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Finishing Strong with Jermal McCoy: Graduation Support in a Virtual School · GCA Unmuted: Voices of Virtual Education

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to GCA Unmuted, the podcast where we share the stories and strategies that show how Georgia Cyber Academy makes online learning work.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: Graduation may be the finish line, but it takes structure or strategy and strong support systems to get there.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: At GCA, a team of graduation coaches works behind the scenes and alongside students to make sure no one crosses that stage alone.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm joined today by Jamal McCoy, our GCA's graduation coach manager.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: He leads the team of coaches who help guide students toward that all-important milestone graduation.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: We'll explore how GCA's graduation support system works, what it takes to manage and scale personalized support in a virtual setting, and how the team celebrates each step toward the finish line.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: So, Jramal, thanks for being here.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh to lead off, can you share a moment or story where the graduation coach team helped turn things around for a student or a group of students?
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: No, but and and first of all, thank you for having me on GCA's Unmuted.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: I watch the program regularly and I'm happy to be a part of it.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you for the invite and give me a chance to talk about the uh graduation coaches and some of the things that we do because we are the quote-unquote unsung heroes in the background.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: We don't look for public accolloids or anything like that it's all about the relationships that we've built with these with the students and the families at GCA.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I could say a couple stories, so many.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like literally, we I report out stories on a monthly basis, so trying to find the right ones.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: But I have one particular student that um that comes to mind that I know several people had a hand in helping the student cross the finish line.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: And because starting out, I won't say the student's name, but I'll just kind of give you an idea.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: It was a female student who was really about to age out of high school.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: The new thing in high school is sometimes it's for four years and sometimes it's five.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it's been a shift in the educational world.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: However, because life happens, and a lot of our students are working full-time.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: Some of them are working full-time, and we have to help them cross that finish line.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: But with this particular student, she was the she was down, she was depressed, and it was just another level.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: And we got her um the year before she aged out.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: So once she before she turned 21 years old.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: So let's be realistic.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: A virtual student who doesn't go to a brick and mortar building and they're 19, 20 years old, the motivation to finish high school is very, you know, it's not really there.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: There's no motivation to graduate.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's especially if people don't have to walk down the hallway to see you and things like that.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that embarrassing moment isn't really there.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's just about your family and you that knows the truth.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: However, this student wanted to dive in.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: She wanted to finish.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: So we, you know, at GCA created a program called FTA, where we have graduation coaches assigned to that group as well.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: And this is for those kids who are about to age out.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: This particular student went from about to age out needing a multitude of credits to recover, a multitude of credits.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I've never seen a student grind so passionately for their future that it really, she took ownership.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: Simple as that, she took ownership of her of her of her of her life, and our graduation coach really just kind of jumped in and helped guide her through that ownership.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: So now we are three years later.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: This particular student now comes back to our uh our uh we call it our VIP program, vocational information sections.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: She is currently in college, about to get her, she finishes her certification in December to be a uh photonomist.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: So she goes, she's gone from not about to graduate at all to having a nice career with certifications and making better money than us.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: So that's awesome.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right there.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: So yes.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: What a what a story.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_01: And what was what was your role in that story, Jamal?
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like were you uh kind of in the background leading um the coach, the the the actual coach that was hands-on?
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: Did you ever get your get in the nitty-gritty of all that?
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: Were you at the systems level?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: What was your role in that story?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: Here's a great thing.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: I I've I feel my role as a graduation coach manager as a whole is literally to remove barriers for our graduation coaches who run up against barriers.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: I and I'm in the background.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: The kids actually get a chance to know me because I pop into all of their virtual sessions just to, you know, I do crazy stuff.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'll pull out a wig and I'll pull a wig on.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: I do all, you know, it's all kind of things just to keep them in our.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm the comic relief.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: But in the background, I'm really the one pushing and you know, letting the graduation coaches go, hey, let's focus on this area, let's focus on these kids for this week.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: Let's focus on these.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: If a kids are having an issue with with uh teachers, and hey, let me talk to the admin and let's see what's going on with this teacher so we can offer opportunities for our kids to actually cross that finish line.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes, sometimes our students just need a little motivation.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes they need positive.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: These are the kids who don't receive accolades in any way, shape, or form in high school, like at all.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: So we actually provide some a space where we celebrate these kids because they're they're they're working through factors that normal kids don't have to work through.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm more of a facilitator and removal of all barriers that might come, they might, the graduations might come coaches come against, or even the students might come against.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: So if they have an issue with the teacher, I'll be that liaison.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: So the graduation coach keeps a positive relationship with the teacher, I can be the good guy, good cop, bad cop type deal.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: So you're you're the good cop and the bad cop sometimes, I would imagine.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so uh it sounds like the graduation coach space um is really not just supporting these students academically, but like the whole student, really, because you said that in this story, this student was like depressed, they were upset, you know.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_01: So it sounds like uh this the the work that y'all are doing is not just like hey, let's make sure we get a bunch of credits, but like really meeting the whole student and helping the whole student, supporting the whole student.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: That story behind the student is is the is the key.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like you and to get that story, you've got to build that trust for a kid to share what's really going on at home.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: And that's until you build the trust, you'll never know the real story.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: So you kind of uh mentioned, and it's great that we kind of know now like your role, you see your position as like, hey, let me remove barriers so that my coaches can do their jobs best, right?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: So can you kind of explain then what is the graduation coach model at GCA and how is it structured across the school?
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: Is it only for 12th graders?
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: Does everybody get a graduation coach?
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_01: Is it are you assigned a graduation coach if you think, hey, this student looks like they might not graduate on time?
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, can you tell us a little bit about like what it what is the graduation coach model, anyways, and uh what do the coaches do and and your barrier lifting as well?
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: Good, good question.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I will say um operationally, so to receive a graduation coach, everybody doesn't get one.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh we are limited with who we touch and how we touch.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: And here's a here's a here's GCA secret sauce.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: Secret sauce is we have 10 graduation coaches.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: 10.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: Most public high schools have one, two max.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and with to receive one, you have to be off-cohort and credit deficient.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, you're gonna be off-cohort if you are credit deficient, but some kids are off, they're credit deficient, but they're not off-cohort, so they're just missing one or two credits, so they don't really need a graduation coach.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: All of our students, every single one of them, are credit deficient and off-cohort, which means they're not gonna graduate on time if they keep going on the pace that they're going.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, what our coaches, what we do is we literally we start out with the intro, let everybody know who we are, we meet with the parents because we have to establish that relationship with the parents first.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they could so they can open and open the door for their for their most prized thing, or their children, you know.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: And once they open that door and we get access to their children, we get down dirty and we know all the family business.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: We know about brothers, sister, uncle, cousin, uh, grandmother, grandpa, we know all of them because sometimes the learning coach isn't the one that that that will actually push the kids where we need them to be.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the learning coach is then is an enabler and we have to go somewhere else.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: But um, so once we have that, the caseloads, all of our graduation coaches have a caseload of about 60 students right now.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: And we've done a great job of scaling that down from 200.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: When we had four graduation coaches, to now we have the 10 and we have scaled it down to about 60 per graduation coach.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: And they have the, I think the importance of that is the fact that they have the caseload that's large enough to really dig in, but small enough to be personalized.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, as you know, each kid doesn't perform at the same level.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes that light bulb doesn't go off until a little bit later.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it goes early.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: Wait, I'm behind.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: Let me do what I need to do to get caught up.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, I'm behind and I'm just not feeling it.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: This is school isn't what I want to do.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be an influencer.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, don't we all?
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So, how do we conquer that?
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how do we get through that?
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: We a, the very first thing is to build that relationship with the student and the parents.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing is we all we host sessions every Monday called uh kickback sessions, and this is just a guided session on some different topics that we talk about we know at-risk kids need.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: But and then then the rest of the week, we have a red group, yellow group, green group, and credit recovery the rest of the day.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: So Monday is kickback session.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: Typically, and I let the graduation coaches structure their days for which group they want to attack, but the red group are students that are failing two or more classes.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um no, red group is three or more classes, and they're only passing one or they're not passing any at all.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: Those intensive IC, I call it the ICU room.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: So we have to go in and really, and the thing about those is when we get to that level, the red group, we're not so much talking about academics.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: We're really talking about what's happening, what's what is stopping you from even wanting to do your work?
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: Or and we really get into the who or why.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the yellow group, they're filling two or more classes, and we're then now we've got some momentum.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: We've built some momentum, we want to keep that momentum going.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: Green group, we're gonna keep positively motivating you and pushing you and just saying and giving you positive words, affirmation, like daily, we give you feedback, daily messages, but it's just to keep you going.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then the credit recovery group, we have a Friday that's credit recovery day, and we we send out our feel-good, friendly notifications to everybody.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that but even if you haven't you're not passionate class, we'll send a message saying, Hey, Johnny completed three assignments this week.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's more than he did last week.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: Celebrate, congratulations for doing that XYZ.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: What that usually does is sparks the next week.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: They'll do four or five, and they like that.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Positive reinforcement, it's positive reinforcement that they don't get because everywhere else, every other student, every other teacher is calling them or principals calling telling them you're not doing XYZ XYZ.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: And we get the calls, hey, you did this.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Good job.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: So next week, you're gonna get those same calls, filter them out and listen for these.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna we're gonna take you one step at a time.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna hold your hand to get you to that stage so you can walk.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: That's literally what that's literally kind of what we do.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: And we employ the teachers who are graduation coaches to begin with, by our title, by trade, even you, we're all graduation coaches.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's sometimes it takes positive stories to get you across, you know, to get you motivated.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: So we just literally inspire not just our students, but their teachers to really reach out to these kids to get to know them deeper than them than their student IDs.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's it sounds like the uh process is like a snowball.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's hard to get started, but once they do, they can maybe keep track and that y'all's positive reinforcement helps them, and then all of a sudden, I was gonna ask, this leads me to does anyone ever um like graduate from a graduation coach?
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: Or once you have a graduation coach, do do you keep the graduation coach through graduation?
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: Good question.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: And no, you can graduate from a graduation coach.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: And look, we do.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: So here's a here's kind of our intake is man, unless you transfer in.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: I take the after the first semester of a ninth grader, if they're failing two or more classes, they immediately have a graduation coach.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: So we catch them early now.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: Once they're caught, and let's say that next year they get caught up, they're back on track, and they're sophomores.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: They're sophomores now, they finished, you know, they're back on track.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: We'll use that next year to make sure they're good.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: We keep them for one year, whether they're we we're gonna keep you for one, two, two full semesters, and then after that, if you're good to go, we'll release you.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Your senior year, we feel like you're good, you can go ahead and enjoy your senior year, and you're back on track to graduate with your cohort.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: So it's kind of like a probationary period a little bit when it when they're when they're good.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and when you mentioned like your main role is the way I support my coaches is I remove barriers.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: Can you give us any like specifics or things that come to mind without throwing people under the bus?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um you know, that that would be like here's some here's some barriers that that help uh your graduation coaches and help the students.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I would say even within my role itself, I provide them, I give them data on a on a daily basis, just about even just I find I find different tickets, different outliers where we can actually, hey, let's focus on this.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: And literally I do that on a daily basis to make sure they're they're doing up.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: And we watch pass rates, we watch pass rates religiously.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: We just do.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's just one of those, we're marketing, you know, throughout the throughout the week, throughout it's almost whenever a K12 report comes out, I'm analyzing that data.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: I'm stuck, I'm doing all kinds of stuff, and we're showing them like, hey, you know, if I have a graduation coach, do you not?
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: You haven't called this kid that much.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: What's going on?
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I spot check them a lot.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: I spot check my graduate grad coaches a lot.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: I say, I just got to call about this student.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: I know the name, say the name, what's going on with them?
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'll just be quiet.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to hear the story.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: I want them to then once I know they know the story, okay.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's let's talk about let's let me say what's really going on.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: And then barriers that I remove are we got some barriers where you know, here's a good thing about the teachers and the different teams at GCA.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody is concerned.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: You might not think that and people are looking at your data and stuff like that, but every every from the teacher to the principal to the FELs to the administrations, um, to the to the attendants people, everybody's everyone is concerned about just your student success.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: Now, reeling at those roles in is where we got to come in.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's where I will reel the role in, where hey ISS, your role is for us to do this, not talk about these things.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: Academically, you're focused on that particular class they might be struggling in, not everything else that's going on within the household, because at that point you're taking away from our roles, building that relationship with the families and stuff like that.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: FEL's roles, they deal with the technical issues, they deal with the family as a unit, we deal with that particular student and what they're what's going on in the academics and that for all their classes, all their missing assignments.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: We dive in before we make a phone call, we dive in, we look at the canvas page, see what's missing, what's you know, where can gaps be filled, and then we'll we'll make that phone call.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's it's just that would be the barriers that some of the barriers that we do is really trying to keep everybody in their own lanes so that the kid can feel supported, not overwhelmed.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's what I was gonna ask.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Is it it sounds like I mean, obviously a GCA, a great thing, you know, I guess you could say a blessing and a curse is we have all these support systems available for our students and different staff members for different roles and purposes for student support.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: But how do you all uh make sure, like you said, students don't feel overwhelmed with like, well, geez, I just spoke with XYZ about this, and now you're talking.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: Is there any is there because it brought up a thought when you were talking about that?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is there any collaboration between the different uh departments, the FELs, the graduation coach managers, the um even like ISS and stuff?
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like, are do you is there any type of like monthly collaboration or weekly or anything like that among you guys?
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: Do you all do any of that or no?
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: That's a great question.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we do.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: And that just started a couple years ago, and it's one of the best things ever because if there's if here's a great one of the great scenarios, a great situation.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: We'll meet once a month, and you're you'll hear somebody say, Has anybody talked to this kid?
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: I know the graduation coach is here.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: Can we and we'll take and they'll go to a breakout room and they'll catch each other up on what they know about a student or whatever, and then they literally work collaboratively.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the graduation coach can't get the kid on the phone, but you look in a call log and you'll see, oh, the FEL talked to him yesterday, or this teacher spoke with them, you know, two days ago.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's the point where those teachers can actually come in and and everybody can kind of go in and talk about these particular students.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it's typically those hard-to-reach families, not just the students, but the families where you can't get them on the phone with this one person at GCA that somebody connected with, and then we'll use that person as our point person to get all that information that we need.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_00: And we'll use that person to drive them to other people to let them know there's more than just one person helping you out here.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: You have a plethora.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you have a team, you've you've got a team.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: And that, and I think that's one of the biggest things.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's crazy because I've been a coach almost all my, you know, my professional life, this seems like.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: So now coaching coaches is the next evolution of that.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of what I feel like I'm doing because we do a lot of we do a lot of PDs on literally coaching, just coaching as a as a as a as a profession, you know, and that what comes with coaching is it's is counseling, like even our counseling team.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of times people don't associate the counselors with the graduation coaches, then they work hand in hand with each other for students.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: So if we feel like a student is outside of our scope when it comes to dealing with a mental or social issue, it's not we have an expert for that.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: We refer them to the counselor.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's great.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: That makes a lot of sense.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: How do your coaches then balance and and how do you or do you have or does does a coach come to mind?
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to say their name, don't want to embarrass them or anything, but like when you think about someone who balances academic check-ins, but also the motivation piece, the accountability piece, the encouragement piece, can does anyone come to mind that you're like, man, that coach does that really well?
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: And what what about what about that?
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: If you could if you could take that and pull it out and put it into all of your coaches.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: What is that recipe of how they're really balancing these academic check-ins with making sure they're motivated, making sure they're held accountable and also encouraged at the same time?
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: Man, here's the crazy part.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: I could say probably 90% of my coaches are like this.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: And each of them have their own styles.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: It was I was and like even so before me as a graduation coach manager, there were two graduation coaches prior to me, but it just kind of got the program started.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_00: They kind of laid the foundation for this whole thing.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: They they know who they are.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um and they laid the foundation for the expectation of coaches.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_00: And when I met those them two, and I was like, wait a minute, that's those qualities in a person, empathy, um, motivation, drive, and literally the heart for the job is what I'm gonna hire from.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: So, like, even some of the questions that you're asking me in this interview, I asked during my own interviews to see if they don't have a story for where they help the kid, I can't even I can't even entertain that, I can't entertain it at all.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: So, all of our coaches have this, they have this special sauce with them that we found during the interviews.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: And everybody's different.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's the one thing.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: All our coaches operate differently, but I would say the one mainstream that goes across the successful for those seven, eight graduation coaches that know almost nine, ten, is the fact that they can put themselves in the student's shoes.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: That's one of the things they can they can remove, they can, they're not just authoritative when they're thought where you do X, Y, and Z, X, Y, and Z, X, Y, and Z, and they're just badgering the student.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about that.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: We we put a lot of um, and and especially the successful ones, they literally have a standard of expectation.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: And our kids don't want to disappoint.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: I've I've seen emails with the kids, I hate I disappointed you this week.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's the disappointment from somebody else that really kind of gets it.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: But the only way a student will feel disappointed is if they feel like you care.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_00: And our graduation coaches literally have sessions and in the morning, they'll have a couple kids, they might meet.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: We have one coach who does a video for her kid, a video for her students and her parents every day.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: Every single day.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, every day.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then we have some that do a lunch bunch in a sense, and then we have an after school where they come in and after, and sometimes after schools are academic, sometimes it's just social because the social aspect leads to leads to academic success.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: Every moves that I'm online in class, I'm online in class, I'm working, I'm working, I'm working.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's kind of okay, I'm on in line in class, I'm with some friends that I met doing other things, and now I can actually ask them hey, you know, I'm having trouble in science.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: You are you good in science?
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: Can we talk?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: Can we mean a break our room and go to do some science, help me with my science?
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it be it breeds a atmosphere of encouragement, you know, and then we build uh an atmosphere of stress, but positive stress, use stress.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: So it's uh no zero November we're in now.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Everything we're talking about, who's got no zeros right now?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's day November 3rd.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: Any assignment that was due in November needs to be done, completed.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're not doing it, we're gonna ask when you come into the MVP and the into into the uh kickback sessions, is hey, everybody on everybody online, you have no zeros right now?
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: If not, go to this breakout room.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: Let's knock the zeros out.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: When you come back, everybody's gonna be a no zero November, and we keep that flow.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: And then usually we have a prize at the end of the month and stuff like that.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a it's a lot of different tricks and tips that we use to capture these kids and and to cross to get them over.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: No, I love that.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's so good.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think then, Jamal, other schools, uh, whether they're brick and mortar, whether they're virtual, could learn from GCA's approach to managing like graduation success?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe they don't have graduation coaches, maybe maybe they do, uh, maybe they need to expand their program, or maybe they don't even have a graduation coach manager like what you do.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but what do you think?
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: What comes to mind uh when you think about GCA's approach and what you think other schools, whether virtual or brick and mortar, could learn from what we do at GCA?
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I would say number one, top of the list, relationships before results.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: Right that relationship, you gotta build a relationship with the student and their families before you before you'll see results.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: And and in that, what drives, what drives that relationship, what drives the and what those push, you gotta know the push-pull.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: If you don't know a what uh a good push-pull pushing, you push the student towards success.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: But then you might pull back because you know what something else is happening.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's not acting, it's something at home.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: Let me pull back and dig more into the social emotional piece so they can so now I can push it.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, let me put your shoes on you and put the wheels and everything.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now I can push it.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: But if I can't push you, if you don't have wheels on you, you know, it's gotta be somewhere to go.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think most school districts hate, and I see a lot of uh graduation coaches, they get defined in public schools and when there's one or two, they're overwhelmed.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have you have the entire 12th grade, 11th, you have the whole school at the end of the day, from high school, ninth through 12th grade to find these kids and these outliers and figure out what's wrong with them.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: However, in brick and mortar, there's no time unless you graduate from after school and those two students are either skipping.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: When school's out, they're gone.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: They're the first ones out the building, you know, or um, or they're not coming to school at all.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not beyond us to go knock on someone's door.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: Virtually.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: Even virtually, we'll knock on the door.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: However, I think if if public schools added more graduation schools, it was a great program that um the governor input it into the into our educational systems.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it works for us, and I think any virtual school has to have a defined team of this sort so they can find out what's going on behind the screen.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_00: If you don't know what's going on behind the screen, the kids they're already at-risk students.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: They're there.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: We know that they're there.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: We know that everybody's household isn't equal.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: So, and it's and here's the other part.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: You might have some of the most successful households, but the parents are working all day, every day, and they trust their students so much that they don't know and they don't investigate, and then they realize wait a minute, I've been slipping on my own job, but there's graduation coaches that have been on top of it, and they realize thank you, thank you for that.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: So um, I think other schools can really learn the relationship.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: To me, it's the relationship that holds this whole thing together.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes the teachers won't have the relationship, sometimes the administration's not gonna have a relationship, but I can tell you probably 90% of the time, graduation coach will have the relationship that you're looking for.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: That that life-changing relationship where somebody at that school they were able to connect with and be their authentic self with to move on.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: You've mentioned a ton of different structures, routines, um like meetings, uh support systems that your team does for the student to support the student.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um are any of those things that y'all do and put in place um are they things that you would recommend other schools do and what would they be?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: And do you think they're scalable?
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think they're sustainable?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, for example, I think you mentioned something about like uh the backtrack meeting or something.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: What was that?
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: The the kickback session, the back, yeah, yeah, kickback kickback session, some something like that.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like I know that you're doing a bunch of routines and stuff that your team is doing that you're probably not even thinking or haven't mentioned yet because you you have so many, but I'm just wondering like are there things that you're doing with your team and that your team's doing that you're like, hey, you know, these other schools they could implement these and they could scale them if they wanted to.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: They could be as big or as small as you think.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: Are there anything like that?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: And what would you say?
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: What would you name specifically?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: I would definitely name a kickback session.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_00: A kickback session in a school would look like basically a space that the graduation coach could create, safe, comfortable, comfortable space where the kids can come in at lunchtime or after school and just kind of kick back and hang out and just talk about what's going on in class, what they enjoyed about it, what's what's what teach, you know, to have conversations about the teachers and stuff like that, so they can kind of have a common ground, like, you know what, this is you know what the teacher might not be a mean teacher.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: They've just probably just really concerned about what I'm doing and why I'm not turning my work in, or you know, or they've given up on me.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because once the kid knows that it feels like a teacher's giving up on them, the other students that surround them within that space can let them know that's just how they are.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: They're really, you know, those of the those conversations that students need to have with each other is a safe space.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a graduation coach is there to kind of lead those conversations.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I would also say if other schools really took the time to dig into the data, like we're data-driven.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_00: The data says so much when you're looking at assignments, completions, and and you really look at the times of year, the ebbs and flow of a of a school year, when students are really gonna come out the gate, beginning the year.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_00: We know kids are able to put their best foot forward.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: How do you take that moment and make it last a little bit longer than you know?
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: How do you take that moment and make it get to October?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_00: Because a lot of times it ends in September.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: How do we stretch it out to October to November to Thanksgiving?
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: But little strategies like that, if if if virtual schools and public schools implement things to that nature and they they target their students or and when those students and got them got them all together in the same space because those kids are going to experience some of the same issues, and they can talk about how to get through it.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: We you can lead a conversation about how to get through those issues.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think that's that's life-changing for kids.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and another thing I was thinking about was those collaboration meetings you talked about that y'all do monthly, like that would probably be something that they they should also implement if if schools are doing this.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: Most definitely.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: That's a good catch.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um now, Jamal, this might you might jump through the screen at me or punch punch your laptop screen here with this questionnaire monitor that you have there.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: But what would you say to someone who's like, you know what?
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: Virtual schools, they can't support graduation, these students, they can't help move them along.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, they can't do any type of personalized support or they can't offer it.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's they're they're virtual.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's it's too much.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: What would you say to somebody who said that?
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: I would say um for me and my even my purpose, even coming to Georgia Cyber Academy and working virtually as an education as a whole, is that education's changing.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's finally at the at a point where education changed.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: If you think about the history of education, how it was taught, like back in the I might even put a date to it, but you think way back in the day when everybody went to the schoolhouse and there's a blackboard was in front, and you just stood up there and you rolled on the blackboard, it's the same situation as some brick and mortars that happened today in 2025, going in 2026.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: We get the opportunity to meet students where they're at.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: How much time are students spending on the screen?
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: On a Saturday or Sunday.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: Now they get to see that same experience, but when they go to those computers or devices, they're looking at it as from an educational point of view, not just an entertainment point of view.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: They're getting a different vantage point.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've always believed that virtual education is a great equalizer.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Whether you come from the wealthiest part of Georgia or the poorest part of Georgia, you're going to meet all your peers in the same classroom with the same teacher with the same opportunities.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: And does it work?
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: Do I think it works better than brick and mortar?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: I think it have, they have their, each one has its own place.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: I do feel that since virtual education has become more prevalent since COVID, I think our kids have a step up versus a step back when it comes to college because the biggest thing I know I had in college, the biggest challenge I had was time management.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: Virtual school, virtual education, GCA forces you to take control of your own day, your own time, and control of your education as an individual student, not as uh your your parents' child going to school.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I think.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think they need the person somebody that would say that this needs to spend a day, and they're like, wow, like wait a minute, I had no idea.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: Our teachers are so creative, and I think we have to I honestly feel like we have the top-notch teachers because we have to entertain, because we're on the screen and we have to educate, and we're the best at it.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was expecting you to say you were gonna tackle them, but hey, that's a lot more uh self-control answer there.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: So leave us with this, Jamal.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: What is the biggest lesson or a lesson that comes to mind that you've learned uh from the process of being a graduation coach, manager, basically helping students who uh really need that support finish strong?
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think my role in all this is to provide clarity, a clear role so they can see.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_00: I think my role is to provide trust.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: When things go wrong, they have somebody they can lean in, lean to, the coaches and the students.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um I also think that I provide consistency and routine for our students and guidance, you know, guardrails that they need.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's one of the biggest, one of the biggest things I learned.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: Biggest thing, the most impactful thing I've learned from being this position is that your at-risk kids are your are your students that are that are the ones that are going out changing the world.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the ones who don't fall into and conform to society.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: They they critically think everything, whether they realize it or not.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: If it's something they don't want to do, they're not.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: If there's a rule they don't know, they don't like, they're not gonna follow it.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: But those are your changers.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_00: That if you think about how many of our most successful people in America are dropouts, whether it be college, but it's just because they're wired differently.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes that hidden leader is your you're at risk of it.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's that is the it's the it's a leadership in them that a lot of people don't recognize until they're graduating or out of high school.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: They have no idea what the story was back when they were in high school.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's so that's so good.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: Uh the hidden gems there.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_01: So here's today's big idea.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: Graduation doesn't happen by accident, it happens when systems, support, and people come together to help every student cross a finish line or with more confidence.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: So thanks again to Jamal for joining us and sharing his perspective.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: If this episode gave you new insight into student support and systems leadership, be sure to subscribe and join us next time on GCA Unmuted Voices of Virtual Education.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Jamal.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you, bye for now.