Latest / Beyond Labels Premium / Episode #151: Vitamin D: Why Experts are Saying ‘No’ to Routine Testing & Supplementation

Transcript

Episode #151: Vitamin D: Why Experts are Saying ‘No’ to Routine Testing & Supplementation · Beyond Labels Premium

0:00
SPEAKER_01: They are no longer endorsing that target 30 nanograms per mil.
0:04
SPEAKER_01: They're saying that it's kind of an arbitrary number that's just been thrown out there that we don't really know if that's the actual target we should be reaching.
0:13
SPEAKER_01: And the second thing is they're no longer endorsing specific vitamin D levels to measure or to determine if somebody is sufficient in vitamin D, insufficient, or deficient.
0:26
SPEAKER_01: They're actually saying that there is no consensus on the definition of the level that is associated with vitamin D deficiency.
0:37
SPEAKER_00: Welcome everybody to another episode of Beyond Labels with your hosts, Joel Salatin.
0:43
SPEAKER_00: That would be me, the farmer, and Dr.
0:45
SPEAKER_00: Cena McCullough, our favorite researcher and uh and sleuth on all things nutritional and living, who has just found new guidelines about vitamin D, which we all know is the sunshine vitamin.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: And she's going to share what she's found about new recommendations for vitamin D.
1:07
SPEAKER_00: Sena, take it away.
1:09
SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Joel.
1:10
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so this is actually a really cool story.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: There are new guidelines that are turning conventional wisdom on its head.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: They're offering surprising new recommendations that could actually impact your decision about taking vitamin D and even testing your vitamin D level.
1:28
SPEAKER_01: As you mentioned, Joel, it is the sunshine vitamin because we could make vitamin D in our skin.
1:33
SPEAKER_01: But vitamin D has nonetheless become increasingly popular because of its potential role in disease reversal.
1:41
SPEAKER_01: In fact, about 18% of adults now report taking vitamin D supplements, and more than 10 million blood tests are performed annually in the U.S.
1:52
SPEAKER_01: in order to check vitamin D levels.
1:55
SPEAKER_01: However, the Enderkin Society has come out with its 2024 guidelines.
2:01
SPEAKER_01: They are now advising against routine vitamin D screening.
2:06
SPEAKER_01: So that means they're advising against routine vitamin D testing, and they are against routine supplementation for certain populations, including adults aged 19 to 74, right?
2:26
SPEAKER_01: So 19 to 74 year olds now.
2:28
SPEAKER_01: They're saying that they're against routine supplementation, that basically you should meet the RDA level and not supplement.
2:35
SPEAKER_01: This is a major shift from the 2011 guidelines.
2:39
SPEAKER_01: And we can dive into what the specific recommendations are per age group, but I want to just take a moment and share why I think this is such an amazing story.
2:50
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
2:51
SPEAKER_01: So I looked into why is there this major shift in the guidelines and what these researchers are saying?
2:57
SPEAKER_01: And this is a panel of experts.
2:59
SPEAKER_01: They're experts in clinical practice, but they're also experts in creating like reference ranges, right?
3:08
SPEAKER_01: These screening protocols that we use in modern medicine.
3:13
SPEAKER_01: So this panel of experts came together and they analyzed randomized controlled trials that were trying to find a connection between vitamin D intake and disease prevention or disease management, you know, including improvements in disease.
3:31
SPEAKER_00: So what they said was the major diseases that vitamin D is is uh purported to you know to deal with.
3:43
SPEAKER_00: I mean, can can you give three or four that are exactly major diseases that that we would that we would link up that we would think about vitamin D when we hear the disease?
3:53
SPEAKER_01: Okay, excellent, Joel.
3:55
SPEAKER_01: So there's been an association between vitamin D intake and a myriad of diseases and disorders, including the whole category of autoimmune diseases, cardiovascular disease, metabolic disease, uh, musculoskeletal diseases, including bone loss, uh fractures, um, infectious diseases, as well as fatigue and also mental um imbalances.
4:26
SPEAKER_01: So um, you know, all that whole slew of mental disorders that we think of.
4:31
SPEAKER_01: So there's just some broad oversweeping categories.
4:33
SPEAKER_01: So you can see why vitamin D has become so popular because in these epidemiological studies, which are basically population studies that use observations, okay, in these epidemiological studies, they are showing associations between low levels of vitamin D and all of those categories of diseases.
4:55
SPEAKER_01: So it seems like it's this primary factor in disease formation and progression.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: Oh, as well as cancers, which are usually an end-stage autoimmune disease.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: So I clumped those, generally speaking, into the autoimmune category.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: So practically everything you can think of, if disease-wise, has some kind of association with vitamin D.
5:15
SPEAKER_01: It's now the catch-all vitamin, okay.
5:18
SPEAKER_01: But what these researchers found out was that when they looked at randomized controlled studies, right?
5:25
SPEAKER_01: These are more of a gold standard for us.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: It's not just observing what happens in a population.
5:30
SPEAKER_01: A randomized controlled study, in contrast, is one where you have a population and you do an intervention, like you have a placebo group that gets no vitamin D, and then you have your experimental group that's getting a certain dose of vitamin D, and you have an outcome that you've measured.
5:46
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
5:46
SPEAKER_01: When you're looking at those randomized controlled trials, they're saying that there is no consistent cause and effect relationship.
5:55
SPEAKER_01: That the the current data that we have in randomized controlled trials does not support the relationship between vitamin D and preventing or ameliorating diseases.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: So you don't so you don't have to get in the sun.
6:14
SPEAKER_01: Well, they're talking about supplementation.
6:16
SPEAKER_01: So they're specifically talking about supplementing, you know.
6:19
SPEAKER_01: All right.
6:20
SPEAKER_01: Um now, what also was really fascinating about these new guidelines is that usually when you're coming up with like a screening protocol.
6:34
SPEAKER_01: It's like when you go into your doctor's office and you say, I want you to test my vitamin D level, they're testing your blood for a 25 hydroxyvitamin D level.
6:44
SPEAKER_01: And then what they do is they compare that to some standard threshold, right?
6:48
SPEAKER_01: And usually that target level is 30 nanograms per mil.
6:52
SPEAKER_01: That's a generalized target level that you want to be above, you know, at least 30 nanograms, preferably a little bit above.
6:58
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
6:58
SPEAKER_01: Well, here's the thing.
7:00
SPEAKER_01: According to the Endocrine Society's research, they are no longer endorsing that targeted level of 30 nanograms per mil.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: They're saying that there's actually no consensus on what the optimal level of blood vitamin D is.
7:18
SPEAKER_01: That there is no agreed upon vitamin D level in the blood that has been showing to prevent disease.
7:25
SPEAKER_01: And even in some studies where they had low vitamin D status, like the subjects had low vitamin D status, and it um there was actually no clear cutoff point for when, if they supplemented and they showed improvements, there is no standard level that they could identify that's a good cutoff point, like a good threshold to measure.
7:47
SPEAKER_01: They also said the target is probably going to change based on the specific disease that you're looking at, which makes a lot of sense, right?
7:54
SPEAKER_01: It also changes based on your environment and your own internal needs.
7:57
SPEAKER_01: So, like you said, if you're indoors, if you're stressing, if your diet is poor in vitamin D, if you're in a sun poor climate.
8:04
SPEAKER_01: So there's all these individualized variables, which goes into what you and I constantly talk about on this program is personalized medicine, right?
8:12
SPEAKER_01: There's no one size fits all.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: So, so that's the first point.
8:16
SPEAKER_01: They are no longer endorsing that target, 30 nanograms per mil.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: They're saying that it's kind of an arbitrary um number that's just been thrown out there that we don't really know if that's the actual target we should be reaching.
8:29
SPEAKER_01: And the second thing is they're no longer endorsing specific vitamin D levels to measure or to determine if somebody is sufficient in vitamin D, insufficient, or deficient.
8:42
SPEAKER_01: They're actually saying that there is no consensus on the definition of the level that is associated with vitamin D deficiency.
8:52
SPEAKER_01: So, what that means is traditionally, vitamin D deficiency was a clinical diagnosis.
8:59
SPEAKER_01: So you would have like signs of rickets or um osteomala, like a softening of the bones.
9:04
SPEAKER_01: That was how they knew that you had vitamin D deficiency.
9:08
SPEAKER_01: Now we're using these blood measures, the circulating 25 hydroxyvitamin D levels, but the levels themselves are controversial, as I mentioned.
9:17
SPEAKER_01: So there's no clear science actually behind choosing that threshold.
9:21
SPEAKER_01: So they're saying that they're not even going to endorse any levels anymore, which is just fascinating.
9:29
SPEAKER_01: Because this is one of those rare times, Joel, when an organization is actually practicing humility, right?
9:37
SPEAKER_01: They are admitting that despite all of the millions of dollars that are spent every year on testing, and despite all of the supplementation that's being recommended and all the levels that we're recommending, they're saying we may have made a mistake.
9:52
SPEAKER_01: We don't actually know what we're doing because the science doesn't support the claims that are being made.
9:58
SPEAKER_01: I mean, isn't that remarkable?
10:00
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, and furthermore, they're saying we don't know.
10:03
SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, they're being honest and saying we don't know.
10:07
SPEAKER_00: I was waiting, I was waiting to see what got you all excited about this.
10:11
SPEAKER_00: And and and uh as a scientist, uh, you really get excited when scientists who are known for regimented, regimented recipe, you know, uh uh things admit that there's there's way more going on here.
10:30
SPEAKER_00: It's almost like um it's almost like when we all knew that there would be, what was it, like 22,000 um strands on the in the human genome mapping project, you know, there were gonna be like 22, 22, 23,000 uh pairs.
10:45
SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm sorry, I'm sorry, we knew there was gonna be a hundred thousand.
10:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry, everybody knew there was gonna be a hundred thousand based on the math of it.
10:51
SPEAKER_00: And then when it was all over at like six months ahead of schedule, I think the only government study that was ever completed ahead of schedule, because they can only find like 22, 23, 23,000.
11:02
SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, and an onion, an onion has like 80,000.
11:07
SPEAKER_00: So um, so we are, you know, we are a third as sophisticated as an onion.
11:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: So so there's so there's there's actually something going on out there that we don't understand.
11:22
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, and it's so cool to me because this is really going against the grain, right?
11:29
SPEAKER_01: The momentum right now, especially over the past few years, is vitamin D is this cure all, and like everybody take these supplements.
11:35
SPEAKER_01: And there's a lot of money invested in vitamin D through supplements and pharmaceuticals and you know, funding for studies.
11:45
SPEAKER_01: So for them to come out and say this, this is a huge deal.
11:48
SPEAKER_01: They are actually being scientists, right?
11:52
SPEAKER_01: I've like, I almost want to tear up because this is so meaningful to me, especially in this period that we're living in right now.
11:57
SPEAKER_01: They are returning to what science was all about, which is seeking truth, right?
12:03
SPEAKER_01: And so they're not letting this funding, these funding sources and all the money and all the suppression, they're not letting that affect this decision.
12:11
SPEAKER_01: They're actually coming out and being bold and saying, we don't know.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: We need to think about this a little bit more because look at the implications that it's probably having.
12:20
SPEAKER_01: And I will have you, I will, I will add in here that there's actually a couple other agencies I have found that are in agreement with them.
12:30
SPEAKER_01: So there's the U.S.
12:31
SPEAKER_01: Preventative Task Service, US Preventative Services Task Force, that it says that there's insufficient evidence for universal screening.
12:40
SPEAKER_01: And there's also the choosing wisely group, which that's an initiative from the American Board of Internal Medicine.
12:47
SPEAKER_01: And they're also advising against testing and the low-risk groups, including a generalized population.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: This is so important of a topic because I don't think a lot of people know this, Joel, because we classify vitamin D as a vitamin, but vitamin D actually is not a true vitamin, right?
13:08
SPEAKER_01: The definition of a vitamin is usually something that we can't make in our own bodies.
13:13
SPEAKER_01: Or if you stretch the definition a little bit, it could include we can't make it in sufficient quantities in our body.
13:22
SPEAKER_01: So that's actually the definition of a vitamin that does not fit with quote unquote vitamin D, because we can make it in our skin.
13:30
SPEAKER_01: And we, for the most part, can make sufficient quantities of it.
13:34
SPEAKER_01: You know, there's always those certain populations, if they're having like uh gastric bypass or sometimes with IBS or things like that, hypocalcemia, um, they may have a difficult time with vitamin D.
13:47
SPEAKER_01: But the point is we can make it in the skin in sufficient quantities.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: So it's actually not technically a vitamin, even though we've labeled it as such, which is also why I want to talk about it here on Beyond Labels, because since we've labeled it as a vitamin, people tend to classify it with the other vitamins and minerals that you can just, you know, pop a pill and presumably get in your daily multivitamin.
14:11
SPEAKER_01: But vitamin D is actually a hormone.
14:15
SPEAKER_01: So when you supplement with vitamin D, it can technically be considered um hormone therapy.
14:22
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: And this is not new information.
14:25
SPEAKER_01: I actually learned this back in graduate school.
14:28
SPEAKER_01: We learned how it can actually act as a hormone.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: It can regulate genes, right?
14:33
SPEAKER_01: It can turn them on and off.
14:35
SPEAKER_01: It can regulate all various functions of the body.
14:38
SPEAKER_01: There's vitamin D receptors in nearly every cell in the body, including in the immune cells.
14:43
SPEAKER_01: So they're not just related to like bone health or potentially disease formation.
14:48
SPEAKER_01: They're related to cell growth and inflammation.
14:51
SPEAKER_01: I mean, your mood, everything.
14:53
SPEAKER_01: So, so when we are looking at quote unquote vitamin D, it's always been a little alarming to me that we are going in this direction where people are now just supplementing with it because it is actually a hormone supplementation and it's actually fat soluble.
15:11
SPEAKER_01: But go ahead, Joel, jump in.
15:13
unknown: Yeah.
15:14
SPEAKER_00: So Cena, uh uh it begs the question: is there a difference?
15:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, for example, in um in urea in in nitrogen, uh nitrogen fertilizer, okay, which I'm more familiar with than vitamin D.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: Um there is one neutron difference between the urea that's made in a you know in a laboratory from, say, petroleum, versus the urea that's in the urine of a cow.
15:43
SPEAKER_00: Um, now the the scientists say, oh, it's all the same, it's all urea, but there's one neutron difference between the one atomic weight difference between the two things.
15:52
SPEAKER_00: Now, no, nobody knows the significance of that.
15:54
SPEAKER_00: Nobody knows, you know, why.
15:56
SPEAKER_00: Um I'm I'm willing to bet that there's probably an important that there's some difference that we don't, or some important function of that neutron that we don't know.
16:07
SPEAKER_00: Uh, but but but anyway, my my question then is is there is there a difference between, for example, the vitamin D that I got this morning by being out in the sun for two hours uh that my skin made versus a vitamin D pill?
16:24
SPEAKER_01: So there does seem to be a difference.
16:27
SPEAKER_01: Okay, now this is this is very controversial, but I would say based on what I have found in the literature, there is a difference.
16:35
SPEAKER_01: So for instance, there's some studies uh that show that vitamin D storage from sun exposure lasts about 10 to 12 weeks.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so like I said, vitamin D is fat soluble.
16:49
SPEAKER_01: So when your skin makes it, you can actually store it in your fat.
16:53
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so if you get that vitamin D formed from sun exposure, it could potentially last in your body in a storage form for 10 to 12 weeks.
17:03
SPEAKER_01: And it stays in your blood about two times as long as when you get um vitamin D from a supplement form and possibly even from a food form.
17:15
SPEAKER_01: So there's something different about the vitamin D that is formed through sun exposure, even in the fact that it stays in your blood roughly two times longer than if you supplemented with it.
17:26
SPEAKER_01: So again, this is very controversial, and a lot of people will say, Oh, go ahead.
17:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, how do they measure that?
17:34
SPEAKER_00: I mean, is there somebody, is there somebody measuring?
17:38
SPEAKER_00: I mean, how do you how do you tag vitamin A from the sun versus vitamin A from a pill?
17:44
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm sorry, I'm I'm you know, you're a lot brighter than I am.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: How do you how do you measure that?
17:51
SPEAKER_00: How do you know that one stays in the body longer than another one?
17:55
SPEAKER_01: So what they'll have to do is use populations and like different control groups.
18:00
SPEAKER_01: And so you can expose certain people to the sun for a certain duration of time, like in a study protocol, and not be giving them foods or supplements that have the vitamin D, and you measure the levels in the blood.
18:12
SPEAKER_01: And then you take other people and you don't expose them to the sun, and then you give them supplements and or food that has the vitamin D in it, and then you measure the vitamin D level that way.
18:22
SPEAKER_00: So it's and we know and we know if you're in the sun for whatever, uh at a certain latitude for X amount of minutes, you're getting X amount of vitamin D per whatever, per hour per so there's rough estimates.
18:41
SPEAKER_00: Now, there are there are actually apps now that's what I'm saying, what I'm saying is if if an hour, if an hour of sun is equivalent to whatever, a pound of of vitamin D supplements, nobody's gonna take a pound of vitamin D supplements, then then the the the length of stay could be more a volume, not a quality.
19:09
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I see what you're saying.
19:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, they they're measuring the level.
19:12
SPEAKER_01: So they would measure the level in the blood before the experimental treatment or the placebo treatment.
19:18
SPEAKER_01: And then they measure again over certain periods of time.
19:22
SPEAKER_01: So they they are measuring the the volume.
19:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm I'm I'm far I'm not gonna arguing with you.
19:29
SPEAKER_00: I'm just I'm just trying to wrap my head around as a you know, as a whatever, you know, just a layman, as a peasant here.
19:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, how how they how they measure that sort of thing.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it just seems almost it seems that's pretty deep.
19:46
SPEAKER_01: It is pretty deep, but this also, when you get into it like this, like we're doing now, which I'm glad that you're asking these questions, because it also reveals some of the uncertainty in science, right?
19:58
SPEAKER_01: We can't control for every variable.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: So when these, when the endocrine society has come forward and admitted we just don't know this information, you are actually here like live uncovering some of the information that we don't know and why we don't know it.
20:13
SPEAKER_01: Because it is very difficult to track these things, right?
20:16
SPEAKER_01: And to identify them and to measure them.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: And then there's going to be measurement error.
20:20
SPEAKER_01: And then it depends on what type of assay that you're using in the lab, because there's also differences in vitamin D levels based on the assay that you're using.
20:28
SPEAKER_01: So there's all these confounding variables.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: So one thing, one study came forward and they did say that um they tested with skin exposure to sun, and that in general, they said that if you get exposed to sun and it gives a little pinkish hue to it, that can actually produce between 10,000 and 25,000 IUs of vitamin D in the body.
20:53
SPEAKER_01: So 10,000 to 25,000 of IUs.
20:57
SPEAKER_01: Now, if you compare that to what is our recommended dietary allowance, right?
21:02
SPEAKER_01: This is the the government's, this is what the government says we need to prevent, like, you know, rickets and things like that.
21:09
SPEAKER_01: They're saying you only need 600 IUs if you're under the age of 50.
21:14
SPEAKER_01: So 600 IUs.
21:16
SPEAKER_01: Whereas if you go into the sun to the point where you have a little bit of pink on it, that's 10,000 to 25,000 IUs.
21:23
SPEAKER_01: See, it's so much more powerful.
21:24
SPEAKER_01: And now I'm not saying go out and get your sun pink because you obviously don't need that.
21:28
SPEAKER_01: Uh, this is just one measurement that was done in through some from scientists to show you how powerful your body is at producing its own quote unquote vitamin D, which is why it's not a vitamin.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: Right, right?
21:42
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is not essential.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, yeah.
21:46
SPEAKER_00: All this makes me think we need to find a a philanthropist investor who will take the endocrine society board out to lunch with the American Heart Association board.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: I'll be there.
22:03
SPEAKER_01: I'll be the moderator.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: Bring a little bit of uh a little bit of humility to the American Heart Association.
22:11
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: And maybe and maybe the Cancer Society too.
22:15
SPEAKER_01: Yes, all of them.
22:16
SPEAKER_01: Wrangle them all up, you know.
22:18
SPEAKER_01: Let's have story time with Joel and Cena.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: Like but yeah, and this is a big deal because you know, people don't really realize this, but you can get too much vitamin D, right?
22:30
SPEAKER_01: As I said, it is fat soluble.
22:32
SPEAKER_01: So your body can store it.
22:33
SPEAKER_01: You can store it in your fat cells, you can store it in your liver, and Joel get this.
22:37
SPEAKER_01: You know how a lot of times people are taking vitamin D along with their calcium supplement because now studies are associating that vitamin D is needed for calcium absorption, give you strong bones and whatnot.
22:48
SPEAKER_01: And I'm not saying that's not true.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: I'm saying we don't know, but I'm not saying that's not true.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: What I'm saying is now there's studies that are showing that if you have excess supplementation with vitamin D, like too much high levels of it, you can actually increase your risk for fall.
23:03
SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, increase a fall risk.
23:06
SPEAKER_01: So you're increasing your chances of falling, which is opposite of what we're trying to do, particularly this elderly population, as we're supplementing them with vitamin D and calcium.
23:15
SPEAKER_01: So let me clarify.
23:17
SPEAKER_01: So vitamin D, we think increases calcium absorption, which is good for your bones.
23:22
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
23:23
SPEAKER_01: But as you're increasing vitamin D levels in your body, you will be increasing calcium levels as well, generally speaking.
23:32
SPEAKER_01: Too much calcium is also a bad thing because nature loves balance, right?
23:37
SPEAKER_01: Too much can cause weakness, right?
23:40
SPEAKER_01: Hence increasing your risk for fall, bone pain, and kidney damage.
23:46
SPEAKER_01: Right?
23:47
SPEAKER_01: Some sometimes some of these researchers also believe that if you consume too much vitamin D, it can lead to depletion of retinol, which is the active form of vitamin A.
23:55
SPEAKER_01: We've talked about this on the program before.
23:57
SPEAKER_01: This is one reason why I say just don't go blanket supplement things because nutrients compete.
24:02
SPEAKER_01: They compete for absorption, binding sites, metabolism, utilization, you know.
24:07
SPEAKER_01: So you can actually outcompete your vitamin A.
24:09
SPEAKER_01: This is one reason why if some people, some practitioners recommend that if you want to supplement with vitamin D, do it with something like cod liver oil.
24:17
SPEAKER_01: So you're getting omega fats, but you're also getting vitamin D and you're getting vitamin A at the same time in the cod liver oil.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: So I would say that if you are going to supplement with vitamin D, make sure you're also intaking adequate levels of vitamin A.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, we also know, um, Joel, I'm sure you've heard about magnesium, right?
24:36
SPEAKER_01: Magnesium has like been the new kid on the block the last few years.
24:39
SPEAKER_01: Everyone's got to take magnesium.
24:41
SPEAKER_01: And like all of us are deficient in magnesium, right?
24:43
SPEAKER_01: These are like the headlines now.
24:45
SPEAKER_01: And take magnesium to sleep, take magnesium to have better bowel movements to model to um improve your mood, right?
24:52
SPEAKER_01: Well, guess what?
24:53
SPEAKER_01: High vitamin D can deplete your magnesium.
24:57
SPEAKER_01: So it's another thing where it's like we have to be careful with what we're putting in our body, who we are listening to, because there are these unintended consequences.
25:06
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
25:06
SPEAKER_01: Look, in addition to getting out in the sun, there are food sources of vitamin D.
25:11
SPEAKER_01: So here's just a few of them.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: A lot of wild fish has vitamin D, salmon, tuna, mackerel, herring.
25:18
SPEAKER_01: Um, Joel, you'll be happy.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: Beef, egg yolks, liver, butter, these all have vitamin D in them.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: There are, of course, fortified foods, milk, cereal, and orange juice, for instance, but I don't suggest fortified foods for vitamin D sources.
25:34
SPEAKER_01: It's a synthetic form.
25:35
SPEAKER_01: Um, there's also some plants.
25:37
SPEAKER_01: So alfalfa, alfalfa has vitamin D.
25:41
SPEAKER_01: Wild mushrooms have vitamin D, they convert it from the sun.
25:46
SPEAKER_01: So oysters, button, chanterelles, shiitake, they all have vitamin D, right?
25:53
SPEAKER_01: So there are other ways that you can get vitamin D, even if you can't get enough sun exposure.
25:57
SPEAKER_01: But Joel, I'm gonna say that I think that this is actually a man-made problem because if you we haven't seen this in the past, right?
26:07
SPEAKER_01: There's no record to in it to indicate that we had these high levels of chronic diseases in the past that we do now.
26:14
SPEAKER_01: I'm talking like our ancient ancestors.
26:16
SPEAKER_01: We don't have records that show that.
26:19
SPEAKER_01: So, and they live just as long as us.
26:21
SPEAKER_01: So please don't send that into the podcast saying that they didn't live as long.
26:25
SPEAKER_01: That's not true.
26:26
SPEAKER_01: Once they got past the age of 15, they think that they lived, hunter-gatherers lived just as long as we did today, but they didn't have all these chronic diseases, right?
26:34
SPEAKER_01: They lived long, healthy lives, usually died in their sleep.
26:38
SPEAKER_01: So I'm saying, I think this is actually a modern problem that we have, in part because we spend too much time indoors, right?
26:49
SPEAKER_01: Even think of all the kids that spend too much time indoors.
26:52
SPEAKER_01: So now we're seeing low vitamin D levels based on whatever the current, you know, a disputed threshold is.
26:59
SPEAKER_01: We are nonetheless are seeing lower vitamin D in the blood, even in children, predominantly because they're spending so much time indoors.
27:06
SPEAKER_01: And then when we take them outside, what do we do?
27:09
SPEAKER_01: We cover them up in clothes and we lather them with sunscreen, right?
27:12
SPEAKER_01: So we're not even allowing the sun to do its job.
27:16
SPEAKER_01: We're not getting out in the morning rays and the evening rays, right?
27:20
SPEAKER_01: I I'll tell you this, and I'm gonna throw it back over to you, Joel.
27:23
SPEAKER_01: The sun is so important that I have a client who actually reversed all of her food sensitivities by doing nothing else but going and sitting in the sun sun rays in the morning, the sun rays in the evening, and then going out in the middle of the day and exercising in the sun.
27:43
SPEAKER_01: Right?
27:43
SPEAKER_01: The sun healed her food sensitivities.
27:47
SPEAKER_01: I mean, is that not like a hopeful story?
27:50
SPEAKER_01: Like that's what makes me want to get out in the sun now.
27:52
SPEAKER_01: You know, I now have moved my office.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: I, unless we're recording a podcast, I'm out on my back porch actually working on my computer and it's plugged in through the Ethernet, so I'm not getting the you know, the EMF exposure, but I'm out in the sun now, um, on my back patio, inspired by that client of mine.
28:10
SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's the power that we have all around us in nature that we are not utilizing.
28:13
SPEAKER_01: So let's stop popping the pills, stop trusting these regulations and these tests that don't have the science to back it up at this point and start trusting nature.
28:25
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
28:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's uh that's great.
28:28
SPEAKER_00: I'm reminded, um, I've got a question, Cena.
28:31
SPEAKER_00: I've got a question for our for our listeners.
28:33
SPEAKER_00: Um I remember well I was just a kid, and my dad was an accountant, so that means he was a he was a very meticulous um record keeper, bean counter, like accountants are.
28:48
SPEAKER_00: And he was frustrated one time because he felt like he didn't have he didn't have enough time.
28:53
SPEAKER_00: So he said, I'm gonna find out where my time is going.
28:55
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna audit myself.
28:56
SPEAKER_00: You know, accountants audit stuff.
28:58
SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna audit myself.
29:00
SPEAKER_00: So he made a, I mean, this is way back in the you know late 60s, before computers, before everything else.
29:05
SPEAKER_00: So he made a made a sheet of paper and and divided the day in in five-minute increments, basically.
29:12
SPEAKER_00: And for a week, he wrote down every single thing that he did, you know, I mean, from brushing teeth to to whatever, okay, driving to work.
29:22
SPEAKER_00: And um, and I remember like yesterday, uh, at the end of the week, he made this grand announcement at supper.
29:29
SPEAKER_00: He said, I found out where my time's going.
29:32
SPEAKER_00: And um, okay, because we watched him, we we were watching him doing it.
29:37
SPEAKER_00: I was just a kid, you know, I was watching him do this all week.
29:40
SPEAKER_00: He said, I spend an hour a day reading the newspaper.
29:44
SPEAKER_00: Well, that's seven hours a week.
29:46
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that think about it, that's almost a day, okay?
29:49
SPEAKER_00: So he said, I'm gonna stop reading the newspaper.
29:51
SPEAKER_00: Well, in our family, we're total news, news nerds, news junkies, so that didn't last very long.
29:56
SPEAKER_00: But but here's my question for our listeners how much time do you andor your children spend in the sun a day?
30:11
SPEAKER_00: And and I'm asking the question after telling the story about dad, because I think we lie to ourselves all the time.
30:19
SPEAKER_00: We lie to ourselves.
30:21
SPEAKER_00: I mean, this is the problem with like diet things.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: You know, how many sweets do you eat?
30:26
SPEAKER_00: People always lie, they never tell how much, you know.
30:29
SPEAKER_00: Uh I mean, I ate a pint of ice cream last night, you know.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: Uh nutritionists know this.
30:37
SPEAKER_01: That's why dietary recalls and things are pretty worthless when we're working with plants.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's right.
30:44
SPEAKER_00: So, so um I I told the story about dad before asking the question because I don't want you to, I don't want you to to to be fraudulent with yourself.
30:55
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
30:55
SPEAKER_00: So, so if you've got to uh either think back a couple days or or make a little sheet, you know, and and and mark down how many hours and don't don't modify your life.
31:07
SPEAKER_00: Don't suddenly, oh, okay, I'm gonna get out of here.
31:09
SPEAKER_00: No, no, no, no, no.
31:10
SPEAKER_00: Just do your routine and audit yourself.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: You know, at the end of the day, sit down and say, well, how many minutes did I spend in the sun?
31:17
SPEAKER_00: I'll bet, I'll bet we'll find that a lot of people don't spend actually 30 minutes a day exposing their skin to the sun on on average.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, in fact, it might even be less than that uh on on a lot.
31:37
SPEAKER_00: Um, how how much how much should we, you know, uh is 30 minutes enough?
31:43
SPEAKER_00: Is it should be an hour?
31:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and it's highly individualized, right?
31:49
SPEAKER_01: It it depends on what you're eating, your stress level, your this your skin tone, where you are on earth.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: So um I'm not into like the electronic little gadgets and stuff.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: I just tap into my intuition.
32:02
SPEAKER_01: But I will tell you, my girlfriend has this app on her phone and it knows where she is.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: And based on like the weather conditions at that time, where she is, it says this is your peak window to get outside into the sun.
32:15
SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, to balance it between uh, you know, getting a lot of the healing rays, but also enough of the UVB rays to make adequate vitamin D.
32:24
SPEAKER_01: So it balances it for her, and then she just goes out there in the sun and enjoys it.
32:29
SPEAKER_01: And it's typically between 15 and 20 minutes a day, actually.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: So it's not even a great deal of time.
32:35
SPEAKER_01: If you can find time to even get outside and walk for like 10 minutes, maybe, you know, first thing in the morning, in the evening, maybe on your lunch break, um, just a little bit of walking outside or even just sitting, just sitting outside with like arms exposed, maybe legs exposed, just so your sun could be your skin could be exposed to the sun, would tremendously help in producing vitamin D in the body.
32:59
SPEAKER_01: If you can't do that, maybe you're able, like if you're stuck inside working, maybe you can sit next to a window, right?
33:04
SPEAKER_01: And open up that window, let the sun rays come through, and you know, expose your arms to that wind, to that sunlight coming through the window.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: Um, there's lots of different ways you can try to integrate this into your daily life.
33:16
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't have to be hard.
33:17
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's free, right?
33:19
SPEAKER_01: It's a free benefit from nature.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: So if you're interested, uh I'm gonna include a link to the um to the actual article that was just released in June about these new guidelines.
33:32
SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna include a link to that in the show description.
33:34
SPEAKER_01: You can look up the article for yourself.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: I also wrote an article about it uh for Epoch Times.
33:40
SPEAKER_01: So I'll include that link as well.
33:41
SPEAKER_01: And basically, I summarize the different requirements.
33:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, sorry, the the different age group guidelines.
33:49
SPEAKER_01: So the different guidelines for these new vitamin D guidelines for each age group and some disease conditions, too, like pre diabetes.
33:57
SPEAKER_01: So check that out and link below.
34:00
SPEAKER_01: Um, Joel gave us a fantastic question this this week to analyze.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna do the same.
34:05
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna see where I'm spending my time and see how I can get outside more.
34:09
SPEAKER_01: So thanks so much for joining us, and we look forward to connecting with you next week.