Latest / The Bold Lounge / Cindy Kolbe: Choosing Hope and Boldness When It Matters Most

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Cindy Kolbe: Choosing Hope and Boldness When It Matters Most · The Bold Lounge

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: My name is Leigh Burgess and I will be your host.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: If you're anything like me, you love hearing inspiring stories of people who have gone on bold journeys and made a positive impact in the world.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: This podcast is all about those kinds of stories.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Every week, we'll hear from someone who has taken a leap or embarked on an extraordinary journey.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: In addition to hearing their stories, we'll also learn about their bold growth mindset that they use to make things happen.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Whether they face challenges or doubts along the way, they persisted and ultimately achieved their goals.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: These impactful stories will leave you feeling motivated and inspired to pursue your own bold journey.
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: I believe everyone has a bold story waiting to be freed.
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: Tune in and get ready to be inspired.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Today I have Cindy Colby.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: She has worked as a non-profit director, a group home manager and literacy instructor.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: She has been a lifelong disability advocate even before her daughter, beth, was paralyzed in an accident at the age of 14.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: After the accident, cindy and Beth became a team.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: They shared extraordinary adventures, traveling from a small town in Ohio to Harvard and around the world.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: Cindy wrote a 2019 memoir of their story titled Struggling with Serendipity, a second edition of the book, launched in December of 22 with a new title Just Keep Swimming A Crash, a Quest and Waves of Hope.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: Cindy published over 50 articles in two years and volunteers for disability and mental health nonprofits and we're all going to talk about your bold moves and all the things that you do to create hope in people's lives today.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the show, welcome to the podcast, cindy, thank you for having me so excited to talk we were doing some pre-chats right before, kind of in the green room before we started and really excited to jump into your definition of bold.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: If you had to define bold today, in 2024, how would you define it?
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, bold is knowing everything will be okay, even after a tragedy, and bold is also choosing optimism, even after a trauma.
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: Bold is also pushing the boundaries of what is possible, even with physical limitations.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: And bold is also to me when I see people choosing to see obstacles as challenges, not roadblocks.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: Really have growth mindset really like yes that doesn't.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Obviously that might be harder or it might take longer, or it's not what I planned, but exactly, you'll keep going forward right, right, and these things are very difficult for me.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: In fact, I rarely think of myself as bold, though others, seeing my parts of my story, sometimes bring that up to me.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it is an interesting thing, I think when you're a bold individual like for myself as an example now you can't get away from me and not see the word bold.
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: But it wasn't something that I walked around with, I didn't say the word very much.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: I think the only thing I said was big swings of bulls.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: So it was those types of things that I think when we're being bold, we're not really trying to name it, we're really just moving through life as we need to or want to, or intentionally taking action on something.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: And I think your multi-level definitions of you know, choosing to see something as just something that is a challenge versus it's a roadblock, I think everything will be okay.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: Choosing positivity or choosing a positive way to look at something that is a challenge or struggle.
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: We don't mean toxic positivity there.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: What we mean is there's an upside to it.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: I think even in your inscription in my book, which I just want to read out loud, it says hope is an incredibly powerful thing and if you never give up, hope wins Right.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: So I think it sounds like one of the things that just to share with you, of all the definitions that I've heard, of all the podcasts that we've had now over 250 that we've taped.
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: Bold is a choice, so being bold is a choice, and so what your friends see in you and what you're hearing is really truly an inspiring story, and I think I love how you defined bold feelings.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: About what bold means is my daughter Beth.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: And for the last 24 years, I've watched her live an amazing level of bold every day, Something I you know, I aspire to or I'm working on.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah and yes, that's, that's part of my story.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so her boldness, I think too, inspires you and others, right.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: And just how she sees life you know, and how she could have seen life Right.
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: So I don't know if this will be your bold moment, but can you share a story or a moment in your life that connects to your definition?
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: Yes, definitely.
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: I immediately thought about, as you know, a significant moment of being bold.
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: There were times where I felt like I had to be brave, like when I decided to write our story, my story, but the real boldness came later.
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: I was at a writing workshop and we're sharing our work in a group, and I had gotten to know some of the people in the workshop already and they knew more of my story than what I was reading.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: So I read this than what I was reading.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: So I read this, and they went around and made comments and several people said that's interesting, you know what you wrote, but you need to go deeper.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: We know more about your story.
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: We know that you struggled with depression and that needs to be in your story too.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: That's part of your story.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: So the moment for me then was deciding okay, yes, it's important for me to share this story, but now I have to be bold enough to share the vulnerable, the hard parts of my personal story.
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, being vulnerable is a bold move, right?
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: So I think that so much in the world today is just the perfection of something, or the outcome of a lot of hard work, or 10 years of work.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: You know, you hear the 10 year overnight success, right?
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: And I think being vulnerable and sharing the messy parts of life helps others see that, wow, like you can keep moving.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: But it is not going to be easy.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: We just even talked about that.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: It is not going to be easy.
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: We just even talked about that.
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: It is not going to be hard.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean it's not going to take an alternate path of how you may need to get there or even take longer than you expected, but the key is to keep going right, to keep going forward.
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: And that was so important with finding what I found to be my purpose in it all, and that is to share that I didn't ask for help when I needed it, and I'm passionate about sharing the message that when people are struggling, you're not alone, even when it feels that way.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: And that it's very, very, very important to ask for help, and if you don't get the help you need, you keep asking yeah, and that it's very, very, very important to ask for help, and if you don't get the help you need, you keep asking yeah.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: So part of me being bold enough to tell the hard part of my personal story, I think, opened up that message and that has resonated with people I've talked to who know my story.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we're going to jump into your story, but let's stay here for a moment about asking for help.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: It's not something that comes easy, at least for me and, I'm assuming, a lot of people.
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: It's not something they, it's their go-to right.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: You know we're we're kind of taught to be at least I was taught to be independent, to take care of things, to get things done, to be strong.
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: You know these are all positive things to be taught, but I think at times it can be very lonely.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: I think it can be.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: I think in between your ears can be a scary place sometimes of how we talk to ourselves or how we view something or how we even see you know something that went right.
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: So, like I think, when we're trying to ask for help, what have you found for yourself?
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: Is something that you've done to be able to see when you need to ask for help, because I think sometimes we're still like in this you know I can figure it out, I can fix it, I don't need to ask anybody.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: What have you learned about yourself?
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: Well, I learned that I waited way too long.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: You know, pretty much crashed and I hope that people who read the book can see that it would have been so much better for me and my family and everyone around me if I had asked for help much earlier.
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so your book, like is, is extremely personal.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: And extremely vulnerable.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Is is extremely personal and extremely vulnerable, and I think one of the things that happens in this world, unfortunately, is people judge us right.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: They, you know people judge us even when we're successful or when things happen that we've never planned, but we figure it out and we move forward.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: You know things that happened to us.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: You know we didn't ask for, but we have to figure out how to make sense of it as much as we can.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: So, the new title Just Keep Swimming.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: A Crash, a Quest and Waves of Hope.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: If you had to explain why you wrote the book, what do you hope that people take away when they read your words?
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: Well, part of it is that if you need for help, ask for it.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: That if you need for help, ask for it, regardless of what the struggle or the challenges like.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: At the time, I even felt like I didn't deserve help for a while.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: Regardless of all those feelings, if you're struggling, you know you, you do matter, you're not alone and you need help and you have the right.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: You deserve help.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: That's, that's definitely part of it yeah, is this how you felt about yourself because of the accident and maybe like, just tell, tell the audience just a little about your story so they they know what we're talking about, because they might not have?
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: Had an opportunity to read your book yet right.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: Well, a little background is we lived in a small town in Ohio Tiffin, ohio, near Toledo, and my husband was a teacher I was teaching literacy at a state institution at the time.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: Three kids, all teenagers at that time actually Just a very busy, you know, ordinary kind of life, very busy, you know ordinary kind of life.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: And then my daughters and I drove to Columbus for my son's college concert.
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: He was at Ohio State and on the way back that night it was very late.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: I fell asleep at the wheel and the car flipped three times and we were lucky to be alive.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: The car flipped three times and we were lucky to be alive, and my other daughter walked out of the car.
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: My youngest did not, and it was a devastating injury.
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: It was a cervical spinal cord injury, if anyone's familiar with that.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: But what that means is that her whole body was paralyzed, from the chest down.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: She did have some movement in her arms, but they were paralyzed too.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: Some of the muscles didn't work, her fingers didn't work.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: She's quadriplegic and she still is Okay, so that part is the same Now.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: That happened in the year 2000.
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: She was 14 years old, she's 38 now and, as you can imagine, you know, the initial time was just completely devastating for my family.
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: The interesting thing is that to hear Beth talk and even at the time not so much for her, she was somehow.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: She doesn't understand how nobody does, but she was very, very fortunate in being able to I don't know flip a switch in her head or whatever happened that she was able to see that.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: Okay, this happened, I can't do anything about it, you know.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: So she had this immediate acceptance of her injury which put her leaps and bounds ahead of everybody else around her.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: None of us could do that, none of us could just accept this immediately.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: But it really served her so well because from day one she's asking the doctors well, what do I do next?
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: She was completely dependent initially and she's saying what can I do next?
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: I want to regain my independence, how do I do this?
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: And at that time the doctors weren't even sure she really would be able to gain any independence.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: So it was such a you know, as you can imagine, all the feelings, all the that initial time was just really tough, and on top of that I put all that guilt on myself.
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: Is this where you really went to a place that you needed to ask for help, that you didn't?
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: Yes, so it's important to mention that I was diagnosed with depression like 10 years before that.
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: Okay, so I definitely have that body chemistry, but at the time I was so focused on Beth, as I wanted to be, you know, I wanted to be there for her.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: That that was my whole focus is okay.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: What can I do for her?
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: And part of that in my mind at the time was not asking for help for myself, because she was the one who needed all the help.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: But even if you're in that situation, you still do need.
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: It's very legitimate.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I certainly don't have the experience that you have had, but I've taken care of a loved one, my husband, when he was very sick unexpectedly, and you go into this, you know, or fight, you know, type of mode.
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah for me, and it was brave face to the world you know, exactly, especially for your children and for everyone else, and right for your parents, for your husband's parents, and then cry in the shower.
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: You know that was me yeah, that was, that's exactly it.
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: First time was my goal, like my only goal, like in when she was in the hospital, when rehab was well, besides just generally supporting her, of course was to not cry in front of her.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: How hard that was incredibly hard, yeah.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: So she was in eighth grade or ninth grade when this happened.
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: End of eighth grade, right.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: And then that was another thing.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: You know part of her mindset.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: You know if this happened in May.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: She says I want to start high school with my friends and we're thinking how can that happen?
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: And well, it did Not easy by any means, but that was been a mentor for many and she still is in her law firm.
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: She's a partner at a law firm is to give you you know where she's at today and she's also just just that.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Just a real, very big general statement, but it's very true to me is that she's had the most exciting life of anyone I know and I know a lot of people had the most exciting life of anyone I know, and I know a lot of people, and she made a choice in what you're saying which is probably unfathomable for a lot of us.
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: There was no feeling sorry, getting mad, you know, going through like I can't believe this happened to me you know, moment, she just owned.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: What's next?
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: Right, that was her focus, yeah, that was her coping mechanism and and she just put everything into that and it just served her wonderfully well.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: yeah, so the book is laid out by the deep end staying afloat, breathing lessons and racing forward so there's obviously there's a swimming thing yes, right tell me how that connects in the swimming theme and let's kind of dig into kind of each of the sections.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Well, the deep end is you know the accident and after and she was not a swimmer, before the accident she was a volleyball player and one of the things at the rehab we were at she ended up at a small town rehab.
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: That's another story and I generally recommend going to the to the big city rehabs, by the way.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: But she ended up she was at a small town rehab and the doctor would not let her get in the warm therapy pool because some people with carotid plegia it's true, they have a something can happen called autonomic dysreflexia, where your blood pressure shoots up and if it's not treated you could have a stroke.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Well, that's true.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: Her physical therapist said well, let's try it.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: She starts having any symptoms.
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: We get her out of water, we check her blood pressure, we do all the things the doctor refused.
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: So you know, this is a stubborn 14 year old who hears this and she's saying I'm going to get in the water.
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: So as soon as, as soon as she got out of inpatient rehab, she started the water therapy where she could get another doctor to order it.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: And she didn't know, when she insisted on it, that she would love it.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: She was told she couldn't.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: And you know she was in that mind frame that well, I'm going to show her that I can.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: Was she like that before the accident?
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: Very headstrong or driven.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: Not as much, okay, not as much really.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: I mean, she was always a very pleasant kid, high achiever.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, doing her thing, but yeah, but this kind of, it seems like it amped it up right.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: Whatever did it, like you know, you're not going to tell me.
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: No, I'll figure out.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Right, right, right, exactly so.
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: She got in the water and she loved it.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: Now, even then she wasn't thinking swimming, you know.
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: To be honest, what she was just thinking is I love this, I can move my body, because at that time, if she was on land it was so hard to move anything, you know, she couldn't move her legs at all and she still can't, you know.
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: So the freedom of movement in the water was amazing.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: But, being typical, beth, even the first time she says well, you know, let me try some things, you know, and they're just trying to, oh, let's move your arm, we're going to exercise in the water.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: And she said, no, no, I want to try things.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: So she wanted to try floating, and which is very difficult.
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: Long story short, that could that deep end.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Part is that she, over several sessions of warm water therapy, she figured out how to float on her back and move her arms under the water to keep her up, which also moved her across the pool slowly, very slowly, but she loved that feeling.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: So, even when warm water therapy ended, she wanted to go to the Y and do that, and she because part of it too, she wanted to get stronger, is very important.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: She knew it's very difficult for people with quadriplegia, like with part of your arms paralyzed.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: The muscles you do have it's very hard to strengthen them.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: It's not like us, you know.
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: We can go to the gym for a month and we can feel stronger.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: You know, no, it takes a long time for people with quadriplegia.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: So she was very focused on that too.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: So she wanted to do the pool as another way to get her arms strong.
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: Okay, then we get into that next section of the book Stay in a float, stay in a float.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: And that was a challenge for her, because after she found that she could float across the pool her, because after she found that she could float across the pool, she had friends in a wheelchair group, teenagers who wanted her to go to the wheelchair games with them.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: And they said, oh, and somebody said do swimming with me.
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: And she goes, I can't swim, I float across the pool.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: And he said it doesn't matter for this and it wasn't a competitive venue.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: So that kind of put swimming in her head and a physical therapy student helped her figure out how to get her hands out of the water and not drown doing the backstroke, you know, which was very difficult, and at that first wheelchair game she meets a national team Paralympic coach, which is very much a serendipity thing.
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: That's part of my, a word that's associated with my story A lot of serendipity.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: I do believe people attract serendipity thing.
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: That's part of my, a word that's associated with my story A lot of serendipity.
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: I do believe people attract serendipity too with their choices.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, their choices Right.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: So so let's talk about that for a second.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: So so she's really going for it.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: You're still at this point, are you still?
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: I'm still struggling.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: You're still struggling, but you're seeing her do her thing and really focused on that right.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: I am, but I'm kind of waiting for the other shoe to drop.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: You know, I keep wondering well, how much can she take?
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: Because, even after she decided so, she meets this coach, she goes to a national meet, big national meet, paralympic meet, where she amazing swimmers and she decides she's going to learn how to swim and she connects with the Toledo swim coach.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: So she's trying to swim forward on her stomach and even then I'm thinking when, what it was so difficult A very, very few quadriplegic people can swim forward on their stomach to do a bad uh just like to do the butterfly, or to do something you know we normally would do with our arms right yeah, exactly the forward strokes, all the yeah.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: But she tried and, tried and tried and she was getting all frustrated and you know and I would she'd want to go to the y again and try and and I even then I wondered well, if she fails at this, you know how will she handle it?
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: Because it was an important goal for her.
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: But she didn't fail.
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: Amazing perseverance, you know.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: I'm just going to keep trying till I can.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: And the coaches helped when they how they could.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: She can do all the strokes.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: So she's very determined, she's learning all the different strokes.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: It's not easy.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: How does one go from having this accident to we're not taught, we're talking about maybe a year later, maybe, right, we're not talking.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Or two years later, like how, what's the time?
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: frame.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah well, she started in the warm water pool just months after, and two years after she was at that national meet okay, so within two years, what kind of conversations did you have together?
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: Because you you've now become, it seems like and you even say it in your intro a team.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: Oh yes definitely.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of the conversations that you have after something like this happens and then evolving into now becoming almost, you know, an Olympian.
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: So two years later now becoming almost, you know, an Olympian.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: So two years later, yeah, you know, I I often say that, uh, I let her lead the way, and I did, because at that time I really didn't feel confident in my decision-making, my abilities, my emotional state.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: Did you forgive yourself?
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: I did, but um later, um later than that time even.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so not even within the first two years you were able to do that no, no.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: Did she?
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, she never blamed me.
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and she has said that, she's told me that even early on and it was wonderful to hear.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: But I just, I guess I was still worried that at some point she was going to fall into depression and when it didn't work out, when things weren't going her way but, she never did.
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: It doesn't sell and she, of course, had, you know, setbacks at different days and bad days, yeah, yeah, I mean it's not like everything went her way yeah, it sounds like a lot of hard work.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: Yes, well, it was.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: It was incredibly hard work and, you know, her doctors credit the fact that she's completely independent in her self-care and that happened about four years after her injury.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: It's very rare and the doctors credit that to that perseverance, because most of us myself included, you know, if I'm trying something for a long time and I can't do it, I can't do it, and but Beth she has, if it was something important to her.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: Like a 14 year old, she wanted to put her hair up in a ponytail.
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: It took her two years but she did it.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: She tried day, you know, not for hours, but every day when she wanted her hair up she would try it and then she'd hand it to me and I'd do it until she figured it out.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's, uh, it's an amazing story.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: In fact, I've done other podcasts and one pod and we're talking in the podcast post says oh, this is fiction, this is a fiction book.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: And I said, no, it's not a fiction book Now read it again yeah.
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: Even just the places she's been, and you know she's traveled around the world more than anyone I know too.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so the next section is breathing lessons and I just want to talk.
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: I just want to read aloud the chapter titles within the breathing lessons and I just want to talk.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: I just want to read aloud the chapter titles within the breathing lessons.
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: It's struggle, storm belong, connect, lead and reach.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: Tell me a little bit about what happens when someone's in the breathing lessons phase of seeing hope, being resilient, really having tenacity to stay at something that could tell you every day to stop, but you keep going anyway.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: So when you get to the breathing lessons section, what we learn from your journey and Beth's journey here?
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, I particularly.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking about my journey.
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: At that time she was at Harvard, which was never on our radar a small town, ohio.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: My kids went to college and other kids went to college in Ohio, and at that time neither her nor I were comfortable with being separated.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: Yet, yeah, yeah, we had done everything together.
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: So Beth came up with a compromise she wanted me around, but not in the dorm room, which she could have had.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: I could have been her assistant in the dorm room, but she didn't want that.
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: So she had a regular roommate and at that point she was doing 99% of her personal care by herself.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: But it was a whole new place, whole new thing From.
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: Tiffin, Ohio, to Boston Mass, I know I know I mean goodness.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: So I lived off campus for a year for her freshman year.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: So that was our compromise we decided on and you know, after the first weeks I saw her once a week.
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: We went out for lunch and, you know, caught up.
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: And so she was really independent, so like you weren't even seeing her daily or having no yeah, so it was a normal check-in, like seeing my parents, you know once a month, once a week for you, and exactly check in and catch up okay right, and the rest of the Harvard years.
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: I wasn't even in Cambridge but um, but for me it was a very difficult time I was.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: I ended up working three jobs.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: Somehow I knew I had time and that was kind of my.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: You know, the storm part there is actually that was like a blizzard year actually.
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: But but beyond this, that storm, it was me crashing.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: It was just like I have to start taking care of myself.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: You know, it was like that storm, it was me crashing.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: It was just like, okay, I have to start taking care of myself.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: You know, it was like that whole came full circle on me.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you had to start working on you at this point, right.
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: She had done all the work for four straight years.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: You had focused totally on her to help support cheer.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: You know whatever you needed to do, you were there.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: You're not focused on you at all, which I can.
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: You know whatever you needed to do, you were there.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: You not focused on you at all, which I can.
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure a lot of moms can see that and I certainly can understand that, that focus.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: And here you are.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: Now she's independent, she's doing her thing at Harvard and you fill your time with three jobs.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: But also that probably doesn't stop some of the stress to that Sure, yeah, you're right.
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: So that was kind of the turning point for me to forgive myself and to get more help.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so where does someone would begin when they're at that phase, when they're ready to start doing the work or it's kind of facing them and they don't have any other choice?
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: Right, because there was nothing like you could work 10 jobs and it would still be there, right.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: And so where did you start?
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Like, what's the starting space to start the work on?
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: Whether it's forgiving yourself or realizing that you know something that happened to you wasn't your fault, but you know you've done your best.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: Like, where did you start?
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: And then some of the steps there yeah, I started with understanding that I needed to share with people I loved letting them in right yeah, yeah and and, but even at that time I just let them in a little bit.
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know the door I opened, but I opened the door yeah, it wasn't locked now.
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: locked now, yeah.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: And all of them said you know, I wish you had told us sooner, but it was a good start.
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: So you were kind of predisposed to depression and so, like, at this point it probably reared its head pretty hard, right Cause there wasn't, like I said, a lot of things to fill it because you were just doing your jobs and your daughter was independent.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: So when you think about those times and kind of where you are now, what are some of the things that you are surprised about in yourself and your?
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: You know what you're capable of doing now versus what you've, you know, gone through.
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: That's a really good question and there are quite a few things I most well.
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: I still consider myself an introvert and it's still difficult for me to.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: It always was difficult for me to speak in a group or anything like that.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: And now you've been on some pretty big stages talking.
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: And this has really pushed my comfort zone in a good way.
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: And I want you know I'm proud of the fact that every year I do workshops at the Abilities Expos, which are focused for people with disabilities and their families, and on all different kinds of topics I've spoken on and I really enjoy that and I enjoy those connections and even after, it's always so nice to talk to people for a long time after and to keep in touch.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: So I'm proud that I can do that and not like hyperventilate Things like that.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: So, working through the fear, getting out of your comfort zone, being bold?
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: Yes, being bold does not equal easy.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: There's not equal in between that equation.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: No, it can be a lot of getting out of your comfort zone.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, one of the titles of your book, the chapter, the last chapter, is Ripple.
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: You obviously have had a ripple effect and Beth's journey has had a ripple effect, and how do you see that?
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I see that especially with both of our stories and our story together.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: Beth herself, over the years she's proud to be part of the disability community.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: There never was any negative associated in her mind with disability swimming through Paralympics, through Harvard, stanford, law you know all of her experiences, even at Capitol Hill.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: She's connecting with people and it's very important for her to connect.
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: She loves connecting with people.
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: She's an extrovert, she's the extrovert, so she's got lots of friends and she keeps in touch with friends and that's very important to her.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: So that ripple effect there is huge.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: It's amazing.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: I mean she still hears from people.
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: Way back in high school and you know you, you talked to me about this doctors, even at rehab when she was recovering, would have her speak to other patients who had new spinal cord injuries.
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: So she's often been tapped by the medical community for that.
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: Other swim coaches have asked her to speak to young girls who are interested in swimming, who have a disability.
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: So that's been wonderful to see.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: There's definitely a big ripple there, yeah.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: And it's her purpose.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: Yes, you know, for me, like you know, obviously a lot of resilience and ability to to get through things that are hard, and she's done very hard things that you know any person you can't do, you know.
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: So, like I'm a terrible swimmer, she would smoke me most likely if we ever raced, and so I just think of just some of the simpler things that she does to just inspire people to the greater things with her overall story and, like you said, it's your individual stories and then together your story that has that real effect.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: Right, there's both, you know and I've met a lot.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: Well, part of my passion is being a mentor for moms of kids with spinal cord injuries through the Christopher Reed Foundation and that's been wonderful for me.
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: Many of them are good friends and we keep in touch and when I go to the abilities expos if they live there, you know we get together, we have a good time and I love doing that.
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: Another part of my story is I've worked with people with disabilities my whole life.
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: You know I've worked in state institutions for people with disabilities.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: When I was in high school I was in a non-profit, in a youth group, where we worked with people with disabilities.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: Even though I had that background I guess it was partly with Beth was not knowing, you know, not knowing what she would be able to do.
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: I knew that whatever it was, she would make the most of it, but early on it just didn't look like that was going to go very far.
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: Right To you, but to her there was no stopping.
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: Exactly To her.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: She was going to be completely independent one day.
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: She didn't know how long, but it was going to happen and it did.
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: How long but it was going to happen and it did.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: So I love talking to the moms early and saying I felt that way and that's the thing that you can actually say right, I understand you, I understand what you're thinking, where you may be, but I'm telling you there's more Can be.
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's possible.
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: And I think that's where hope and possibility and kind of definition of choosing to see the positive right.
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: Of what right?
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: hope is a really, uh, big word for me and I I think it is very, very, very powerful and I think that's what both, what Beth had from the night of the accident.
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: You know she's telling me, you know I'm trying to get her seat belt off and we're talking and she goes mom, it's okay, I'm gonna be okay.
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: She's telling off and we're talking and she goes, mom, it's okay, I'm going to be okay, she's telling me this in this situation and she believes it.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: And even later, you know, and at the hospital, you know, in an ICU, you know she's telling me, mom, I'm going to be okay, and you know it chokes me up to think about that.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: You know she believed it.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I, you know, the B of the bold framework is belief, and I spend a lot of time talking about that, just about my story, which is, obviously, is nothing like best, but there's so much power in the belief in yourself and belief of what's possible.
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: You'll get through something that's difficult and figure it out.
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: You know, like I told you right before we started taping, I was like you know when, when I made the change in my life, like I was just powered by belief, like that's what was tank, that's it.
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: I didn't have a plan, I didn't, I didn't know what was going to happen next.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: Well, that was her too.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: She had no idea.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so she's, she has high octane right and I think, you know, just hearing that, I think, is something for everyone to hear, like a couple of things there.
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: What we just talked about was, you know, you can maybe not see the possibility for someone, or it doesn't seem like even logical to see the possibility, but your belief and just support of that person, going after it or taking the chance or trying, is so important.
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: So I think we need to hear that because it could be our child, it could be our loved one.
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be something like we're talking about, but it could be like even someone trying something new.
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: Like don't crush the dream or the thought of possibility just support them as they're taking the steps to understand and be curious about it, right.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: To see what they can do, Cause obviously Beth found a lot she couldn't but you don't know unless you try Right, and you know that's.
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: That's a big lesson there.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: I think the other lesson we've heard is ask for help sooner than later If you're feeling like, wow, I'm all by myself, I can't ask anyone.
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: I shouldn't ask anyone.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: This is not you know, I don't deserve to be helped.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: Ask and take that step.
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: Start with someone close, Right.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: Don't stop at one thing.
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: One thing isn't working?
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: Question it, try something else, keep trying.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: Keep trying isn't working, question it, try something else, keep trying, keep trying.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: One of the things from early on that surprised me just right away after her injury.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: It's a very severe disability that she has In her mind.
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: She always knew, or believed, that one day she would get married and have kids.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: And I'm here in Washington DC because I have the privilege of helping to take care of her 16 month old daughter, and Beth is also.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: Her second child is due in February, another little girl.
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: She lives with her husband, dan, and you know it just happened the way she thought it would.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: And I need the power of belief, you know yeah, and that she set her mind to like I'm going to have what the life I want to have, right, right and when I want it.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: You know, you know she didn't even date much at Harvard.
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: I guess a little bit, but not really.
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: You know it wasn't like this was a big focus for her that she was working on, it was just like I just know, down the road it's going to happen and and and it did.
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so like you can't miss what's meant for you.
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: I think that kind of is also the takeaway from this as well, and so many lessons from your story.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: All the information about the book and to connect with Cindy and Beth is below in the episode notes.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: Any closing words you'd like to share with the listeners as they create really their own quest, as they hope and see their future moving forward.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: One thing I want to mention is that I love to hear from people, and if you are struggling and if part of the help that you would like is just someone to listen, I'm a good listener and I also have enjoyed friendships I've made with people online.
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so connect.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: The best way to get ahold of you is how.
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: Facebook Okay, my page on Facebook is Just Keep Swimming.
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: Okay, great, it also combined with Just Keep Swimming book.
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I'd love to hear from you.
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: All right, wonderful.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being on the Bold Lounge and for inspiring us today with your and Beth's story.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: Through the continuum of bold stories vulnerability to taking a leap you will meet more extraordinary people making a positive impact for others through their unique and important story.
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: By highlighting these stories, we hope to inspire others and share the journey of those with a bold mindset.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: We hope you've enjoyed this podcast and look forward to sharing the next bold journey with you.