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Mini: Kintsugi · Why We Do What We Do

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  Speaker 1: You're listening to Why we Do what we Do. Welcome
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  Speaker 1: to Why We Do what we Do? Mini. I'm your
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  Speaker 1: host Abraham, and I'm your host Shane. We are a
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  Speaker 1: psychology podcast. We talk about the things that humans and
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  Speaker 1: non human animals do, and sometimes we talk about just
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  Speaker 1: really lovely traditions that are just good and great and
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  Speaker 1: we like them.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, sometimes traditions are really really fun. And this one
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  Speaker 2: is just a really I think, just a really interesting one,
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  Speaker 2: one that doesn't really I feel like it doesn't show
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  Speaker 2: up anywhere else except for in the region that we're
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  Speaker 2: going to talk about.
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  Speaker 1: It's kind of unique. I think it is spreading. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: it is becoming more commonplace, but it is unique. And
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  Speaker 1: you know, we use the word tradition, and I have
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  Speaker 1: criticized that word in the past, and I think that
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  Speaker 1: I would I stand by that criticism because this is
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  Speaker 1: not a tradition in the sense that we do it
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  Speaker 1: even though it's pointless and dumb. It's tradition in the
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  Speaker 1: sense that it's been done this way for a long time,
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  Speaker 1: or at least a version of it, but it's still
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  Speaker 1: very practical, whereas most traditions are not. When they are
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  Speaker 1: traditions In my mind, I've always thought that a tradition
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  Speaker 1: is what survives when the practical utility of a thing
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  Speaker 1: is long dead. Sure, and the point for doing it
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  Speaker 1: is long dead. But when things are practical, they stick around.
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  Speaker 1: And although it looks like a tradition because it doesn't
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  Speaker 1: change very much, it has actual reason to exist, and
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  Speaker 1: so we keep doing it. Yeah, but there are many
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  Speaker 1: traditions that persist. There are things that persist that have
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  Speaker 1: no reason to happen that way, and those are traditions anyway.
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  Speaker 1: So let's go ahead and dive into this, though, because
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  Speaker 1: we've already spent so much time, and this is a
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  Speaker 1: mini which means we don't have very much time, and
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  Speaker 1: actually that means I need to do a little bit
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  Speaker 1: of preamble, which is welcome and thank you for joining us.
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  Speaker 1: I hope that you enjoy what you hear in this podcast.
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  Speaker 1: You can support us by liking, subscribing, leaving us a rating, review,
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  Speaker 1: joining us on Patreon, and I'll give a quick elaboration
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  Speaker 1: of that at the end of this discussion. But this
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  Speaker 1: is a mini We release these on Mondays, and these
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  Speaker 1: are a short dive into a topic that we find
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  Speaker 1: interesting or want to explore or want to explain or something.
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  Speaker 1: We just talk, but for like fifteen minutes or so.
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  Speaker 1: But I've spent a huge amount of those minutes, proportionally speaking,
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  Speaker 1: not talking about our topic. So I think we need
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  Speaker 1: to get into it. Unless you have something to add
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  Speaker 1: to a preamble that I may have forgotten, which I
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  Speaker 1: do a lot.
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  Speaker 2: No party on Abraham.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, when a dish breaks, or any ceramic thing, we
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  Speaker 1: might throw it away and get a new one. It's broken,
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  Speaker 1: so we have to go out, go to the store
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  Speaker 1: pick up a new thing that we broke. Whatever, however,
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  Speaker 1: we might choose instead to repair the dish and glue
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  Speaker 1: it back together. That's the thing we might do.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, and usually we hope the glue will be invisible.
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  Speaker 2: But in the ancient Japanese art of kinsugi or kinsukuri
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  Speaker 2: I believe it's pronounced, the pieces are mended with powdered gold,
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  Speaker 2: silver or platinum mixed with lacquer. The brightly colored adhusive
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  Speaker 2: accentuates the imperfections of the repaired pottery rather than trying
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  Speaker 2: to hide them, so it makes them really really clear
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  Speaker 2: and stand out.
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  Speaker 1: This is also the album by Death Cab for Cutie yes,
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  Speaker 1: it is. This is just it's a beautiful idea and
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  Speaker 1: it applies both metaphorically and literally to many facets of
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  Speaker 1: our lives and cultures. So let's dig in a little
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  Speaker 1: bit to the history of kansugi, what it is, how
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  Speaker 1: it works, and how we can think about it psychologically
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  Speaker 1: in a metaphorical and literal way.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. So the art of kansugi has likely been around
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  Speaker 2: for centuries, but the origin is actually not very clear.
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  Speaker 2: Scholars are confident that kinsugi has been a common practice
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  Speaker 2: in Japan since the sixteen hundreds, and there are multiple
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  Speaker 2: legendary origin stories.
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  Speaker 1: So these stories are pretty apocryphal, unlikely that they're totally accurate,
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  Speaker 1: but we'll give you two of them. At least. One
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  Speaker 1: story suggested that there was the samurai long ago who
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  Speaker 1: accidentally broke his lord's pottery, and he wanted to show
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  Speaker 1: his contrition for breaking the pottery and also demonstrate and
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  Speaker 1: communicate that this was an accident and that the breaking
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  Speaker 1: of the pottery was not done in anger or out
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  Speaker 1: of rebellion or anything like that. So when reassembling the pottery,
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  Speaker 1: he used gold powder in the lacquer to help show
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  Speaker 1: that he made the repair and was doing it to
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  Speaker 1: not hide the fact that it happened and that it
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  Speaker 1: was not done out of anger anything of that nature. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Another story instead claims that an ancient shogun had sent
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  Speaker 2: a broken tea bowl of china for repairs. When the
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  Speaker 2: bowl returned with unseemingly metal staples holding it in place,
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  Speaker 2: the shogun instead employed craftsmen to find a more elegant,
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  Speaker 2: visually pleasing way of accomplishing the repairs, and they came
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  Speaker 2: up with a technique to embed gold into those cracks,
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  Speaker 2: into those fissures, in those fractures.
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  Speaker 1: Either way, however it was done or wherever it comes from,
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  Speaker 1: whatever happened there, Konsugi, which translates roughly to gold patch
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  Speaker 1: or something like that, is the outcome of three core values.
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  Speaker 1: We have a muttanai, which is regret that something is wasted,
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  Speaker 1: mouchine which is the acceptance of change, and wabi sabi,
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  Speaker 1: which is finding beauty in the flaw and the imperfect.
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  Speaker 1: And you can sort of see that immediately in what
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  Speaker 1: we've described so far, and that'll become more apparent as
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  Speaker 1: we go through it, that those are sort of values
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  Speaker 1: embedded in this practice.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, So if you can imagine if you drop the
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  Speaker 2: dish on the floor. Let's say it's something ceramic, like
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  Speaker 2: some type of glass like that. Then imagine all the
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  Speaker 2: broken pieces are reassembled to make the dishhole again, and
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  Speaker 2: all of the brakes and cracks and fissures and fractures
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  Speaker 2: and all that happened when the dish at the floor.
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  Speaker 2: They're held together by a thin web of gold or
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  Speaker 2: silver lines that now hold the entire piece together. That's kinsugi.
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  Speaker 2: So it looks like the plate that you had before,
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  Speaker 2: but now it's got like these gold kind of rivers
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  Speaker 2: that run through the entire dish, if you will.
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  Speaker 1: And it's often that it is now even stronger the
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  Speaker 1: way that it's held together. That because it has all
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  Speaker 1: these points where there's like various things that are holding
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  Speaker 1: it together, it's now less likely to be able to
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  Speaker 1: break again. It's now a stronger piece from the So
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  Speaker 1: it's both accentuating the beauty and improving its overall durability
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  Speaker 1: and functionality, which is the opposite. When you split a
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  Speaker 1: podcast and then you insert ads, that's like the opposite
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  Speaker 1: of kinsuki. We're back at some points in there and
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  Speaker 1: ad break happens. I'm not sure where just to had
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  Speaker 1: to figure it out. Sorry, that wasn't clear, all right.
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  Speaker 1: There are a few different types of kinsugi that people
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  Speaker 1: do this, So there is what's called crack konsugi. This
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  Speaker 1: is the most common. I think people have an association
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  Speaker 1: with a drug and that's not what's going on here.
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  Speaker 1: This is simply fitting broken pieces together with some adhesive.
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  Speaker 1: Super glue is really common in modern times. In the
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  Speaker 1: past it was some other sticky sort of lacquer like substance.
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  Speaker 1: But it's just you take all this all the pieces
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  Speaker 1: that were there, and they were there originally, put them
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  Speaker 1: back together, use some adhesive, but make sure it's it's
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  Speaker 1: colored with some kind of precious metal. That's kinsugi.
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  Speaker 2: Yep. There's also the piece method done by a piece maker,
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  Speaker 2: if you will right get it speaker. This is the
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  Speaker 2: where an entire piece of the broken object may be
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  Speaker 2: replaced by a solid piece of epoxy or some other
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  Speaker 2: resin like materials to use to fill the gap. So
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  Speaker 2: maybe like part of like the like when the dish
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  Speaker 2: is broken, like one piece is just too damage to
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  Speaker 2: be able to replace, so like you like to be
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  Speaker 2: able to replace it with the original piece, so you
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  Speaker 2: have to fill in the gaps.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, like a whole entire chunk that's like just the
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  Speaker 1: filler material, yeah, but also still has that coloring to it. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: although I did see some examples where it was like
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  Speaker 1: also entirely clear, but also highlights the fact that there's
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  Speaker 1: a piece missing. That was kind of cool too. I'll
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  Speaker 1: talk about that in a minute.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: So we have the crack method, the piece method, and
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  Speaker 1: the last one is called joint call. And this is
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  Speaker 1: where you actually use broken pieces from different pottery, from
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  Speaker 1: different like things that were broken, and they're used in
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  Speaker 1: place of a missing piece, and the two are held
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  Speaker 1: together with gold or that silver colored adhesive or platinum
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  Speaker 1: or whatever. So imagine you had like a piece of
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  Speaker 1: a broken tea cup that might be use to fill
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  Speaker 1: the gap and a broken plate for example. Not unlike
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  Speaker 1: patching genes, you know, for people who particularly grew up
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  Speaker 1: in like the eighties and nineties and well before that actually,
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  Speaker 1: but when you were using patches as like accent marks
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  Speaker 1: on genes in a way like you'd use logos and
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  Speaker 1: band patches and that sort of thing. Yeah, Anyway, in
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  Speaker 1: this particular type, like you take pieces from different objects
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  Speaker 1: that were broken and you use them to rebuild the
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  Speaker 1: broken object, and so it has the sort of appearance
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  Speaker 1: of like let's say it was a bowl or a plate,
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  Speaker 1: but you also have this like totally different color, different
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  Speaker 1: material that's in the chunk of it to help fill
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  Speaker 1: that space. But that's that joint call kinsuki.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, super cool. So of course metaphors abound. You know,
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  Speaker 2: humans like to find symbolism and see ourselves and everything,
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  Speaker 2: and kinsugi is one of those things that we see
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  Speaker 2: ourselves in. Right. We often try to hide our flaws
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  Speaker 2: or think of them as failures to overcome, but kinsugi
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  Speaker 2: instead might lead us to regard our flaws as a
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  Speaker 2: piece of who we are, and that it is through
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  Speaker 2: our mistakes that we have come the people we are
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  Speaker 2: today and stronger as a result. So no one makes
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  Speaker 2: it out of this life unscathed. But maybe those breaks,
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  Speaker 2: those fractures, those cracks, and when they're repaired, make us
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  Speaker 2: stronger and more resilient than we were before.
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  Speaker 1: And I know a lot of us might look back
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  Speaker 1: on our lives and say I would have done this differently,
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  Speaker 1: but I also think we acknowledged that had we done that,
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  Speaker 1: we wouldn't have ended up where we are. Sure if
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  Speaker 1: we hadn't gone through, you know, some experience or made
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  Speaker 1: some mistakes. We wouldn't have learned from those mistakes. We
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  Speaker 1: might not have had the opportunity to be the wiser
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  Speaker 1: for having gone through that, and we didn't want to
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  Speaker 1: go through in the moment, and we might have regretted
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  Speaker 1: that happened, but we also acknowledged the role that it played.
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  Speaker 1: So it's not that we celebrate the mistakes as like,
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  Speaker 1: let's go make a mess and screw everything up. It's
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  Speaker 1: let's acknowledge that that's the thing that happened. It is
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  Speaker 1: a part of us, and it is part of what
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  Speaker 1: made us who we are. Yeah, And you could also
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  Speaker 1: think of this societally as well. Perhaps if we accept
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  Speaker 1: the divisions we have in our culture and our societies
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  Speaker 1: and our cities, if we see those as unique variables
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  Speaker 1: that contribute to the rich and storied tapestry of our culture,
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  Speaker 1: it's possible something like that would help us see a
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  Speaker 1: path forward working together, that we acknowledge these divisions and
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  Speaker 1: we say like, let's take a look at those, Let's
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  Speaker 1: see what is the thing that seems like it's driving
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  Speaker 1: us apart and actually recognize it, like the fact that
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  Speaker 1: we are complicated as part of what makes us unique
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  Speaker 1: and great, and that we don't want a homogeneous group
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  Speaker 1: of hive minds like we want people to be individuals.
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  Speaker 1: We want people to be unique. Yeah, and have their
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  Speaker 1: own story as their own histories. And let's see the
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  Speaker 1: fact that we are different as a thing to acknowledge
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  Speaker 1: as being beautiful in its own way. It seems unlikely
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  Speaker 1: this will happen in the near future. We appear to
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  Speaker 1: be in the shatter the pottery phase of our culture. Sure,
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  Speaker 1: but maybe once people are done destroying society, we'll have
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  Speaker 1: a chance to put the pieces back together and maybe
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  Speaker 1: see the divisions among us as things that we can
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  Speaker 1: learn from.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. And finally, there is the literal practice of repairing
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  Speaker 2: broken things. The materialistic nature of our society that emphasizes
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  Speaker 2: stuff and new and more has many of us feeling
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  Speaker 2: disheartened about the amount of waste we're producing and the
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  Speaker 2: amount of money we are spending on the raw materials
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  Speaker 2: required to constantly make new things. So if we adopt
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  Speaker 2: a thing like this, we can repair things and reuse
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  Speaker 2: things and like take things that are kind of like
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  Speaker 2: and disrepair and fix them and be able to use
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  Speaker 2: them in a meaningful way. We can kind of upcycle
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  Speaker 2: things if you will. Yeah, and this is just a
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  Speaker 2: really beautiful way of doing this. It's just a little
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  Speaker 2: bit different than maybe just like repurposing something.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, So konsugi is a method to preserve our
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  Speaker 1: broken things longer rather than commit them to waste and
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  Speaker 1: to just purchase new things. So it has that aspect
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  Speaker 1: to it as well. So we have our metaphorical look
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  Speaker 1: at individual people or a metaphorical look at society as
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  Speaker 1: a whole, and a literal look at kensugi as a
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  Speaker 1: way to just preserve our raw materials and like not
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  Speaker 1: create so much garbage. Yeah, you know, we're not trying
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  Speaker 1: to end up in the state that Wally started with
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  Speaker 1: a Disney Pixar movie. I think it was Pixar Rasney something.
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  Speaker 2: Yes it was Pixar.
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  Speaker 1: Yes, okay, great, Well anyway, that's what we have to
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  Speaker 1: say about that. So go do kinsugi. Is there anything
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  Speaker 1: you would like to add or anything that I forgot
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  Speaker 1: before we wrap this up really quick?
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  Speaker 2: Uh nope, I don't think so.
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  Speaker 1: We did it in fifteen minutes. If you'd like to
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  Speaker 1: add free content behind the scenes stuff early episodes, and
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  Speaker 1: you have thoughts about Kinsugi, we would love to hear
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  Speaker 1: from you. Email us directly info at WWDWWD podcast dot com,
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: or reach out to us on the social media platforms
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: that we'd love to engage with you there, like subscribe,
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  Speaker 1: tell friends, do stuff like that. Also, thank you so
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: much for the team of people for helping make this happen.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you for recording with me today, Shane.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you for having me.
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  Speaker 1: Our social media coordinator is Emma Wilson, and our audio
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  Speaker 1: engineer technician is Justin who is awesome at doing all
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  Speaker 1: the audio things.
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  Speaker 2: Yes he is. He's the best.
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  Speaker 1: Anything that I forgot that you would like to add
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: before we say oah goodbyes, Nope, not today, all right?
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  Speaker 1: Thank you all for listening. Right around fifteen minutes, I
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: think we did it. But this is Abraham and this
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: is Shane. Why we do what we do? Mini is
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: out Bie. You've been listening to Why We Do what
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: We you You can learn more about this and other
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  Speaker 1: episodes by going to WWD WWD podcast dot com.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: Thanks for listening, and we hope you have an awesome day.