Latest / Basic Folk / Vibe Coaches: Maya de Vitry, Ethan Jodziewicz, Joel Timmons, & Shelby Means, ep. 325

Transcript

Vibe Coaches: Maya de Vitry, Ethan Jodziewicz, Joel Timmons, & Shelby Means, ep. 325 · Basic Folk

0:12
[SPEAKER_08]: And I, and welcome to Basic Folk, where we have honest conversations with folk musicians on the bluegrass situation.
0:17
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm your host Cindy House.
0:19
[SPEAKER_08]: And thanks for checking out the show today.
0:22
[SPEAKER_08]: We have Maya DeVeetry, Ethan Yo Jebitz, Joel Timons, and Shelby Means on the show today.
0:28
[SPEAKER_08]: It's going to be very exciting.
0:30
[SPEAKER_08]: But first, let's talk about ways to stay in touch.
0:34
[SPEAKER_08]: You can join our monthly newsletter at the link in the show notes or you can go to basicbook.com, sign up there.
0:42
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0:50
[SPEAKER_08]: You can also become a contributing member.
0:53
[SPEAKER_08]: Five dollars a month, a great way to support this cute little folk podcast.
0:56
[SPEAKER_08]: Link in the show notes for the link to donate or you can go to basicbook.com slash donate.
1:05
[SPEAKER_08]: Make your contribution there and thanks.
1:07
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:09
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, if you're having a great summer, just about wrapped up here, you maybe are thinking like summer is over.
1:16
[SPEAKER_08]: I am already eating my Halloween candy, which great.
1:21
[SPEAKER_08]: Good for you.
1:21
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm still in the thick of summer.
1:24
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm getting a lot of bug bites, a lot of Hornet stings.
1:28
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks to my dog who loves to stir up a Hornet's nest and then is upset when they chase her down the road.
1:36
[SPEAKER_08]: That's what we're dealing with here.
1:37
[SPEAKER_08]: Hope everything is well in your world.
1:40
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's get to the show.
1:43
[SPEAKER_08]: Myedavitri, Ethan Yojevitz, Joel Timons and Shelby Means are on the show today talking about their new collaborations.
1:52
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya produced both Shelby and Joel's debut albums this year.
1:57
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel and Ethan play in Maya's band and the two couples, Joel and Shelby are married and Ethan and Maya are partners.
2:05
[SPEAKER_08]: They are very close friends.
2:06
[SPEAKER_08]: They all met in Nashville where Maya and Ethan still live while Joel and Shelby live in Charleston.
2:12
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel talks about the huge gesture Shelby made in leaving Nashville behind for his hometown of Charleston, and he also talks about the elated feeling they both got when Shelby, who was also played bass in Delame, got the chance to play upright in Molly, Tuddle, and Golden Highway.
2:28
[SPEAKER_08]: Big themes of this friend group include trust, lifting each other up, and being one another's vibe coaches.
2:35
[SPEAKER_08]: In our conversation we talk about choosing love,
2:38
[SPEAKER_08]: Connecting with your music friends and non-musical ways, and of course, the most epic hair and Americana, Joel Timons and his mullet.
2:47
[SPEAKER_08]: The group shares insights on how they are still close and able to connect and spend time with each other despite the distance.
2:54
[SPEAKER_08]: Short flights and drives are worth it when you've got friends like this.
2:58
[SPEAKER_08]: During the interview, we'll hear a couple clips from Maya and Joel and Shelby, but in the meantime, let's get to our conversation with Maya DeVeetry, Ethan Yojevitz, Joel Timons and Shelby Means.
3:23
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you guys so much for being here.
3:25
[SPEAKER_08]: Mind to be true, Ethan, your Jevits, Shelby Means, and Joel Timons, a meeting of the mines.
3:31
[SPEAKER_08]: Welcome to basic folk.
3:33
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you.
3:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks.
3:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for having us.
3:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, thanks, Cindy.
3:38
[SPEAKER_08]: So anybody can answer any question unless I have like a particular, I've been listening to dressing a particular person, but before we start, if everybody could go around and just say, hi, and what their name is, so people know what your voice is sound like.
3:56
[SPEAKER_08]: So, Maya, can you start?
3:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Hi, my name is Maya, to VTree.
4:01
[SPEAKER_00]: This is Ethan Yojavitz over here.
4:03
[SPEAKER_06]: Hey, this is Shelby Means, and you're listening to basic folk.
4:09
[SPEAKER_06]: I'm totally what this sound like.
4:12
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm Joel.
4:13
[SPEAKER_04]: Hi, I'm Joel Timons.
4:16
[SPEAKER_08]: You all have so many musical projects and collaborations and have been playing music all of your lives.
4:24
[SPEAKER_08]: So this might seem like kind of a simple question, but I'm interested to know what can you say about music being a bridge to meeting other people and connecting with other people and how has that bridge changed as you settled into your lives?
4:40
[SPEAKER_08]: Good questions.
4:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I think initially it was, you know, kind of felt like kids on the playground, you know, when you're, when you're younger, like, you play music?
4:53
[SPEAKER_00]: I play music.
4:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's try playing music together.
4:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's cool.
4:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like at a certain time, you kind of start realizing, oh, I kind of like go in this direction.
5:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I kind of like playing this kind of music.
5:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe you can sort of get more specific for a while, which I definitely saw happening for me in part over the last decade or so.
5:22
[SPEAKER_00]: And I guess at this moment now,
5:26
[SPEAKER_00]: trying to feel a little bit more of the kid on the playground thing and try and broaden the kinds of things I'm doing again.
5:34
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember I'm thinking about this because I'm at music camp here in Revard, North Carolina and going as a guitar student and I remember going just want to know a gathering as a fiddle student when I was eighteen and meeting
5:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Duncan Whickle and Bronwyn Keith Hines, who then later became a bandmate of Shelby's in Golden Highway and Jack Devaro, and just these people who were my age and were just as obsessed with music.
6:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And that was like a bridge I'd been looking for, I think, probably for years and going to that place and that
6:18
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, some, or I don't know, that destination helped me find people who were just, you know, like, not ashamed to just want to play fiddle tunes for four hours.
6:30
[SPEAKER_02]: And then that was the whole hang.
6:32
[SPEAKER_02]: So that was, that was a really important bridge for me when I think back on it.
6:36
[SPEAKER_02]: And, um, yeah.
6:39
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm just thinking about being at camp and connecting with people like as a student.
6:44
[SPEAKER_04]: And for me, it was like in school choir and the band program.
6:48
[SPEAKER_04]: And like Ethan was saying, you know, like, oh, you playing music, I play music.
6:52
[SPEAKER_04]: Let's jam after school.
6:54
[SPEAKER_04]: And some of those friendships are still like my closest friends today.
6:59
[SPEAKER_04]: But there was, there's been a long time of like,
7:03
[SPEAKER_04]: traveling to perform music and experiencing the world as a as a touring musician and the kind of connections and doors that get open to you through that way of expression are really really exciting you know we get rather than just rocking up in some place as a as a tourist or a business traveler you know people
7:23
[SPEAKER_04]: Connect with the art, connect with the music and the lyrics, and they want to show you something deep and personal about where they live or what they do.
7:34
[SPEAKER_04]: But I think it's so cool that we're back at Camp Nou, and just going to be connecting with people just on the excitement of making sound.
7:40
[SPEAKER_06]: For me, it's music has been a bridge within my family.
7:45
[SPEAKER_06]: Musically, I grew up playing with my dad and my brother, we were inspired to play music.
7:53
[SPEAKER_06]: because of my dad.
7:54
[SPEAKER_06]: But then once I got out into the broader world, like what Joel was saying, I had the privilege of joining Delame, which is an all-women, bluegrass band.
8:08
[SPEAKER_06]: And we were music was a cultural bridge in that way between different parts of the world and completely different
8:20
[SPEAKER_06]: up bringing completely different languages.
8:23
[SPEAKER_06]: We would go to places where no one spoke English and start playing our music.
8:30
[SPEAKER_06]: And if we were with other musicians, they would be able to start jamming with us and start just connecting with us through music.
8:41
[SPEAKER_06]: So in that way, I think music is such a powerful bridge between cultures.
8:48
[SPEAKER_08]: Great.
8:49
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya, the last time I saw you play, in fact, Ethan and Joel were with you.
8:55
[SPEAKER_08]: You were talking about wanting to make it small versus making it big.
9:00
[SPEAKER_08]: Do you remember talking about that?
9:03
[SPEAKER_08]: And what is your definition of making it small?
9:06
[SPEAKER_02]: I think a lot about scale and what I'm doing, I guess, like because I think you have to kind of define it for yourself a little bit.
9:16
[SPEAKER_02]: because it's otherwise it's so big.
9:20
[SPEAKER_02]: What is kind of advertised is like what you would want or what you're seeking or people on the outside looking in like what they think you might want.
9:28
[SPEAKER_02]: I think making it small is for me it's having autonomy and like agency and being able to be able to collaborate as deeply as I want with people that I care about and it's
9:47
[SPEAKER_02]: keeping something spontaneous possible, I think.
9:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Like in July, I'm going out west and we're doing some shows together.
10:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Me, Joel, and Shelby, like in the kind of in the round format.
10:10
[SPEAKER_02]: We're also doing some shows that are Shelby Means shows and I'm jumping up and playing fiddle on those.
10:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Shelby's gonna play based on a Maya Dividre show.
10:17
[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's this stretch of time that's just built in for, like, hiking and camping and maybe backpacking or, you know, just some kind of unknown adventure and Ethan is flying out to join us and be able to, you know, be in that region for that time so that, so that that's a part of it too.
10:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Like that's,
10:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that I can enjoy.
10:41
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, that I'm not striving for something too shiny that I miss those kinds of opportunities to be in Colorado or Wyoming or Utah in a way that feels like a human and not just like, I'm a machine that sings songs.
11:07
[SPEAKER_08]: Right.
11:08
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
11:09
[SPEAKER_08]: It seems like this is a group of musicians who are like, are not trying to gain like many thousands of social media followers like be best friends with Taylor Swift like win all the awards.
11:21
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya, I read in one of your press releases, you described your post-stray birds life as breathing in a different atmosphere where you try to give and receive in a musical ecosystem where there's trust people lifting each other up and letting music flow.
11:37
[SPEAKER_08]: So, what does everybody else think of that kind of musical ecosystem and like, what are your practices for living in that space versus the one where your best friends with Taylor Swift?
11:49
[SPEAKER_08]: And trying to get that E-got.
11:52
[SPEAKER_06]: Wait, you're saying we could be best friends with Taylor Swift.
11:54
[SPEAKER_08]: Do you have a... It's a pot connection.
11:56
[SPEAKER_06]: It's a possibility.
11:56
[SPEAKER_06]: Do you introduce?
11:57
[SPEAKER_06]: Just kidding.
12:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, funnily enough talking about being best friends with Taylor Swift.
12:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I have some friends now who I think are really, really amazing.
12:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And these folks are some of them.
12:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And there are others.
12:15
[SPEAKER_00]: And people who I think are truly amazing and deserve to be known by a whole lot of people.
12:27
[SPEAKER_00]: you know I guess it's just I don't know sometimes I look at a lot of the the records from you know a few decades ago that I really love and you start to notice there's a lot of the same players on them and you start to realize they were all kind of in the same age group then and they kind of lived in the same town maybe you know and and those people by like investing in playing together and learning how
12:54
[SPEAKER_00]: to sound good on records together and how to collaborate well together.
12:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we're able to create effectively like a genre or many genres that people now, like us can listen to and, you know, really connect with the music and really feel like the players are really jelling.
13:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And so as far as like a musical ecosystem, I just think that
13:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I would rather than like trying to seek playing with somebody who's already super famous or something.
13:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd rather like have us all slowly become like at the very least like a cult classic.
13:37
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, maybe like a few decades from now, there's like a devoted following of people who are like, want to hear everything that Jill and Shelby and Maya and Ethan were part of like in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the,
14:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we've all on here found ourselves, you know, I think we all come from humble musical beginnings where we just wanted to play music with our friends, or alone in our bedrooms or whatever, and inevitably at a certain point, if you're doing this professionally, you suddenly find yourself on stage
14:23
[SPEAKER_00]: or backstage or in a studio with somebody who you really admire or who like actually is like famous and you just have to be normal and you kind of oftentimes get this realization that they're just a person who liked playing music with their friends when they were a kid too.
14:39
[SPEAKER_00]: And so some of those moments of the realism for me where I have found myself on stage with a hero or in another situation with a hero and just had to like take a deep breath and just try and be the musician that I am and not make it anything that it's not.
14:58
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I really, I really connect with what you said, Ethan, that when I first moved to Nashville, maybe in twenty fifteen,
15:08
[SPEAKER_04]: Most of my motivation was personal to get to know Shelby Means better, but I also did have professional and musical ambitions in Nashville with, like, regard to songwriting and co-writing.
15:20
[SPEAKER_04]: I thought maybe I could maybe I could get in the room with some of these guys that are making this commercial country music, you know, and I could get some mailbox money.
15:28
[SPEAKER_04]: And I started going to those Nashville songwriter association meetings, you know, and it's like,
15:35
[SPEAKER_04]: You're pitching songs and you're watching people how they negotiate the craft and you're hearing about some people that are getting these publishing deals.
15:41
[SPEAKER_04]: And at some point along the way, I don't remember who it was that gave me this advice and it's like, you're not going to crack into that click that's making the salt the hits right now.
15:52
[SPEAKER_04]: What you need to do is look around at your peers.
15:54
[SPEAKER_04]: all the other people that moved in Asheville the same time as you who and find the people that you genuinely connect with and those are the people that like in five or in ten years y'all are going to be the click making the hits or whatever it is you want to be making you know and just deep in the deep in those connections with the people that are kind of like
16:12
[SPEAKER_04]: at your entry point to the scene.
16:15
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's really proven to be true.
16:17
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I think my and I moved to Nashville around the same time.
16:19
[SPEAKER_04]: Took a few years before we were friends and a few more years before we started collaborating, you know.
16:25
[SPEAKER_04]: But I found that to be really a wonderful ecosystem where we are playing different roles and each other's creative output, you know.
16:35
[SPEAKER_08]: And I love that advice.
16:37
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
16:38
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it was really, you know, like I'm just going and knocking on the publishing houses doors, you know, they're like, we're all full, you know, but there's other ambitious driven creatives that like want to make one of the right songs, you know, so find those people.
16:53
[SPEAKER_08]: Also, could you quickly define male box money?
16:57
[SPEAKER_04]: mailbox money is like a shorthand for royalties you know if you were to have a song on the radio or in a movie and you owned under the songwriting of the publishing rights to it then you get that mailbox money and now it's more like inbox money I guess you know
17:17
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya recently released a claw hammer banjo version of her song Flowers, which is originally on the album Violet Light from twenty-twenty-two.
17:26
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a beautiful song about the simplicity of reaching towards nourishment, like flowers reaching for rain.
17:33
[SPEAKER_08]: And Maya, you said you're continually fascinated by the word love and how so many things can get swept into the definition, including like care and acceptance, comfort and respect, but also sometimes control
17:46
[SPEAKER_08]: domination, manipulation, until it's just a really warped and distorted and confusing idea, which, like, elicits anxiety, thinking about that.
17:56
[SPEAKER_08]: However, this is maybe like another kind of simple question, but this is for anyone who wants to answer, like in thinking about love and all the confusion and sadness it can bring, why do you think love is still worth pursuing and choosing and what ways do you all work to try and choose love?
18:13
[SPEAKER_06]: You're making me cry.
18:14
[SPEAKER_04]: I thought those were a good show.
18:19
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll be question.
18:20
[SPEAKER_06]: No, God.
18:24
[SPEAKER_06]: I think love is really important to pursue.
18:29
[SPEAKER_06]: And unfortunately, when you love people, it's a vulnerable place and you can get hurt.
18:35
[SPEAKER_06]: Whether that means you're losing them or there's breakup involved or whatever that is.
18:43
[SPEAKER_06]: Love's probably the most powerful thing that we can do with each other for each other, for ourselves, even.
18:52
[SPEAKER_06]: Got to love yourself first before you can love others.
18:56
[SPEAKER_06]: So that's a constant practice.
18:58
[SPEAKER_06]: And I just, I do think it's worth it because I have lost people that I've loved deeply and not just
19:08
[SPEAKER_06]: I just think that everything that I learned from those people that I've lost through the process of it is really important.
19:17
[SPEAKER_06]: And it's easy to question why, what's the point of life, why do we keep, why should I keep going?
19:26
[SPEAKER_06]: I could just lay in bed all day and that would be easier than getting up and whatever.
19:33
[SPEAKER_06]: I got my little dog Casper who I love deeply and he makes it worth it.
19:37
[SPEAKER_06]: It makes me want to keep going and pursue and Joel brings me coffee in the morning so like his love language is to, you know, show up with service and I think that all the loss that I've experienced through loving helps me be a deeper person and write better songs.
20:01
[SPEAKER_06]: So that's why love is important for the songwriting.
20:05
[SPEAKER_06]: Beautiful.
20:06
[SPEAKER_00]: I think at it's best when people see a performance or hear a record, it inspires them in some way, and especially seeing a live performance and seeing how people are connecting with each other on stage, I think that in particular can be inspiring to people.
20:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think a lot of times it's not about the music necessarily or about the words, I mean it is, but
20:32
[SPEAKER_00]: just allowing people to see you being connected with yourself and with the other people around you, I think, can inspire that connection in other people.
20:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know,
20:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Most of us probably have had some kind of experience like I had some years ago after a show with Sierra Hall, I had a guy come up to me in the audience who was saying that he had been
21:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically attempting to get ready to kill himself every night for quite a while after he'd gotten back from some military service and then he saw us perform and saw how we connected with each other and it sparked something in him to reconnect with himself and it like opened, reopened some self-love.
21:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, he's telling me this and, like, you know, and he looks me right in the eye and says, like, if you ever forget why you do this, just remember this, you know.
21:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's been a couple times like that now.
21:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'll bet all of us here could say something like that about how someone has told us, how deeply just doing our thing has affected them and maybe opened up the space for more love.
22:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Definitely, I've like, you know, laying in bed on tour, and I'm like, at home, I don't use my phone in bed, but I always break the rules on tour.
22:11
[SPEAKER_02]: And sometimes I'm just laying there and I get on Instagram, and there's like a direct message from somebody saying exactly that.
22:17
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, out of nowhere, out of the blue, somebody that's just like, I just want you to know that this song has, like, saved my life.
22:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's, or, like, somebody at a show recently, he just, like, looks me in the eye and he said, I hope that you take this the right way, but I love you.
22:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I love you.
22:38
[SPEAKER_02]: I love you.
22:39
[SPEAKER_02]: I like some silly back to him.
22:41
[SPEAKER_02]: And, and I just, I don't know, like, the, I think there's something about, like, music that is nourishing that nourishment piece, you know, that we're nourishing ourselves when we can be
22:55
[SPEAKER_02]: When we choose showing up instead of like choosing fear and shutting down and being kind of when we choose to be open and take risks with our friends and front of other people and take risks with putting ourselves out there creatively and and I think that is healing for people because we're just told that everything is so scary and that there's so much to fear and other people and then we fear things in ourselves and
23:25
[SPEAKER_02]: If music's a way to, you know, to get there, then that's our job.
23:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I could add too much to that.
23:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Going to a concert is a really nice time to just focus on one thing.
23:39
[SPEAKER_00]: That also I think a lot of people don't get.
23:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I think a lot of people have intention to work on mindfulness in their lives and non distraction, at least for a while, but oftentimes a concert can be a place where you actually can do that.
23:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And anyone who's listening, I encourage you, go to concerts and really pay attention, like put your phone away.
24:03
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, there's a lot of people nowadays who are responding to texts all through a concert.
24:07
[SPEAKER_00]: The concert's never, you know, at least in our kind of like, in our world, it's never going to be longer than ninety minutes to two hours.
24:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Just put the thing down and listen and see if you can get swept up in it in the moment in a different way than you expected.
24:31
[SPEAKER_05]: I can't help the way I feel after all I need to do It's thought I'd have much more than this to show I don't know when I'll be back I doubt it goes Can't you like that?
24:57
[SPEAKER_05]: It's a long summer old bed at you
25:07
[SPEAKER_08]: This is actually, I want to know about the story of another song on Violet Light, the Incredible How Bad.
25:14
[SPEAKER_08]: I want to live in Incredible My Dividre Bangor, featuring Sally and George on Harmony's, which is the name of Shelby and Joel's duo named after Shelby's grandparents.
25:27
[SPEAKER_08]: And Ethan, I hear from Maya that it was your idea to ask Shelby and Joel to sing harmonies like how did how did that come about like I don't know if this was the first time you all collaborated but it's such an awesome song and I'd love to hear.
25:44
[SPEAKER_08]: You know, Ethan tapped a bottom, your socks.
25:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Technically, we had collaborated before, but we'd collaborated on bike rides and rock climbing trips in various combinations of the four of us.
25:59
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, the Ethan and Maya rock climbing trips.
26:03
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I think that was the first musical collaboration for the four of us.
26:08
[SPEAKER_00]: And really it was pretty simple.
26:10
[SPEAKER_00]: They're great musicians who sound amazing singing together.
26:14
[SPEAKER_00]: But that song is about...
26:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Frightening and potentially really dangerous, potentially deadly experience.
26:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Maya and I had on the Call of Outrail in Kauai.
26:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And really simply, we had booked a trip to Hawaii because I had a companion pass on Southwest Airlines that year.
26:39
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was nearing the end of the year.
26:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were like, let's use it one more time.
26:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we went to Hawaii on it and we ran into Shelby and Joel a few months before that at the Denver Airport.
26:49
[SPEAKER_00]: We were all returning to Nashville.
26:51
[SPEAKER_00]: They were still living there at the time.
26:52
[SPEAKER_00]: I think.
26:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
26:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And we just mentioned we were going to cry and Joel was like, Oh, you got to do the call out trail.
26:59
[SPEAKER_00]: It's crazy.
27:01
[SPEAKER_00]: It's beautiful.
27:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It's awesome.
27:02
[SPEAKER_00]: I did it years ago.
27:03
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
27:04
[SPEAKER_08]: I remember, okay.
27:05
[SPEAKER_08]: I was trying to like, I was like scanning my inbox and my notes.
27:08
[SPEAKER_08]: I was like, there's something else to this story that I'm forgetting.
27:12
[SPEAKER_08]: And that's it that it was Shelby and Joel that
27:15
[SPEAKER_08]: turns you towards that trail then.
27:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
27:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Totally.
27:21
[SPEAKER_00]: So when Maya wrote that song and it came time to record it and we were co producing that violet light album making all of the
27:32
[SPEAKER_00]: sort of overarching artistic decisions together.
27:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It just felt really obvious to me.
27:39
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was during COVID when we were having people all come in sort of one by one to the house to track on it.
27:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And it just, in addition to wanting the music to go, to have them involved, we just wanted to hang out with them too.
27:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Not the house.
27:59
[SPEAKER_08]: Nice, yeah.
28:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And these guys were amazing on it.
28:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Just like, I mean, I think we worked on that song for like five hours or something.
28:11
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they got really deep in figuring out we figured out all those parts on the bridge in there.
28:16
[SPEAKER_00]: We just pinpointed each of those notes that they were singing.
28:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was just a really, really fun day hanging out with them all day long.
28:25
[SPEAKER_00]: My I probably made a chicken tortilla soup at the end of it.
28:29
[SPEAKER_02]: I did, and I left it on a really unsafe setting heat wise.
28:33
[SPEAKER_02]: And then we had to, like, make a show.
28:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Shelby's dad's a food scientist, so she got some data for us on whether or not we should eat it.
28:43
[SPEAKER_02]: But all I was, Shelby's idea, I remember to, you know, we kind of thought we were done, and then she was like, what if I sang this?
28:52
[SPEAKER_02]: other part like on the verses and just that.
28:55
[SPEAKER_02]: So that really became a part of the song, you know, to always have the harmony singer like singing all those verses too and she just nailed that part too.
29:05
[SPEAKER_02]: So it was such a fun day.
29:07
[SPEAKER_06]: So my first experience working with Maya as a vocal producer and Ethan as well, but on the the verse part out, I remember Maya telling me just
29:19
[SPEAKER_06]: put it a little more back like a little we don't want to be too on top of the beat with the words so like can we relax the phrasing a little bit pull it back because the song's really chugging along but it was cool that the the vocals were kind of pulling back what do you mean like not pronouncing so much a little bit I kind of imagined it as if
29:50
[SPEAKER_06]: I kind of just had really sleepy or I was like waking up and just kind of stretching the words stretching.
29:59
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh cool.
30:01
[SPEAKER_06]: Cool.
30:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Some people kind of have described it to me as like
30:06
[SPEAKER_02]: You can picture a car and if the car is moving you could be riding on the hood of the car and like your feet are kind of dangling right out front or you're in the driver seat or you're in the back seat or you're like maybe sitting on the trunk but you're still like you're moving along but like where in the beat when the actual like word is falling are you and so I just I didn't want Shelby riding on the hood I was like just you know
30:30
[SPEAKER_02]: It's getting a vaccine a little bit, because it changes the way the song feels and different styles of music feel different in that way.
30:39
[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's one way I had had it describe to me one time.
30:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I get loud when I get mad.
30:55
[SPEAKER_03]: I get tough when I get sad.
30:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll tell you with the horns like a Spaniard in the pin.
31:05
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm here to play for blood boys and I'll be here till the end.
31:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Or I am the bravest bullfighter that ever dared to pin.
31:18
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel and Shelby met in twenty twelve and it seems like Joel decided that he was he was going to move to Nashville because of Shelby.
31:26
[SPEAKER_08]: I learned that in this interview.
31:29
[SPEAKER_08]: You started playing together as Sally and George.
31:33
[SPEAKER_08]: So what was your original musical connection like and how do you still see that connection when you play together now?
31:39
[SPEAKER_04]: Originally, I just saw Shelby on stage performing with Delume.
31:45
[SPEAKER_04]: So play in Bluegrass and being her wonderful charismatic self with upright bass.
31:51
[SPEAKER_04]: I was taken.
31:53
[SPEAKER_06]: I picked my nose, right?
31:56
[SPEAKER_04]: And it was really like, you know, we had a small chat that year at the festival, and then another, you know, I kind of stayed in touch with her, had a crush on her, but it was a whole year that went by over a year that went by before we even really had another conversation.
32:11
[SPEAKER_04]: And then I delivered her by email, a song that I had written, describing the rest of our life together, like describing our first meeting, and then like the rest of our life all the way to happy and old.
32:24
[SPEAKER_04]: And then she was kind of silent, the email host on this, who kind of went dark, worked up a week's.
32:32
[SPEAKER_04]: And she explained that she had a boyfriend, but she thought it was a pretty cool song.
32:37
[SPEAKER_04]: We should keep in touch.
32:39
[SPEAKER_04]: And so it was like all that had happened and come to pass and then her boyfriend broke up.
32:50
[SPEAKER_04]: with me living in Charleston, her living in Nashville.
32:52
[SPEAKER_04]: It was kind of like, well, if we're going to date, we kind of have to like, somebody's going to get on a plane, you know?
32:56
[SPEAKER_04]: They're just like calendar meetings were involved from like the very beginning of our courtship.
33:03
[SPEAKER_04]: So we were just laying the building blocks for how to have a life and music together before we ever sang together.
33:10
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think
33:13
[SPEAKER_04]: That was like a certainly an additional level of vulnerability of opening of our relationship.
33:19
[SPEAKER_04]: We've been dating and supporting each other in our separate musical journeys.
33:25
[SPEAKER_04]: But then when we actually got together and sang songs together, figured out what songs do you know, what songs do I know?
33:31
[SPEAKER_04]: Could we write a song together?
33:32
[SPEAKER_04]: Each of those was just a deeper level of
33:35
[SPEAKER_04]: trust and vulnerability and like fortunately we started saying together we were both choir kids and we had a nice blend you know and we write songs in different ways that I think I'll make each other so it's it's a it's a continue to deepen it's been amazing
33:54
[SPEAKER_04]: This last chapter where Sally and George was very collaborative, we were like co-writing and kind of co-producing and making the arrangements together, you know, and bringing in our separate influences.
34:06
[SPEAKER_04]: This last chapter has been like me leading into my influences to make a solo record.
34:12
[SPEAKER_04]: with Shelby right there, you know, co-writing songs, singing harmonies, and baking treats during the studio.
34:19
[SPEAKER_04]: And then for Shelby's Bluegrass record, I was kind of behind the scenes, helping with the songwriting and the studio snacks.
34:27
[SPEAKER_04]: And so it's been neat to like,
34:32
[SPEAKER_04]: each kind of disappear behind each other for a moment and allow our artistic voice to be more crystallized in these two different recordings.
34:45
[SPEAKER_08]: This is a question about Joel's hair, which as far as I can tell has always been long.
34:54
[SPEAKER_08]: There it is.
34:55
[SPEAKER_08]: Currently, Joel's hair is this incredible mullet if you haven't had a chance.
35:00
[SPEAKER_08]: It really is like,
35:02
[SPEAKER_08]: It's like really a separate beast.
35:05
[SPEAKER_08]: It is business in the front.
35:07
[SPEAKER_08]: And I mean, it is party in the front and party all over.
35:10
[SPEAKER_08]: Maybe so bold.
35:12
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel, your hair is perhaps the most epic hair in all of folk in country.
35:18
[SPEAKER_08]: How long have you had your hair cut?
35:22
[SPEAKER_08]: How does your hair impact the way people perceive your you and your music?
35:27
[SPEAKER_08]: And this also is a free for all if anyone else wants to chime in about Joel's amazing hair.
35:34
[SPEAKER_04]: I do have a lot to say on this subject.
35:38
[SPEAKER_04]: I haven't always had long hair.
35:39
[SPEAKER_04]: I could find some pictures where I had a platinum buzzcat.
35:43
[SPEAKER_04]: This was probably over ten years ago before I probably had long hair when I met Shelby.
35:49
[SPEAKER_04]: Then during the pandemic,
35:51
[SPEAKER_04]: We were headed out west and we stopped through Knoxville, Tennessee, and our friend Cindy Lou gave me my first mallet.
36:01
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, my first mallet since childhood, first adult mallet.
36:05
[SPEAKER_04]: And there was a very nicely feather, you know, very like a very professional do.
36:12
[SPEAKER_06]: And I thought it would- A bit case urban, if I might add.
36:16
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh, okay.
36:17
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
36:19
[SPEAKER_04]: So I thought it was going to be a brief transitional haircut back to some kind of like short hair or buzz cut.
36:27
[SPEAKER_04]: But I quickly just like felt this new found power and masculinity and like respect, you know, when I walked into a gas station and then a friend of mine, a friend of mine advised me like, dude, you need to grow a mustache and go with the mullet.
36:45
[SPEAKER_04]: And then when I did that, it unlocked this whole, like I finally became a man, essentially.
36:52
[SPEAKER_06]: Wow.
36:54
[SPEAKER_06]: People think he looks a lot like Tony Rice.
36:57
[SPEAKER_06]: And now with the mustache in the mallet, just if that, you know, gets him backstage a lot of places.
37:02
[SPEAKER_06]: Not just.
37:05
[SPEAKER_06]: But actually, Ethan had a mallet.
37:07
[SPEAKER_06]: I believe when Joel cut his hair into a mallet.
37:12
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
37:12
[SPEAKER_04]: I credit Ethan as part of my inspiration for sure.
37:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll take it.
37:20
[SPEAKER_04]: He had to walk so I could run.
37:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, his is better than mine ever was.
37:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Mine was out of, you know, COVID just I only could really see the front to cut my own hair.
37:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just kind of cut the front and let the back alone.
37:36
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, Joel has since taken to cutting his own wallet.
37:38
[SPEAKER_06]: Every once in a while, he'll enlist me.
37:41
[SPEAKER_06]: And he tells me, I'd like it to look like I went to, uh, what did you say, French rastery?
37:49
[SPEAKER_04]: No, it's a park bench in London with a rusty razor.
37:53
[SPEAKER_06]: Something like that, like make my hair look like, you know, I want it, rough and raw.
37:59
[SPEAKER_06]: And everyone's around.
38:00
[SPEAKER_06]: He'll get a, uh, a pro to really shape the wallet and
38:06
[SPEAKER_06]: But mainly it's about cutting out the ears, making the ears are visible.
38:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
38:14
[SPEAKER_08]: This is a question about Shelby being good at explaining things.
38:19
[SPEAKER_08]: Of Shelby means Jerry Douglas has said she knows what she wants and she's good at explaining it.
38:27
[SPEAKER_08]: Would you all agree?
38:29
[SPEAKER_08]: And also Shelby, where do you think that particular?
38:31
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm very envious of that trait.
38:35
[SPEAKER_08]: But where do you think that comes from?
38:38
[SPEAKER_06]: With Jerry, I think, going into the recording process, we had thirteen songs in three days to get them all done.
38:49
[SPEAKER_06]: So I mapped out, and I thought about the arrangements for each song.
38:53
[SPEAKER_06]: I knew who I wanted to solo wear.
38:56
[SPEAKER_06]: And I knew what tempo I wanted the song to be at.
38:59
[SPEAKER_06]: And I just, I wanted to be really prepared and Maya helped me so much, figuring all the logistics out like who's coming in on what day and how we're going to schedule the musicians.
39:11
[SPEAKER_06]: And then once we were in there, I didn't want to have to waste time thinking about arrangements.
39:16
[SPEAKER_06]: So I wanted to leave space a little bit for improvisations at the end of songs in a little bit at the beginning, but just having the general map of how the songs would go, that was important so we could get it all done.
39:29
[SPEAKER_06]: That's probably where it comes from with Jerry.
39:34
[SPEAKER_08]: There's the rest of the class thing.
39:38
[SPEAKER_04]: she's a great communicator for sure she really is and she has a pleasant speaking voice so people like listen they want to hear what she has to say but yeah I mean as a as like
39:52
[SPEAKER_04]: All the different roles that we play, you know, relationship-wise as partners or roommates or driving buddies or bandmates, that kind of communication is really, really valuable.
40:06
[SPEAKER_04]: So she's good one to have her out.
40:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing grows forever.
40:26
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a good thing to remember.
40:30
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all right, being right.
40:33
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all right, being wrong.
40:36
[SPEAKER_01]: If there's any good thing, I'm gonna sing it.
40:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Anytime, there's any good.
40:50
[SPEAKER_08]: All right, on choosing Maya Dividre as producer for both of your records, it is pretty cool Shelby and Joel that you both chose Maya to produce each of your solo debut albums.
41:02
[SPEAKER_08]: What made you want her as a producer and like what's something that surprised you about what kind of producer she was in practice?
41:11
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe I should go first just because
41:14
[SPEAKER_04]: chronologically I've made that decision first and I've been playing guitar for Maya for a little bit at that point and sort of like mulling over the idea that I wanted to make a solo record and kind of thought like well
41:33
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe the ideal person is like a keyboard player, you know, that also has a studio, you know, and maybe there a drummer too, then we can just like me and this person can just like knock the whole thing out and record it, and it would be really like minimal.
41:50
[SPEAKER_04]: But then I just, I just was just kind of watching, watching the way that Maya led her band, and then also sort of was creating an identity
42:00
[SPEAKER_04]: separate from what she done with the stray birds and just like, you know, washing the studio that she was working at and the people that she was playing with and just thought, yeah, I mean, I think that's kind of what I want.
42:15
[SPEAKER_04]: And I really love her songwriting and her attention to the vocals.
42:23
[SPEAKER_04]: So just all those skills together,
42:26
[SPEAKER_04]: And I like a lover recordings and I knew that she had been producing and co-producing her last couple records and was like, well, yeah, let's give it a shot.
42:37
[SPEAKER_04]: And it was a new, I didn't have
42:42
[SPEAKER_04]: I've never made a solo record before, so I didn't have anything to sort of wait against.
42:45
[SPEAKER_04]: So I felt like just let's just walk through this door.
42:49
[SPEAKER_04]: And I knew the scheduling would be easy because we were touring together, so we could work in the gaps versus coordinating two different touring schedules.
42:59
[SPEAKER_04]: So they were like, put both practical and creative considerations.
43:04
[SPEAKER_04]: But I'm really, really happy it turned out so good.
43:06
[SPEAKER_04]: Like a lot of the work went in before we before this recording ever started.
43:13
[SPEAKER_04]: I came to Nashville a couple times.
43:14
[SPEAKER_04]: My I came to Charleston and we sort of workshop the songs went through the notebooks figured out what we wanted to do and how they were going to feel and what instruments we wanted and who was going to be there on what days you know and we got it all got it all organized and it turned out better than I could have ever expected.
43:35
[SPEAKER_04]: And Shelby was watching me this whole time.
43:39
[SPEAKER_06]: taking notes.
43:43
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I have made records with producers.
43:49
[SPEAKER_06]: My first with a producer was Delamez.
43:52
[SPEAKER_06]: This world often can be who Brian Sutton produced and he was a really good producer.
43:58
[SPEAKER_06]: He did a pre-production session with us and then we got into the studio and he managed
44:09
[SPEAKER_06]: all the parts.
44:10
[SPEAKER_06]: It wasn't so much scheduling because it was one band, but he managed the ups and downs of recording in the vulnerability of hearing yourself and helping to pull the best out of each of us, I think.
44:26
[SPEAKER_06]: So I knew that a good producer could do that sort of thing.
44:30
[SPEAKER_06]: And I'd also had Joel and I made a Sally and George Records self-produced, and although there were joys
44:39
[SPEAKER_06]: um, involved in that.
44:42
[SPEAKER_06]: There were also many challenges involved in self-producing.
44:46
[SPEAKER_06]: So I didn't want to, I didn't, I wanted a producer for my solar record.
44:53
[SPEAKER_06]: And having seen my work with Joel, I knew she really honored the vision of the artist.
45:00
[SPEAKER_06]: And I thought that was super important.
45:03
[SPEAKER_06]: I also heard that Maya was invited into the Sweetwater Workler's recording session as a studio du-la.
45:12
[SPEAKER_06]: And that was kind of what they called her.
45:15
[SPEAKER_06]: And I thought that sounds perfect.
45:17
[SPEAKER_06]: I need a studio du-la.
45:20
[SPEAKER_06]: Someone to help me feel comfortable to kind of be my cheerleader and just make sure that I'm relaxed because that
45:31
[SPEAKER_06]: will create a better product in the end.
45:34
[SPEAKER_06]: So that was really cool.
45:37
[SPEAKER_06]: Knowing that about my end and just having played with her before and as a band leader, I could imagine what it would be like if she was in a leadership role in the studio and I really trust her ear and her
45:54
[SPEAKER_06]: One thing I was surprised and impressed with is when you're in this studio you're working really intensely for many hours in a row and the producer is in charge of listening to everything and making sure that everything gets done and making sure that you got the best that you can without going too far, don't pushing, not pushing the artist too far,
46:19
[SPEAKER_06]: to the point where things aren't improving, but keep going until things get better.
46:25
[SPEAKER_06]: And then, yes, we got it.
46:28
[SPEAKER_06]: So Maya's ability to focus and say, I think we got it, I think we need to move on.
46:36
[SPEAKER_06]: That was really impressive to me.
46:39
[SPEAKER_06]: It's not so crazy, but it's impressive.
46:45
[SPEAKER_08]: All right, I got a couple questions about both of your solo records.
46:50
[SPEAKER_08]: So, Joel, psychedelic surf country.
46:53
[SPEAKER_08]: I want to ask you about the swimming song.
46:57
[SPEAKER_08]: So, that has everybody on the call is on the swimming song.
47:01
[SPEAKER_08]: My and Shelby are on harmonies Ethan is on base.
47:05
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a loud and wain right the third song that you heard him play live in twenty seventeen.
47:09
[SPEAKER_08]: I just got to interview Loudon really who's so awesome.
47:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, and I listen to his audio book.
47:18
[SPEAKER_08]: his memoir, which if you have not checked it out, it's really excellent.
47:22
[SPEAKER_08]: There's a whole chapter on his ten favorite places to go swimming.
47:28
[SPEAKER_08]: So anyways, I just love that song.
47:31
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a classic.
47:32
[SPEAKER_08]: I love your version of it.
47:35
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel, what was it about that song that resonated with you and then what was that one like for everyone to record?
47:40
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I mean, I grew up on the beach, so it was a super
47:47
[SPEAKER_04]: relatable.
47:48
[SPEAKER_04]: I wasn't really a pool kid, but I was a beach kid and a creek kid for sure.
47:53
[SPEAKER_04]: So just that joy and freedom and like, you know, power that comes for being a little kid and moving your body through the water.
48:04
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, I just, I still take great joy in that.
48:07
[SPEAKER_04]: And, and yes, the song was a really obvious one for me.
48:13
[SPEAKER_04]: And just sort of the,
48:15
[SPEAKER_04]: kind of the surf punk.
48:16
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't even really know where that came from.
48:18
[SPEAKER_04]: I just started playing it and that's just kind of how it came out, rather than doing it in like the twelve-eight kind of thing you know.
48:25
[SPEAKER_04]: And the band really latched right onto that and my own Shelby's harmonies.
48:30
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm really pleased with the whole thing.
48:34
[SPEAKER_04]: we made a music video for that song also and we used some footage from like the early eighties that my mom had shot on super eight of me and my my cousin's playing on the beach you know so it's like he did there's there's a baby in the nude yeah yeah yes right it's it hasn't been flagged yet that's me that's me actually got my first first solo record album I was full frontal
49:03
[SPEAKER_08]: brain.
49:04
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm just not really, there's nothing to hide, you know?
49:10
[SPEAKER_08]: Excellent.
49:12
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh, let me see.
49:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, so the other song I want to ask you about was guitar's guns and pickup trucks.
49:18
[SPEAKER_08]: So Joel, you wrote that song for Shelby's dad who you said is a tough Western dude with a gun safe, a collection of old trucks and a deep love of bluegrass music and he's in Wyoming, I think.
49:30
[SPEAKER_08]: So what have you learned about getting along with people who are different from you?
49:35
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks to your father-in-law.
49:39
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's a great question.
49:41
[SPEAKER_04]: He turns out that as graph as he was at first and how interested and he was in my qualifications today to solder, we have a lot in common.
49:54
[SPEAKER_04]: We have more in common than we do differently now.
49:58
[SPEAKER_04]: that was like communicating through those differences, knowing like what subjects are like not worth, you know, not worth arguing over, you know, we can fight, we can stay in the lanes where we have common ground and find out where we disagree and then stay away from those, you know, for the good of the me only you know.
50:22
[SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, he's on his way up to Montana Federal Camp, so he's going to Bluegrass Camp this week too, so we're
50:29
[SPEAKER_04]: We're huge, relating here.
50:33
[SPEAKER_06]: I think my dad was so happy that Joel wrote a song for him.
50:38
[SPEAKER_06]: He gifted him a guitar.
50:42
[SPEAKER_06]: So, I'm glad it was a guitar.
50:48
[SPEAKER_06]: I don't need another pickup track, just kidding.
50:49
[SPEAKER_06]: I would take a pickup track.
50:53
[SPEAKER_04]: I think he's worried I was gonna show up to a Shelby Means Bluegrass gig with a Taylor or something.
50:59
[SPEAKER_04]: So he had to get me a D-A-T.
51:00
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
51:00
[SPEAKER_07]: Very good.
51:03
[SPEAKER_04]: He's a traditionalist.
51:08
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, Shelby means your debut self-shitled album at the time of this episode being released.
51:14
[SPEAKER_08]: The album will be out.
51:16
[SPEAKER_08]: Hooray!
51:17
[SPEAKER_08]: Congratulations.
51:19
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you.
51:21
[SPEAKER_08]: So, all right, this is actually a question for Ethan.
51:25
[SPEAKER_08]: You've been listening to the record, I know.
51:29
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm sure you've heard this album.
51:31
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya mentioned that you offered like a big emotional support when she was working on Shelby's record.
51:38
[SPEAKER_08]: For those who don't know, Ethan is a bass player.
51:42
[SPEAKER_08]: What kind of advantage did Maya have with you a bass player in her corner while she was producing a bassist's solo record?
51:58
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure if it was an advantage that I'm a base player in particular.
52:03
[SPEAKER_00]: My is really good at.
52:11
[SPEAKER_00]: like I'm an ex I'm more of an external processor and my I can be more of an internal processor and when we have even when we've worked on music together um you know violet light was very much we kind of were talking about everything but like for instance her how to break a fall record which I played based on I live with her I lived with her at that time she was writing the songs actively
52:39
[SPEAKER_00]: over many months and I had never heard them until I got to the studio.
52:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
52:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And it should have managed to keep it only working times when I wouldn't be able to hear.
52:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And so actually as far as anything like musically that might relate to this record, not that I even would have wanted to have any part of that to step on Maya's leadership.
53:07
[SPEAKER_00]: But I just kind of would hear what over here are snippets of roughs or mixes or stuff like that when she would listen to them on the home stereo.
53:19
[SPEAKER_00]: But I didn't even hear the full record until Shelby had a listening party at the studio where they made it a couple weeks ago.
53:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And that was the first time I actually heard everything.
53:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So it truly was just more emotional support.
53:39
[SPEAKER_00]: for better or for worse, you know, being in a partnership with another musician means that we understand how deeply we get into projects and how much they mean to us and how much we care about them and that there's a lot that goes into that interpersonally and logistically and your personal energy
54:04
[SPEAKER_00]: management and stuff like that.
54:05
[SPEAKER_00]: So I really just, yeah, I really just was, we call ourselves each other's vibe coach.
54:14
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, I think I was there as a vibe coach when necessary, but otherwise I certainly wouldn't want me being a bass player with
54:30
[SPEAKER_00]: of my own style to like influence anything about another record that Maya was working on that I wasn't involved in even if it was a base player with her own style.
54:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but I mean, I don't.
54:46
[SPEAKER_02]: I would not have been able to make any of these records in the way that I made them.
54:56
[SPEAKER_02]: with the conviction that I did or with the attention that I was able to give without having a supportive partner, like even, even if it's like coming home from a long day to studio and he's made a stir fry.
55:15
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm just like, oh, there's food.
55:16
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my gosh.
55:17
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like those moments of
55:22
[SPEAKER_02]: or just, yeah, I don't know, like, just the fact, some of the people that we were working with on Shelby's record, like, Ethan had worked with him before, played with him before.
55:35
[SPEAKER_02]: There were connections that I was able to feel a little more, like there was like a little less distance between,
55:46
[SPEAKER_02]: me and Bluegrass in general, just because of some of Ethan's more recent connections with Bluegrass.
55:52
[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I don't like very subtle things like that that actually really kind of affect you.
56:01
[SPEAKER_02]: And just, yeah, just knowing that he trusted me and believed in me, like as a human, you know, that's nice to have that.
56:13
[SPEAKER_02]: You can't really like, you can't
56:16
[SPEAKER_02]: You can't really ever value that enough.
56:24
[SPEAKER_02]: And how that translates then to how you show up in your work.
56:32
[SPEAKER_08]: Shelby, this is a bluegrass album, which is one of your deep musical loves.
56:37
[SPEAKER_08]: And you've talked about your Nashville jam sessions with neighbors and friends.
56:43
[SPEAKER_08]: What were those jam sessions like and how do you think they evolved your musicality or connection to other players?
56:51
[SPEAKER_06]: They were awesome.
56:55
[SPEAKER_06]: I would try and think of all my friends and the different instruments that I wanted to come to the jam session and I never closed the jam.
57:06
[SPEAKER_06]: I wanted it to be like if my friend had a new friend in town visiting and they played the banjo and they wanted to come over that was totally fine with me.
57:14
[SPEAKER_06]: I usually had some sort of food, some chili, which I learned from my parents, who would host jam sessions.
57:21
[SPEAKER_06]: You got it.
57:21
[SPEAKER_06]: If you eat good, you play good.
57:24
[SPEAKER_06]: So we had food.
57:27
[SPEAKER_06]: Sometimes there would be a theme like on Valentine's Day.
57:30
[SPEAKER_06]: I would do like heart cookies or whatever.
57:32
[SPEAKER_06]: But just just fun.
57:34
[SPEAKER_06]: Just trying to have fun and my goal, moving to Nashville, was to surround myself with
57:40
[SPEAKER_06]: players who were better than me and to get better by that.
57:45
[SPEAKER_06]: Just play with people who are better and through that I met so many great friends and a lot of collaborators on my record with songwriting just kind of happened in just writing songs after hanging out after a jam or something like that.
58:03
[SPEAKER_06]: So organic but I think
58:09
[SPEAKER_06]: that can kind of describe my Nashville time.
58:12
[SPEAKER_06]: Everything I felt like I got into the Nashville flow when I first moved to town and one party led to another party where I met someone else and then I was hanging up with Christian and I ended up moving in with him and then we had a great household together Christian Settlemeyer because he was very outgoing person, is a very outgoing person and was
58:33
[SPEAKER_06]: like a conspirator the outlets get the jams together but sometimes they were even super simple because in our little complex it was me and Christian in the duplex Frank Rishi and sometimes his sisters or other friends living on the other side and Kelsey Walden in the trailer right next door so that already was a good jam so we just hang out and play music and just be silly get together and we're in our twenties and
59:02
[SPEAKER_06]: living it up in Nashville, in music city.
59:05
[SPEAKER_08]: This album also chronicles C U and Jule leaving Nashville for Charleston, which is Joel's home turf.
59:12
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
59:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Actually, it was like so excited to learn that you guys are in Charleston.
59:18
[SPEAKER_08]: My aunt's uncle lived there and we visited them a couple of times and it is awesome.
59:23
[SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
59:25
[SPEAKER_08]: So fun.
59:27
[SPEAKER_08]: But that is chronicleed in the song, Suitcase Blues.
59:31
[SPEAKER_08]: which sounds like it was a hard move so what has that move been like for you both?
59:39
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah for me it kind of bears it all in the song a little bit just of my nostalgia and
59:47
[SPEAKER_06]: about leaving Nashville.
59:50
[SPEAKER_06]: But shortly after we moved to Nashville, I got this amazing gig with Molly Tuttle and Golden Highway, and that really helped me feel like everything I'd worked for in Nashville was worth something.
1:00:06
[SPEAKER_06]: But I had a connection there, I had work based out of Nashville.
1:00:13
[SPEAKER_06]: That felt really good and it also felt really good to come back home to Charleston and be able to go for a walk on the beach and be surrounded by family, which was super important to me as well.
1:00:25
[SPEAKER_06]: So every transition I feel has some stickiness, a little bit of just navigating mentally that I have to do to
1:00:38
[SPEAKER_06]: get through it and just try and stay positive about it.
1:00:41
[SPEAKER_06]: But I certainly really enjoy living in Charleston now and being around Joel, it makes Joel happy to be home and that's really important to our relationship like our mental health and happiness.
1:00:57
[SPEAKER_06]: So we got to prioritize that.
1:01:04
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, just to clarify, it was right after we moved back to Charleston from Nashville, that she'll be got the call from Molly for that gig.
1:01:14
[SPEAKER_04]: And I was really relieved because it was a huge gesture for our relationship, for her to move away from that town where she had kind of like established herself as an adult and as a musician and as a, you know, a pre-minute, bluegrass picker.
1:01:31
[SPEAKER_04]: So I knew that if she had lost that opportunity because we'd relocate to South Carolina, it might have been the end of our marriage or we might have just been quickly trying to move in back to Tennessee or something.
1:01:43
[SPEAKER_04]: So it was really good.
1:01:44
[SPEAKER_04]: It was really good for both for her to have that work and still be so connected with the community there and for me to be playing with Maya and Nashville as well.
1:01:52
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, we've just, honestly, like I'm there.
1:01:57
[SPEAKER_04]: as much as I was when I lived there because I was touring so much out of Nashville.
1:02:01
[SPEAKER_04]: We were traveling to Sally and George and I was playing with Soldier for Train.
1:02:04
[SPEAKER_04]: And then when I would get back to Nashville, I would like want to be, you know, go surfing or go hiking is like kind of the way that I recharge my battery.
1:02:14
[SPEAKER_04]: And Nashville wasn't nurturing in that way.
1:02:18
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like the social scene, the jams.
1:02:21
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what it gives.
1:02:23
[SPEAKER_04]: And that can fill your cup, you know.
1:02:28
[SPEAKER_04]: For me, I love Nashville more when I can like, treasure what it has to offer and not expect things out of it that it's not capable of delivering for me.
1:02:38
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I, you know, I go to South Carolina for the ocean and for the family ties and for my old friends.
1:02:46
[SPEAKER_04]: And I go to Nashville for the for the musical community and for the incredible shows that go down every night of the week, you know, and the spontaneous collaborations that occur.
1:02:58
[SPEAKER_06]: even and Maya had a lot to do with Joel's mental happiness in Nashville because they're they also love hiking and like rock climbing like we were saying and so to connect with people who were such badass musicians that also wanted to go move their bodies and find beautiful spots in nature that was really that was a turning point I think in our Nashville time
1:03:28
[SPEAKER_06]: off topic, but relating to all of us here.
1:03:32
[SPEAKER_08]: Well, Maya Shelby and Joel right now are at music summer camp, and I know that Maya and Shelby are gonna be playing in Charleston.
1:03:42
[SPEAKER_08]: I mean, when you're listening to this episode right now, this is all in the past, but I texted my uncle and I was like, check out this cool show, but it seems like the friendship and doors despite the distance between the four of you.
1:03:59
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, we love hosting our friends to come to Charleston.
1:04:03
[SPEAKER_06]: It's a nice getaway.
1:04:05
[SPEAKER_06]: There's an easy nonstop flight from Nashville to Charleston.
1:04:08
[SPEAKER_06]: And if anyone's craving a little ocean time, you know, we can come visit Shelby and Joel on the beach.
1:04:18
[SPEAKER_06]: And saying like for us to come and come into Nashville, just we treasure Maya and Ethan and our friendship there.
1:04:28
[SPEAKER_06]: Thankfully, we've got these easy flights or a day drive to get to the next city.
1:04:36
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Joel and Shelby hosted me and Ethan for, for fourth of July, I think it was last summer.
1:04:42
[SPEAKER_02]: We went for a beach vacation and stayed with them for a couple of days and took us biking on the beach and we saw some beautiful sunsets and they know where to go to get the, you know, the fresh catch.
1:04:53
[SPEAKER_02]: And we have the best fish.
1:04:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, that was, that was a grouper for the ages.
1:04:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That Joel grew back for us.
1:05:03
[SPEAKER_02]: And that felt really good to do that because that was we had tracked, you know, Joel and I were sort of at the end of of this of the work with his record and then Shelby and I were still in the midst of her record, but we had we had tracked it in Nashville and March and then
1:05:23
[SPEAKER_02]: They were still some, you know, harmony singers to track down, scheduling things to align, but to be able to just set all that aside and and and go ride bikes on the beach for a couple days.
1:05:36
[SPEAKER_02]: It was that was really meaningful trip.
1:05:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, one of the things that can be tough as a musician that might not be obvious to other people who work other professions, you know, you kind of end up all your friends or musicians and you all really love music a lot and you like playing it and talking about it and it can be really easy to
1:06:04
[SPEAKER_00]: only do that with your friends and only ever connect through music, which is fine, but you know, it picture, for anyone who's listening to this picture, your career, and if you only ever connected to people who did that and who only talked about that.
1:06:22
[SPEAKER_00]: It might get old after a while.
1:06:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And music is a really wonderful powerful thing that we all do ultimately out of joy, but remembering to connect not about music, remembering to culture friendships that are more normal, you know, just about being friends.
1:06:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, on that trip in particular,
1:06:46
[SPEAKER_00]: maybe we played a little music together but I don't know that we ever really did.
1:06:51
[SPEAKER_00]: It was more like let's go take a bike ride or let's go take a walk or let's go see some music which is maybe a more normal person thing to do or go get a taco or grill some fish or whatever and that's
1:07:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, I guess that's a thing, I think, with the four of us hanging out in general since we've all known each other, I feel like we have kind of prioritized that with, you know, going hiking or climbing or doing all these other things in addition to the music, just to make it, to make sure that at the end of the day, we connect in more ways than just through our instruments, you know.
1:07:31
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:07:33
[SPEAKER_08]: This has been awesome.
1:07:34
[SPEAKER_08]: Before I let you go, we're going to do a lightning round.
1:07:38
[SPEAKER_08]: Ethan and Maya have played this game before.
1:07:40
[SPEAKER_08]: It's kind of like the newlyweds.
1:07:42
[SPEAKER_08]: It's called Witch One.
1:07:44
[SPEAKER_08]: And we're going to go back and forth between Maya and Ethan and Shelby and Joel.
1:07:49
[SPEAKER_08]: So your answer is yourself, your spouse, both of you or none of you.
1:07:55
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, Maya and Ethan will do this one first to give an example for Shelby and Joel.
1:08:02
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya and Ethan, which one?
1:08:05
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh wait, I forgot about this.
1:08:07
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm going to count down three, two, one, and then after I say one, is that's when you say the answer?
1:08:12
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:08:12
[SPEAKER_08]: All the G's.
1:08:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, here we go.
1:08:14
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya and Ethan, which one knows all the passwords?
1:08:19
[SPEAKER_08]: Three, two, one.
1:08:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Ethan.
1:08:22
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya, I have to turn your mic on.
1:08:27
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's do it again.
1:08:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I lip red what she said.
1:08:30
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, she said Ethan.
1:08:31
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:08:36
[SPEAKER_08]: All right.
1:08:36
[SPEAKER_08]: Do you guys get it?
1:08:37
[SPEAKER_06]: God.
1:08:37
[SPEAKER_06]: I think so.
1:08:38
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:08:41
[SPEAKER_08]: Shelby and Joel, which one is writing you a really long note in your birthday card?
1:08:48
[SPEAKER_08]: Three, two, one.
1:08:50
[SPEAKER_04]: Neither one of us.
1:08:53
[SPEAKER_08]: You neither can believe it.
1:08:55
[SPEAKER_06]: Sorry, I'm not an answer, but.
1:08:58
[SPEAKER_06]: No, it's an answer.
1:09:00
[SPEAKER_06]: It's all right.
1:09:02
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll keep trying.
1:09:03
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm not giving up on you, too.
1:09:05
[SPEAKER_08]: All right.
1:09:07
[SPEAKER_08]: Maya and Ethan, which one is sending postcards on vacation?
1:09:10
[SPEAKER_08]: Three, two, one.
1:09:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Maya.
1:09:15
[SPEAKER_08]: All right, okay.
1:09:20
[SPEAKER_08]: Shelby and Joel, which one is winning the card game?
1:09:24
[SPEAKER_08]: Three, two, one.
1:09:27
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel.
1:09:28
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:09:30
[SPEAKER_08]: All right.
1:09:33
[SPEAKER_08]: My and Ethan, which one is awake in the middle of the night?
1:09:37
[SPEAKER_08]: Three, two, one.
1:09:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Ethan.
1:09:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Back could be better.
1:09:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:09:47
[SPEAKER_08]: All right.
1:09:48
[SPEAKER_08]: I want to do that one too.
1:09:50
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:09:51
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll do one more for Shelby and Joel.
1:09:53
[SPEAKER_08]: And then we'll do one for everyone.
1:09:55
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:09:56
[SPEAKER_08]: Shelby and Joel.
1:09:57
[SPEAKER_08]: Which one is driving?
1:10:00
[SPEAKER_08]: Joel.
1:10:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Joel.
1:10:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Joel.
1:10:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Joel.
1:10:02
[SPEAKER_08]: I was sorry.
1:10:02
[SPEAKER_08]: I didn't even give you a second.
1:10:04
[SPEAKER_08]: That's okay.
1:10:05
[SPEAKER_08]: Sometimes it's too exciting.
1:10:07
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
1:10:08
[SPEAKER_08]: This one is for everyone.
1:10:12
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll do the countdown.
1:10:13
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, and then we'll learn which one is petting every dog three two one all of us
1:10:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Only if I've just like seen a dog actively plow through Poison Ivy.
1:10:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Like there was a time when when when their dog Casper was out on the road with us and he had just plowed through some Poison Ivy and then he came over for some for some cuddles and I've presented him.
1:10:47
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh, yeah.
1:10:48
[SPEAKER_06]: I've gotten Poison Ivy from my dog.
1:10:50
[SPEAKER_06]: So that is smart.
1:10:54
[SPEAKER_08]: epic.
1:10:55
[SPEAKER_08]: Well, thank you so much for your time.
1:10:57
[SPEAKER_08]: This has been really wonderful, sitting and talking with you all.
1:11:00
[SPEAKER_08]: I really appreciate it.
1:11:02
[SPEAKER_04]: Thank you so much.
1:11:03
[SPEAKER_04]: Thanks for having me.
1:11:10
[SPEAKER_08]: This episode of Basic Folk was produced by CJ Nungesser, Dietrich Strauss Composes or Music.
1:11:16
[SPEAKER_08]: Basic Folk is a production of the Bluegrass situation.
1:11:19
[SPEAKER_08]: You can find all of our episodes there.
1:11:21
[SPEAKER_08]: You can search for Basic Folk on the Series XM app.
1:11:24
[SPEAKER_08]: You can check us out on FolkAlley's mobile app or FolkAlley.com.
1:11:29
[SPEAKER_08]: You can go to Basic Folk.com or you can listen wherever you get your podcasts.
1:11:35
[SPEAKER_08]: If you enjoyed this episode, perhaps you should share it with a friend.
1:11:39
[SPEAKER_08]: Maybe that friend who is a former farm girl, or that friend who has the most epic hair, that friend truly will appreciate this episode.
1:11:50
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks for listening all the way to the end.
1:11:52
[SPEAKER_08]: Talk to you next time.
1:11:53
[SPEAKER_08]: Bye!