Latest / Luke's English Podcast / S1E17 - Listener_s Round Table covering the Ian Rogers Case(M4A_128K)

Transcript

S1E17 - Listener_s Round Table covering the Ian Rogers Case(M4A_128K) · Luke's English Podcast

0:00
Speaker 1: In Tragedy a true crime podcast, we discuss crimes that
0:04
Speaker 1: may be violent in nature. At times, we may cover homicides,
0:08
Speaker 1: missing people, and other topics that may be unsettling. Listener
0:12
Speaker 1: discretion is advised. Welcome to Tragedy, a True crime podcast.
0:33
Speaker 1: I'm Alisa and I'm Michael, and tonight we are doing
0:36
Speaker 1: something very special, something we've never done before and something
0:39
Speaker 1: we're really excited about, which is a listener round table,
0:43
Speaker 1: and we've decided to focus on the missing person's case
0:47
Speaker 1: of Ian Rogers. We have five listeners here with us
0:51
Speaker 1: tonight and they are true crime junkies and listeners of
0:55
Speaker 1: our podcasts, and we'll be listening for their feedback on
0:58
Speaker 1: the podcast, things that they've learned, questions that they might have,
1:02
Speaker 1: and we're going to set some ground rules before we
1:05
Speaker 1: launched the conversation. Would you go ahead and share those?
1:07
Speaker 2: Yeah. The biggest rule is this is not a question
1:10
Speaker 2: and answer. This is an open conversation. We're interested in
1:13
Speaker 2: your opinion, your theories, your perspective. One of the things
1:17
Speaker 2: that we realized with this particular case is there was
1:20
Speaker 2: a lot of interviews that were part of this case,
1:23
Speaker 2: and I'm actually very interested if you gleaned something from
1:27
Speaker 2: those interviews that maybe we didn't it, maybe didn't think
1:30
Speaker 2: to come up with and to get your perspective on
1:33
Speaker 2: those ideas. And so that's all we ask for.
1:35
Speaker 1: This, all right, and we're going to jump right into it,
1:39
Speaker 1: and we're going to ask Adam to kick us off.
1:42
Speaker 1: You had a great question, a timeline question. So if
1:45
Speaker 1: you'll start us off with that question, that would be great.
1:48
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:48
Speaker 3: Thanks, Really excited to join y'all because I love listening
1:51
Speaker 3: to y'all's podcast. But I guess my question is in
1:55
Speaker 3: listening to both interviews, there seemed to be a little
1:58
Speaker 3: bit of back and forth between Ian and specifically they
2:04
Speaker 3: was mentioned and thinking the second episode of this season
2:07
Speaker 3: when he spent up to an hour in the driveway,
2:10
Speaker 3: and to me that just, you know, it seems like
2:12
Speaker 3: a ton of time. I drive back and forth to
2:15
Speaker 3: work and listened to about a forty five minute podcast
2:18
Speaker 3: and to spend forty five minutes in a driveway just
2:21
Speaker 3: sitting on you know, not doing anything, not you know,
2:25
Speaker 3: not on the phone, not contemplating his second thought or
2:28
Speaker 3: second decision. So I guess the question to me is like,
2:31
Speaker 3: what is he doing in the driveway for that long,
2:34
Speaker 3: and that, you know, then leads to a whole other
2:36
Speaker 3: series of questions for me of you know, cell phone records,
2:40
Speaker 3: what his finances are, had he met someone, had a
2:43
Speaker 3: discussion and argument with someone the night before, that did
2:46
Speaker 3: a couple of days before. So yeah, I don't know,
2:49
Speaker 3: And just listening back to that, that's the main part
2:51
Speaker 3: that kind of rings up, and I can't really move
2:55
Speaker 3: forward until I think that that question for me is answered.
2:59
Speaker 4: I was kind of stumped by that one also because
3:01
Speaker 4: it's the back and forth and the just sitting there
3:05
Speaker 4: stumped me as well, because that doesn't seem to fit
3:09
Speaker 4: with the need to hurry and get to work right,
3:12
Speaker 4: which is what everyone seemed to think that he needed
3:15
Speaker 4: to do.
3:17
Speaker 3: That's that's just a behavior that you're something something else is,
3:22
Speaker 3: you know, running through your mind at least.
3:24
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess if I stayed in my car, it
3:27
Speaker 5: would be either to finish listening to a radio story, honestly,
3:31
Speaker 5: or to text with somebody.
3:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I.
3:34
Speaker 5: Try to text talk when I'm driving, right, and then
3:36
Speaker 5: if something comes up on your phone, you're like, holy cats,
3:39
Speaker 5: what just happened my phone?
3:40
Speaker 1: It blew up or whatever? You know, so this would
3:42
Speaker 1: be like why I would stay in my car?
3:44
Speaker 5: Have they have they check cell phone revers.
3:48
Speaker 2: They have we obviously, because it's an open case, we
3:53
Speaker 2: can only get so much information. So we've been able
3:55
Speaker 2: to kind of glean some of what's happening on the
3:57
Speaker 2: cell phone during that period of time. We have no
4:00
Speaker 2: information on the cell phone. Most of what we have
4:02
Speaker 2: on the cell phone is pains on where that particular
4:05
Speaker 2: cell phone was at certain places in time, a certain
4:07
Speaker 2: points in time. And the other thing is we have
4:11
Speaker 2: information from his mom about certain texts that were going
4:15
Speaker 2: back and forth, as well as techs that were going
4:17
Speaker 2: to work, but those were much later. The driveway is
4:20
Speaker 2: an interesting conversation because we don't know what he was doing.
4:23
Speaker 2: You know, we've been told everything from you know, he
4:27
Speaker 2: was just sitting there and went to sleep in the driveway.
4:30
Speaker 2: We've been told that he possibly was maybe taking drugs
4:34
Speaker 2: and sitting in the driveway. That the driveway is it's
4:37
Speaker 2: an interesting thing to point out because it's a big
4:39
Speaker 2: question mark for us. No one really knows why he
4:41
Speaker 2: sat there for so long.
4:42
Speaker 1: Well, I think there's actually two places. There's this gap
4:45
Speaker 1: in time when he after he dropped off his girlfriend
4:48
Speaker 1: and went back to the place that they shared. This
4:50
Speaker 1: is probably going to be around five am, right, And
4:53
Speaker 1: then we know that he got to his mom's house
4:56
Speaker 1: around seven thirty because she saw him. But then we
4:58
Speaker 1: also know that he didn't le his mom's house until
5:01
Speaker 1: nine thirty. We have a picture of the truck. This
5:05
Speaker 1: is new that was given to us just recently. And
5:07
Speaker 1: so there seems to be two places he was kind
5:10
Speaker 1: of lingering in the first place being the place he
5:13
Speaker 1: lived at and then as it's been reported, he needed
5:15
Speaker 1: to stop by his mom's house to get the ladders.
5:20
Speaker 1: Now and his brother was there at the time, and
5:22
Speaker 1: reportedly there was a conversation between you two of them,
5:24
Speaker 1: and he's the one who took the picture at her house.
5:26
Speaker 1: But there's this gap five am to nine thirty where
5:30
Speaker 1: he seems to be in two places or back and forth,
5:32
Speaker 1: and he's supposed to be at work at.
5:33
Speaker 2: Eight, So I mean, that's a big gap in time.
5:37
Speaker 3: I'd be curious that there's like a if you could
5:40
Speaker 3: get a specific timeline of like where he was and
5:43
Speaker 3: you know, between the two places, because if he's spending
5:46
Speaker 3: significant amount of time at you know, both places, I
5:49
Speaker 3: don't know.
5:49
Speaker 2: It's like.
5:51
Speaker 3: And think getting further into you know, further questions and stuff.
5:54
Speaker 3: But is he contemplating a decision that he's making, you know,
5:59
Speaker 3: a good point.
6:00
Speaker 1: Want to be alone and sit in your car. And
6:02
Speaker 1: you know, his mom did tell us in the very
6:04
Speaker 1: first time we actually talked to her over the phone
6:07
Speaker 1: that there were times when he would just kind of
6:09
Speaker 1: go places to just think and contemplate. I'm like that
6:12
Speaker 1: I need you alone. Is how I recharge, right, even
6:15
Speaker 1: if it's ten or fifteen minutes in my office. So
6:18
Speaker 1: it's not necessarily behavior that that we understand he didn't
6:22
Speaker 1: exhibit before, but it does seem like a big chunk
6:25
Speaker 1: of time and now you're late to work, correct, right?
6:29
Speaker 4: Do we know how far like how long did it
6:32
Speaker 4: take to get from where he lived to his mom's
6:36
Speaker 4: house because they weren't super close together, right, am I
6:38
Speaker 4: remembering that?
6:38
Speaker 1: Correct? From the well, you know they are actually pretty
6:41
Speaker 1: close together. They're Cowfardville, which is a fairly small town.
6:47
Speaker 1: You know, I would say no more than ten minutes.
6:52
Speaker 2: Yefields then were was just far their way. Yeah, yeah,
6:55
Speaker 2: Crawfiels one of those places that regardless of which two
6:58
Speaker 2: points that you pick. You can't possibly be more than
7:01
Speaker 2: twenty minutes apart.
7:03
Speaker 1: Unless it's Friday afternoon and everybody's going to the beach.
7:06
Speaker 1: But it's not what time it was. It was really
7:09
Speaker 1: really early in the morning. And then the route to
7:12
Speaker 1: work is up into Tallahassee, and that's just varies on
7:15
Speaker 1: what traffic is like from Crawfordville to Tallahassee. And he's
7:19
Speaker 1: going to the north west northeast part of Tallahassee, which
7:23
Speaker 1: is a little farther makes up the job.
7:24
Speaker 2: The drive a little long, yeah, based on where he
7:27
Speaker 2: was going, you know, just because I've driven that so
7:28
Speaker 2: many times, you're not going to make it less and more.
7:32
Speaker 2: I mean in less than forty five minutes. That's a
7:34
Speaker 2: forty five minute drive minimum, And that's if the traffic
7:37
Speaker 2: was nice to you.
7:38
Speaker 1: So if he's supposed to be work at eight, which
7:39
Speaker 1: is what his boss told us, he should be leaving
7:42
Speaker 1: Crawfordville at seven at the latest, not arriving to his
7:46
Speaker 1: mom's house in Crawfordville at seven thirty.
7:50
Speaker 6: Right.
7:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, other thoughts on that gap of time that anybody
7:55
Speaker 1: kind of came up with as we were talking through that.
7:58
Speaker 7: This mighty out there I wondered if he had like
8:00
Speaker 7: a second cell phone to kind of hide ne various
8:03
Speaker 7: actions like drugs, girlfriend. I don't know, that's.
8:07
Speaker 2: That's not a bad question, A bad question. We don't know.
8:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, I will, that's a good question I can ask
8:13
Speaker 1: probably Kaylee. Yep, I think, yeah, this is perfect. This
8:18
Speaker 1: is exactly what we were kind of hoping for. Okay,
8:23
Speaker 1: let's toss the questions to Chelsea. Does it matter which
8:29
Speaker 1: one I started?
8:29
Speaker 2: Absolutely not.
8:30
Speaker 1: Whatever makes sense to you? What work are.
8:33
Speaker 4: Okay, so kind of on the same topic, then he
8:38
Speaker 4: seemed we know that he was struggling, at least historically,
8:41
Speaker 4: he had struggled with drugs. He had struggled with them,
8:43
Speaker 4: anger stuff with his girlfriend. Whatever that bite was about,
8:47
Speaker 4: we don't know any more other than that there was
8:49
Speaker 4: some kind of argument. There could have been.
8:51
Speaker 2: I hadn't thought.
8:52
Speaker 4: About a different device other than do we know if
8:57
Speaker 4: they've checked any of his computers or anything that kind
9:01
Speaker 4: of digital technology outside of the cell phone.
9:05
Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever asked a question about laptops, iPads,
9:10
Speaker 1: anything like that. I think Kaylee would know, since that's
9:14
Speaker 1: the person he was most recently living with, if he
9:17
Speaker 1: had any of those kind of devices.
9:18
Speaker 2: It's a good question.
9:19
Speaker 1: Another good question.
9:20
Speaker 2: The type of job he had would not have really
9:22
Speaker 2: dictated the need for that. But r good questions. Why
9:25
Speaker 2: hasn't come up for us yet? We haven't askepect computers
9:29
Speaker 2: and most this is not a you know, this is
9:32
Speaker 2: not a wealthy person. This is lower income. And I
9:35
Speaker 2: know that there were money struggles in general, and from
9:38
Speaker 2: what we can tell that what money they did have,
9:39
Speaker 2: he probably spent on some kind of substance, so he
9:43
Speaker 2: may not have had a computer, but we haven't asked
9:44
Speaker 2: that question.
9:45
Speaker 1: No, it's a good question. I would guess that the
9:48
Speaker 1: we'll call a county sheriff's office. Well, I know for
9:51
Speaker 1: sure with the phone records, they've done their due diligence.
9:53
Speaker 1: We do know that it took for some reason, there
9:55
Speaker 1: was some sort of delay in them even accessing the
9:59
Speaker 1: phone because I feel like she said it was two
10:01
Speaker 1: or three months, and I think it was because the
10:03
Speaker 1: original request for the phone records was incorrectly file by
10:07
Speaker 1: the we'll call it Kenny sheriff's office. So they have
10:09
Speaker 1: the they have the phone records, you know, and we
10:12
Speaker 1: have done what's called APOIA, a Freedom of Information Act
10:15
Speaker 1: request several times, and they just won't give us anything.
10:20
Speaker 1: They're citing that it's open and active, so they won't
10:22
Speaker 1: give us any of that information unfortunately. So we just
10:26
Speaker 1: kind of assume that they've done their due diligence as
10:28
Speaker 1: far as who is he texting? Who is he? We
10:31
Speaker 1: know some phone calls and texts he made because they
10:33
Speaker 1: were too certain people that we talked to, and we
10:35
Speaker 1: have approximate timestamps on those, but outside of those things,
10:39
Speaker 1: we don't really know anything.
10:41
Speaker 3: I I've so this has kind of like triggered a
10:45
Speaker 3: thought just in maybe what to maybe look up or
10:49
Speaker 3: research further. But based on that I didn't pick up
10:51
Speaker 3: on through the interviews the heavy drug use or suspected
10:57
Speaker 3: maybe drug use, and so in that at that time,
11:01
Speaker 3: is there in arrest record for public records, knowledge of
11:07
Speaker 3: crimes being committed by other known suspects, assaults you know,
11:13
Speaker 3: related to drug you know, paraphnalia or anything like that.
11:17
Speaker 1: And you know, Devin A, I think this really links
11:21
Speaker 1: with your question. You want to toss that out there,
11:23
Speaker 1: because it's almost like you took that right out of
11:25
Speaker 1: your mind.
11:26
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, not a problem. We're talking about the let's
11:30
Speaker 8: see I've have a cheap questions. I said, the disposition
11:36
Speaker 8: of any of the drug salespeople known that Ian or
11:40
Speaker 8: any close family members interacted with, where they the kind
11:43
Speaker 8: to get violent? And does law enforcement know who they are?
11:47
Speaker 1: Yep, I don't really have names of people, so I
11:52
Speaker 1: wouldn't really be able to look up who the who
11:54
Speaker 1: the drug dealers are. Let's just let's talk about.
11:57
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, I mean, I keep in mind too, you
12:00
Speaker 2: did background checks and everyone that we do know of, yes,
12:02
Speaker 2: and there was nothing that really jumped out from there
12:05
Speaker 2: to to relate to relate specifically to drugs outside of marijuana,
12:10
Speaker 2: and there was no real crimes outside of And I've
12:14
Speaker 2: made reference to this a few times of everyone. No
12:17
Speaker 2: one in Walkala County can drive evident least so because
12:20
Speaker 2: every single time we do a background check, it's just
12:22
Speaker 2: massive amounts of traffic violations. I mean, I'm warning everyone
12:25
Speaker 2: could drive through walk Callic County be garible. But so
12:27
Speaker 2: nothing was right.
12:29
Speaker 8: Oh what about is I don't know, is we legal
12:34
Speaker 8: in Florida or not?
12:35
Speaker 2: Medical is got it?
12:37
Speaker 6: Okay?
12:37
Speaker 7: I probably was interrupting.
12:38
Speaker 2: No, you're fine, But now we start talking about associated areas,
12:44
Speaker 2: and so that's when the drug conversation gets kind of
12:47
Speaker 2: interesting because there's whether you we have either in or out.
12:51
Speaker 2: We just recently, you know, gotten had to correct that
12:54
Speaker 2: in some of our updates because we were told something
12:56
Speaker 2: wrong to begin with, but doesn't really matter. The area
12:58
Speaker 2: around Tom Brown Park, it was a deviation from where
13:01
Speaker 2: he was really supposed to be if his intent was
13:04
Speaker 2: to go to work. And keep in mind, I need
13:05
Speaker 2: to clarify or he saw his truck, We don't actually
13:08
Speaker 2: have confirmation that he was driving. We just know we
13:12
Speaker 2: saw the truck there. That is a known area for
13:15
Speaker 2: some pretty significant drug trafficking and some you know, just
13:18
Speaker 2: drug use in that area, and there's actually even camps
13:22
Speaker 2: in that area known for being like meth camps, things
13:25
Speaker 2: like that. And there was also another place that we
13:28
Speaker 2: found out that was off the record, that he was
13:30
Speaker 2: known to I'm not sure frequent is the right word,
13:33
Speaker 2: but he's definitely been seen there that was well known
13:36
Speaker 2: for you know, having access to meth and having some
13:39
Speaker 2: homeless people in that area and having a drug problem
13:41
Speaker 2: in that area. So it's two different places he personally
13:44
Speaker 2: associated with that were you know, definitely beyond just you know,
13:49
Speaker 2: recreational marijuana.
13:50
Speaker 1: Use, And again I would hope that the we'll call
13:53
Speaker 1: a candy sharp. They know, they just who's out there doing?
13:55
Speaker 1: They know, they know these spots, they know the people.
13:58
Speaker 1: And so I think to both of your points, we
14:01
Speaker 1: have to default again to the Wacala County Sheriff's office
14:03
Speaker 1: and hope that they have done their due diligence, like
14:06
Speaker 1: who are the main dealers, Like who are the main players?
14:09
Speaker 1: They know it's not a small place. This isn't like
14:11
Speaker 1: big city. I don't know, tell I was in a
14:13
Speaker 1: really big city. It's not big city Atlanta, and it's
14:15
Speaker 1: not big city. So they know. And I would hope
14:18
Speaker 1: that they would have been, you know, dropping in on
14:20
Speaker 1: those folks for a visit to see if they had
14:23
Speaker 1: any knowledge of seeing him or had any interactions with
14:27
Speaker 1: him in the you know, in the days and weeks
14:30
Speaker 1: leading up to, or any indication that there had been
14:32
Speaker 1: some sort of previous altercations. I think is kind of
14:34
Speaker 1: what they're getting at. Mm hmmm. It's all things I
14:38
Speaker 1: wish we had information about, but I get why they
14:40
Speaker 1: won't share with us.
14:41
Speaker 2: It's just frustrating, you know.
14:45
Speaker 1: Other thoughts on that, and I love how you guys
14:47
Speaker 1: are popping in. You're like, oh, this makes me think
14:49
Speaker 1: of that that's exactly what we were hoping for. So
14:52
Speaker 1: thank you for doing that. I really really love it.
14:55
Speaker 1: How about you, Kate, you WoT my question? Yeah, I'll
14:59
Speaker 1: take Can you remind me how old was he in
15:01
Speaker 1: forty forty? Oh he's older and that that was okay?
15:04
Speaker 5: So, I mean, I think it's really interesting how there's
15:08
Speaker 5: this assumption, and I think this is like a generally
15:10
Speaker 5: accepted thing in law enforcement, is that a grown person
15:14
Speaker 5: can go whenever they want and wherever they want. They
15:16
Speaker 5: don't have to tell anybody about it, right, Like I mean,
15:18
Speaker 5: I can take off, I can tell you, or I
15:20
Speaker 5: cannot tell you.
15:21
Speaker 1: So I thought that was a.
15:22
Speaker 5: Really interesting component to why they didn't check on him.
15:27
Speaker 5: You know, I think some like I think I've even
15:29
Speaker 5: heard that you have to be gone like three days
15:31
Speaker 5: or some like kind of scary long time to be investigated, right,
15:35
Speaker 5: So I wanted to know if you guys thought that,
15:39
Speaker 5: like what ian socioeconomic status, how that impacted the investigation
15:45
Speaker 5: into his disappearance, Like what other ways it impacted that
15:48
Speaker 5: investigation one hundred percent?
15:50
Speaker 1: I think that's going to be a question for you
15:52
Speaker 1: you're going to know a little bit, well, you know
15:53
Speaker 1: a lot more about the community. I refer to these
15:56
Speaker 1: I say, oh, it's your people, because this is where
15:59
Speaker 1: you were born and raised.
16:01
Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't think that, you know, I don't think
16:04
Speaker 2: they didn't look into it as a result of in
16:05
Speaker 2: kind of socioeconomic status. Do I think that some cases
16:10
Speaker 2: like this are marginalized when people are adults? I think yeah,
16:13
Speaker 2: because Yeah, the idea is, could this person have just
16:16
Speaker 2: picked up and wandered away and decided to leave his life.
16:19
Speaker 2: That's that's not impossible, that's not unheard of. What we
16:22
Speaker 2: talk about in the podcast is you know, is this
16:26
Speaker 2: the characteristic of this person and what's surrounding him would
16:30
Speaker 2: have either facilitated that or negated it. And you know,
16:33
Speaker 2: in reality, it means unanimously people talk about how much
16:39
Speaker 2: he cared about his son and that his son's birthday
16:42
Speaker 2: party was literally the next day. And so we just
16:45
Speaker 2: feel like, based on that feedback and based on everything
16:47
Speaker 2: we've heard regarding that subject, this is if he was
16:50
Speaker 2: going to walk away, this wouldn't be the data he
16:51
Speaker 2: would have done it. You know, we just can't we
16:54
Speaker 2: can't get our mind around that as far as the
16:57
Speaker 2: investigation itself, you know, we've gone you know again, we
17:01
Speaker 2: provided an update recently that we've heard a lot of
17:05
Speaker 2: different stories when we've been in contact with the sheriff's office.
17:08
Speaker 2: You know, we've had missing person case, No, it's a
17:10
Speaker 2: criminal case. Now it's back to a missing person case.
17:13
Speaker 2: And we've been given multiple names on who's assigned. I
17:16
Speaker 2: don't know whether that is a representation of you know,
17:19
Speaker 2: not taking the crime seriously, or or the discussions a
17:22
Speaker 2: crime but disappearance seriously, or is a representation of just
17:26
Speaker 2: disorganization on the department's behalf.
17:30
Speaker 3: So did they I guess in the same context did
17:33
Speaker 3: they You mentioned they found a skeleton or in the
17:37
Speaker 3: in the area.
17:38
Speaker 2: Yep, if you looked at the map, there was. It's interesting,
17:42
Speaker 2: there's there was a skeleton that was found and it's
17:45
Speaker 2: only I would say, driving ten to fifteen minutes away
17:49
Speaker 2: from when we last see his trunk. Now interesting. Yeah,
17:53
Speaker 2: The interesting part of that is it's our go ahead.
17:56
Speaker 3: They run DNA on that. Just in terms of like
17:59
Speaker 3: considering the cost to the investigation.
18:01
Speaker 2: We know that the FDL has been in touch with
18:04
Speaker 2: Ian's mom. We know that they've taken DNA samples from her.
18:08
Speaker 2: We do not have the results of that, so they're obviously,
18:12
Speaker 2: you know, some kind of either suspicion or least elimination
18:15
Speaker 2: happening with the DNA samples. Again, no results on that yet.
18:19
Speaker 2: When I first heard about it, I was, you know,
18:22
Speaker 2: I'm like, what's the likelihood that we have a guy
18:24
Speaker 2: that disappeared, you know, fifteen minutes away and then there's
18:26
Speaker 2: a skeleton that's basically meeting the same basic age and
18:32
Speaker 2: size of Ian Rodgers, And so I was kind of like, Okay,
18:35
Speaker 2: we found the guy, unfortunately, but we also got more
18:39
Speaker 2: information about how they were dressed, and this person was
18:42
Speaker 2: not dressed the same way as Ian. And then when
18:44
Speaker 2: we were when we were talking to one of the
18:47
Speaker 2: other you know, interviews, it was who was this is
18:50
Speaker 2: one of the reporters. Reporters, we found out that you know,
18:54
Speaker 2: there was another person that was missing in the area
18:56
Speaker 2: and that that could be this person as well. Oddly enough,
18:59
Speaker 2: they were missing with their truck as well.
19:01
Speaker 1: Actually it wasn't one of the reporters. It was one
19:02
Speaker 1: of the dive people. Yeah, one of the sonar people
19:06
Speaker 1: sent us the missing person out of Tallahassee. That could
19:11
Speaker 1: logically also that could be who the skull is this other.
19:14
Speaker 2: Person, And that's why we haven't talked about that anymore
19:17
Speaker 2: for these episodes because we're at a dead end on
19:20
Speaker 2: needing more information at it could be and it could
19:22
Speaker 2: be someone else. Yeah, it could be another episode or
19:25
Speaker 2: two if we find out who that is.
19:29
Speaker 6: I didn't mean to change change the train of thought there,
19:32
Speaker 6: so this is.
19:33
Speaker 1: Exactly what we want.
19:34
Speaker 4: Yeah, whatever comes on the same kind of mindset. You
19:38
Speaker 4: mentioned the background of drugs, and really it was his
19:41
Speaker 4: boss that kind of talked the most about that in
19:44
Speaker 4: the interviews, and it seemed like he had been cleaned
19:48
Speaker 4: for a little while at least, or not abusing for
19:51
Speaker 4: a little while. But had he ever disappeared before when
19:56
Speaker 4: he was heavily involved in drugs. I hadn't thought about
19:58
Speaker 4: that question in chill.
20:00
Speaker 2: It's a good question with if you want to talk
20:03
Speaker 2: about Joe's interview and how that got relevant, that's really
20:05
Speaker 2: where it first came up, at least on the record.
20:09
Speaker 2: The answer is yeah. I mean, one of the reasons
20:12
Speaker 2: he was let go and let go multiple times according
20:16
Speaker 2: to Joe's interview, was that he, you know, he would
20:19
Speaker 2: kind of go on these situations where he was having
20:22
Speaker 2: Joe just described it as problems and where he couldn't
20:25
Speaker 2: show up to work on time or not show up
20:27
Speaker 2: at all, and it was it was one of the
20:28
Speaker 2: things that led directly to him not being terminated once
20:30
Speaker 2: but being terminated twice.
20:32
Speaker 1: I think it's an interesting question to ask the family
20:34
Speaker 1: members too. There's a difference between not showing up for
20:36
Speaker 1: work for a couple of days and just literally not
20:38
Speaker 1: being anywhere for a couple of days.
20:40
Speaker 2: Well, it does relate to what Teresa said, where Ian
20:43
Speaker 2: would go off for long periods of time, Yeah, to think,
20:46
Speaker 2: and you know, we suspect that maybe some of that
20:49
Speaker 2: was thinking, maybe some of that was being alone, so
20:52
Speaker 2: you know, he could do whatever else wanted to do. Yeah, Okay.
20:55
Speaker 4: When I heard that, like in my mind, I pictured
20:58
Speaker 4: that as like a long time, as in several hours,
21:01
Speaker 4: like being he would be out of pocket for chunks
21:05
Speaker 4: of the day. I hadn't thought of it in terms
21:08
Speaker 4: of chunks, So I think.
21:09
Speaker 7: It's just that's respected.
21:12
Speaker 1: So I don't know, I.
21:13
Speaker 6: Love it interesting.
21:14
Speaker 1: I think you did pick the right case because we
21:17
Speaker 1: have people we can access for these questions, right, So
21:20
Speaker 1: good choice. So we went back and forth between this
21:22
Speaker 1: one and in our first case, and I do think
21:25
Speaker 1: this was the right one because we can come back
21:27
Speaker 1: to a large number of people that we spoke with,
21:30
Speaker 1: both on and off the record to get more clarity
21:33
Speaker 1: on this. Yeah, speaking of that, Maggie had a related question.
21:38
Speaker 5: Yeah, is there is there anybody else you guys.
21:40
Speaker 1: Are wanting to talk to?
21:42
Speaker 2: You want to start it, you want to take.
21:45
Speaker 1: So, yes, yes there is. When our first point of contact, well,
21:53
Speaker 1: we got this case from Crawfordville, someone who lives in
21:56
Speaker 1: Crawfordville who was listening to our other case, and she
21:59
Speaker 1: sent me message and she said, I, you know, if
22:02
Speaker 1: you guys are thinking about another case and we'll call
22:04
Speaker 1: it County, you might want to cover the disappearance of
22:06
Speaker 1: Ian Rodgers. I know his mom let me reach out
22:09
Speaker 1: to her and so I was like, great, we didn't
22:12
Speaker 1: just cold call her. And so this person who lives
22:15
Speaker 1: in Crawfordville reached out to Ian's mom. Teresa made the
22:18
Speaker 1: connection for us and it just kind of went from there.
22:21
Speaker 1: One of the first things that we that we ask
22:24
Speaker 1: and I think we asked it on the podcast, is
22:26
Speaker 1: who else I know we did who else can we
22:29
Speaker 1: should we talk to and what we're learning through this
22:31
Speaker 1: process is what is most important for us and something
22:34
Speaker 1: that we want to really bring to the forefront. And
22:37
Speaker 1: the work that we're doing is that we're humanizing these
22:39
Speaker 1: cases or we're not here to like sensationalize it. And
22:42
Speaker 1: we the best way we can humanize though, is by
22:45
Speaker 1: actually talking to those people who are involved, right, and
22:48
Speaker 1: people who are close to the case. And this is
22:49
Speaker 1: going to be something that will be pervasive as we
22:52
Speaker 1: continue to go through our podcast series. And so one
22:56
Speaker 1: of the people that Teresa said she thought would be
23:01
Speaker 1: super super interested in that and would talk to us
23:04
Speaker 1: as Kelly. And Kelly is Ian's child's mother, and they
23:10
Speaker 1: were in a relationship for several years and from what
23:13
Speaker 1: we can tell, they they separated. They were never married,
23:17
Speaker 1: but their relationship ended about six years ago. Now, with
23:22
Speaker 1: a lot of relationships didn't always like come to a
23:25
Speaker 1: precise end, right sometimes, particularly when it's the mother of
23:29
Speaker 1: your of your child. Right, it's not like they're never
23:31
Speaker 1: speaking to each other again, and it does seem like,
23:35
Speaker 1: you know, at the to the benefit of their child.
23:38
Speaker 1: They did continue to speak to each other and had
23:41
Speaker 1: an amicable relationship, and Kelly also was pretty highly involved
23:49
Speaker 1: from what Theresa told us in the initial maybe six
23:52
Speaker 1: maybe six months to a year maybe longer of spearheading right,
23:56
Speaker 1: Where's Ian? Kelly is the person who reached out to
24:00
Speaker 1: several dive organizations. Kelly is the person who created the
24:03
Speaker 1: missing post, the missing person's poster. She put her number
24:06
Speaker 1: on there as the point of contact and was very
24:08
Speaker 1: active in the Operation Bring Ian Rodgers home facebook page.
24:12
Speaker 1: And so we're thinking, great, we definitely want to speak
24:14
Speaker 1: with her. We you know, we think she's going to
24:16
Speaker 1: have a lot of information to contribute, and she did
24:21
Speaker 1: not want to talk to us. We reached out to
24:23
Speaker 1: her several different ways, first through Messenger and then in
24:30
Speaker 1: the group I posted in that Facebook group, and she
24:32
Speaker 1: commented a couple of times, and then she just sort
24:37
Speaker 1: of went dark on us, and so we kind of
24:39
Speaker 1: just proceeded the way that we were going. And then
24:44
Speaker 1: it became very apparent in the Operation Bring Ian Rodgers
24:48
Speaker 1: facebook page group that she was not not only not
24:52
Speaker 1: interested in speaking to us, but she completely uh disagreed
24:57
Speaker 1: with everything we were doing. She made some aggressive comments
25:03
Speaker 1: in the Facebook group about how we didn't know everything
25:06
Speaker 1: and the police knows everything, and the podcast is doing
25:09
Speaker 1: a disservice, And at that moment, I removed myself from
25:16
Speaker 1: that Facebook group because that's not what I was there for.
25:19
Speaker 1: And we make it very clear people don't have to participate,
25:23
Speaker 1: right like, not participating in our podcast and not speaking
25:27
Speaker 1: to us doesn't mean you know something and you're trying
25:29
Speaker 1: to keep it secret. There are several different reasons why
25:32
Speaker 1: people don't want to participate. And so I felt like,
25:35
Speaker 1: because this was a Facebook group that she was integral
25:39
Speaker 1: in starting and she was very strongly against us and
25:43
Speaker 1: our podcast, that I would just remove myself from that
25:46
Speaker 1: situation and not make it any more stressful for her
25:48
Speaker 1: than you know it already has been. And then a
25:52
Speaker 1: couple of weeks later, maybe three weeks later, Ian's mom
25:55
Speaker 1: reached out to me and she said, we need you
25:57
Speaker 1: back in the Facebook group you're not. We need the
26:00
Speaker 1: podcast posted in the Facebook group. We need you to
26:02
Speaker 1: share with what you're learning.
26:04
Speaker 2: And I said, I'm I'm.
26:06
Speaker 1: Nervous about that because Kelly's a big part of that
26:09
Speaker 1: group and I don't want to upset her anymore than
26:11
Speaker 1: we clearly already have. And she said, Kelly's not in
26:14
Speaker 1: that group anymore. Kelly took herself out of the group
26:17
Speaker 1: and we really really want you back, and I'm asking
26:20
Speaker 1: you please to come back to the Facebook group and
26:22
Speaker 1: continue to post your podcast. So that's a long answer
26:26
Speaker 1: to the question. Yes, we would. We would have loved
26:31
Speaker 1: just to speak with Kelly and love to get some
26:34
Speaker 1: information from her that might help. But also we recognize
26:37
Speaker 1: that she and may feel like she's given everything she
26:39
Speaker 1: can to the we'll call it County Sheriff's office, and
26:41
Speaker 1: who are we like, We're a couple of podcasts. She
26:44
Speaker 1: doesn't know us, and so I think that's the biggest
26:48
Speaker 1: person in my mind that.
26:50
Speaker 2: I wish we could talk to agree because you know,
26:53
Speaker 2: when I go through when anytime we start putting this together,
26:55
Speaker 2: I spend a great deal of time trying to think
26:58
Speaker 2: about how to properly tell the story, because it gets
27:01
Speaker 2: people talking, it's people thinking, It gets ideas out there
27:04
Speaker 2: that maybe other people haven't thought of. And when there's
27:06
Speaker 2: somebody that was definitely part of the story and in
27:10
Speaker 2: the timeline that something occurred, that means parts of that
27:14
Speaker 2: story are missing, even if they are small, and so
27:16
Speaker 2: they're definitely parts of Ian's story that are missing that
27:20
Speaker 2: I think Kelly does know. I'm glad. I certainly hope
27:23
Speaker 2: that she's told the Sheriff's office that there's no reason.
27:25
Speaker 2: I believe that she hasn't done that, and again, she
27:27
Speaker 2: doesn't have to come here, but it does mean there's
27:29
Speaker 2: pieces of the story missing.
27:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, he talked to the siblings. Unfortunately, Ian's brother Daniel,
27:38
Speaker 1: who is well to our knowledge, the last person who
27:42
Speaker 1: saw him. He is the Ian stopped by his mom's
27:45
Speaker 1: house to pick up his ladders. His brother Daniel, who
27:49
Speaker 1: lived at the home at the time, was there and
27:51
Speaker 1: they spoke and had a conversation. But this February he
27:57
Speaker 1: passed away. I heard that in the last episode lost
28:01
Speaker 1: both of her. But well, Ian is missing, her other
28:04
Speaker 1: biological son passed away, and her dad recently passed away.
28:07
Speaker 2: So it's it's been a rough year.
28:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been really really awful for her.
28:12
Speaker 8: Let's see close to either of the the step I
28:16
Speaker 8: guess there's step step brothers.
28:18
Speaker 1: There are some steps, but Teresa's never really indicated to
28:21
Speaker 1: us that they It's not somebody that she said we
28:24
Speaker 1: should talk to. Right when we were first speaking with her,
28:27
Speaker 1: we really started with who she said we should talk to,
28:30
Speaker 1: and then it kind of went from there. We've never
28:32
Speaker 1: heard those people come up as relevant.
28:36
Speaker 2: The only thing that we we did struggle with keeping
28:38
Speaker 2: track of is there's like five Dayaniels five day and
28:43
Speaker 2: so we had to really pay attention to keep track
28:45
Speaker 2: of all that.
28:46
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, that's a good question.
28:49
Speaker 4: What about close friends? I know you talked to the
28:51
Speaker 4: people that he worked with, but are there I know
28:53
Speaker 4: there was a Dan.
28:54
Speaker 7: That was also a close friend, which is what made
28:56
Speaker 7: me think about that.
28:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, he seems, you know, he wouldn't. I think he
29:01
Speaker 1: did actually call him his best friend. I don't know,
29:03
Speaker 1: guys are kind of like, we don't have a best friend,
29:05
Speaker 1: but he did. He called him his best friend. And
29:08
Speaker 1: I think maybe some other folks at work, but Daniel
29:12
Speaker 1: seems to be the person that he was most connected with,
29:15
Speaker 1: at least on a friendship basis, and we did, we
29:17
Speaker 1: did speak to him, and we didn't really go outside
29:20
Speaker 1: of that friend circle too much. I mean, it seems
29:22
Speaker 1: like he pretty much in the in the like six
29:25
Speaker 1: months leading up to his disappearance. As Joe said, I mean,
29:28
Speaker 1: what do you say? This is the best ian I've
29:30
Speaker 1: ever seen and he knew him for a long time,
29:33
Speaker 1: so I think he was just keeping his head down,
29:35
Speaker 1: you know, going to work, spending time with his child,
29:39
Speaker 1: and things were going really, really well. So I don't know,
29:42
Speaker 1: he was like hanging out and doing a bunch of
29:43
Speaker 1: stuff with other people at the time.
29:45
Speaker 2: And keep in mind too, that one of the things
29:48
Speaker 2: Dan mintioned his best friend Dan is that he tended
29:52
Speaker 2: to keep a lot of his emotions to himself. Yeah,
29:54
Speaker 2: and so there was no indication because you know, we
29:57
Speaker 2: did talk about the possibility of suicide on this and
30:01
Speaker 2: you know, was there any signs of that and there
30:03
Speaker 2: didn't appear to be, according to Dan, anything that would
30:07
Speaker 2: have been suspicious regarding that. But again I had to
30:10
Speaker 2: overlate with the other statement was he kept a lot
30:13
Speaker 2: of his emotions tight to himself, and so I don't
30:16
Speaker 2: think that's something that he was discussing with anyone. I
30:19
Speaker 2: feel like they would have come up with Kaylee.
30:21
Speaker 4: Ye.
30:21
Speaker 2: Kaylee didn't mention anything about it. Dan did mention any
30:24
Speaker 2: about it, and of course Joe don't forever did mention
30:26
Speaker 2: aning about it. Joe's interview was really compelling from the
30:30
Speaker 2: perspective of again, just you said it the best version
30:33
Speaker 2: of Ian he's ever seen. And so that's why he's
30:37
Speaker 2: on the upswing. He's got a new job, new pay,
30:40
Speaker 2: new truck, he's got a lot to be excited about.
30:42
Speaker 2: So is this person who would have taken his own life?
30:45
Speaker 2: It's hard to you know, it's hard to put it
30:48
Speaker 2: was hard to put my brain there on that being
30:49
Speaker 2: a possibility, though it is a possibility.
30:53
Speaker 7: I have a question that just came up to me, is.
30:57
Speaker 8: Like, so, I'm from a lower Sees background as well,
31:01
Speaker 8: and I know, well the struggle of when you start
31:05
Speaker 8: to succeed, then you're the voice in your head just wants.
31:08
Speaker 7: To tear you down more than anything. And I can
31:12
Speaker 7: really empathize for Ian if he was if he was
31:14
Speaker 7: feeling that way.
31:15
Speaker 6: In that moment.
31:16
Speaker 7: And I don't know where my question is with that,
31:17
Speaker 7: because the only person that knows.
31:19
Speaker 3: That is him.
31:19
Speaker 7: But well, I suppose it led us to context.
31:23
Speaker 2: There's something that we said, there, you are on it,
31:26
Speaker 2: You're onto something, because there was another conversation we had
31:29
Speaker 2: where some people indicated that he had conversations with them
31:34
Speaker 2: that he did not deserve the positive things that were happening.
31:38
Speaker 2: So it was really interesting you picked up on that
31:40
Speaker 2: because we didn't really get into that and nod you know,
31:43
Speaker 2: because we were trying to figure out what that meant.
31:45
Speaker 2: And we were also very careful.
31:47
Speaker 6: We like to.
31:47
Speaker 2: Corroborate a lot of information before we talk about it,
31:51
Speaker 2: and you know, so we had some source issues with
31:53
Speaker 2: that one. But it's something that was brought.
31:55
Speaker 1: Up not worthy.
31:56
Speaker 2: I'm not worried it was not worthy.
31:57
Speaker 1: I'm not worthy of these things.
31:58
Speaker 2: That was the word that was used. M hm.
32:01
Speaker 1: Could it be possibly because maybe he wasn't cleaned and
32:03
Speaker 1: he felt.
32:04
Speaker 6: Bad about that?
32:05
Speaker 2: Possible? Yep. I mean the drug problem is pretty you know,
32:12
Speaker 2: it's it's unfortunately, it's a big piece of his story,
32:15
Speaker 2: and it's hard for us to with everything that we
32:18
Speaker 2: learned and everything all the people we've talked to, it's
32:21
Speaker 2: hard for us to not believe that's part of what happened.
32:24
Speaker 2: We just don't know. We don't know what role it played.
32:27
Speaker 2: We just I'm pretty I'm pretty sure it did play
32:29
Speaker 2: a role something.
32:31
Speaker 3: I think it's also important to keep in mind that
32:33
Speaker 3: even if it does play a role, it's it's still
32:36
Speaker 3: a human, you know, it's being perfect, And I think
32:40
Speaker 3: that makes me curious if I don't know what Kla County.
32:44
Speaker 3: But you know, even though I've not spent much time
32:48
Speaker 3: in Florida. I've heard of will Kya County before meeting y'all.
32:52
Speaker 3: So I just wonder if law enforcement in that same
32:58
Speaker 3: aspect has given this saying attention to that.
33:02
Speaker 2: That did creep in my mind as well, you know, like,
33:05
Speaker 2: is have they dismissed this? I'm like, all, great, sow,
33:08
Speaker 2: you know, just he's he's odeed. He's out in the
33:10
Speaker 2: woods somewhere. We'll get to it when you're I don't know,
33:13
Speaker 2: but that did creep in my mind is maybe they're
33:15
Speaker 2: not taking it seriously from that perspective. I do know
33:19
Speaker 2: this area has has some drug problems. I mean, that
33:21
Speaker 2: was even evident in our other case with the Jodi
33:24
Speaker 2: Kilgore case, So it's kind of hard to avoid it. Yeah,
33:28
Speaker 2: it's it's a good comment, but yeah, that and but
33:30
Speaker 2: again it's one of the reasons that we're trying to
33:32
Speaker 2: take the approach we are. I mean, we did acknowledge
33:34
Speaker 2: the the challenges around drugs with Ian's case, but we
33:37
Speaker 2: didn't overly sensatialize it on purpose because I'm not nearly
33:42
Speaker 2: as interested in that as I am in finding it.
33:44
Speaker 2: So we have to tell that part of the story
33:47
Speaker 2: because we think it's related in it, but I'm not.
33:50
Speaker 2: We're not well, we're not telling it from the perspective of, oh, look,
33:52
Speaker 2: this guy was taking drugs. We're taking it from the
33:54
Speaker 2: perspective of maybe one of his friends that knows that
33:57
Speaker 2: might it might spark a memory that they go, you know,
34:00
Speaker 2: and I probably should mention that he hung out here
34:02
Speaker 2: a lot and that hasn't been brought up anywhere, or
34:05
Speaker 2: some detail that no one's shared yet.
34:07
Speaker 4: I think that's the part for me that, like, I mean,
34:09
Speaker 4: he we know from history that he had had struggles.
34:14
Speaker 4: We know he had made those comments about feeling unworthy
34:16
Speaker 4: and things like that, and you don't ever know where
34:20
Speaker 4: that depression because some people do mask that very well.
34:23
Speaker 4: And it doesn't mean there's people that do commit suicide
34:26
Speaker 4: that you would never expect. But where's the truck?
34:31
Speaker 7: To me, like the truck.
34:35
Speaker 5: That went back to like you, I think as Michael
34:37
Speaker 5: was just yeah, you're saying where's the truck? Is that
34:40
Speaker 5: it just you guys talking about all those sinkholes and
34:43
Speaker 5: all these places, like it feels like somebody else was involved, right, Like, yeah, oh,
34:48
Speaker 5: I know what it was. Michael said that it's so
34:50
Speaker 5: hard to get lost, like if I just wanted to
34:52
Speaker 5: get lost like still I you know, I've thought about
34:56
Speaker 5: that as people you have to access money, and you
34:58
Speaker 5: guys said that that they're there is no like access
35:01
Speaker 5: to like credit cards or even if you went out
35:04
Speaker 5: if you just wanted to get really lost and you
35:06
Speaker 5: went out and got to get a bunch of cash.
35:07
Speaker 1: He didn't do any of that.
35:09
Speaker 5: So that's like I'm trying to take the idea of
35:12
Speaker 5: suicide possibly, but then I'm like, there's all these weird
35:14
Speaker 5: things that don't match, like with the truck and being lost.
35:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And you're exactly right. I mean, you guys,
35:22
Speaker 2: since you've all listened, I've probably lost track of how
35:24
Speaker 2: many times I've said, where's the truck? You know, where
35:27
Speaker 2: the hell is the truck? And so you know, that's
35:29
Speaker 2: one reason, you know, we kind of split it up
35:31
Speaker 2: between like an you know, accidental suicide or or intentional.
35:37
Speaker 2: And then you know, when you start talking accidental, like
35:39
Speaker 2: the where's the truck question becomes a big one. You know,
35:43
Speaker 2: intentional did he you know, did he hide the truck?
35:46
Speaker 2: You know, that's one reason the divers are doing what
35:48
Speaker 2: they're doing because this area of Florida where I'm from
35:51
Speaker 2: is covered in Saint Phle's covered in it. And it's
35:54
Speaker 2: because of the topology of Florida, and it sits on
35:56
Speaker 2: top of an awkwardfer and then it just literally the tannins.
36:01
Speaker 2: Not to get into a you know, science conversation, righted talk,
36:04
Speaker 2: we do a ted talk with the tannins that come
36:08
Speaker 2: from the bulliage around that area. They eat through the
36:10
Speaker 2: limestone and that's what creates these sinkholes. And so there's
36:15
Speaker 2: I mean, there's hundreds and hundreds of them all through
36:17
Speaker 2: the state of Florida. And so hiding, you know, hiding
36:20
Speaker 2: a vehicle or dumping a vehicle in these sinkholes is
36:22
Speaker 2: not uncommon. In fact, it's very common, and it's a
36:26
Speaker 2: lot of it's related to, you know, people who steal cars.
36:29
Speaker 2: They go in on joy ride and they dump them
36:31
Speaker 2: in sink chols and that's how they get away with it.
36:34
Speaker 2: And so it's it's a weird hobby, but it is
36:36
Speaker 2: something that happens pretty frequently in Florida, enough to where
36:39
Speaker 2: we have three different established diving groups that look for
36:42
Speaker 2: sucking cars that we know of.
36:44
Speaker 1: But what is different about Florida is that there are
36:47
Speaker 1: not many bodies of water that are deep like.
36:49
Speaker 2: In South Florid. Yeah, a lot, a lot of the water, right,
36:55
Speaker 2: and so you know there are exceptions, but you know,
36:58
Speaker 2: since some of the sinkholes can be deep. But and
37:00
Speaker 2: so that's one reason there's been so much focus on
37:02
Speaker 2: finding the truck because at this point, I think people,
37:04
Speaker 2: you know, as much as I hate to say it,
37:07
Speaker 2: because I really want to, I hope we find this
37:09
Speaker 2: guy in a meth camp and just looking for help.
37:11
Speaker 2: That's what I'm hoping that we find him in rehab
37:14
Speaker 2: or rehab. But in reality, his phone has not been
37:18
Speaker 2: used or found. There's been no activity on any credit cards,
37:22
Speaker 2: any bank accounts. There is no truck. This is I've
37:26
Speaker 2: said in it before. Poof, he's gone and so and
37:29
Speaker 2: there's been no record. You know, it's really difficult. Me
37:32
Speaker 2: come from the technology world. It's really difficult to erase
37:34
Speaker 2: your footprint without money. It's possible, but you need to
37:37
Speaker 2: have some other means of money.
37:39
Speaker 8: Yes, So what happened with the boss who owned the truck?
37:43
Speaker 8: Did he file like a that it was stolen?
37:47
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yes he did.
37:49
Speaker 7: Okay, is there any I hate to cast shadows, but
37:53
Speaker 7: is there any question of the boss somehow was in
37:57
Speaker 7: it for some insurance weirdness.
37:59
Speaker 6: I don't know.
38:00
Speaker 2: That's a that's an interesting comment. We took nothing from
38:03
Speaker 2: Joe's interview and any person that's talked to us about Joe,
38:07
Speaker 2: he really really liked Ian And if you think about it,
38:10
Speaker 2: he's been in friends with him. Was a thirty years, Yeah,
38:12
Speaker 2: long time, twenty years something like that was a long time.
38:14
Speaker 2: And he's known about his addiction issues. But he has
38:18
Speaker 2: so much respect for you. And he didn't hire him
38:19
Speaker 2: back once or twice. He hired him back three times. Yeah, yeah, yep,
38:23
Speaker 2: given him chances. This isn't someone who I think was
38:26
Speaker 2: looking for an insurance thing with the end. I don't
38:28
Speaker 2: think that's the case.
38:29
Speaker 6: All. Yeah, are there any salvage yards in the area.
38:33
Speaker 2: Tons. Absolutely. We haven't asked that question as far as
38:36
Speaker 2: has the salvage yard has been looked at. Somebody want
38:38
Speaker 2: to note that one. Yeah, that's a great question. I
38:40
Speaker 2: know of at least two kind of those you know,
38:43
Speaker 2: you pick and pull salvage yards, those type. But yeah,
38:47
Speaker 2: there's definitely salvage yards around. We know that his truck
38:50
Speaker 2: was reported stolen, and you know, not that it was stolen,
38:54
Speaker 2: but it was for the Bolo. They can get it
38:56
Speaker 2: out there, and at this point there's been no spotting
38:59
Speaker 2: up the truck now. And I've said it a number
39:01
Speaker 2: of times, this is also the most common contractor truck
39:05
Speaker 2: on the planet. It's inexpensive. It's a dodge Ram, inexpensive
39:09
Speaker 2: for a truck, but it's inexpensive, dodge Ram white. It's
39:13
Speaker 2: white and dry by you, and you will never pay notice,
39:16
Speaker 2: to pay any attention to them.
39:17
Speaker 4: And just for clarification, the the way it was spotted
39:22
Speaker 4: was through the license plate. Correct.
39:25
Speaker 1: It was like a traffic camera right that captured it
39:29
Speaker 1: in the Tom Brown Park area. I don't I've seen
39:33
Speaker 1: the picture and I don't remember the picture having the
39:36
Speaker 1: license plate in it. But we we well, we'll call
39:39
Speaker 1: it Canta share us off as they feel pretty strong. White,
39:41
Speaker 1: that's the truck. That is Ian's truck, but they can't.
39:45
Speaker 1: No one can prove that he was in it.
39:47
Speaker 2: And the reason they think that is because they can
39:49
Speaker 2: see the ladders in the back of the truck.
39:51
Speaker 1: That's what she says.
39:52
Speaker 4: Okay, yeah, okay, because we have no but we don't
39:55
Speaker 4: know that the license plate has ever been I mean
39:59
Speaker 4: obviously its report is stolen.
40:01
Speaker 6: Stolen.
40:01
Speaker 4: Then there's the license plate has not been indicated anywhere else.
40:05
Speaker 4: We haven't seen the BIN number anywhere else. And I
40:07
Speaker 4: assume that the boss.
40:09
Speaker 7: Did not have any sort of tracking.
40:12
Speaker 4: Yes, I feel like if I was a boss, I
40:13
Speaker 4: would have bought a truck for an employee. I would
40:16
Speaker 4: have put some sort of tracker group yep on it.
40:19
Speaker 2: I bet you he's kicking himself.
40:21
Speaker 1: He wanted to, but there was literally no time, Like
40:24
Speaker 1: Ian got the truck Friday.
40:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is it was just recently in his possession. Yes,
40:30
Speaker 2: I'm sure Joe, if he was here, he'd say I'm
40:32
Speaker 2: kicking myself right now because we would probably know where
40:34
Speaker 2: he is.
40:35
Speaker 6: Yeah.
40:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. Other thoughts that
40:40
Speaker 1: have come up, theories that you all want to share.
40:43
Speaker 1: Do you land strongly in any any of the theories
40:47
Speaker 1: we've talked about, or maybe you have your own that
40:49
Speaker 1: you want to share.
40:50
Speaker 6: I appreciate.
40:51
Speaker 5: I know it's nerdy, Michael, but you and I are
40:52
Speaker 5: both nerdy as I like you talking about the geography.
40:55
Speaker 1: And the hipography in Florida because I have no con
41:00
Speaker 1: of what it's like.
41:01
Speaker 5: I mean, I know it's a lot greener than Colorado.
41:03
Speaker 5: But I think that's an important part of your podcast
41:06
Speaker 5: is talking about that setting. I mean, and you even
41:09
Speaker 5: you guys talking about like the distances or the traffic
41:15
Speaker 5: to Tallahassee or like just explaining the setting really helps
41:19
Speaker 5: me because I'm.
41:20
Speaker 1: Like, I don't know what it looks like. Yeah, the
41:22
Speaker 1: whole sinkhole thing was I'm like, is this the thing?
41:25
Speaker 1: And he's like, yeah, it's absolutely a thing. And you know,
41:29
Speaker 1: the organizations that we speak with. One he's just starting
41:32
Speaker 1: and building his own business, but the other two are
41:34
Speaker 1: very established, and they were like, yeah, I just look
41:37
Speaker 1: it up, you know, and there's this massive number and
41:39
Speaker 1: they're finding cars like they were just last weekend doing
41:43
Speaker 1: a three day search for someone and their vehicle that's
41:47
Speaker 1: missing for over fifty years. And sometimes they're pulling these
41:50
Speaker 1: cars out of out of sinkholes and lakes and things
41:54
Speaker 1: that have been there for that long.
41:55
Speaker 6: Wait.
41:56
Speaker 5: Wait, so is a sinkhole like kind of like does
41:58
Speaker 5: it integrate back into a swamp or something?
42:01
Speaker 1: Is it like a hole but then it's filled with water?
42:03
Speaker 6: Is that?
42:04
Speaker 2: Yeah? They can form lots of different ways, but the
42:07
Speaker 2: one that when the ones that I'm most familiar with
42:09
Speaker 2: is what happens is the ground around the top of
42:13
Speaker 2: it just erodes away through these acids, and then it
42:17
Speaker 2: opens up to basically a water filled cavern that's underneath
42:22
Speaker 2: the tops the water and you're basically looking down in
42:25
Speaker 2: what they call the Florida Aquifer sometimes, which is where
42:29
Speaker 2: most of the at least in the northern part of
42:31
Speaker 2: the state of Florida gets its drinking water.
42:33
Speaker 5: So funny because it's totally opposite from what happens in Colorado,
42:35
Speaker 5: because in Colorado it gets so dry, then if some
42:38
Speaker 5: water comes through it like washes it like a sink
42:41
Speaker 5: coal in Colorado is a totally different situation.
42:43
Speaker 1: So I appreciate you explaining that.
42:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, Florida is one of those places that you know,
42:47
Speaker 2: there's a lot of places, a lot of places that
42:50
Speaker 2: you can you can dig one foot down and you'll
42:52
Speaker 2: have water. I mean, it's it's it's it can be that.
42:55
Speaker 2: You know, it's some of the areas where I grew
42:56
Speaker 2: up in the National Forest, you had to dig very far,
43:00
Speaker 2: maybe maybe a foot is exaggerating a little bit, but
43:03
Speaker 2: you didn't have to dig very far to hit water.
43:05
Speaker 4: Do they see, because oh, sorry, Adam, go ahead, No, I.
43:08
Speaker 3: Was just gonna say, like you mentioned, like people will
43:10
Speaker 3: steal cars and sink them in sinkholes.
43:14
Speaker 2: Mhm.
43:15
Speaker 6: Do the law enforcement catch the people who do that.
43:18
Speaker 6: I'm sure they catch some, but the whole idea is
43:21
Speaker 6: they dump them in the sink call. It's washing away
43:23
Speaker 6: all the evidence. They able to separate themselves from the
43:27
Speaker 6: last position of the car and where they are pretty quickly.
43:29
Speaker 2: And it takes the while detectable, it can you know,
43:32
Speaker 2: they may they may spend weeks looking for this car.
43:36
Speaker 2: You know, especially when you start talking about smaller counties
43:38
Speaker 2: and things like that. It's not like they have dedicated
43:41
Speaker 2: teams of divers that are jumping in every sink call.
43:43
Speaker 2: Everybody get a chance. It's one reason these associations that
43:47
Speaker 2: we now have gotten familiar with, that's one reason they exist,
43:51
Speaker 2: and they're they're trying to become more established. And the
43:54
Speaker 2: one thing that we did take away from that that
43:56
Speaker 2: we're you know, we're trying to you know, help them
43:59
Speaker 2: with as far as you've just the communication on it
44:01
Speaker 2: is there's not a strong line of communication between these
44:04
Speaker 2: organizations and law enforcement, which I think is unfortunate because
44:08
Speaker 2: this is free help, free help.
44:11
Speaker 4: Have there been any searches outside of bodies of water,
44:15
Speaker 4: like ground searches? I know it was talked about with
44:17
Speaker 4: like hunters and things like that, hoping to maybe find something,
44:22
Speaker 4: But have there been official searches that were ground searches?
44:26
Speaker 2: What do you mean by official.
44:28
Speaker 4: Any sort of organized not necessarily by law enforcement, but
44:33
Speaker 4: even by family or anything like that.
44:36
Speaker 2: There's been some I know that their family split up
44:38
Speaker 2: and they tried different areas of property, different places they
44:42
Speaker 2: knew ian was to hang out. Was that the ping area,
44:46
Speaker 2: the ping area where the last cell phone ping was.
44:49
Speaker 2: That was pretty heavily looked at. And then we had
44:51
Speaker 2: the depths of History YouTube video if you guys took
44:54
Speaker 2: a look at that as well, where he actually ended
44:56
Speaker 2: up on accidentally on private property out on land with
45:01
Speaker 2: metal detectors as well as as you look you when
45:04
Speaker 2: I saw metal detector, I'm like, what are you looking for?
45:05
Speaker 2: He's looking at the phone, and so he was trying
45:08
Speaker 2: to find the phone. And then he even launched drones
45:11
Speaker 2: to scan the air looking for the truck and just
45:14
Speaker 2: you know, there was nothing. Again, where's the truck?
45:17
Speaker 1: Yep?
45:17
Speaker 4: Yeah, has law enforcement so to follow up? So that
45:21
Speaker 4: was all outside of law enforcement. I don't think we
45:24
Speaker 4: know I don't think we know dogs or anything like
45:26
Speaker 4: that do anything.
45:28
Speaker 2: If there was, If that was done, it hasn't been
45:30
Speaker 2: Obviously wasn't told just by sheriff's office. It also wasn't
45:33
Speaker 2: reported on any news agency, not that we found. So
45:37
Speaker 2: I would say no, at least not extensively, because I
45:39
Speaker 2: feel like it was extensively done. It would have been
45:41
Speaker 2: captured by the.
45:42
Speaker 1: Name, it would have been carried.
45:43
Speaker 4: Yeah, because I just get stuck on the fact that
45:48
Speaker 4: because we don't know where the truck is, I feel
45:50
Speaker 4: like it's highly unlikely that it was suicide because where
45:53
Speaker 4: would the truck have gone.
45:55
Speaker 2: I'm in that camp too.
45:56
Speaker 4: And so then it either has to have been an
45:58
Speaker 4: accident that someone got scared and covered up by getting
46:01
Speaker 4: rid of the truck, or something terrible happened it's kind
46:06
Speaker 4: of or he is like somebody moved the truck after
46:10
Speaker 4: he got into a camp somewhere. I feel like those
46:13
Speaker 4: are the three most likely. I struggle with why someone
46:17
Speaker 4: would have moved the truck if he was just in
46:19
Speaker 4: a camp, unless he used it as bartering to get drugs.
46:22
Speaker 4: But then why did they just get rid of it.
46:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm still you know, she and I have talked
46:27
Speaker 2: about the truck quite a bit, and you know, there's
46:30
Speaker 2: all kinds of it. We even talked about, you know,
46:32
Speaker 2: how the truck not get found. Did it get stolen
46:34
Speaker 2: and parted out, you know, to where it was just
46:37
Speaker 2: taken apart and sold his pieces. Twenty years ago, that
46:40
Speaker 2: was really easy. Today that's harder because everything serialized now
46:44
Speaker 2: and associated with and so it's not impossible, but it's
46:48
Speaker 2: not as likely as it would have been years ago.
46:50
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, Okay, did someone kill him and take his truck?
46:53
Speaker 2: If again, I get stuck with where's the truck? And
46:56
Speaker 2: then the sinkhole thing? I mean, it could be in
46:58
Speaker 2: a sinkhole, but damn, those things have been extensively looked
47:01
Speaker 2: at this point. These three organizations have done a phenomenal
47:04
Speaker 2: job of trying to, you know, identify all the areas
47:08
Speaker 2: that were even remotely possible and have found nothing. There
47:11
Speaker 2: was even one guy that we talked to that he
47:13
Speaker 2: literally launched his boat and scanned every single boat ramp on.
47:17
Speaker 2: There's a lake called Lake Talquin. I'm familiar with Late
47:20
Speaker 2: Talquin since I grew up there. It is enormous, and
47:23
Speaker 2: that is a lot of boat ramps, boat ramps being
47:26
Speaker 2: the most successible place to drive a vehicle into the water.
47:28
Speaker 2: So he didn't find anything.
47:30
Speaker 5: I was thinking, I mean, it's still involved somebody else
47:32
Speaker 5: stealing the truck, but it was like it could be
47:34
Speaker 5: in plain sight.
47:35
Speaker 1: I don't know how cops like look for a.
47:37
Speaker 5: License plate, but I feel like so many white trucks.
47:40
Speaker 1: It could just be like there, like, don't anything.
47:43
Speaker 5: I don't know, I don't know how people look for license.
47:45
Speaker 2: Plates At this point. I mean, I'm desperate on the
47:47
Speaker 2: truck because I even I didn't talk about it so
47:49
Speaker 2: long ago at all, but I haven't said, you know,
47:52
Speaker 2: I've watched American pickers enough to know that sometimes they
47:55
Speaker 2: just find a vehicle that has been in somebody's shed
47:58
Speaker 2: for sixty years and they just found it. Now, I
48:01
Speaker 2: was like, is this thing just parked in someone's barn
48:04
Speaker 2: and they went to hide it?
48:05
Speaker 7: What about that property he was on, Is that a
48:08
Speaker 7: possibility of market.
48:10
Speaker 2: In the barn over at Kayley's house. I don't think so.
48:15
Speaker 1: The cell phone ping the cell phone.
48:18
Speaker 2: I don't remember this there being any structures in that area.
48:21
Speaker 2: It's all woods, it's all woods, since that's the area
48:24
Speaker 2: that I was thinking about of did he just drive
48:27
Speaker 2: out there and you know, something happened to him, and
48:29
Speaker 2: you know, maybe we're going to find him sitting in
48:31
Speaker 2: a truck in the middle of woods, somewhere in the
48:33
Speaker 2: middle of nowhere. And it is a pretty I would
48:35
Speaker 2: say remote, but it's you know, it's an area that
48:37
Speaker 2: you don't go to unless you're hunting. And the thing is,
48:40
Speaker 2: we've already been through a hunting season, and so I
48:43
Speaker 2: if we hadn't been through a hunting season, I would
48:45
Speaker 2: say this is a searchable area. But we had been
48:48
Speaker 2: through a hunting season, and it's in my opinion, unlikely
48:51
Speaker 2: that they wouldn't have stumbled.
48:52
Speaker 3: On him out That is the undergrowth there, because in
48:56
Speaker 3: Colorado the undergrowth is not thick, and being from Dallas,
49:00
Speaker 3: it is very you know, you can't go off trail anywhere.
49:04
Speaker 2: It can it can bury. That's a good question. I
49:07
Speaker 2: would say for the most part, the underbrush in Florida's
49:09
Speaker 2: pretty thick. No matter where you go. It's all those ferns, right,
49:12
Speaker 2: it's not ferns, palmetal fans.
49:14
Speaker 1: And it's the palmetto fans.
49:17
Speaker 3: Yeah, listen, to a lot of podcasts where there's been
49:20
Speaker 3: you know, they've discovered you know, we're all a true
49:23
Speaker 3: crime podcast listener, so listen to other podcasts where you
49:26
Speaker 3: know they've discovered, you know, a body and a barrel,
49:30
Speaker 3: and then like ten years later they discovered the second
49:32
Speaker 3: body of barrel fifty yards away, And so makes me wonder,
49:36
Speaker 3: kind of going back to the searching, you know, the
49:39
Speaker 3: organized searches, how much you know that if that area
49:42
Speaker 3: is remote, is that undergrowth just that thick that you
49:46
Speaker 3: know something is back there?
49:49
Speaker 2: And you're absolutely correct, it's and it's one of the
49:51
Speaker 2: reasons that most people we talked to they haven't really
49:54
Speaker 2: been focused on looking for Ian specifically, they've been focused
49:57
Speaker 2: on looking for the truck. Yeah, because that is much
49:59
Speaker 2: much easier to spot in that scenario. They feel like
50:02
Speaker 2: at this point, if if he's not with us anymore,
50:05
Speaker 2: it would be less likely that they would actually find
50:07
Speaker 2: him based on these areas, especially sinkholes and the undergrowth
50:11
Speaker 2: in the woods in general. But again, you go back
50:14
Speaker 2: to it's very difficult to hide a big, giant white truck. Guys,
50:17
Speaker 2: I've gotten desperate enough. I've even gone through and pulled
50:21
Speaker 2: up you know, Google Earth and just scanned the latest
50:24
Speaker 2: satellite scans of this whole area looking for a white
50:27
Speaker 2: truck just sitting in the woods in the middle of nowhere.
50:30
Speaker 2: And I've even that I found nothing. Not that I
50:32
Speaker 2: expected it, but you know, people find all kinds of
50:34
Speaker 2: weird stuff that way.
50:35
Speaker 6: Why not everyone doing light ar out there?
50:39
Speaker 1: I think, I know, I've we heard about that in
50:41
Speaker 1: another case and they used light ar and they found
50:43
Speaker 1: something that was underground. Some sort of tell us more
50:46
Speaker 1: about what that is for our listeners, because I can't precisely.
50:49
Speaker 3: I just think to so light are it's and I
50:53
Speaker 3: don't know all of it, just what I've heard in
50:55
Speaker 3: the seen and news, But essentially laser technology kind of
51:00
Speaker 3: instead of ducing coals, you know, a sonar. It sends
51:04
Speaker 3: down tons of different lasers and is able to measure
51:08
Speaker 3: and then essentially see through undergrowth to see structures. And
51:12
Speaker 3: I know that they've been using that in South America
51:14
Speaker 3: to find lots of you know, temples and unknown city spots.
51:19
Speaker 8: The.
51:21
Speaker 2: Pylons or the structures underneath the pyramids of what you're
51:25
Speaker 2: talking about. That's what it is. He's right, He's right.
51:28
Speaker 1: This is a yeah, we know this because I have
51:30
Speaker 1: another friend whose husband is all and that's why I'm like,
51:33
Speaker 1: I know we've heard this because her husband every time
51:36
Speaker 1: we get together with them, this is all they talk
51:37
Speaker 1: about is these pillars and all this kind of thing. Yeah,
51:41
Speaker 1: it is one of the you know, it is really
51:42
Speaker 1: thick and it's hard to conceptualize. You know, I'm from Colorado, right,
51:47
Speaker 1: lived there my whole life. The very first time I
51:49
Speaker 1: ever saw bear was in Florida. I'm like, how did
51:51
Speaker 1: this happen? I don't understand because in North Florida it
51:53
Speaker 1: is literally the woods, like it is the woods. And
51:56
Speaker 1: when you moved to Colorado. I remember we were going
51:59
Speaker 1: on a when we came over a big hill and
52:01
Speaker 1: you were like wow, and I'm like what And he's like,
52:04
Speaker 1: look how far I can see?
52:06
Speaker 6: Because you could just see.
52:06
Speaker 1: For miles and miles and miles. But where he's from,
52:10
Speaker 1: like you can't even see through. I mean you're driving
52:12
Speaker 1: down the road and you can see maybe fifteen feet back,
52:16
Speaker 1: sometimes even less because it is so thick.
52:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say, you know, there's areas and especially
52:21
Speaker 2: north floor that can be a little scary if you
52:24
Speaker 2: are not very good about understanding where you're headed and
52:27
Speaker 2: you know you don't understand you know, where you're positioned
52:30
Speaker 2: on a map, or because you can get lost, like
52:33
Speaker 2: it just takes no time. You can take ten feet
52:35
Speaker 2: into the tree line and you're gone.
52:39
Speaker 1: It's possible.
52:40
Speaker 2: That's how thick it is. Yep, in some areas it is.
52:43
Speaker 1: Well, I just want to thank everybody so much for
52:45
Speaker 1: joining us, Like we came away with some great questions.
52:48
Speaker 1: Good to ask several people that we've been speaking to.
52:51
Speaker 1: And I know we'll probably be talking about this for
52:54
Speaker 1: a couple hours tonight. You know, it's already pretty late
52:57
Speaker 1: where we are, but we don't care.
52:58
Speaker 2: It's pretty late, but I've got time to make fun
53:00
Speaker 2: of Milton, so I'll definitely do that. And that's all
53:07
Speaker 2: that's on the podcast.
53:08
Speaker 1: Well it doesn't happen, we can stop there, we can
53:12
Speaker 1: stop the recording, all right.
53:13
Speaker 2: Well, thanks every much for joining us, and we really
53:16
Speaker 2: appreciate all the feedback we got. And let's see, let's
53:19
Speaker 2: let's see what he just comes out of us. We're
53:21
Speaker 2: going to start, you know, approaching people with some of
53:22
Speaker 2: these new questions and let's see what we can find out.
53:39
Speaker 1: As far as we can determine Ian Rodgers was last
53:43
Speaker 1: verifiably seen around seven point thirty on the morning of
53:46
Speaker 1: August twenty sixth, twenty twenty four. At that time, he
53:51
Speaker 1: was picking up tools for work from his mother's home
53:53
Speaker 1: in Crawfordville, Florida. Somewhere close to eight am, Ian spoke
53:58
Speaker 1: with his boss to report that the word truck he
54:00
Speaker 1: had just been given was overheating. It seems at least
54:04
Speaker 1: two text messages were sent from Ian's phone sometime after
54:08
Speaker 1: eight am and before two pm. Ian never made it
54:12
Speaker 1: to the job site that day. At the time of
54:15
Speaker 1: his disappearance, Ian was wearing a black hat, sunglasses, a
54:20
Speaker 1: blue long sleeve dry fit shirt, a white undershirt, tan
54:25
Speaker 1: cargo shorts, and brown work boots. Ian has a half
54:30
Speaker 1: tattoo on his right forearm, which consists of two gorillas
54:34
Speaker 1: and assault shaker, a tribal tattoo on his left calf,
54:38
Speaker 1: and a scroll tattoo with the word mom on his
54:41
Speaker 1: right calf. If you have any information, please call the
54:45
Speaker 1: Wacolla County Sheriff's Office at eight five oh seven four
54:50
Speaker 1: five seven one zero zero, or you can email us
54:55
Speaker 1: at Tragedy a True crime podcast at gmail dot com.