:59
  Speaker 4: not going to tell me professional wrestling, but just in
• 46:01
  Speaker 4: just in general, you know, were you just you're endorphins
• 46:05
  Speaker 4: just so upright at that point where you're just in
• 46:08
  Speaker 4: dorphins just sort of taking you over, and you were
• 46:10
  Speaker 4: sort of like an autopilot.
• 46:13
  Speaker 5: I barely was functioning. I can remember bits and pieces.
• 46:18
  Speaker 5: I remember trying to call my final match, and I
• 46:22
  Speaker 5: would just have moments where I would drift off and
• 46:24
  Speaker 5: say nothing. And Ian Rotten, who I was gonna wrestle,
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: kept saying like, are you sure you can do this?
• 46:31
  Speaker 5: Like are you sure? Are you sure you can do this?
• 46:33
  Speaker 5: And so he had to pretty much just like handfeed
• 46:36
  Speaker 5: me that last match. My head was so scrambled and
• 46:38
  Speaker 5: I was so out of it. So no, it wasn't
• 46:40
  Speaker 5: even an adrenaline rush. It was more just I want
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: to get this over and go home and know that
• 46:45
  Speaker 5: it's done, you know, so that that was the only
• 46:47
  Speaker 5: thing carrying me through.
• 46:49
  Speaker 4: And so so in the aftermath, you know, you're retired
• 46:53
  Speaker 4: from professional wrestling, and you know, I actually ended up
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: a few years ago seeing a documentary you made called Unscarred,
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: this Mondo Story, and I wanted to ask about that,
• 47:02
  Speaker 4: you know, because that was actually funny because you had
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: a lot of footage on there that I thought it
• 47:06
  Speaker 4: was hilarious, you know, like you guys put the toilets
• 47:09
  Speaker 4: up on the on the train tracks and stuff like
• 47:11
  Speaker 4: that and that like crazy. So you know what inspired
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: you to to to make that documentary? Uh, you know,
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: chronicling those years from from you as sort of like
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: a teenager all the way into into wrestling.
• 47:24
  Speaker 5: It was I was dabbling putting together it was basically
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: just gonna be like sort of a scrapbook way of
• 47:31
  Speaker 5: remembering things from my wrestling career, but a company caught
• 47:35
  Speaker 5: wind of it and I was offered a deal. It
• 47:38
  Speaker 5: was basically commission. So I made that thing and sold
• 47:41
  Speaker 5: it for a distribution. So it was during film school.
• 47:44
  Speaker 5: I only had like six weeks to get that thing done.
• 47:47
  Speaker 5: I'd committed to a direct TV uh date, and so
• 47:52
  Speaker 5: that was on top of my full load of uh
• 47:54
  Speaker 5: you know, college classes, and so just rocked that thing
• 47:58
  Speaker 5: out pretty fast. But it was it was commision basically
• 48:00
  Speaker 5: through a freendomize through a contact I had.
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: So and then basically because I love all the footage,
• 48:07
  Speaker 4: so basically when you were you were shooting all this stuff.
• 48:09
  Speaker 4: You know, this is back when like mini DV cams
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: or even remember those big VHS tape recorders. So I imagine
• 48:15
  Speaker 4: too that you probably had a lot of those, like
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: a lot of that footage you had to kind of
• 48:19
  Speaker 4: combined together in different formats like a VHS, uh you know,
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: mini DV AM.
• 48:24
  Speaker 5: I right, yeah, I just about everything I shot was
• 48:29
  Speaker 5: on those small like high eight tapes, like those small
• 48:33
  Speaker 5: Sony or whatever, you know, cassette tapes. I got my
• 48:36
  Speaker 5: hands on one of those cameras I think around age fifteen,
• 48:39
  Speaker 5: and I mean filled up just hours and hours and
• 48:42
  Speaker 5: hours of that stuff. We just shot stuff all the time.
• 48:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and now so as we come full circle, you know,
• 48:48
  Speaker 4: the camera stuff now is so it's so much lighter
• 48:52
  Speaker 4: and it's a better quality. I mean, hell, I was
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: just playing about the DSLR the other day and I'm like,
• 48:56
  Speaker 4: my god, I remember those big VHS cameras and I
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: remember playing those back and like, wow, look at this
• 49:02
  Speaker 4: quality of a picnic or whatever else. And now you're
• 49:05
  Speaker 4: just like, my god, how the hell did I love
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: that damn thing around.
• 49:09
  Speaker 5: I still remember first hearing when you're going to be
• 49:13
  Speaker 5: able to record on a digital medium and you know,
• 49:16
  Speaker 5: on these little compact flash cards or whatever, and I
• 49:21
  Speaker 5: just couldn't fathom it. And I couldn't trust it either.
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: It's just like yeah, right like that, it's it's going
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: to be like a hard drive, like you pump it
• 49:28
  Speaker 5: and it's going to erase everything. And I was terrified
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: of that at first. But I can't really think of
• 49:33
  Speaker 5: any mistakes with DSLRs, just like dumping everything on their own.
• 49:38
  Speaker 5: They seem pretty reliable. So it's impressive. It's really impressive
• 49:41
  Speaker 5: how the technologies come.
• 49:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's you know, and you know, with all the
• 49:46
  Speaker 4: different formats that you know, we've both worked with, and
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: with all the different things that are coming out, you know,
• 49:51
  Speaker 4: I'm gravitating more and more towards you know, a I
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: used to love physical media.
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: Be right back after a word from our sponsor, and
• 50:06
  Speaker 3: now back to the show.
• 50:09
  Speaker 4: Well, I still do. I shouldn't say I used to it,
• 50:10
  Speaker 4: but you know what I mean. But like now, it's
• 50:13
  Speaker 4: it's so much, you know, stuff to sort of keep
• 50:16
  Speaker 4: track of. And he has, you know, piles of DVDs
• 50:17
  Speaker 4: here and piles of books here, and I'm in the
• 50:20
  Speaker 4: back of my mind, I'm thinking to myself, someday, am
• 50:23
  Speaker 4: I just gonna get rid of all this and have
• 50:25
  Speaker 4: nothing but an entire library on a kindle and just
• 50:28
  Speaker 4: go from there, you know what i mean, Because you
• 50:30
  Speaker 4: eventually you're like, I don't know this physical stuff. It's
• 50:32
  Speaker 4: just kind of sometimes you love having it because you
• 50:35
  Speaker 4: can't get nobody can take it from you because it's
• 50:37
  Speaker 4: not in the cloud. But sometimes you say to yourself, man,
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: it's just if I wanted to declutter this room and
• 50:43
  Speaker 4: have to get rid of a lot of stuff.
• 50:46
  Speaker 5: It's I'm gonna be interested to see how that goes
• 50:50
  Speaker 5: because I just moved back from Japan and DVD stores
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: are still doing well there, like rental stores, and I
• 50:58
  Speaker 5: love that, and I missed that experience. DVD's blu rays
• 51:02
  Speaker 5: just walk around, you know, brows, look at look at covers,
• 51:06
  Speaker 5: and to me, that's a lot better than you know,
• 51:08
  Speaker 5: hopping on iTunes and scrolling through somethings. That's just it's
• 51:11
  Speaker 5: not the same feeling. And and I don't know if
• 51:14
  Speaker 5: it's I don't think it's just me being nostalgic. I
• 51:16
  Speaker 5: think it's just makes the experience more relaxing. Like there's
• 51:19
  Speaker 5: only so much time you want to spend staring at
• 51:22
  Speaker 5: a glowing rectangle each day, you know, And so I
• 51:26
  Speaker 5: don't know. I also I just pulled a bunch of
• 51:28
  Speaker 5: books out of storage and sold them, and while they
• 51:31
  Speaker 5: were like tallying up the price, I was walking around
• 51:33
  Speaker 5: a bookstore in the States and and thinking like, man,
• 51:37
  Speaker 5: this is I miss this, Like this is this is
• 51:39
  Speaker 5: a good feeling. And so I think there's always going
• 51:42
  Speaker 5: to be a contingency of people who are going to
• 51:44
  Speaker 5: hold on to the physical medium. But as it gets
• 51:47
  Speaker 5: cheaper and cheaper to make, uh, distribute movies, you know,
• 51:51
  Speaker 5: through digital mediums that there there is going to be
• 51:53
  Speaker 5: a push and pull, a tug of war going on
• 51:55
  Speaker 5: for sure.
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know you moved to Japan. You know I
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: wanted to ask about that too, because you know, when
• 52:01
  Speaker 4: we reconnected, I saw you were living in Japan, and
• 52:04
  Speaker 4: I'm thinking to myself, my god, I go, this is
• 52:06
  Speaker 4: you know, to to sort of just pick up and
• 52:09
  Speaker 4: move to Japan. And it's just it's it's it's it's
• 52:13
  Speaker 4: something off the beaten path. I mean, I love Japan,
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: but I he always hear two things from everybody about
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: going to Japan. I hear these two things. They love it,
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: But my god, isn't expensive? Is that true? Is that true?
• 52:26
  Speaker 5: Meant, it's very true, and especially any any kind of
• 52:30
  Speaker 5: travel in Japan. Like I will never complain about tolls
• 52:35
  Speaker 5: in the US. Again, Like when you're driving, you can
• 52:39
  Speaker 5: you can get on the highway and drive for like
• 52:42
  Speaker 5: three hours something like that and get off and depending
• 52:45
  Speaker 5: on where you are, like going from like Tokyo south
• 52:49
  Speaker 5: to Chiba, get off and pay thirty five to forty
• 52:52
  Speaker 5: dollars and told like I've experienced this, or you make
• 52:56
  Speaker 5: a wrong turn in Tokyo and you just take a
• 52:59
  Speaker 5: loop and like a spaghetti bowl, you know, exit, you
• 53:02
  Speaker 5: have to pay five bucks just for going through that loop,
• 53:05
  Speaker 5: and then you get back on, then you have to
• 53:06
  Speaker 5: pay it again. Like it's it's it's just horrendous. But
• 53:11
  Speaker 5: it's very expensive. But if you can, if you can
• 53:14
  Speaker 5: find a way to swing it. It's very very reliable transportation,
• 53:18
  Speaker 5: like the trains and the buses. It's just remarkable how
• 53:21
  Speaker 5: on time they are. But every country, every place you're
• 53:26
  Speaker 5: gonna live, is gonna have its ups and downs. But
• 53:28
  Speaker 5: I had a wonderful time in Japan in Tokyo. You know.
• 53:32
  Speaker 4: It's funny. I have a friend of mine who just
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: moved to Maldova, and Maldova is this weird well, I
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: shouldn't say weird country. It's a it's a country. It's
• 53:40
  Speaker 4: a smaller country in eastern Europe. And he just moved
• 53:45
  Speaker 4: there from Canada and he absolutely loves it and he
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: goes because his money goes further there. He talks about
• 53:54
  Speaker 4: all the stuff that they have, The internet's faster than
• 53:56
  Speaker 4: where he was in Canada and everything else. And but
• 54:00
  Speaker 4: I always just think, go back to that where it's
• 54:02
  Speaker 4: you know, And I have a friend of mine who
• 54:03
  Speaker 4: moved to Latvia. But then I always think about, you know,
• 54:05
  Speaker 4: my friends who've actually like like yourself, who've gone to Japan,
• 54:09
  Speaker 4: and it's the exact opposite to like, you know, yeah,
• 54:11
  Speaker 4: we love the culture, we love love the the the
• 54:14
  Speaker 4: media and how crazy Japan is. But they're like, my god,
• 54:17
  Speaker 4: they were like, it's so expensive here. And I had
• 54:20
  Speaker 4: a friend of mine who went there and he said,
• 54:22
  Speaker 4: you must have to be a multi millionaire to live
• 54:24
  Speaker 4: in Tokyo because he said everything is just so priced,
• 54:27
  Speaker 4: so high. And he goes, I goes, I don't know
• 54:29
  Speaker 4: how people do it over there.
• 54:32
  Speaker 5: It's I had a blast, you know. I had so
• 54:36
  Speaker 5: many experiences in film over there, so many random jobs,
• 54:40
  Speaker 5: you know, operating cameras. I got to operate the red
• 54:43
  Speaker 5: like a full on, like steady cam uh, you know,
• 54:46
  Speaker 5: worked as a gaffer, directing tons of editing. I got
• 54:50
  Speaker 5: to work behind or in front of the camera. I
• 54:53
  Speaker 5: learned that if you if you're basically a Caucasian or
• 54:57
  Speaker 5: even a Westerner, somebody not from Japan, you have a visa,
• 55:01
  Speaker 5: a work visa and a flexible schedule. You're an actor.
• 55:05
  Speaker 5: You're a model. It's that simple. I'm not even kidding
• 55:09
  Speaker 5: like I One day I was I was looking through
• 55:11
  Speaker 5: the modeling websites, like the agencies, and I just like,
• 55:15
  Speaker 5: you know, rubbing my eyes and looking again. And I
• 55:17
  Speaker 5: sat back and I read an article on how easy
• 55:20
  Speaker 5: it is to get into it, and I just said,
• 55:21
  Speaker 5: that's it. I'm an actor, and you know, fast forward
• 55:24
  Speaker 5: a few years. I've been in all sorts of movies,
• 55:27
  Speaker 5: TV commercials, shows, I mean like big rolls, small roles, everything.
• 55:33
  Speaker 5: It's like, I so got over my fear of being
• 55:36
  Speaker 5: on camera. First I'd be all nervous, but then I
• 55:38
  Speaker 5: was just like, this is so easy, and honestly, the
• 55:41
  Speaker 5: quality is not usually on par with what we would
• 55:45
  Speaker 5: do in the US. So if you want to practice
• 55:48
  Speaker 5: getting comfortable on camera, Japan is a fantastic place to
• 55:51
  Speaker 5: do that. Wild a lot of fun. But yeah, the
• 55:54
  Speaker 5: thing is that I got fed up with those The
• 55:55
  Speaker 5: film industry pays horribly and they do not treat talent
• 56:00
  Speaker 5: well at all. They're not unions. There are no unions.
• 56:04
  Speaker 5: There's no protection for most talents, and so the low
• 56:08
  Speaker 5: pay and the abuse you have to sustain is just
• 56:10
  Speaker 5: like unfathomable. So I had a blast for a while,
• 56:14
  Speaker 5: but as I speak to you right now. I'm driving
• 56:17
  Speaker 5: to LA from Phoenix because I'm like, this was fun,
• 56:21
  Speaker 5: but I got to make some money doing this, you know.
• 56:23
  Speaker 5: I got to get in a place where people have
• 56:25
  Speaker 5: money and real things are happening.
• 56:29
  Speaker 4: And so that you move back to America now, and
• 56:33
  Speaker 4: now are you moving full time back to LA.
• 56:37
  Speaker 5: That's the plan. Yeah, I have a place I can crash.
• 56:43
  Speaker 5: I've got a buddy I'm gonna live with for a
• 56:45
  Speaker 5: few months. But there's a huge, huge convention I'm attending
• 56:49
  Speaker 5: this weekend, which it's called pitch Fest, or they call
• 56:53
  Speaker 5: it script Fest, but the Great American pitch Fest. If
• 56:58
  Speaker 5: I lose you, let me know. I'm driving through uh
• 57:01
  Speaker 5: a little valley right here. But yeah, but they go ahead.
• 57:06
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry. If I lose you, I'll just just call
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: you right back. But you know, it's funny. It's funny,
• 57:11
  Speaker 4: Matt and and I'm sorry to also to interrupt you. Uh.
• 57:14
  Speaker 4: I actually applied to Pitchfest years ago because they were
• 57:18
  Speaker 4: looking for a head of media and I actually applied
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: and I was I was like a finalist for the position,
• 57:23
  Speaker 4: but I didn't get it. And uh, it's just it's
• 57:26
  Speaker 4: just funny that you're actually going to that just uh,
• 57:28
  Speaker 4: I actually know the two people but Bob and uh
• 57:31
  Speaker 4: and I think it's Seni or son I, whatever her
• 57:33
  Speaker 4: name is.
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: Uh.
• 57:34
  Speaker 4: I actually know those two people who actually run that.
• 57:38
  Speaker 5: That's that's that's outstanding, man. That would have been a
• 57:40
  Speaker 5: great game. And you know what, I was reading through
• 57:43
  Speaker 5: the guest list or list of companies and agencies that
• 57:47
  Speaker 5: are going to be there, and I saw, yeah, Whitney
• 57:51
  Speaker 5: Whitney Davis. She's got her own literary agency. But you
• 57:54
  Speaker 5: interviewed her episode one two, but that that was one
• 57:58
  Speaker 5: of the one of the best episodes I think I've
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: listened to your podcast. She gave all sorts of insight
• 58:04
  Speaker 5: on what it takes to get representation as a writer
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: and to work in LA. But yeah, she's she's going
• 58:10
  Speaker 5: to be there. So I'm going to try and bring
• 58:12
  Speaker 5: some projects and pitch and see. I'm not sure if
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: it's a good great fit for what she does, but
• 58:17
  Speaker 5: I just thought she was really encouraging and so I'm excited.
• 58:22
  Speaker 4: You know, It's funny, Matt. Everybody who listens to my podcast,
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: and I've said this before, will always mention Whitney Davis
• 58:29
  Speaker 4: is one of her favorite episode, one of their favorite episodes.
• 58:32
  Speaker 4: They'll always say, I was listening to your podcast, and
• 58:35
  Speaker 4: so I listened to the one with whatever. Oh, but
• 58:37
  Speaker 4: the one with Whitney Davis was awesome, and I said,
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: I told her, I said, everyone compliments you, Whitney. I said,
• 58:44
  Speaker 4: you got to come back on and talk about networking.
• 58:46
  Speaker 4: But yeah, yeah, honestly, she she is a phenomenal man.
• 58:51
  Speaker 4: And I honestly, Matt, if you could get a chance
• 58:53
  Speaker 4: to even grab coffee with her, I would really really
• 58:56
  Speaker 4: encourage it.
• 58:58
  Speaker 5: I'm gonna I'm gonna totally named up Dave Willis when
• 59:01
  Speaker 5: I meet her. And I was excited because on the
• 59:05
  Speaker 5: episode it sounded like she mostly represents novelists, but reading
• 59:09
  Speaker 5: up on what she's doing right now, she's representing quite
• 59:12
  Speaker 5: a few screenwriters. She's she's getting people work in TV
• 59:15
  Speaker 5: and film, and so yeah, I'm excited to meet her.
• 59:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, she's she's actually done a lot of this
• 59:22
  Speaker 4: more screenwriting stuff now, and she went to Dallas and
• 59:25
  Speaker 4: the whole screenwriting seminar there. Then she's going Now she's
• 59:28
  Speaker 4: you know, obviously living living in La Now. Oh wait,
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry. She goes back and forth beween La and
• 59:33
  Speaker 4: Texas that that's what she does. Yeah, because I think
• 59:35
  Speaker 4: she she said to me she likes La but her husband, uh,
• 59:39
  Speaker 4: and then we want us to close to Texas. But
• 59:41
  Speaker 4: but yeah, if you get a chance to even have
• 59:42
  Speaker 4: coffee with her, honestly, huge, huge recommendation to do. So. So,
• 59:47
  Speaker 4: you know, and we're talking about Pitchfest, you know, So
• 59:50
  Speaker 4: are you focusing a lot a lot too, Matt on
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: writing scripts?
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: Now?
• 59:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I have three three scripts that I'm bringing the
• 59:59
  Speaker 5: pitch Fest that bury quite a bit.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 3: Will be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: And now back to the show.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 5: And so I was just given the executive directory and
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 5: it's really helpful. It tells exactly what these companies are
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 5: looking for, how to pitch to them, how not to
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 5: pitch to them, what the budget is, what genre they want.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 5: And so yeah, writing and directing is still my primary goal.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 5: But you know, I have a couple demo reels in order.
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 5: This is they're mostly looking for writers at pitch Fest,
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 5: but these are production companies looking for scripts for you know,
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 5: material they want to produce, whether it's for a TV
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 5: pilot or TV series or a film. And so they
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 5: most of these companies employee directors as well. So I'm
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 5: just going to see what I can, what I could
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 5: do when I can pull off here.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 4: And also one of the things you have to talking
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 4: about to Matt is the Trade, right, So the Trade,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 4: which just had its premiere. I'm sorry, well, if you
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 4: want to call it the premiere, I don't know how
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 4: you would want to phrase that, Matt. But you know,
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 4: the Trade is the movie that you've just shot recently,
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 4: you know, and that's obviously something that you're going to
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 4: be obviously using as a discussion point. So if you could, Matt,
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 4: could you talk about you know, to talk about the
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 4: Trade and what the film is forever for all the
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 4: listeners out there.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 5: Sure, I'll try and tell you in a nutshell. So
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 5: I was in Tokyo for five and a half years,
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 5: if you can believe it, working in the film industry.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: There were a couple feature length films that I tried
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: to get off the ground with people there didn't happen
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 5: for various reasons. But I just I want to make features.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 5: It's what I want to do, and so it's good
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 5: to always, I believe, just stop and say what do
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 5: I have right now or what story can I tell
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 5: right now? And I did not intend on telling a
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 5: story related to my wrestling career, But while I was
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 5: in Japan, there was a younger guy who mimicked who
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 5: was mimicking my wrestling career. He's ten years younger than me.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 5: He was a diehard fan. My wrestling name is Nick
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 5: Mondo or sick Nick Mondo, and he used to come
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 5: to the shows with sign saying a little Mondo and
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 5: he dressed like me, just this skinny little kid. Five
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 5: years after I quit, he got into wrestling. I didn't
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 5: know he was going to do this. I knew he
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 5: was training, but he debuted as Little Bondo but put on,
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 5: you know, fifty pounds of muscle, put on some weight,
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 5: and was basically reenacting my character. I was okay with
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 5: that until he started reenacting all of the violent stuff
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 5: that I did, getting hurt severely, and in sort of
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 5: an agreement with him, making a deal with him, I said,
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 5: I'll make an appearance in one of your matches if
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 5: he was going to carry on a very very dangerous
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 5: stunt that had to concern and we made a bargain.
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 5: He decided not to go through with it if I
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 5: would show up in one of his matches I did.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 5: This was in twenty thirteen, December twenty thirteen. It ended
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 5: up being a pretty emotional moment in the ring. It
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 5: went over really well. He retired that character on the spot,
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 5: and anyway, it shook loose all sorts of ideas. Meanwhile,
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 5: I'm trying to figure out what kind of a film
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 5: can I make right now? So I had the idea
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 5: for a wacky docu drama, half scripted, half documentary basically
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 5: detailing how and why I got into this violent wrestling
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 5: business and why I left so abruptly, and so that's
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 5: the trade. It premiered in London, it screened in Tokyo,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 5: and just this past week, my sales reps did a
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 5: special VIP screening in New York City for distributors and
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 5: for press. So that is a film that I'm pushing
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 5: for sale right now. What my reps are taking care
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 5: of that, which is which is a relief. But that's
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 5: one thing I'm hoping I can use for some momentum.
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 5: It's half scripted, like I said, but that's my intention
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 5: is to get into narrative film rather than documentary. So
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 5: I'm really reaching for for a narrative film right now.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 4: So so Matt, I want to ask you know what
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 4: what was that? Well, by the way, I remember little
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 4: Mondo coming to these shows too. I remember him being
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 4: in the crowd and and you know him dressing as
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 4: you and and his his he would come with his dad.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 4: And then I saw probably a few years ago, I
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: did see that that there was actually he actually started
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 4: wrestling and doing all that stuff. So what was the
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 4: one what stuft was it where he was going to
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 4: reenact of yours that that you finally had to step
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 4: in and say no.
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 5: Well, these death match tournaments that I mentioned. A year
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 5: prior to my retirement, I was in a death match tournament.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 5: I made it to the final round and I finally
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 5: lost in the finals by It was a two hundred
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 5: light tube, barbed wire and salt death match. So probably
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 5: don't need to paint too much more of a picture
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 5: for you. It was. It was nasty, it was bloody,
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 5: needed stitches afterwards. But I lost the match by having
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 5: one person hold my arms and the other one fire
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 5: up a weed whacker and hit me in the stomach
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 5: with it. So it's it's it's unbelievably insane. I once once.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 5: Once you step away from that whole scene, it's like,
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 5: what on earth was I thinking? But in that world
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 5: that it kind of fits in with the with the aesthetic,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 5: with what's going on, and so it became kind of intamos.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 5: It got a lot of circulation. And so Rory that's
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 5: his real name, Rory little Mondo was planning a stunt
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 5: where they were going to destroy him in the ring
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 5: and then he was going to get hit in the
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 5: stomach twice with the weed whacker, and I just told
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 5: him this really discerves me. I was like, I knew
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 5: you and you didn't even weigh one hundred pounds. I
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 5: just I have a problem with you maiming yourself like
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 5: trying to honor me. I'm like, this is not what
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 5: I want you to do, you know. Like, So that
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 5: was that was what he was planning on doing that.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 5: I finally made a bargain with it to not do it.
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 4: You know again, Matt, you know it's funny. I was
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 4: actually at Tournament Death one where that happens. I actually
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 4: have to find it, but I have a photo of
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 4: you taking homeless Jimmy off the top of that rider
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 4: truck through that lighttube covered table.
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 5: So kidding, you were there, yep, I was there.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 4: I remember you because you fought wife Beater in the
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 4: finals and I remember that. That was actually funny enough.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 4: That was actually, I think my final CCW show, or
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 4: we're close to it. I can't remember if no, no, it
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 4: wasn't my final one. My final one was one of
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 4: the Cages of Death. That was my final. Actually, that
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 4: was one of my final wrestling shows ever. I've only
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 4: been to like two or three after that. One was
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 4: when Hot when Hallcokan came to Philly, but that's a
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 4: whole nother story. But yeah, I was actually there, Matt,
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 4: and I was. I was actually right there when you
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 4: put home as Jimmy through that glass the lighttube covered table.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 5: Oh man, that's fun that.
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah. See, we we've been running into each other here
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: all these years, and now we finally finally get to
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 4: have this conversation. It's no, seriously, it's a small world, right.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 4: I have to find that that photo though, and but yeah,
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 4: but you know it's so as we talk about the
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 4: trade and it's it had its premiere in London, and
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 4: you know it's premiere and it's premiere in Tokyo and
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 4: also there was that press screening in New York a
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 4: few days ago. What are some of the of the
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 4: of the plans for the trade, I mean, are you
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 4: hoping to sort of you know, I mean, is it?
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 4: Is it like you do you have like a personal
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 4: goal for it, like to get it on Netflix. I
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 4: would say getting in get it in Blockbuster, but there's
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 4: not really twenty blockbusters around anymore.
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I just I hope. I hope to get this thing.
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 5: Obviously a really good distribution deal in North America. Wrestling
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 5: fans in general, art collectors you know this, and so
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 5: I want to get a really good DVD Blu Ray
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 5: package going. I already have a bunch of bonus features
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 5: that I can include. I hope for Mexico. I hope
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 5: for the UK, hope for Germany, maybe Japan. Distribution in
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 5: Japan is really tough, but I know there's some Southeast
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 5: Asia potential, actually maybe China. I don't know if this
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 5: is possible, but but my reps are going to try
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 5: and set up some sort of a limited maybe East
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 5: Coast theatrical run just like art house theaters, and maybe
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 5: do a few meet and greet type screenings. Uh, but uh,
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 5: it would be great. You know, I hope to turn
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 5: this thing into a profitable venture. I've invested a lot
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 5: into it, so I just wanted to be a really
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 5: good step to another project. That's that's my ultimate goal.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 5: It's something that people can readily have available if they're interested.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 4: You know, I think that meet and greet is a
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 4: great idea, especially if you do that and like these
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 4: really wrestling friendly towns like Philly, New York, Boston, all
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 4: places like that, and especially the meet and greet. You know,
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 4: it's kind of like what Kevin Smith did with Red State,
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 4: where he just basically took it on the road and
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 4: it became like the old the old way that people
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 4: used people used to show films, which was they would
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 4: take their film reels and they would go to town to
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 4: town to town and say, you know, tonight is your
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 4: chance to see the Wizard of Oz or Gone with
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 4: the Wind or whatever, and then you know, they'd go
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 4: on the next town the next day. And I think
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 4: that for indie filmmakers is really important because you have
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 4: to you know, stand out from the pack. And I
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 4: you know, as sort of as if I could talks
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 4: as these big uh you know, film studios they're always
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 4: wondering how they can sort of, you know, up charge
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 4: the ticket and and still keep sales at a particular level.
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 3: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 3: and now back to the show.
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 4: And they always try to package things like you'll get
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 4: the digital download, you'll maybe get a shirt, you make
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 4: it something else. And I think the biggest thing was
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 4: remember World War Z. When that came out, Brad Pitt
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 4: was making all those surprise appearances everywhere, and all of
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 4: a sudden, the ticket sales started going up for the
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 4: thing because everyone's like, oh my god, is Brad Pitt
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 4: going to show up here and talk to us? Because
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean. So I really think being
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 4: able to meet the filmmaker is critical. And by the way, Matt,
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 4: I'm sure as you know this, you'll know who's a
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 4: filmmaker in the crowd, because after they see the movie,
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 4: the number one question they're going to ask you is
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 4: what'd you shoot that on?
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a good point. The two screenings that that
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 5: I attended so far, so much fun, and the Q
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 5: and A is that we did afterwards, so I'm completely
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 5: on board. Or I was actually working on setting up
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 5: a co promotion with a wrestling company on the East Coast,
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 5: like a screening the night before a big wrestling show.
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 5: But my reps actually said, hold off on that, because
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 5: if we give this opportunity to the distributors, we think
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 5: that could be really appealing to them, especially if they
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 5: already have the DVD's blue rays printed and can sell
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 5: them at these events. So I said, all right, it's
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 5: in your hands. But by the way, how's that going.
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 5: I know you were going to try and chase down
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 5: Kevin Smith for an interview. Any any possibility on that.
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 4: It's kind of like stalled out. It was. I thought
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 4: we were going somewhere with it, and it just kind
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 4: of petered out. I really have to start stalking him
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 4: again and just being like, come on this show, man,
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 4: but but but all king as I it did really
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 4: peter out. And when when he when he has maybe
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 4: when he when he's going to promote Red uh not
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 4: Red Moose Jaws, then I'll probably start talking to him
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 4: again and see maybe I can get him on the show.
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people will be interested.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 5: I said Richard Kelly too, I about to hear what
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 5: he's up to. The director of Donne Darko, you know
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 5: what he has to say. But yeah, yeah, you're doing
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 5: great with your podcast. Man.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 4: Oh oh, thank you, Matt. I really appreciate that.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 5: Man.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 4: I try my best. Sometimes I stumble and stammer because
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 4: I want to say like five things at one time.
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 4: But other than that, you know, I've got a pretty
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 4: good guest list. You know. It's it's just funny because
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 4: one of the things that I have I'm pretty strong
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 4: at is networking. It's just a skill that comes natural
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 4: to me. So like doing this podcast, people are like,
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 4: how the hell did you get this guy on here?
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 4: And I go, I have no idea, because when I
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 4: had Kazzie and Ovis on here, who did Dallas Buyer's
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 4: Club and a bunch of others, like really cool movies,
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 4: and like, you know, he's he's an A level producer,
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 4: and like, how the hell did you get him to
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 4: agree to do your podcast? And I go, I have
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 4: no idea. I just it was just kind of, you know,
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 4: it happened, and it's just, you know, one of those
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 4: things and and that's how it happened, you know. It
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 4: just I've just been very good at networking, and that's
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 4: how I sort of been able to go all these
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 4: awesome people like yourself now on the podcast.
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 5: Thank you and I was gonna say it, I uh.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 5: Episode one forty eight and one forty nine. I highly recommend.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 5: One forty eight was Michael g Keyjo how do you
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 5: say his name?
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 4: That's it? You?
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah? From he he directed Alice the Hatred. But and
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 5: then one Dan Mervish, the director of the Slam Dance Festival.
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 5: If you want to hear a lot of amazing stories
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 5: and learn a lot about people who are getting things done,
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 5: getting films done, and moving things in the industry like that.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 5: I love those two episodes, both fantastic.
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and and Dan Murvish. Everyone was always asking when
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 4: his When his episode came out, people were like, wait
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 4: a minute, did you have an axe murder or something
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 4: on your podcast? I said no, no, no, he worked
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 4: with an axe murderer. Guys, come on, get it right.
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 5: But that was that was at that story, even involving
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 5: Johnny Depp at one point. So yeah, I love that story.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 5: So bizarre.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, seriously, how Johnny Depp got ended up being connected
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 4: to this axe murderer from you from from this college,
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 4: It's like, what the hell, It's a it's such a weird,
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 4: weird story, but it's all true and uh, because I
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 4: looked up the story after the podcast and I was like,
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 4: holy crap. I was just like, this is this is
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 4: this is a one hundred percent real, real, real, true story,
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 4: you know, and it's just it's unbelievable and uh. But
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 4: but I've been again, I've been very fortunate to have
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 4: a lot of really cool people on the podcast again,
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 4: like yourself, Matt, and you know, as we were talking
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 4: about everything, you know, from pro wrestling to filmmaking to
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 4: your latest film, The Trade, and you're going to Pitchfest,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 4: which I wish you the best of luck. So I
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 4: mean we've been talking for roughly about an hour, maybe
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 4: hour and ten minutes, so you know, just in closing, Matt,
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 4: is there anything that we get a chance to talk
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 4: about that maybe you want to talk about right now,
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 4: or just any sort of parting thoughts that you'd like
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 4: to say to put a period the end of this
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 4: whole conversation.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 5: Well, I just I think there's a tremendous film education
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 5: coming through here on your podcast. So I want to
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 5: I want to thank you for that. You know, I'm
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 5: like you and a lot of people on your podcast.
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 5: I mean, you get some really high profile people, but
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 5: we're all just trying to figure out this this film
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 5: industry thing and crack the code. But but you know, yeah,
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 5: I'm in a season of transition right now, so i
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 5: don't know exactly what's next. But I'm gonna try my
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 5: hand at LA and you know, see how it goes.
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 5: But but you know, thank you for helping me promote
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 5: the trade and what I'm doing. And you know, yeah,
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 5: I just I look forward to keep it in the
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 5: touch with you and I definitely will.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and please do Matt, And uh, you know, I'm
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 4: gonna make sure. By the way, I was going to
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 4: ask about your social media and I know you're not
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 4: on like Twitter or anything like that. I wanted to
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 4: just to say really quickly to Matt, do you know
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 4: that there's a person out there that actually has a
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 4: Twitter account that's pretending to be you, and they're tweeting
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 4: at other wrestlers that are obviously fake accounts, so like
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 4: Nick Monda, Like they have a Nick Mondo account that's
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 4: called you know, unscored Mondo, and he's tweeting at some
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 4: guy who's supposed to be see him punk and they're
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 4: going back and forth with each other. But it's just
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 4: like I don't know why they would be doing this,
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 4: but it just I got to laugh out of that
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 4: because I actually was going to tweet at you one
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 4: time and I saw that account. Look wait, that's not
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 4: that's not mad. What the hell is that?
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 5: It's I think I need to get a Twitter account going.
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 5: This has happened before. I've had to shut people down.
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 5: I've gotten notifications last year two people I had to
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 5: shut down on Twitter. It's happened on Facebook right now.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 5: Since I moved back to the States, I got a
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 5: new iPhone, I was traveling and I got blocked out
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 5: of my Facebook account and I currently am and that's
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 5: where I promote everything. But I think I need to
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 5: get on either Twitter or Instagram or both. But like,
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 5: I'm not letting go of this account thing yet, Like
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 5: I'm I'm gonna see what needs to happen to get
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 5: it back. But like I've tried everything right now. But
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 5: that's the bizarre world of social media. This has happened
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 5: to me at least at least ten times over the
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 5: years where I have to go and shut down somebody
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 5: who's pretending to be me, which which I don't understand
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 5: why somebody would want to do that. But yeah, thanks
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 5: for letting me know. I'm gonna have to look at
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 5: Twitter again. It sounds like.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, Matthew Barter Bair news like that. I'm sorry
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 4: because I saw that. I was like, whoa mondo? I
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 4: was like, wait this on him because but but no,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 4: But honestly, Matt, if you ever, h if you ever
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 4: do get to a Twitter or Instagram, I'm on both,
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 4: and I'd be glad to give you some shout outs
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 4: and stuff like that, and I'll even, you know, I'll
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 4: encourage everyone to follow you. And because I honestly you're
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 4: You're such an interesting guy and I'm so glad we
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 4: could actually like finally do this interview and finally meet
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 4: up and share all these stories about pro wrestling and
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 4: everything else. And it's just been a very fun trip
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 4: down memory lane. And if I could, Max, I know
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 4: you have to run. I know your I know you
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 4: got ten thousand things going on. I remember one time
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 4: we went to a group of of friends and I
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 4: went to CZW and this is again a champ soccer
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 4: arena in Sould, New Jersey, and this this very like,
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 4: uh pretty very very like. You know, uppity girl went
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 4: with us, who was a girlfriend of this guy, and
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 4: she she goes, she sits down, and she goes, I
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 4: feel like I'm gonna be stabbed at any moment in this.
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 4: I said, yeah, this is a good chance. It was
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 4: just and everyone around, like everyone around laughed because they
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 4: could just see this girl was so out of her
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 4: element and it was just it was just a funny,
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 4: a funny, uh little anecdote. But it's been so fun
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 4: talking to you, Matt, uh, you know, going down memory lane.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 4: Is there any links that you like to send anybody to, like,
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 4: if you have an official website you like to send
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 4: everyone to.
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 5: I'll just I'll give you the links the two trailers
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 5: for my film, the other one we just we just launched,
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 5: and so that that's what I'd like to spread. The
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 5: we're on right now, and I, like I said, I
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 5: think very shortly, I'm just gonna have to hop on
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 5: Twitter and Instagram and and hopefully get this Facebook thing resolved.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 5: But but yeah, thank you so much. And I was
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 5: just gonna say, like most people, I either separate or
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 5: need to separate if I'm doing these interviews into either
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 5: the wrestling half or the film half. And so that's
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 5: pretty unique getting to talk to you and mix both.
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 5: And I think that's that's really cool, just the common
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 5: trajectory if you will, you know, the week then on.
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 5: So yeah, let's let's do it again. Man.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And there is a lot of storytelling involved in
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 4: professional wrestling, and I you know, and I know, I mean,
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 4: I haven't watched wrestling years, but but I know there
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 4: is a storytelling aspect that you know, I feel is
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 4: lost in current day wrestling. But that's a whole nother story. Matt.
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 4: You know, I would love to have you back on
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 4: anytime you have to come back on you want to
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 4: talk about, even your experience at pitch Fest or anything
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 4: you like to talk about. You know, always feel free.
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 4: Everyone listening. It's Dave Bullis dot com Twitter, It's at
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 4: Dave Underscore Bullets and uh, I want to say thank
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 4: you everybody for listening, and thank you Matt for coming on.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 5: My friend Dave, thank you. I will be listening in
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 5: the future. I'm a fan.
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 4: Hey, I appreciate it. My friend and I where our
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 4: pants are going to cross again? Because all we've seen to.
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 5: Right, hopefully not in a wrestling ring though, right, that's
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 5: what this is. It's somebody's backyard, you know exactly.
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 4: It can't be like at WrestleMania in a cage like
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 4: Bundy and Hogan. It's got to be. It's got to
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 4: be in the backyard, in the middle of nowhere in Birdsborough,
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 4: you versus me on like a film camera and a
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 4: pole match.
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 5: I'm gonna be ping Pong Mondo. That person that calls
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 5: me ping Pong's out of the street.
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 4: I tell you it's it's it's Bundy is a is
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 4: a hell of a he. He of a hell of
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 4: a guy. It's just the funny stories about him. Matt
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 4: Big Pummondo. So Matt again, best of luck and Pitch
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 4: best best luck in La Dude. I'll talk to you
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 4: very soon.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 5: Peace, buddy. Thanks again, I'll talk to you soon.
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at Indie film muscle
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 2: dot com Forward slash seven eighty seven. If you have
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 2: it already, please head over to Filmmaking podcast dot com, subscribe.
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 3: And leave a good review for the show. It really
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 3: helps us out a lot, guys.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 4: Thank you again so much for listening.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: Guys, as always, keep that hustle going, keep that dream alive,
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 3: Stay safe out there, and I'll talk to you soon.
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle podcast at
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 1: indiefilm hustle dot com. That's I N D I E
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 1: F I L M h U S T l E
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 1: dot com.