Latest / Conservation Stories / Housing, Hope, and Human Dignity With Chase Head

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Housing, Hope, and Human Dignity With Chase Head · Conservation Stories

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Foreign. Welcome back to another episode of Conservation Stories. Conservation Stories is a podcast brought to you by the Sand Hill Area Research Association. And I'm happy to have Chase head back with us again. Chase was here a few months ago talking about the food bank and what he does for them and what the food bank does. And we had a few more episodes after yours talking more about the SNAP program and you know, the federal side and that kind of thing. But when you left last time, you just like threw this comment out there that you have this really property business and I got super intrigued.
• 0:44
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. So I have a couple of companies in the real estate industry, but specifically Yucca Properties is one that my wife and I have and we do all kinds of stuff in the real estate industry. So we do long term rentals and flips and Airbnbs and a little bit of everything in that space. But with, with Yucca, we do a lot to really try to help people. So I kind of look at it as, as a helping side and a hospitality side and, and it's a lot of fun and feel good about the work that we get to do.
• 1:19
  Speaker A: I really, I really appreciate the way that you, you know, look at and approach the world through that lens of like, you know, it's about what I, the mark that I leave behind. Well, yeah, I love that.
• 1:31
  Speaker B: I try to. Yeah. That's.
• 1:33
  Speaker A: You could be doing a lot of things, but you're working at the food bank.
• 1:37
  Speaker B: True. Yeah. And my work at the food bank and my work kind of in the low income housing.
• 1:43
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 1:44
  Speaker B: Area has, has given me a lot of perspective and different perspective on, on the world we live in and the country.
• 1:52
  Speaker A: And it's so true. And it's really interesting because I really think, you know, until you experience something or you love someone who's experienced something, it's really hard to have an empathy, you know. And I remember when we adopted our son, he's from, from China and he was a teenager and that was a very eye opening experience for us. You know, things that we'd never experienced before suddenly became.
• 2:15
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 2:16
  Speaker A: A reality in our home and a heartbreak, you know.
• 2:21
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 2:21
  Speaker A: And so it's hard to. But I know. I remember the counselor saying the empathy is a muscle. And that makes sense to me.
• 2:29
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 2:29
  Speaker A: Like it's not something you're necessarily. I don't have any of this. It's something you can have and you can increase.
• 2:35
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. I think you can definitely strengthen it. It's, it's interesting. I don't know if you're familiar with the CliftonStrengths finder kind of personality assessment. But.
• 2:44
  Speaker A: Yep.
• 2:45
  Speaker B: I can't think of the other one. There's 34 strengths on there, and there's two of them that they say you're. You're born with, if an empathy is one of them. So. So I think there are people like my wife who just.
• 2:56
  Speaker A: Super.
• 2:56
  Speaker B: That's just their strength and they're born with it.
• 2:59
  Speaker A: Right. Yeah.
• 2:59
  Speaker B: And she can have a conversation with somebody and take from that conversation something that never crossed my mind.
• 3:04
  Speaker A: And. Yes.
• 3:06
  Speaker B: So it just comes natural to her. But some of us. Yeah, we got to work on it and.
• 3:09
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 3:10
  Speaker B: And seeing different things.
• 3:12
  Speaker A: Well. And it's. You know, we are. We live in such a bootstrap world. I mean, our culture is bootstrap, and it's hard for us to think, hey, we've experienced these things. We got over it. Yep. Weren't they. You know what I mean? It's just. It's so. I think we are finally coming into more of a realization of that the things that happened two, three generations ago, we are still benefiting from or we're still trying to overcome.
• 3:38
  Speaker B: Yeah, I would agree with that. And. And talking about just pulling yourself up by the bootstraps, you know, what has been, you know, made a reality to me is that. And. And I'm a conservative, naturally. Or. And. And that's kind of the mentality is. And. And I think God created us to work and work is good and. And that I think people should work and provide for themselves. But being in these spaces that I find myself in, the reality is that a lot of people just don't have the capacity for whatever reason that may be. I don't always know why that is. And then inflation and different things that have happened or, you know, a snowstorm that kept you from getting to work last week.
• 4:32
  Speaker A: Yes. Oh, my gosh. It's so fragile, you living on the edge. Yeah.
• 4:35
  Speaker B: I mean, there's a lot of society that something like that can make a huge impact on their life. And so.
• 4:41
  Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. It's amazing how quickly someone can become homeless in those kind of situations. Yeah. It really. Isn't it, that those people are here around us. And, you know, I think that we. We have a culture that we understand in theory, I think a lot of the things that were taught in church, but maybe we haven't ever really sometimes don't know how to put that into practice, you know, or haven't maybe always found pathways to do that. You know what I mean? Or, you know, those Kind of things that there's always somebody. I remember my grandmother saying, you know, there's always someone worse off than you are. When they were living in a little tiny shack on the farm and. But then they were migrant workers that would come through that were living in a, literally like a barn, you know what I mean? And she would have like one dish was disappearing and a cup was disappearing or whatever. And she went in there and they had one little milk crate on the wall and there were those plates and dishes, you know, that, that they had taken from her house. And she just said, I didn't, you know, like, how can you take, how do you have the heart to, like, you know, it's just that that's all they had. That was it.
• 5:47
  Speaker B: Yep.
• 5:48
  Speaker A: You know, and so just that to be able to have empathy for somebody that's even in a worse situation than you are.
• 5:55
  Speaker B: Absolutely.
• 5:56
  Speaker A: That's a big deal. It really is. So tell us about Yucca Properties.
• 6:00
  Speaker B: Yeah, so like I briefly mentioned, we're kind of in all of the, well, not all of them, but we're in a lot of the real estate spaces, whether that's long term rentals, short term rentals, Airbnbs, flips, that's kind of, kind of where we deal also have a part in a real estate agency. But for, for this specifically, it's, you know, I kind of look at it as a couple different areas. So my flips and my short term rentals are the side where, you know, it's, we're a for profit company first and I have to make a profit to be able to continue to do what I, what I get to do. But, but my long term rentals, I do a lot of stuff there with, with the low income side of things. And, and I really look at that as getting to be, you know, part of my ministry that I've been called, called to do and get to do. So, so we work with a lot of different nonprofits in town trying to find housing for the homeless. And then we do a lot with folks that are just living off of a Social Security check and they have very, very little to get by. So we try to provide dignified housing to them. That, and not only that, but help connect them with the resources that they need to, to live the best life that they can. So.
• 7:24
  Speaker A: Yeah, because there are a lot of things going on in Lubbock that I realize there's. So there's really a lot that I'll run into something and I'm like, I didn't even know you Were here. You know, I didn't know you were doing this or I didn't know it was a need, you know, and so it is. I'm sure that there's, you know, a lot of people out there that maybe don't know about all of those resources. And that's a different task. Just collect all of that information in those resources.
• 7:50
  Speaker B: It is. It is a task. And I just recently purchased a 16 unit property in south Overton area that is very low income. And a lot of the folks, you know, and going back to the work I get to do with the food bank is that. I had a lady there asked me yesterday, she was like, is there any way that y' all can get. That y' all can bring the food to us? We just have such a hard time.
• 8:17
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 8:17
  Speaker B: Going to pick it up.
• 8:19
  Speaker A: Pick it up. Right.
• 8:19
  Speaker B: And one of the things we've done there is started distributing food at the Lubbock Dream center every Wednesday. So letting these folks know that, you know, that we're. That in all these different areas, whether it's housing or food or, you know, some of them don't have furniture, whatever it may be that there's rent, resources out there and. And really good folks trying to make it easier and more accessible.
• 8:45
  Speaker A: And so did you guys kind of like go. I mean, does the food bank kind of have just an overarching, like, here's kind of who we call if somebody needs something besides food.
• 8:55
  Speaker B: We do, yeah.
• 8:56
  Speaker A: List to kind of start from.
• 8:57
  Speaker B: We do have that list. And then we also kind of. We. We try to make that available to people whether they realize they need it or not. You know, a lot of people don't. You don't know what you don't know, so.
• 9:08
  Speaker A: Exactly.
• 9:09
  Speaker B: And yeah, so I kind of try to take that. That with me into the. Into what I do in housing and. And offer those services there as well.
• 9:18
  Speaker A: So that's really cool. So you guys are using those properties really to kind of. I know some of them you've mentioned before, like you're flipping properties. And so I know that work is, like you mentioned, it's a value to you and finding people that can maybe fill those roles that also maybe need a skill.
• 9:38
  Speaker B: Well, they do. Yeah. So we flip houses and one of the really cool things. And all this stuff I feel like has been kind of divine intervention that I didn't necessarily seek out, but I've done it with a couple of different people where they have. They recently got out of prison, they needed work. They couldn't find work. And I have a dilapidated property that's needing fixed up. They have construction background, a lot of people have some construction background. And we'll put them in a house and let them work on it for four or five months to get it up to where it is rentable. And in that time they can learn some skills. They get housed for free and then at the end of it we'll start, try to help job with job placement, find them a job and after they have some skills they've been out on their own for a little bit so they're more employable.
• 10:33
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 10:34
  Speaker B: And then, you know, they can turn around and start renting that property from us.
• 10:38
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's, that's just great. To me that's such a great. Getting people job, job ready is really bad. I think it's just as valuable to find somebody to go like, yeah, I can't recommend this person for this, this and this. But I tell you what, I can recommend them for.
• 10:54
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 10:55
  Speaker A: You know, because some people are super gifted at some things and some people aren't.
• 11:00
  Speaker B: Yeah. Well, I'm super resourceful. It's, it's real interesting. What also when you work with, you know, some of the low income community, how resourceful people are when you, when you're kind of forced into that position that of what they can do with so little.
• 11:16
  Speaker A: Well and you know, I think something we don't appreciate is how much of our, how much of our brain we have free because we're not having to dig for our resources.
• 11:32
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 11:32
  Speaker A: You know, and so I remember driving in traffic and my son was at Lubbock High and just there was so much anger with people picking their kids up from school. You know what I mean? And I remember just thinking, you know, you have no idea what, what, what people are struggling with. And now it is 4:15 or whatever and that's it. I've had it.
• 12:00
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 12:01
  Speaker A: You know, whether it's, you know, I can't take one more decision or I can't or I'm so distracted I forget that I'm supposed to have turned or I'm supposed to stop or I'm not supposed to pass the bus and then, you know, it's just, you just never know. But you saw that the dis there, the difference between the rich and poor is very, very. Yeah, it's very, very obvious. You know, and so it's easy to know who's struggling, right?
• 12:27
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And the, I think knowing who's struggling but then trying to think where I was kind of going with this but you just don't. You don't know what people are going through either, so. So me or you, we can get frustrated in a school pickup line or.
• 12:53
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 12:53
  Speaker B: Or whatever, but then what? You know, this. This line of work gives me a little bit of perspective on thinking, man, how blessed am I. Why. Why am I frustrated right now that I'm sitting in the school pickup line for 20 minutes exactly.
• 13:09
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 13:09
  Speaker B: When.
• 13:09
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 13:10
  Speaker B: Really have no idea what all. What these people.
• 13:12
  Speaker A: I mean, I look at someone and think, this. This little. This lady driving this car. She may have two jobs and she may be supporting five kids, and no. No one. You know, she might. May or may not have a. A spouse. She may or may not have family nearby. You know, when you know those people by name and you know those situations.
• 13:33
  Speaker B: Yep.
• 13:34
  Speaker A: It makes a difference.
• 13:35
  Speaker B: Yeah. I kind of have a personal story along this whole car line from. From this. This week, actually. So I got in a little accident here a while back, and insurance companies were going back and forth and anyways, last week they totaled my pickup, which is, I think, fortunate because I didn't want to wait through the whole. So in the. In this time frame of not having a pickup, I have a good friend that owns a car dealership, and he told me, so, yeah, just go pick up this. This truck. And this thing barely starts, but it gets me around, and I'm not paying for it. And. And how frustrated I am dealing with this. But this is some people. But also how blessed I am to.
• 14:12
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 14:13
  Speaker B: To have people like that in my life that helped me out. And, I mean, the majority don't have.
• 14:19
  Speaker A: Well, and I do think that that also points to another thing about how creative we can be. I know when we went through bankruptcy and we were like, well, we can't tithe anymore. Like, we just. It's just not something that's really. That we are able to do. But we have this pickup. And so for years we loaned that pickup out, and I don't. I can't. I can't even count how many college students drove that pickup. Yeah. I mean, it was so for so long that, like, you had. The door wouldn't open on the driver's side, so you had to roll the window down and climb out. You know, I mean, like, it was. But every one of those guys are like. I mean, it was just kind of this running joke, you know what I mean? But it went so, so, so many miles. I think well over 300,000 miles of helping people get places that they couldn't have gotten.
• 15:05
  Speaker B: And Just kept on trucking along and
• 15:07
  Speaker A: it just kept on trucking along, you know, but we're like, well, if we can't give here, how what do we have that we can give? You know, and I might not have as much money, but I have time or, you know, like there's. It's just interesting to me things that I think that we can do that when we really truly want to. Of service and of help to people.
• 15:26
  Speaker B: Yep. And I think that's part of it. And for, for whatever reason God called me to, to having a heart of wanting to, to help people and I think having the ability and, and relationships and everything he's. He's put in my life to be able to do that. So. Yeah, but, but you really, you see it in, in West Texas that, you know, people want to help. There's.
• 15:49
  Speaker A: They do. And I think, I mean, I know the United States just in general is extremely, extremely giving. We're as a nation and I follow a woman on Instagram, Sharon McMahon, and she'll just like, we're going to raise money for this and like, you know, within days it's like you've raised a half a million dollars just from people, World Food bank or whatever it is. You know, I mean, it's just like all these things, it's just amazing, you know how. And you see even more and more just kids and you know, my kids generation, it's no big deal to them to like they want to help each other and if they aren't setting up their own GoFundMe, somebody's gonna do it for them.
• 16:22
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 16:23
  Speaker A: You know, and so I feel like it's been a great opportunity for me to build. Oh, a friend that I haven't seen in 10 years is cancer. But here's a way I can give money to them.
• 16:32
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 16:32
  Speaker A: You know, and do things for them.
• 16:35
  Speaker B: Well, and that's been one of the things that's eye opening to me. So I kind of started got into this with. I don't even remember how exactly, but I got.
• 16:45
  Speaker A: That's usually how things happen.
• 16:47
  Speaker B: Actually, I do remember how I got into it. So a good friend of mine, Trey Culver, if you don't know Trey, I bet a lot of people know his brother Jarrett that played for Tech. But Trey and I were having. And Trey was a national champion high jumper at Tech, so quite the athletes in that family. But I was having lunch with Trey one day and we were talking and came up about a little back house that I had to rent and. And he was. Had just he was on the board at Open Door, so. Hey.
• 17:17
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 17:18
  Speaker B: So he connected me with Open Door and the people over there. And so I started working with Open Door and doing more and more housing with them. And. And then I would start having other non profits reach out to me and say, hey, I heard you're working in this. This area. Yeah, would you be? We have somebody that's needing something. And now I have multiple nonprofits that I'm working with and different city agencies and different stuff that are reaching out to me, and then they're also providing connections to me with resources to get. So it's just kind of a network that's grown.
• 17:56
  Speaker A: So what does it like in the housing world? What does it look like for. I know, I've heard stories of people that wait eight years for Section 8 housing, you know what I mean? And things like that. Like, and. And home ownership traditionally has been the first step in wealth creating, you know, for our country. So how. How. What, what does it look like? Are there. Do we need more low income housing? Do we need more subsidized housing? Do we need to find pathways to help younger kids who are like, I forget it, I'm never going to own a home.
• 18:34
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 18:35
  Speaker A: Be able to move into a home. What is, what does that look like in Lubbock?
• 18:40
  Speaker B: What a great question. You know, I think there's so many layers to that question.
• 18:45
  Speaker A: Right?
• 18:46
  Speaker B: Yeah. You have this younger generation that's coming up right now and graduating college and with inflation and the increased cost of living and especially housing costs. I mean, they're outrageous that, like, people have this mindset that homeownership's just out of reach. And I think that's the unfortunate situation for so many people. So, yeah, I think there's certainly a place for, for builders and, and people to come in and provide that. You know, most of the. Not to talk bad about anybody, but most of the builders, they like doing the.
• 19:27
  Speaker A: Well, sure. I mean, the things that make money. They're there to make money.
• 19:30
  Speaker B: They're there to make money. And all of us, I mean, we have to make money. We've said that. Exactly, exactly.
• 19:34
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 19:35
  Speaker B: But they like to do these big custom homes and there's a part of the population that. That does that can afford that.
• 19:43
  Speaker A: Right, right.
• 19:44
  Speaker B: And it is profitable. But then there's also, you know, the great work that. That beaten bow and some of these companies like that are doing to get to provide homeownership to people that it's really not.
• 19:56
  Speaker A: Right.
• 19:57
  Speaker B: Affordable outside of that. So, I mean, there's there are companies that are doing that. I think there probably needs to be more.
• 20:02
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 20:04
  Speaker B: And so that's definitely a problem that we're facing. And I mean, I think it is 100% on inflation is our issue there.
• 20:15
  Speaker A: You know, our kids, my older son and his wife lived with us for. Not long enough. It was the happiest years of my life, honestly. It was so pleasant to live with them. We just had such a great time and. But they wanted to save up to buy a house, you know, and so it was great to be a part of, you know, helping them to accomplish that, you know, and then they turned around, you know, and. And helped, you know, the next person that bought their house. You know what I mean? And so I, you know, I think. I think about that a lot and a lot about how, you know, there may. It may be harder now, but it's not impossible. And it may be on our generation to help that generation, you know, figure out how to take that first step.
• 21:06
  Speaker B: Well, and I think there's also just a lot of, you know, maybe, I don't know, financial literacy is the right word for it or not, or common sense or what. But if. If you're willing to. To pass up on that latte every day or.
• 21:20
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 21:21
  Speaker B: Eating out seven nights a week, you know, and have leftovers, like, maybe you can, you know, save up for that down payment and.
• 21:27
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 21:28
  Speaker B: And it's just a different.
• 21:29
  Speaker A: It is amazing. I mean, because I've always been like, yeah, you know, but I mean, I'm not. I am not the. I'm the spender in the family, not the saver. And so over the years, I have given more and more oversight to the saver, acknowledging I want to be where you want us to be. I don't want to be where we're going to wind up if it's. If it's all up to me, you know what I mean? And so, you know, I do see the difference when we're, like, on a path that he's made that we've all agreed on, you know.
• 22:03
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 22:03
  Speaker A: Wow. My gosh. At the end of the year, we, like, we have all these accounts and they have more money, and then we can actually go to the doctor, even if you don't have health insurance, you know what I mean? Like, it makes a difference, you know what I mean? A little bit at a time. But it feels like now it's like, Well, I do think there's a lot of discouragement, you know, that like. Well, it really can't. It can't make that much difference, you know.
• 22:25
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 22:26
  Speaker A: But a tiny drop. It takes longer to fill a bucket now.
• 22:29
  Speaker B: It does. It. It absolutely does. And man, you know, and that's kind of on that homeownership side of things. But then there's a lot of population of more. What I'm working with that is just, you know, how are they going to pay their rent? The rent and not even how are they going to pay their rent if they're paying 75% of their money out of pocket for application fees that they keep getting turned down on, or they're paying to stay in a motel because they're just to stay off the streets? Well, they're never going to have that deposit. So one of the things that I really try to do and work with people on is let them pay deposits out over time, get them into places to where they're stable. They can go get a job, they can go get food because they have an address. They can do all these things. And like, I'm not a charity, so it's not. I'm not giving them this, but I'm giving them an opportunity to prove to me that they're willing to work for it.
• 23:25
  Speaker A: Yeah, you know, we, we always talk about triple bottom line economics. So that's where the word sustainability came from. So at the intersection of people, planet and profits, when those things have a positive impact, that's where you get the word sustainability. Because if you can be doing something, but if it's just draining your finances, eventually it can't be sustained.
• 23:49
  Speaker B: Yeah, well, it's almost like a, you know, a hamster on a wheel.
• 23:54
  Speaker A: Yeah. Yes, exactly.
• 23:56
  Speaker B: Just not going anywhere, you know, Exactly. Putting out the effort, but not.
• 24:00
  Speaker A: Right.
• 24:01
  Speaker B: Not making any progress.
• 24:02
  Speaker A: Making any progress. And I know a lot of people feel that way too, but I think it's, I think that's what I see is like, I feel like what you, your view of your, your business is that these are things that I can do together, which I think is something you see at Beaten Bow, is that they're always saying, like, there's ways to bring your, your, your values into your everyday management of your company.
• 24:29
  Speaker B: Yeah, well. And, you know, the, one of the things just with that storm that we just had, I've put two people in housing this last couple of weeks that, that needed it. They needed a place to stay, they needed a warm roof over their head. They needed a place that they're not going to be taken advantage of. I mean, I think that's something you see a lot But I think so the, you know, on these two in particular, you know, I'm trying to cover my costs, of course, and blessed by some of these other areas that I'm in that I can, that I can be profitable and make it and help this ministry side of things the way that I see it. But you know, with a lot of these, I pray every time that I put somebody in it, I pray for them that it provides what they need and I pray for my business and my company that Jesus, you're going to, you're going to provide for me, you know, that, that we're going to make this work. And, and it takes faith and. But you know, so far we've been extremely blessed by it. And I kind of see that as just a, you know, that I'm blessed to be able to do that. And one of the really cool stories about Open Door that with that first person that we moved in, it was probably a year ago, maybe a little over a year ago. And my, my kids were at church camp and I went into the grocery store. My wife and I were running some errands or something. I went into the grocery store to get a couple of things and I came back out, I wasn't in for five minutes. I came out, got back in the truck and my wife was crying. She had tears running down her face and I thought, what in the world happened? And those five minutes that I went into, into United or wherever it was, and, and I was like, what's going on? So she was on Facebook, of course, and, and she had just saw Open Doors post where they had moved this gentleman into the, into the property that we had and the whole, you know, their whole staff was laying hands on him and praying over the house and praying over him and. Yeah, and that was just a really cool moment. And it was a moment that kind of just affirms that man, what we're doing is, is good. And.
• 26:52
  Speaker A: Yeah, so I don't know. I know what Open Door is. I think some people listening to us might not. So give us a little bit about, about who they are.
• 27:00
  Speaker B: Yeah, so they're a non profit in town that they're. And I don't want to speak for them, they'd probably be somebody great to have. Come on, tell you what, all they do, but really they try to provide homes to the homeless and they do it through grant funding and I don't know if they have some government funding there too. I think they have a little bit, but how they get all their funding, I'm not Real. Sure. And when the government or grants are paying for it, those are fine. It's really those people with, you know, I can be profitable there and still provide a dignified place and. But it's really those people on Social Security and just fixed incomes that. And these people are on fixed incomes. Luckily for them, housing is not something that they have to be too concerned about because there are great people in organizations that are doing that type of work on going out and getting the grants and getting the funding to take care of them.
• 27:58
  Speaker A: So what does a homeless population look like in Lubbock?
• 28:02
  Speaker B: It's gotten worse.
• 28:04
  Speaker A: It seems to me like it has. Yeah.
• 28:06
  Speaker B: Yeah. It's gotten worse. I can't tell you the statistics.
• 28:08
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 28:08
  Speaker B: On it. I just. I don't know.
• 28:10
  Speaker A: But.
• 28:12
  Speaker B: But it's. It's definitely.
• 28:14
  Speaker A: So I think what opened my eyes. I. I can't remember if we discussed this any in the last podcast. We're talking about the food bank. But I. My older son works with the homeless in Denver. Actually two, three. I have several kids in different. So three by five biological kids and then spouses and, you know, that kind of thing. So. But. So I have two sons and they both do. But one in particular works very consistently with immigration populations there and the homeless, because a lot of those, they were really flooded with Venezuelan immigration population. You know, and so it's been really interesting to see how that community does what they can do. You know, so there's a potluck. And so he's cooking for that potluck every week. And then everybody, like people in that neighborhood come around. But not just that homeless people that somebody gave him a bucket of chicken or, you know, something, whatever. They all show up and then. And they eat together.
• 29:16
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 29:17
  Speaker A: You know, and he. The stories that he has told me, you know, like professional dancer that was with the Denver, you know, whatever dance company or ballet.
• 29:31
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 29:33
  Speaker A: And wound up homeless during COVID And it, you know, when, when my son met him, he's like, man, I've been. It's taking him three years. You know what I mean? And he just got tired of taking advantage of. Felt like I'm just going from couch to couch to couch. And so he just wound up out on the street. And then. Then, you know, you have your stuff with you, and then if you get stopped or the police, which happens often in Denver, the police come and they just pick everything up in an encampment. Well, then you don't have your driver's license or your birth certificate might have been in that or you know, whatever identification that you have is now gone.
• 30:11
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 30:11
  Speaker A: You know, and so, you know, that fella had been through that multiple times, you know, and so, you know, he. But there are also people who just chronically in that position because we don't have a great mental health system to help people that have mental health issues.
• 30:29
  Speaker B: Well, you know, I think mental health is a, is a piece of it. And then like I, I think I mentioned it earlier that some of the people just don't have the mental capacity.
• 30:40
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 30:40
  Speaker B: And that may sound.
• 30:42
  Speaker A: No, it's, it's, it's very true. No, I think that is, I think it is very true that there are, you know, there, there people are among us that like the least of these like how we are and I believe we are, you know, I mean Jesus said that what you do to them, you've done to me, you know.
• 31:02
  Speaker B: Well, and, and you know, for living in what I think is the, the greatest, most blessed country the world's ever seen and to take that even a step farther in the, in the best state, in the, in the best area of it, you know, I think we, you know, I think we have a responsibility to take care of those people. Now there are the people out there that do like we talked about, that need to go get a job and work and, and. But there are those people that I got one fella that I talked to weekly that he does have a job at a, at a convenience store and he works and, and he, there's a man in town that takes care of his rent for him every month. I don't know why or how, but when I bought these apartments, he, he called me and told me, he said I, I pay for this guy's rent, so where do I need to mail the check to? So, so there are people like that and this. But this guy works at a convenience store. But it's really, you know, that's all
• 32:09
  Speaker A: that, you know, that's an interesting, that's an interesting idea though. You know, I know we've, we have been friends with single moms and sometimes we would like, hey, we'll put you on our phone plan or you know, things like that. But I hadn't thought about. That's actually a really kind of a low hanging fruit, a way to help somebody even just, you know, anonymously to say, hey, chases are somebody.
• 32:32
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 32:32
  Speaker A: That you know, needs help catching up on their, you know, rent or anything like that. I mean that's a, that would be a huge blessing to a lot of people, I'm sure.
• 32:42
  Speaker B: Yeah, well, that's not something I would probably go ask for, not being in a. That non. Profit space, but for, for that individual. I mean, the guy, he's, you know, he's not capable of going out and having a job that he's.
• 32:55
  Speaker A: But he's, but he, he has dignity and worth no less than.
• 33:00
  Speaker B: Absolutely.
• 33:00
  Speaker A: Than we do. And that's, that's what we're, you know, I think that's the thing is like you're honoring the creator of that person by saying you're made in the image of a creator and we, we want to honor that. Yeah. By, by being part of your story and.
• 33:18
  Speaker B: Yep. I don't think you can say it any better than what you just did.
• 33:21
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's, I just think that's a, it's a great story and I think that there's, you know, I think you can, we can get frustrated and feel like, oh, you know, people aren't in love, but people aren't doing things. People are doing things and it's just a matter of knowing. And I also think sometimes about Jesus saying that the poor are always going to be among you. Like, these are always going to be issues. And sometimes we're like, well, until we meet, there's no more homeless. What if you're doing something and they're still homeless? Then have you done. I think there are jobs that never, that never end.
• 33:56
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 33:57
  Speaker A: And we measure success maybe by a different metric, you know, than what other outcomes might look like. You know, and so sometimes I feel like I've become friends with a woman who is known as she. She has been the, the woman who ended the global AIDS epidemic. She's an epidemiologist, brilliant. Here in Lubbock, doing some really amazing work. It's pretty incredible. And basically, you know, they just were like, all this money is going out, it's not getting anywhere. And you know, the administration said, here, here, take this and fix this, basically. And so, I mean, she built something and on an outcome based, you know, hey, this is a solvable problem.
• 34:43
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 34:43
  Speaker A: You know, and I do think that there are social problems that are solvable, but I think that there will always be a percentage of our society that we will have to be responsible for as just. That is a human.
• 35:01
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 35:02
  Speaker A: Requirement. And those people acknowledging their value is, I think, important in a time where it is kind of a dehumanizing moment in our history. You know, it's easy to.
• 35:16
  Speaker B: Yeah. And the more I've been in this, in the housing and the food banking world, I think the, the more that, that you see that and agree with it and understand it. That, you know, we, we say in food banking that we would love to see that there wasn't a line for us to serve, and that can be our goal. But, but, you know, it's, it's knowing that you're not ever gonna.
• 35:42
  Speaker A: Right.
• 35:43
  Speaker B: Reach the goal. It's a process.
• 35:45
  Speaker A: Well, it's, you know, and that's one thing. It's like, you get, that's what's called work. Work is, you know, it's never ending. You know, and, but it's our job, I think, as. Yes. As humans, to continually improve not life for us, but life for everything.
• 35:59
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 35:59
  Speaker A: You know, and to be responsible, you know, for not just for the things that we've been given and not just continually extract. That came up in another conversation earlier today about just that kind of extraction mindset that we've had on our environment. You know, how we've. We're taking as much as possibly can from the soil, we're taking as much as it possibly can from the water. And, and at some point we've got to be thinking about how do we, you know, and, and we see that. And this is what he was mentioning too. You're seeing that return to some of that thinking that came, you know, was in the 50s even, you know, and how do I, instead of just constantly extracting, I'm constantly thinking, how do I put this back in the system?
• 36:46
  Speaker B: Right. It kind of reminds me of a book that I just finished called the Infinite Game by Simon Sinek. But, you know, when we're talking about homelessness or food insecurity or whatever, it's, you know, I think that's how we have to look at it, that it is an infinite game, that there's, it's not finite. There's no, there's not going to be an end score to it or an end, you know, a certain set of rules that.
• 37:10
  Speaker A: Yeah. I can't remember if we talked about Timothy Keller. He's a preacher, but died of cancer in the last couple of years and, but New York. And he wrote a book called Generous justice. And that was very fundamentally kind of life altering for me because he brings up this idea about the reason people are poor is very complicated. The reason people are hungry is complicated. You know, that we have complicated problems that black and white answers don't solve.
• 37:43
  Speaker B: Right.
• 37:44
  Speaker A: You know, but we live in a black and white world. And so we want, you know, everyone from this group is like this, or everyone from this group is like this. And if they would just do this, you know what I mean? Then, you know, it's easy.
• 37:59
  Speaker B: Well, it's easy to say that, yeah, go get a job and.
• 38:01
  Speaker A: Right.
• 38:01
  Speaker B: And.
• 38:02
  Speaker A: Right. Yeah, but.
• 38:03
  Speaker B: Yeah, it's not as.
• 38:03
  Speaker A: Yeah, but I think a lot of people do want to know. You know, I do think that there's a lot of people out there. We hear the loudest voices on either side, but there's so many of. Of people that are just sitting here in the middle going, yeah, surely there's something different besides that or that.
• 38:20
  Speaker B: Absolutely.
• 38:22
  Speaker A: Well, this has been a great conversation. Anything else you want to add? Want people to know about?
• 38:27
  Speaker B: You know, I think just. I don't know anything that I want people to know about. I think a good point that you brought up was, you know, that. That there are ways that people can help and. And do things. Like that gentleman that's paying for the guy's rent is, you know, just search your own heart kind of. I guess my charge would be, what can you do? What. Maybe it's not money. Maybe it is volunteer help out, spending some time rides the. A lot of these people, I'm moving in, they. With what they come. Came from Walmart with. With what's left over from their Social Security check is what they have. And they are very, very happy to have a furnace and a roof over their head and a door to lock. But. Yeah, but, you know, that. That old chair, I was gonna just sit there.
• 39:19
  Speaker A: In my mind, I'm seeing a chair that's in my garage going, I need to get.
• 39:22
  Speaker B: That's been sitting in your storage facility for five years that you're paying rent on. You know, that type of stuff. There's. And it's not me that needs it, but there's organizations like Catholic Charities and Restore and all these people that will get it into the hands of people that will. That. That will bless. And I think. I think giving is better than receiving. So if. If you are.
• 39:44
  Speaker A: It is amazing. It really is.
• 39:45
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 39:46
  Speaker A: And I think that's another, you know, thing to talk about too, is it's humiliating to be in that place.
• 39:52
  Speaker B: Absolutely, yeah. People don't want to.
• 39:54
  Speaker A: It's awful. I mean, I've been there, you know what I mean? And it really changed. Like, our going through bankruptcy changed fundamentally how I felt about people that I was giving to. Like, I suddenly was. The roles were reversed, you know, and at one point, you just have to say, like, you know, how would I feel if I wanted to do this for someone? And they were like, didn't want to do it, you know what I mean? Which is sometimes why I think anonymous things are so helpful, you know, just because it takes some of the shame out of that feeling of, you know, and I just know how blessed we were people. My, my, my sister in law would bring my kids junk food. She would go to the store and there's a, like a little grocery outlet in Amarillo and she would bring them pop Tarts and you know, things that we were like not buying, you know, and it was like she'd come in with bags of all these, you know, things. And it's just things that you never think about, you know what I mean? But definitely to remember that the people that are in those situations are already full of shame.
• 41:07
  Speaker B: Yep, absolutely. Providing some dignity. And I always think about that with, with children and going to school with, you know, if it's a lot of what we get from the government looks like government food, you know, so going to school with a pop Tart or, or a fruit roll up or whatever, you know, to feel kind of that normalcy like, like the other kids in your class is so important.
• 41:34
  Speaker A: Exactly. It doesn't say this food.
• 41:37
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 41:38
  Speaker A: Given to welfare queen. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 41:42
  Speaker B: Stamp and having a place to go home and do your homework versus jump from couch to couch or, or you know, going to stay at a.
• 41:52
  Speaker A: The needs are endless in the world. They're endless in the world and. But be of good cheer, you know, Someone who's overcome the world.
• 42:01
  Speaker B: Absolutely.
• 42:02
  Speaker A: Well, thanks friends for joining us. I just really enjoy visiting with you. I think that your wife and I on the empathy scale are probably about the same because my husband always says, somebody ask how did you. How did you hear about your son? And Doug says, well, I was laying in bed one night until her. He was on Facebook. She said, oh, Doug. Which is not actually true, but he likes to tell it that way anyway. So we'll visit again another time.
• 42:31
  Speaker B: Yep.
• 42:31
  Speaker A: Thanks.
• 42:32
  Speaker B: Enjoyed it. Thank you for having me.
• 42:34
  Speaker A: Thanks for listening in again, friends. If you enjoyed it, share it and we'll leave your information in the links in the notes and everything. And if you anybody has got. Hey, I want to tell me how to deal with the food bank or I want to give something. If you're motivated to share during this time, do it.
• 42:55
  Speaker B: Yep. That or even if you just want to talk, talk real estate and you've had the thought of getting into it. I would love to share what I've learned over the last 15, 16 years.
• 43:06
  Speaker A: I think so. I mean, you know. Yeah. It's a really great way to. And especially, I think we're seeing a lot of transition now. People that have had farmland that I think we're going to see that's. I know we're seeing that sell from that generation, you know, and then that, that's their. The income that's left, you know, and so I think there's a lot of that happening. So, anyway, thank you. Appreciate it.
• 43:29
  Speaker B: Absolutely. Thank you.
• 43:30
  Speaker A: Thank you.