Latest / The Padded Cell Podcast / SWINGERS NOT SINNERS - Episode 155 part 2 - The Padded Cell Podcast

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SWINGERS NOT SINNERS - Episode 155 part 2 - The Padded Cell Podcast · The Padded Cell Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Are you a deviant?
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like those of us who binge-watch serial killer programs, laugh at the stupid stuff people do, and revel in anything else?
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you found your people! Jibbly nobles, as we crack open the door of the path of cell and release the insanely stupid, the weirdly wonderful, and those who choose to live as summers of summice or nobles.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: We've developed into strange, the macabre, the sexy and the rage.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're a deviant, then you have your placements in the path of cell.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_02: Following on from last week, this is the continuation of episode 155.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: Enjoy.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: So um I want to talk a little bit more about swinging.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_02: Oh.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because we've brought it up loads.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, people have done lazy lobotomies and stuff like that.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: But I haven't really talked about why.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: Why, yeah.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_02: Why people swing.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I'm gonna talk a little bit about what it is and why and stuff like that, and we'll just you know, chat between us and all that kind of thing.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, I think people nowadays they've still got this like mental picture of you know pampas grass, car keys in a bowl, car keys in a bowl, um the vicar's wife, it's all yeah very Keith and Sandra in the suburbs of pampas grass and all that kind of thing, you know, pineapples.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I don't even know where half of the stereotypes have come from, to be honest with you, because swingers are just all of you, anybody, honestly, the most normal people you will ever meet.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: And Pampers.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: Most of you will actually be shocked if you find out.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Because they'd be like, What then?
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: They seem so normal.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: They're people, they're normal.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: All the time.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: I used to do that, like this girl used to come to like a librarian, and she's a date.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: And a friend of ours, we can't say who, have don't they still got pampas grass in their front garden?
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: No, they did have pampas grass in the front garden and the swingers for years.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember they had pampas grass?
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: No, I don't think they have.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, what a shame.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, anyway, anyway.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: So swinging is basically consensual non-monogamy.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_02: So it's not cheating, um, it's not you know doing things without each other knowing.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's a conversation that you have between yourself and your partner, and you decide to bring other people into your relationship with full consent, communicate between yourselves on you know what it what your expectations are, but it's all done consensually.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_02: So we call it consensual non-monogamy nowadays, not necessarily swinging, but we all call it swinging.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: I think the people out there who don't get it call it consensual non-monogamy because I think that's how they get it in their head.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so being non-monogamous, but you know about it.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, whereas swinging.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Now we we have to clinically label it all.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we do.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: You can't just yeah, it's swinging, doesn't matter what's just swinging, you know.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: You know, um we don't need a legal definition to talk about something.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, you don't.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: We use swinging, you know, but people like to give things names.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um I want to just clear a few things up.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_02: So swinging um is the consensual non-monogamy.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_02: It means that both of you are involved, whether you actually take part, you're both involved in the discussion.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, most of the time you're there, sometimes you're not, but both parties are fully involved, fully aware of what is going on, both enjoying the dynamic and all that.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_02: Then you've got open relationships.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: Slightly different.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: So they might still go to swing in clubs, but an open relationship is that um, you know, you'll have your full-time partner, but you might actually have um relationships, whether it's short-term or long term, with somebody else.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: It might just be that you're it's just a sexual thing, it's not a relationship in like you know, your boyfriend and girlfriend.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: An open relationship tends to be more of a sexual thing, and you have your partnership with your life partner.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_02: Then you've got polyamory, which is becoming really big.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: Massively big, and I think it's gonna implode.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_02: Really big.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: Polyamory is when you've got um uh a primary couple who have secondary partners.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna say tertiary because there's no sort of hierarchy in that sense.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_02: What I mean is they have the primary partner and then one or more secondary partners, and the polyamory um group become a family.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes the family all participates and they're all one big family.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes you might have the female, and she'll have her second partner who might not get really get involved.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but then her primary male partner might have a female who is involved.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: There's so many different dynamics, it's unreal.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: You do have some uh polyamory relationships where like me and Jim have ourselves and we might have a second partner, and they never meet, we never talk about it, that kind of thing.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: That would never happen with me and Jim, by the way.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: That's not our dynamic at all.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: But that's the difference.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: So swinging is mainly everybody's involved in either the leads up to the conversations, decision making, actually being there or involved afterwards as like a reclaim.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_02: You've got your open relationship where you have your primary partner with other sexual partners that might be separate from your own.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then you have polyamory where basically you can have lots of different lovers, and the lovers often become more like partners, not just sex.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_02: Polyamory has become a massive on the swinging scene at the moment.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's changed the dynamic of swinging, I think.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think it has completely.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: But it's it's to touch on the polyamory, it's been around four years anyway.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's been around forever.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's becoming more widely seen in the UK because there are places in America you can have three or four wives.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, of course you can, yeah.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And there's people happily been doing it for years.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: I want to say it's the Mormons I might be.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm feeling like Utah, but I could be wrong.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: There's a guy I used to watch on TikTok who owned a drainage company, and I can't remember his name, but if you've seen him on TikTok, you'll know his face, ginger beard.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: And he had three wives, and I think they were all called Helen.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Every single one it was a pure fluke, or they all they all had the same name, and he was dead open about it.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: I've got three wives, and he's like, and I see this one on this day, and this one on this day.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: They all lived in the same house.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: He had kids, I think he had kids with the and it was just like but normal because where he lived, it was legal, it was allowed, it was some people found it strange, but it wasn't breaking any rules, it wasn't like a shock to society, it was only a shock to people that didn't live whether you saw wherever it was, because you couldn't do it.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: And now it's like spreading, not spreading, it makes it sound like it's an infectious, but people are just not hiding it as much over here, I think.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: I think people just experiment on more about it, to be honest, a little bit more open, there's more dialogue now about these things, more understanding and all that, you know.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I just think people are a bit more liberal now to try other things, you know, they feel less judged and all that, you know.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but um polyamory is is massive on the swinging scene.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: When me and Jim first started out, it was fucking go.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: You literally went to a club, you met somebody, you liked them or you didn't like them.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: If you liked them, you might play, and then you might never see them again.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's just fucking go.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: It was always just fucking go.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_02: And then you know, obviously, you might meet people who become your friends, you might play with them, you might not.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's it.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: No feelings or nothing like that.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: And I do have a theory on this, that's why I wanted to bring it up today.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: I want to get your idea on this.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: So, on the fetish scene, the BDSM scene, polyamory has been around and practiced and very common for decades.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's very common on the BDSM scene.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: I can actually count on one hand, no, I have three three families who have successfully make it work over the years.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: I know a couple.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: It's very, very, very complicated.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: But it's really common in the BDSM scene.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: And what I've found, I say, over the past eight or nine, ten years, is that more fetishists are experimenting in swinging, yeah, and more swingers experimenting in BDSM.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: I think every club in the country now has a crossover night.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: If it doesn't, it will have soon.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: Crossover means that uh it's a swinging night, but BDSM's welcome.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_02: You can experiment both ways.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like a taster for both where you get to mingle, then innit?
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: And you can have a conversation.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: So it's about you know dipping your toe into the other realms, if you like, and they often cross over, and Townhouse has crossover events where both are very welcome.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so swingers who were just into fucky fucky are now into beatty beatty in a big, big, big, big way.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: And there's some hardened BDSM players that I know who are only into kink who are now swingers.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: So what I think is happening is that the more BDSM players that are coming into the swinging scene, they are bringing what they know and love about you know uh polyamory and different types of relationships into the swinging scene.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: And more swingers are going, well, I wouldn't mind a bit of that, actually.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: And they're now experimenting with polyamory.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well, open their eyes, there's just other options that are out there, and they can see that other people make it work.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: So that's why I think we're seeing more of it.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: Do you concur or do you have other thoughts on polyamory and why it's more common?
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: I can I can I I agree with the the fetishists and the swingers, they're all trying things.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because the more say when when you go to the club, the more you're at the club, you'll have these sexual fantasies, you'll have things you want to try, the more you do it.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: The more you need to push it.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: If you start at the most basic level for all blokes out there, is I'd love to watch my bird with another bird.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's like every mileage.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: But that's where it starts.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Then you've watched it.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: Suddenly that's boring now.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: So you need to push it again.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: So that's you build and build and build, and you become aware of different things.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: You you have conversations in the club, you start talking to what other people like, they share ideas, and the freedom to actually speak in the club without anyone going, eh, is amazing.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: You can't get that.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's sort of what lowers you back in a way, isn't it?
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yeah.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then when you introduce the the crossovers or fetishy guys think, oh, just come along, or you might just go to the club and it'd be a fet night and you haven't realised.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: You start chatting to people, so you then start hearing out their interests.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: So if they do mix like that, do I think the Fet coming in is levering the blooming polyamory?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: You don't.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: You just think it's people evolving.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's a lot of people.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_02: But why weren't they doing that years ago then?
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: Because years ago the world didn't even accept swinging.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_02: But we were still there, so why weren't we evolving into polyamorous?
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: Because you weren't plastered all over Instagram, you weren't plastered all over Snapchat, TikTok, or everything else being loud and proud about it.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: You were hidden, it was an underground society.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you've also got the sort of darker side of it where it's a lot easier to find out what people are up to these days.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_01: So if you were, say, in a secret polyamorous relationship, you could have kept that hidden for years.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: Nowadays, say it was you and Jim, and you've gone out to meet someone and you've got Life 360 on your phone, or he's logged onto your computer and seen your browsing history, there's easier ways to get caught.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: So is it not easy just to have you're already swingers, we're already in this life.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Let's have a little conversation because our mates are doing it, we can see it works, we know it exists, and you're just pushing the boundaries a little bit more.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: So I wouldn't say it's so much the fetishes bringing it in, it's the fact that it's more wildly available just to find out about.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: There's blokes on TikTok who do drainage installations going, Yeah, I've got four wives.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's definitely more talked about, but for me, okay, the the landscape of swinging's changed.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: But the people that enter the scene are just the same as he went.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it's for the fetish, they they push more like they start off with a little bit of caning or a little bit of beating and stuff.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: They're intrigued by that, but they're also very secure in their own little relationship that they might go into polyamory, but it'll be years down the line.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think if anyone did it straight away, you'd be like, that's that's an alarm bell to me, that is.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: If we just go back though, I don't I'm I'm trying to make a point, I'm not trying to get I'm not getting across very well.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: Twenty years ago, it just didn't come into the stratosphere to go to a swingers club and develop a relationship which might turn into a boyfriend or a girlfriend.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't even a discussion, not because you didn't know about it, that wasn't swinging.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_03: No, it wasn't.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: So if you went to a swingers club, you didn't go thinking, oh, if I play with him a few times, you know, feelings might develop and we can discuss polyamory, it might not even be a thought, but you know, you didn't ever go with that, it was just swinging, and there'd been people on the scene for years and years and years, long before us, 10 years.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: They'd never gone on to develop love and relationships.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know back then, even when I started back then, you didn't the only way you'd know if you'd meet when you'd meet them again in the club, you'd bump into them again.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: Now they've got so many different websites they can log into to keep the social connection going that it can develop outside of the club.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: Back then, you saw them, they might have only gone once a month, so you might have only seen them once a month, could have been three months.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: But we had the fucking awful site that we don't talk about were always on there, yeah.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Was that still around then 20 years ago?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: In 2004.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: Was it as widely used though?
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I went on it in 2005, it was for chocke worldwide.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: It was a cesspit even then, it was the only thing we had.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_02: The actual format of it hasn't even changed.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_02: It looks exactly the same as it did in 2004.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, but we we had a means of you know chatting, and you know, if you met some Wazie, I could have easily carried on chatting to them on Fab if I wanted to.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_02: On that site, um yeah, but I didn't, you know, it's like we've had our meet now and that's it.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean it wasn't really shagging go when I started.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so I'm just like I'm really interested.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_02: What do all you think about that?
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and not I'm not gonna judge you, I am just like, you know, how has it evolved now into more don't get me wrong, there's still people out there that shag and go.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: So don't I don't want to frighten you off by thinking, am I gonna end up losing my fucking husband if we go swinging?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, there's still plenty of people out there that want to shag and go, believe me.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: But what I'm talking about is the rise in um polyamory in swinging, and I just don't know why and words come from.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: So I've got a theory that's come from the BTSM community that are coming into the swinging scene.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: You've got a theory in that people's evolve now, they've got more access to information, chatting outside clubs and all that.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_01: The world is just feeding, is it?
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: Because once you're also once you go swinging and you're in that world, and if you look on those websites and if you go on the social media sites, your algorithm is gonna feed it to you.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, of course, and it's gonna keep feeding and keep feeding and looking for new things, and then you'll keep feeding it back because you'll be like, oh, I don't quite like the look of that once you go looking a bit more, and it's just gonna get bigger and bigger and bigger.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, now there's so much polyamory on normal safe sites like Instagram and TikTok that you're gonna see it.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: Whereas 20 years ago you wouldn't have seen it because people kept it quiet, now they don't, so it's gonna keep feeding into you, and that just piques interest and makes people want to go.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_02: So it's exposure then.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's a good word.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: Exposure.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so we didn't have the exposure, you know, it was talked about, but um, and I did on the fetish scene, I did know a polyamory family back then.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: It just wasn't as common even on that side, but it was common, just not as as common as it is now.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's just interesting how the scene has has evolved and developed into what it is now.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, that that was a bit more of a discussion, but I think it was a really worthwhile discussion, that baz about that little bit because I've got more.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: Also, back in the day, in the 70s, I thought that you know, obviously, swing has been around forever, but mainstream, since around the 70s, you know, you may have been on TV and hinted at a little bit there.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: And if you think about where the swing and go back to, you'd probably say the 70s.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: No, it goes back to the Romans, it goes back way, way, way, way, way back further.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: But documented and seen talked about and all that, you know, from the 70s, but they didn't call it swinging.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_02: You open your wagon wheel baz.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_02: Come on.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_02: I'm on the wagon wheel, I've not eaten today.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_02: I've not eaten.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: He's opening a wagon wheel.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_02: If you don't know what a wagon wheel is, I'll I'll hold it up while Baz is um out earnest.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: Taste of heavy.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's a round wheel type thing with chocolate and a biscuit and marshmallow and jam.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Swapin' good, that's what it is.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, very nice.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so it didn't really call it swinging back in the 70s.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe some people did, but it's still a new wish world.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: It was wife swapping.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_02: But what is wrong with that term, Baz?
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: It just implies you've got to be married to do it.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: Nope.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just the wives that swap either.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: The husband swap.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's basically not necessarily broken rope, but it's framing women as a commodity.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna swap my wife with for your wife.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's like a commodity type.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it puts the man in charge, and we all know in the swinging world the men are not in charge.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: No fucking way.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_02: So the whole thing had to change really, and uh swinging um came about around the around the set the 70s.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_02: It was around the 60s, but um it was more mainstream by the 70s because people are like wife swapping is just like it's not on, really, isn't it?
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: I remember when my mum found out she just went ballet, I was alive in the 60s, you know, or 70s.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_01: Fair enough, I don't know.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, so there's been a study done of 540 people who are currently practicing swingers, and they asked them their motivations for swinging.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a lot of reasons, but there's a lot of just like practical, pragmatic, like well, do you know me and me fella don't have much time to shag at home because we've got kids.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_02: So we go to a swingers club and just have sex with our each other, but occasionally, if we like somebody, we might invite them in.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_02: And that's sort of how it's worked.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_02: So a lot of people, it was just like it was just practical.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: I was eating my wagon wheel, but when I saw it, it was more about using your facilities.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was that, wasn't it?
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: We had a hot tub as well back in the day.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: We had to get rid of it because it was just too expensive.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: The water and lecky just killed that off.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my god, the sauna.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_02: Our Lecky belt was just ridiculous, like 1200 quid a month.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_02: So, anyway, the practical reasons, obviously, sexuality.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_02: So, a lot of people, especially females, come to a swingers club because they want to explore their bisexual side.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: Now, they might feel like they have bisexual tendencies.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just allowing the space that that deserves.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but they don't know.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: They've never done it, they haven't kissed a girl yet.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_02: And so they'll go to a swingers club to see if it's just a fancy that needs to stay in the head, or they do actually like it.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: I can't tell you the amount of women over the years who've like, oh yeah, bisexual.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: I can spot them a mile off now.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: Pillow princess.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: And the spaghetti.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, straight until wet.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: Straight until west.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: But even then, they'll just you know, lie their head on the pillow like a pillow princess, allow whoever to do whatever they want, and then go, yeah, great that thanks, and go downstairs, have a drink, and the poor girl's left frustrated.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: That was quite a lot.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but there's a lot of ladies out there who, you know, uh experiment with the bisexual side for the first time in a swingers club with their partner, and then often it just develops from the so so common, like you said before.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: It's like it's the most common start on a swinging journey.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_02: It really is, it just evolves.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: I've said before, a swinging relationship evolves like a normal relationship.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it does.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: It just evolves and you spread your wings and stuff like that.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I mean there's loads of other reasons, but I thought that was the practical one.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: I thought you had related that because I bet you were like with kids and all the rest of it.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: Honestly, the the main there was the curiosity, because we knew about it.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: It took a long time to build up the courage to actually go.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: But it was more like just using the facilities because we could finally enjoy time together without fear or with a kid waking up, someone opening the door, anything like that.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: You think it's look no easy and messy as you want as well?
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then it did just evolve, and weirdly, the side I never saw, which you did touch on, was probably the side that was different from when you started was the friends we made.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, brilliant.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: Was I never in a million years thought I would make those kind of friends.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: Not like to say those is a bad word, but as close a friends as I have from going to a swinging club.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: But think about it then.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_01: And then became going to the swinging club to see the friends, not to go swinging.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: That became more.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then if you got a shark, I got a wank, it was a bonus.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sound.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: But think about it, Baz.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_02: What you're doing when you're in those circles, you're being absolutely transparent.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: You're just being yourself.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_02: You can be as open as and liberal as you want because they're not going to judge you.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody is themselves there, and you tell people things in a swingers club that you wouldn't tell outside of a swingers.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: And to therefore you form trust and relationships with people, really strong friendships.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_02: Really strong friendships.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: People from the club probably knew me better than people I'd grown up with for years.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: That have been mates for 30, 40 years.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_01: Six months after chatting to one of our friends with the Pampers grass, you knew me better than the guy who was the best man at my wedding, sort of thing, you know.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's like because it's it's bizarre.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: I I haven't got a lot of my long-term friends anymore.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: You know, they've moved on.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: Some of them dropped me when they found out what I was doing.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um others are just, you know, you you sort of grow apart, don't you?
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_02: Because you're interesting in honour.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: But I'd say all of my good friends are on the scene.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: I think all mine.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: No, I've got a couple actually that aren't on the scene.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_02: I'm trying to think.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: But I think even they might have died, but no, one of them has definitely been to the club.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um anyway, so the whole fantasy versus reality thing.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm talking about why people go into clubs and everything.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, females often want to experiment with the bisexual side, and the guys are like that, yeah, come on, woo, all this.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_02: But sometimes you know, fantasies need to stay in the head, and you know, what an amazing threesome with two girls and and a guy, yourself or whatever, in your head, it's just like the best thing ever.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: But then when you realise the girls are having a great time between themselves and you're just there having a five cup hour.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: There's always somebody left out.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, there is.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: You've got to be cool with sitting off and just watching and being okay with that.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_02: But if you're new embarking, you'd be like, That well, what about me?
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know what I mean?
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and like group sex as well.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's sort of fantasy.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: If you watch porn, decent porn, it's always so fluid, and everyone knows the doing, and it's all respectful and the banging.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, everyone's attractive and all that.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: In reality, in a group sex, and all you've got a foot in your face, you've got a foot in your face, it's sweaty as fuck.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's like 15 people in the room, it's dead sweaty.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: You're sweaty, everybody's sweaty, but for those who like it, it adds to it.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, you could be giving somebody a blowjob while you're getting fucked by somebody, and then you're wanking somebody off there, you know.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's just and then your elbow slips and you pull that.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and then as you quite rightly say, you know, you're doing that, and then you know, somebody slips by accident, you end up on somebody's arse in your face, and you go, Oh, for while you're there, it's just bad.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: It is the practicalities are never as nice as the fancy.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's very awkward.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then from a bloke side, the hardest thing in the world is all it takes is like the wrong look or the wrong pair of eyes or someone to clock you, and that's it, you've gone limp.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: And then you're going shit, chit, chit, shit, shit, because you can't get it back.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, it's so hard to be a guy in a swingle scene.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it really is.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_02: It really is.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't like to be a guy.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: All the bravado guys are like, oh, I could well do that until they've walked into that room and watched another bloke look them square in the eye.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: With the cock in your hand.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_01: With your cock in your hand while they're trying to get a blowjob.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: They have no idea.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's really hard for guys, uh, just in general, you know, the rules and just like you know, trying to read women.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: Who can read a woman at the best of times?
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: No one, no, no matter when she's walking around with her tits out and beautiful underwear looking stunning.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like my everything, everything inside of me is saying, go over, speak to her, because I really, really want to fuck her right now.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_02: But the other parts of me is like, I'm terrified because she's walking around with her tits out, the underwear.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's like it's just contradictory.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, some like I don't want to see your cock, and others like, Why are you walking around in a towel?
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: Get your cock out.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can't win.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: As a bloke, you cannot win.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I actually kind of like take my hat off to the single guys that go and start it.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, me too.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: Balls it takes to walk into a place like that where you don't know anyone, you don't know anything.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: And to throw yourself into that scene, yeah, is they're always glad they did in the end, though.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: They don't leave dirty often they leave disappointed, but no, no, it is it is tough like isn't it?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's so hard because every woman wants something different, every couple's have a different dynamic, and you're just you going, I just came off with a bite and a shag.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to try and navigate the entire thing and get and you're not gonna get it right.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: No, and also there's gonna be emotions pop up that you're not expecting.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, going back to the whys, you're the fantasies.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes, you know, a guy might go, I really, really want to see my wife another guy.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: I've seen it on porn, I was just singing my head and all that.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_02: But then when it comes down to it and she's really enjoying herself, yeah.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: Some guys are like, oh, and they're not prepared for the emotions.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: Don't get me wrong, they might not jump in and go, right, that's it, you're not can't stop, stop, play, stop.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, they might be dealing with some conflict and emotions inside, and so sometimes fantasies and realities don't meet, and it can be a little bit um problematic.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, definitely.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: I mean what's that's where it starts, like you said, is it's communication.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: Or because even if you do go down this road and you start doing it, and something doesn't go as well as you thought.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: In the ideal world, you spoke about it before you've gone into it, you've discussed what your boundaries are and what you're allowed, what you haven't, so you've stayed within them, but then if it hasn't gone how you thought, you're both mature enough to go, do you know what?
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't like that.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: And this is why.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: And you deal with it, you don't get any shit with her, or you don't get any shit with him because they didn't react to quite the way that you thought they would.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: Because like you say, when it actually happened, you can't take that back now, it's done.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: And you're gonna process it differently.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_01: You might like it a lot more than you thought.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why you push them all suddenly six months later, you're in a polyamorous relationship.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, that's how it happened.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_01: But if you don't like it, don't get in a shit with each other over it.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: Talk about it.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_02: I think if you're not uh adult enough to have the adult conversations before, during and after, you shouldn't be doing it at all.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: If you're gonna feel awkward telling your partner that, you know, this thing we've been talking about for months and been looking forward to, when I actually got there, it made me feel really horrible inside, and I actually feel a bit jealous.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you if you can't say those words out loud, you should not be doing it.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: Is it like the jealousy you said?
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: They might just see their wife or partner enjoying it more than they thought they would.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: They enjoy seeing the actual act, but the pleasure or the noises she's making, he might go, Well, she's never made that noise for me.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: That's where you have the conversation.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_01: She might not know she's made that noise.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Because that's in a way, that's what entices you into swinging, is of course it's different.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_01: You've been married 10 years, you've had the same cock.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_02: You're on a little bit of a few.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_01: Fancy something different, you're gonna react differently because it's new, it's different.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: Of course you are.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: And also, when you're in that excited, inside excited ex uh environment and you're all like, you know, sexually charged and that in that sort of club environment, you are gonna act a bit differently anyway, rather than you know, the way you do in your own bedroom and stuff.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, jealousy is um it's a very real thing, it's a very real thing.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't talk about swinging without talking about jealousy.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_02: No, um, and you know, swinging's boss.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: It is, you know.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: If you get it right and you talk about it, and you know, you just take every step as it comes and don't push yourself to do everything in six months like some people do in burnout, it's brilliant, and we've met great friends and all the rest of it.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: But you've got to be prepared for some jealousy.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: So, even all the communication in the world, talking, weighing everything up and setting your rules, boundaries, and all the rest of it.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: You might go to a club and don't do a thing, but you've got a stunning wife or a you know, dead handsome guy, and there's other people in the room who are looking at your partner like, oh my god, and it's not looking like you do across a pub like that.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, she's a bit fit.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_02: You're looking like, hmm, I'd love to get my cock in here.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm afraid to say that's the sort of language that goes through your head when you're in a swingers club.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's not all romanticised and you know, love, it's raw, hot fucking.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: And so when you're in a club and you know you see a guy, and you know, his cock's just dropped out of his towel, you're like that.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: People are like, I need that.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_02: The things I could do with that.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you've got to be blunt.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: It is, it's you're red hot kind of stuff, you know, raw.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so you might have all this attention on your partner all of a sudden, and it might make you go, you're not used to it.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_02: You're not used to people being so blatantly looking at your partner when you're out again in town.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_02: People might just like take a little sideways glance, and if you see a look and be like that, you know, all that in a swingers club, they won't.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_01: I always said and stood by you the safest night out in the world was in the swingers club.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because nobody was sneakily trying to get like buy you the drink at the bar, don't tell you a fellow.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_01: No, even for the blokes getting women chatting them up, you know, it happens and you're safer in the club because people would just walk up and go, You so alright, you're a couple.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's shagger, you know.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: But what's your whole name?
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: Fancy a fuck.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's it.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: Dead easy.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's out there, it was honest, and you'd be like, no, alright, mate.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, sound.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: You're having a good night anyway.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then the conversation would carry on.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: No one got arguments.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_02: But that's yeah, you've come at it with the right frame of mind.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_02: If you come at it, you know, with a little bit unsure or without communicating, that's where the jealousy and all that can creep in.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: You ever get that?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: Stop right there, go home and talk about it.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: You don't want jealousy to creep in because it'll just end in tears.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_02: It will.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_02: You go ahead with stuff and you're already feeling those sorts of emotions, it's gonna end in massive tears.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_02: And probably somebody like me breaking up your argument in the changing rooms, which I've done many.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_02: Many times many occasions.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_02: Many occasions.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: So there's different types of swinging.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we've got the same room, yeah, fun where everybody's involved.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_02: It could be the same room where just two girls are involved, the guys are sitting off, watching.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's been loads of situations like that.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: Massive.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: So the guys just sit off, have a little wink while the girls are getting it on.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's almost like putting a little show on there.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: I've stopped doing that years ago, don't do that anymore.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: Never build a meaning.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_02: Separate room swinging is where you go in as a couple and you might meet somebody and you go off separately with the person that you've met.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_02: Uh soft swap.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: Soft swap is a little bit um a bit broad, but basically it means anything but penetration, really.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: So it can be anything from just like you know, cuddles and snugs up to blowjobs.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_02: Some people some people even class blowjobs as a little bit more than soft swap, but I would class it as soft swap.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_01: So you see sometimes it's soft swap oral.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_02: It might be that just the girls are playing, and that's sometimes called soft swap.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, she's getting finger blasted and dillied and strap-on'd everywhere.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_02: That's not soft swapping to me.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: It does me add in the way people regard female to female sex differently than male-female parents to have sex.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's like some people say, 'I'm not cheating' because I'm fucking a girl.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_02: You're still having sex.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_02: It does me hidden.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so full swap where everybody plays.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_02: It could be that males and females are by as well.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like a four-way full swap, but you could have it's a fossil swap with a couple swap, but the females also play as well.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_02: Have you ever had a no-kissing rule?
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen it.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've done it.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: We've experienced cope with that, you know.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: Did it once and I was like, I can't do that again.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's just I can't just fuck somebody without any snugs.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: No, I I couldn't do it.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I tried it, I don't know, I'm gonna do it.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: I don't I wasn't.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'd probably try it and I'd probably fuck it up within the first five minutes.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you go in for a kiss then go because I mean I actually did that, and the eye went.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I went, oh, that immediately went.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: Even as a bloke, if my missus was to say we're gonna have a no kissing, I'd go, nah.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I know I wouldn't be able to do it.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, kissing's integral.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: Kissing is so sensual and it's I don't get though why some people say no kissing, but you can give him a blowjob and li lick his bummel.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_01: He can come in your mouth, but he can't he can't kiss you.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I know kissing is something that you do when you're you know you're falling in love with somebody and you know you're dating or whatever.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_02: But you can also do it with a stranger, and it doesn't have to lead into love and feelings.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_02: You can still snog and walk away.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's more risky, I think, to allow somebody to fuck your wife.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's been amazing, much better than you when she fucked off of them.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_02: Your snog and's not gonna do it.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: You get the the swingers that they don't like it, and you know what?
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's fine, that's there.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: As long as they're both happy with it, that's fine.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_01: You do you boo.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_01: But they're like no kissing because it's too personal, and then the other end that haven't quite become swingers yet, so they're just cheating on each other, are going, it was only a kiss.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because it I can kind of say they're right, because it is only a kiss.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, could have been a lot worse.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_01: You could have shagged each other, yeah.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_01: Someone's getting this wrong here.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: There's a song in there, it was only a kiss, it was only a kiss.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_02: Chelsea.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: You did it earlier, you did it with a kiss a girl and liked it as well.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_04: I kissed a girl and I liked it.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_01: Help.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I mean I could have sounded that a lot better, but yeah.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_01: I do, I do, I've heard it, I've never ever come across it.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: I think I'd actively avoid it, to be honest.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, never again.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_02: Uh no repeat partners, some people say.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_02: A common rule uh that I found people say, well, play with you once, but not again, because it stopped your feelings and stuff like that.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: I get that.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_02: Couples only and single women only.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_02: We have well we had, still have in Townhouse.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_02: Couples only events, really, really great for females who are looking to play.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_02: Really, really good.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_02: No single men.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's a common.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: No couples only, really, really common.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_02: No exchanging phone numbers, very common, but people can still meet each other online and all that.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_02: Condons and bearback.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: I don't agree with bearback at all.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_02: This is all different types of swinging.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: People do, but I mean I've had a vasectomy, so I don't need to worry about that side of it.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: But SDIs.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: No, as much as most people enter the swinging world because let's be honest, sex is fun.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: We're adults, we like sex.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll go and do that, shall we?
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: You don't want one night of fun to come back and bite you on the ass for ages.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it's for the sake of what, putting the condom on.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, yeah, sound, I'll do that, shall I?
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh well, got on my motorbike without a crash helmet.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_01: So why will I go to a swingers club without a crash helmet?
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's like And um it's funny because a lot of over 50s, 60s are actually having unprotected sex and the rate of chlamydia and gone arena have gone through the roof for middle-aged people.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: Because people they're getting divorced, finding new partners, or go and swinging and having bareback sex and then getting riddled.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: But they naively focus on I don't want any more babies.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: Without realising that there's a lot more STIs out there than people realise.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, and also guys, girls, everybody in between, your poop hole is not a loophole.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: If you're gonna have anal sex, throw a condom on.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: It is, it's like, okay, it's probably actually gonna carry more.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like now, it does exist.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_01: You've got prep, you've got doxy prep.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_02: But but even so, that's for HIV AIDS, it's not for the likes of chlamydia and stuff like that.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_01: You've still got some, doesn't it?
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: Doxyprep does, but the other the other one doesn't, I don't think.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_01: But hospitals exist.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: I still wouldn't go up my motorbike with other crash opposements or leather gloves.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: So unprotected sex on the swing and seeing, you know, really, really, really recommend you don't do that.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_02: No, you know, because you might have unprotected sex with one person, but that one person might have had sex with five other people that week.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: And those five people might have had sex with five other people, do the maths.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and some people have the thing of don't play with friends.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_02: So I I haven't played with someone who's already a friend, because that's a bit weird.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: I've played with somebody who's become a friend, but then if they've really close friends, no, they're friend zoned.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_02: Your friend zoned bad zones.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_02: That was sort of my problem.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, fuck say.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: Barry's friend zoned.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_01: I've eaten strawberries off your naked body anyway, so I'm done.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you were one of them, weren't you?
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_01: You were on the stage as a human buffet.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_01: That's right, man.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think I took a strawberry out of your foo.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: Probably, yeah.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_02: Probably.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you've seen me completely naked with my legs open and everything can out all that.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: But and you're friend zoned.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's alright, I'm happy with that.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because I do it as well.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: I sort of back to what I said about meeting the best mates in the world.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: Suddenly realised I'd fucking friend zoned everybody.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: It comes to that, oh no, I can't.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_01: No, no.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_01: We've been on holiday, we can't do that now.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's like there's nobody left at all, mate.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_01: Oh well, we'll still go, it's a laugh.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's absolutely mad.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what the um opposite word is to jealousy?
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_02: Compassion.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_01: Compassion.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_02: Who's it?
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's a nice word.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: So jealousy, it's it sounds like it sounds like a negative emotion, doesn't it?
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_02: Jealousy.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_02: Compassion.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_02: It sounds quite a nice emotion.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_02: It's like a nice word.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_02: So compassion is the complete opposite to jealousy.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: So it's when you're actually attracted to watching your partner with somebody else or be attracted to somebody else, so they get off on it.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so a lot of swingers have compassion with.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_01: Unknowingly have got compassion.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_02: Have got compassion.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_02: So are swingers actually happy?
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_02: What would you say, Baz?
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: Not just you know you, but experience of you know watching people around you and all that.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_01: I think they are.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_01: I think they're the happiest around.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: Because the biggest thing I think that gives them their happiness is the openness and the communication they have with their partners.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: Because there's no need to sneak around, there's no secrets, there's no it's just it's freeing, I think is the word.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: And they are dead happy.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: I uh I think so as well.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, for the most part, I have seen a couple of people, you know, split off over the years and stuff, but it hasn't really been because of swinging.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: They happen to be swingers and they split up for other reasons.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think I've known anybody directly that has said, you know, swinging has split us up.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_02: Because of jealousy, because of this, because she went off with somebody else or whatever.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_02: I've known, I have known some people who run off with somebody else.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but I've known that, but uh, but I'd argue that the relationship is great anyway.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_01: You I don't think you could singly blame swinging for that demise.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: There's already problems.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_02: So uh having welcomed tens of thousands of swingers through the door of townhouse over 15 years, I can categorically, hand on heart, say that swingers for the most part are very happy.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_02: Uh that is singles and couples.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we have single guys who don't want to be in a relationship, they work away on rigs and stuff like that.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_02: Come into the club, have a great time, see the friends that they've made over a period of time, go off again.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_02: Don't want a relationship.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_02: They love the swinging lifestyle.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: Single females are saying, they've got kids, they don't want to introduce another fella into the household, the kids are all ready, you know, wherever.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: And so they come in, they fill the boots, meet all the friends, they can walk into the club on their own because they feel safe.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: Know them for a while.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: There'll be somebody there they know as well.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then, you know, move back to our couples.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_02: And the couple dynamic is just it's so so so varied.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_02: If you get it right and you communicate before, during, after, it's a continuous thing, it it will work.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_02: And you tiptoe, and when it isn't going quite so right, give a little break, talk about it, give it a bit of space, and then go back to it in your writing.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: Me and Jim had a break for a year.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I had a few of the time as well.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but you find because of the friends you make, even if it is going a little bit awry and you're not sure why, you can talk to people because you've made these friends in the club and they will go, Oh, I do know what we did that a couple of months ago.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_01: And everyone can relate.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_01: So you're you're happier still because you've you've got somewhere to offload your problems, yeah.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: Or look for help.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_02: You literally find your people.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: You do, yeah.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: You find your people.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_01: You really do.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_02: So would I recommend swinging?
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I can't say I'd recommend it because you're obviously you're going to be that way inclined.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: It's not for everybody.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: I totally understand it's not for everybody.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I wouldn't get into swinging if your relationship's on the rocks, if it needs a spicing up, if it needs something extra, if your sex life isn't quite doing what it needs to do.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_02: Swinging needs to only happen between people who are 100% solid, happy, have a very healthy sex life, and you go to a swinger sort of bring somebody into a relationship, um, just to add a different dynamic to what's already amazing.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_02: If you start off with uh anything that needs to be improved, it's a downward spiral.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because that little bit that needs to be improved is gonna have a magnifying glass put on it, and it's just gonna be intensified every single time you go.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_01: So no, you can't do that.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_01: Sort that out, then go.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, use the build-up, use your fantasies that you've got.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_01: Start learning to talk to each other, and you'll probably find that little bit fixes itself because you're having a little chat.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then just go from there.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_01: But it isn't like what people think it is either.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: Where you walk in, it's not like a Roman orgy, they're not going to sit there, grab you, pull you on the couch, and join in.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's going to a bar with friends.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: I used to like in the townhouse to like a hotel bar.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's a nice posh bar, sold decent drinks, and there's bedrooms upstairs.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's like being in the hotel.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: You're meeting all different people from all different walks of life.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: And it was brilliant.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: It was just a nice quiet night out with optional extras.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_02: And if you're that way inclined, people can watch you have sex as well, which you kind of don't normally have in a hotel room.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_01: No, but a lot of people don't realise how much they quite like that until it's happened.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what?
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: Voyeurism and exhibitionism is massive.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it's also a good starting point.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_01: If you really wanted to start building up slowly, you do it in the dark corner of the room, and then the next time you go, you're a little bit closer to the light, and then before you know it, people can watch you.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_02: And before you know it, your little white ass is banging up and down in the spotlight.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_01: Well, there's a row of fellas having a wank.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's lovely.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: You know, but just don't think you're gonna get pounced on, but no, no.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_01: And definitely don't go if there was a crack already in your relationship.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_02: Definitely not.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_02: And also, you know, swinging isn't just about sex with other people, it can be just about sex with your partner being watched, like we've just said, or watching other people.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_02: Some people go and they really get off on watching a live sex show in front of them.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_02: They go home and have sex with their partner then for weeks, getting off on the fact they've watched all this going on.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you know, if you if you've got that inkling in the back of your mind, you're like, do you know what?
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's this something that I fancy.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh there's so much out there now.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_02: People talk about swinging so much.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_02: When I started out, you couldn't get any information.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_02: You had to just phone the club up and actually go astronomers.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: It was dodgy as fuck.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, Jimmy was lovely on the phone.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_02: He had so many, so many comments from people saying, you know, you've been really, really helpful and when they see you in the club.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you're Jim.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, thanks for everything you know, you're brilliant.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but now there's loads and loads of information out there.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: So much as podcasts like this, there's blogs, there's all sorts.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_02: Have a good read around, there's forums you can go on, just not the fab forum, it's shit.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_02: And sue me.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_02: Don't fucking care.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: Dr.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm amazed it still exists.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: It shouldn't exist, it should be a bullet of anything.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, yeah.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_01: And if you want to know anything, fire us a question.
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_01: Why not?
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like if we feel like you know us and you want to just fire us a question.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_02: But they do, they do find the know us and they ask us all these.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_01: But rather than blindly reading a Reddit for them, you've got to just fire it away.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_02: So experienced, you know.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, yes, it's it's an amazing, amazing world if you're that way inclined, but you've got to communicate all the time.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: Don't go with any expectations.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_02: Try not to take your fantasies in exactly as they are in your head, because they never ever unfold in reality the way they are in your head.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_02: Always use a condom, please, for the greater good of the community.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you very much.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_02: And uh just stay safe in general and be sensible, really, and remember that your partner is your number one, yeah.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_02: And have fun, have a laugh, have fun, and enjoy meeting all those amazing friends that you're gonna have.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_01: Honestly, the friends became the biggest reason for going.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_01: We all used to call ourselves we're shit swingers.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't think we were.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, we just all we still sort of latched on.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_01: We're swinging with each other though, really.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_01: No, we didn't still did, but we latched on to the initial reason why we went of what we thought swinging was, was that's what was still planted in the back of our heads, that's what swinging was.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: But then we actually became swingers and realised that swinging, sex is about the eighth thing on the list.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_01: It becomes or sex with others, shall I say, is so far down the list that it just became about the friendship, the opening you can't you can't describe it, you've got to feel it.
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you've got to feel it.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's just boss.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: It is, it's so so so good.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_02: So I hope that's helped a little bit.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_02: I've gone into swinging a little bit more.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, I could do like episodes and episodes and episodes.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_02: I'd I've done swinging 101 on Patreon, uh, where we look at specific questions like what you wear in a swingers club.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_02: So there's two episodes, swinger 101 on Patreon.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_02: If you want to look at like nitty-gritty of certain questions, but I just wanted to give a little overview of some things like you know, compassion, the whole stereotype, the keys and the bull thing.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_02: We did that once in time house for a laugh, it was terrible.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um say we don't do keys and the bull.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_02: Certainly not.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_02: There's definitely I don't know where the pan apple came from.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_02: Pan Apple comes from Pinos.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_02: Who decides?
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_01: I've always wondered this.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: So cruise ships, if you somebody was the first.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_02: If you go on cruise ships, they on the door, the doors are metal, loads people have um door magnets, fridge magnets all over them.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: Some of them are ridiculous.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_02: Please stop.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_02: They have like the kids' drawings they've been doing in the fucking class, and they stick them on the door.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, it's lovely for you.
• 47:45
  unknown: Yeah.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: Leave it on the fridge in the house.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so anyway, they put magnets on the door.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: And because you're away and you're a holiday and you peanut collada, all that kind of thing, people were putting pines on the door.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_02: And as you go along the pineapple, they're going to go and fall.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so what Swingers decided to do was use one of these magnets that was one of many magnets, so it was a bit inconspicuous at the time.
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I think the I think it was if the pineapples up were swingers and were available, the pineapples down with swingers and don't come and not.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so the pineapple down has become the swingers code, which come from cruise ships.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_01: I knew it was on the who decided to use a pineapple code.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_01: You reckon somebody was the first, weren't they?
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean I've looked and looked and looked, and that's as far back as I can go.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's where sort of started with cruise ships, and I've seen so many, so many swingers on cruise ships.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_01: And the caravan club.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_02: And the caravan club.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's been going for years, you know.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_01: Years.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's like the first ever.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think it probably was, you know.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_02: I thought of like caravan swinging as well, with like you know, sight showers.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because the awning's not sweaty enough, is it?
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_02: Baby wipe washers, no.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: Some fenfresh.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_02: So not the same as normal because I'm looking at my screen, but you know.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_02: Lady lobotomy.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_02: My boyfriend of three years found my sex toys and he's furious.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_02: He believes I shouldn't need them.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_02: So I've been hiding them.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I've only got two.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_02: He went completely crazy and said that I betrayed his trust and he wasn't enough for me, obviously.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_02: Personally, I think he's been irrational.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_02: But I love him.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_02: I want him to understand.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_02: I want to understand his perspective.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_02: However, he's not even talking to me.
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_02: Am I missing something here?
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_02: And that is Karina 23.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_01: How would you say it without fucking people off?
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a red flag.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_02: Red flag!
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_01: Fucking get rid of him.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: Wave the red flag.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's not the answer you want, but so this is a boyfriend of three years who's said all along he doesn't like sex toys, but she obviously likes them, has kept two hidden.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_02: He's found them and he's now going nuts, not speaking to her.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_02: He's furious and said that if he shouldn't need them.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_01: The control there is it's uncomfortable already.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_01: And you're like, Does he not wank?
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_01: He doesn't need a toy, he's got a hand.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_01: He's going for his shit, he's having a wank while he's there.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_01: He's got porn up on his phone, so that's okay.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_01: But you can't have a wank using a toy.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I know there's some men who get um they're very insecure about the fact that some women need a dildo.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_02: But guys I'm gonna say girls as well, but you know, guys.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_02: A cock, a fleshy cock, is a different sensation to a plastic dildo.
• 50:39
  unknown: Yeah.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_02: A cock that's warm, has a pulse, and a man behind it is completely different to a cold, plastic, flesh-like, battery-operated dildo.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_02: So please, guys, pack those insecurities in a bag and throw them in the river.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's just there's just no comparison whatsoever.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_02: If you've got a problem with your partner masturbating, that's a completely different argument altogether.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_02: And therefore, if you've got a problem with her masturbating, then you shouldn't be masturbating either.
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_02: Naturally, I'd be saying to her, run a mile.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: Similarly, in this case, if you've got a problem with your partner masturbating with toys, but you're okay wanking your car, have a word.
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_02: All she's doing is experiencing different sensations other than with her hand.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_02: You know, are you jealous because she can have a wank in a different way, then you can only just use your hand and maybe a finger up your bum hole.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_01: She's 23.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_01: She's discovering her body as well.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_02: She doesn't even know everything about herself.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's so it's a it's a sex toy.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_01: The industry's massive.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_01: They were having sex toy parties back in 1980.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_01: Back in 1970.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: Sex toys have been going since prehistoric times, we found out.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's like getting jealous over a toy.
• 51:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 51:56
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know how to do it.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's exactly what he is.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_01: I love to not be dead belittle into her boyfriend, but it's like I want to shake him and just be like, what's wrong with you, mate?
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to be more brutal, but I'm going to be more brutal.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_02: This is the start of a downward spiral.
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_02: Hate to say it, I've been there.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_02: I had an ex who would not allow me to have a sex toy and said exactly the same thing.
• 52:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you shouldn't need a sex toy if you've got me.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, I'm not going to go into myself.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: But um he's got insecurities, bigger, you know, bigger issues and tissues, yeah.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I would say that the sex toy to the tip of the iceberg.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, completely.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh the the problem isn't a sex toy, it's his own insecurity, his toxic masculinity.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_02: He shouldn't be telling you what you can and can't do with your own clitoris and vagina.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_02: If you want to use a sex toy, love, you use a sex toy.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_02: And if he won't even speak to you and have a conversation with you about it now, you need to search against your position with this person going forward.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_02: You're 23, as Baz said before, you're discovering your own body.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_02: The stuff that you don't even know about your body that you're going to discover through sex toys are going to blow your fucking mind.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_02: So please, please don't stop using sex toys.
• 53:08
  SPEAKER_02: Get more than two.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_02: Get some varied ones.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_01: Go and get a Tracy's dog.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: Tracy's dog.
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_02: Brilliant.
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you get all the different sex toys and you you experiment with your body.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_02: And if he doesn't like it, he is not the guy for you.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_01: And go and find a guy that would like it.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because do you know what?
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's a fucking lot of good fun when you do it.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_02: There's loads of guys that love watching women with sex toys.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_01: I'm one of them.
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_02: Get them off, yeah.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's amazing.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_02: For your boyfriend of three years who doesn't like that, there might be some women out there who don't like to masturbate.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_02: There are a couple, you know.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_02: There are some women that just don't want to touch that area.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um, for lots of different reasons.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but I think actually, more to the point, he doesn't need a woman who doesn't want to masturbate, he needs therapy.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_01: My first.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry, Karina, I've got to be brutally a love because you've got friends around and about.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_02: One you either can't talk to or it's telling you the wrong fucking thing, because three years down the line, you're still hiding your sex toys.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_02: If you've got friends who know you've got sex toys, they should be saying why you're hiding your sex toys.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's his reaction.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm gonna be the friend that says to you, leave him.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_02: Because this is a downward spiral.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's a sort of a lot of things he's gonna try and control.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: You should be able to do what the fuck you want with your body.
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I actually guess that this is only one thing of many that's probably wrong in your relationship.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_02: You're just telling about the sex toy because this is just a podcaster it is.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's probably other things that are going wrong in your relationship right now.
• 54:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'd agree.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_02: Do you agree?
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_01: Even down to probably little digs about what you're wearing when you go out.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_02: Wearing lipstick with a certain shape.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_01: A certain friend who might be promiscuous, he doesn't like you talking to them.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_02: This is a means of controlling.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_01: As soon as you read that, my first reaction was shit, go.
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, red flag.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:47
  unknown: Yeah.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_02: Run a mile.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's not even the fact that he doesn't like the sex toys.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_01: There will be fellas out there, it's how he's handled that.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_01: He he's literally ignoring you.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_01: That is I don't want to use the big A word, but it's a form of abuse.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_01: Silent treatment is a form of abuse.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: And if he's giving you that because he's found a fucking dildo, well, he needs to grow a bit and learn to have a fucking conversation.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I'm not beating around the bush here.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_02: This is abusive.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_02: So um, you know, emotional abuse is just as damaging as physical abuse.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_02: And everyone's been through it, you'll you'll you'll say at points, just hit me, because it's easier to comprehend and understand and package away than it is when somebody is mentally abusing you day in, day out.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_01: If you can do that over a fucking sex toy, he's like, Well, how extremes are you gonna go over something that actually really matters in life?
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he's emotionally abusing you because he's saying you shouldn't need them if you've got me.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, it's emasculating him, basically, he's saying, you know.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_02: And it's all bullshit, it's all a means of control.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_02: So Karina love, please, please, please leave him.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 55:52
  SPEAKER_02: Is my best advice.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_02: There might be somebody out there who are listens to this gonna vic, it's a bit harsh that you know she loves him and you know she's trying to understand.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_02: No, there's a few things in that message that are red flags.
• 56:03
  SPEAKER_02: She's got two sex toys that she wants to hide, he's furious about it, he's already saying he doesn't like sex toys.
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um and he's now not even talking about it, he's being completely irrational over it.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_02: Four red flags.
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_02: So leave him.
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, but that's my opinion.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_02: Love you bye.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_02: Love you bye.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_02: So we have been withering for quite a long time.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_02: So do you know muffin man?
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't got a fetish factoid today.
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_02: I said fetish factory, but it doesn't tell you what my fetish factoid is.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_02: So my ad one, because I've got loads, but I haven't said what it is to print the sheet out to tell me what and to which one to go to.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't got one.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_01: I have to pull one from the roller decks.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um fetish factoid.
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_02: One that you that you might not have heard of.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 56:58
  SPEAKER_02: So you all know this.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'm testing you! I'm testing you.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know?
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_02: The muffin man.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_02: What dacrophilia is Dacrophilia?
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_02: So come on, you lose.
• 57:13
  SPEAKER_02: Don't you dare look.
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_02: Tyler, I know you.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_02: Don't you look this up?
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_02: What is dacrophilia?
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_01: Is that needling?
• 57:21
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_01: Not putting them like feathers in your back.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_01: No, don't hanging.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_02: Hanging!
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, with hooks, suspension.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_02: Where's dacro coming from then with all that?
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_01: My head's going dracular, you just dropped the R for the blood.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_02: No, but dacrophilia is getting off on seeing or making somebody cry.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, you evil bastards.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_02: You were not like that now.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm too compassionate.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, this is why I would never be any good at BDSM stuff, because I'm the type that would smack your ass and then go, I'm really sorry.
• 57:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's not me.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, No.
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_01: So to get off on making someone cry, I think.
• 58:04
  SPEAKER_02: So there's quite a lot of sadists out there, so I just want to say that's a bit sadistic because you'll beat them round until they're crying, and then when they're crying, fuck them.
• 58:13
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_02: I might even fuck them really hard to make them cry even more, or bite them, you um whack them round the arse or something like that while they're being fucked.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_02: To make them cry.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_01: I just think that's a bit mean.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_01: I'm over anything.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'll try anything once, mate, but I just think Do you know who I think is into this?
• 58:30
  SPEAKER_02: Who we've talked about before?
• 58:31
  SPEAKER_02: Preston.
• 58:31
  SPEAKER_01: Oh god, yeah, I probably.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_02: I think you are, aren't you?
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_02: You've gotta be.
• 58:36
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing surprises me with him, yeah.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_01: He probably invented it.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I like seeing somebody crying a BDSM session with a you know, but it'd been like flogging somebody for ages and they're crying with the release and amazing art form.
• 58:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like, because I don't it can look quite artistic, BDSM stuff.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_01: And almost like a real art, you see them crying, it can be quite artist.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's not art, it's just pure sadism.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_02: I've beaten them into such a state of broken them and they're crying.
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_02: That I'll love it.
• 59:07
  SPEAKER_02: Because that's what they want.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_02: If I'm doing that, because that is not normally what I'd go for, but if I'm doing that and they want it and and they've got it, fucking hell, there's no better feeling.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_02: But if I'm having sex with somebody and they start crying, I don't I won't get it.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_01: If I was having sex with someone and they started crying, my dick would instantly go limp straight away.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I'd be like, what's the matter?
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then the fixing, because I'd be like, I think it's a personality thing.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_01: I like to fix problems.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I'd be like, what's wrong with you?
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_01: Let's fix this.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_01: Find a solution.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_01: I'm the same.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't look like that.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: I'd care, I'd hug.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just I'm a caring, nice guy.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_02: But so I'm not into dacrophilia.
• 59:44
  SPEAKER_02: Did you all guess it?
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_02: Did you all remember what it was from our previous fetish factoid?
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_02: Why dak?
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_02: Uh dacro is it's a Latin, I think, for tears or something like that, yeah.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, this is about fucking, I don't know, episode 50 something.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: Long, long, long time ago.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm literally dragging the details out of my head.
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_02: But just goes to show that I can't do remain remember things that I teach you.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_02: Dacrophilia, getting off on crying.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_02: Sick fucks.
• 1:00:11
  SPEAKER_02: Come on.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_02: So on that uh whinging bombshell, we're gonna go.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_02: Do you want to do the thing?
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yes.
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, we'll give it a go.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, go.
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_01: I reckon.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_02: Right, before you do, could you just get it right?
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_02: I just want to show you something while he's thinking.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_02: My Halloween t-shirt.
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_02: It says okay, for those who aren't watching, it's me as a skeleton in like a leather green chair with my legs crossed, and I'm a skeleton, but I've got Doc Martins on, and I'm holding a green mug with purple lazy C on it, steaming, of course.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_02: I've also got um green headphones on with a purple centre, all on brand, with a purple throw.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and yeah, it says pod till I die on it.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's my design, it's just mine.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_02: However, if you haven't noticed, we've got a t-shirt in the shop.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_02: There's been someone's sale, but the new range is out.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and um a variation of this is out there for you guys.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_02: The pod till I die is just for me.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_01: Got it exclusive, aren't you?
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of the gaffer.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, there you go.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_01: So but yeah, yeah, I've ended up got it.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_01: So it's if you've been what if you've been listening, stick the cart along, we'll be back in five.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_01: If you're not, we'll catch you next week.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_01: Talking gone.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_01: I thought you did well.
• 1:01:37
  SPEAKER_01: I think I did alright.
• 1:01:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's alright.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's more episodes out there, right?
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_01: Go and find them.
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_01: If you're watching them all at the same time, stick the cattle on, we'll be back in a minute.
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_01: If you've got to wait a week, I'll see you on Thursday.
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_02: See, I like your version better.
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_02: Mine's mine's very formal, but yeah, you said the same thing, just in a barry kind of way.
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_02: Just didn't you, yeah.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_01: In the winging it way.
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_02: But I know that there's some people out there that'll be eye-twitching if I don't say the chora in the proper way.
• 1:02:02
  SPEAKER_03: Go on then.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_02: Because I would be like that.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, they haven't done the right.
• 1:02:05
  SPEAKER_02: If somebody changes their music on their podcast, there's fuck a murder.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_02: Pesh, you know what it's like, don't you, mate?
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_02: Me and you, when the music changes, oh my god.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're binge watching, put the kettle on.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_02: Let's see in five.
• 1:02:16
  SPEAKER_02: If not, we'll see you next week.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_02: Tra.
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_02: Coming up on episode 156.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_02: Folklore type stories.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, also I brought folklore.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm very intrigued.
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so you have to do that.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_02: If your stories like twist into mine.
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_02: Ambitious me things.
• 1:02:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just a bit.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_02: An Empress is sending people out to check if vampires are real.
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_02: You know, let's keep BDSM alive in our history.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_02: And the penis came out and opened up and like ate somebody from the penis.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_02: You could just like burn some white sage, couldn't you?
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_02: You haven't got to go to the extreme of chopping a hands off and burning the fingers.
• 1:02:55
  SPEAKER_00: KGB vampires?
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 1:02:57
  SPEAKER_00: Great, Samuel.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_02: Human curiosity just blows in the house.
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_00: We can't help it, can we?
• 1:03:01
  SPEAKER_00: We have to be wings all the time.
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_02: Not judging, we don't understand it to judge, to be honest.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_02: And there we have it! Another day made better by listening to the Curazers of Chaos.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks for dropping by, and if you enjoyed the shipping, we'd really appreciate you sharing a love to Panthecell Podcast with your friends.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to give us a follow on our socials, maybe leave us some five-star reviews, and feel free to send us an email to Messi at the Panthercell Podcast.com.uk, or even interact us on Facebook because the love chat studio.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_02: Be sure to stop by next week because, as mommy says, I don't know where I'm going next, but I promise it will be boring.
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_02: Catch you soon.