Latest / Beyond the Facade with Choose Recovery Services and Blueprint Institute / 32: My Partner Can't Handle the Truth!

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32: My Partner Can't Handle the Truth! · Beyond the Facade with Choose Recovery Services and Blueprint Institute

• 0:00
  Hey everybody, I'm excited to do that.
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  You showed up here and are listening today.
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  Have you ever had this experience where you just feel
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  like this is definitely a piece of information that I shouldn't
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  be sharing with my partner? Like I I either deserve some
• 0:16
  right to some type of privacy or really is sharing everything
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  helpful? It can't be everything.
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  We're going to talk about that today.
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  Welcome to Beyond the Facade podcast.
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  I'm your host, Luke Gordon, and I'm thrilled to have you join me
• 0:34
  in the space today. What we're going to be doing is
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  diving deep into the trials and triumphs and truths of seeking
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  authenticity. Becoming your true self isn't
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  about a single action or a moment.
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  It's a relentless pursuit, a commitment to self that reveals
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  a rich connection and meaning that our life has to offer.
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  So whether this is your first time tuning in or you're a
• 0:53
  regular listener, know this. What you're building here goes
• 0:56
  beyond a conversation. You're here to challenge, to
• 0:59
  change, and to celebrate the incredible journey of becoming
• 1:02
  your authentic self. Because when you dare to show up
• 1:05
  fully, the rewards are immeasurable.
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  So welcome to Beyond the facade. Let's get started.
• 1:09
  All right, so one thing is I want to mention to you all is we
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  do have an intensive coming up in Spanish Fork, UT it's called
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  the unmasked. It's unraveling layers of shame
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  and reclaiming your authentic self.
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  We if you're walking around, you're feeling like that you
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  can't really be authentic and vulnerable and connected to the
• 1:30
  people that you love. Love to have you explore this a
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  little bit. So please reach out to us to
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  learn a little bit more. We'll put in the notes more
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  about the intensive. It's a three day in Spanish
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  Fork, UT on January 15th through the 17th and be doing a decent
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  amount of digging into the why and the root cause of the hiding
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  in secrecy and shame. So please come hang out with us.
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  All right, so let's jump into this.
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  So I'm really excited to have Laura back here.
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  Is that your second time back here, Laura?
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  It is, yeah. Thanks.
• 2:00
  I appreciate you being willing to come back.
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  Love it. So I wanted Laura to be here
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  because basically the the perspective of her professional
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  perspective and because of the amount of work that she does
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  with the partner in healing the betrayed partner and what
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  they're what goes through my their mind and what they think
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  about Laura. I could really just appreciate
• 2:24
  you weighing in and all that. But let me set up what we're
• 2:28
  talking about today with this, with the general thing that
• 2:33
  happens that specifically been coming up in our groups lately
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  around what should I share and what not should I share?
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  You have this situation that comes up frequently where you
• 2:44
  have, let's say in a therapy session with a therapist or
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  maybe with a sponsor or somebody else where the person weighs in
• 2:54
  on their spouses or partners behavior or thoughts or
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  anything. And they say, yeah, I don't
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  know, like your partner seems to be kind of unreasonable or I
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  don't know if they have realistic expectations or maybe
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  they're selfish or boundaries are too strict or I think
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  they're going about the wrong way.
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  And because that person is trusted or respected, has a high
• 3:19
  degree of influence, what comes up often, which is the I don't
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  think I should be sharing that or maybe even thinking about a
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  sharing it because I'm in a confidential place.
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  And I don't think it I don't think it should.
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  What any other themes to that Laura of the not sharing because
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  of a certain reason. I think that's really so common
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  across the board, right? And I think that how we handle
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  that is is going to be the key there to your healing both
• 3:50
  individually and relationally. So a lot of times what the men
• 3:55
  that I say will work with is, yeah, that doesn't have anything
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  to do with me. That's just somebody else's
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  opinion. That's somebody else's thoughts.
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  They're not mine. So I'm not going to share just
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  random stuff that's going to make her hurt.
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  And then there's also AI notice that's tucked away in the back
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  of their mind that it's actually sometimes verbalized or
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  sometimes or it's not or not even recognized, which is, I
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  think that can have a point. I think there's some truth
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  there. OK.
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  And yeah, go ahead. Can I go back to something you
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  said just a second ago? Yeah.
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  I don't want to tell her that because it would hurt her.
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  OK, Can I'm going to just ask you to maybe role play for a
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  second. Like, why do you get to decide
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  what she hears and what she doesn't hear?
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  OK, so I'm going to, like you said, role play.
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  I'm going to put myself in the shoes of one of the men that I'm
• 4:54
  around and what they would say to that.
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  Does that work? Yeah, yeah.
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  Can you ask that question again? Why do you get to decide what
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  she gets to hear? I think I, I don't know if I get
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  to decide, but I, I don't, I've been placed in a situation where
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  you don't want to hurt her with that information.
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  I don't know if I agree with that or I don't agree with that.
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  So what's the point in giving that to her?
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  OK. And OK, here's another question
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  then. When all of this acting out
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  behavior was discovered by your partner, what was the hardest
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  part for her to metabolize in all of that?
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  The lies, the secrecy, the hiding.
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  Yeah, but I want to pause on the role play for a second because
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  let's just like highlight that partner after partner after
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  partner that I meet with. The acting out behavior is so
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  hurtful, but it's the lies that are so traumatizing because the
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  reality that I was living wasn't the one I knew about.
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  So when you're trying to heal relationally, you have to have
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  that rigorous honesty and you deciding what she gets to hear.
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  And what she doesn't get to hear is back in that same mindset of
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  I can't tell her because she would be hurt.
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  And that very act of keeping that from her is what is going
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  to traumatize her. OK.
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  I'm going to stay in the role play and I'm going to push back
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  on that. OK, go ahead, try.
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  OK, you really try. I love it.
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  Try. OK, But it wasn't like behavior
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  that I picked. It's not like I was looking at
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  porn and choosing to hide that from her.
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  I didn't invite myself into that environment to get that.
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  I recognize that this person that I value that says this.
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  It's not like I'm picking that. That was theirs, you know, and I
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  just, I was around for it. So am I lying or anything by
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  that? OK, well here's here's a
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  question. OK.
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  Is this person that you are that you heard it from, is this
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  person being hired to help you, to heal you and a relationship?
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  I mean, yeah. OK, so this person is in a
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  position of trust. They've made comments that are
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  not in alignment with that goal. Yeah, yeah, I know.
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  That's, that's, that's true. That's true.
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  And I'm kind of angry that they put me there.
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  OK OK so let's look at this from like an attachment perspective
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  for a second. We can Only Connect to the
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  degree that there are no secrets.
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  So the minute that I am not being fully honest with my
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  partner, I have right there put a limit on how secure I can feel
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  in the relationship and how secure the relationship can be
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  intimacy wise. So if your goal is a healed
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  relationship, then deciding what she or the partner gets to hear
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  or doesn't get to hear because of how they might metabolize
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  that information, you're right there.
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  You're putting a limit on how close and how secure you can
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  feel in that relationship. OK, so I, I have a question that
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  I'll ask on behalf of the people, the men or women that
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  are in the situation of this of needing to, of recognize that
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  healthiness is transparency. I get why I need to not hide,
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  but does she even really want to know this?
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  Because I feel like I can, I feel like I can not make a
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  decision for her, but I wouldn't want to know this.
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  I wouldn't want to know if somebody says that I'm this.
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  So what if I feel like I know what she wants?
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  Let's just operate from the assumption that you don't know
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  what she want. And let's ask part of that
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  healing process from betrayal is voice and choice.
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  She needs to have the choice and be able to use her voice.
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  That's part of. That's part of what?
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  That's part of the partner's healing.
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  OK, so she. That ability, yeah, because that
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  has been taken away, That's part of that traumatic.
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  My reality that I was living isn't the one I knew about.
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  I didn't have the ability to consent to be in the
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  relationship, right? And I didn't have the ability to
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  use my voice and say I'm not OK with this behavior.
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  And so part of that healing process is allowing that voice
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  and choice to now be a part of the relationship.
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  OK, OK, so this is really good. Let's zoom way out of it.
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  And I want to a couple of thoughts around all of this.
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  And I want you to just, if you're listening to this kind of
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  just check in with yourself. I'm going, which I'm recognize
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  you're probably already doing, which is what is it?
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  How does this apply to me? Does it apply to me?
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  And I really love about something you said, Laura,
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  around the partner in healings, part of her process or their
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  process is voice and choice, which is I just think that
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  healing is going to be the lack of conflict, like the just the
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  good days. And I recognize so much, the
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  healing now is going to be in me running to those tough
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  conversations and sharing that information that I know there's
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  going to be an emotional impact. And I go into those and I chase
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  those and I go after those. So she has an opportunity to
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  heal inside of the relationship instead of outside of the
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  relationship. Exactly.
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  Yeah, I think that's so hard to see is I think that the healing
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  has happens on the days without that and they actually don't.
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  That's not where the healing happens.
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  It happens in the days where this dialogue happens.
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  Yeah. For example, if I go to the gym
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  and I lift weights, that's where I'm getting stronger, not
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  thinking about going to the gym, not the days after the gym when
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  I'm taking rest days, it's in the heart, it's lifting the
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  heavy weights. That's where I'm getting
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  stronger. Yep, Yep.
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  Here's the cleverly disguised thing that our brains do when
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  I've won the person is experienced compulsive behavior
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  and their brain is just wired to self protect is clever ways to
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  disguise I'm doing this for somebody else, but I'm really
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  just doing it for myself when I'm really doing a self
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  protection. So it is at 1000 foot view.
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  It really just does look like you care about your person.
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  You're just like I care about them.
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  I don't want them to hurt. But what we find out often as we
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  unpack this is OK, so tell me what's coming up for you?
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  What's this about? And you go layers deep.
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  And we're going to have a conversation and they are going
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  to say things. The partner and healing the
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  betrayed person is going to say things and they're going to have
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  questions. Oh, yeah.
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  What are the questions about? What do you think?
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  How do you feel? Do you think that I'm this?
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  And then they recognize like, I don't really want to go there
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  because. Right now, I have to have a
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  conversation about the thing that I've been avoiding, right?
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  Because why did it happen in the 1st place?
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  Why am I in that environment, right?
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  Why am I with a sponsor or a therapist or somebody that I
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  trust and this subject comes up? It's because what is actually
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  the root? Was there something?
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  What do you think about with that, Laura?
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  Yeah, they say that mental health is commitment to reality
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  at all costs, right? And having to confront that
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  reality that this like, we might actually have a conversation
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  about maybe some resentments that I have that I've built up
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  that I've used as like justification in the past.
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  And I haven't wanted to dig into that because I know that I'm the
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  one that caused all this pain. And yeah, makes sense that
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  you're going to have that like fear and we can Only Connect to
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  the level that we have no secrets.
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  Yeah, yeah, because the one that's often is, is when you get
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  down to it is like, yeah. And I think I already said this,
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  but I think that person I'm talking to kind of has a point
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  that they, I think my partner is too rigid.
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  I think my partner is blank, too many boundaries, too
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  controlling. And I'm not telling you go to
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  your partner and throw everything on them and give them
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  all this unexpressed emotion. Expect them to change as much as
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  the conversations around transparency of what I'm
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  actually working through. So it's not about protecting my
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  partner, it's about protecting my unexpressed emotions that can
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  lead to further conflicts and disconnection.
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  Well, maybe protecting the parts of me that don't know how to
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  handle the reaction of the person of the partner, right?
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  Because that partner is likely to be really upset and probably
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  won't feel safe with that person seeking recovery, continuing to
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  see that trusted person, of course.
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  And I don't want the reaction that's going to happen if I
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  bring that up like that. Are you really protecting your
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  partner or are you afraid of how you might not have the skills
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  yet to respond? Yeah, and that's a pretty
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  common, which is I don't feel like I have the skills to
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  respond. They outsmart me.
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  Every time I enter a conflict, I don't have an answer and so I
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  avoid all of it. Begin with Laura, I feel like I
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  already asked this question, but I want to just keep going back
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  there one more time. Do the partner in healing the
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  person's betrayed, Do they actually want the person to
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  bring to them things that are going to 'cause that type of
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  emotional response? The things that the unexpressed
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  emotions? Do they want the things that
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  are? Do they want this stuff?
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  Does my question make sense? It it does.
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  And I'm trying to decide how I want to answer that because I
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  think if you were to survey 100 partners, the majority of them
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  would say, yes, I want, I need it.
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  Don't keep secrets from me. I need that honesty and
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  transparency and those same people in that conversation
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  would be like, I hate feeling dysregulated.
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  I hate that I'm so triggered right now.
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  I hate that you're even bringing this to me.
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  That doesn't mean let's let's not make the response the
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  evidence that you shouldn't have said something.
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  Yes, yes. Can you say that like three more
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  times in different ways? Let's not make the circumstance
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  the evidence. I think I said that last time I
• 16:20
  was on the podcast. So the circumstances, this
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  partner is really mad and she's yelling and she's telling me I
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  need to stop seeing this therapist or, or get a different
• 16:30
  sponsor or whatever because how dare they say that.
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  And that's not safe for me as as the person that just shared that
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  information, my brain is going to naturally say I should not
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  have shared that, I should not look now that person is so mad
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  at me and that's this isn't healing.
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  This isn't healing us at all. And it's actually the hard
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  conversations. That's where the repair in the
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  relationship happens. Can we navigate a hard
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  conversation? So can you give the listeners
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  what evidence, What are they, what should they be measuring?
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  If they shouldn't be measuring my partner's response to this,
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  what should they be measuring? Was I honest?
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  Was I acting in integrity? Am I living within my value
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  system? None of it has to do with the
• 17:22
  partner. You know what I think about when
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  I hear you say that and I think back about like attic days or
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  compulsive days and go like, that's not worth it.
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  What's the reward in that? Isn't that interesting?
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  Like. And I could just because even
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  though it wasn't yesterday, I can still.
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  And when I listen to you hear you say, yeah, though evidence
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  was measured as was I honest. And my dopamine saturated brain
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  does not see value in that right.
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  It doesn't see it. It's there's no, doesn't feel
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  like there's that much of A reward in there.
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  And that's that change of mindset that has to happen in
• 18:16
  that shift in recovery, right? Like I have to give up what I
• 18:19
  want now for what I want most. And if what I want now is like
• 18:24
  no conflict, then I'm going to give up what I want most, which
• 18:29
  is a deep connected relationship with my partner or a life of
• 18:35
  living in integrity. Like those things can't happen
• 18:39
  if I'm not doing the work now. Well, if you're training for
• 18:45
  like a, a, a marathon, you could any one of those training days
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  say, I don't like this, I hate running, it's cold, my shins
• 18:54
  hurt or whatever. And at any moment you could just
• 18:57
  be like, this isn't worth it. Hey, what do you want most?
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  Do you want to be able to run a marathon or do you want to just
• 19:03
  sit on the couch and watch TV today?
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  Yeah, and it's interesting because it's definitely an
• 19:08
  acquired taste, honesty and truth.
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  And the outcome, it's definitely doesn't taste good to begin
• 19:13
  with, but it starts tasting good way later.
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  So all I need to do is just be in enough pain to really want
• 19:20
  and need something different than that.
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  So not like say I don't know why I said all I need to do.
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  So easy. Yeah, this is easy.
• 19:28
  This is easy. The other piece of this that I
• 19:31
  wanted to mention, I had the opportunity to attend the
• 19:34
  women's intensive and it was amazing the feedback that we got
• 19:38
  from it. And just, I won't share the
• 19:41
  specifics because it's not appropriate, but just, and I,
• 19:44
  and if you're one of the people that attended it and this isn't
• 19:46
  your experience, I get my I just recognize that.
• 19:51
  But for that feeling like there's something different now
• 19:55
  and things to build on. But one thing that came up from
• 19:58
  the intensive that just still holds so much power for me, and
• 20:01
  it's not new, which is partners just saying, why was he not
• 20:06
  honest and how could he do this? Like how could he do this and
• 20:11
  not be real with me? And not see what kind of harm it
• 20:16
  could cause. And then I just think back about
• 20:20
  what's that movie with Jack Nicholson that says you can't
• 20:23
  handle the truth. Do you know what movie I'm
• 20:24
  talking about? I'm.
• 20:26
  Not your movie, gal. You're not the movie person that
• 20:29
  you're not the movie trivia person that I have on my team.
• 20:32
  Nope. OK, so there's that move, a few
• 20:34
  good men. And at the very end of the
• 20:36
  movie, he's like yelling in a courtroom, like you can't handle
• 20:39
  the truth. And those women are like, I, I
• 20:43
  need the truth in order for me to move through and be in this
• 20:46
  relationship. I need truth.
• 20:48
  And I think about him going, you can't handle the truth.
• 20:51
  And I think about him to your point earlier, making that
• 20:54
  decision for her over and over and over again, like what she
• 20:58
  can and can't handle. And inside my body right now, I
• 21:00
  want to jump out of my skin and I'm like, stop telling her what
• 21:05
  she can handle and what she can't.
• 21:07
  Can you not see how strong she is?
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  Can you not see what this stuff is?
• 21:12
  Stop protecting her in such a fruitful, not actually helpful
• 21:17
  way. Just think about this concept,
• 21:20
  my maladaptive ways of thinking that I'm protecting somebody.
• 21:24
  Yeah. And even as you say that, I can
• 21:25
  also imagine that there are listeners that are saying, but
• 21:29
  you don't know, my partner couldn't handle this.
• 21:33
  I just say that partner's body is handling it, whether or not
• 21:36
  she's aware of it. That's not fair to her to have
• 21:41
  her body having to respond to something that she doesn't know
• 21:45
  is happening. Can you slow that down and break
• 21:48
  that down a little bit more? Because that really, really
• 21:50
  matters what you're talking about.
• 21:53
  Like what is what you're saying? Her body is responding, She is
• 21:59
  there. There is handling going on.
• 22:01
  Yeah, and this kind of stems from Omar Munwala's concept of
• 22:06
  the secret sexual basement where he talks about there's this
• 22:08
  house and there's this beautiful family and, and there's this
• 22:12
  secret basement that has a trap door underneath the kitchen
• 22:15
  table that only the betraying partner knows about.
• 22:19
  And he goes down there and and then he comes back up and he
• 22:21
  puts the rug under, but there's fumes coming up from the
• 22:24
  basement. There's like depression,
• 22:28
  anxiety, chronic illness, autoimmune diseases.
• 22:31
  Those are all things that the partner's body is handling that
• 22:35
  are in effect or a side effect of living in a relationship that
• 22:41
  isn't in integrity. If that person is living in a
• 22:47
  relationship where the reality that they are living is not the
• 22:51
  one they know about, their body is responding, even if their
• 22:56
  brain doesn't know why. And think of that double bind
• 22:59
  there because the body is saying I'm not safe and the brain is
• 23:04
  saying I can trust and that that creates a mismatch there.
• 23:10
  So powerful, so powerful, their body knows, right?
• 23:15
  They body knows this isn't a secret to the body.
• 23:18
  So they're already, they're already handling it.
• 23:22
  It's just in a really, really destructive, hurtful way.
• 23:26
  Thank you for saying that. Any other thoughts on this Loris
• 23:28
  before we start to wrap it out? No.
• 23:31
  Yeah. This has been such a fun
• 23:32
  conversation. Yeah.
• 23:33
  Thanks for joining us for it and thanks for telling us that
• 23:36
  speaking to the the partners experience, that space of
• 23:41
  letting go of a theme that can be helpful is just that stated
• 23:45
  thing. Like you picture yourself on the
• 23:47
  edge of the Cliff, there's cold water below.
• 23:50
  Like how do I get the courage to to do things that I'm not
• 23:54
  normally used to doing as far as living in reality and sharing
• 23:57
  what truth is just that theme of let go of the outcome.
• 24:01
  It's OK Let go of the outcome, don't manage it, see what
• 24:07
  happens. Just watch and let go.
• 24:10
  Anyway, thanks for hanging out with AJ Laura.
• 24:12
  Absolutely. Hey, thanks for joining us
• 24:17
  today. If this is something that you
• 24:18
  connected with, I'd love to meet with you more and talk about it.
• 24:22
  So what you can do is go to chooserecoveryservices.com or
• 24:25
  check the show notes and there what we can do is set up a quick
• 24:28
  conversation meet. Thanks so much for listening to
• 24:30
  Beyond the Facade where we unmask the authentic self.