Latest / The Burnout Podcast with Fexingo: Workplace Exhaustion, Recovery, and Sustainable Careers / How Burnout Reshapes Your Relationship with Meetings
Transcript
- Lucas: The thing about burnout and meetings is that when you're exhausted, a meeting doesn't just feel like an obligation—it feels like an assault on your last reserves of energy. Luna: Right. And it's not just you—there's a reason companies started treating meetings like a hazard. Lucas: Exactly. Shopify made headlines back in January 2023 when they just wiped out all recurring meetings. No more standing Monday check-in, no weekly sync, no monthly all-hands. Gone. Luna: Was that the one where they gave everyone a 'meeting cost' calculator? Lucas: Yes—they calculated that the average meeting cost about $600 per hour per attendee when you factored in salaries. So they forced every meeting to have a written agenda, and if there was no agenda, the meeting was automatically canceled. They saw something like a 95% reduction in meetings. Luna: That's drastic. But the interesting part is what happened after—did productivity actually go up? Lucas: Initially, yes. People got so much deep work done. But over time, some teams reported feeling more isolated. The informal hallway chat that happened before a meeting? Gone. The spontaneous decision-making that came from a quick sync? Replaced by a slow email thread. So meetings aren't the enemy—they're both a drain and a connective tissue. Luna: Especially when you're burned out, that connective tissue might feel like dead weight. You don't have the energy for small talk or performative enthusiasm. Lucas: And that's the core tension—when you're depleted, a meeting becomes a transaction of energy. You go in with a certain amount, and you know you'll come out with less. Luna: If this episode helps you think about how you approach meetings differently, that's exactly the kind of feedback we hear from listeners. Lucas: And if today was actually useful to you, the way these stay ad-free is listener support. You can find us at buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. Luna: Yeah, it's a low-key way to keep the podcast going—no agenda, no obligation. Just a genuine thank you. Lucas: So back to the meeting problem. There's actually research on this. A study from Ohio State University in 2020 looked at what they called 'meeting fatigue'—the mental exhaustion from too many back to back video calls. Luna: What did they find? Was it just about the number of meetings, or something structural? Lucas: Both. They found that the structure matters a lot. Meetings that lack a clear agenda, that run long, or that involve too many people are exponentially more draining. But also, the sheer volume—more than four hours of meetings per day—was correlated with significantly higher burnout scores. Luna: And that's four hours, not eight. So if your calendar is full of hour-long blocks, you could hit that threshold by lunch. Lucas: Exactly. And the irony is that when you're already burned out, you're less likely to decline a meeting. You lose the confidence to say 'this could be an email' or 'can we share a document instead?' Luna: So it becomes a vicious cycle: burnout makes you accept more meetings, which makes the burnout worse. Lucas: Right. And that's why some companies are moving toward asynchronous-first cultures. GitLab, for example, has been doing this for years—they document everything, decisions happen in merge requests, and meetings are reserved for ambiguous or high-stakes topics. Luna: But that works best for engineering teams. What about roles that depend on real-time collaboration—like sales or creative strategy? Lucas: Great point. Not every meeting can be replaced by a doc. But you can redesign them. Salesforce, for instance, introduced 'no meeting Wednesdays' so people get a full day for deep work. Some teams limit meetings to twenty-five minutes instead of thirty—giving a buffer for breaks. Luna: And for the burned-out individual, what's the most practical thing? I've heard of 'meeting audits'—going through your recurring invites and asking 'what happens if I skip this?' Lucas: That's a great start. Also, scheduling 'focus blocks' on your calendar so you're not booked solid. The key is to treat your energy like a finite resource—because it is. Luna: One thing I've noticed: when I'm burned out, even the anticipation of a meeting drains me. I'll spend the thirty minutes before a call anxious or doomscrolling instead of working. Lucas: That's called 'meeting recovery time'—the mental prep and decompression. Researchers estimate it takes up to twenty minutes to regain focus after a meeting. So if you have four meetings in a day, that's potentially eighty minutes of lost productivity just in transition. Luna: And if you're already exhausted, those transitions are even harder. You don't bounce back—you just limp to the next thing. Lucas: So what do we do? I think there's a bigger conversation here about redesigning meetings for the burned-out world. What if every meeting started with a two-minute check-in where people could honestly say their energy level? No judgment. Luna: That would change the tone completely. Instead of pretending everyone's at 100 percent, you acknowledge reality. Lucas: And it might make meetings shorter—if people know they're not alone in feeling drained, they're more likely to push for efficiency. Luna: I also wonder about the role of the organizer. If you're the one calling the meeting, you have a responsibility to make it worth everyone's time. Lucas: Absolutely. Amazon's famous for requiring a six-page narrative memo before any meeting. That forces everyone to think before they talk. But not every company is Amazon. Luna: So for someone listening who's buried in meetings and running on empty—what's one thing they can try tomorrow? Lucas: I'd say: block your calendar for the first ninety minutes of the day as 'deep work only.' No meetings, no Slack, no email. And see how that changes your energy level. Then protect that block like it's a client meeting. Luna: That's concrete. And maybe the next step is to decline one meeting a week that truly doesn't need you. Just send a note saying 'I'll review the recording' or 'please share the minutes.' Lucas: Yes. And here's the thing—when you're burned out, it feels impossible to say no. But practicing it in small doses rebuilds that muscle. I've seen people go from accepting everything to cutting their meeting load by half within a month. Luna: It's a form of reclaiming agency. And agency is one of the strongest antidotes to burnout. Lucas: Exactly. Meetings aren't going away, but your relationship with them can change. And that change might be one of the most impactful things you do for your energy. Luna: So as we wrap up—what's the one question you'd leave listeners with? Lucas: I'd ask: if you could redesign your ideal meeting week—starting from zero—what would it look like? And what's stopping you from getting closer to that? Luna: That's a good place to sit with. Thanks, Lucas. Lucas: Thanks, Luna. We'll talk next time.