Latest / Giving Pain Purpose with Lyndsay Soprano / Eliminating High Voltage Anxiety
Transcript
- This is your pain game podcast where we discuss chronic pain and trauma >> Lyndsay Soprano: This is your pain game podcast, where we talk about the game of living in and with chronic pain and trauma getting to the heart of how to heal. I am your host, Lyndsay Soprano. On this show, I plan on discussing with doctors, chronic pain patients, holistic practitioners, loved ones, and anybody that is interested in having their voice heard in the chronic pain and trauma world that we live in. So I am an Olympic gold medal champion of anxiety. I mean, I can do anxiety upside down on a balance beam, falling off of a balance beam, tumbling on the floor, ice skating, skiing, dancing, whatever. Maybe even a little break dancing. However, I think that I would be better than Australia. I was a little bit disappointed in their performance, but, you know, anxiety to someone that hasn't truly experienced the debilitation that it causes in a person's life, not just, like, our day to day stuff, but, like, our heart and our soul. I feel like you guys must think it's fake if you haven't experienced it. And I can say, and so can my guest in a little bit say it is not fake, but, like, who would have anxiety about labels not facing out or colors not being coordinated, or just the sheer dread of what has already happened in your life that you cannot fix, but feel in some odd way that you could? And so now let's worry about that. Something that's already happened that you have no control over anymore, and then more dread of what might happen in two minutes from now that might be unexpected, that you might have to adjust your entire day because of something unknown that for sure is looming in the dark corners of the next two minutes. And then worry about what might happen after those two minutes. If the thing you were dreading didn't happen, you wonder why and worry about that, but then have to focus on the next two minutes you're dreading while worrying about the past two minutes. This is my brain. This is how I have been since I was nine years old. And, it kind of makes me feel a little crazy. And I think those of us that have experienced this type of anxiety have felt that way, that have led to panic attacks. And, you know, one of the things that I have done to try and fight the anxiety beast, if you will, was to keep really, really busy, always, always busy, always having things to do. An overachiever and also an olympic people pleaser. I mean, anything that I could do to. To keep myself as busy as possible, to overachieve as much as I could, that was how I handled that anxiety beast. And I, you know, I allowed it to control every facet of my life, and most specifically in my business, I was wonderfully successful. I am successful. But with that success came my illness. It is. Right. We've got diagnoses now and in so many different departments, mental, emotional, and 100% physical. My body has taken a toll from what I have done to it through anxiety. Right. And so during the process of talking to you guys for the past couple of years, I've learned a lot about who I truly am. and I never thought that I had this much to uncover within me about why this anxiety has just sat here and eaten me alive and controlled me. So enough is enough of this anxiety. You know, guys, I'm done with it. I've been working on it in a couple different ways, but we're going to dig in today with a really awesome dude that I have for you guys today. So I want to talk about how we can all come together and reduce, if not entirely eliminate, our anxiety and change that hot fuel into something a little bit more cooler and a little bit more sweeter and maybe get some peace and quiet within all of this noise. I know my brain is a completely noisy place, so. All right, get your ear holes ready because, And crank up the volume because we are ready to rock with this guy. So, without further ado, I would like to introduce you to my guest today, John Graham. John spent 20 years battling anxiety and panic attacks using unconventional techniques Hello, darling. >> John Graham: Wow, what an honor and revealing. Yeah, intro. Love that. I'm happy to be here to share, you know, my crazy story, too, of the very similar experience, but, yeah, happy. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, it's pretty nuts of the things that you've gone through in order to curb your enthusiasm of anxiety. So let me introduce you real quick, and then we'll hop right into it. So John is a three time USA memory champion, and we're going to talk about that. A grandmaster of memory entrepreneur, and he also mentors high performers on all different levels. Right. He has performed insane mental feats on tv shows all over the world with over 400 million viewers watching. Talk about anxiety and panic. I just get hot and sticky thinking about that. He overcame daily panic attacks and decades of anxiety by using unconventional methods to release suppressed emotions and release the control conditioning of his mind. He spent 20 plus years trying mental tactics and treatments to battle his chronic anxiety and panic attacks. That, didn't work when he realized the real root was emotional, it took him a few months to release a few months to release his chronic anxiety and panic attacks for good. So I am rolling out the red carpet for you, babe, and like to quick talk about what the heck a memory champion is and how that kind of has led into playing into overcoming your panic attacks and anxiety. And let's take it from there. >> John Graham: Yeah. memory athlete, as we like to call ourselves, right? We're athletic. We have trained our minds. Like, ten years ago, I literally read a book on this. So it's called moonwalking with Einstein. Talks about mental techniques. You may have heard of the memory palace. You may have heard of visualization and linking and all those cool things. You can use your mind to remember massive amounts of information. So, for example, I once memorized 229 names and faces in 15 minutes. I once memorized a deck of cards. I looked at a deck of cards, shuffled all 52 cards in order for 21 and a half seconds, and knew the full order, all using technique. Like, I was not born this way, not natural. So I learned that. I went into that world. I trained for years. I competed at competitions where we memorized numbers, names, words, all these kind of cool things, and won three national titles along with. >> Lyndsay Soprano: And so that desire to gain more knowledge and to be this overachiever, where did that come from? Within you. Because I know where it came from within me. Certainly not the mental feats, but I have mental feats in a different way. >> John Graham: Yeah, we're all just shaped, in different ways by our conditioning, our upbringing. You know, it's not a right or wrong, but the way we intake, like, the first seven years of our life, especially. We're a sponge. Our brain is in a theta wave, theta wave state. So we're like a sponge. We absorb everything. We absorb what people tell us, what our parents say when they disconnect from us or disapprove, you know, we feel into that, and we form our whole concept of reality that way. So at the very, very root, most people who are listening this have a. Have a core wound of I'm, not enough, or this is not enough. Meaning this trophy behind me is not enough. I need another one. That money is not enough. I need more. That house is not enough. I need more. And we're always trying to satiate that not enoughness through accomplishment, through attainment. And it's, as, you know, it doesn't satiate it. It's ephemeral. It just lasts momentarily. But we're always using that as our mechanism for happiness, when, in fact, that can never be satiated. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. I mean, keeping up to the Joneses is, like, a legit thing. And, I mean, I came from two very well off households. I am engaged to a very well off man. We're well off in our family. We're doing. But we've worked. We work like monsters to do what we do, and then at the end of the day, we're like, well, that was exhausting. And we didn't even enjoy any of the things that we needed to be enjoying because we were busy trying to make more money or trying to get more things or get the bigger house or get the better car, all of that. And does it make us a little happier? Sure. But does it make you happy? No, not. Not in my opinion. At least not from my experience. Certainly hasn't helped me with anxiety, because, for me, wanting to be a, ah, people being a people pleaser and being an overachiever, that and of itself, those two things combined is like a bomb. You know, it explodes. When one thing goes wrong in my world, I tend to freak out a little bit about, I'm far better than I used to be. But, thanks, Lexapro. I finally got myself on an anti anxiety drug, and I can tell difference This episode brought to you by Lexapro. No, but I mean, literally, I finally got myself on an anti anxiety drug, and I can definitely tell the difference, but I don't want to be on it. I hate it. I don't do the drug thing. But it got to the point that I thought I was having a nervous breakdown, like, nine months ago. I was like, I cannot take on any more than what I am doing. M and I am just defeated. >> John Graham: I've been there. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, I know you have. How long did you suffer from anxiety and panic attacks before you were cured So, can we talk about when did your panic attacks and your anxiety start? >> John Graham: I didn't know it was anxiety. for the longest time, that was normal, just the way I operated. First, panic attacks, anxiety attacks probably happened back in 2021. So about three years ago, you know, I was at a family event, at a Christmas event, and I walked out where everyone was. It was this big gymnasium, and all of a sudden, I got this overwhelming, like, adrenaline surge, and I felt like I couldn't explain it. Like, something was off, something was really critically wrong, and I. All I wanted to do was run out and, like, leave. Like, it was like, this doom, impending doom. Like, something was just, you know, and it can range from, like, a mild sense of, like, something's wrong and you tense up and you're in fear. So all the way, like, to, I'm going to drop dead and die right now, because sometimes it mimics, like, heart attacks. Like, a couple times, my arm tightened up and my chest tightened up, and I thought I was having a heart attack, and my blood pressure and my heart rate, and I start feeling dizzy. And you feel like you're going to die. Like you're looking at your loved ones like, this is it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: This is it. >> John Graham: One time, the left side of my face went completely numb. And I'm like, okay, I'm having a stroke, you know? And, yeah, I went to the ER, like, three different times, you know, like. And every time they're like, by the time I got there, I had calmed down. It was better, but they couldn't figure out what was wrong. I did all the tests, all the ekgs, all the brain scans, like the mris, all that stuff, and nothing was wrong. But I was experiencing some intense physical symptoms. That's why, like, people who think anxiety is fake, what they really see is like, oh, it's a mental thing, right? Anxiety. There's a distinction here. We're not talking about, oh, I'm nervous for a test. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Right? >> John Graham: That's a normal nervousness worry that every single human being on the face of the planet experience. We're talking about the dread waking up with it every day, never being able to shake it, always thinking of future events and things that are going to happen and trying to play everything out in your mind. Right? And it's awful. >> Lyndsay Soprano: It's more than awful. You explained that very, very well because I shared that same. It feels like an elephant sitting on your chest. I'm clammy, I'm sweating, sweaty. I feel like I just have to pace around. Like I have absolutely no control of my thoughts, my feelings, my emotions. I feel like I'm a little bit loony, you know? And I'm like, there's no way I can live like this. There's no way I'm gonna live like this. I can do pain all day long. Physical pain, anxiety. Oh, my God, it's far worse to me than any kind of physical pain I've ever been in. And I live in it 24 hours a day, you know? So how long did you. Because I know that you're cured, if you will, now, but how long did you suffer from anxiety and panic attacks before you started to really realize, holy shit, like, I got to get my fucking act together and figure out what's going on with me. >> John Graham: Yeah, I mean, anxiety was building over the course of probably 20 years, probably since I was 13. Was it really started? It got way worse, like, within the last four years. so this is actually very recent. So 2021 panic attacks are happening maybe every couple of months, enough to notice them, but, like, okay, they're gone, and then forget about them. Then they started happening daily multiple times a day. It got so bad. Like, I couldn't go downstairs and be with my daughters. I couldn't sit at the dinner table. Every single time I did something, I felt the surge of adrenaline through me and just. I'm upstairs all the time, avoiding my family, avoiding going out, avoiding all this stuff. Just a prisoner. It was awful. And that's the moment where I completely, like, realized every single thing that I was trying to do to solve this was not working. It's like the moment you have a heart attack. In that moment, you change. You're never the same because you're going to do things differently. You've hit rock bottom. You're going to change your diet, your health, everything. Same thing with panic. I'm like, I just said, what I am doing is not working. All this mental gymnastics, technique, meditations, all this stuff is not helping. So what is the root? And it's like divine timing. All of a sudden, I'm starting getting these answers because I'm open to it. It's an emotional root issue. It's not. We treat it as mental health, mental performance, which. That's a part of it. But the core root, that deep, deep root, is suppressed emotions. So if we address that not through the mind, we release those, we alchemize those, we integrate that. We overcome it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, because when you're talking about mainstream methods, not. Not having any success with it, I agree. I mean, I've done all of the things, the meditations, the books, the breathing, the breath work, the this, the that. I mean, all kinds of, you know, yoga retreats and this retreat and ayurvedic this. And, I mean, it's like, oh, my. To the point that all of that stuff started causing me anxiety, because not only am I trying to do all of these new things and take on new techniques and being the over cheer that I am feeling like I'm a failure because I'm not doing them right, I might. I've got to not be doing them right. I'm doing something wrong here that I'm not feeling better. And I've done that loop over and over and over again. And when I was talking earlier about how I thought, like, I'm like, honey, I don't even know. Like, I. You might need to put me away for 30 days right now, because I am losing my marbles right now. And it wasn't because I was crazy. It was because I, Because of this anxiety that just sits on me like it's just preying on me, you know, the albatross. It feels very heavy for me. It does. So you end up going through all these different methods. When you have anxiety, you immediately want to get rid of it Do you mind talking about a couple of those that you tried? briefly? Because that would be great, because I know a lot of us are like, yeah, I've been there. I've done that. But it'd be interesting to see, hear what you've tried. >> John Graham: Yeah. When you have anxiety, you immediately want to get rid of it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: And that's the issue, is we try to get rid of it. So what we do, let's say you're in a moment of anxiety. What do we normally do? We try to get out of it. We try to calm ourselves down through a guided meditation or a walk. We watch a Netflix show. We scroll on our phone. No judgment, by the way, because I've done all these things, right? We're humans. We try to drink, we try to, whatever, smoke weed. That's something I never did, by the way. But, you know, we do. To feel better. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yes. >> John Graham: Right? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yes. >> John Graham: We escape it. Well, that perpetuates. Because what we're doing is this stuff is coming up and we go, oh, this is scary. We shove it back down. We literally suppress it. We keep it in. We tense up, we hold it in for later. We think we're. >> Lyndsay Soprano: I'll deal with that later. >> John Graham: Yeah. Yeah. We're thinking it's gone because our mind's gone. We cleared maybe for a moment, but really it's just more. It's suppressed. It's going to become louder. The can is kicked down the road, and now there's two cans you're kicking down the road. Right. It just accumulates. So I tried. I did meditations, I tried the medication route. Realized really quick I didn't want to do that. Just, you know, stop. High blood pressure medicine, supplements, nootropics, like the mind, you know, journaling, like therapeutic reframes, positive thinking, hypnosis. All this stuff. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, yeah, all stuff. >> John Graham: Every single thing. And none of that can touch it. None of that can touch the real root. You're trying to. You're trying to manipulate and reframe and entrain the mind using your mind. Well, your mind has a programming and you're trying to reprogram, and you're programming within your programming. It's just a mess. Right? You said you're exhausted just thinking about it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Totally about it. It falls. >> John Graham: Yeah. We're trying to use force and control to solve a force and control problem, and it's not going to work. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. Yeah. >> John Graham: So we have to go deeper than that. >> Lyndsay Soprano: So in order to do that deep diving stuff, and I hate to use that, it's very corporate America, let's deep dive into this, because. But we do need to do that. and I think that's. That it's a scary place when people think about, oh, I've got to get down to the root cause of things. that's one thing that this show has forced me to do. it is literally, in fact, I recorded on another show. I was a guest on another show, last week. I shared things I've never shared with anybody, including my spouse. And I emailed her afterwards because I couldn't sleep that night. Cause I was like, shit, I am not ready. I'm not ready. I'm not ready. But at least I was. She goes, but you're ready. You said it. And I'm like, okay, well, now I gotta think about it. So she and I have been emailing back and forth. My anxiety is totally raised about something that happened to me that I haven't shared with anybody before. But the show kind of forces me to be raw and honest and get to the root of, why I'm sitting in a wheelchair for half of my life, why I can't walk my dogs, why I can't walk barefoot. Blah, blah, blah, on and on and on. And I believe wholeheartedly that so much of that is trauma that sits on our bodies. You know, we talk about it all the time on the show. The book. The body keeps the score. Your mind is part of your body, guys. Your brain is part of that, so it keeps the score. And our hearts also hold memory and hold score as well. Yeah. What have you done to get to where you are now So I want to get into moving into now. What have you done to get to where you are now? What's your secret sauce? I mean, we don't want to give it all away, but we've got to give a little bit of it away. and as to why our bodies hold on to things and why our heart holds on to memory the way that it does. >> John Graham: Yeah. that's the key. So suppress the motions. Every single moment of your life that you didn't handle still inside of you Let's talk about this. Every single moment of your life that you didn't handle still inside of you. That's an impression. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Fuck, yeah. >> John Graham: Yep. >> Lyndsay Soprano: It was nice knowing you, John. Thank you so much for joining the show. >> John Graham: I know that's a hard truth to swallow. It's like, it is. It's unresolved. And people can call it trauma. I never like that word because it's got all kinds of things. We have suppressed impressions or experiences that are still inside of us, that haunt us, that bother us, right? They shape the way we are. But the thing is, is if we experience those feelings, we can process them out for good, the way they were intended to. Just like, this conversation, we're flowing through it. Like, you're not hung up on, like, one little thing of it, just marinating on it. you're just, like, letting the conversation flow. That's the way life should be. Just like, you're driving down the road and you see trees. They should come in, go out, come in, go out. But we hold on to things, and we push them away internally because we can't handle the voltage. It's uncomfortable. It's a heartbreak. It's embarrassing. Those moments, those feelings never get fully processed out. And they store inside of us, inside of our bodies. But what do we do when this uncomfortable energy happens? We tense up. What that tension does is it holds it in. It doesn't allow it to move. We halted. So people with anxiety are extremely tense. Like, shoulders, back of the head, tension, headache. Right? Tense, tense, tension. Tension holds that in. And so the first thing you have to realize is, number one, we have to regulate that nervous system. People are obsessed with their brain, but forgetting their nerves. Their whole nervous system is a part of that function. Releasing the tension of our nervous system. But releasing the tension of our muscles will allow this voltage to start moving through naturally. Like, we don't need to force it. We don't need to, like, do breath work to force it out of us, because, again, that just is force and manipulation. We need to let go, literally let go of our muscles, let go of the control of our breathing. And that entrains our body to start letting go of this voltage and allowing us to handle it. So I teach a very simple process where people literally lay down, shut their eyes, let go of, and I guide people through this. Let go of all the muscles, head to toe, head to toe. Very specific muscles. Letting go of the control of their breathing, letting go of the control of their mind. Because when you start letting go, the body can do what it needs to do. Like, we get in the way so much, we don't even realize. >> Lyndsay Soprano: No kidding. Yeah, get out of your own way. I love that line. Yes. >> John Graham: The body knows what to do. It has a supreme intelligence like my wife just had. We just had our third daughter. She's right. Pregnant for nine months. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Real power. >> John Graham: She. Yeah, she didn't make that baby. Meaning, everyone's going, oh, what are you talking about, John? You're a man, like what? No, listen, she didn't, like, make that arm and make the blood vessel, like, with her mind, she didn't effort it. She didn't, like, manifest it. Like, she let. She ate the food and her body made it beautifully. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: Same thing happens, like, naturally, if we get out of our own way and we. Our body can heal anxiety, can release all this wonderful stuff. So I teach people that first step is you have to, have to, have to have an optimized, regulated nervous system. That's mandatory. >> Lyndsay Soprano: And it absolutely is. One of the things that I struggle with in meditation is controlling anxiety Yeah. Well, the laying down thing and the breathing and controlling it, one of the things that I struggle with in meditation and breath work, especially when I, like, I do a lot of it in my sauna, but I read when I sauna and I've got meditation music going on usually. So I read, I'm a multitasker, you know, I got to get a bunch of shit done in my sauna every morning. Of course I do. But one of the things that, with. When I just lay down, like, in my bed, and I turn on some kind of a meditation to calm my anxiety, all I'm focusing on is I should be breathing the way that they're telling me to breathe, and I need to be doing that right now. And, oh, I forgot about that. And, now I'm thinking about a shopping list, and then I'm coming back and I'm, like, doing all of those things that it's to the point that it almost gives me anxiety doing it, which is so counterintuitive, you know? But I'm like, oh, great, I gotta lay down for ten minutes. What the hell am I gonna do for ten minutes right now? Like, that is intense. >> John Graham: It's intense. Yeah. The legend. >> John Graham: Because you want to be busy, your mind is over dominant. It needs to do something. It always needs to do something. Needs to do it. Right. Right in the mind. Yeah. That's why people think it's a mental issue. But yeah, it's deeper than that. Why? Why do we need to do something? Right? Because you're avoiding a feeling inside of you that could arise if you say the wrong thing in an email. If that podcast gets out, you're afraid of what someone will say because it will poke something inside of you. in a nasty feeling. It's always the feeling. It's not the. >> Lyndsay Soprano: It is. Yeah. And also, I think that when, my fear, I know, sounds totally like what I know that a lot of people that listen to my show, I get emails from them that something triggered them and I mean, we put in our, you know, our disclaimers in the beginning of episodes and all that stuff, and I had to, like, step outside of me and go. I'm not here to trigger anybody. Of course not. We're here having this conversation, if you need to step away from it, that, I can't control how you're going to respond to something that you hear. And that's something fairly new with me that I've been trying to, and I even say it to other people, I'm like, don't worry about what anybody else thinks. I. About how you do something, how they respond to it is not your problem. It is not. But that's always been me. That's the people pleasing part of my anxiety, too, is, well, I need to make sure that everybody's good to go and everybody's all tucked in perfectly in life. And then I'll work on my bullshit, which causes anxiety, because then I'm behind on things that I should have been doing for myself. And then it's the slippery slope, and it goes over and over and over again. And then I wake up in the morning and I do it all over again. >> John Graham: Yeah. We're told all these, you know, beautiful piece of advice. Like, don't worry what people think, but it doesn't help because mentally we understand it. But internally, our body's like, honey. Yeah. We don't feel that way. Right. So it's like instant resistance when we do that. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: Like, I'm not going to care what people think of me, but internally you're like, That's scary. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, my God. Yeah. >> John Graham: Yeah. So that creates a lot of resistance, a lot of anxiety. Right. That's why it's always stacked. When you're feeling anxiety, what do you typically do And so let's talk about this deeper for a second. When you're feeling anxiety, what do you typically do? You do something to calm down or avoid it or escape it. Right. That's what all the mainstream methods want you to do. We want to do the exact opposite. If you're willing to go there and release it, turn around and face it. The feeling, that awful, dreaded feeling. Because again, these are feelings, impressions that are inside of us, that once they're arising, if we process them, if we feel them, they're gonna process out for good. So I just said I'm diving into this pool of pain, right? Emotional pain, letting everything up, feeling it all. I mean, that's the short, abbreviated version. It's very hard to do, mostly because of the mind. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, no kidding. >> John Graham: Not so much the body. You can handle pain. Like you said, it's the mind that gets in the way of this issue. And that's what I have to help people move through is that conditioning of, fear and of like, oh my gosh, I need to be productive and is this working? And, like, I got better stuff to do. I don't want to do this, all this stuff, but really, we have to feel all the stuff. Once it comes up and you feel anxiety, instead of scrolling on your phone or listening to God in meditation to calm you down, let's just be in that sensation as much as possible. Immerse yourself in that. Because that's just. That's literally what's arising is the moment you were in third grade when everyone laughed at you for giving the wrong answer. You know, for as example, you're not anxious because of the email that you just received or the podcast conversation you just had. The feeling that's arising is an old feeling from the past that we keep shoving back down or an accumulation of overwhelming amounts of things. Like, you're being poked on many levels. That's what overwhelm is. Overwhelm is when you get pokede by so many things that bother you, that all this stuff is, like, arising and you can't handle you literally, your capacity to handle things, it can't. It overflows. You can't handle it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Man, it really is amazing how quickly we can derail ourselves. because that overwhelm, it's like it's just a fight. It feels like it's a fire hose. Like, there's absolutely no possible way I can do every single thing and take care of everybody and make everybody happy, including myself. And, that's. Some people, like my dad has always said, some of the most wonderful things about you, Lyndsay, are your worst traits. >> John Graham: God, I used to be overwhelmed all the time. >> Lyndsay Soprano: All the time. >> John Graham: So exhausting. It's anxiety written all over it. But, yeah, it's like trying to do everything. That's the superficial part. But internally, what's happening is that email bothered, you poked. Now you're angry. Then someone didn't clean up the table, and now poked, you're angry. And then I. Now you, like, you know, like, all this stuff just keeps jabbing you. And what that is, is the old stuff is like, now it's swirling and we can't handle it. We're not dealing with it. We're trying to avoid it, we're trying to escape it. And it's like, it's there, right? yeah. >> Lyndsay Soprano: And it's something that happened to us when we were, like, 14 or 19 or something that we stuffed, and then something that's similar to that, we're like, oops, I'm not ready to deal with that. So I'm going to stuff that guy down. And then you just keep stuffing and stuffing and stuffing, and this is all. This is people's stuff, whether they're rebellious people or not. All right, so we all do it. Yeah, we all do it. So don't you be patting yourself on the back thinking that you're just perfect, okay? I would. Perfect is boring. Nobody wants to be perfect. But, You talk about letting go of anxiety and letting your capacity expand So, okay, so we. So you sit down, and you get people to lay down, and they start working when you're working with them, about, like, getting there, that initial, like, what's bringing that anxiety up and letting it go. So can you talk a little bit about more the steps that you go through? Again, just the surface, because I want people to come to you. >> John Graham: Fully regulated nervous system, fully optimized nervous system. So we don't do anything with the mind. I literally, every day, once or twice, have people do this. I have a track that I've recorded. My voice is very, like, soothing and powerful to walk you through it, so you don't have to think about anything. And I don't want you thinking about anything. But you lay down, and I literally walk you through how to release tension. Like, tension you've held in your body for decades. You might not realize it. Letting go, letting go, letting go. Letting go of the control of your breath. Cause we like to, like, calm ourselves with deep breaths. There's nothing wrong with that, by the way. But we let go of that. We let go of that. We let go of our mind, not push away our mind. There's a huge difference. I don't want you, like, pushing away your thoughts. We let go of all this control, and that entrains you to start this process of letting go. Like, this is the how to of letting go. You do it physically first, and that releases the tensions that you've held for decades, which store all the suppressed emotions in your body, which gum up your nervous system and, like, clamp it down. And that's why you might even feel, you know, like, neurological pain or numbness. Right, I did. It releases. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Ding ding. >> John Graham: Yeah. So you start releasing. That's the first step is you regulate your nervous system because your body has a supreme intelligence. That's the first step. >> Lyndsay Soprano: When you get through that first part, what comes next? Because I feel like the next step is where I have anxiety about it. the first part of what you're talking about, I'm already there with releasing and talking and opening up and facing demons and facing bad decisions or bad things that happened to me that I had no control over. I've been doing that for now, about two years, really heavily over the past nine to twelve months. but I'm scared to hear what m the next step is because that's me. >> John Graham: The next thing is, I call it the unhooking method. This is a method, and I called it that a long time ago. I would probably call it something else now. I tend to call it now. I'm switching the messaging to call it collecting your potential. Because here's what's happening when a negative emotion arises. Anxiety, frustration, embarrassment, fear, whatever, are feeling a negative emotion, right? Again, we're conditioned to do the opposite of what we should do. We run from it or we push it away trying to feel better. We want to be in that because every time you're poked, that is a portal, so to speak, that opens up for your potential. That's where, you know, I talked about capacity. Here's. I'm holding up a. A yeti mug, right? This is your capacity. This is all you can handle in life. You can only handle 200 liters. I don't even know. You can only handle this much emotional voltage. If you go over, you're done, you're exhausted, you're drained, right? And they overflow daily. So your capacity is limited. But if you turn around and sink into those feelings, you process out those emotions just by being in that sensation, you're going to start expanding your capacity because you're accumulating parts of you that were lost or suppressed or fractured. So you're accumulating more and more capacity to handle life because you're neutralizing all of this stuff that used to bother you. You're neutralizing all of this emotional reactivity, right? Neutralizing means, like here is a zero instead of a negative charge to all these experiences. You now have a zero charge. It doesn't affect you. You're unbotherable by these things now because you processed out what was holding you in that we don't do that mentally. We just simply sink into that feeling. I mean, that's. You have to relax and allow it to happen. Right? I walk people through that because it sounds really simple. But the hardest part that everyone has the first two weeks when we do this is the mind gets in the way. And because we're trained, I have stuff to do. I don't have time for this. How long is this last? How much is in here? Like, am I doing this? Right? That was your big thing. Am I doing this? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: The mind will get in the way of everything. So the mind isn't the issue. It's just. It's just in the way. So I teach you how to do that because those two things combined when I'm, Every day, you're relaxing your muscles, letting go of the control of your breath, letting go of your mind, you're training yourself to start letting go. So every time something visceral comes up, instead of reacting or running from it, you're like, wow, I'm going to relax and handle this. I'm going to relax and handle this. You start handling the low hanging fruit. You're going to able to start handle more and more and more voltage, and you start accumulating more capacity, and you neutralize all of this suppressed emotion that was once inside of you that was causing the anxiety and all these feelings of overwhelm and everything that's affecting you. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. And I think a lot of us that have been dealing with, quote unquote, our mental illness in anxiety world, right, we go through our cognitive behavioral therapy, we talk to our therapist, we do all the talk therapy. I mean, all I'm doing is talking about the same shit over and over and over again. Four years later, you still have the same therapy sessions with your therapist Let's be real. Like, it's the same stuff. So I'm still having the same conversation with my therapist four years later. I am not processing anything that has happened to me in any way, shape, or form that I'm still having the same conversation. Is every session the same? No. But is there absolutely a common thread throughout all of it? 100%. And so, like, I've kind of backed out on a little bit of that because I was feeling like all I was doing was tearing up Benji's because I'm like, bro, I'm here every week, and I'm having the same conversation. My anxiety is almost getting higher because, we're really not getting to the root of where all of this is actually coming from. And I'm not afraid of, not living in anxiety. But it's been such a partner, even though a bad dance partner, you know, but terrible dance partner, stepping on my feet, tripping me, making me fall on the dance floor, they're still my partner, and I know nothing other than that. When you release suppressed emotions, does anxiety dissipate as well So when you're releasing this suppression and you're releasing all these emotions, does that relationship that you've had with anxiety dissipate as well, because that's my number one relationship that I've had in my life. Is with anxiety the best marriage I've ever had because it's been the most consistent. You know, how does, how do you approach that topic? >> John Graham: Well, when you start facing these things energetically or emotionally, like, just feeling the feelings out of the mind, you're going to change. Like, you're going to, you are going to see the world differently. You're going to see things you couldn't see before. And I know that sounds like woo woo and what? It magically? >> Lyndsay Soprano: No, it doesn't. >> John Graham: It's like a magical thing, but it's like, you will see just like, the clarity you get from, like, oh, my gosh. Like, I was like this my whole life. I was guilt tripping people and I was manipulative. Like, for me, right? You see it, but you also don't. It doesn't affect you like it did. Like, oh, my gosh, I'm a bad person because you start stepping back from the mind here. Let's talk about the mind for a second. You're not your mind, you're not your thoughts. You're not the, shoulds and need to do and have to do and guilt and all that. The thoughts, that's a construct. You're the awareness behind the mind now. That's woo woo, right? But you changed. You change completely. You expand instead of contracting areas that you're just staying in cycles. You're in the washing machine. Like, I'm going to be very bold here, talking about the cognitive therapy. I'm glad you're realizing that's not working. And I'm glad for people listening. Get out of that if that resonates with you. Cause you can't resolve this through the mind. It's great to understand where this stuff comes from. I'm not saying cognitive therapy is wrong, but it will not resolve this. Your mind cannot resolve this. I'm a mind champion. I love, I, freaking love the mind. Listen to me. It can't. It's not the final frontier. It's limited. >> Lyndsay Soprano: I love you. You are. I mean, your brain is so incredibly powerful. And m, we always say, well, the mind brain connection, the body mind, all of that, all the connectivity between that. Do you believe in that? And the mind and body connection to a certain extent. The hardest part is letting go of identity, which is the mind Okay, good. Just wanted to see where you were on that. Because for sure, the mind over matter thing, that tagline has been overused so many times, and do I have the capacity to do mind over matter, 100%. The kind of pain that I live in, in order for me to do my daily what I do and walk around the way that I do, even when I'm in excruciating pain like I am, right now, while we're doing this, I mind over matter it in order to show up. And I know that that's how I've done life my whole life. And there are times where, like I said earlier, there are wonderful things about me, and those same things that are wonderful about me are also horrible about me. And so trying to level that, that playing field out between that person that does wonderful things, that also ends up being horrible for her, I've got to figure that whole thing out and where that came into play. I think I know when it happened. I was very young, but I'm not 100% sure. And that's something that I'm ready to lay down and let go of. You know, I am. There's an element of me that's a little bit scared because, like I mentioned, I'm used to that girl. I'm used to that person sitting here on my shoulder, weighing me down. Like, what am I going to do if I feel like a balloon flying into the sky now that she's gone? You know, that's a little bit scary. In fact, there was an episode I did very, very long time ago. I don't know, first couple of months of me doing this show, and we had talked about, she had asked me a question, and it's not verbatim, but she said, what are you going to do when you don't live in pain anymore? And I was like, well, shit, I don't know. Like, do I have to stop my podcast? Absolutely not. You know, like, there were things like, well, I lived like this now for almost a decade, and who am I going to be without that pain? Who am I going to be without that anxiety? Who am I going to be without those panic attacks? That is something that I have to deal with on my own. So did you feel similar to that when you started to like, ooh, I might be onto something? Did you feel like you were going to be losing a part of yourself? I know you said that you legitimately changed, but you're still John, but there's just elements of you that are just gone. >> John Graham: Anything from a different perspective. So, yes, you are. The hardest part is letting go of identity, which is the mind. Right. The mind grasp on all these concepts and ideas of who we should be and what we've been and like, it's invisible sometimes. But to you, to your point, this happens gradually, or, like, you face one identity death at a time. It's not like, it's not like overnight you wake up and you're like a completely, like, levitating person or anything. You know? You're in fact, more grounded because you've been living in your head, disconnected from the heart. You talk about the heart memories. Right? >> Lyndsay Soprano: I was just going to come back to that. Yeah. >> John Graham: So, like, I give this example a lot. Think of what? Think of an example here. Do you prefer, the cold showers, or do you prefer hot sauces? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, that tricked my brain for a second. You stinker. Hot sauce. >> John Graham: Okay, I can give both examples. They're both related. But hot sauce, like, let's say you're trying the hot ones challenge and, like, increasingly excruciating hot sauces. Like, hotter and hotter and hotter. Do you like when that. When you're in that extreme pain, do you grab the milk and, like, try to distract yourself and think of something else? Or do you just completely immerse in that sensation? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Well, I mean, my answer would be milk right now for sure. And I think most of you that were listening, like, we all have a visual in our head of going to the refrigerator and grabbing milk right now, by the way, I am dairy free, so it'd be oat milk. Does that still work? >> John Graham: Some type of, like. Yeah. Ah, relief, right? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: Here's the cold shower example. Or, you know, if you're in the middle of a icy cold shower, do you distract yourself and try to think of a warm beach or something else, or do you immerse yourself in that pain? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, I mean, that's tough because I think, I feel like the Gemini in me is a little bit of both. You know, like, with all the things that I've tried to do with my pain, I have had to do some pretty crazy things. One of them is sitting in absolute freezing cold ice bathtubs, you know, and I was in it. I was in it to win it. There was not one other thought that I was doing outside of this is going to help me. I know. And it did. It actually did, by the way. I was sitting in this cold. I mean, we were pouring ice into this bath because it feels like my, bone marrow is burning from the inside out 24 hours a day. It's awesome. and so when I'm really, really on fire. Yeah, exactly. I only have so many ways to explain how this feels in my body, but it was like, my sweetie was, like, going to the kitchen and pouring ice on me, just like that's all we were doing. And this was early on in my pain journey. And I remember that moment like it was yesterday because it gave me relief, and I wasn't thinking about anything else. And I released all of that pain that I was feeling. I was great for, like, a week after that. And a week is a big win in the pain world. I'd like it to be longer than that, but, yeah, I mean, that's a good point, because, like, be here now. That's a phrase that, you know, is very corporate America. But be here now when it comes to just, like, be in that cold, icy cold shower, be in that hot sauce moment, and, you know, instead of trying to avoid that, try to experience it, process it, and then let it go. Is that what I'm picking up from you? >> John Graham: Absolutely. You got me. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Okay, good. Yeah. >> John Graham: there's no judgment on what you do in those examples. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Right? >> John Graham: But if we're talking about anxiety and emotional voltage, like, if we're off in our thoughts, trying to escape that feeling or listening to music or breath work or, like, drinking milk or smoking weed, like, we're distracting ourselves and we're living in our head to escape, trying to figure out how to get out of it, how to either feel better or not feel bad. Right? That's what perpetuates we live in this mind of, How do I get out of it? How do I get out of it? What do I do? How do I get out of it? What do I do? What do I do? Or the alternative route is to be in it, fully immersed in that sensation. And when we do that, we connect more with our body, more with our heart, and we dissolve all of this stuff that's accumulated. And so that's the path, is when you're in the cold shower of life or the hot sauce of life, do your best to handle as much of it as you can before you grab the milk. I'm sure there'll be moments where you have to grab the milk or get out. You know, jump out of the pool and get a towel. That's okay. That's normal. But the only way through is to go in it, to immerse in it, to be with it. Because those are parts of us that are suppressed, that they will always be there, haunting us, coming back until we deal with them. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. Lurking there. Like I said in the very beginning, I had mentioned about those dark. Those dark little corners that you're just like, mmm m there's stuff back there that I've kept there for a long time. And there's a lot of cobwebs there and they're kind of just chilling. Like, keep them there for a while. But, man, no matter how times you move, how many times you pack up your boxes and you move your house around, that stuff is still with you until you open the boxes and empty them out. And I went through, I've moved a lot, and not because of a spouse being in the military, but life has been very interesting. And with each move, I'm packing stuff and I'm like, how the f. Did this make the cut again? Like, 23 times in twelve years I've moved. And that in and of itself is, no wonder I'm in a wheelchair half of my life. That's part of the reason. But I remember moving boxes from one house to another, never unpacking them because they were just like, going into the attic or going into the basement or wherever we were moving to. And I finally was like, on one move, I went, I'm opening up every single one of these boxes before I move them again. Boy, oh, boy. I had kept every single corsage from every dance with my high school sweetheart, and it was lovingly bagged. And I'd been moving the stuff around. I scanned pictures and I threw everything away. Like, I, cleaning out of. Cleaning out the attic, you know, getting rid of the cobwebs, getting rid of that stuff, that. Why are we carrying it around for as long as we are? Why are we continuing to move with this stuff that gives us no value, that gives us nothing good for our life. That's only our albatross that is continuing to drag us down. So that's something that we're packing right now for our last move. So I'm using that right now. And I just did it before this episode. I'm packing a box. I'm like, how the hell is this here? >> John Graham: Oh, my God. That, >> Lyndsay Soprano: It's nuts. >> John Graham: That's a great physical manifestation of what's happening internally, you know? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Great, thank you. Yes. >> John Graham: No, like, I say that because I was the same exact way. I moved, like eleven times in ten years, not as much. Right. We are seeking. I'll speak to me. I don't want to, like, put you in the scenario, because maybe this is true, maybe it's not. But I'm seeking. I'm traveling the world. I'm traveling. I'm moving because I'm internally. I'm not okay with where I am. I'm always seeking. Oh, maybe that's better. Maybe that's better, right in the box is the accumulation is holding on to all this stuff that's meaningless that we don't need anymore. Right. And it's funny how that manifests physically because I was the same way, like, doing all the same things. And it's. We change ourselves internally first to change that external. But, yeah, we're trying to seek and find all this happiness and love and gratification externally. Like, maybe that trophy will help, maybe that house will help, maybe that thing will help, maybe that accomplishment. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: None of it is. None of it will last ever. Like, I won my fourth trophy. I'm m a three time us champion. I won, or, sorry, I won my third trophy last year, and I was like, I looked at it that evening and I felt kind of empty. I was like, I need another one. And I was like, wait, wait, wait. Does this ever end? Does this ever end? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: and I retired. I'm like, I don't need another one. I'm, I don't need to keep chasing this thing, this accomplishment. I need to change and release all the stuff inside of me that's blocking the feeling of happiness, all of this suppressed emotion. Like, let's get real deep here. What? Where is happiness? Where is love? Like, we're all trying to find it. Where is it? It's inside of us. It's a feeling that's inside of us. Yet we try to get the house, the money, or the award out here to make us happy. Why don't we just go straight to the happiness? Why do we have to find an intermediary route to it, like, the house? You know what I mean? Like, go directly if you want to be happy, if you want to be free, if you want to love, go right to it. When you let go of suppressed emotion, your potential will increase There is an endless. An endless surge of love inside of you, but it's blocked by all of the suppressed emotion that we come it up with. So the only way to experience that feeling is to get rid of, release all the stuff that's damming up the river inside. And then you'll feel it. You'll feel the bliss, you'll feel the love. You'll be okay. If someone yells at you, you'll laugh and smile. It won't bother you anymore because there's nothing blocking that, right? The only reason the house or the accomplishment or the money feels good is because it matched all our preferences and it went right to that source. It, navigated all those little blockages and found some happiness in there. You felt it for a day or two or a week, and then you're seeking it again. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, no kidding. always seeking. I know, exactly. And a lot of people are listening. They're like, oh, God, that's totally me. My biggest concern about letting go is that, like I mentioned a little earlier, is that I will change and not change like, I want it to be good change, but I don't want to, like, lose who I am. To, like, I don't want to lose, like, am m I not going to be funny anymore? >> John Graham: Where we are, let's say, now, has this much capacity. Our highest mission can't be handled with this much capacity. So when you start letting go, and really what that is, is you're collect. I call it collecting potential. You're reintegrating and expanding these parts of you that were fragmented over time, your potential will increase. You'll be able to handle more voltage. 3000 volts versus 200 of life, of emotion, of, just things. Right. That will also lead to embodiment. Embodiment, meaning you hold the qualities that you need for your next level to unfold, your highest destiny. So you become certain. You're confident, you're fearless. You're not, like, performing those things like everyone tells you, like, pump yourself up and be confident. It's not performative. You're embodied. You hold those qualities within you. You're unbotherable. Because all this old stuff that affected you and, you know, caused you to be insecure and not confident is on. Is resolved. So you're embodied in. Your capacity is higher. So, yes, you may lose certain things that you were attached to before. I certainly lost a lot of attachment to things that I thought I needed. But in that release, you expand and you're able to handle more of life. So your highest destiny, your highest potential unfolds in front of your eyes. Not only does it unfold, but you can handle it now. You can handle the next step instead of forcing it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: It sounds so freeing because I feel like a lot of my life have been trapped, you know, and I've created these Personas and I've been who I am. I've been wild and crazy and who I am. M, as a person, kind of was ingrained in trying to hide the massive amount of stress and anxiety and stuff that I felt at such a young age. Fear based, 100%. The turmoil that is within me and within my heart that I've held onto is 100% fear based in my mind, that I'm always a little bit scared. Even though people are like, oh, my God, you're the strongest person I know. I'm like, no, I'm not. Stop saying that. That is the worst thing you could ever say to anybody. Also, you are only given as much as you can handle. Bite me. That is not true. I want to take all those quotes and just shove it because it gives it. Because it makes you feel inadequate. It doesn't make it, almost, like, takes who I am and makes me just, like, feel small and then, like, I'm not a small person. None of us are small. None of us are small. And, you know, that fear of letting go is something that I've had to broach every single day whenever I have a guest. Come on. Because this is scary to do. It's scary to be open and honest and raw and real and thank you for being here and doing that with us today, because we. This is what we're here for. I mean, this is it, you know? And I'm hoping that everybody here that's listening, even if you have a little tinge of anxiety or you're crazy ass like me and John. Well, John's better now, so. John: How do you feel today? Lindsey: Grounded Actually, that's a question before we jam, because we're. Oh, my goodness. We've been chatting for an hour already. And how do you feel today? >> John Graham: Great present. Grounded. Yeah. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. You just seem so cool and calm and cucumber. But I didn't know you before all this, so I used. >> John Graham: People used to think I was pretty chill because on the outside, I'm a cancer zodiac sign, which means outside, you look calm and centered. On the inside, you're like a mush. Like, you're like mushy crab. And that's change. That's changed. Like, I can legit that. I'm just the best I've ever felt in my whole life. Cause things bother me anymore. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, you mentioned that bother. Bother list or something. You said I didn't want unbotherable. Yes. I love that word. Because everything bugs me. >> John Graham: That's the portal. If someone wants something to do list, Lyndsay, you're gonna freak out. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, no. >> John Graham: This is gonna cause you anxiety. I'm gonna trigger. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, great. Thanks, John. It was nice knowing you. >> John Graham: Triggering is good, by the way. Cause it brings stuff up, right? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Sure. Of course. Yeah, no, I'm in. I'm in. >> John Graham: Grounded will trigger you. That's okay. Every single thing that bothers you is a portal to accessing suppressed emotions So, list every single thing that bothers you today. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, my God. >> John Graham: Yeah. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Just today, the next 24 hours. >> John Graham: Yeah. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Okay. >> John Graham: List every single thing that bothers you or that you think about that bothers you. Okay, so, everyone's like, oh, I got to dig in the past and find out what you know. In third grade, I gave that example of third grade. When you're embarrassed, you don't need to know all the stuff that happened in the past. You don't mentally need to dig, because every single thing that bothers you is a portal to accessing these suppressed emotions. Every single time you are bothered by something a little bit annoyed to all the way. Furious, anxious, whatever. That's a portal. Something's coming up. Do you suppress it, deny it, avoid it, escape it? Meditate it away? Foam it away? >> Lyndsay Soprano: Hm. >> John Graham: Or do you lean into it every single time something bothers you? >> Lyndsay Soprano: I like leaning in. >> John Graham: That's why. Yeah, that's why people are anxious or so triggered all the time. And I was too. Like, all the stuff that bothers you is your portal. It's because we have held on to attachments and impressions of things in the past that bothered us, that we couldn't handle in that moment. So we can't handle them to this day, whether they're related or not. But stuff's coming up, so we have to be able to handle that voltage. And slowly, over time, or quickly, depending on how much you lean into this stuff, you're going to start alchemizing, expanding, releasing, feeling better, unbothered. >> Lyndsay Soprano: I've already started my list in my head. I'm m onto number 72 just now. First one starting with crumbs on the counter. Good God. >> John Graham: Exactly. It's things like that. It's all these little things. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah. >> John Graham: It's so much petty stuff. And it's that. Thank you for being honest, because it's all the little things. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yep. >> John Graham: Seem huge. And of course, big things. So much bothers us. And when, like, that was my wizard of Oz moment where I was living in black and white and all of a sudden I was living in color. I was like, oh, my God, I have so much stuff that I've suppressed that's inside of me. >> Lyndsay Soprano: That's a great visual. That's a great, great visual. And I might lift that from you, but I will give you credit. >> John Graham: I heard it. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Well, now that. Now that all of us have to write a list of everything that bothers us Now that all of us have to write a list of everything that bothers you today, this is what everybody's homework is. Okay, write your list down. And then what do we do with this list? Do we email it to you? >> John Graham: Have emails for days, if you want to. I'm not going to do anything with it because that's not my responsibility. But, you know, he'll laugh. Here's the thing. And I'll be honest with people. You can listen to this podcast, do the things that I mentioned on your own, and try it on your own if you like. I was able to do a lot of it on my own without guidance. Some of the things I needed, some guidance from other people, right? The, mind will get in the way. If you want my guidance, come find me, talk to me, right? Cause I can guide you through how you can do this on your own. I'm not your therapist. You, do not need to rely on me. Once you learn to this method of release and the things I talked about, there's even a third step, right? To release some of the bigger boulders inside of you. Those really nasty things that bother you, like the breakups and the betrayals and all that stuff. We know what we're talking about. If you need some guidance, I'm happy to help. Right? But that list, those are your portals to your higher potential. Every single one of those things. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Oh, my gosh, this has been so good. And I want to keep talking to you forever, but I can't. So. All right, before we hit the dusty trail here, we can find you. He's got a freebie. It's a free video on how to release your anxiety forever. It has release panic.com, forward slash free. I will put this all up in show notes on where to find them. He's on Instagram and Facebook and YouTube and Twitter, and all of his handles are a little different, so I will put all of them up. >> John Graham: Instagram is probably the best place to follow me, by the way. >> Lyndsay Soprano: Yeah, as it should be. Stay away from everywhere but Instagram. Make peace with all the stuff that bothers you, John says Okay, guys, anything you'd like to leave us with before we hit the dusty trail here? >> John Graham: Make peace with all the stuff that bothers you. That's your way. You know, listen to this a few times if you need to, but let's turn the other way. Let's recondition that response to anxiety and fear and frustration. Any negative emotion, let's lean into it instead of running away and trying to feel better in that moment. That's your portal. Are you going to walk through it, or are you going to escape from it? >> Lyndsay Soprano: I love it so much. Thank you so much for being here, John. And, keep those kitchen counters clean for that wife of yours. Welcome to the Pain Game podcast. Do you live with debilitating anxiety All right? You are exclusively invited to share this. Handling the high voltage. Lean into it. Vip pain. Journey together. Let's get to the heart of how to keel with you by my side. Did you need to hear this conversation today? I certainly did. And I even knew what I was getting into. Do you live with debilitating anxiety? Do you live with even just a scoshe of anxiety crumbs on the counter driving you nuts? Or do you know somebody that feels the same way? Please send them our way. John and Lyndsay are here for you. And yes, I spoke in third person there. welcome to the Pain Game podcast. That's what we're here for. So please follow the pain game podcast. Wherever you digest your podcast content, we will be there. Visit us@thepaingamepodcast.com and follow us on all the socials. Thanks for listening, my little vip's. Catch you on the other.