Latest / Foul Territory / SIGNING DAY: Bo Bichette/Kyle Tucker/JT Realmuto deals, Bellinger’s latest offer, Silent 3-team trade?!

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SIGNING DAY: Bo Bichette/Kyle Tucker/JT Realmuto deals, Bellinger’s latest offer, Silent 3-team trade?! · Foul Territory

0:04
Speaker 1: We're doing the show early today. Breaking news right off
0:07
Speaker 1: the top as Ken Rosenthal gives us more here three years,
0:11
Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty six million dollars for what everyone expected.
0:14
Speaker 1: Bobaschett signing with the Mets to play third base, no deferrals,
0:17
Speaker 1: opt outs after years one and two. Also, the deal
0:21
Speaker 1: includes a five million dollar opt out bonus that means
0:25
Speaker 1: in one season bobashett can make forty seven million dollars
0:30
Speaker 1: to play a position that he's never played before for
0:33
Speaker 1: the Mets, the ultimate pivot after they lose out on
0:36
Speaker 1: Kyle Tucker, and Ken pointed out, maybe they trade Brett
0:39
Speaker 1: Baty or there's been some things about him potentially being
0:44
Speaker 1: a super utility or maybe playing more first base as
0:46
Speaker 1: they signed Polanco. But he's going to do a lot
0:48
Speaker 1: of dh anyway. Scotty Brown Aircrafts Trevor May. We're going
0:51
Speaker 1: to talk to Ken a little bit later among others,
0:53
Speaker 1: but let's dive right in. Trevor. Your former team, the Mets,
0:58
Speaker 1: does not like to wait long when they lose. That's
1:00
Speaker 1: Steve Cohen, richest owner in sports going. I will place
1:03
Speaker 1: my money here.
1:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I mean, we saw it happen a little
1:07
Speaker 2: bit with the Red Sauce the other day with Rangers
1:10
Speaker 2: for us too, like they have someone's waiting in the
1:12
Speaker 2: wings usually and it gives them an opportunity to either
1:16
Speaker 2: up the deal if they need to, or or just
1:18
Speaker 2: like pull the trigger the next day. So we've seen
1:22
Speaker 2: it happen a couple of times very recently. Yeah, it's
1:24
Speaker 2: it's It surprised me a little bit. I thought I
1:27
Speaker 2: thought the Phillies were, you know, the best fit. Honestly,
1:30
Speaker 2: that was my I was. I put all my chips
1:32
Speaker 2: in on that one. But you know what we are wrong.
1:34
Speaker 3: You know, I've been doing this for few years now,
1:36
Speaker 3: wrong pretty much every whole time.
1:37
Speaker 2: So big deal. It's another one of those kind of
1:39
Speaker 2: like bridge deals. We're seeing them a lot more. It's
1:43
Speaker 2: very interesting with the opt outs after each year really
1:46
Speaker 2: high AAV's but shorter time periods. It's gonna be interesting
1:49
Speaker 2: to see. We've seen him play second for the first
1:50
Speaker 2: time in the World Series and that seemed to work out,
1:52
Speaker 2: but now third base seems like now something he's got
1:56
Speaker 2: to he's got to learn as well. I don't know
1:57
Speaker 2: if it translates as well over there, but you know,
2:01
Speaker 2: the Mets want their guy. They mostly get their guy.
2:08
Speaker 4: That sounded like a vote of confidence. I would see
2:10
Speaker 4: what giraffeck Mark has to say about that mostly got
2:13
Speaker 4: their guy, They got rid of a couple other guys.
2:18
Speaker 4: Is this a needle mover? Absolutely? Does this fit in
2:21
Speaker 4: the parameters of what the Mets want to do, what
2:24
Speaker 4: I think David Stearns wants to do with Uncle Stevie's money,
2:29
Speaker 4: going hey, hey, spend this money, like, let's go get somebody.
2:34
Speaker 4: They went and got the best guy available for what
2:36
Speaker 4: their need is. Does this preclude them? Does this not
2:42
Speaker 4: allow them to go get Cody Bellinger? Totally other topic,
2:47
Speaker 4: but we'll see Bo playing third base? To me, is
2:52
Speaker 4: that value is his first step quickness where they're gonna
2:56
Speaker 4: unlock some value? Is this just a best player available
3:00
Speaker 4: will find a spot? Is this also a Is this
3:05
Speaker 4: a prequel to what they're going to be doing with
3:08
Speaker 4: a Brett Baty? You know you always want to We
3:10
Speaker 4: always talk about, hey, we're going to keep all.
3:12
Speaker 5: This talent around.
3:14
Speaker 4: The reason they lost last year, the reason they had
3:17
Speaker 4: the season they did, they didn't make the playoffs was
3:20
Speaker 4: not because of third base, was not because of Pete Alonzo.
3:25
Speaker 4: At first base because it couldn't pitch. Does this move
3:29
Speaker 4: enable them to find that pitcher that will put them
3:32
Speaker 4: over to put them in the playoffs and then see
3:35
Speaker 4: what happens from there. But to me, Boba schet on
3:38
Speaker 4: this contract for forty seven million dollars coming off a
3:42
Speaker 4: very good platform year. The fact that he's getting two
3:45
Speaker 4: more million dollars than what Alex Bregman got last year,
3:50
Speaker 4: and Alex Bregman almost has twice the career war in
3:55
Speaker 4: his career is interesting, And to me, it's a pivot
3:59
Speaker 4: that not getting Tucker shows that the Mets a little desperate.
4:07
Speaker 4: I mean, maybe that's a bad word to say, but
4:09
Speaker 4: a little desperate.
4:11
Speaker 1: Desperate's okay, desperate. It's usually good for fan bases. They
4:14
Speaker 1: want desperate. And it's funny how the Mets were like
4:16
Speaker 1: run prevention defense, bo out of position at third Jorge
4:19
Speaker 1: Polanco out of position potentially at first base. But let's
4:22
Speaker 1: get the inside scoop right now. Wow, it's the Winter
4:34
Speaker 1: meetings this week. Who knew Ken Rosenthalft senior insider with
4:38
Speaker 1: us right now? Your reaction to Bobaschett landing with the
4:42
Speaker 1: Mets and the fit.
4:44
Speaker 6: I was a little bit of surprised, for sure. I
4:47
Speaker 6: think we all were, but I understand what the Mets
4:50
Speaker 6: are doing, and certainly we saw the Red Sox pivot
4:53
Speaker 6: after they lost Bregmann, they signed Ranger Suarez. The Mets
4:56
Speaker 6: pivoting here. Bashett was not someone that those of us
5:01
Speaker 6: on the outside necessarily connected to them, but they were
5:04
Speaker 6: talking to him, and they do see this as a
5:08
Speaker 6: viable thing for them. Obviously third base, and they can
5:12
Speaker 6: bounce Beaty around, perhaps first base, maybe in the outfield
5:15
Speaker 6: as well. It is an interesting direction for a team
5:19
Speaker 6: that's been talking about defense all season long. They'll have
5:22
Speaker 6: Bashett out of position at third base, he hasn't played
5:25
Speaker 6: that position before. Jorge Polanco at first base, he hasn't
5:28
Speaker 6: played that position before. They were talking about Kyle Tucker
5:31
Speaker 6: who has been declining in right field, and yet this
5:35
Speaker 6: is something that should really benefit them offensively. Boba Schett is,
5:39
Speaker 6: if anything, an underrated hitter. It's one of the great
5:42
Speaker 6: hitters in the game. Hits all kinds of pitching. And
5:45
Speaker 6: he's a guy too that, along with Polanco, will help
5:50
Speaker 6: restore that offense. And Marcus Simmons part of this mix too.
5:54
Speaker 6: The offense that they've lost with Alonso and Nimo and
5:57
Speaker 6: of course Jeff McNeil as well.
6:00
Speaker 4: Ken I just said, maybe it's a desperate move by
6:04
Speaker 4: the Mets. Would you use the word desperate or would
6:07
Speaker 4: you say, you know what, it's just the next one
6:10
Speaker 4: that we had and we had to make the move.
6:14
Speaker 6: From what I understand, Eric actually more of the latter
6:17
Speaker 6: that it wasn't necessarily desperate. They were desperate to.
6:20
Speaker 3: Get a hitter.
6:21
Speaker 6: Yes, but when they didn't get Tucker, they had been
6:24
Speaker 6: in contact with Brishette. It's not like they just called
6:26
Speaker 6: him up and said let's go. This had been going on,
6:29
Speaker 6: and in that sense, they just reacted to the market.
6:33
Speaker 6: What has been stunning has been the turn of events
6:37
Speaker 6: the last I don't know, eighteen hours or so. I
6:40
Speaker 6: don't know that people necessarily expected Tucker to go to
6:43
Speaker 6: the Dodgers, and I don't know that people ever expected
6:46
Speaker 6: Burshette to go to the Mets. I was on record,
6:49
Speaker 6: well at least on this show, saying I thought the
6:51
Speaker 6: Phillies were favored for Burshette. They were, and then boom
6:56
Speaker 6: free agency struck. And this is what happens in the
6:58
Speaker 6: open market. We often talk among ourselves at the athletic. Okay,
7:03
Speaker 6: who's in the market for this guy? Who's gonna get him?
7:06
Speaker 6: And to some degree it's folly because things change so quickly.
7:10
Speaker 6: Teams come out of nowhere, and this has been kind
7:13
Speaker 6: of an example what we've seen over the last whatever
7:16
Speaker 6: how many hours it's been.
7:18
Speaker 4: You and a couple other insiders said the same thing
7:21
Speaker 4: that Bo was, it looks like Bo's going to go
7:24
Speaker 4: to the Phillies. Was this a great ploy to get
7:28
Speaker 4: the Mets to pay extra for Bobaschett?
7:31
Speaker 6: By the the Phillies wanted Bobaschett and that was serious.
7:35
Speaker 6: Bob Nightingales reported that they were at seven years, two
7:38
Speaker 6: hundred million. That sounds like the proper range from the
7:42
Speaker 6: Phillies for Bobachhet what they would want to do, they'd
7:45
Speaker 6: want the lower AAV But at the same time, it
7:49
Speaker 6: just didn't happen for them. And they're an interesting team
7:52
Speaker 6: too right now because this was guy that they focused on.
7:56
Speaker 6: They really wanted him, they met with him, they were
7:58
Speaker 6: enthused about it. Theybviously made a big offer for him,
8:02
Speaker 6: and yet they didn't get him. So do they now
8:05
Speaker 6: keep Alec Bohe? Do they go out and resign?
8:07
Speaker 3: JT?
8:08
Speaker 6: O Rumuto. All these things are in play for them.
8:11
Speaker 6: They are in play and weren't play the entire offseason.
8:15
Speaker 6: The question now is do they try to do something
8:18
Speaker 6: else and maybe just pivot from those guys entirely.
8:21
Speaker 3: It's unclear. Ken. Touching back on the Mets.
8:25
Speaker 2: You know, Eka mentioned it at the top of the
8:29
Speaker 2: hour that the hitting wasn't necessarily the issue last year
8:32
Speaker 2: for them. It was the pitching, and they haven't done
8:34
Speaker 2: much in that side of things. So moving forward, we
8:37
Speaker 2: know fran Raven Valdeza stall out there available. Do you
8:41
Speaker 2: see the Mets going having spent their money and possibly
8:45
Speaker 2: just kind of leaning on this young.
8:46
Speaker 3: Crop of.
8:49
Speaker 2: Highly touted prospects, or is there still room to grab
8:53
Speaker 2: a front end guy like Franburh and then fill in
8:55
Speaker 2: behind him.
8:56
Speaker 6: Trevor, to me, there's no question they have to add pitching.
9:00
Speaker 6: As you mentioned, it was the entire reason, for the
9:03
Speaker 6: most part that they collapsed last season. They had some
9:06
Speaker 6: other issues, They did have some clubhouse dynamics that were off.
9:10
Speaker 6: The offense at times was not there, but really this
9:13
Speaker 6: was all about starting pitching. So they know this, they
9:17
Speaker 6: know they have to do more, and I would expect
9:20
Speaker 6: maybe a trade and a free agent.
9:21
Speaker 5: I don't know that.
9:22
Speaker 6: I'm just guessing now, but clearly they are one of
9:26
Speaker 6: the teams in the market for from ber Valdez, who
9:28
Speaker 6: is the top remaining free agent. They are a team
9:30
Speaker 6: that has been in contact with the Milwaukee Brewers about
9:33
Speaker 6: Freddy Peralta. Mackenzie Gore also is available in a trade.
9:36
Speaker 6: I don't know that the Nats would do it within
9:38
Speaker 6: the division. I don't know that they should care about that,
9:40
Speaker 6: but he's out there, so there are ways they can
9:43
Speaker 6: go for pitching still, but the options are really starting
9:48
Speaker 6: to dwindle. To be perfectly honest, with Suarez going off
9:51
Speaker 6: the board.
9:53
Speaker 4: Who is who's benefiting the least from this type of contact?
9:58
Speaker 4: And we saw tuckers and now we saw today the
10:02
Speaker 4: short term massive AAVs. Because these AAVs, in my opinion
10:07
Speaker 4: as a player, it's pushing the value annual average value
10:12
Speaker 4: way up for players. I get it, it's not as
10:14
Speaker 4: long term, but when that number moves up, more money
10:17
Speaker 4: is going in the player's pocket while it's not guaranteed
10:20
Speaker 4: for the length. So who is who's benefiting the most
10:23
Speaker 4: from these short term AAVs.
10:27
Speaker 6: We'd say both parties, both sides both the club and
10:30
Speaker 6: the player. The club because the commitments not that long,
10:33
Speaker 6: you're not buying the decline phase. And the player because
10:36
Speaker 6: he's getting paid at a level that he might have
10:40
Speaker 6: gotten over a seven or eight year deal, but he's
10:43
Speaker 6: getting it over a shorter amount of time. And in
10:45
Speaker 6: the cases of both Tucker and Bishett, they can opt
10:49
Speaker 6: out early and go back into the market. And the
10:52
Speaker 6: next two markets in particular are not exactly deep in
10:57
Speaker 6: quality hitters. So there's a benefit both ways here. And
11:01
Speaker 6: we've heard for years Eric teams hate long term deals,
11:05
Speaker 6: they hate buying into the client phase. Well, this is
11:08
Speaker 6: the way to avoid that. You're paying more money because
11:12
Speaker 6: you're not going long term. You're paying almost the equivalent
11:15
Speaker 6: of what you might be paying out long term. But
11:18
Speaker 6: this is a preferred way to go. Look at the
11:21
Speaker 6: Blue Jays, for example, with Tucker. My guess is, and
11:26
Speaker 6: I've heard rumblings to this effect that they were around
11:28
Speaker 6: ten years and three hundred and fifty million below Vladimir
11:32
Speaker 6: Guerrero Junior average annual value. That number would make sense
11:35
Speaker 6: if they were high or fined. Just for the sake
11:37
Speaker 6: of discussion, here, three hundred and fifty million is a
11:40
Speaker 6: lot more than two hundred and forty million, But Kyle
11:44
Speaker 6: Tucker will have every bit of opportunity to get another contract,
11:49
Speaker 6: to opt out of this one and maybe build it
11:51
Speaker 6: that way. He can get to that number in the end,
11:54
Speaker 6: and he gets the short term benefit of the high
11:56
Speaker 6: AAVs as well. So it's definitely good for the player
11:59
Speaker 6: and in my view, definitely good for the club.
12:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is interesting that we're seeing this emerge suddenly,
12:05
Speaker 1: more so when teams have been trying to do this
12:07
Speaker 1: for a while. I think back to the Dodgers with
12:09
Speaker 1: Bryce Harper. They were offering a huge number, but Bryce
12:12
Speaker 1: went with the longer years. Ken. The one thing that
12:15
Speaker 1: I want to clarify with fans is that front offices
12:18
Speaker 1: will try and put like a win or whatever their
12:19
Speaker 1: number is right against how much money should be worth
12:23
Speaker 1: a win, And this actually matches that a little bit
12:27
Speaker 1: more so. Right where a player, if he's a six
12:28
Speaker 1: to win player or whatever, you can put that against
12:30
Speaker 1: say eleven million bucks and say, hey, he's worth sixty
12:32
Speaker 1: six mil. It sounds crazy, but the way to do
12:35
Speaker 1: it on a shorter term deal can get that done.
12:37
Speaker 1: If it's a longer term deal, it also helps to
12:40
Speaker 1: the team to stretch out the number for the luxury
12:42
Speaker 1: tax implications. So that's what I wanted to ask you
12:45
Speaker 1: about here. Teams like the Dodgers last night, Teams like
12:47
Speaker 1: the Mets now in this case, I mean, if you
12:49
Speaker 1: do some quick math, they're essentially paying double for the player.
12:52
Speaker 1: Right it's forty seven. It's going to turn into about
12:54
Speaker 1: one hundred million dollars this year. And not no one's
12:56
Speaker 1: feeling bad for Steve Cohen, but just emphasizing that. Do
12:59
Speaker 1: you think I think teams are considering that or they're
13:02
Speaker 1: just saying, Hey, I don't want to take on the
13:03
Speaker 1: long term risk. Under any circumstance, I will take this
13:05
Speaker 1: massive short term hit.
13:07
Speaker 6: Teams are obviously making that decision, these big market teams
13:10
Speaker 6: that are able to cut these kinds of deals.
13:13
Speaker 5: And as we get.
13:15
Speaker 6: Into the collective bargaining negotiations, and I wrote a whole
13:17
Speaker 6: column about this whole situation this morning, we're gonna see,
13:21
Speaker 6: obviously the fight about one a salary cap, which the
13:25
Speaker 6: owners want, and two if there is no salary cap,
13:28
Speaker 6: then certainly a different conversation about the luxury tax thresholds,
13:32
Speaker 6: the penalties, how they need to be adjusted. So it
13:37
Speaker 6: seems to me teams will pay what they can afford,
13:40
Speaker 6: right and the Mets and Dodgers clearly feel they can
13:43
Speaker 6: afford this. I'm sure other teams are rather bothered by that,
13:47
Speaker 6: but they are again playing within the current rules obviously,
13:51
Speaker 6: and if they change the CBA, whether it's through a
13:54
Speaker 6: cap or some other restrictive nature, then they'll let these
13:59
Speaker 6: team will have to adjust. I'm sure it would be
14:01
Speaker 6: grandfathered in. It wouldn't happen right away, at least as
14:04
Speaker 6: far as a cap is concerned. But with luxury tax
14:09
Speaker 6: thresholds and penalties, they are adjusted every CBA. If that's
14:12
Speaker 6: the system that remains intact, they will be adjusted again.
14:18
Speaker 2: Ken, I have a theory, and I like to I
14:21
Speaker 2: like to throw theories out to you because you always
14:22
Speaker 2: have such great insight on them. What I'm noticing about
14:25
Speaker 2: these short term deals, maybe with the exception of the
14:28
Speaker 2: opt outs that are heavily favored in the players, these
14:32
Speaker 2: deals are starting to feel very similar to another sports
14:35
Speaker 2: Max contracts.
14:37
Speaker 3: So do you think that this could be the.
14:42
Speaker 2: Commonality of these these happening more often with the really
14:45
Speaker 2: short years with the huge numbers. Do you think that's
14:49
Speaker 2: a little bit of an attempt to swing it towards
14:53
Speaker 2: the way the contracts are set up for say NBA players,
14:56
Speaker 2: where I know there's less players and it's a little
14:59
Speaker 2: bit different. But it does feel like this might be
15:03
Speaker 2: what deals look more like if there were a cap play.
15:07
Speaker 3: Does that sound like something that could be happening here.
15:10
Speaker 6: Trevor, I have not thought of that, And I've got
15:12
Speaker 6: to be honest, I am not as familiar with the
15:15
Speaker 6: cap system and the NBA and the other leagues as
15:18
Speaker 6: I probably should be. But that's because I'm covering baseball
15:22
Speaker 6: all the time and it doesn't stop. But we're govern
15:24
Speaker 6: no excuse, I don't know that that's the thinking. I
15:28
Speaker 6: don't expect that that would be the way front offices
15:31
Speaker 6: would be looking at it. To me, they're looking at
15:33
Speaker 6: it right now. How do we do this right now?
15:36
Speaker 6: Because we don't know if a cap system is going
15:39
Speaker 6: to be in effect at any point in the near future,
15:42
Speaker 6: even with the CBA expiring December first, it might turn
15:45
Speaker 6: out that the owners do not succeed in their quest
15:48
Speaker 6: for a cap and we retain what is the framework
15:52
Speaker 6: that currently is in place. So it just seems to
15:55
Speaker 6: me teams operate with the thought of how they can
16:00
Speaker 6: best operate within the current parameters of a CBA. I
16:05
Speaker 6: can't imagine I may be wrong about this, but I
16:08
Speaker 6: can't imagine that they'd be thinking, let's get ready for
16:12
Speaker 6: the cap system. This is going to work for us good.
16:15
Speaker 6: I don't know that that's the case at all.
16:18
Speaker 4: One basic question for you, Ken And is obviously just
16:21
Speaker 4: your opinion. You don't like giving your opinions. Are the
16:24
Speaker 4: Mets better? It depends on the question are the Mets
16:27
Speaker 4: better at this point in the offseason than they were
16:32
Speaker 4: at the end of last year. There is their lineup
16:35
Speaker 4: better than it was last year, obviously a lot of
16:37
Speaker 4: different pieces that they've added in and pieces that they've subtracted.
16:44
Speaker 6: All Right, it's a complicated question for a couple of reasons. One,
16:47
Speaker 6: if you're looking at strictly the players involved, I do
16:52
Speaker 6: believe they're better offensively. I think this combination Bashett, Polanco
16:57
Speaker 6: Simeon is at least the equal of Alonzo, Nimo and McNeil.
17:03
Speaker 6: That said, Alonso is a huge part of what they did,
17:07
Speaker 6: and while Bashett is a different kind of right handed hitter.
17:12
Speaker 6: It's going to be interesting to see how this all evolves.
17:15
Speaker 6: And Simeon is a guy who offensively has been in
17:17
Speaker 6: great decline. He's the worst of the six players, or
17:20
Speaker 6: at least has been in the last couple of years
17:22
Speaker 6: that I just mentioned, So hard to judge from that perspective.
17:27
Speaker 6: But to me, they have regained their footing offensively. Then
17:32
Speaker 6: the question becomes, Okay, from a financial standpoint, do these
17:35
Speaker 6: deals make as much sense as they might have for
17:39
Speaker 6: Alonso and Nimo? And again McNeil, now, Alonso is an
17:44
Speaker 6: interesting case because the Mets offered Kyle Tucker fifty five
17:47
Speaker 6: million a year. They didn't or wouldn't offer Pete Alonso
17:51
Speaker 6: thirty one million a year, which would have matched the
17:53
Speaker 6: Orioles offer. And some people might say, well, why is
17:57
Speaker 6: that now? Tucker is a better player. He's certainly a
18:00
Speaker 6: better defender, though he's not a great defender at this
18:03
Speaker 6: stage of his career, but that discrepancy. If you could
18:06
Speaker 6: have had Pete for that much less, then maybe you
18:08
Speaker 6: could have done some of these other things as well.
18:10
Speaker 6: So to the essence of your question, it seems to
18:14
Speaker 6: me that they've regained their offensive equilibrium.
18:17
Speaker 3: Here.
18:17
Speaker 6: The question then becomes, okay, do they do it at
18:21
Speaker 6: a proper rate. Should they have kept Alonso, who was,
18:23
Speaker 6: of course a fan favorite. It's a complicated thing, but
18:26
Speaker 6: in terms of sheer run production, which is your question,
18:30
Speaker 6: they should be fine in my opinion.
18:32
Speaker 1: What about run prevention, Ken, That's the last one I
18:35
Speaker 1: want to hit with you, because that was the keyword
18:37
Speaker 1: that David Stearns used when talking about the team, and
18:40
Speaker 1: I think in one of your recent notes, Colum talked
18:42
Speaker 1: about how other teams felt like they were missing something defensively.
18:46
Speaker 1: Isn't it a little bit strange how the infield is
18:48
Speaker 1: starting to formulate. You're gonna have everyone out of a position.
18:51
Speaker 1: If Brett Baty doesn't get traded, he's going to play
18:53
Speaker 1: some first with Polanco and bobas sheet at third. Nobody
18:56
Speaker 1: had that on their Bengo card entering the off season.
18:59
Speaker 6: Yes, and that is certainly a question for the Mets
19:01
Speaker 6: and as they reshape their pitching staff, if their defense
19:05
Speaker 6: isn't much better than it was last season, then okay,
19:10
Speaker 6: you've reshaped your pitching staff, but you're still in a
19:12
Speaker 6: run prevention standpoint. From a run prevention standpoint, not where
19:16
Speaker 6: you should be. So when I wrote about Tucker, a
19:19
Speaker 6: couple of days ago, I raised the question, hey, what
19:22
Speaker 6: are you doing here when you claim that run prevention
19:24
Speaker 6: was your big thing. You're going for two fifty million
19:26
Speaker 6: dollars corner outfielders. Well, they needed the hitter, and they
19:30
Speaker 6: certainly needed the hitter. We all knew that they didn't
19:33
Speaker 6: get that hitter. They got another hitter who is going
19:35
Speaker 6: to play, as you mentioned, at a position. So all
19:39
Speaker 6: of these questions, Scott are entirely fair, and we will
19:43
Speaker 6: see in twenty twenty six whether David Stern's play here
19:49
Speaker 6: was the right one. We're gonna find out. That's the
19:51
Speaker 6: beauty of this sport. It all evolves on the field
19:54
Speaker 6: and we get our answers there.
19:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's almost like fantasy baseball fun. Hey, let's just
20:00
Speaker 1: plug this guy here, this guy there. Not even fantasy
20:02
Speaker 1: because they don't let you do that. You have to
20:04
Speaker 1: have position flexibility. You have to say maybe video game
20:07
Speaker 1: kind of fun. So yes, I'm with you, Ken, you
20:08
Speaker 1: know what, as especially you and me, people that don't
20:11
Speaker 1: root for our particular team, much like we're just having
20:14
Speaker 1: a good time following all the chaos. So it's great. Yes, Ken,
20:18
Speaker 1: thank you so much, appreciate it, and we'll look for
20:21
Speaker 1: the next big signing here during the real Winter meetings
20:24
Speaker 1: that are happening right now virtually.
20:26
Speaker 6: Thanks Scott.
20:32
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm telling you the Winter meetings are now okay
20:35
Speaker 1: and they're virtual. JT Real Muto and the Philadelphia Phillies
20:38
Speaker 1: agree on a three year contract for forty five million
20:40
Speaker 1: dollars guaranteed. There are incentives in there. It looks like
20:43
Speaker 1: maybe five a year, with a chance to get to
20:45
Speaker 1: sixty million dollars over the course of that contract. Robert
20:49
Speaker 1: Murray part of the mix here with the money, Ken Rose,
20:51
Speaker 1: Don Matt Gelb. We're first breaking the story that they
20:54
Speaker 1: were close, of course, Trevor. This is the chain of reaction.
20:59
Speaker 1: We have Kyle, then we have Steve Cohen staying up
21:02
Speaker 1: all night and signing Bow. And then the Phillies are like,
21:05
Speaker 1: oh crap, that little Bow affair that we had for
21:09
Speaker 1: five minutes talking to him and saying maybe not JT.
21:11
Speaker 1: Well that's done. He doesn't like us. We're back to
21:14
Speaker 1: JT and they sign him really quickly.
21:16
Speaker 3: That's that works.
21:17
Speaker 2: The guy, the top guy on the board goes the
21:20
Speaker 2: dominoes fall the fastest, and sometimes when the second guy goes,
21:26
Speaker 2: like in Alex Bregman's case, or arguably third or whatever.
21:30
Speaker 2: It gets the first guy moving a little bit more.
21:32
Speaker 2: So we needed one to fall. We got it, and
21:34
Speaker 2: now we've got four guys signing in a matter of days.
21:37
Speaker 2: You know, I love this deal too. JT Is is
21:41
Speaker 2: just a rock solid and worst case scenario, a rock
21:44
Speaker 2: solid catcher. He is a veteran, a student of the game.
21:48
Speaker 2: Pitchers love throwing to him. He's got the core of
21:51
Speaker 2: pictures they have. They're all love throwing to him. So
21:54
Speaker 2: you know, this is right up the alley. That's what
21:56
Speaker 2: That's what he deserves to be paid. He's got his
21:58
Speaker 2: big contract that he just lived out. He's he's a
22:01
Speaker 2: very wealthy person, and he's in a place that he
22:03
Speaker 2: seemingly really likes to be.
22:04
Speaker 3: So you know, they wouldn't surprise me one bit.
22:07
Speaker 2: Very like Carl Schwarber, like just wants to play this
22:10
Speaker 2: thing out and play it out at a place that
22:12
Speaker 2: he likes to be. So you know, he's he's getting
22:14
Speaker 2: up there in age. But I just he's one of
22:16
Speaker 2: the most athletic catchers that I've seen and that I
22:19
Speaker 2: that I had the pleasure to play against. He's he's
22:21
Speaker 2: still up there in the athletic catcher category, even being
22:25
Speaker 2: older than most of the other guys, So you just
22:28
Speaker 2: can't go wrong there. Yeah, the bat's resting a little bit,
22:31
Speaker 2: but uh, you know they're they are. They're counting on
22:33
Speaker 2: their core guys to be the big run producers as is. Anyways,
22:37
Speaker 2: he's not gonna hurt you. He puts good of AB's together,
22:40
Speaker 2: and he stays healthy and he stays on the field.
22:42
Speaker 3: So I like this deal.
22:43
Speaker 2: I like the escalators just in case he does produce
22:47
Speaker 2: at an even higher level. But if it ain't broke,
22:50
Speaker 2: don't don't fix it. And that's what it took to
22:52
Speaker 2: get him, and it seems like a pretty modest deal,
22:54
Speaker 2: not going to really hurt him too much.
22:57
Speaker 3: So I love it.
22:58
Speaker 2: Happy for JT and I have for Phillies fans. I
23:01
Speaker 2: think that's a that's a piece that you get a
23:03
Speaker 2: piece of mind knowing that you got a guy who
23:05
Speaker 2: knows what he's doing back there and knows the crew
23:07
Speaker 2: that's going to be throwing all to them.
23:10
Speaker 4: Is everybody scared now? They're just running the same team back.
23:13
Speaker 4: The Phillies didn't make any changes. They were so terrible,
23:17
Speaker 4: winning all their games last year in the regular season
23:20
Speaker 4: and then getting beat by the Dodgers. They're running the
23:23
Speaker 4: same team back. I'm gonna go ahead and be on
23:26
Speaker 4: the other side of it.
23:27
Speaker 5: They're hungry.
23:29
Speaker 4: I think these guys have been texting and calling each
23:31
Speaker 4: other the whole offseason, and I would disagree with the
23:35
Speaker 4: Phillies Show. I think Ruben said it on The Phillies Show,
23:39
Speaker 4: one of our other shows that you know, well, these
23:43
Speaker 4: guys are texting Boba Schett. They might be, you know,
23:46
Speaker 4: it might be undercutting their other buddy, JT.
23:49
Speaker 5: Real Muto.
23:51
Speaker 4: I think I think JT may have taken a little
23:54
Speaker 4: bit less. If both signed there, then they had a
23:57
Speaker 4: little extra cash. I think from what I heard it
24:00
Speaker 4: was two years eighteen a year, which would have put
24:03
Speaker 4: him at thirty six. Let's stretch it out, give him
24:06
Speaker 4: nine more million. He wasn't going to get three years
24:10
Speaker 4: at eighteen a year, so he got three years at
24:14
Speaker 4: forty five, so it's fifteen a year. It's an eight
24:17
Speaker 4: million dollar, eight million dollar pay cut that he got
24:21
Speaker 4: from last year. To me, I think this is right
24:24
Speaker 4: online with what the Phillies do. They make very very
24:27
Speaker 4: good offers to guys who are in their system. Guys
24:31
Speaker 4: who they know, guys who they care about, and they're
24:33
Speaker 4: very professional with it. Can JT's offense improve, probably marginally.
24:40
Speaker 4: Is he going to hit have an eight to fifty ops?
24:43
Speaker 6: No?
24:44
Speaker 5: Does he need to? Absolutely not.
24:46
Speaker 4: Dave Dombrowski called out Bryce Harper, whether it was on
24:50
Speaker 4: purpose or not. Bryce Harper now has a T shirt
24:52
Speaker 4: that says not elite. He's hungry. Trey Turner is hungry.
24:58
Speaker 4: He won the batting title last year.
25:00
Speaker 3: JT.
25:00
Speaker 4: Real Muto knows. He has been in Philly for years
25:04
Speaker 4: now and there's not a World Series. Kyle Schwarber wanted
25:07
Speaker 4: to come back. Did he get the best offer from
25:09
Speaker 4: the Phillies. Yeah, but he wanted to come back because
25:12
Speaker 4: they are hungry for what they have fallen short of.
25:17
Speaker 4: And I don't think this is a downgrade at all
25:20
Speaker 4: to me. I think this is an upgrade because of
25:23
Speaker 4: the fact that who would the Phillies have pivoted to
25:26
Speaker 4: at a premier position. Would they have pivoted to Jonaheim
25:31
Speaker 4: Victor Carrattini, both big league catchers, but not to the
25:35
Speaker 4: level of JT. The familiarity with the pictures, which most
25:39
Speaker 4: of the pictures are coming back, and the familiarity with
25:42
Speaker 4: the fact that he comes up with big hits. He's
25:45
Speaker 4: not going to be the Star Wars He's not going
25:46
Speaker 4: to be the aircraft carrier in your lineup, but he's
25:50
Speaker 4: part of a lineup that works well together. And in
25:53
Speaker 4: my opinion, this is kind of a It was a
25:58
Speaker 4: basic signing that has large ramifications.
26:02
Speaker 1: He's more valuable to the Phillies than anyone else, and
26:04
Speaker 1: he's definitely a valuable player, but it was hard to
26:07
Speaker 1: see another team emerge with money like this. I mean,
26:11
Speaker 1: we never heard about it, and you know it's funny.
26:14
Speaker 1: His agent, who is now out of the agency game
26:16
Speaker 1: and works for Buster Posey with the Giants, Jeff Berry,
26:18
Speaker 1: I believe, mentioned how last time around it was frustrating
26:21
Speaker 1: for him both with JTN with Hater. He was like,
26:23
Speaker 1: I never got anything else, even in the same ballpark, right,
26:26
Speaker 1: nobody even made a real offer, I know for Hater,
26:29
Speaker 1: and I'm pretty sure he said that for JT as well.
26:31
Speaker 1: It's not that there was an interest, but teams were like, oh,
26:33
Speaker 1: if you're playing in this level, then you should sign
26:37
Speaker 1: with Philly. We're not there. So it's not to knock JT.
26:41
Speaker 1: It's just that it appeared as if this was the
26:43
Speaker 1: spot and this is how his free agency played out
26:46
Speaker 1: last time around. So I'll pose this question to you, Trevor,
26:50
Speaker 1: because I posed it to Eric all the time. Did
26:53
Speaker 1: you feel like the Phillies needed to mix it up
26:56
Speaker 1: more than they did this offseason? Are you rkay with
26:59
Speaker 1: the way that they even running things out there? It's
27:01
Speaker 1: not like they've done nothing right. There's some some tweaks here.
27:03
Speaker 1: Matt Strom is out. Who did they replace it with?
27:07
Speaker 5: Was that Brad Keller?
27:08
Speaker 1: Brad Keller is in a Doolie, Garcia is in. Max
27:12
Speaker 1: Kepler is out and now busted for Breyds. But Trevor,
27:15
Speaker 1: what do you think about the way that the Phillies
27:17
Speaker 1: are putting out this year's squad? Obviously Kyle Schorber returns
27:21
Speaker 1: been a big disappointment the last couple of postseasons.
27:25
Speaker 2: I think there are a little bit I think they're
27:28
Speaker 2: a little bit on the de fence here, and I
27:30
Speaker 2: think this was a decision that it was talked about
27:32
Speaker 2: a lot this obviously, especially after they get right after
27:34
Speaker 2: they got eliminated. That is it time to blow it
27:36
Speaker 2: up and go a different direction with our core or
27:40
Speaker 2: should we stick with this or run it back, try
27:42
Speaker 2: to run it back one more year, because that was
27:44
Speaker 2: just one of those didn't execute when we had the opportunity,
27:48
Speaker 2: because as Kratzy said, like they had a great regular season,
27:51
Speaker 2: Like it's not like they fell off there, it was
27:54
Speaker 2: just they didn't get the job done against the team
27:56
Speaker 2: that eventually won the World Series that everyone says as
27:59
Speaker 2: a super team. So like, if we're only going off
28:02
Speaker 2: of that series and then we're going to make huge
28:05
Speaker 2: wholesale changes, you got to be certain that you can
28:09
Speaker 2: move the pieces in and there's free agents out there
28:12
Speaker 2: that you can start building a core, and you have
28:13
Speaker 2: another crop of young guys coming in, and I think
28:15
Speaker 2: the timing's not quite right for that. And then as
28:19
Speaker 2: Swerverers kind of I think market developed and they were
28:23
Speaker 2: able to grab him.
28:23
Speaker 3: That's when the decision got locked in. They're like, Okay, let's.
28:26
Speaker 2: Try to run this back, and this might be the
28:28
Speaker 2: last year because you know, we we only have Zach
28:31
Speaker 2: Wheeler for so much longer. But we also you know,
28:34
Speaker 2: we have Christopher Sanchez who's very quickly become the ace.
28:39
Speaker 3: You know, he got him for a while.
28:40
Speaker 2: So it's like there it's this weird like liminal space
28:43
Speaker 2: between knowing what we are, we know what we have
28:47
Speaker 2: and we know that.
28:48
Speaker 3: It can win a division and that can get us
28:50
Speaker 3: in a good position to go on a run in
28:51
Speaker 3: the playoffs. So maybe we just go for that again
28:54
Speaker 3: and see what happens.
28:55
Speaker 2: But I think that if this happens again and there's
28:58
Speaker 2: an early bounce from the playoff, actually, to be honest,
29:01
Speaker 2: if there's no World Series, frankly, even if they win
29:03
Speaker 2: the World Series, it probably no matter what. After this year,
29:06
Speaker 2: those I think cohostal changes will start to be made
29:07
Speaker 2: in a big way. Now we'll see what happens with
29:10
Speaker 2: the Stott in the Boems situation, like the back end
29:14
Speaker 2: of the of the batting average or the batting order
29:17
Speaker 2: and such. But like for them to go back and
29:20
Speaker 2: do it again, it's I think it's a conscious decision.
29:23
Speaker 2: This isn't lack of like, oh, we couldn't get anybody.
29:25
Speaker 2: I think they're okay doing it, and I don't necessarily
29:28
Speaker 2: disagree with it either.
29:29
Speaker 3: I think that it's worth another shot. They were a
29:31
Speaker 3: very good team.
29:31
Speaker 2: They were one of the most complete teams I thought
29:33
Speaker 2: all season last year. And though some guys have gone,
29:37
Speaker 2: he just wore is gone, and we don't know what
29:39
Speaker 2: we're gonna get out of Nola, and those things are
29:41
Speaker 2: some more question marks than there were.
29:42
Speaker 3: There's still a very deep team.
29:44
Speaker 2: They're still a very complete team, and I think they
29:45
Speaker 2: filled in some of their holes with some potential comeback
29:48
Speaker 2: candidates who could be a big deal. I think adult
29:50
Speaker 2: Scarcia could potentially be, like, he could go off. He
29:53
Speaker 2: could have one of those years where he's just amazing.
29:56
Speaker 2: He could do a ti Oscar type thing. I mean
29:58
Speaker 2: he has it in a couple of years, but he could.
30:00
Speaker 2: It's possible, and if that completely changes the complexion. So
30:02
Speaker 2: I think they put themselves in position with high ceilings
30:05
Speaker 2: where a couple of things work out, we're singing a
30:07
Speaker 2: different tune.
30:07
Speaker 3: And they still have their.
30:08
Speaker 2: Core of rock solid veteran guys who all liked being there.
30:12
Speaker 2: And I think that was just where that decision came
30:14
Speaker 2: from and how it came together.
30:16
Speaker 1: Now that we saw it all play out, Kratz and
30:18
Speaker 1: you watch many many Phillies games and you know this team,
30:23
Speaker 1: do you think they would have been better off if
30:24
Speaker 1: they landed bo I mean, there was a chance that
30:26
Speaker 1: Steve Cohen didn't pull the all nighter and say okay,
30:30
Speaker 1: we'll give you the bag, and then he was going
30:32
Speaker 1: to be a Philly probably today seven years two hundred.
30:35
Speaker 1: That was one of the reports that he asked for.
30:37
Speaker 1: Phillies were like, cool, we're down and they have yeah,
30:40
Speaker 1: some long term money coming off the books that they'll
30:43
Speaker 1: be able to kind of balance things out better. It
30:46
Speaker 1: didn't happen. So do you think Bobaschet to the Phillies
30:49
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty six would have made them better than
30:51
Speaker 1: Boom and real Muto on that team.
30:57
Speaker 5: In twenty twenty six? Just twenty six? Okay? Yeah?
31:02
Speaker 4: No, I mean the way you were, the way you
31:04
Speaker 4: were wording the question, I thought you were going to say,
31:08
Speaker 4: moving forward in twenty twenty six, I think the offense is.
31:13
Speaker 5: Better with with Bo.
31:16
Speaker 4: With Bo in the lineup, The issue is, I don't
31:19
Speaker 4: think the team is better without JT. I don't think
31:23
Speaker 4: you can find me unless you unless they could figure
31:25
Speaker 4: out how to trade for an Ali Rutchman, which I
31:27
Speaker 4: get it, he's had down years. I don't see how
31:33
Speaker 4: you make I don't think bo makes enough of an
31:36
Speaker 4: upgrade over Boom that it mitigates what JT brings to
31:42
Speaker 4: this team. I have a tough time, believing that he
31:45
Speaker 4: picks up enough of the value to losing bomb, which
31:49
Speaker 4: he has to out hit, which he'll do for sure.
31:52
Speaker 4: I mean, Bom does a great job of driving runs in,
31:55
Speaker 4: just like bo does a great job of driving runs in.
31:58
Speaker 4: But behind the dish is such an important piece. The
32:02
Speaker 4: part that I thought you were going to lean to
32:04
Speaker 4: was does it make them better going forward? To me,
32:07
Speaker 4: I think this JT contract, it's ironic. It's three years.
32:12
Speaker 4: To me, that's the Phillies window. And maybe I'm a player,
32:15
Speaker 4: so maybe the windows only two years. I think the
32:18
Speaker 4: window is three years. Trey Turner in three years will
32:22
Speaker 4: be thirty five years old. J T will be done
32:25
Speaker 4: at the end of his three years. It could go
32:28
Speaker 4: up with all the extensions and you know everything that
32:32
Speaker 4: could happen with that contract. Bryce Schwarber will be thirty
32:37
Speaker 4: seven in three years. Bryce Harper will be thirty six
32:41
Speaker 4: in three years. It's ironic that this is the last
32:44
Speaker 4: guy they signed in this and three years.
32:48
Speaker 5: I think it's set.
32:49
Speaker 4: This sets the Phillies up better for the future than
32:52
Speaker 4: adding another seven or eight year contract, however long the
32:55
Speaker 4: bow contract was going to be and have those guys
33:00
Speaker 4: aging with an aging bow to me. This sets it
33:04
Speaker 4: up where it's like, Okay, at the end of this contract,
33:07
Speaker 4: the next GM, the next president Baseball operations. If it's
33:11
Speaker 4: not Dave, maybe it's Sam Fole, maybe he comes back in.
33:13
Speaker 4: Maybe it's Preston Maddingly or somebody from the outside. That's
33:17
Speaker 4: when they have to realize that this window, it's most
33:21
Speaker 4: likely shut because of the age of everybody, because Trey
33:25
Speaker 4: and Bryce are not going to be able to DH
33:27
Speaker 4: so they still have to be out there on the
33:29
Speaker 4: field because Schwarber's still in for two more years after
33:33
Speaker 4: this three year JT Real Muteau deals done.
33:37
Speaker 1: Hey, they might not have the deepest farm system, but
33:41
Speaker 1: I do like some of the guys that are coming
33:43
Speaker 1: through and that are just about ready to cook. Aiden
33:47
Speaker 1: Miller infields, justin Crawford outfield, Andrew Paynter on the mount.
33:51
Speaker 1: I mean, you tell me if I'm missing any others
33:53
Speaker 1: that you think are going to be potential impact in
33:56
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six. All three of those guys can be
33:59
Speaker 1: impact twenty six for the Phillies.
34:02
Speaker 4: I'm gonna say two will. I'm gonna say two Will.
34:05
Speaker 4: I mean, Trevor's the pitcher. But when I watched Andrew
34:08
Speaker 4: Painter throw. Yes he wasn't he didn't have command last year,
34:12
Speaker 4: but his athleticism and the fact that he's able to
34:15
Speaker 4: contain his frame in such a small window. I think
34:20
Speaker 4: after Tommy John coming back from it, I think he's
34:23
Speaker 4: going to regain that command because of his athleticism, the
34:27
Speaker 4: speed that he comes down the mound, and how controlled
34:30
Speaker 4: he is in such a large frame. And I think
34:33
Speaker 4: he's I think he's going to be impact, and I
34:35
Speaker 4: think Justin Crawford is going to be impact. And I
34:37
Speaker 4: think without signing Bow it gives them a lane to
34:40
Speaker 4: allow Aiden Miller a little bit more seasoning in the
34:45
Speaker 4: minor leagues. But also anything happens to stop, anything happens
34:49
Speaker 4: to Trey, anything happens to boem Bang, Aiden Miller is
34:52
Speaker 4: ready for that.
34:57
Speaker 1: Okay, So now we can link the Idle Tucker deal
35:01
Speaker 1: and the Bobashett deal and talk about the entire aftermath
35:04
Speaker 1: here all in one shot. So, Trevor, we did a
35:07
Speaker 1: live show late last night when Tucker signed. We haven't
35:10
Speaker 1: gotten your instant reaction to this one yet. So your
35:13
Speaker 1: thoughts on how Kyle Tucker ends up with the Dodgers
35:17
Speaker 1: and is making a boatload of money. He said no
35:20
Speaker 1: to a longer offer from the Blue Jays with more
35:22
Speaker 1: guaranteed money, he said no to it somewhat similar offer,
35:25
Speaker 1: but it seems like a little bit more money in
35:27
Speaker 1: at present value with the Mets, and he chose to
35:29
Speaker 1: be I don't want to say, like sixth fiddle, but
35:32
Speaker 1: he's not going to get bothered much by the media
35:35
Speaker 1: in LA. There are a lot of other players that'll
35:37
Speaker 1: do the talking for him.
35:40
Speaker 2: That last part right there was actually a really interesting
35:43
Speaker 2: point because as we've seen in the past with Kyle Tucker,
35:46
Speaker 2: he's a pretty laid back guy that's not a man
35:49
Speaker 2: of many words, so that sounds probably pretty great to him.
35:53
Speaker 2: You know, the Dodgers have won back to Backworld Series.
35:56
Speaker 2: That's going to be enticing to many players. Whether or
35:59
Speaker 2: not you like it or not, I understand, but it
36:02
Speaker 2: is like so hard to win a World Series. There's
36:06
Speaker 2: twenty six guys on every team. The number of players
36:09
Speaker 2: that eventually get one is low for baseball, so there's
36:15
Speaker 2: a little bit of like eye roll, and I understand
36:17
Speaker 2: fans shouldn't like.
36:18
Speaker 3: That at all.
36:19
Speaker 2: I get it, but also I don't fall to the
36:21
Speaker 2: guy having played myself for seeing an opportunity.
36:24
Speaker 3: There as well.
36:25
Speaker 2: It is pretty crazy to think that they are replacing
36:28
Speaker 2: like a MICROCOMFORTO with Kyle Tucker.
36:30
Speaker 3: That is a big jump in production, to say the least.
36:36
Speaker 2: And I just can't act like I was surprised, like
36:41
Speaker 2: maybe the fact that he was willing to take a
36:43
Speaker 2: four year deal even though the AAV is in the stratosphere.
36:46
Speaker 2: You know, a guy that is still in his twenties,
36:49
Speaker 2: you know, the way this thing has been put together forever.
36:52
Speaker 2: You go into free agency with the assumption that you're
36:54
Speaker 2: getting one shot, like you can only conceivably guarantee one shot,
36:59
Speaker 2: And we're seeingly short turn deals with these hyavees where
37:01
Speaker 2: guys are taking another shot. They're sending themselves up for
37:04
Speaker 2: a second chance, something that wasn't happening before. But I
37:07
Speaker 2: think that these long term deals have soured a lot.
37:11
Speaker 2: They kind of sour every single time this whole baking in,
37:14
Speaker 2: you know, front end value and then just like paying
37:17
Speaker 2: for the front ears at the end, and like nobody
37:19
Speaker 2: likes that players included, so of course.
37:22
Speaker 3: It switches this way.
37:23
Speaker 2: So yeah, it was it's probably for baseball and for
37:27
Speaker 2: the psyche of the collective fan base of every team.
37:31
Speaker 2: This is probably the worst possible thing that could happen.
37:34
Speaker 2: But I will say, you know, he is bringing some
37:36
Speaker 2: youth in a team that was one of the oldest
37:38
Speaker 2: teams on average, especially in the lineup in the league
37:41
Speaker 2: last year, and so it was another savvy move from
37:44
Speaker 2: from the Dodgers, and they're setting themselves up to make
37:48
Speaker 2: another take another run at this thing, and he can
37:50
Speaker 2: kind of it's crazy to think this, but there is.
37:53
Speaker 3: A level of under the radar day in and day out.
37:56
Speaker 2: For him as well, which might be an ideal situation,
37:59
Speaker 2: especially with maybe some of the scrutiny that comes from
38:02
Speaker 2: being either the only team in a country or being
38:06
Speaker 2: on the Mets. So it's just perfect storm situation. Not
38:12
Speaker 2: ideal for everyone else, but this so happens to be ideal,
38:14
Speaker 2: probably for Kyle Tucker.
38:16
Speaker 4: I think it is ideal for other people. I mean
38:18
Speaker 4: the other teams. Yes, I get it, it's not ideal
38:21
Speaker 4: for fans. Actually, I got to switch my I rarely
38:24
Speaker 4: switch my hat, but we were talking about bo before
38:27
Speaker 4: and so I gotta now switch my other hat so
38:29
Speaker 4: I can profess a Dodgers fan, which I've been accused
38:33
Speaker 4: of being by nobody. But my biggest thing is I
38:39
Speaker 4: think I think it helps the game. And people were
38:42
Speaker 4: gonna say, no way, there's no chance. I think it
38:45
Speaker 4: helps the game because I've never seen in athletics, I'm
38:49
Speaker 4: talking competitive athletics where somebody who's the best doesn't bring
38:56
Speaker 4: the best.
38:57
Speaker 5: Out in everybody else.
38:58
Speaker 4: So I feel like with the Dodgers are doing is
39:01
Speaker 4: they're raising the tide of what the expectation is.
39:05
Speaker 5: You want to.
39:06
Speaker 3: Beat the Dodgers.
39:08
Speaker 4: Had they not signed Tucker, they would have wanted to
39:11
Speaker 4: beat the Dodgers anyway. Had they not signed Tucker, there
39:14
Speaker 4: would have been still the Padres rivalry. You know, it
39:17
Speaker 4: just it makes it grow even more. And I guess
39:21
Speaker 4: the whole like, negative publicity is good publicity. Any publicity
39:26
Speaker 4: is good publicity. But to me, I think Kyle Tucker
39:32
Speaker 4: signing there has less to do with the fact that,
39:36
Speaker 4: you know, he's very he's a recluse, like he doesn't
39:40
Speaker 4: want to talk to people. There's stars all up and
39:44
Speaker 4: down this lineup that are going to take some of
39:46
Speaker 4: that stuff off of his plate.
39:48
Speaker 5: To me, I think he just wants to win.
39:50
Speaker 4: And we've talked the last few days about is he
39:53
Speaker 4: a star or is he a superstar? His numbers would
39:57
Speaker 4: say he's a star. My opinion is he's a star.
40:01
Speaker 4: Scott thinks it's a superstar. There's a lot of semantics
40:03
Speaker 4: in that. How do you make a star a superstar?
40:08
Speaker 4: You take some pressure off him from the other guys.
40:11
Speaker 4: To me, I think he joins this team and becomes
40:15
Speaker 4: a superstar. I think he can have a jump in
40:17
Speaker 4: his numbers, not only because the Dodgers do a lot
40:20
Speaker 4: of really good things, but just look at the construction
40:23
Speaker 4: of the lineup there. I don't know if they could
40:25
Speaker 4: have Will Smith step up and hit fourth for them
40:28
Speaker 4: and Kyle Tucker fifth. To me, I think that enhances
40:32
Speaker 4: this lineup because or Will Smith is going to do
40:36
Speaker 4: what he did last year and hit like four point
40:39
Speaker 4: fifty with runners in scoring position first half of the season,
40:42
Speaker 4: because you just have to figure out how to navigate
40:45
Speaker 4: this lineup, and the left on left, you know, could
40:48
Speaker 4: benefit one or the other. It's you know, you're paying Peter,
40:53
Speaker 4: you're stealing from Peter to pay Paul, and that kind
40:55
Speaker 4: of mindset. But to me, this lineup with Tucker makes
41:00
Speaker 4: Tucker better. I'm not saying it doesn't make anybody else better,
41:03
Speaker 4: But it makes Tucker better. It's another It's another example
41:07
Speaker 4: of the Dodgers finding surplus value in assigning.
41:14
Speaker 1: So I'm not going to act like I know everything
41:16
Speaker 1: about the NBA these days, But Kevin Durant's name was
41:19
Speaker 1: thrown out there. He's won two titles. He's a great,
41:21
Speaker 1: great player in the league for a long period of time.
41:24
Speaker 1: His two titles were with the Warriors twenty eighteen twenty nineteen.
41:27
Speaker 1: He joined a super team. Did Kyle Tucker not just
41:30
Speaker 1: do that? Sure, money has to be a factor in
41:32
Speaker 1: many other things, But Trevor, my question to you, does
41:36
Speaker 1: that change your perception of someone, whether you're a player
41:39
Speaker 1: or a fan at all, if you're joining the big
41:42
Speaker 1: bad evil empire to try and rack up a ring
41:44
Speaker 1: on your own And also from a financial perspective, would
41:50
Speaker 1: you rather do the deal that he just signed or
41:52
Speaker 1: the ten three point fifty ish that the Blue Jays
41:55
Speaker 1: were throwing his way. Once you actually hear that and
41:58
Speaker 1: you do the math, you're like, man, I do think
42:01
Speaker 1: that he can probably put together more money in his
42:04
Speaker 1: career if he just rides it out this way. That's
42:07
Speaker 1: the dream for a team like the Dodgers, because they
42:09
Speaker 1: don't have to commit long term. And also, let's not
42:13
Speaker 1: forget about this part. Kyle Tucker hasn't lived up in Toronto,
42:16
Speaker 1: not that he wouldn't fall in love with it, But
42:17
Speaker 1: when you sign a double digit year deal with a team,
42:21
Speaker 1: like a portion of your prime years of your life
42:25
Speaker 1: are going to be there now, right, Like that changes
42:28
Speaker 1: things and for some guys they might not want to
42:30
Speaker 1: commit like that.
42:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think we're seeing that more popular become more popular.
42:36
Speaker 2: I'll be honest myself personally, I actually said this to
42:41
Speaker 2: Francisco Indoor once when I thanked him or thanked him
42:44
Speaker 2: when I Will congratulated him on signing his eleven year deal,
42:47
Speaker 2: I was like, hey, man, that's awesome.
42:48
Speaker 3: Eleven years.
42:50
Speaker 2: That's a long time man, Like, Like, you know, for me,
42:54
Speaker 2: I'd be like, you know, how am I going to
42:57
Speaker 2: feel in eleven years and how are things going to be?
42:59
Speaker 2: Probably no matter what I do, and no matter how
43:01
Speaker 2: hard I try, not physically, and probably not gonna be
43:05
Speaker 2: the same guy I am now. So I think that,
43:08
Speaker 2: you know, it's a huge commitment both ways, and I
43:12
Speaker 2: think that players like an opportunity to to change it
43:15
Speaker 2: up and like keep that open a little bit, and
43:17
Speaker 2: that's becoming more common, and I don't blame anyone for
43:22
Speaker 2: doing that so sometimes and it's it's honestly kind of
43:27
Speaker 2: nice to see that though money probably is the top
43:30
Speaker 2: of the pros and cons list when you make your
43:33
Speaker 2: list as a free agent, it's not so bold and
43:35
Speaker 2: not so big and not so far away from all
43:37
Speaker 2: the other ones, which I think is a healthier place
43:41
Speaker 2: to be just in general. And so for for guys
43:46
Speaker 2: to choose to give themselves more options, choose this option
43:49
Speaker 2: and also give themselves another crack at make an adjustment
43:52
Speaker 2: living somewhere else or maybe you know, if it just
43:55
Speaker 2: isn't working out culture wise, vibe wise, because that's one
43:58
Speaker 2: thing you'll you won't know until you get there, and
44:00
Speaker 2: you have to sign to get there.
44:01
Speaker 3: So it's like a.
44:02
Speaker 2: Huge commitment to marry someone that you have very little,
44:07
Speaker 2: you have not been dating for very long, and it's
44:09
Speaker 2: it is one of those situations. So to be honest,
44:12
Speaker 2: the way that the tenure deals work from that standpoint,
44:16
Speaker 2: don't They are a little bit I logical in a
44:18
Speaker 2: lot of different ways. And so this becoming more common,
44:22
Speaker 2: and the higher AAV kind of softens the ability to
44:26
Speaker 2: push the market. Bigger money, bigger dollar numbers, right, The
44:29
Speaker 2: higher AAV kind of closes that gap a little bit too,
44:31
Speaker 2: So it solves that problem somewhat to make the other
44:35
Speaker 2: things a.
44:35
Speaker 3: Little bit more palable.
44:36
Speaker 2: So not we're seeing it a little bit more and
44:39
Speaker 2: more and more guys willing to do it, and you know,
44:42
Speaker 2: I can't fault them because that would probably where my
44:45
Speaker 2: predisposition would be as well. But I always thought of
44:48
Speaker 2: myself a little bit as an outlier there. It's kind
44:50
Speaker 2: of interesting to see that maybe maybe I wasn't, you know,
44:52
Speaker 2: on an island as much as I thought it was.
44:55
Speaker 1: Also, we're showing the net present value of the deal.
44:57
Speaker 1: There are deferrals for Kyle Tucker's contract if he doesn't
45:01
Speaker 1: opt out after the second year of the deal, but
45:05
Speaker 1: the net present value doesn't go down that much fifty
45:08
Speaker 1: seven million dollars per season. Some people thought it would
45:11
Speaker 1: go much lower based on how the Dodgers have done
45:13
Speaker 1: deals in the past. This wasn't a show heo Tani
45:16
Speaker 1: phone call.
45:17
Speaker 3: Guys.
45:17
Speaker 1: This wasn't Hey, I'm good, I'm making one hundred a
45:20
Speaker 1: year off the field. I want to defer this so
45:22
Speaker 1: I don't do the California state taxes. At some point
45:25
Speaker 1: Kyle Tucker's like, give him a damn money right now,
45:27
Speaker 1: and the Dodgers had it for him. I mean, they're
45:29
Speaker 1: profiting their asses off right now by winning consistently, by
45:33
Speaker 1: selling on the marketing side with all the Japanese talent
45:36
Speaker 1: that they have, in addition to what they're doing in
45:38
Speaker 1: the States with brand deals. They are crushing it.
45:40
Speaker 3: Right.
45:41
Speaker 1: You invest in not just winning, but also I guess
45:43
Speaker 1: the right players to market around and look at what's
45:46
Speaker 1: happening for them. It's all become a perfect storm. They
45:48
Speaker 1: also have drafted and developed very well. But yes, it's
45:52
Speaker 1: technically by far the highest average annual value in history.
45:56
Speaker 1: This was from last night when we didn't know what
45:58
Speaker 1: the deferrals looked like. But for show, hey, his net
46:00
Speaker 1: present value contract is around four hundred and fifty million dollars,
46:03
Speaker 1: so that brings his rate down pretty significantly. Right, It's
46:06
Speaker 1: about forty five million dollars per season, So Kyle Tucker's
46:10
Speaker 1: at fifty seven crats. He destroyed that number. He even
46:14
Speaker 1: destroyed Juan Soto's number by over six million dollars per season,
46:18
Speaker 1: So on a per year basis, he is by far
46:21
Speaker 1: the highest paid player in baseball right now. Just something
46:24
Speaker 1: to think about. And obviously Bobashett is in the top
46:27
Speaker 1: what five now as well with what could be forty
46:30
Speaker 1: seven million dollars for one season of ball. So I
46:33
Speaker 1: wanted to get your thoughts on that, and then also
46:34
Speaker 1: I want to get to the aftermath of teams that
46:36
Speaker 1: have missed out, right, I mean, the Mets missed out,
46:38
Speaker 1: but then they pivot in five seconds. The Phillies missed out.
46:42
Speaker 1: We actually saw the one report that they threw seven years,
46:44
Speaker 1: two hundred million dollars at Bobashett. It was his request,
46:48
Speaker 1: that seemed to be his dream deal until the Mets
46:50
Speaker 1: missed out on Kyle Tucker, and clearly this morning said hey,
46:54
Speaker 1: we can get you pretty close to that number in
46:56
Speaker 1: a lot less years. Are you interested? Because he's twenty seven,
47:00
Speaker 1: So it's like, do you want to hit the free
47:01
Speaker 1: agent market again at twenty eight, twenty nine, thirty, any
47:03
Speaker 1: of those years would you like to do that?
47:05
Speaker 3: Instead?
47:05
Speaker 1: Come off a platform year when the sport has more
47:08
Speaker 1: stability after a collective bargaining agreement gets done and they
47:12
Speaker 1: were able to take down the Phillies. Same thing for
47:14
Speaker 1: the Blue jays Ken was on the money. Ken said
47:17
Speaker 1: all off season long, Boba Schet not likely to be
47:20
Speaker 1: back with Toronto. He was correct. But also we look
47:25
Speaker 1: at a Toronto team that was going after Kyle Tucker
47:27
Speaker 1: and comes up short. Fans go, hey, where are we
47:30
Speaker 1: spending that money? So what do you think about the
47:32
Speaker 1: money aftermath?
47:33
Speaker 4: For all of this, the fact that he got the
47:36
Speaker 4: most because it's such a short term deal, A little
47:41
Speaker 4: surprised the fact that it's six million dollars more is
47:45
Speaker 4: such a large number. It's such a staggering number that
47:49
Speaker 4: I was like a little resident to be. I was
47:51
Speaker 4: a little like just hesitant to say did we get
47:56
Speaker 4: the numbers right? Because I pose this question to you, guys,
48:00
Speaker 4: what does that number look like if you want to
48:02
Speaker 4: sign Kyle Tucker to a short term deal?
48:04
Speaker 5: Is it more than Aaron Judge? Is it more than?
48:08
Speaker 4: And then we heard the fifty million being bantered about,
48:11
Speaker 4: and I'm like, okay, Like, I guess that's good.
48:15
Speaker 5: This blew it out of the water.
48:17
Speaker 4: This is why teams don't like free agency, because this
48:22
Speaker 4: is an opportunity. They're in a free market. And he
48:24
Speaker 4: was able to negotiate with two teams that are willing
48:27
Speaker 4: to go the same realm, the same range, and to
48:30
Speaker 4: an extent with BO two, they're going to the same
48:33
Speaker 4: range of Hey, you know what, fifty fifty five, fifty six,
48:38
Speaker 4: fifty sixty, Okay, it's gonna be fifty seven. Final answer,
48:44
Speaker 4: this is it great? I wanted to go to the
48:46
Speaker 4: Dodgers anyway. I didn't want to go to the Mets. Obviously,
48:50
Speaker 4: deferrals and opt outs and all that stuff sways into it.
48:54
Speaker 4: But the money in general is a crazy thing to me,
48:58
Speaker 4: and I would I feel like Ken. The question I
49:03
Speaker 4: posed to Ken before was who is it better for?
49:05
Speaker 4: Is it better for Major League Baseball? Or is it
49:08
Speaker 4: better for the players? And Kyle Tucker moved that needle
49:13
Speaker 4: a long way.
49:14
Speaker 5: For the players.
49:15
Speaker 4: What happens in the next CBA, I don't know what
49:17
Speaker 4: these guys get back in the in the free agent market. Chapman, Snell, Bregman. Now,
49:26
Speaker 4: all these guys have done this and been successful. And
49:30
Speaker 4: now the needle moved even more, even Bobashett to or
49:35
Speaker 4: Alex Bregman to. Now Bobaschett two million dollars more. That's
49:39
Speaker 4: two million dollars for the players going forward, going forward,
49:44
Speaker 4: if you want to do a short term deal and
49:46
Speaker 4: you have better numbers than Kyle Tucker, who has no MVPs,
49:50
Speaker 4: whose sprint speed is going is declining, who is not
49:55
Speaker 4: in you know not he was in the best health
49:58
Speaker 4: the last two years. Whether you argue that or not,
50:00
Speaker 4: he could have had an MVP season the year he
50:03
Speaker 4: was out for over half the year. I get that,
50:06
Speaker 4: But the number has gone up, and I think that's
50:09
Speaker 4: only good for the players. So I think this number,
50:12
Speaker 4: I couldn't believe. He beat out the average annual value
50:18
Speaker 4: actual today's value of it by six million. That is
50:22
Speaker 4: a large, large number, two millions, a large number for
50:25
Speaker 4: Boba Schett to beat out Bragman just from last year.
50:29
Speaker 4: So the market is moving. And after this next CBA,
50:33
Speaker 4: a lot of these TV deals are going to be
50:34
Speaker 4: worked out too, So there's gonna be a little bit
50:36
Speaker 4: more money secure or money certain ctsh.
50:41
Speaker 5: In the market.
50:43
Speaker 3: Yeah.
50:43
Speaker 1: You know what's funny too is the recent call out
50:46
Speaker 1: Trevor by Commissioner Manfred for a signing deadline. So it's
50:51
Speaker 1: January sixteenth, So on the fifteenth and sixteenth, baseball has
50:55
Speaker 1: absolutely stolen the headlines. We have a college football Championship
50:59
Speaker 1: coming up on. We're in the thick of the NFL playoffs,
51:03
Speaker 1: NBA and NHL is going on, and the most popular
51:06
Speaker 1: storylines at the top of the website that you follow,
51:09
Speaker 1: whatever it is, right, has Kyle Tucker to the Dodgers.
51:12
Speaker 1: Now it's Bobashett to the Mets. So are you sure
51:16
Speaker 1: we're about that? Do you really want to have a
51:18
Speaker 1: signing deadline where then we're gonna do absolutely nothing for
51:20
Speaker 1: two months? I know it gets frustrating, but also we
51:24
Speaker 1: don't get these deals until this time. These deals were
51:26
Speaker 1: not on the table up until around now, and then
51:28
Speaker 1: all of a sudden everything happens. Right, the Mets weren't
51:31
Speaker 1: in on Bobaschett. I mean, sure, did they have conversations,
51:33
Speaker 1: I can mentioned sure, But did we think they were
51:36
Speaker 1: seriously in for Bobashett? No, Steve Cohen just woke up
51:39
Speaker 1: this morning and said, fuck it, let's go.
51:44
Speaker 3: He did.
51:46
Speaker 2: I think Rat said on a really interesting point with
51:48
Speaker 2: the revenue certainty, like as that becomes more certain, this
51:52
Speaker 2: stuff starts to work itself out a little bit earlier,
51:54
Speaker 2: like it's the uncertainty that is dragging these things out,
51:57
Speaker 2: and it feels normal that there's it takes forever for
52:00
Speaker 2: anything to happen in free agency right now, because every
52:03
Speaker 2: year there's some weird extenuating circumstance like there was a lockout,
52:06
Speaker 2: or there's COVID, or there's or we're trying to recoup
52:10
Speaker 2: money from the last year, or it was the year
52:11
Speaker 2: after COVID, like there's been something for like seven straight years.
52:15
Speaker 2: And and once this starts to kind of slow down,
52:18
Speaker 2: now we have the the pending CBA being negotiated again,
52:21
Speaker 2: so at some point it will slow down, and I
52:24
Speaker 2: think that solves itself a little bit as well. Also,
52:28
Speaker 2: I think there's a really interesting trend here because when
52:31
Speaker 2: negotiations happen, basically both parties they agree on a focus,
52:38
Speaker 2: like how what is going to move the need of
52:40
Speaker 2: the most. Sometimes it's even in terms of just within money.
52:43
Speaker 2: Sometimes it's length, sometimes it's total. Sometimes it's per year. Right,
52:48
Speaker 2: And I'm noticing, and I think that you guys are too,
52:51
Speaker 2: is that that per year is where the focus is
52:54
Speaker 2: hyper focus.
52:56
Speaker 3: We're talking about that a lot.
52:57
Speaker 2: The AAV is coming up a lot, and that's the
53:00
Speaker 2: number that's getting pushed. All of these things have different
53:03
Speaker 2: thresholds for pushing them forward to expand the market, and
53:08
Speaker 2: we are moving away from total money and years and
53:11
Speaker 2: to the AAV, which leads even with the Scooble thing
53:15
Speaker 2: and the conversation around his arbitration case pending, that's also
53:20
Speaker 2: about how much he's going to make in one year
53:22
Speaker 2: and trying to push that forward. So the focus on
53:25
Speaker 2: both sides, I think the players and the league and
53:27
Speaker 2: don't They don't agree on a lot, but I think
53:30
Speaker 2: they both see a lot of value. Like that's worth
53:33
Speaker 2: looking at. It solve some problems if we just focus
53:36
Speaker 2: on the AAV, which then naturally shortens the length of
53:39
Speaker 2: the contract. It gives players another opportunity to do It
53:42
Speaker 2: gives them flexibility to opt out year after year, make
53:45
Speaker 2: change their mind any year, and teams are not on
53:48
Speaker 2: the hook for as much total money. Like that's kind
53:51
Speaker 2: of a win win. It's it's it's weird to think about,
53:54
Speaker 2: but it kind of is. So we're seeing that shift happening,
53:58
Speaker 2: and we're also seeing possibly some solidifying and some certainty in.
54:03
Speaker 3: The amount of money you have.
54:04
Speaker 2: This makes like the teams being able to project, hey r,
54:08
Speaker 2: here's what their salaries number is in a huge range.
54:12
Speaker 3: It could be anymore.
54:13
Speaker 2: It's it's a little bit easier to predict where there's
54:15
Speaker 2: a little bit of certainty there and that at the
54:18
Speaker 2: end of the day is what they want the salary
54:20
Speaker 2: cap for anyway. So it's like it's almost as if,
54:22
Speaker 2: and this is an optimistic take, it's almost as if
54:25
Speaker 2: some of this focus maybe that's a that's a thread
54:28
Speaker 2: to pull out for both sides and say, maybe we
54:30
Speaker 2: can have something advantageous and focus on the AAV side
54:33
Speaker 2: of things and making sure that is healthy, which will
54:37
Speaker 2: which will then incentivize lowering these huge spends over a
54:41
Speaker 2: lot of a period of time where they don't know
54:43
Speaker 2: if on the back end, if they're not even gonna
54:44
Speaker 2: get any production, which is scary, and people with lots
54:48
Speaker 2: of money are risk adverse. That makes a lot of sense.
54:50
Speaker 2: They're running a business like if that's just built in,
54:53
Speaker 2: then that might be it might solve itself at least
54:56
Speaker 2: to a certain certain point. Now, obviously AAV's can get
54:59
Speaker 2: ridiculous and there will be a ceiling where okay, we're
55:03
Speaker 2: getting this is too much even year after year with
55:06
Speaker 2: the amount of money we have, we're gonna go way over.
55:08
Speaker 2: But like we'k and we might be approaching that. But
55:11
Speaker 2: I think this is more of a positive change than
55:14
Speaker 2: a negative change because I think it benefits. There's benefit
55:18
Speaker 2: for both sides. More often with these types of deals, wait.
55:22
Speaker 4: A benefit for both sides, and it grows the game together.
55:27
Speaker 4: Owners make more money, players make more money. We have
55:30
Speaker 4: five two hundred viewers right now. Baseball is not dead.
55:35
Speaker 4: Baseball we get to watch it. But I have one comment,
55:39
Speaker 4: and I disagree with Scott. Stevie Cohen did not wake
55:43
Speaker 4: up this morning and do that Bobashett deal. Stevie Cohen
55:47
Speaker 4: did not go to sleep last night because he didn't
55:49
Speaker 4: get Kyle Tucker, so he didn't wake up this morning.
55:51
Speaker 5: He slept. He was up the entire night, just like you, Scotty.
55:55
Speaker 1: That's true because it went down pretty late and then
55:58
Speaker 1: he's up early with the markets, so he did not sleep.
56:01
Speaker 1: He'll take a nap after this.
56:03
Speaker 4: Maybe when the international markets closed.
56:06
Speaker 5: That's when he goes to bed.
56:08
Speaker 2: He had he had an option out there just in
56:11
Speaker 2: case if the other deal didn't go through, the other
56:12
Speaker 2: one just kicked in. He just sent the email and
56:15
Speaker 2: got the thumbs up it was done. That's how he
56:17
Speaker 2: That's how he rolls. That's how business works. Keep going.
56:19
Speaker 1: Life is good when a team is your toy. Let
56:22
Speaker 1: me ask you guys this defensive alignment because we asked
56:25
Speaker 1: Ken about it and then we didn't get to the
56:27
Speaker 1: topic yet. But defensive alignment for the Mets?
56:33
Speaker 3: What are we doing?
56:34
Speaker 1: And like, if you're a pitcher, let's start with Trevor right,
56:37
Speaker 1: you were on this team. Do you feel comfortable with
56:40
Speaker 1: what's going on out there? Dudes learning different positions and hey,
56:43
Speaker 1: Boba shot looked money in limited time over at second base.
56:45
Speaker 1: So I'm not going to say he's not capable of
56:47
Speaker 1: handling third. It's just the question mark and the inexperienced
56:52
Speaker 1: factor of just throwing a bunch of guys at different positions.
56:55
Speaker 1: Is here's the thing David Sartin to saying our defense
56:58
Speaker 1: wasn't good enough. And I believe that athletes can just
57:01
Speaker 1: play other positions. So is he challenging the system a
57:04
Speaker 1: little bit here? When guys say, oh, I got to
57:06
Speaker 1: learn position, it's not that easy. David Stern's like, that
57:09
Speaker 1: is we can plug this guy here, that guy there.
57:13
Speaker 3: I think it depends on the guy.
57:15
Speaker 2: You know, there's no reason to think that a guy
57:17
Speaker 2: a twenty seven year old guy who has athletic who
57:20
Speaker 2: played like the switch from short stop short stop is
57:22
Speaker 2: the hardest infield position, so like it is conceivable. And
57:26
Speaker 2: I know he was the worst defensive shortstop in the
57:30
Speaker 2: league two years running, but like there is there is.
57:34
Speaker 2: I think there's some wisdom in thinking that it will improve.
57:38
Speaker 2: Now how much we don't know it's and I'll be honest,
57:40
Speaker 2: it's not like Viento's and Beaty are like amazing wizards
57:44
Speaker 2: over there, So maybe that plays in as well. Like
57:48
Speaker 2: if we get the same thing, but we get the bat,
57:51
Speaker 2: we can handle that. Because Francisco Lindor is a gold
57:54
Speaker 2: glove or close to every single year. Marcus Simeon's a
57:57
Speaker 2: goal glove second back. I think those two guys are
57:59
Speaker 2: going to be eat up the middle, two veteran guys
58:02
Speaker 2: that are locked in and make the right play and
58:04
Speaker 2: make all the play they're supposed to make. And Hore Polanco,
58:09
Speaker 2: he moves better than Pete Alonso. We'll see how the
58:12
Speaker 2: glove comes through. But he played some third base last
58:15
Speaker 2: year too, so he moves around. He goes from being
58:17
Speaker 2: a middle infielder to a corner infielder as well, which
58:20
Speaker 2: is an easier transition to make, so I think they're
58:22
Speaker 2: banking on that.
58:23
Speaker 3: I think what's gonna come down to is.
58:24
Speaker 2: Oh, you got to get those four guys and they
58:26
Speaker 2: got to be on the field and they got to
58:27
Speaker 2: practice a lot together, because that's what it comes down to,
58:31
Speaker 2: that trust factor.
58:32
Speaker 3: And as a pitcher going into spring training, you're gonna
58:34
Speaker 3: look around and be like, let's see how this goes.
58:37
Speaker 3: Like just the way it is, it's just the way.
58:39
Speaker 2: You just don't know until you know. But it also
58:43
Speaker 2: in the case of Sterns like for him to extrapolate
58:48
Speaker 2: and see, you know, these transitions should be easier than
58:52
Speaker 2: maybe other situations, and it's conceivable, but it is going to.
58:57
Speaker 3: Take a lot of work.
58:59
Speaker 2: I mean, when you're we're talking about like fifty million
59:02
Speaker 2: dollars a year, right like that, that seems like maybe
59:05
Speaker 2: a little bit a little bit of a risk. But uh,
59:09
Speaker 2: I mean the bat just him and Soda together in
59:12
Speaker 2: a lineup, is that is a that is a nightmare.
59:15
Speaker 3: That is a nightmare for a picture.
59:16
Speaker 2: And maybe that was the thing that's like, hey, this
59:18
Speaker 2: is just one of this opportunity presents itself.
59:20
Speaker 3: We are idiots for not taking it.
59:22
Speaker 2: And that is probably where the final domino fell right
59:25
Speaker 2: there when they went on the right side of the
59:27
Speaker 2: fence and they went for both.
59:29
Speaker 4: Before I get to my comment about Bo's defense, Trevor
59:33
Speaker 4: is a pitcher, and I know pictures while they're looking
59:36
Speaker 4: around like is it gonna work, they're also like, oh,
59:41
Speaker 4: we had a better third baseman, that play would have
59:43
Speaker 4: been made. Why are we shifting? Why are we in
59:46
Speaker 4: the shift right here? This is on that would have
59:49
Speaker 4: been a ground ball. A second you're like, well he
59:51
Speaker 4: hit at two hundred and ten miles an hour so,
59:53
Speaker 4: and then when it's groundball, double play into the shift,
59:56
Speaker 4: pictures are like, knew it did my job.
1:00:00
Speaker 5: Great job? Am I right or wrong?
1:00:02
Speaker 2: Trevor, No, life's detected, especially relievers, like we're there to
1:00:07
Speaker 2: We're there to complain about every single thing we can
1:00:08
Speaker 2: possibly find. So that is definitely like having built in excuses.
1:00:12
Speaker 3: Not the worst thing in the world. We're gonna get
1:00:14
Speaker 3: bland either way, that doesn't matter.
1:00:18
Speaker 4: It's like a kicker. It's like a kicker, you know,
1:00:21
Speaker 4: if you miss it, that's stinking wind. But my comment
1:00:24
Speaker 4: about Bo's defense I texted this morning right after bow sign.
1:00:28
Speaker 4: I texted a big league shortstop that had to start
1:00:32
Speaker 4: shifting positions. And I said, what is tougher the move
1:00:36
Speaker 4: from short to second every day or the move from
1:00:39
Speaker 4: short to third? And he said, by far third base.
1:00:44
Speaker 4: He said, the angles are completely different, and we can't
1:00:47
Speaker 4: go into an entire hour long show explaining it. But
1:00:51
Speaker 4: that's what third base is about. It's about those angles.
1:00:54
Speaker 4: So can somebody teach bo those angles, somebody that he respects,
1:01:00
Speaker 4: somebody that he has to learn that first step and
1:01:03
Speaker 4: that first step is probably your only step at third base,
1:01:07
Speaker 4: So that's where his value is gonna be. Can he
1:01:10
Speaker 4: go six feet back and six feet in? And if
1:01:14
Speaker 4: he can, to me, that's where he will increase his value.
1:01:18
Speaker 4: Not ooh, he really ran far. The plays were third
1:01:22
Speaker 4: baseman's run far to go get a ball. That's not like,
1:01:26
Speaker 4: that's not range. Range is that first step in all
1:01:31
Speaker 4: four directions front, back, left, right, and creating that angle
1:01:35
Speaker 4: to get yourself from six feet to eight feet And
1:01:39
Speaker 4: it was good insight by him, somebody that had to
1:01:42
Speaker 4: really make that transition. And he said third was the
1:01:45
Speaker 4: toughest because of the angle. So there's go'n be a
1:01:48
Speaker 4: lot of pressure on bo. Oh yeah, And he has
1:01:51
Speaker 4: to hit three hundred two.
1:01:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, February twenty second. You can already see the headline.
1:01:55
Speaker 1: David Wright in camp with the Mets, working with Boba Schett,
1:02:04
Speaker 1: the big fish who might be a little more popular
1:02:06
Speaker 1: these days. Cody Bellinger. John Hayman reporting the Yankees are
1:02:11
Speaker 1: willing to add not one, but two opt outs to
1:02:14
Speaker 1: Belly's contract offer. It would also include a big signing
1:02:18
Speaker 1: bonus and no deferrals in the contract. Trevor. The number
1:02:21
Speaker 1: we've been hearing for Bellingers around thirty million dollars per season,
1:02:26
Speaker 1: and it seems like the Yankees and Belly have been
1:02:28
Speaker 1: at an impasse because they only want to hand out
1:02:31
Speaker 1: five years. I'm trying to think also at who's leaking
1:02:35
Speaker 1: this out. Is it the Yankees because they want everyone
1:02:37
Speaker 1: to know how hard they're trying, or is it Belly's
1:02:39
Speaker 1: camp because they want to know a this is what
1:02:41
Speaker 1: we're getting last call, But it appears to be right
1:02:44
Speaker 1: if we're guessing based on all the reports. Getting conjured
1:02:47
Speaker 1: together five years about thirty a year, multiple opt outs,
1:02:52
Speaker 1: and no deferrals, really solid signing bonus up front. I
1:02:58
Speaker 1: don't want to say take it or leave it, but
1:02:59
Speaker 1: the Yankees being like this, what you would like, This
1:03:02
Speaker 1: is where we value you. Maybe another team swoops in,
1:03:05
Speaker 1: like the Blue Jays.
1:03:07
Speaker 2: I mean, oh my god, the Yankees are obsessed with him,
1:03:10
Speaker 2: like they really really want him. Hey, if I'm Yankees fans,
1:03:15
Speaker 2: at least you can't say they're not. Don't try it,
1:03:17
Speaker 2: like you can't just give you don't just go, hey,
1:03:20
Speaker 2: we gave him exactly.
1:03:21
Speaker 3: The thing he asked for the first one. I get that.
1:03:24
Speaker 2: I think adding the opt outs in is trying to
1:03:26
Speaker 2: shorten that deal. That's what you have to do. Now,
1:03:28
Speaker 2: there might be a third opt out that needs to
1:03:29
Speaker 2: be in there, because again, if there's only two and
1:03:31
Speaker 2: it's in the back, it's in the back end. He
1:03:34
Speaker 2: still have the guaranteed maybe if there's one before each one,
1:03:36
Speaker 2: and then you can kick up the aa V a
1:03:38
Speaker 2: little bit, give another chance. But again he's a little
1:03:40
Speaker 2: bit older than say it, Tucker, so maybe it's not
1:03:43
Speaker 2: as so so interesting, Like he doesn't like that still's
1:03:45
Speaker 2: kind of taking him to where another contract isn't going
1:03:48
Speaker 2: to be very lucrative, and he wants that covered. What
1:03:50
Speaker 2: I think is really interesting is the signing bonus thing,
1:03:52
Speaker 2: because that is going to help him avoid New York
1:03:54
Speaker 2: City taxes, which is very high, not as high so COW,
1:03:56
Speaker 2: but close.
1:03:57
Speaker 3: It's second, honest, and that is significant.
1:04:00
Speaker 2: And then the no deferred money, it creeps that value
1:04:03
Speaker 2: up at the number that he wants. So those are big, like,
1:04:07
Speaker 2: those are big concessions and uh, that's a lot oftentimes
1:04:12
Speaker 2: enough to to shake loose this this fixation with seven years.
1:04:16
Speaker 2: But it sounds like security is so important to him
1:04:21
Speaker 2: and if you can that's why the opt outs might
1:04:25
Speaker 2: fall on deaf ears. And he's like, I don't I
1:04:27
Speaker 2: want a place where I don't even have to think
1:04:28
Speaker 2: about opting out, Like because I've just committed to this.
1:04:30
Speaker 3: Is it till into the into the into the.
1:04:34
Speaker 2: Sunset are close to and it's like to be stubborn
1:04:38
Speaker 2: and stick with that long term deal as hard as
1:04:40
Speaker 2: he seemingly is. Security sounds like the thing he wants
1:04:44
Speaker 2: the most, But maybe those other two things, the signing bonus,
1:04:47
Speaker 2: the non deferred money, like getting all the money up front,
1:04:51
Speaker 2: there is a certain level security comes along with that.
1:04:53
Speaker 2: We'll see if that's enough to get it over the line.
1:04:55
Speaker 2: If it's if it's enough to satisfy that feeling, we'll
1:04:58
Speaker 2: we'll I guess we'll have to see very minimum. I mean,
1:05:02
Speaker 2: if they're leaking it, they put it out there, you
1:05:04
Speaker 2: can't really are like they're they're they're going for like
1:05:07
Speaker 2: they're going for they really want them. They keep going back,
1:05:09
Speaker 2: they keep justing, they keep getting creative, and there is
1:05:12
Speaker 2: at least a level a little bit, uh if you're
1:05:16
Speaker 2: a Yankes fan, a little bit of appreciation order they
1:05:18
Speaker 2: should be for for the attempt.
1:05:21
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, you don't get them,
1:05:22
Speaker 3: it doesn't matter.
1:05:24
Speaker 5: I mean, I feel like they have to get them. Obviously.
1:05:28
Speaker 4: You can never operate like that if you're the Yankees,
1:05:30
Speaker 4: you're any other team, man. I mean, there's a lot
1:05:34
Speaker 4: going on. The Red Sox are missing out on Bregman.
1:05:37
Speaker 4: They go and get Ranger, they trade it for Sunny Gray.
1:05:40
Speaker 4: They you know, they have young prospects coming up. Maybe
1:05:44
Speaker 4: the Red Sox haven't done enough yet. Boom, they get Ranger.
1:05:47
Speaker 4: They after their pivot. Okay, the Blue Jays have been
1:05:50
Speaker 4: doing what they're doing. The Orioles are still lurking and
1:05:53
Speaker 4: working and they you know, they've made some incredible moves
1:05:57
Speaker 4: with Pete Alonzo.
1:05:58
Speaker 5: They had upgrades.
1:06:00
Speaker 4: Do the Yankees have to get it. And that's where
1:06:02
Speaker 4: Cody's like, I know, you have to get me. I
1:06:05
Speaker 4: want to go back there. This is this is like
1:06:08
Speaker 4: both of us, we want this. And it feels like
1:06:10
Speaker 4: the Yankees are going, here's your contract. I forget what
1:06:14
Speaker 4: it was. It was a cartoon and it was like,
1:06:16
Speaker 4: here's what I'll give you, and they're like, I don't know.
1:06:19
Speaker 4: And then they're like, okay, we have this and we
1:06:22
Speaker 4: have one of these. Okay, that's great, but hang on,
1:06:26
Speaker 4: hang on, okay, so we have the contract, we have this,
1:06:29
Speaker 4: and we have that, and they're like, uh, let's.
1:06:34
Speaker 3: This is it.
1:06:35
Speaker 4: This is what we got, contract, this, that, and we
1:06:37
Speaker 4: got all of these things. And Cody's like, I didn't
1:06:41
Speaker 4: ask for all that. I asked for seven years. That's
1:06:44
Speaker 4: what I want. Maybe a little less annual value, but
1:06:49
Speaker 4: I want seven years to take me at thirty seven.
1:06:51
Speaker 4: I don't think Cody wants to go back out on
1:06:53
Speaker 4: the market at thirty five or after his thirty five
1:06:56
Speaker 4: aged thirty five season, Like I just think I think
1:06:59
Speaker 4: it's they're at an impass and I don't know exactly
1:07:04
Speaker 4: how the negotiations go, Like how many times have they
1:07:06
Speaker 4: gone back to each other, and I think he wants seven.
1:07:11
Speaker 4: They won five. My guess they settle on six. Cody
1:07:15
Speaker 4: Bellinger plays till he's thirty six there and they get
1:07:20
Speaker 4: their man and they make a few other moves and
1:07:23
Speaker 4: one big starting pitcher splash.
1:07:27
Speaker 1: Yankees might say, all right, six years, but we're going
1:07:29
Speaker 1: to lower the avert annal value a little bit totally.
1:07:33
Speaker 4: But I mean, I definitely think they will. I think
1:07:36
Speaker 4: that's the that's the play, and Yankee fans will be like, well,
1:07:40
Speaker 4: when have they ever done that? Sorry, it was a
1:07:43
Speaker 4: dja l Mayhew, but le Mayhew wanted to come back.
1:07:47
Speaker 4: I think Cody wants to come back. I think le
1:07:50
Speaker 4: Mayhew got six years ninety. I think he had at
1:07:54
Speaker 4: the time like four years seventy nine, and I forget
1:08:00
Speaker 4: what the number was from someone else and they were like, well,
1:08:04
Speaker 4: we'll give you a little bit more money, eleven million more,
1:08:07
Speaker 4: but we got to spread that out along a long ways,
1:08:10
Speaker 4: and he's like, cool, let's do it. And so I
1:08:13
Speaker 4: think that's where Cody's at.
1:08:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, that might have a little deferral action to it,
1:08:17
Speaker 1: so that it's a little bit more money but not
1:08:19
Speaker 1: a ton more money. But you get that sixth year
1:08:22
Speaker 1: if he's truly craving that, or you just take the
1:08:25
Speaker 1: five and say, wow, they really like me, like Trevor said,
1:08:28
Speaker 1: and he gave me all kinds of goodies, like a
1:08:30
Speaker 1: signing bonus to get some cash up front. But we'll see.
1:08:33
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems to be the one. I don't
1:08:35
Speaker 1: want to say sure thing, but it's definitely it's definitely
1:08:40
Speaker 1: a perfect fit for both sides, or at least it
1:08:43
Speaker 1: appears that way. Maybe a team swoops in and surprises us.
1:08:46
Speaker 1: It's not like we haven't seen that since this morning.
1:08:50
Speaker 1: Boba Schett and the Mets. Yes, anyway, we're gonna talk
1:08:54
Speaker 1: more about this. What who the Mets had to do it?
1:08:58
Speaker 5: No, no, no, no, no, wow, Yeah, the Mets had it.
1:09:01
Speaker 5: The Yankees have to do it.
1:09:02
Speaker 4: Is there a have to do it more out on
1:09:05
Speaker 4: the market right now, besides maybe starting pitching for the
1:09:08
Speaker 4: Orioles or or the Mets. Like, to me, this is
1:09:12
Speaker 4: the most we like. They have to do it. They
1:09:16
Speaker 4: have to go. There's no more Bobachett. Pivot to Bobachett
1:09:20
Speaker 4: and then put Jason Domingas in the outfield and Trent
1:09:24
Speaker 4: Grisham plays every day and you find a place for
1:09:27
Speaker 4: you know, you put Jazz in left and then Jason
1:09:31
Speaker 4: sits or whatever, Like there's no I don't think there's
1:09:34
Speaker 4: a Is there a pivot for the Yankees? Maybe I'm
1:09:36
Speaker 4: forgetting somebody, but I don't see the pivot right now.
1:09:48
Speaker 1: The quietest three team trade of all time went down
1:09:53
Speaker 1: in baseball last night. Trevor, I'm sure you saw this
1:09:56
Speaker 1: and got a chuckle. Kyle Tucker signs and then through
1:10:00
Speaker 1: the algorithm you really had to dig, right, You're like digging.
1:10:03
Speaker 1: There's like jokes, all kinds of hate about the Dodgers
1:10:07
Speaker 1: doing everything, and you're like, oh, wow, I see this
1:10:10
Speaker 1: one tweet about a three team trade that involves the Rays,
1:10:15
Speaker 1: the Reds, and the Angels. Josh Low is now an Angel,
1:10:20
Speaker 1: Gavin Lux and right hander pitching prospect Chris Clark going
1:10:25
Speaker 1: to the Rays, left handed reliever Brock Burke to the Reds,
1:10:29
Speaker 1: and Keith Low put a great article out in The
1:10:32
Speaker 1: Athletic to explain some of the dynamics here. Josh Low
1:10:35
Speaker 1: has had like the mini breakout in twenty twenty three
1:10:38
Speaker 1: and really declined in the past two years. The Rays
1:10:42
Speaker 1: have quite a few outfielders, including Jacob Melton added to
1:10:45
Speaker 1: the mix, so now they're able to give him more
1:10:48
Speaker 1: freedom of playing time. Also on this, Trevor, you have
1:10:53
Speaker 1: Gavin Lux, used to be a top prospect with the Dodgers,
1:10:56
Speaker 1: now moving around a little bit. He was with the Reds.
1:10:58
Speaker 1: It's kind of weird year for him. I mean, obp
1:11:01
Speaker 1: monster right, three poin fifty on base percentage was top
1:11:04
Speaker 1: forty in baseball left field. Defensive metrics weren't great, but
1:11:08
Speaker 1: I mean, I think he's going to be better at
1:11:10
Speaker 1: second base and I'm imagining he's replacing Brandon Lau over there.
1:11:13
Speaker 1: Red shed a little bit of money too, not that
1:11:16
Speaker 1: they need to, but five and a half million for Lux. Instead,
1:11:18
Speaker 1: they bring on brock Burke to be part of the
1:11:20
Speaker 1: bullpen for about half the price. Maybe there's another move
1:11:24
Speaker 1: coming for the Reds in their outfield. I think there
1:11:26
Speaker 1: should be. But your thoughts on the fun that was
1:11:29
Speaker 1: had here? Oh, and I guess the Angels getting Josh Low,
1:11:32
Speaker 1: who does still have I think high potential to be
1:11:34
Speaker 1: a part of an outfield that still needs to fill
1:11:36
Speaker 1: itself out. The only regular from last year that returns
1:11:39
Speaker 1: is Joe Adell.
1:11:41
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think it's just a classic.
1:11:43
Speaker 2: Anything with the trade or trade with the Rays is
1:11:46
Speaker 2: just a bunch of teams filling in.
1:11:48
Speaker 3: It's a bunch.
1:11:49
Speaker 2: Of quality players that are around the same maybe overall
1:11:54
Speaker 2: value for the team. And then we're just putting guys
1:11:56
Speaker 2: and we need a right fielder and we need a
1:11:58
Speaker 2: second bason. Okay, let's wap these two guys and now
1:12:00
Speaker 2: we have them in the right positions. But maybe maybe
1:12:03
Speaker 2: our wind total didn't go up in any meaningful way,
1:12:05
Speaker 2: and then maybe there's a prospect that they can hit on.
1:12:07
Speaker 2: And so I mean, these three teams are all kind
1:12:10
Speaker 2: of doing that.
1:12:12
Speaker 3: It is interesting.
1:12:14
Speaker 2: I'm someday I'm going to solve the Angel's equation, like
1:12:18
Speaker 2: what the long term goals are and plan is. It's
1:12:22
Speaker 2: a lot of uh, go grab a guy who had
1:12:25
Speaker 2: a good year a few years ago and then hope
1:12:27
Speaker 2: he comes back, and then most done doesn't.
1:12:31
Speaker 3: But hey, I'm I'm pulling for for Josh.
1:12:33
Speaker 2: Low He like you said, he is a ceiling to
1:12:36
Speaker 2: be a substantial bet in that lineup lefty stick, so
1:12:40
Speaker 2: he also kind of fulfills in need. Perimannassians made these
1:12:42
Speaker 2: type of deals as well, just trying to fill out
1:12:45
Speaker 2: the areas where there's not a lot of depth. So
1:12:48
Speaker 2: I mean, there's there's nothing really to say beyond that,
1:12:52
Speaker 2: and it's gonna be uh And the Red's going to
1:12:54
Speaker 2: getting relief pitching. They've been doing that a little bit too,
1:12:56
Speaker 2: but yeah, they definitely need to do a little bit more.
1:13:00
Speaker 3: It's going to be interesting.
1:13:01
Speaker 2: It's kind of weird to see how little they've been
1:13:03
Speaker 2: doing it after being a playoff team last year. But again,
1:13:06
Speaker 2: it might have been they might have been handed that
1:13:08
Speaker 2: more than they earned it, and that could be something
1:13:10
Speaker 2: that they're feeling a little bit. They're not quite ready
1:13:12
Speaker 2: to go put their foot on the gas, but they
1:13:14
Speaker 2: definitely need to do something because they are close and
1:13:16
Speaker 2: you've got to take advantage of twelve teams go to
1:13:17
Speaker 2: the playoffs. You know, you can get in with eighty
1:13:19
Speaker 2: three wins, and.
1:13:22
Speaker 3: Who knows what happens at that point, you can go
1:13:23
Speaker 3: steal one. So I like it.
1:13:26
Speaker 2: I think I think all three of these teams got
1:13:28
Speaker 2: more solid, maybe not necessarily gonna make bigger waves, but
1:13:34
Speaker 2: maybe more consistent teams.
1:13:36
Speaker 3: And I like the pieces here.
1:13:39
Speaker 4: I love this for the Angels because of the fact
1:13:42
Speaker 4: that I think Josh Lowe is the best player in
1:13:44
Speaker 4: this entire Rigamoreau of players being moved, But this year
1:13:52
Speaker 4: they said, we need more slug. They went and got
1:13:55
Speaker 4: Jorge Solaire in the outfield, which is now blocked Mike
1:13:58
Speaker 4: Trout and Joe Adele took the leap forward in the
1:14:02
Speaker 4: sense that he hit a bunch of homers but was
1:14:06
Speaker 4: the worst defensive center fielder in the game. So to me,
1:14:10
Speaker 4: I like this for the Angels, but it seems like
1:14:12
Speaker 4: it was like, yeah, we did want more slug, but
1:14:15
Speaker 4: then we got Jorge and now there's not slug available.
1:14:19
Speaker 4: We got rid of Taylor Ward, so we actually lost
1:14:21
Speaker 4: more slug. So did they change their mindset? I don't know,
1:14:26
Speaker 4: but I think I think I think Josh Low is
1:14:29
Speaker 4: going to have a better year than he had this
1:14:31
Speaker 4: past year's coming off of an injury his plate played
1:14:35
Speaker 4: after he came back last year. I just think I
1:14:37
Speaker 4: think there's a dynamic portion to his game that I
1:14:41
Speaker 4: don't think a lot of people know, because you know,
1:14:43
Speaker 4: the rays don't get seen by many people live in
1:14:46
Speaker 4: their stadium or nationally. But I think Gavin Lux I'll
1:14:51
Speaker 4: never forget when he was in spring training and he
1:14:54
Speaker 4: was gonna he was anointed as the next shortstop for
1:14:58
Speaker 4: the Los Angeles Dodgers. Kind of got a little yippie
1:15:02
Speaker 4: tore his knee up pretty bad, and I think he's
1:15:06
Speaker 4: really trying to still continue to come back from that.
1:15:09
Speaker 4: And I think if he can settle into a place
1:15:12
Speaker 4: that will just let him get his at bats, he
1:15:15
Speaker 4: can figure out a way to stay out on the
1:15:16
Speaker 4: field for one hundred and fifty five games this year.
1:15:20
Speaker 4: I think his own base percentage will make his batting
1:15:24
Speaker 4: average climb. He makes great decisions at the plate, and
1:15:28
Speaker 4: I think if he can play one hundred and forty
1:15:30
Speaker 4: games at second base and get into one hundred and
1:15:32
Speaker 4: fifty to one hundred and fifty five games, I think
1:15:35
Speaker 4: the amount of those at bats that consistency will help
1:15:39
Speaker 4: him regain some of his highly touted prospect status that
1:15:44
Speaker 4: he had, and I think it could be a really
1:15:48
Speaker 4: good piece for the Rays to be able to fit
1:15:50
Speaker 4: back in. But he has to be out on the
1:15:53
Speaker 4: field every single day to get those significant, consistent at bats,
1:15:57
Speaker 4: and I think that has to happen at one position,
1:16:00
Speaker 4: because sometimes when you're bouncing around, it's tough to get
1:16:03
Speaker 4: that flow going.
1:16:06
Speaker 1: Did you guys see the movie The replacements back in
1:16:09
Speaker 1: the day. Keanu reeves that one hit. I just thought
1:16:12
Speaker 1: it was really fun, right, all these guys that had
1:16:14
Speaker 1: these past primes or superstar level fame. So for some reason,
1:16:19
Speaker 1: and maybe you have a play on words with baseball,
1:16:21
Speaker 1: because replacement level player is a thing, so it's like
1:16:23
Speaker 1: the replacement levels. Maybe I'm just going totally off on
1:16:26
Speaker 1: a limb here, but the Angel's point here is that
1:16:28
Speaker 1: they seem to be bringing guys in that like had
1:16:30
Speaker 1: this little burst, right, Josh Lowe, Alec Manoa, Grayson Rodriguez. Right,
1:16:37
Speaker 1: there's a lot of these like, hey, this guy had
1:16:40
Speaker 1: some awesome and it's Jordan Romano's. Let's see if we
1:16:43
Speaker 1: could find it again. Let's see if we could bring
1:16:45
Speaker 1: it back.
1:16:46
Speaker 4: No Kratz, Yeah, Okay, yeah, I mean let's lessen this trade.
1:16:52
Speaker 4: Lesson this trade. I believe it with the Jordan Romano,
1:16:55
Speaker 4: I believe it with the Alec Manoa they signed Noah Cinderguard,
1:16:59
Speaker 4: the other you know they've It feels like to me
1:17:05
Speaker 4: they're a year late. It feels like the Angels get
1:17:08
Speaker 4: somebody and it's a year too late.
1:17:10
Speaker 1: Like Ah, Man, if.
1:17:11
Speaker 4: We had had Tyler Anderson when he was legit if
1:17:15
Speaker 4: we had had you know, this guy when he was
1:17:18
Speaker 4: when he was the man, if we had gotten now,
1:17:20
Speaker 4: I think the Kakuchi signing is has been something for him.
1:17:25
Speaker 4: You know, if they can turn the air conditioning back up,
1:17:27
Speaker 4: that would be good. But I think it's I think
1:17:29
Speaker 4: that's where they miss. I think that's where they miss.
1:17:31
Speaker 4: And they don't have enough depth in the minor leagues
1:17:33
Speaker 4: because all their minor leaguers are in the big leagues.
1:17:36
Speaker 4: They're they're they're training in the big leagues. And I
1:17:39
Speaker 4: think these like pastor prime. I wouldn't say past their
1:17:43
Speaker 4: prime because I really think Josh Lowe is a good player.
1:17:46
Speaker 4: I think he's out of all those guys that you
1:17:49
Speaker 4: just mentioned, I think he can be. I think he
1:17:52
Speaker 4: can be a twenty plus home run guy. I think
1:17:54
Speaker 4: he can be a twenty plus bag maybe even a
1:17:56
Speaker 4: thirty plus bag guy. So if you pick up twenty
1:17:59
Speaker 4: twenty thirty guy, that's gonna play way better outfield than
1:18:03
Speaker 4: anybody they were gonna put out there. I mean, think
1:18:05
Speaker 4: about their outfield defense right now. I haven't looked up
1:18:08
Speaker 4: Josh Lowe's metrics in the outfield. I think it could
1:18:11
Speaker 4: be a little skewed from playing in George Steinbrenner. But
1:18:14
Speaker 4: I'd have to look it up. Trout, so Lair and
1:18:19
Speaker 4: Joe Adell. Yeah, Josh Lowe is gonna roam around there.
1:18:23
Speaker 4: He's gonna look like Kelly Leak in that outfield.
1:18:27
Speaker 5: Yeah.
1:18:27
Speaker 1: And his metrics aren't great right, and they were down
1:18:31
Speaker 1: quite a bit in twenty twenty five. Keith Law's articles
1:18:33
Speaker 1: interesting because it actually it doesn't say like conditioning issue,
1:18:36
Speaker 1: but it's saying how he's getting himself in a much
1:18:38
Speaker 1: better position shape wise and whatever save the best shape
1:18:43
Speaker 1: in my life stuff. But yeah, I mean he did
1:18:45
Speaker 1: kind of point to that multiple times in the articles.
1:18:47
Speaker 1: So because he's a good athlete, so maybe there's something there.
1:18:50
Speaker 1: But I would say, yeah, if he returns to the
1:18:52
Speaker 1: norms more maybe an average defender out there. I get
1:18:54
Speaker 1: what you're saying, though, it's it's not a shiny outfield defensively,
1:18:58
Speaker 1: you got him low or him Trout, Joe Adele and
1:19:02
Speaker 1: then maybe or Hazel are getting some time out there.
1:19:06
Speaker 1: The way to fix the Angels Trevor is a new owner.
1:19:09
Speaker 1: It's the only way. At this point, they have no plan.
1:19:11
Speaker 1: It's that's very clear. I have lost faith in anything
1:19:14
Speaker 1: going on there for a while now, and we act
1:19:16
Speaker 1: like it's the Rockies, like it's so tough to solve this,
1:19:19
Speaker 1: Like the Rockies actually have a real environment situation to
1:19:22
Speaker 1: figure out. The Angels don't. So I don't want to
1:19:25
Speaker 1: put them in the same category at all. Like there
1:19:27
Speaker 1: are difficulties to long term success in Colorado. The Angel's
1:19:31
Speaker 1: successes or plan for success is much more simple. They're
1:19:34
Speaker 1: just like lost in space.
1:19:37
Speaker 3: I mean, no one wants to go to SoCal very obviously. Yeah,
1:19:41
Speaker 3: that's really problem.
1:19:42
Speaker 1: They can't recruit.
1:19:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it's definitely Art Moreno, and he stumbled into
1:19:48
Speaker 2: a World Series the first year he owned the team
1:19:50
Speaker 2: and then has not sense. And I would just I
1:19:53
Speaker 2: just did a big segment on may Day about the
1:19:56
Speaker 2: worst contracts in history, and they have like five of
1:19:58
Speaker 2: the top seven. So it's just and they've all been
1:20:01
Speaker 2: during Art's tenure there, with Josh Hamilton and pool hosts
1:20:07
Speaker 2: and Rendon and.
1:20:09
Speaker 3: I mean to a little bit of extent.
1:20:10
Speaker 2: I mean, we love everyone loves Mike Trout, but like
1:20:13
Speaker 2: the value is not matched the money right now, Like it's.
1:20:16
Speaker 3: Just keeps happening.
1:20:17
Speaker 2: Uh, the trading for Vernon Wells when he's at the
1:20:20
Speaker 2: bottom right, So like it's just it's just what they do.
1:20:23
Speaker 2: Like he hears the name and it's almost as if
1:20:25
Speaker 2: he's like, oh, I've heard that name before and then
1:20:27
Speaker 2: he just says yes, like and it's been that with
1:20:31
Speaker 2: honestly managers, and it's been that with jam. It's just
1:20:34
Speaker 2: like got people who have been around. He's heard the
1:20:35
Speaker 2: name before, and he's like, that's a baseball person. Let's
1:20:37
Speaker 2: get him.
1:20:37
Speaker 3: And you can't just keep flip flopping. And I have
1:20:39
Speaker 3: a goal.
1:20:40
Speaker 2: You got to be baseball savvy and so and it
1:20:43
Speaker 2: starts with him, and I'm not gonna blame I know
1:20:45
Speaker 2: everyone over there is doing it. Everyone below that wrong
1:20:49
Speaker 2: is doing everything they can to navigate this thing. And
1:20:52
Speaker 2: there's other teams that have similar problems where it's just like,
1:20:54
Speaker 2: what like, at some point you're running too at a
1:20:57
Speaker 2: block mescuse of the person who's been there the whole time.
1:21:00
Speaker 2: But you know, at some point we gotta pitching is
1:21:03
Speaker 2: just gotta be the You gotta win with pitching, and
1:21:06
Speaker 2: it's a place to go. Everyone wants to pitch that like,
1:21:08
Speaker 2: go pitch, and so it's nice all the time. You
1:21:10
Speaker 2: can always grip the ball. You know what, you know
1:21:12
Speaker 2: what the temperature is going to be almost to the
1:21:14
Speaker 2: to the to the degree every day because it's the same,
1:21:18
Speaker 2: Like that's a great place to go pitch. The ball
1:21:20
Speaker 2: isn't necessarily fly like crazy, so like it's just it
1:21:22
Speaker 2: seems like something that they just don't have that, Like
1:21:24
Speaker 2: you mentioned the obstacles of like mince. People go be like, hey,
1:21:28
Speaker 2: I know you like pitching, but you're gonna give up
1:21:29
Speaker 2: more runs. But we'll give you money to compensate you
1:21:32
Speaker 2: for that. At least the Rockets have tried that a
1:21:34
Speaker 2: couple of times. They just are just swing missing left right,
1:21:36
Speaker 2: and it is frustrating. But I'm not an Angels fan,
1:21:39
Speaker 2: but like you know, I didn't follow them super closely,
1:21:41
Speaker 2: but you know, you want to see you it's peaks
1:21:43
Speaker 2: and valleys. You just can't be in a valley forever,
1:21:45
Speaker 2: and it gets frustrating. Someone covers baseball is watching it,
1:21:49
Speaker 2: just like you know, wh when's when's your time coming back?
1:21:52
Speaker 3: Oh? Five was a long what was it? O? Three? Three? Two?
1:21:58
Speaker 3: Long time ago? All right, long long? You know, thirteen
1:22:02
Speaker 3: year olds in the middle of Trevor's like here we go, come.
1:22:04
Speaker 1: On, yeah, let's go guys. I'm with you, and just
1:22:08
Speaker 1: for time purposes, I'll just say what Kratz texted me.
1:22:10
Speaker 1: Or they also forgot to trade show he o Tani
1:22:12
Speaker 1: when they two months left of him and could have
1:22:14
Speaker 1: gotten the world, including Jackson Merrill.
1:22:17
Speaker 2: And that's an ownership Yeah, I know all the black
1:22:21
Speaker 2: forgot about that that.
1:22:22
Speaker 3: I think that's ptsd' out of my head.
1:22:25
Speaker 4: Jackson Merril, Jackson Merril, I heard Jackson Holiday. Both of
1:22:31
Speaker 4: those guys were on for show. Hey, and he ended
1:22:35
Speaker 4: up tearing his UCL or had reconstruction of his UCO
1:22:39
Speaker 4: and missed it like they could have traded him for
1:22:42
Speaker 4: that Like for those guys. Ah, that's an ownership thing.
1:22:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's painful. We have an Angel show for therapy
1:22:50
Speaker 1: if you want it, Halo Territory. But we also have
1:22:52
Speaker 1: since we were talking about the trade, Riverfront Territory, which
1:22:56
Speaker 1: is our new Red show. It's about a month and
1:22:58
Speaker 1: a half old. It's got Danny Graves and c Shrint
1:23:00
Speaker 1: Rosecrants who covers the team on a daily basis. It's
1:23:04
Speaker 1: ft network coverage that you're looking for on a team
1:23:06
Speaker 1: by team. Yes, we've been hearing you. We've been launching
1:23:09
Speaker 1: shows left and right. And also Danny will be at
1:23:14
Speaker 1: Redsfest this weekend, so the last chance to promo it.
1:23:17
Speaker 1: So I just wanted to throw it out there. Three
1:23:19
Speaker 1: o'clock Eastern Poker tournament action. The tournament itself starts at four,
1:23:24
Speaker 1: but grab there's a bar, drinks, food, the whole deal
1:23:27
Speaker 1: at the Convention Center in Cincinnati, and then twelve o'clock
1:23:31
Speaker 1: Eastern or local panel discussion at the Ben MGM Sports
1:23:35
Speaker 1: Book at the Banks over there. So go check it
1:23:38
Speaker 1: all out. We'll see you this weekend, myself, Danny and
1:23:41
Speaker 1: Todd Father. All right, one more move Willie Castro two
1:23:46
Speaker 1: years about thirteen million bucks two the Colorado Rockies and Kratz.
1:23:50
Speaker 1: There was a great joke online from someone who was like, really,
1:23:54
Speaker 1: the Rockies couldn't have Willy Castro day, Come on, Dodgers
1:23:58
Speaker 1: of course steal their thunder, like we signed Kyle Tucker.
1:24:03
Speaker 1: So this is not going to get its own segment
1:24:05
Speaker 1: on FT. It's going to get a one minute mention.
1:24:07
Speaker 1: But good for Willy. I mean, he had a really
1:24:08
Speaker 1: good year two years ago All Star and then this
1:24:11
Speaker 1: past season was much more of a down year. Guys
1:24:13
Speaker 1: that covered the Twins were like surprised that he got
1:24:15
Speaker 1: a two year deal, but good for him. And it
1:24:17
Speaker 1: takes a little extra sometimes for the recruiting trail right
1:24:20
Speaker 1: now for the Rockies, but to do it all guy
1:24:22
Speaker 1: that can set a good example and whoever gets called up,
1:24:26
Speaker 1: he can just build a next open spot.
1:24:29
Speaker 5: Good for the Rockies.
1:24:30
Speaker 4: Good for the Rockies for doing a little extra. They
1:24:33
Speaker 4: spent money, whether they had to do it, they wanted
1:24:36
Speaker 4: to do it, whatever, But good for the Rockies for
1:24:40
Speaker 4: going out and doing this. And it's definitely a buying
1:24:46
Speaker 4: law on a guy that coming in to last season
1:24:49
Speaker 4: after his All Star season, you were like, this guy's
1:24:52
Speaker 4: taking the next step, going to be the next like
1:24:55
Speaker 4: ben Zobras type of contract, not saying that he is
1:24:58
Speaker 4: ben Zobras, but that guy that can play above average
1:25:01
Speaker 4: at a bunch of different positions. And you know what,
1:25:05
Speaker 4: he didn't have a good year. Rockies still saw value.
1:25:08
Speaker 4: They were willing to go, whether it was the extra
1:25:11
Speaker 4: years or a little extra in the contract.
1:25:13
Speaker 5: Good for Willy.
1:25:17
Speaker 1: What are you saying, Trevor, they're done?
1:25:20
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the fix. Let's go bring it.
1:25:22
Speaker 2: In, yeh, Willie Castro and give Michael Lorenz in a
1:25:26
Speaker 2: bat as well as the ball.
1:25:27
Speaker 3: And uh, now I you know what I I you
1:25:33
Speaker 3: know we can.
1:25:33
Speaker 2: You can say you want about the Rockies and and
1:25:36
Speaker 2: and Dick Monford the operating part of there. But like it,
1:25:40
Speaker 2: I don't think it's a question whether or not, like
1:25:42
Speaker 2: he likes baseball and he really does want to be
1:25:45
Speaker 2: a good like he wants his team to be good.
1:25:47
Speaker 2: I just think that like maybe there's a lack of
1:25:51
Speaker 2: creativity and a lack of uh spending money in places
1:25:55
Speaker 2: that you could that may develop your team better and
1:25:58
Speaker 2: understand and use your advance use where you play as
1:26:02
Speaker 2: an advantage because it stinks to play there, But eighty
1:26:04
Speaker 2: one teams have to come to you and eighty one
1:26:07
Speaker 2: games other teams who aren't there all the time have
1:26:09
Speaker 2: to play there. So maybe you can make separate yourself
1:26:12
Speaker 2: in that way. I mean, I just don't see that happening.
1:26:14
Speaker 2: But they went for Chris Bryant that has it worked out,
1:26:17
Speaker 2: But they went for it. Like there's teams that just
1:26:18
Speaker 2: don't go for it at all, which is just like
1:26:21
Speaker 2: you can't there's nothing, nothing will ever happen if you
1:26:23
Speaker 2: never go for it. So at least they do that
1:26:25
Speaker 2: at least they do that, and at least they you know,
1:26:28
Speaker 2: will Willie's gonna go get a chance to recoup some
1:26:30
Speaker 2: of his value. He plays all over the field, he's
1:26:32
Speaker 2: a veteran guy. There's there's worse outcomes as it's no
1:26:36
Speaker 2: risk and worst case scenario, or or maybe he recoups
1:26:40
Speaker 2: some value and he gets to go continue to build
1:26:43
Speaker 2: up a case for a better contracted future, which is
1:26:45
Speaker 2: a good for him.
1:26:46
Speaker 3: So like, I like it.
1:26:47
Speaker 2: I understand where they're at and like, you know, how
1:26:49
Speaker 2: are you gonna how are you gonna go blow it
1:26:52
Speaker 2: out at this point when you won forty something games
1:26:54
Speaker 2: last year? But incremental improvements and hopefully though the I
1:26:57
Speaker 2: want to see the player development stuff get better. But
1:27:00
Speaker 2: you know, they're hiring new people, so let's see that.
1:27:03
Speaker 2: Let's see if that colles as well, and I do
1:27:05
Speaker 2: I will give them credit for making a move.
1:27:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, baby steps, And you do have to add vets
1:27:10
Speaker 1: to set examples and also guys that you can potentially flip. Right,
1:27:13
Speaker 1: it's definitely possible that Willy has a bounce back season
1:27:15
Speaker 1: and they trade him either this year or they have
1:27:17
Speaker 1: for two years, So that could happen in twenty twenty seven,
1:27:32
Speaker 1: and then there were two krats and me kind of
1:27:35
Speaker 1: talked about Kratz hats already, but you could still throw
1:27:37
Speaker 1: it out there and maybe do a double.
1:27:39
Speaker 5: For anybody who wasn't.
1:27:40
Speaker 4: Because now we have five thousand people watching, don't forget
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Speaker 4: get us a three hundred thousand. Today's winners probably the first.
1:27:56
Speaker 4: I think it's the first day I've ever worn two
1:27:57
Speaker 4: hats on one show. The Mets and Dodgers. Will they
1:28:01
Speaker 4: meet up? Will the moves that they made today have
1:28:04
Speaker 4: them clashing in the Nationally Championship Game this year? Some
1:28:10
Speaker 4: will think yes, some will think no. Great day for
1:28:14
Speaker 4: both organizations. But who who actually won the day? That's
1:28:18
Speaker 4: the question. I'll let you guys figure.
1:28:20
Speaker 1: Out National leagu Championship Series remake Dodgers Mets, remember twenty
1:28:29
Speaker 1: twenty four. I'm not sure more pitching decisions that need
1:28:33
Speaker 1: to be made, I think on the Mets side, but
1:28:36
Speaker 1: we shall see. Winter Meetings Week virtually continues on FT.
1:28:42
Speaker 1: Hopefully they take a break this weekend. I'll be in
1:28:44
Speaker 1: Cincinnati with Todd and Danny. I'll try and do my
1:28:46
Speaker 1: best to outlast them in poker tomorrow in the big
1:28:49
Speaker 1: tournament at the Convention Center, all for a good cause.
1:28:51
Speaker 1: And then next week we're back at it and we'll
1:28:54
Speaker 1: cover more trades and signings. AJ back with us. We
1:28:57
Speaker 1: do have a show on Monday, so we'll be live
1:28:59
Speaker 1: Monday one o'clock Eustern time. Thanks for the team behind
1:29:03
Speaker 1: the scenes working extra hard, including last night for the
1:29:05
Speaker 1: Breaking News show, which was awesome and included Jim Bowden
1:29:08
Speaker 1: and Ken Rosenthal with Moore on The Kyle Tucker News
1:29:11
Speaker 1: which is still very relevant. Have a nice weekend everyone,