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IFH 863: How One Tweet Can Change Your Screenwriting Career with Jeanne Veillette Bowerman · Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the ifh podcast Network. For more
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  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Indie Film Muscle Podcast, Episode number eight
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  Speaker 2: sixty three. You try to do it, and you do
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  Speaker 2: it honestly, you can't control people's responses.
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  Speaker 3: Really, Edgar Wright.
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  Speaker 1: Broadcasting from the back Alley and Hollywood. It's the Indie
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  Speaker 1: Film Hustle Podcast, where we show you how to survive
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  Speaker 1: the film biz.
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  Speaker 3: And here's your host, Alex Ferrari.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Huscle Podcast.
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  Speaker 3: I am your humble.
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  Speaker 4: Host Alex Ferrari. Today's show is sponsored by Rise of
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  Speaker 4: That's film bizbook dot com. Enjoy today's episode with guest
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: host Dave Bullis.
• 1:55
  Speaker 5: All, everyone, thanks again for joining me. Joining me today
• 1:58
  Speaker 5: is Genie Volettbauer. Genie is the editor and online community
• 2:03
  Speaker 5: manager of scriptmag dot com and she's also the co
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  Speaker 5: founder and moderator of the weekly Twitter's Screenwriter Chat, which
• 2:09
  Speaker 5: is hashtag script chat. And she's also wrote the narrative
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  Speaker 5: adaptation of the Pulzer Prize winning novel Slivery by Another
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  Speaker 5: Name and Furthermore, Genie has a script in the top
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  Speaker 5: twenty five of the Tracking Board and was named one
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  Speaker 5: of the top ten most influential screenwunning blogs by Stephanie Palmer.
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  Speaker 3: Well, Genie, how are you good?
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  Speaker 6: How are you?
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  Speaker 5: I'm doing pretty good. It's, you know, just another mild
• 2:32
  Speaker 5: day here in Philadelphia. How's everything in New York?
• 2:35
  Speaker 6: It's Ashley Miles. It's a little, you know, compared to
• 2:39
  Speaker 6: the storms we've had lately, it's nice.
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  Speaker 5: So, Gene, just to get started, could you give us
• 2:46
  Speaker 5: all a little bit about your background and you know
• 2:48
  Speaker 5: how you got started.
• 2:50
  Speaker 6: Well, I actually went to the hotel school at Cornell
• 2:54
  Speaker 6: and I owned a motel at restaurant for fifteen years.
• 2:58
  Speaker 6: And then I turned forty. I kind of was like, Okay,
• 3:03
  Speaker 6: I'm a stay at home mom with no kids at home,
• 3:05
  Speaker 6: and I had closed the business, and I always want
• 3:09
  Speaker 6: I had always wanted to write, and so I started
• 3:13
  Speaker 6: writing a novel and I had no idea what the
• 3:16
  Speaker 6: hell I was doing. And one of my friends from
• 3:20
  Speaker 6: college said that once she had a screenplay, they're you know,
• 3:23
  Speaker 6: they're easier and well. And at the time I could
• 3:28
  Speaker 6: see why someone would think of that, because it's only
• 3:30
  Speaker 6: like one hundred and ten pages, you know, compared to
• 3:32
  Speaker 6: hundreds of pages for novel. But obviously, as you know,
• 3:36
  Speaker 6: as the years progressed and I kept writing more and more,
• 3:39
  Speaker 6: I realized that the unbelievable art and to writing a script,
• 3:44
  Speaker 6: it's so different than writing novels, which I'm also I'm
• 3:48
  Speaker 6: also writing some novels too now, but it uh so,
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  Speaker 6: I kind of just got started that way, just kind
• 3:55
  Speaker 6: of went into it without knowing what the hell I
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  Speaker 6: was doing, which is probably in some respects looking back
• 4:00
  Speaker 6: on it, the best way to do it, because I
• 4:03
  Speaker 6: think if I had known how difficult it was to
• 4:05
  Speaker 6: break into this industry, how hard it was to write
• 4:08
  Speaker 6: a screenplay effectively and well, that might have intimidated me.
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  Speaker 6: And so I think for me, definitely ignorance with bliz
• 4:17
  Speaker 6: for sure. And then I started well writing Slavery by
• 4:21
  Speaker 6: not a Name. I started getting on I got on
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  Speaker 6: Twitter so that I could kind of meet other screenwaters
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  Speaker 6: and get a buzz going to the project. But I
• 4:29
  Speaker 6: didn't realize at all the power of Twitter and the
• 4:34
  Speaker 6: incredible network you could develop there. And because of the
• 4:39
  Speaker 6: network from Twitter, it's really how I got a script.
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  Speaker 6: Magazine found me and I was first a columnst there
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  Speaker 6: and then now the editor. It's how I've met so
• 4:48
  Speaker 6: many people, my current writing partner who's on Twitter known
• 4:52
  Speaker 6: as unknown Screenwriter, I've made so many incredible connections. And
• 4:56
  Speaker 6: also how script chat was form. So really social media
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  Speaker 6: is a incredible way for somebody who lived output of
• 5:02
  Speaker 6: la to make some groundwork.
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  Speaker 3: And that's how we met too.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely, so you know what exactly were you tweeting
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  Speaker 5: so that Script Magazine was able to find you.
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  Speaker 6: Well, when we started script Chat, Joshua Stecker was a
• 5:20
  Speaker 6: then online editor of Script Magazine and he is amazing
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  Speaker 6: at social media, really great with Twitter, and he noticed
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  Speaker 6: the hashtag script chat, and since it's Script Magazine, it
• 5:31
  Speaker 6: caught his attention. And he's also a big history buff
• 5:36
  Speaker 6: and so when and a journalist, you know, and so
• 5:41
  Speaker 6: when he saw the project I was working on, clay
• 5:44
  Speaker 6: By of a name, he and that my partner in
• 5:47
  Speaker 6: that project is the author of the book, who at
• 5:49
  Speaker 6: the time was a senior national correspondent of the Wall
• 5:52
  Speaker 6: Street Journal. And Joshua was just really intrigued by the
• 5:56
  Speaker 6: whole project that we're working on and offered us an
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  Speaker 6: opportunity to just do one uh blog online about the project,
• 6:06
  Speaker 6: and after getting to know me for over the course
• 6:08
  Speaker 6: of the following year, that one blog turned into my
• 6:12
  Speaker 6: weekly column, Balls of Steel, which I don't have the
• 6:16
  Speaker 6: time to write weekly anymore. But and that's how Balls
• 6:19
  Speaker 6: and Steel was born. And you know that's Tuscript magazine
• 6:21
  Speaker 6: found me. And then once Balls and Steel was Steel
• 6:23
  Speaker 6: was born and then they needed an editor. I raised
• 6:26
  Speaker 6: my hand, you know, because it's nice having a day
• 6:28
  Speaker 6: job that's in the in the industry.
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  Speaker 5: So so you know, you use this as a great
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: networking tool. You know, have you gotten other like, you know,
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: writing jobs just from people finding you on Twitter like
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: sort of like you know, they try to contact you
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  Speaker 5: to heart write scripts for them.
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  Speaker 6: Yeah. Like there's a guy who's from London, Clive Frayne.
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  Speaker 6: He got me together and some other people.
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  Speaker 2: Uh.
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  Speaker 6: He was at the time, he was in Milan. We
• 7:01
  Speaker 6: had a writer in New Mexico, one in la and
• 7:03
  Speaker 6: one in London, and we were working on a TV
• 7:06
  Speaker 6: project that we were going to have uh that was
• 7:10
  Speaker 6: going to be picked up in London and ended up
• 7:14
  Speaker 6: losing funding at the last minute. But it was an
• 7:17
  Speaker 6: incredible experience to work on a TV show that even
• 7:20
  Speaker 6: though it didn't get greenlit, I still learned so much.
• 7:24
  Speaker 6: And it was in my episode was a whorehouse hostage takeovers,
• 7:30
  Speaker 6: which was so much fun to write, and it was
• 7:33
  Speaker 6: great because it was just another way for me to
• 7:36
  Speaker 6: I didn't know what the hell I was doing, but
• 7:38
  Speaker 6: I just rolled with it, and it's another way to
• 7:41
  Speaker 6: just step I totally stepped outside of my comfort zone
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  Speaker 6: doing it because I didn't know, you know, I wasn't
• 7:47
  Speaker 6: a TV writer, you know, and I just kind of
• 7:50
  Speaker 6: imagined someone standing behind me holding a remote control so that,
• 7:54
  Speaker 6: you know, at any time, they could click away, and
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  Speaker 6: that that really helped me. But yeah, so I got that,
• 8:00
  Speaker 6: and I got another gig writing like educational videos that
• 8:04
  Speaker 6: we wrote like in a sitcom format, and that was
• 8:08
  Speaker 6: from some of a director I met on Twitter. I mean,
• 8:10
  Speaker 6: I've gotten a lot of gigs side gigs and my
• 8:14
  Speaker 6: job really from people I met online.
• 8:17
  Speaker 5: So I'm sorry I have to go back for that.
• 8:20
  Speaker 5: It's it's hussle taker. It's actually a hostile situation and
• 8:23
  Speaker 5: a whorehouse.
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  Speaker 6: Yeah, it.
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  Speaker 3: Was so good.
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  Speaker 6: And then when I wrote it, they ended and I
• 8:30
  Speaker 6: killed this this character and they ended up the character
• 8:33
  Speaker 6: who I just made up for the episode in order
• 8:35
  Speaker 6: to kill him, and and they loved the characters so
• 8:39
  Speaker 6: much they were like, okay, you have you can't kill
• 8:41
  Speaker 6: him now, you have to keep him alive because we
• 8:43
  Speaker 6: want to use him in another episode. It's like, oh shit,
• 8:46
  Speaker 6: So I had to come up with a whole other
• 8:47
  Speaker 6: way to figure out how to you know what the
• 8:49
  Speaker 6: climax of my episode was going to be now because
• 8:51
  Speaker 6: they just took it away. But it was But it
• 8:54
  Speaker 6: was really really fun experience, you know, you.
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: Know, it's it's funny. I have a friend of mine.
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: He wrote something called House of Horrors, and basically it's
• 9:03
  Speaker 5: like imagine if Hostile, the movie Hostile and Home Alone mixed.
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: That's what House of Horrors is.
• 9:10
  Speaker 5: Oh and yeah, It's like they have all these they
• 9:13
  Speaker 5: sell these traps and they find out like, you know,
• 9:15
  Speaker 5: these prostitutes are leading these guys into this you know,
• 9:19
  Speaker 5: this truck stop area and then killing them one by
• 9:21
  Speaker 5: one and then they the guys trying to deeper hand
• 9:23
  Speaker 5: by saying these traps and uh, it's just it was
• 9:26
  Speaker 5: funny because he told me he sent it out and
• 9:29
  Speaker 5: some of the reactions that he gets just by the
• 9:31
  Speaker 5: name alone He's like, people were like, I don't know
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: if I want to read this to you know, you
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: know this, I don't know because it's a comedy horror,
• 9:39
  Speaker 5: so it's kind of falls that gray area. Have you
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: seen a lot of things like that, you know, where
• 9:45
  Speaker 5: where sort of scripts sort of get passed over, mainly
• 9:49
  Speaker 5: over over, like you know, just because of like the
• 9:51
  Speaker 5: title or even just the you know, the log line.
• 9:55
  Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: and now back to the show.
• 10:04
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I think it's so much easier for
• 10:07
  Speaker 6: them to say no than it is to say yes,
• 10:10
  Speaker 6: and and it you know, because when you think about it,
• 10:13
  Speaker 6: like in the publishing world, like I've got a lot
• 10:15
  Speaker 6: of fun to have met online who are novelists, and
• 10:19
  Speaker 6: I watched them pump out novel after novel after novel,
• 10:22
  Speaker 6: whether it's with traditional publishing or whether it's fell published,
• 10:26
  Speaker 6: Because it doesn't take millions of dollars to publish a book,
• 10:30
  Speaker 6: you know, but to create a turn a screenpoint into
• 10:34
  Speaker 6: a movie takes can take millions of dollars. So it's
• 10:39
  Speaker 6: so much easier for them to say no and not
• 10:42
  Speaker 6: get in trouble with their boss, you know, for saying
• 10:44
  Speaker 6: yeah to something that you might bomb, you know. And
• 10:48
  Speaker 6: also the way the economy is now, you know, after
• 10:50
  Speaker 6: the crash in two thousand and eight, it's just different.
• 10:53
  Speaker 6: They're not willing to take as many chances. You see
• 10:56
  Speaker 6: so many more writers now doing web series. It's doing
• 11:00
  Speaker 6: things that, you know, looking to put their shows on YouTube,
• 11:05
  Speaker 6: like you know, did anything outside of the box of
• 11:08
  Speaker 6: traditional production. Because it's just you have to be creative
• 11:13
  Speaker 6: and think of a different way to get your story
• 11:14
  Speaker 6: out there. I even encourage writers to write their scripts
• 11:18
  Speaker 6: turn them into novels because then their intellectual property. And
• 11:22
  Speaker 6: half of what Hollywood does is half of the films
• 11:25
  Speaker 6: that are at or out of patience. So you know,
• 11:28
  Speaker 6: now you're opening up your script for one hundred percent
• 11:31
  Speaker 6: of the market, not to pass as the market by
• 11:33
  Speaker 6: being a non intellectual property. So and I am seeing
• 11:39
  Speaker 6: some writers do that and give that a shot, I mean,
• 11:42
  Speaker 6: and then they and some I've got a friend who
• 11:44
  Speaker 6: fell in love with with the process and now just
• 11:47
  Speaker 6: wants to write novels.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: Interesting.
• 11:50
  Speaker 5: You know, I actually have a question from the from
• 11:52
  Speaker 5: one of the audience members. They they actually and I
• 11:56
  Speaker 5: guess let me actually ask it now since you know
• 11:57
  Speaker 5: it is just about what we were talking about. It says,
• 12:00
  Speaker 5: I want to turn my screen my screenplay into a novel.
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: Novel. Excuse me, i'llah William.
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: Peter Blattie who wrote The Exorcists, and he says, do
• 12:09
  Speaker 5: you think that this is a viable way to get
• 12:11
  Speaker 5: my screen to get my screenplay and further work noticed
• 12:15
  Speaker 5: by creating a website and then directing everyone there. So
• 12:18
  Speaker 5: I think what he's doing is he's trying to, you know,
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: create a book and then when if someone was adapted,
• 12:22
  Speaker 5: you can alomatically say hey, I have this screenplay.
• 12:26
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean I think that. I think. I think
• 12:29
  Speaker 6: one of the one of the many lessons I learned
• 12:31
  Speaker 6: from Doug Blackman, who wrote Slavery But I have the
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: Name is when you have this piece of the you know,
• 12:38
  Speaker 6: this this thing that you created, whether it be a
• 12:40
  Speaker 6: book or script or whatever, you to think about all
• 12:44
  Speaker 6: the different ways you can tap into that to utilize
• 12:48
  Speaker 6: that piece of property that instead of just thinking of
• 12:52
  Speaker 6: this is just a feature film, you know period. You know,
• 12:55
  Speaker 6: the Key's got the book and turned it into a
• 12:58
  Speaker 6: documentary for PBS. I wrote that at the narrative adaptation
• 13:02
  Speaker 6: with him. It's studying material for classes. He'd love to
• 13:07
  Speaker 6: make a play out of it. I mean, like you
• 13:09
  Speaker 6: have to think about, like all the different things you
• 13:11
  Speaker 6: can do with that piece of intellectual property that you have.
• 13:15
  Speaker 6: And so if it's the other benefit too, just as
• 13:19
  Speaker 6: a writer is knowing that if you turn it into
• 13:22
  Speaker 6: a book, if you publish it, and self publishing it
• 13:24
  Speaker 6: is an absolutely credible option. Now it's not considered vanity
• 13:30
  Speaker 6: publishing anymore. So you killed yourself to write the script,
• 13:34
  Speaker 6: You killed yourself to write this story. You must love
• 13:36
  Speaker 6: it if you're going to be pitching it and staying
• 13:39
  Speaker 6: with it, if you haven't abandoned it yet, So why
• 13:42
  Speaker 6: not put it in some sort of form that people
• 13:45
  Speaker 6: can read it, so it's not just fitting on your
• 13:47
  Speaker 6: hard drives. And even if it never fells as a screenplay,
• 13:51
  Speaker 6: people are out there reading your words and reading your story,
• 13:54
  Speaker 6: and you're getting some sort of validation back from that.
• 13:58
  Speaker 6: And it's part of why I blog, because when I blog,
• 14:02
  Speaker 6: people are reading my words, even if it's just a
• 14:05
  Speaker 6: thousand words, somebody's reading it, you know, and it makes
• 14:08
  Speaker 6: me feel there's a sense of satisfaction in that as
• 14:11
  Speaker 6: a writer. Instead of having everything I do just sit
• 14:14
  Speaker 6: on my far drive and you know, if it doesn't
• 14:17
  Speaker 6: get made into a movie, nobody sees it. So yeah,
• 14:20
  Speaker 6: I would definitely tell them, yes, do it.
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: Oh excellent.
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: And you know that's something I brought up to too,
• 14:25
  Speaker 5: because I actually brought up graphic novel adaptation because you know,
• 14:29
  Speaker 5: I was actually listening to another podcast and they brought up,
• 14:32
  Speaker 5: you know, how to go to Amazon and you can
• 14:36
  Speaker 5: create a kindel version, and then they also brought up
• 14:38
  Speaker 5: how to create an actual physical version that's basically put
• 14:41
  Speaker 5: on demand, so that way, you know, it's a win
• 14:45
  Speaker 5: win for everybody. So you know, and like you said,
• 14:47
  Speaker 5: it's not vanity anymore, you know, self publishing. I I
• 14:51
  Speaker 5: was talking to a guest I forget off the top
• 14:53
  Speaker 5: of my head, which guests was. But they actually brought
• 14:55
  Speaker 5: up the fact that it would take a lot for
• 14:57
  Speaker 5: them to actually go back to, you.
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: Know, pitching again to like Penguin or you know, random.
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: Books, because they think it's more viable now to just
• 15:05
  Speaker 5: self publish yourself, create your own Amazon store, and go
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: and girl off your own website like you have, you
• 15:09
  Speaker 5: have your own blog and now you have people going
• 15:12
  Speaker 5: directly to your website, which is genievb dot com.
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: And you know, people can now see.
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: All your other work, you know, so it's like your
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: your care your your own marketing department pretty much, and
• 15:23
  Speaker 5: your own your own content creation everything.
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: Well.
• 15:26
  Speaker 6: And one of our one of our scrip Check co
• 15:28
  Speaker 6: founders Jamie Livingstone, and I should mention, uh, the other
• 15:32
  Speaker 6: co founders are King Garland and Zach Sandford. Jamie took
• 15:36
  Speaker 6: a little break from screenwriting and started writing novels, thinking
• 15:40
  Speaker 6: she would just, oh, yeah, I'll write a couple of novels.
• 15:42
  Speaker 6: But her novels have become so popular that she can't
• 15:45
  Speaker 6: stop writing them because their audience wants another one. And
• 15:48
  Speaker 6: she joined together with and forgive me, Jamie if you're listening,
• 15:52
  Speaker 6: and I get this wrong, but I think this is
• 15:55
  Speaker 6: how it went. She joined together with six other authors,
• 15:58
  Speaker 6: and they are the Unlucky Seven, and they they sell
• 16:02
  Speaker 6: their books collectively together, these thriller books, seven thriller books,
• 16:06
  Speaker 6: and they are like USA today best selling authors. They
• 16:11
  Speaker 6: might even have just become New York Times with song authors.
• 16:13
  Speaker 6: I don't know, I'll have to book that up and see.
• 16:15
  Speaker 6: But if you look up Unlucky Seven you can find them.
• 16:19
  Speaker 6: And but and this is this is a woman who's
• 16:23
  Speaker 6: you know, a screenwriter and said I need a break,
• 16:25
  Speaker 6: I need to do something different, and started writing these novels.
• 16:28
  Speaker 6: And she did easily turn them these new series because
• 16:31
  Speaker 6: she has a series of novels, so she could easily
• 16:33
  Speaker 6: turn them into a TV show into what, you know,
• 16:36
  Speaker 6: all different kinds of things. And but those stories are
• 16:39
  Speaker 6: out there to get attention from people. And you know,
• 16:43
  Speaker 6: you got to if you're a writer, you need to write.
• 16:45
  Speaker 6: And and there's no point in writing something that nobody
• 16:48
  Speaker 6: ever gets to read.
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and I'll link to that in the show notes too,
• 16:54
  Speaker 5: the Unlucky Seven.
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: But yeah, that's pretty interesting.
• 16:57
  Speaker 5: And you know, and and you know, just creating like
• 17:01
  Speaker 5: this podcast too is it's just a different way. So
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: I know it's not writing obviously, but what you know,
• 17:07
  Speaker 5: I just use that sort of I think it's good
• 17:11
  Speaker 5: because it's something I wanted to do.
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: Just to do it.
• 17:14
  Speaker 5: It was sort of like all my my two thousand
• 17:17
  Speaker 5: and four things to you know, get started list because
• 17:19
  Speaker 5: I was part of other podcast you know, and uh,
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: but you know, but you know, it's also I think
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: another way to you know, get exposure for not only me,
• 17:26
  Speaker 5: but the guests you know, somebody ever stumps upon something.
• 17:28
  Speaker 6: You know, absolutely absolutely, and script chat did that for
• 17:32
  Speaker 6: us very much though, Like it got us exposure, it
• 17:36
  Speaker 6: got us recognized by people. You know, people then would
• 17:39
  Speaker 6: start contacting us to say, you know, I want to
• 17:41
  Speaker 6: be a guest on script chat. I mean, it's a
• 17:44
  Speaker 6: great networking tool, and it also is a it's not
• 17:47
  Speaker 6: just that it's it's it's a pay it forward thing,
• 17:50
  Speaker 6: you know, where you're you're talking about something you love
• 17:54
  Speaker 6: and you're also giving this you know, content to your
• 17:58
  Speaker 6: listeners so that they can learn, and it leaves you
• 18:00
  Speaker 6: feeling warm and fuzzy and leaves people feeling warm and
• 18:03
  Speaker 6: fuzzy about you, and it's just a win win Yeah.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: Absolutely so.
• 18:09
  Speaker 5: So you know, Genie, you know, could you give us,
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: you know, just to switch topics, but could you give us,
• 18:16
  Speaker 5: you know, what is your daily writing life like I mean,
• 18:18
  Speaker 5: like what is your daily uh you know, your daily routine?
• 18:22
  Speaker 6: Like insane?
• 18:26
  Speaker 5: Well that's because that tells you with two questions and
• 18:29
  Speaker 5: I've figured, you know what, I might as well just
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: ask this with kill two birds one stone.
• 18:34
  Speaker 6: Yeah, well, okay, there's things about my life that people
• 18:38
  Speaker 6: you know, I'm one of us feels like really open
• 18:40
  Speaker 6: about stuff I'm not. I don't try to pretend I'm
• 18:43
  Speaker 6: something I'm not or anything like that. I mean, I am.
• 18:45
  Speaker 6: I am my reader at Script Magazine. I'm hustling, I'm writing.
• 18:49
  Speaker 6: I'm trying to juggle a day job and a family.
• 18:52
  Speaker 6: And and I have uh one daughter in college, and
• 18:58
  Speaker 6: my son is a senior in high school, and and
• 19:00
  Speaker 6: so we've been applied to colleges and doing all that
• 19:02
  Speaker 6: kind of stuff. And I've got pets, and I've I've
• 19:07
  Speaker 6: got and if Script magazine. What a lot of people
• 19:09
  Speaker 6: don't know is I don't have a team at Script.
• 19:13
  Speaker 6: It's just me, and I have sixty contributors. So I
• 19:17
  Speaker 6: manage these sixty contributors and edit all of the work
• 19:20
  Speaker 6: that you see online. And so it's it's juggling. It
• 19:28
  Speaker 6: is challenging. But what I've discovered is that, you know,
• 19:34
  Speaker 6: I think what was the biggest buss is for me
• 19:35
  Speaker 6: that works for me. For other people, I think what
• 19:38
  Speaker 6: really works for them is to have the nine to
• 19:40
  Speaker 6: five job where you go you just focus on your
• 19:43
  Speaker 6: work nine to five and you come home and you
• 19:44
  Speaker 6: don't have that kind of job where you know you
• 19:47
  Speaker 6: have to take it home with you. You might have
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: to work on the weekends at night, and then you
• 19:50
  Speaker 6: can just focus on your writing on those off hours.
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: and now back to the show.
• 20:04
  Speaker 6: For me, my job is not like that because I
• 20:05
  Speaker 6: have people from all different time zones. I've got writers
• 20:08
  Speaker 6: in la and I have writers in London, so I
• 20:12
  Speaker 6: get emails all the time. And since they're freelance writers,
• 20:16
  Speaker 6: a lot of time they're working and writing their articles
• 20:18
  Speaker 6: on the weekends. They don't have boundaries of nine to five.
• 20:21
  Speaker 6: So I can't have boundaries of nine to five. So
• 20:25
  Speaker 6: that's the challenge for me in finding time to write.
• 20:28
  Speaker 6: And when your kids are hungry. Your kids are hungry,
• 20:30
  Speaker 6: they want dinner on the table, you know. And I'm
• 20:33
  Speaker 6: still pretty old fashioned that way, you know, like I
• 20:36
  Speaker 6: still have dinner on the table every night, and you know,
• 20:38
  Speaker 6: all that kind of stuff. But so what I do
• 20:42
  Speaker 6: is I find that I never used to be a
• 20:46
  Speaker 6: morning writer. Like right now, while we're talking, my my
• 20:49
  Speaker 6: daughter's texting me because she's at the supermarket and one,
• 20:52
  Speaker 6: you know, to get hold on, Okay, I'm going to
• 20:57
  Speaker 6: ignore her. So and so what I do is I
• 21:03
  Speaker 6: get up in the morning and I end I try to.
• 21:06
  Speaker 7: Just write, Like as soon as I get the kid
• 21:09
  Speaker 7: off to school and get the dog fed, I sit
• 21:12
  Speaker 7: down and I try to write, because I find that
• 21:16
  Speaker 7: if I try to do all my other stuff first
• 21:18
  Speaker 7: and then write, I'm too tired at the end of
• 21:21
  Speaker 7: the night, Like I can't write after dinner.
• 21:23
  Speaker 6: Like I know a lot of people can write at night,
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: late into the night. I can't do that. I'm too tired.
• 21:27
  Speaker 6: I want a drink. I'm done. So I start my
• 21:32
  Speaker 6: day writing and then I'll pop in check my email
• 21:36
  Speaker 6: at work, make sure everything is okay. And then as
• 21:39
  Speaker 6: soon as I'm like okay, tapped out, wrote that scene,
• 21:42
  Speaker 6: wrote whatever it was my goal was for the day.
• 21:44
  Speaker 6: Even if I honestly dave, even if I only write
• 21:47
  Speaker 6: for fifteen minutes, I have to write something because or
• 21:52
  Speaker 6: else I'm just a bitch. Like it gets me irritable,
• 21:55
  Speaker 6: like I didn't take care of myself today may speak.
• 21:57
  Speaker 6: Then as the day goes on, I start getting resentful
• 22:00
  Speaker 6: because I didn't I didn't do what I wanted to do.
• 22:02
  Speaker 6: So I try really really hard to do that. I'm
• 22:05
  Speaker 6: not always successful, but I do try to write in
• 22:07
  Speaker 6: the morning and then and then I and then I
• 22:11
  Speaker 6: go full full on into my day job and just
• 22:13
  Speaker 6: work work, work, work, work, And then if but if
• 22:17
  Speaker 6: I'm inspired and I want to keep writing in the morning,
• 22:20
  Speaker 6: and I just am on a roll, I keep writing,
• 22:23
  Speaker 6: and then I then I will many many nights, I
• 22:27
  Speaker 6: will end up doing my day job until eleven o'clock
• 22:29
  Speaker 6: at night because I have to do what I didn't
• 22:32
  Speaker 6: do during the day. But I'm very blessed to work
• 22:36
  Speaker 6: from home so that I have that flexibility to tap
• 22:39
  Speaker 6: into my creativity when I'm feeling it. And I know
• 22:43
  Speaker 6: a lot of other people don't have that. But and
• 22:46
  Speaker 6: then I try on the weekends, I dedicate Sunday Funday,
• 22:50
  Speaker 6: you know, and so I try to do all my
• 22:53
  Speaker 6: mom's stuff on Saturday so that on Sunday is my
• 22:56
  Speaker 6: day and I can just write. That's how I find
• 23:00
  Speaker 6: works for me.
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: Well excellent.
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: So, you know, because a lot of people do work
• 23:06
  Speaker 5: the nine to five, and sometimes there are like, you know,
• 23:08
  Speaker 5: people who are on call. So like if they do
• 23:10
  Speaker 5: work the nine to five, suddenly are they getting you know,
• 23:12
  Speaker 5: calls at you know, eight o'clock at night.
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: You know, yeah, exactly, so easy.
• 23:18
  Speaker 6: The other thing too. I'll do the introjet for a second.
• 23:20
  Speaker 6: The other thing too, is to try to write on
• 23:24
  Speaker 6: your lunch break, like you know, just just really be
• 23:27
  Speaker 6: disciplined and write any second you can. I'm actually one
• 23:30
  Speaker 6: of my friends had contacted me the other day nervous.
• 23:34
  Speaker 6: He had opportunity for to take on a gig to
• 23:36
  Speaker 6: write a script and actually get paid to do it.
• 23:39
  Speaker 6: And he was very nervous to say yes because how
• 23:42
  Speaker 6: am I going to find a time to do this?
• 23:43
  Speaker 6: And and so I put a call out onto Facebook
• 23:47
  Speaker 6: and onto Twitter for people to give me advice about
• 23:50
  Speaker 6: how they work a day job and get writing done.
• 23:53
  Speaker 6: And people send in a ton ton of comments and
• 23:57
  Speaker 6: tweets which I've collected, and I will write a few
• 24:00
  Speaker 6: your balls and steal about this, just bullet lifting everybody's
• 24:03
  Speaker 6: ideas of how to get how to get that done.
• 24:07
  Speaker 6: I probably won't write it for a couple of weeks,
• 24:09
  Speaker 6: but when I do, I'll shoot to the url.
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: Oh thank you, you know, because you know I speak
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: of you know, you said writing at least fifteen minutes.
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: And I remember I got advice before from someone from
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: an actual working writer at in LA and he said
• 24:24
  Speaker 5: the same thing because basically, he said, as long as
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: you can just even get a small amount done, he said,
• 24:32
  Speaker 5: by the end, he actually timed it out. He said,
• 24:34
  Speaker 5: if what he tries to do is it's at least
• 24:36
  Speaker 5: fifteen minutes a day, and at most, he said.
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: He'll just do it. He like sort of burns.
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: Out and on those magical days when you know, sort
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: of everything, his schedule clears up, and basically he tries
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: to get a rough draft done within like three to
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: four weeks.
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: What have you heard?
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: I mean, is your style similar to that we try
• 24:57
  Speaker 5: to get, you know, just that first draft bang, guys
• 24:59
  Speaker 5: quickly possible?
• 25:03
  Speaker 6: It's well, yes, I'm actually trying a different process right now,
• 25:10
  Speaker 6: which I'll discuss in one second. I just want to
• 25:12
  Speaker 6: say this about this current topic so that I don't forget.
• 25:15
  Speaker 6: But one of the beautiful things about the fifteen minutes
• 25:18
  Speaker 6: is even just even just getting if you spend fifteen
• 25:25
  Speaker 6: minutes on it, what's going to happen is your mind
• 25:27
  Speaker 6: is still going to be thinking about it all throughout
• 25:29
  Speaker 6: the day. And so that fifteen minutes really is a
• 25:34
  Speaker 6: lot more than fifteen minutes, because even if you're not
• 25:37
  Speaker 6: putting words on the page and you're thinking about it.
• 25:39
  Speaker 6: That counts as writing because you're digesting and developing the
• 25:42
  Speaker 6: story in your head. And the other trick I would
• 25:48
  Speaker 6: say that helps you pick right up quickly. Would you
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: only have fifteen minutes? Is don't finish like never never
• 25:57
  Speaker 6: completely finish a scene so that you have and say, oh,
• 26:00
  Speaker 6: now I'm done today because I finished the scene. If
• 26:02
  Speaker 6: you if your goal is to finish that scene, finish it,
• 26:04
  Speaker 6: but then start the next scene before and then stop
• 26:08
  Speaker 6: for the day, because if you've already started the scene,
• 26:12
  Speaker 6: your head's going to be thinking about that scene throughout
• 26:15
  Speaker 6: the day. So when you sit back down, you're not
• 26:17
  Speaker 6: looking at a blank page and you've already been digesting it,
• 26:20
  Speaker 6: so you can just kind of hit the ground running.
• 26:22
  Speaker 6: Those are little things that I think have helped me.
• 26:27
  Speaker 5: So so then so what process now are are you
• 26:31
  Speaker 5: using to write this new scroup? I?
• 26:35
  Speaker 6: Oh yeah, Oh my god, I am so far out
• 26:38
  Speaker 6: of my comfort zone, dave it. I just I just
• 26:42
  Speaker 6: had a long talk with about this yesterday because I
• 26:45
  Speaker 6: was freaking out because it's so different than what I
• 26:47
  Speaker 6: normally do. I normally outline. I'm like an outline junkie,
• 26:52
  Speaker 6: and I think part of it is because I hate
• 26:55
  Speaker 6: starting things, so outlining, I just you know, outline, out line,
• 27:00
  Speaker 6: and I kind of sometimes use it too much as
• 27:03
  Speaker 6: a safety net. And even though I never really I
• 27:07
  Speaker 6: stick to the outline somewhat, I never have a problem
• 27:09
  Speaker 6: when I'm writing going off the outline, exploring characters, all
• 27:13
  Speaker 6: of that kind of stuff. But for some reason, I
• 27:15
  Speaker 6: just kind of need an outline. And and and so
• 27:20
  Speaker 6: an Unk never writes for the outline. He might have
• 27:23
  Speaker 6: just sort of a broad brushstroke, but he's been doing
• 27:26
  Speaker 6: this for years and and I don't know, if you
• 27:30
  Speaker 6: just to clarify, I'm known screenwriters, a ghostwriter. He writes
• 27:35
  Speaker 6: for hire, you know, credit with NDAs. He's written, He's
• 27:38
  Speaker 6: written with some incredible people and rewritten some incredibly talented
• 27:45
  Speaker 6: cop writers. I mean, he's he's been at this for
• 27:48
  Speaker 6: a very long time. So he is challenging me to
• 27:53
  Speaker 6: try to embrace with this new project that we're working on,
• 27:57
  Speaker 6: his style, which and I'm I love challenging myself. I
• 28:01
  Speaker 6: love trying different different propsses and seeing what works best
• 28:05
  Speaker 6: for me and discovering new ways to do things and
• 28:08
  Speaker 6: new ways to tap into that creative energy. So we
• 28:11
  Speaker 6: are literally writing the first draft. Like it's like we're
• 28:15
  Speaker 6: brainstorming like I have when I send him this when
• 28:18
  Speaker 6: I write something and I sent him the script to
• 28:20
  Speaker 6: pick up where we left off. I never know what
• 28:23
  Speaker 6: he's going to do. Like this last scene. He sent
• 28:26
  Speaker 6: it back to me and he'd kill someone and I'm
• 28:28
  Speaker 6: like okay, and we're like exploring characters, and so I
• 28:35
  Speaker 6: was like, Okay, I'm struggling with this. I'm really struggling.
• 28:37
  Speaker 6: I'm feeling like I don't know, like I'm standing blindfolded
• 28:41
  Speaker 6: in the middle of the forest, you know, like where
• 28:43
  Speaker 6: am I supposed to go? You know? And he and
• 28:47
  Speaker 6: so he's just encouraging me to He's like, you know,
• 28:50
  Speaker 6: you am reminding me of things like and this is
• 28:52
  Speaker 6: what's great when you have a writing partner knows you
• 28:54
  Speaker 6: well and knows and knows you know, like what might
• 28:58
  Speaker 6: he could look at my fear objectively and not emotionally
• 29:03
  Speaker 6: and remind me. Look, you're a martial artist. When you're
• 29:05
  Speaker 6: standing in the dojo and somebody starts fighting, you do
• 29:08
  Speaker 6: you do you sit there and think about it. You
• 29:11
  Speaker 6: just react. You just you know, block, punch, kick, whatever
• 29:14
  Speaker 6: you have to do. You just muffle memory and you
• 29:16
  Speaker 6: just relax and do it. So do the same thing
• 29:18
  Speaker 6: when you're writing, like shut the door, like Stephen King says,
• 29:21
  Speaker 6: and just write and can and take that pressure off
• 29:25
  Speaker 6: of your shelves and just think of it as like
• 29:27
  Speaker 6: you're just brainstorming, but in script format, so that then
• 29:31
  Speaker 6: by the end of the time of brainstorming, instead of
• 29:33
  Speaker 6: having an outline, we have a script and then we
• 29:36
  Speaker 6: can play with that. And so I'm trying that, and
• 29:43
  Speaker 6: I think.
• 29:44
  Speaker 8: I'm gonna like it, but it's a little it's a
• 29:48
  Speaker 8: little scary for somebody who's used to outlining, but there's
• 29:51
  Speaker 8: tons of people who do it this way and and
• 29:54
  Speaker 8: don't outline.
• 29:55
  Speaker 6: So I'm just trying a different a different process of time.
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 30:06
  Speaker 4: and now back to the show.
• 30:09
  Speaker 5: So, so, Genie, when you outline, do you like what
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: exactly do you how do you outline?
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: And what I mean by that is do you like
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: go by like sid fields? Uh? Two points? You know
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: what I mean? I forget the name of Selt my head.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: I can't believe, uh no, I know.
• 30:26
  Speaker 6: And there's all those different ways, like the beach sheet
• 30:29
  Speaker 6: and in the Hero's journey, and there's so many different
• 30:32
  Speaker 6: structure ways I think. I think once you when you're
• 30:36
  Speaker 6: starting out, it's really important to pay attention to that
• 30:39
  Speaker 6: kind of stuff. And then at a certain point, a
• 30:42
  Speaker 6: certain point, you sort of get to a point where
• 30:45
  Speaker 6: you know story well enough that you don't have to
• 30:48
  Speaker 6: look at that roadmap kind of thing. One of the
• 30:51
  Speaker 6: things when I started that I really loved was Michael
• 30:56
  Speaker 6: Haig and Chris Fogler have a DVD called The Hero's
• 30:59
  Speaker 6: Two Journy, and I thought that was that was something
• 31:03
  Speaker 6: that really helped me when I was beginning because it
• 31:06
  Speaker 6: talked about not just the structure in terms of plot points,
• 31:08
  Speaker 6: but also the structure in terms of the character's arc
• 31:11
  Speaker 6: and evolution, and that I thought was a really great
• 31:15
  Speaker 6: resource for a beginning writer. And even to remind yourself,
• 31:19
  Speaker 6: I would go back and watch it, you know, right
• 31:21
  Speaker 6: before I would start any news script, just to kind
• 31:23
  Speaker 6: of refresh my mind and memory of it. But then
• 31:27
  Speaker 6: it just becomes intuitive. So what I what I had
• 31:30
  Speaker 6: been doing? Oh my god, like with Slavery by another name,
• 31:33
  Speaker 6: that that script had become Slavery by in some respect.
• 31:37
  Speaker 6: It's like six years, you know, into it, but we
• 31:41
  Speaker 6: had a thirty one page outline, and by the time
• 31:44
  Speaker 6: that it got to that point, it was like flug lines.
• 31:49
  Speaker 6: I would then do this really detailed outline and then
• 31:52
  Speaker 6: put it into the screenwriting software and with complete with
• 31:58
  Speaker 6: slugline and a paragraph each what was supposed to happen
• 32:02
  Speaker 6: in the intent and purpose of that scene. And that
• 32:05
  Speaker 6: helped me because I was never ever looking at a
• 32:08
  Speaker 6: blank page. So I would go in and I would
• 32:12
  Speaker 6: look at this is what I'm going to do, and
• 32:13
  Speaker 6: then I would just sit down and write that scene.
• 32:15
  Speaker 6: And sometimes things would change. Scenes, we'd get deleted and
• 32:18
  Speaker 6: added and change, you know. You know. The trick to
• 32:21
  Speaker 6: outlining is never to think of it as something that's
• 32:23
  Speaker 6: set and s done. You have to like let it go,
• 32:25
  Speaker 6: you know. But at least it gives you sort of
• 32:28
  Speaker 6: a little map and you can veer off of it
• 32:30
  Speaker 6: and whatnot. And that has that was always my comfort zone,
• 32:33
  Speaker 6: knowing that I had this, Okay, this is I'm a planner,
• 32:36
  Speaker 6: so it helped me to know I have a plan,
• 32:38
  Speaker 6: this is the plan of this scene, and this is
• 32:40
  Speaker 6: what's going to happen.
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I've outlined too, and I'm sure other
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: people have and suddenly. You know, when you start writing,
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: you either realize you've not written enough, you've written too much,
• 32:52
  Speaker 5: and you're like, oh my god, I thought was going
• 32:54
  Speaker 5: to be you know, a two page scene is now
• 32:57
  Speaker 5: spanning fifteen pages, and yes, and that's.
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: On you sort of.
• 33:01
  Speaker 5: So when that happens, do you just sort of continue
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: with the just doing it and then then you'll edit
• 33:07
  Speaker 5: later and when you're finished a rough draft, Yeah, I.
• 33:10
  Speaker 6: Just I just let it go, just write however much
• 33:12
  Speaker 6: I want to write. The first draft of Slavery by
• 33:15
  Speaker 6: Now the name was one hundred and seventy five pages,
• 33:18
  Speaker 6: and it's an epic story. But nothing's worth one hundred
• 33:23
  Speaker 6: and seventy five, so it's I think it's now like
• 33:26
  Speaker 6: one hundred and thirty two, but it's but it isn't
• 33:29
  Speaker 6: you know, it's a little lengthy, but it is an
• 33:31
  Speaker 6: epic story. I wouldn't if it was any other story
• 33:34
  Speaker 6: other than this, I wouldn't have it be that long.
• 33:37
  Speaker 6: But but yeah, you just let it go and then
• 33:41
  Speaker 6: and you can. I mean, that's what rewriting is all about,
• 33:43
  Speaker 6: because you never know what's going to come out like,
• 33:45
  Speaker 6: and even when people would give me notes and I
• 33:47
  Speaker 6: wouldn't like those notes, I wouldn't agree with them, I
• 33:51
  Speaker 6: would still try them because you know, there might be
• 33:56
  Speaker 6: something in that note, there's something in it that's worthy
• 33:59
  Speaker 6: of something. It might not be the exact note they
• 34:02
  Speaker 6: gave me, that their solution might not be the solution
• 34:06
  Speaker 6: that I ended up using, But by trying something, I
• 34:09
  Speaker 6: could always find a solution that worked for me and
• 34:12
  Speaker 6: the note giver. And that and when I say a
• 34:17
  Speaker 6: solution that worked for the note giver, it only needs
• 34:20
  Speaker 6: to work for the note giver. If the notegiver is
• 34:22
  Speaker 6: your producer, If it's just somebody who's reading your script
• 34:24
  Speaker 6: to give you notes, you don't have to worry about
• 34:27
  Speaker 6: pleasing them. You just listen to what they're saying and
• 34:30
  Speaker 6: see if it works for your story or not. But
• 34:32
  Speaker 6: when I had producers, definitely pleasing them is important.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 34:40
  Speaker 5: I'm part of a writer's group and we always, you know,
• 34:42
  Speaker 5: give each other notes. You know, we hands in you know,
• 34:45
  Speaker 5: script each month, not completed scripts, but usually like.
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: Ten to twenty pages.
• 34:51
  Speaker 5: And when you get notes, you see a lot of
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: different ideas, you know, stuff like that.
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: So that's a very good point.
• 34:56
  Speaker 5: The point you just brought up was take the note
• 34:59
  Speaker 5: from the other readers and see if you agree with
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: it and see how it would help your story, and
• 35:03
  Speaker 5: also see, you know, the person saying it and why
• 35:06
  Speaker 5: they're saying it. Mean, like what are they trying to convey,
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: because some people will have, you know, certain things like
• 35:11
  Speaker 5: they just want to read horror scripts or some people
• 35:13
  Speaker 5: who just want to read comedies, you know, and you know,
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: I think that also obviously weighs into whatever they're trying
• 35:20
  Speaker 5: to convey.
• 35:21
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 35:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah, uh so, Genie, do you want to take some
• 35:25
  Speaker 5: questions because you have a lot, but I'm not gonna
• 35:28
  Speaker 5: take I'm not gonna ask all of them. Uh, Like
• 35:30
  Speaker 5: I was just just mentioned to you as we started this,
• 35:33
  Speaker 5: there was a lot that came in at.
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: Like the midnight hour.
• 35:36
  Speaker 5: Whatever you want to ask, sure, so I'll ask probably
• 35:39
  Speaker 5: the best five or so. So the first question actually
• 35:43
  Speaker 5: had came in this is by John who's a producer
• 35:46
  Speaker 5: on the screen, the producer of the film The Walking
• 35:49
  Speaker 5: Full and his question is does one script excuse me,
• 35:53
  Speaker 5: there's one page of the script equal one page on screen?
• 35:57
  Speaker 6: You know, I mean I think it's it's typically that's
• 36:01
  Speaker 6: the rule. Like when you're writing, you think of one
• 36:04
  Speaker 6: minute is one page, but it depends on what's on
• 36:08
  Speaker 6: the page and what the director decides to do with that.
• 36:11
  Speaker 6: And you know, but that's the basic standard rule. It
• 36:16
  Speaker 6: doesn't exactly like if you stat there would stop watch,
• 36:18
  Speaker 6: you know, like and it doesn't exactly make a minute,
• 36:21
  Speaker 6: but that's just the way to gauge.
• 36:25
  Speaker 5: Yeah, by the way, have you seen that yet the
• 36:27
  Speaker 5: commercial because they're doing any go go for it and
• 36:30
  Speaker 5: he actually the film is all about a guy who
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: actually walked from New York all the way to California.
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: Oh cool, And I don't know if you if you've
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: heard of it yet.
• 36:42
  Speaker 6: We have a walking stick because I'm really into walking
• 36:44
  Speaker 6: sticks lately.
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: He did.
• 36:46
  Speaker 5: There's different pictures of him going through all the different
• 36:48
  Speaker 5: states and some states he actually had a walking stick.
• 36:51
  Speaker 6: I want one that has like a little button that
• 36:53
  Speaker 6: you pushed that a knife comes out. Because I live
• 36:58
  Speaker 6: in the country, so I'm walking on these back like
• 37:00
  Speaker 6: your roads, and there were bear and you know, there's
• 37:04
  Speaker 6: there's a lot of stuff out there. You know. There
• 37:06
  Speaker 6: was a completely different side note, But no, I haven't
• 37:09
  Speaker 6: seen it yet, and I would love to check it out.
• 37:11
  Speaker 5: There was a walking stick that I saw that actually
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: unfolded and there was a sword inside, so like it
• 37:18
  Speaker 5: was this steck. This stick was actually the sheath so
• 37:21
  Speaker 5: you would pull it out, and it was actually a
• 37:23
  Speaker 5: double bladed sword.
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: So I guess if there was a bear, you could
• 37:26
  Speaker 3: actually fend it off.
• 37:27
  Speaker 5: At least you had something, and then you could just
• 37:29
  Speaker 5: resheath it and then get it's a walking stick again.
• 37:31
  Speaker 6: Oh my god, I totally want that. I totally want
• 37:36
  Speaker 6: that so bad.
• 37:38
  Speaker 5: As Yeah, I saw like a couple of years ago,
• 37:42
  Speaker 5: I was looking my mom was asking for a walking stick,
• 37:45
  Speaker 5: and I found it and I was like, wow, I
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: was liked, you get it. No, I didn't get it
• 37:50
  Speaker 5: because I don't think she would probably be like, oh
• 37:52
  Speaker 5: my god, I'm never using it, because she'll she'll only
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: used like certain stuff. And I know if I showed
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: it there was a sword inside, she'd be like, oh
• 37:58
  Speaker 5: my god, I'll get arrested.
• 38:00
  Speaker 6: But she probably send you to therapy.
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 38:07
  Speaker 5: So the the second question is how does an unknown
• 38:11
  Speaker 5: screenwriter get representation?
• 38:14
  Speaker 6: Oh my god, this is like this this week could
• 38:17
  Speaker 6: talk all day about. I think basically what there's there's
• 38:22
  Speaker 6: a lot of stuff that that like, I've moderated a
• 38:25
  Speaker 6: lot of panels the conferences where we've got panels of
• 38:27
  Speaker 6: the agents and managers and everybody. Everybody wants to know
• 38:31
  Speaker 6: like this magic trick, you know, and actually wrote a
• 38:35
  Speaker 6: post called the magic trick is selling your screenplay. It's
• 38:39
  Speaker 6: one of my Balls and Steel posts where you know,
• 38:41
  Speaker 6: I talk about some of that, but basically in terms
• 38:44
  Speaker 6: of getting representation, specifically not selling it from what I
• 38:50
  Speaker 6: don't have representation, and but I have gotten my script
• 38:54
  Speaker 6: read by like the top agencies and great production companies
• 38:59
  Speaker 6: and things like that, by hustling, like I learned learn
• 39:04
  Speaker 6: how to pitch. And one of the best ways to
• 39:07
  Speaker 6: learn how to pitch is to go to UH pitchfests.
• 39:10
  Speaker 6: And you're not, honestly, you're not going to sell your
• 39:13
  Speaker 6: script at a pitchfest, but you're going to learn how
• 39:16
  Speaker 6: to how to pitch your script, how to get comfortable
• 39:20
  Speaker 6: talking to executives. You're going to make connections, you're going
• 39:23
  Speaker 6: to get part of You're not just trying to sell
• 39:26
  Speaker 6: your script. You're trying to sell yourself. And because if
• 39:29
  Speaker 6: they say yeah to the script, they're going to have
• 39:30
  Speaker 6: to work with you. So it really is helpful to
• 39:35
  Speaker 6: practice those pitching skills with people in those in that
• 39:39
  Speaker 6: pitchfest environment because you can do every you know, the
• 39:41
  Speaker 6: pitches are only for five minutes, so you just you're
• 39:44
  Speaker 6: in line. You just go go, go, go, go for
• 39:46
  Speaker 6: hours all day and you can easily get in like,
• 39:49
  Speaker 6: you know, fifteen eighteen pitches in a day, and those
• 39:53
  Speaker 6: are fifteen or eighteen people.
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: Who will be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 40:02
  Speaker 4: And now back to the show.
• 40:05
  Speaker 6: If you had to drive all around LA and try
• 40:07
  Speaker 6: to get meetings with you never would be able to.
• 40:10
  Speaker 6: And yeah, I mean there's no question a lot of
• 40:13
  Speaker 6: them are assistants, you know, but today's assistant is tomorrow's
• 40:17
  Speaker 6: studio head. That people change companies so often in this
• 40:21
  Speaker 6: industry that they may be at x y Z company
• 40:24
  Speaker 6: today but over at ABC Company tomorrow, you know, and
• 40:27
  Speaker 6: that may be the fit for your script, you know,
• 40:30
  Speaker 6: like so and they might just and the trick is
• 40:33
  Speaker 6: getting read so that people know whether you're a good
• 40:36
  Speaker 6: writer or not. And if you're a really good writer,
• 40:39
  Speaker 6: your script is going to stand out. And so the
• 40:42
  Speaker 6: other way to do it is by entering contests like
• 40:46
  Speaker 6: like this tracking board launch pad. The whole purpose of
• 40:50
  Speaker 6: this is not it's to try to get these twenty
• 40:53
  Speaker 6: five top writers to launch their careers. The blacklist is
• 40:59
  Speaker 6: another great way too. It's not a contest, but it's
• 41:02
  Speaker 6: just it's a great way to get feedback on your
• 41:04
  Speaker 6: script and get it listed. And so many executives do
• 41:07
  Speaker 6: look at the blacklist to find material you can tag
• 41:11
  Speaker 6: your your stuff. I just I just entered slavery, run
• 41:16
  Speaker 6: another name into what. I'm waiting for the feedback so
• 41:18
  Speaker 6: that it could be listed, because I'm curious to see
• 41:21
  Speaker 6: how the process works. I know, you know they've got
• 41:24
  Speaker 6: they've had people get representation from that as well. The best,
• 41:28
  Speaker 6: you know, the big contest like Austin the Austin Field
• 41:32
  Speaker 6: Festival one is really good final draft, big break script,
• 41:35
  Speaker 6: a Plue the Blue Cat. When it's the big contest,
• 41:41
  Speaker 6: executives will notice they will read those and you may
• 41:45
  Speaker 6: not even know they're reading your script if it if
• 41:48
  Speaker 6: it places as a finalist, people will just read them.
• 41:53
  Speaker 6: It's not like they'll even contact you to say we're
• 41:55
  Speaker 6: gonna read your script. They just get them. And so
• 42:01
  Speaker 6: but don't I would say, don't bother with the contests
• 42:04
  Speaker 6: that are that are smaller that unless there it's like
• 42:07
  Speaker 6: a contest that gives you, like, you know, money as
• 42:10
  Speaker 6: a prize that and you need the money. But if
• 42:13
  Speaker 6: you're if it's a smaller contact, they're not going to
• 42:15
  Speaker 6: really notice the representations. The reps aren't really going to
• 42:19
  Speaker 6: notice those, you know. So unless they offer feedback or
• 42:24
  Speaker 6: something else that you find a personal value, they probably
• 42:27
  Speaker 6: aren't going to help you career wise. But you know,
• 42:30
  Speaker 6: just and write a lot like right. The other you know,
• 42:33
  Speaker 6: the other thing is you've got to write something that's marketable,
• 42:36
  Speaker 6: something they can sell. There's no point in them reping
• 42:39
  Speaker 6: you like And that's this is why this is probably
• 42:42
  Speaker 6: why I don't have an agent yet, because the the
• 42:45
  Speaker 6: thing that I'm most known for is slavery by another name,
• 42:48
  Speaker 6: which is a very very difficult thing to sell. And
• 42:51
  Speaker 6: everyone who reads it says, oh my god, this has
• 42:54
  Speaker 6: to get made. This is such an important story, and
• 42:55
  Speaker 6: it's about slavery post Civil War, everything that's going on
• 42:58
  Speaker 6: right now with Ferguson and all of this relations between
• 43:02
  Speaker 6: the law enforcement and the African American community. Slaverbread of
• 43:05
  Speaker 6: a name is all about prison laboring and how the
• 43:08
  Speaker 6: souths after the Civil War, how the South created these
• 43:12
  Speaker 6: laws relave to re enslave blacks by arresting them for
• 43:17
  Speaker 6: these false crimes and then leasing them as prison laborers.
• 43:20
  Speaker 6: And that's why slavery by another name, and this is
• 43:24
  Speaker 6: and before those laws were created, blacks and whites, they're
• 43:27
  Speaker 6: fifty to fifty blacks and whites in prisons. And then
• 43:31
  Speaker 6: after these laws a disproportionate number of African Americans were
• 43:34
  Speaker 6: imprison and that leads a stigma in society where people
• 43:40
  Speaker 6: start thinking, oh, my god, they are dangerous people, and
• 43:43
  Speaker 6: they aren't. It's you know, it's the laws that were created.
• 43:46
  Speaker 6: And you know, years and years of that happening, you know,
• 43:52
  Speaker 6: changes society's perception of a culture. And so it's extremely
• 43:58
  Speaker 6: timely right now. So I'm hoping that that helps us.
• 44:02
  Speaker 6: But it's still a very difficult sell because it's a
• 44:05
  Speaker 6: period piece. It you know, it's not going to be
• 44:07
  Speaker 6: a cheap film to make, so you need to to
• 44:10
  Speaker 6: get representation. They need to know they can sell something
• 44:13
  Speaker 6: and make money off of you. So I'm writing other
• 44:17
  Speaker 6: things right now with ONNK and myself that are much
• 44:20
  Speaker 6: more marketable, that are easier to sell, so that then
• 44:23
  Speaker 6: hopefully I can get those sold and then someone to
• 44:25
  Speaker 6: look at slavery. So you know, don't pick don't do
• 44:28
  Speaker 6: what I did and pick that monumental, herculean project, you know,
• 44:33
  Speaker 6: and and have that be your your your thing that's
• 44:37
  Speaker 6: on the forefront. You know, think, think smaller and marketable
• 44:41
  Speaker 6: and something that they can sell, because that's you know,
• 44:43
  Speaker 6: that's how they put food on their table, is to
• 44:45
  Speaker 6: sell yourself.
• 44:48
  Speaker 5: So that ties in with the My next question you're
• 44:50
  Speaker 5: speaking of a solable screenplay is how to tell?
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: How do you tell if you have a good concept
• 44:56
  Speaker 3: or not.
• 44:58
  Speaker 5: Oftentimes I'll up a concept and begin writing only to
• 45:02
  Speaker 5: hit a dead end.
• 45:07
  Speaker 6: That is the million dollar question, I mean, if you
• 45:10
  Speaker 6: know what I mean, really, I think it's it's one
• 45:14
  Speaker 6: of the things that I did. You know, we're working
• 45:16
  Speaker 6: on this project now. It's a horror project, and over
• 45:21
  Speaker 6: Thanksgiving I pitched it to my nieces and nephews who
• 45:23
  Speaker 6: are all like in that target audience range eighteen to
• 45:26
  Speaker 6: twenty five, you know, and they were all like, oh
• 45:29
  Speaker 6: my god, oh my god, I would totally see that.
• 45:32
  Speaker 6: Oh my god. You know, Like, so you want that
• 45:34
  Speaker 6: kind of reaction from your target audience. But also think
• 45:38
  Speaker 6: about think about budget, think about because those are also
• 45:44
  Speaker 6: things that matter. You know, eighteen to twenty five year
• 45:48
  Speaker 6: old males are like, I think, the biggest audience for
• 45:51
  Speaker 6: films and they'll go see them multiple times. So if
• 45:56
  Speaker 6: you can tap into that, you know, but you also
• 45:58
  Speaker 6: have to find not just the mar marketable idea, but
• 46:01
  Speaker 6: the idea that you can be passionate about writing, because
• 46:04
  Speaker 6: if you weren't, if you're just writing a horror piece,
• 46:07
  Speaker 6: you know, horror dot horror, but like a total like
• 46:10
  Speaker 6: horror piece for money for whatever, just to see if
• 46:13
  Speaker 6: you can break in that way, but you aren't passionate
• 46:16
  Speaker 6: about it, it's it's going to show on the page.
• 46:20
  Speaker 6: So the trick is finding something that you have you
• 46:24
  Speaker 6: can tap into and and and really enjoy writing that
• 46:30
  Speaker 6: somebody can sell and there would be an audience for
• 46:32
  Speaker 6: it that has not a monumental budget, because that matters too,
• 46:40
  Speaker 6: you know. So it's it's tricky. I mean, there's a
• 46:45
  Speaker 6: high concept you know, is uh is it is really tough.
• 46:50
  Speaker 6: I was talking to a professional writer, Joe Zoom one day.
• 46:57
  Speaker 6: He was a guest on script shot. He's I think
• 47:00
  Speaker 6: one of his scripts is on Track and Boards Hitlist,
• 47:02
  Speaker 6: and he was telling me that with his manager he
• 47:07
  Speaker 6: will literally go over one hundred ideas, one hundred or
• 47:11
  Speaker 6: more ideas, and his aunt, his manager will say, this
• 47:15
  Speaker 6: is the one you're going to write. So if you
• 47:20
  Speaker 6: can get representation, they can certainly help you decide which
• 47:23
  Speaker 6: one they think they can sell. But I would say,
• 47:26
  Speaker 6: look at things like the hit list, look at the blacklist,
• 47:28
  Speaker 6: look at the top twenty five on the tracking board,
• 47:32
  Speaker 6: launch pad, look at log lines of things that are selling,
• 47:37
  Speaker 6: and sort of research and figure out. And it's not
• 47:41
  Speaker 6: about following the trends. It's about figuring out what made that?
• 47:46
  Speaker 6: Why was that log line so good? You know, like
• 47:49
  Speaker 6: it takes a while to hone that skill of figuring
• 47:52
  Speaker 6: out what is the project? And honestly, I think you're
• 47:56
  Speaker 6: better off spending a lot of time figure out what
• 48:01
  Speaker 6: to write then just writing any idea that you have,
• 48:05
  Speaker 6: because you know, if you write it and you can't
• 48:09
  Speaker 6: sell it, you still learn stuff from brighting things even
• 48:11
  Speaker 6: if you don't sell it, so it still helps Holmee.
• 48:13
  Speaker 6: You're writing skills. But if you're really trying to get
• 48:16
  Speaker 6: representation and sell something, spend a lot of time figuring
• 48:20
  Speaker 6: out what it is you're going to write that would
• 48:22
  Speaker 6: attract somebody, would attract the audience, isn't going to cost
• 48:25
  Speaker 6: a fortune to make, especially if you're just breaking in,
• 48:27
  Speaker 6: you know, because if it's not going to cost a
• 48:31
  Speaker 6: lot to make, you can also do it as an
• 48:33
  Speaker 6: indie film.
• 48:34
  Speaker 5: Too, exactly right. And you know we were talking about
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: that with Pat's guests as well. Was you know, if
• 48:40
  Speaker 5: you had to, if you sort of reverse engineer it
• 48:43
  Speaker 5: by taking a list of what you have, which is
• 48:45
  Speaker 5: sometimes called the ri Regaz list, So hey, I have
• 48:48
  Speaker 5: access to like this farmhouse and stuff like that, and
• 48:50
  Speaker 5: suddenly you're building basing a film there, you know, settings
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: entirely inside of this farmhouse. And you know that way,
• 48:57
  Speaker 5: if it doesn't get notice that way, you can just
• 48:59
  Speaker 5: try to crowdfund it, or you know, pull every resource
• 49:01
  Speaker 5: you have together to make this small film and maybe
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: just put up on YouTube, just try to get noticed.
• 49:07
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, and people do it all the time.
• 49:08
  Speaker 6: They make these these films and then they go they
• 49:11
  Speaker 6: submit them to film festivals and they get noticed and
• 49:13
  Speaker 6: they win awards, and then they go on to do
• 49:15
  Speaker 6: something bigger. You know, it happens all the time.
• 49:20
  Speaker 5: And speaking of a million dollar questions, this is, uh,
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: this ties in with what we're talking about and this
• 49:25
  Speaker 5: is this is another million dollar question is getting discovered,
• 49:28
  Speaker 5: which is I'm hoping to get discovered with my screenplay,
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: but I don't know where to start this person list,
• 49:34
  Speaker 5: the Blacklist, tracking Board, script shadow, Is there a specific
• 49:40
  Speaker 5: website that they should put their material on for a
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: better chance of getting noticed.
• 49:46
  Speaker 6: The first thing I would say, before you put your
• 49:49
  Speaker 6: script anywhere, make sure it is the best possible script
• 49:53
  Speaker 6: that it can be, and so get feedback.
• 49:58
  Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 50:04
  Speaker 4: and now back to the show.
• 50:07
  Speaker 6: You know, don't put it out too soon, because there's
• 50:12
  Speaker 6: like you know, there's they keep track of stuff like that,
• 50:16
  Speaker 6: you know, like whether whether to consider the writer or not,
• 50:19
  Speaker 6: not just the idea, but the writer. So you want
• 50:22
  Speaker 6: to make sure that it's written well because you don't
• 50:24
  Speaker 6: want to have like a red mark next to your name.
• 50:28
  Speaker 6: So one of the things that like the tracking Board
• 50:31
  Speaker 6: does and the Blacklist does is you get you get feedback.
• 50:35
  Speaker 6: And I know a lot of people talk about that
• 50:39
  Speaker 6: line to pay for coverage, not line to pay for notes.
• 50:43
  Speaker 6: I think I've always done it. I've always gotten some
• 50:48
  Speaker 6: sort of coverage and and not coverage so much, but
• 50:52
  Speaker 6: you know, notes and script notes, especially when I started off.
• 50:57
  Speaker 6: Now I don't. Now I don't really pay for them anymore.
• 51:00
  Speaker 6: I mean I did on the Blacklist and on the
• 51:02
  Speaker 6: Track and Board, but because I have great respect for them.
• 51:05
  Speaker 6: But for the most part, I mean I have I
• 51:08
  Speaker 6: have friends who are great writers, and we trade scripts
• 51:10
  Speaker 6: with each other and we give each other notes. But
• 51:13
  Speaker 6: for these opportunities to get noticed, I'm not opposed to paying.
• 51:18
  Speaker 6: And I look at it as it's like you're paying
• 51:22
  Speaker 6: for a tutor. You know, it's part it's an investment
• 51:24
  Speaker 6: in myself and in my education as a writer, and
• 51:29
  Speaker 6: so I always learned something from notes that makes me
• 51:32
  Speaker 6: a better writer. So before you list it anywhere, make
• 51:37
  Speaker 6: sure it is the best possible script that it can be,
• 51:41
  Speaker 6: and then submit it. And I would definitely say all
• 51:45
  Speaker 6: of those things that I mentioned in those contests that
• 51:47
  Speaker 6: we talked about earlier are all great ways to get noticed.
• 51:52
  Speaker 5: So, you know, just to continue that question, what if
• 51:54
  Speaker 5: somebody just put a screenplay up on their own.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: Website, like they actually create a website.
• 52:00
  Speaker 5: Uh, you know, they got wis dot com and I
• 52:02
  Speaker 5: just built their own website doing very simple stuff.
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: What do you think of that idea just sort of
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: to just to get it out there.
• 52:09
  Speaker 6: I wouldn't do it. Okay, I'm not even sure I
• 52:17
  Speaker 6: can I can articulate why. But I'm a big spidy
• 52:19
  Speaker 6: sense person. You know, my im media spidy sense was no, no, no,
• 52:22
  Speaker 6: don't do that, and I trust my gut. I think
• 52:28
  Speaker 6: there's there's because you know, because you're going to change
• 52:31
  Speaker 6: I mean, you know, you're going to change it, you're
• 52:33
  Speaker 6: going to rewrite it, you're going to evolve it. So
• 52:35
  Speaker 6: if you put it up and it's not just fucking amazing,
• 52:41
  Speaker 6: then you know, you kind of blow the opportunity to
• 52:47
  Speaker 6: really have it be this, you know, the best it
• 52:50
  Speaker 6: can be. I think, you know, because what if somebody
• 52:52
  Speaker 6: reads it today, but then tomorrow you do a rewrite,
• 52:55
  Speaker 6: that's just killer. But now they're not going to revisit
• 52:58
  Speaker 6: it because they already read it, you know, like it's
• 53:01
  Speaker 6: I don't know, it's just not something I would do.
• 53:03
  Speaker 6: I think that you're better off just queerying people and
• 53:08
  Speaker 6: or going to pitching events or entering contests and having
• 53:12
  Speaker 6: people request it to read it. That's that's me, you know.
• 53:20
  Speaker 5: No, I just you know, I just wanted to ask
• 53:22
  Speaker 5: since we were talking about it, and I heard somebody
• 53:25
  Speaker 5: once suggested.
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: That to me, and I was like, I don't know
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: about that. So that's why I kind of and.
• 53:31
  Speaker 6: I think if your spidey sense immediately says I don't
• 53:34
  Speaker 6: know about that, I think you have to just trust
• 53:35
  Speaker 6: that and not go with it, you know, not do it.
• 53:38
  Speaker 6: And sometimes you don't need like an absolute rational reason
• 53:42
  Speaker 6: why to do or not do something. Just trust your gut,
• 53:47
  Speaker 6: you know.
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I know what's exactly what you mean.
• 53:51
  Speaker 5: So, you know, Genie, I've we've been talking about for
• 53:53
  Speaker 5: about an hour. I've taken up a lot of your time.
• 53:57
  Speaker 5: So you're a busy first, I know, so you've like,
• 54:01
  Speaker 5: I gotta get writing.
• 54:03
  Speaker 6: Oh it's a nice break. Actually, it's totally fine.
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: Uh So is there anything that we that we have
• 54:11
  Speaker 3: a discussed that you will like to bring up?
• 54:14
  Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, I would like to say on a
• 54:17
  Speaker 6: little bit about social media and social media etiquette. I
• 54:23
  Speaker 6: think it's really really important when you're participating in social
• 54:27
  Speaker 6: media that you are mindful and respectful of people's time
• 54:33
  Speaker 6: and and and and really what you're there for, you know,
• 54:39
  Speaker 6: like you're there to connect, You're there to be social,
• 54:41
  Speaker 6: You're there to build a network and build a relationship.
• 54:45
  Speaker 6: So it's important for people to not be selfish online
• 54:51
  Speaker 6: and to be giving. And and you know, like what
• 54:56
  Speaker 6: you're doing with these podcasts, what I do with script chat,
• 54:59
  Speaker 6: what you know a lot of other people do, would
• 55:01
  Speaker 6: just simply you know, and obviously these are big platforms
• 55:04
  Speaker 6: that not everyone can wants to do and wants to
• 55:08
  Speaker 6: dedicate that kind of time. But even I'm talking just
• 55:11
  Speaker 6: as simple as you found a great article you want
• 55:13
  Speaker 6: to share with other writers, tweet it out, you know.
• 55:17
  Speaker 6: You know, if you meet if you meet people online
• 55:20
  Speaker 6: and you think this person might like say, say you
• 55:23
  Speaker 6: want to write a graphic novel, but you want to
• 55:25
  Speaker 6: have you need somebody who might you know, you might
• 55:28
  Speaker 6: need an artist, or you might need something else that
• 55:31
  Speaker 6: that they say, Oh, I know somebody who could help Dave,
• 55:33
  Speaker 6: you know, and then introduce those two people. You know,
• 55:35
  Speaker 6: it's it's it's not about you all the time, you know,
• 55:40
  Speaker 6: like it's it is about it's a community of people.
• 55:44
  Speaker 6: And and the best way to get the most value
• 55:48
  Speaker 6: out of that space is to be a giving person.
• 55:54
  Speaker 6: And it does, all it does truly come back to you.
• 55:57
  Speaker 6: And then every once in a while you're going to
• 55:59
  Speaker 6: need some help and you can say to somebody say, hey,
• 56:02
  Speaker 6: you know I want it. I'm doing a crowdfunding campaign
• 56:05
  Speaker 6: or I'm doing this, or I'm doing that. I could
• 56:06
  Speaker 6: use some help with this. People will be much more
• 56:08
  Speaker 6: likely to come and help you if you've been helpful
• 56:11
  Speaker 6: to other people. That's my two cents. And and just
• 56:15
  Speaker 6: don't suck like you know, I just be a good,
• 56:20
  Speaker 6: decent human being.
• 56:24
  Speaker 3: You know. It's funny.
• 56:24
  Speaker 5: I actually knew somebody who would take the Facebook every
• 56:28
  Speaker 5: time they had a problem with somebody, and they would
• 56:30
  Speaker 5: just like go into this person, and people all over
• 56:34
  Speaker 5: like what the hell is with that person?
• 56:36
  Speaker 3: Like why would you do that? Delete?
• 56:40
  Speaker 6: The delete tweet feature is a very good thing.
• 56:47
  Speaker 5: That's why I always try to make jokes or you know,
• 56:50
  Speaker 5: or networking. That's why I kind of social media if
• 56:53
  Speaker 5: if you notice, I stay out of politics completely.
• 56:56
  Speaker 6: I just talk about them at all.
• 56:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, there's just I don't think it's can do if
• 57:00
  Speaker 5: to any any sort of dialogue or anything. That's why
• 57:02
  Speaker 5: it's either self deprecating jokes at myself or like hey,
• 57:06
  Speaker 5: it's a useful piece of information, and then you know,
• 57:08
  Speaker 5: look at their one like oh, hey, I got this podcast.
• 57:10
  Speaker 5: I suck, but the guests don't, so it's yeah.
• 57:14
  Speaker 6: And I find that whenever people do talk about politicis,
• 57:17
  Speaker 6: even if it's even if it's my same political viewpoint,
• 57:20
  Speaker 6: they always it always pisses people off and people start
• 57:24
  Speaker 6: on following them and and you know it, and then
• 57:27
  Speaker 6: it's it's what is what is the point of that? Like,
• 57:31
  Speaker 6: first of all, why can't we all isn't this what
• 57:33
  Speaker 6: America is all about? That we all have different view
• 57:35
  Speaker 6: points of view? And why can't we celebrate that? Why
• 57:37
  Speaker 6: do people have to get so pissy about it? I
• 57:40
  Speaker 6: just don't want to engage in it because I find
• 57:42
  Speaker 6: it's just really really it ends up being biting and negative,
• 57:45
  Speaker 6: and that's not what I'm there for. I don't really honestly,
• 57:49
  Speaker 6: I don't really give a shit. Like, you know, everybody
• 57:52
  Speaker 6: can feel the way they want to feel, and they
• 57:54
  Speaker 6: have a right to feel they want to the way
• 57:55
  Speaker 6: they want to feel. But I don't have to feel
• 57:58
  Speaker 6: the way everyone else feels and everyone else to feel
• 58:00
  Speaker 6: the way I feel. Just like any advice I've given
• 58:02
  Speaker 6: today on screenwriting, there you know there's going to be
• 58:04
  Speaker 6: somebody who disagrees with it, And I'm totally fine with
• 58:07
  Speaker 6: that because I only speak from my experience as a screenwriter,
• 58:11
  Speaker 6: and so this has been my experience. Are there other
• 58:15
  Speaker 6: ways to break in? Are there other ways to get
• 58:16
  Speaker 6: a manager? Absolutely? You've got a friend who who knows somebody?
• 58:20
  Speaker 6: I mean, it's definitely like who you know, don't be
• 58:23
  Speaker 6: afraid to ask people, you know, do you know somebody
• 58:25
  Speaker 6: who might like the script? You know, ask your friends. Like,
• 58:28
  Speaker 6: there's so many different ways to go about it. There's
• 58:31
  Speaker 6: as many ways to break into the industry as there
• 58:33
  Speaker 6: are people. There's no one right way. And so I
• 58:37
  Speaker 6: think in social media people have to be open to
• 58:39
  Speaker 6: different viewpoints and different philosophies and different angles of breaking in.
• 58:44
  Speaker 6: And some people hate pitchfest. I love them. You know,
• 58:47
  Speaker 6: they worked for me, they haven't worked for other people.
• 58:50
  Speaker 6: Everybody's going to have a different experience. So I would
• 58:52
  Speaker 6: suggest to everyone that they just try dip their toe
• 58:56
  Speaker 6: in and try a whole bunch of different kinds of
• 58:58
  Speaker 6: things and see what feels organic and works for you
• 59:03
  Speaker 6: and then go with that.
• 59:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that sounds amazing. And also you put on the
• 59:08
  Speaker 5: point is there's a ton of different ways to break in,
• 59:11
  Speaker 5: and uh and You never really know who's watching on
• 59:14
  Speaker 5: social media too, because I mean, and you hear about that.
• 59:17
  Speaker 5: Uh uh, I don't see all the time, but you hear.
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: About them more frequently.
• 59:21
  Speaker 5: Is someone was found on Twitter or someone was found
• 59:24
  Speaker 5: on their blog, like uh, di Ablo Code was found
• 59:27
  Speaker 5: because of her blog.
• 59:28
  Speaker 6: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, yeah.
• 59:32
  Speaker 3: You know you never know. That's why I think stay
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: ways from two.
• 59:35
  Speaker 6: I think screenoaders really should have websites and have blogged
• 59:40
  Speaker 6: about something. I don't give a shit if you're blogging
• 59:41
  Speaker 6: about your cat, you know, just blog about something because
• 59:45
  Speaker 6: it helps people know that you can tell a story,
• 59:48
  Speaker 6: and even a story just in five hundred words or
• 59:52
  Speaker 6: whatever it is for the blog post. That makes them
• 59:54
  Speaker 6: more confident requesting your script if they see that you
• 59:57
  Speaker 6: can at least write and.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 4: and now back to the show.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 6: Be articulate and tell an engaging story, make them laugh,
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 6: make them cry, make them feel something. Plus practically, it
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 6: has all your contact information on it, Like, don't make
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 6: it hard for people to find you on Twitter. You know,
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 6: there's not there. There's not always people that if they
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 6: don't have a website, there's nowhere for people to really know,
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 6: like to get your email address or to you know,
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 6: so make it easy for executives to discover you, and
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 6: having a website is the best way to do it.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a good point because I've actually gotten a
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 5: ton of contacts through my contact form on my website
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 5: and yeah, yeah, so that's you know. And also it's
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 5: good because I can filter through all some of the stuff.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: Some of the stuff's usually like hey, Dave, I don't
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 5: know who you are and you don't know me, but
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 5: here's my crowdfunding campaign give me money.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 6: Like oh my god. Yes, you should see some of
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 6: the things I get in my email and book. But
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 6: we won't go there because that's a whole other we
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 6: should do like a Gen's mail bag.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 5: Anytime you want to come back, Genie, please let me know,
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 5: and we will do that. We will go through all
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 5: the different emails you get because actually that not only
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 5: is fascinating, but I think it would be educational as well.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 6: Yeah oh yeah, and we might need to be drinking
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 6: for that one.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: Why not.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm drinking coffee right now, but I'll switch
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: to like wild turkey one oh one.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 6: Or something perfect perfect my favorite.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: Do you like wild turkey.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I do love it. And you know what's really
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 6: great if you soak rollers in it.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, just really.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 6: Yes, poke little holes in the bottom of the rollers
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 6: and stick them in a shallow bowl and put wild
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 6: turkey in there. Oh it's great.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 5: You know, I've never I've never heard of that before,
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 5: but I'm gonna try it now. That's all I get
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 5: through wild turkey one on one because I got addicted
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 5: to the American Honey wild turkey because it's just so smooth.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 6: Oh yeah.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 5: And I had a Thanksgiving party with some friends and
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 5: they normally they're like, oh, we don't drink whiskey, and
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 5: I put them a little bit of the American Honey
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 5: wild turkey and they're like, oh my god, this is amazing.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 3: This tastes so good. I was like, yeah, it's smooth,
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: and you know, it's like my go to drink.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it's great, and we need that.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 5: We get too many emails about crowdfunding campaigns. I actually
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 5: just became a moderator of a board all called the
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 5: launch Board, and it's all about you know, tips and
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 5: tricks about crowdfunding and this and that. And one of
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 5: the rules that the person who who made it said
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 5: was do not post your crowdfunding campaign. He goes asking
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 5: for advice and trying to promote it are two different things.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 5: And he's like, you know, because he and I were
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 5: talking and he said he had to leave a bunch
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 5: of private groups on Facebook because of that. It was
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 5: just so many crowdfunding campaigns one after the other, and
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 5: You're like, this isn't even a group anymore. It's just
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 5: you know, like a it's a I'm getting marketed to,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 5: and just it's like spam, you know, So it.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 6: Is and it's and I you know, I did it
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 6: once for our short film Impass, and we reased over
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 6: fifteen thousand dollars. And I'm so so appreciative to everybody
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 6: who helped us with that. But I wouldn't I really,
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 6: If I never have to do another crowdfunding campaign again
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 6: in my life, I'll be thrilled. It's it's exhausting, it's
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 6: hard work, it's you know, it's and it's and I
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 6: don't know, I just I hope I never have to
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 6: do one again.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 5: Even I'm sorry, even people you know, I know who
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 5: had the quote unquote rich relatives, even they struggled. I'm
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 5: not saying, you know, if Famine's listening, I'm not saying
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 5: not to do it because you as you know, I've
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 5: had a ton of guests on the recent background.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 6: Find so incredible. It's an incredible reason. And there's some
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 6: incredible platforms to to do crowdfunding now you know Seed
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 6: and Spark. I mean, there's still many great, great platforms
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 6: for people to help independent filmmakers get the money to
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 6: make their dreams come true. I mean, I think crowdfunding
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 6: is great. I have no problem with it. I'm just saying,
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 6: as somebody to do it, it's it's it's a lot
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 6: of work. Oh yeah, absolutely, you earn everything, you know,
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 6: a lot of work.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah, oh absolutely, It definitely is a lot of work.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 5: That's what always calls people on before they start one.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 5: I always say, and you know, this is going to
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 5: be a lot of work. This is going to be like, oh,
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 5: I'm going to send one tweet out and suddenly I'm
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 5: going to be, you know, rolling in six figures.
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 6: But you see, it's all comes down to the don't
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 6: suck because if you stuck on social media, no one
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 6: is going to want to help you in your crowdfunding campaign.
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 6: I mean, you know it's and you can't think about
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 6: that after the fact. Just to think about that from
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 6: day one, when you start tweeting or start connecting with
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 6: people online, you have to always be mindful of that.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 6: Like I say to my kids, you know, don't say,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 6: don't you know, put anything out there that you wouldn't
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 6: want to see on the front page of the newspaper.
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 6: I just happened to be very comfortable with seeing anything
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 6: other front's that. I'm not very guarded, you know, online,
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 6: but I think some people should be a little more
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 6: guarded than they are.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 5: I think we all have friends like that where it's like,
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 5: maybe you should take that tweet down. Maybe it's not
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 5: you know, you're trying to get investors for your film
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 5: and he's and he was, you know, tweeting about random
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 5: stuff that could be taken very out of context. Oh yeah,
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 5: but but Geenie, this has been awesome having you on
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 5: where Oh thank you, you know again, Like if you
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 5: want to come back on, please let me know because
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 5: I would love to do the Jenny's mail bag, Jeanie's
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 5: mail bag, and you know, we go through all the
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 5: crazy emails.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 6: Take a file for that, like the great.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 5: Uh so Genie, where can people find you at?
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 6: If you go to Genie vb V as in victorbisboy
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 6: dot com, there's a contact page there that has all
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 6: the different ways you can stalk me and all different
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 6: social media outlets and my email address as well, And careful,
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 6: careful if you email me, you might end up on
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 6: the show exactly.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah, don't suck and write something crazy. And I'm going
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 5: to link to that in the show notes, and as well,
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 5: I'm going to put a link to everyone to find
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 5: her script maag articles because as we've talked about, Genie
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 5: writes the Balls of Steel and.
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 3: She has a wonderful, wonderful articles in there that can
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 3: help you out.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 5: Thank you everyone for listening Genie, thanks are for coming on,
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 5: and if you anything, always give.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 3: Me a holler.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 6: Thanks, thanks for having me.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 3: Dave, oh my pleasure. All right, have a good day
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 3: you too, Take care bye, Bllie.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at Indy on muscle
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: dot com Forward slash eight sixty three and if you
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: have it already, please head over to Filmmaking podcast dot com, subscribe.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 3: And leave a good review for the show.
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 4: It really helps us out a lot, guys.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 3: Thank you again so much for listening to guys.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 4: As always, keep that hustle going, keep that dream alive,
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 4: Stay safe out there, and I'll talk to you soon.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle Podcast at
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: indiefilm hustle dot com. That's I N D I E
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: F I L M h U S T l E
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: dot com.