Latest / The Late Debate / The Late Debate | 16 June

Transcript

The Late Debate | 16 June · The Late Debate

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Lately.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: General, welcome to the Late Debate.
• 0:06
  Speaker 3: It's great to have your company on the Late Debate.
• 0:08
  Speaker 3: I'm James Macpherson with Caleb Bond and freyer Leitch coming
• 0:11
  Speaker 3: up tonight. An Italian museum displays a crystal encrusted chair
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: with a sign do not sit on it. It's very expensive.
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: Will you know exactly what happens? Will show you a
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: little later. Plus, when we look at what's making news tomorrow,
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: Defense Minister Richard Miles admits what we all know in
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: the event of a conflict between China and the USA,
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: Australia will be involved, which begs the question what's the
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: government doing to prepare? And on the front page of
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: Victorian papers tomorrow the government they're announcing tough penalties for
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: criminals who boast about their crimes online.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: All of that a.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: Little later, but first, reading people's minds, well it's the
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: stuff of science fiction, right, Well, don't be so sure,
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: because researchers at Sydney's University of Technology are currently working
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: on a way to do it, using MRI scans to
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: measure brain activity in response to specific words, and using
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: AI to map patterns in the brain. They believe reading
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: minds is pretty close to being a thing. And as always,
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: all of these things are predicted by the Simpsons.
• 1:20
  Speaker 4: I know you can read my thoughts. Bart. Just a
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: little reminder, if I find out you cut class, your
• 1:26
  Speaker 4: ass is mine. Yes, you heard me, I think words
• 1:32
  Speaker 4: I would never say.
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: I know you can read my look boy, yum yum
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: yum yum yum yum yum yum, yom yom yom yom
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: yom yom yom yam.
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: Now, if the researchers at Sydney's University of Technology are successful,
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: there's some great applications for this.
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: Doctor's hope that it.
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: Will help, for instance, stroke victims to be able to communicate.
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: Business people are hoping that we'll be enabled to operate
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: devices such as laptops by simple thinking. But Freyer and Caleb,
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: there are always downsides. Can you imagine advertisers would be
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: salivating what a thought of knowing the very words to
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: use that will trigger your brain. They could advertise directly
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: to you and have you buying things without you even
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: realizing why you're buying it. And I imagine an overly
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: enthusiastic police minister wanting to use this technology to have
• 2:21
  Speaker 3: alleged criminals self incriminate by their own thoughts. Caleb, surely
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: our brain should be the final frontier of privacy.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: I'm not convinced this is a good idea.
• 2:33
  Speaker 5: This could be exceedingly dangerous.
• 2:35
  Speaker 6: I'm totally on board with the medical applications for this
• 2:38
  Speaker 6: people who are nonverbal. I mean, you know, in the
• 2:41
  Speaker 6: same way that we develop cochlear implants for people who
• 2:44
  Speaker 6: are deaf, extraordinary technology that allows them to hear. If
• 2:48
  Speaker 6: it can assist people in a medical way, I think
• 2:50
  Speaker 6: that is totally justified in that research should be done.
• 2:54
  Speaker 6: And of course Elon Musk has been getting on board
• 2:56
  Speaker 6: with that with his neural link chip.
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: That he wants to do.
• 2:59
  Speaker 6: But once we've developed that technology for people to use
• 3:02
  Speaker 6: for medical purposes, you can bet your bottom dollar unless
• 3:06
  Speaker 6: there is regulation in place that prevents it from being
• 3:08
  Speaker 6: used for other purposes, it will be used for other purposes.
• 3:12
  Speaker 5: And there are people who will voluntarily want to.
• 3:15
  Speaker 6: Hook themselves up to things like this, to have computers
• 3:18
  Speaker 6: read their thoughts, to have chips implanted in their brains
• 3:21
  Speaker 6: that essentially mean they don't have to think about anything
• 3:24
  Speaker 6: because the computer chip can tell them exactly what they
• 3:26
  Speaker 6: want to know at any given time without having to
• 3:29
  Speaker 6: put fingers on a keyboard or open your mouth to
• 3:32
  Speaker 6: talk to a text to speech situation. Right, I mean,
• 3:35
  Speaker 6: there are people who will want that, but just think
• 3:38
  Speaker 6: about the implications of doing so, and the most dangerous
• 3:42
  Speaker 6: thing about it all, and the reason I think that
• 3:44
  Speaker 6: that application should be banned altogether, regardless of whether or
• 3:48
  Speaker 6: not you're willing to take the risk, is imagine if
• 3:51
  Speaker 6: people have these things hooked up to their brains, particularly chips,
• 3:55
  Speaker 6: and a nefarious actor in another country, let's for instance,
• 3:58
  Speaker 6: call them China, manages to hack into the systems to
• 4:02
  Speaker 6: which these chips connect, Imagine what they could start doing
• 4:05
  Speaker 6: to people's brains. Honestly, that is dangerous and silly and
• 4:10
  Speaker 6: we shouldn't allow.
• 4:11
  Speaker 7: But you could make the same argument about all sorts
• 4:14
  Speaker 7: of new technologies. And the reality is that it looks
• 4:17
  Speaker 7: like these brain computer brain interfaces, which is what they're called,
• 4:22
  Speaker 7: will be commercialized within the next ten to twenty years,
• 4:26
  Speaker 7: and I personally would love to have one.
• 4:28
  Speaker 8: I mean, think about it.
• 4:29
  Speaker 7: We've gotten through Chinese, I think, so, We've gone from
• 4:33
  Speaker 7: it's not a Chinese tip China. We've gone from having
• 4:37
  Speaker 7: computers now we have wearables like Apple watches things like that.
• 4:42
  Speaker 7: The next logical step is further integration of technology into
• 4:47
  Speaker 7: our person, which would be a brain reading computer essentially.
• 4:52
  Speaker 8: And yes, there are some security risks, but.
• 4:55
  Speaker 7: That's the case with anything, and the potential benefits for
• 4:58
  Speaker 7: all grinding in intelligence productivity.
• 5:01
  Speaker 8: It'd be great if I.
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: Was to sort of instruct my kids as to what
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: they should study if they were a bit younger than
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: what they currently are, I would totally advise them to
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: go into ethical law, that sort of area in human rights,
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: because as AI evolves, ethics is going to be the
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: number one issue. And as always, ethics comes after these
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: things are invented, after they're commercialized, and then people think, oh,
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: hang on a second, what about the consequences. I would
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: be okay with this if they would pause and say,
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: all right, what are the implications. Let's put things in
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: place now, because you know, the right to your own
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: thoughts could become the number one ethical issue of the
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: next couple of decades.
• 5:42
  Speaker 7: Yeah, and the point you raised earlier about if you
• 5:46
  Speaker 7: get charged with the crime, for example, could the police
• 5:49
  Speaker 7: then subpoena the records of your brain activity to determine
• 5:53
  Speaker 7: what you were thinking to establish intent, or where you
• 5:56
  Speaker 7: were or what you were doing. I mean, the implications
• 5:58
  Speaker 7: of this are assive and rather scary, but I do
• 6:02
  Speaker 7: think it's also quite an exciting technology.
• 6:04
  Speaker 6: I mean, you know, it was to more than two
• 6:07
  Speaker 6: years ago now when Elon Musk and another big hitters
• 6:10
  Speaker 6: Steve was the co founder of Microsoft big hitters in
• 6:13
  Speaker 6: the AI world, came out and said, we need to
• 6:16
  Speaker 6: have a moratorium on development of AI technology now and
• 6:20
  Speaker 6: seriously think about the.
• 6:21
  Speaker 5: Regulation of this before we go any further. And that
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: hasn't happened. I mean, we're going head first into this stuff.
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: You remember Biden famously put Kamala Harris in chap Oh,
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: I know, right in the age of AOL and her seriously,
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: I mean she.
• 6:35
  Speaker 5: Said, you know, you know what AI is. It's two
• 6:38
  Speaker 5: letters ah And she actually said that.
• 6:42
  Speaker 6: But you know, if your phone gets hacked, your computer
• 6:44
  Speaker 6: gets hacked, you can chuck it in the bin get
• 6:46
  Speaker 6: rid of it. If your brain gets hacked, well, thinks
• 6:48
  Speaker 6: are somewhat more difficult. Some people who may wish they
• 6:51
  Speaker 6: could have their brains hacked, they could learn a thing
• 6:53
  Speaker 6: or two. Apparently, is jen Z though a new reporter's
• 6:57
  Speaker 6: come out done by you GAV. They did a serve
• 7:00
  Speaker 6: for Westinghouse, of course, the manufacturer of white goods, and
• 7:04
  Speaker 6: perhaps Westinghouse commissioned this to approve to gen Z why
• 7:08
  Speaker 6: they need to buy their products, but will leave that
• 7:10
  Speaker 6: to one side. Some of the results of this survey
• 7:14
  Speaker 6: are extraordinary, though YouGov was looking into the household competency
• 7:19
  Speaker 6: of people aged eighteen to thirty home economics. I suppose
• 7:23
  Speaker 6: we used to call it. That's certainly what they called
• 7:24
  Speaker 6: it when I was at school anyway, which wasn't all
• 7:26
  Speaker 6: that long ago, But I don't know what they call
• 7:28
  Speaker 6: it for the kiddies now. But according to this survey,
• 7:30
  Speaker 6: Australians aged eighteen to thirty, nearly half of them feel
• 7:35
  Speaker 6: unprepared to manage chores. Seventy two percent feel burdened by
• 7:39
  Speaker 6: adult responsibilities.
• 7:41
  Speaker 5: Or we're all burdened by adult responsibilities.
• 7:43
  Speaker 6: I mean, thirty percent have never mowed a lawn, probably
• 7:47
  Speaker 6: because they've never lived in a place where they've had
• 7:50
  Speaker 6: a lawn they could mow. Twenty six percent have never
• 7:53
  Speaker 6: paid all their own household bills, so presumably they're leaning
• 7:56
  Speaker 6: on mummy and daddy to help them out with that.
• 7:58
  Speaker 5: Cut the strings, will you please?
• 8:00
  Speaker 6: Twenty five percent have never had a whole week of
• 8:03
  Speaker 6: cooking at home.
• 8:05
  Speaker 5: I mean, I don't know that.
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  Speaker 6: They must be earning a lot of money these people.
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  Speaker 6: Twenty four percent have never cleaned an oven. Forty five
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  Speaker 6: percent don't know what to cook day to day. Get
• 8:15
  Speaker 6: a cookbook. The rest of us have done it. Fifty
• 8:17
  Speaker 6: one percent skip meals multiple times a week, presumably because
• 8:21
  Speaker 6: they haven't been able to work out what to cook.
• 8:23
  Speaker 6: I mean, get on TikTok for heaven's say, you can
• 8:25
  Speaker 6: find cooking videos on there. Thirty eight percent eat out
• 8:28
  Speaker 6: or have take away multiple times a week. And look,
• 8:31
  Speaker 6: I'm guilty of that, but it's because I can afford
• 8:33
  Speaker 6: to do it, and I like eating at nice restaurants.
• 8:35
  Speaker 5: But if you're doing it because.
• 8:36
  Speaker 6: You can't work out or don't know how to cook,
• 8:39
  Speaker 6: there's something you need to do about that. Thirty nine
• 8:41
  Speaker 6: percent take dirty clothes to their parents. I mean, how
• 8:45
  Speaker 6: hard is it to use a washing machine? Which brings
• 8:49
  Speaker 6: me to the next one. Seventy three percent, so they
• 8:52
  Speaker 6: have ruined clothes by not washing or drying them properly.
• 8:57
  Speaker 5: Read the instructions.
• 8:59
  Speaker 6: People don't they teach literacy at school these days, and
• 9:03
  Speaker 6: seventy percent regret not learning more home management before moving out.
• 9:07
  Speaker 6: And I'm not surprised having gone through all of those statistics.
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  Speaker 6: What is wrong with people eighteen to thirty of which
• 9:14
  Speaker 6: I am one?
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  Speaker 5: I mean, I left home. I managed to work out
• 9:18
  Speaker 5: how to cook, I managed to work out how.
• 9:21
  Speaker 6: To use a washing machine. I managed to work out
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  Speaker 6: how to clean things. I don't particularly enjoy doing it,
• 9:26
  Speaker 6: but you know you've got to do it every now
• 9:28
  Speaker 6: and again. I think this is a a We've become
• 9:32
  Speaker 6: victims of our own circumstances, right, And part of this
• 9:36
  Speaker 6: is the parents, and part of it is the kids.
• 9:39
  Speaker 6: We now live in a world where we're constantly distracted.
• 9:42
  Speaker 6: So once upon a time, things just had to be
• 9:45
  Speaker 6: done and you had no real choice about getting them done,
• 9:48
  Speaker 6: and you weren't constantly distracted by your mobile phone or
• 9:51
  Speaker 6: a computer or one hundred other gizmos around the house.
• 9:54
  Speaker 6: So if the kids were bored, mom and dad said
• 9:56
  Speaker 6: go and mow the lawd or do the dishes, you
• 9:58
  Speaker 6: found a way to occupy you time. And generally that
• 10:01
  Speaker 6: was stuff that had to be done. But because of
• 10:03
  Speaker 6: all these conveniences, we now have the dishwashers and the
• 10:06
  Speaker 6: washing machines, and the lawn mower that you don't have
• 10:10
  Speaker 6: to touch. It's an automatic lawnmower, all the other stuff.
• 10:12
  Speaker 6: We don't even know how to do things anymore. So
• 10:15
  Speaker 6: parents are not passing skills on to their children because
• 10:19
  Speaker 6: they're busy and they've got other stuff to do in
• 10:21
  Speaker 6: an economy.
• 10:22
  Speaker 5: That's going backwards.
• 10:23
  Speaker 6: And then the kids go out into the big bad world,
• 10:25
  Speaker 6: and when they actually face the prospect of having to
• 10:28
  Speaker 6: do something, they just sit.
• 10:29
  Speaker 5: There and look at their phone instead because it's easier.
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: That The statistic that most flawed me was thirty percent
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: of young people have never mowed the lawn.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: What are their parents doing? The reason you have kids
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: is so that you don't have to mow the lawn.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: Get them out there doing it.
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: As a couple of things to this one is I
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: think a lot of parents treat their kids like their
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: friends or their mates. And warning to parents, if you
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: treat your kids like friends, you'll end up raising your
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: grandchildren yourself, as your kids won't know how to be parents.
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: But the other thing is necessity is the mother of invention. Right,
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: you don't know what you don't know, and it's when
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: you move out of home that suddenly.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: You realize, oh, how do you do that?
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: Well, we all figured it out ourselves, and your generation frayer,
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: will figure it out themselves as well.
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: That's what you do well.
• 11:12
  Speaker 6: I mean.
• 11:13
  Speaker 7: The other factor here to consider is that the rate
• 11:16
  Speaker 7: of young adults still living with their parents well into
• 11:20
  Speaker 7: their twenties has almost doubled in the last twenty years.
• 11:24
  Speaker 7: So not only are parents coddling their children, not teaching
• 11:27
  Speaker 7: them these skills to be self reliant, but young people
• 11:32
  Speaker 7: are barely even getting the opportunity to use them because
• 11:34
  Speaker 7: they're staying at home with their parents for so much longer,
• 11:37
  Speaker 7: and so really I think for our generation, adulthood has
• 11:42
  Speaker 7: really been delayed significantly. A lot of these milestones, moving out,
• 11:45
  Speaker 7: getting married, having a family, they're all.
• 11:48
  Speaker 8: Being pushed back now by about twenty years.
• 11:50
  Speaker 7: You know, the average age people got married border House
• 11:53
  Speaker 7: had children was their early twenties. Now it's their mid thirties.
• 11:57
  Speaker 7: So it does raise some interesting concerns. But also on
• 12:01
  Speaker 7: a similar note with regards to children, it's not just
• 12:05
  Speaker 7: young adults that are struggling, it's young kids as well.
• 12:10
  Speaker 7: The Australian early development census is conducted every three years.
• 12:14
  Speaker 7: They survey around two hundred and eighty thousand children and
• 12:18
  Speaker 7: fifteen thousand teachers, and those kids are in their first
• 12:22
  Speaker 7: year of full time school. They're assessed across five domains
• 12:26
  Speaker 7: of physical wellbeing, social, emotional, language, general knowledge, et cetera,
• 12:31
  Speaker 7: et cetera.
• 12:33
  Speaker 8: And what is really disturbing is the rates of children who.
• 12:38
  Speaker 7: Are considered developmentally vulnerable is at its highest level since
• 12:43
  Speaker 7: two thousand and nine, and it's gone up significantly since
• 12:47
  Speaker 7: the survey was last conducted three years ago. Now, some
• 12:51
  Speaker 7: of the theories are pandemic, kids not being socialized, they're
• 12:56
  Speaker 7: not going to pre school, but it is very concerning
• 12:59
  Speaker 7: and one of the one of the startling statistics was
• 13:01
  Speaker 7: that apparently one in ten kids now struggle to get
• 13:06
  Speaker 7: along with others, so they can't control aggression, they can't
• 13:10
  Speaker 7: self regulate emotion.
• 13:12
  Speaker 8: If that's how they're.
• 13:13
  Speaker 7: Starting school, those issues tend to only compound.
• 13:18
  Speaker 8: How are they going to learn properly?
• 13:20
  Speaker 7: And if they can't learn properly, they're going to cause
• 13:22
  Speaker 7: even more of a trouble in school, and then how
• 13:24
  Speaker 7: are they're going to operate through the rest of life.
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: I think there's no doubt the pandemic is responsible for
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: quite a bit of that, and Education Minister Jason Claire
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: pointed that out what depressed me Caleb was then Jason
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: Claire said, the answer is more preschool. Send your kids
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: to preschool because that will teach them to be emotionally
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: resilient and be able to manage their emotions.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: And no, no, it's not preschool.
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: The answer is parenting. And I think for parents it's
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: not just disciplining behavior. I know my kids had behavioral issues,
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: but the thing that always concerns me more than their behavior.
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: Because a boil, throw a ball through a window, that's
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: going to happen, But it's the attitude that you've got
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: to discipline and teach kids to regulate their emotions. If
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: you let kids throw tantrums, if you let them start
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: to allow their emotions to go out of control and
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: don't discipline that, you end up with very unruly teenagers.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: Then you end up with a crime crisis, and then
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: you end up with victoria.
• 14:18
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and I think we should be clear as well
• 14:20
  Speaker 6: that the children we're talking about here, for the most part,
• 14:24
  Speaker 6: children who weren't that affected by COVID, is that the
• 14:27
  Speaker 6: children who were most affected by COVID were the ones
• 14:29
  Speaker 6: who were already in school and were forming their friendships
• 14:33
  Speaker 6: and bonds and then sort of had that cruelly ripped
• 14:36
  Speaker 6: away from them. So they're kids who are sort of
• 14:38
  Speaker 6: going into high school now. Are any into high school
• 14:41
  Speaker 6: that suffered the most through that? We're talking about kids
• 14:43
  Speaker 6: who were born basically just before the pandemic, really, and
• 14:48
  Speaker 6: on that count, it's not so much the pandemic, which
• 14:50
  Speaker 6: is what Jason Clair, the Education Minister, is blaming this on,
• 14:54
  Speaker 6: because it's easy for him to point to something over.
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: There and go, ah, you know that's the fault of
• 14:58
  Speaker 5: all this what's going going on here?
• 15:00
  Speaker 6: And I will preface it, I am not a parent,
• 15:03
  Speaker 6: so before you come at me for giving you parenting advice,
• 15:05
  Speaker 6: I will say that I am not a parent, but
• 15:07
  Speaker 6: I do dat a child psychologist, so she has some
• 15:10
  Speaker 6: idea about this stuff because she sees it all the time.
• 15:13
  Speaker 6: You have a world now where children have devices all
• 15:17
  Speaker 6: the time and they are trained to have instant gratification.
• 15:21
  Speaker 6: You press a button and something happens. And so when
• 15:24
  Speaker 6: you get into a classroom and things are run in
• 15:27
  Speaker 6: rather a different way and you have to wait for
• 15:29
  Speaker 6: the teacher to tell you what to do, and you
• 15:32
  Speaker 6: have to wait for other students to catch up to
• 15:34
  Speaker 6: where you have got to, or maybe you're on the
• 15:36
  Speaker 6: other end of that. Every now and again, children haven't
• 15:39
  Speaker 6: learned how to deal with these things. We mollycoddle children
• 15:42
  Speaker 6: these days. We don't give them any responsibility or independence.
• 15:46
  Speaker 6: We don't give them the opportunity to learn how to
• 15:49
  Speaker 6: deal with problems in life.
• 15:51
  Speaker 5: I mean, it's not all that long ago.
• 15:53
  Speaker 6: The five or six year old would get on their
• 15:56
  Speaker 6: bike in the school holidays and bug her off for
• 15:58
  Speaker 6: a few hours and Mam would say, be back home
• 16:01
  Speaker 6: for tea.
• 16:01
  Speaker 5: Doesn't happen anymore, Oh, we're too scared kid's going to
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: get abducted.
• 16:05
  Speaker 6: So we take all of these rights and responsibilities away
• 16:08
  Speaker 6: from children, and they don't learn how to actually interact
• 16:13
  Speaker 6: with the world and regulate themselves and deal with when
• 16:16
  Speaker 6: things go wrong and they fall off the bike and
• 16:18
  Speaker 6: mom goes, well, that was a bit silly, wasn't it.
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: That doesn't happen, ah, You like, the kids just don't
• 16:25
  Speaker 5: learn how to deal with the world. And then we
• 16:27
  Speaker 5: are surprised they.
• 16:29
  Speaker 6: Go off to school and they can't regulate their emotions
• 16:32
  Speaker 6: or how to operate in a social setting.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: We've done it to them, unfortunately, Yeah, we absolutely have.
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: I want to get your thoughts guys on a new
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: law in California where one particular government area is making
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: it effectively illegal to be homeless. What they've decided is
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: that if you're a homeless person and you've been offered
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: not once, but three times the options of various accommodation,
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: and you decline that offer, then it will be possible
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: for you to be jailed. Pam Foley from who's the
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: Vice mayor of San Jose said, we can't expect to
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: adequately treat mental illness, addiction, or unemployment effectively if someone.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: Is living outdoors.
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: Stable shelter, whether through intram housing, safe parking, or safe
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: sleeping sites, not only connects people with critical services and
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: job training, but ultimately paves the way towards permanent housing. Now,
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: in this particular district, there are nine hundred and three
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: known people to be homeless. Of those nine hundred people,
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: about a third of them reports psychotic conditions. So a
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: lot of these people, not all, but fully a third
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: of these people are mentally unstable. Living on the streets
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: it's in the interests of the city to clean up
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: these encampments that you can see on your screen, which
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: are not only an I saw, but as you can imagine,
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: would encourage crime. They're not safe spaces. So it's in
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: the interests of the city. But I would argue it's
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: also in the interests of people to remove them from
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: living on the streets. It might sound inhumane and freyer,
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: it's been argued it's in humane to lock people up
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: for being homeless, But if.
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: You've got people who repeatedly refuse.
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: Accommodation, then I think it's inhumane to leave them on
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: the streets, particularly if they're drug affected or beset by
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: some sort of mental illness exactly.
• 18:21
  Speaker 7: And they're calling this the responsibility to shelter. And also
• 18:24
  Speaker 7: keep in mind they're not going to be arrested if
• 18:27
  Speaker 7: there aren't enough beds available, So they have to have
• 18:29
  Speaker 7: rejected shelter three times and there has to actually be
• 18:33
  Speaker 7: a bed available for them. So I don't see I
• 18:37
  Speaker 7: think this is a very valid consideration. And I also
• 18:41
  Speaker 7: think the other factor is, I mean, you just can't
• 18:44
  Speaker 7: have these sorts of permanent encampments that are cropping up,
• 18:47
  Speaker 7: not just here, but around the US, and we're seeing
• 18:49
  Speaker 7: it a little bit in Australia. Obviously, we have a
• 18:52
  Speaker 7: genuine housing crisis and there are many people who simply
• 18:55
  Speaker 7: cannot afford to put a roof over their heads.
• 18:58
  Speaker 8: I'm not talking about.
• 18:59
  Speaker 7: Those people, but I'm talking about people who choose to
• 19:02
  Speaker 7: live on the streets, and.
• 19:04
  Speaker 8: That is quite a common thing.
• 19:05
  Speaker 7: A lot of the homeless people you'll see, especially around Sydney,
• 19:09
  Speaker 7: do have temporary shelter, do have council housing, but choose
• 19:13
  Speaker 7: to be on the streets because they prefer it. They
• 19:15
  Speaker 7: have mental health issues, they don't like their neighbors, a
• 19:18
  Speaker 7: whole range of issues. But is it really the responsibility
• 19:22
  Speaker 7: for every other citizen to have to compromise their.
• 19:25
  Speaker 8: Safety put up with this in their streets. I don't
• 19:29
  Speaker 8: think so.
• 19:29
  Speaker 7: It does seem a bit harsh, but I think they're
• 19:31
  Speaker 7: cleaning up the streets and it's good.
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: I think it's a balancing act.
• 19:35
  Speaker 6: Insofar as if you've got large encampments, there's clearly a problem.
• 19:39
  Speaker 6: You can't have a public park just turning to a
• 19:43
  Speaker 6: homeless center essentially, so you have to do something about that.
• 19:46
  Speaker 5: I understand that if you have a mental.
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: Health issue that poses a risk to the public, then
• 19:52
  Speaker 6: you ought to be detained on mental health grounds anyway,
• 19:55
  Speaker 6: So nothing to do with whether you're homeless or not.
• 19:57
  Speaker 6: And I think in today's world we not to do
• 20:00
  Speaker 6: that because we're too scared to admit that some people
• 20:03
  Speaker 6: have mental health issues that is dangerous to them and
• 20:06
  Speaker 6: other people, and we wait until things go really bad.
• 20:10
  Speaker 5: So I think that's more than just homeless people.
• 20:12
  Speaker 6: There are lots of people with mental health issues that
• 20:14
  Speaker 6: ought to be detained for their own safety.
• 20:17
  Speaker 5: But there are a lot of people who choose to.
• 20:19
  Speaker 6: Live on the streets and not necessarily in encampments because
• 20:22
  Speaker 6: the other options they have are awful. And my father
• 20:26
  Speaker 6: has worked as a council gardener for most of my
• 20:29
  Speaker 6: life in a capital city and has dealt with homeless
• 20:32
  Speaker 6: people through his whole working life and knows them and
• 20:36
  Speaker 6: talks to them every day because he sees.
• 20:37
  Speaker 5: Them every day.
• 20:38
  Speaker 6: They live in his park on benches or whatever. Most
• 20:41
  Speaker 6: of them are generally harmless people, and when he says them,
• 20:44
  Speaker 6: why do you live here, I'll say, well, they come
• 20:47
  Speaker 6: along and they offer me some accommodation in a hostel
• 20:50
  Speaker 6: or some joint and I go into this hostel which
• 20:53
  Speaker 6: is full of drag addled people and they steal all
• 20:56
  Speaker 6: my property and whatever, so I don't want to be there.
• 20:59
  Speaker 6: I'd much that's rather as dumb as it seems, live
• 21:02
  Speaker 6: on a park bench than with a roof over my head,
• 21:05
  Speaker 6: because for whatever's reason, I don't have a lot of money,
• 21:08
  Speaker 6: and this is where I've ended up.
• 21:10
  Speaker 5: If you're not causing.
• 21:11
  Speaker 6: Any danger to anyone, and you're not in the way,
• 21:14
  Speaker 6: and you sort of pack up your stuff in the
• 21:16
  Speaker 6: day and go about your business, I don't particularly.
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: Care leave them alone.
• 21:20
  Speaker 6: If you've got large encampments, I understand the need to
• 21:22
  Speaker 6: move them on, but the mental health aspect is the
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: biggest one. And if they're people who are a danger
• 21:27
  Speaker 6: to society, don't matter whether they're homeless, they should be
• 21:30
  Speaker 6: in a funny farm.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: So I agree with you. The mental health aspect is
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: a big one.
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: And if you've walked through a major capital city in
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: this country, I'm thinking particularly Melbourne and Sydney, which I
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: have even during the day. I'm not just talking about
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: at night. It's shocking the number of people who are
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: clearly mentally unwell, who are doing all sorts of weird things,
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: saying all sorts of yelling out, all sorts.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Of weird things. It's a major problem.
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: And I think if you've got people who have been
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: offered accommodate, I take your point that sometimes you might
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: find accommodation that is just for whatever reason, you're better
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: off on the street. But if you're offered not one,
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: not two, but three options and you decline all of them,
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: there has to be a point where governments say, you
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: know what, we can't have you on the storde.
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: And the other thing as well.
• 22:12
  Speaker 6: In Australia, I don't know what it's like in the
• 22:13
  Speaker 6: United States, what this system is over there. Have a
• 22:15
  Speaker 6: look at the waiting list for public housing in this country.
• 22:19
  Speaker 6: I mean the last check I know in South Australia alone,
• 22:23
  Speaker 6: which has only got two million people, they had a.
• 22:25
  Speaker 5: Fifty thousand head weight for public housing.
• 22:29
  Speaker 6: And this is people who obviously, you know, can't afford
• 22:31
  Speaker 6: to buy a place on their own and are desperate
• 22:32
  Speaker 6: for something and they just.
• 22:34
  Speaker 5: Can't get hold of it. What a terrible position we
• 22:37
  Speaker 5: find ourselves in. And onto a.
• 22:39
  Speaker 6: Well should we call it a strange story out of Victoria,
• 22:42
  Speaker 6: where a lot of strange stories seem to come from
• 22:46
  Speaker 6: Trinity Grammar, a very prestigious school in Melbourne, decided that
• 22:50
  Speaker 6: they would have a Pride Week assembly.
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: Apparently they do this every year. Now I don't know
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: why an Anglican.
• 22:56
  Speaker 6: School is having a Pride Week assembly, but go they
• 23:00
  Speaker 6: choose to do this, and they have a keynote speaker
• 23:03
  Speaker 6: who comes out every year, and this year it was
• 23:06
  Speaker 6: a bloke by the name of Basim Kurbitch. He's Palestinian,
• 23:10
  Speaker 6: as you can see there from the kefia around his neck.
• 23:13
  Speaker 6: He's a pride activist and he came along and gave
• 23:16
  Speaker 6: a pep talk to these boys about how it's okay
• 23:19
  Speaker 6: to be gay, etc. And the point of this is
• 23:21
  Speaker 6: to apparently promote diversity of thought and sexuality.
• 23:25
  Speaker 5: Et cetera.
• 23:25
  Speaker 6: But during the course of this talk, he talked about
• 23:30
  Speaker 6: various things, including that you should visualize your goals, and
• 23:33
  Speaker 6: he encouraged students in the room to look up visualize
• 23:37
  Speaker 6: your goals, which many of the boys in the room
• 23:40
  Speaker 6: then later did, which led them to his Instagram page
• 23:44
  Speaker 6: where they found, and I'm sorry to subject you to this,
• 23:48
  Speaker 6: they found a video of him putting a sex toy
• 23:52
  Speaker 6: in his mouth under a task called quote unquote a
• 23:56
  Speaker 6: dildo hand job challenge, not words.
• 23:59
  Speaker 5: I ever thought I would be reading out on this program,
• 24:02
  Speaker 5: But there you go.
• 24:03
  Speaker 6: I mean, what on earth is an Anglican school having
• 24:07
  Speaker 6: a pride assembly in the first place, but inviting a
• 24:11
  Speaker 6: chap along who posts that sort of content on social media,
• 24:15
  Speaker 6: surely knowing that boys would go and look up his
• 24:18
  Speaker 6: social media and then share this stuff around the school.
• 24:21
  Speaker 5: What is it that you lead into my school?
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: Well, the Anglican school, I'll tell you how they invited
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: this chap They rang the government funded Pride Center.
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: Who recommended this guy.
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, obviously you'd call the Pride Center if
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: you're an Anglican college charging our parents forty two thousand
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: dollars a year for your year seven to ten boys
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: who were in this assembly to be part of Pride week.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: The Pride Center said, not our fault. We weren't asked
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: to vet the speaker's social media. You were just asking
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: us who would a good speaker be. And so the
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: school blames the Pride Center, the Pride Center blames the school,
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: and the boys are rather upset and their parents, prayer
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: are furious.
• 25:03
  Speaker 8: I mean rightfully.
• 25:04
  Speaker 7: So one of the parents said, I pay good money
• 25:07
  Speaker 7: to send my child to a Christian school, I expect
• 25:11
  Speaker 7: them to uphold Christian values. I don't see how having
• 25:14
  Speaker 7: an annual Pride assembly is really upholding Christian values. And
• 25:18
  Speaker 7: then the other serious question is that you've got a
• 25:23
  Speaker 7: Palestinian Arab Pride activist who has repeatedly criticized Israel for
• 25:31
  Speaker 7: their record on LGBTQ issues while worshiping other Arab countries,
• 25:38
  Speaker 7: including Gaza. It's like, mate, how do you think LGBT
• 25:43
  Speaker 7: people are treated in Gaza? I mean, Palestinians are actually
• 25:48
  Speaker 7: able to seek refuge in Israel if they're gay, because
• 25:52
  Speaker 7: they're treated so appallingly under Hamas and the Palestinian authority.
• 25:57
  Speaker 7: But of course that wasn't given a look at it,
• 25:59
  Speaker 7: and none of the parents seemed complaining about that.
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: The other thing in this the school, when you invite
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: a speaker to come and give a presumably, as you said,
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: it's a speech about well, it was actually about different
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: forms of love, so that was the topic of the speech.
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: But when you get the speaker rock up wearing a
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: kefia in the current environment, now wear a kefia if
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: you want knock yourself out. But when the speaker at
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: the year seven to year ten boys assembly comes.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: Wearing a kefia. Wouldn't you, as a school principal or
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: deputy say.
• 26:30
  Speaker 5: We might be going into an dangerous territory. It would
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: be a hint, wouldn't you would think so?
• 26:35
  Speaker 6: But why I just can't get my head around why
• 26:37
  Speaker 6: they would want this fella or anyone else to come
• 26:40
  Speaker 6: and talk about pride to a Christian school in the
• 26:43
  Speaker 6: first place.
• 26:43
  Speaker 5: I mean, you know you can do it all in
• 26:46
  Speaker 5: about twenty seconds flat.
• 26:48
  Speaker 6: Stand up and say, look, the Bible has its teachings
• 26:52
  Speaker 6: about homosexuality, but love thy neighbor, etc. Do unto others
• 26:57
  Speaker 6: as you would have done under you take any more
• 27:00
  Speaker 6: than that. You don't need to have someone come in
• 27:03
  Speaker 6: and give a lecture in a Christian school about being
• 27:07
  Speaker 6: gay or whatever or whatever.
• 27:09
  Speaker 5: These videos are that he puts.
• 27:10
  Speaker 6: Up online like you can do it in ten seconds
• 27:13
  Speaker 6: flat to tell people treat other people nicely.
• 27:15
  Speaker 5: It's as simbil as that isn't it.
• 27:16
  Speaker 7: It is so outrageous and just another example really of
• 27:19
  Speaker 7: how schools and our education system has become so ideological
• 27:24
  Speaker 7: and politicized, even at elite Christian schools, but also down
• 27:29
  Speaker 7: in Victoria.
• 27:30
  Speaker 8: Another very disturbing story.
• 27:32
  Speaker 7: A sixty two year old man has been brutally beaten
• 27:38
  Speaker 7: by a former immigration detainee freed under.
• 27:42
  Speaker 8: A High Court decision.
• 27:43
  Speaker 7: This was the allegedly he was allegedly beaten, I should
• 27:47
  Speaker 7: say this was under the NZYQ decision, where one hundred
• 27:51
  Speaker 7: and forty nine detainees were released after the High Court
• 27:54
  Speaker 7: found it was unconstitutional to indefinitely hold people in immigration
• 27:59
  Speaker 7: to ten. A number of those free detainees have allegedly
• 28:04
  Speaker 7: gone on to reoffend and commit further crimes, and this
• 28:08
  Speaker 7: one just today is absolutely abhorrent. A poor sixty two
• 28:15
  Speaker 7: year old man just going about his day was brutally
• 28:19
  Speaker 7: beaten on the sidewalk, allegedly had his head kicked in
• 28:23
  Speaker 7: by this release detainee.
• 28:26
  Speaker 8: How many more lives have to be.
• 28:29
  Speaker 7: Destroyed because of Labour's incompetence They bungled this entire process.
• 28:35
  Speaker 7: Labor had the opportunity to issue preventative detention orders.
• 28:39
  Speaker 8: To take these people back in.
• 28:41
  Speaker 7: This alleged detainee who allegedly stumped his head in, also
• 28:47
  Speaker 7: had charges laid against him over taking off the ankle
• 28:50
  Speaker 7: bracelet and violating his visa conditions. Those were dropped there
• 28:54
  Speaker 7: have been just moments after moments when Labor could have
• 28:59
  Speaker 7: rain taking control of this situation, and they failed to,
• 29:03
  Speaker 7: and now it looks like someone has died.
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: The former detainee charged with this crime was previously arrested
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: for removing his ankle bracelet, and of course the High
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: Court ruled that it was unconstitutional to require people to
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: wear those sort of tracking devices. I would have thought,
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: if you're the government and you think we've released someone
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: in the community, we've asked them, we're an ankle bracelet,
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: so you're not at risk. They remove that at the
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: time unlawfully. Later on the High Court changes that decision.
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: But the government wouldn't they say, this is a person
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: who clearly doesn't want to follow the law, and Labor
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: passed legislation to be able to redatain.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: People who they thought would be a threat.
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: If you are blatantly just flying in the face of
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: court orders or government instructions, such as wearing the bracelet,
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: wouldn't you think this is a person who's not going
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: to abide by the law, let's redetain them. To the
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: best of my knowledge, they haven't redetained anybody. And as
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: he said, for one in five now it is I
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: think of these former detainees have gone on to commit
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: fresh crimes.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: As labor have allowed them into the community.
• 30:11
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and this bloke acident, let's not call him a bloke,
• 30:13
  Speaker 6: Let's call him a scumbag, because that's what he is.
• 30:16
  Speaker 6: Was jailed for domestic violence for a year. That's how
• 30:19
  Speaker 6: he then ended up in detention in the first place,
• 30:22
  Speaker 6: and he pleaded guilty to that offense and then said
• 30:25
  Speaker 6: that he didn't do it. So I think we've already
• 30:28
  Speaker 6: got a taste for the fact that he doesn't have
• 30:30
  Speaker 6: a great deal of regard for the law. So notwithstanding
• 30:34
  Speaker 6: the crime that he is now charged with, he's not
• 30:37
  Speaker 6: the sort of bloke that should be in this country.
• 30:40
  Speaker 6: But we know the decision that the High Court made
• 30:43
  Speaker 6: under NZYQ. So the way we get around that is
• 30:46
  Speaker 6: that the government came up with laws that allowed them
• 30:49
  Speaker 6: to redetain people that they thought were a risk to
• 30:51
  Speaker 6: the public. And to my knowledge, they've not used those
• 30:55
  Speaker 6: laws once. What was the point of coming up with
• 31:00
  Speaker 6: those laws if you weren't going to use them. We
• 31:04
  Speaker 6: thought it was going to be about protecting the public.
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: You didn't do it.
• 31:08
  Speaker 6: Now we have a charge against a detainee for and
• 31:13
  Speaker 6: horrific crime.
• 31:14
  Speaker 5: I mean, these things should have been dealt with a very.
• 31:16
  Speaker 6: Long time ago, and they will come up again, and
• 31:19
  Speaker 6: they will come up again, and they will come up again.
• 31:22
  Speaker 6: But I don't think the federal government particularly matters at
• 31:25
  Speaker 6: this cares sorry about this matter at this point.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: I'm sure they don't.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: And reading this story today, I almost yawned because it's
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: become so familion.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: We've heard this story so many times and.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: Yet it is absolutely outrageous every single instance speaking of
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: government's bundling crime and trying to control it. The Victorian
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: government have come up with another hairbrain scheme to tackle
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: the crime crisis. They're going to make it illegal for
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: certain criminals or gangsters to use more than one phone
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: and to use encrypted services the policemen. To Anthony Carbines
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: said today, any criminals who think they can dodge the
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: law with multiple phones can think again.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: In two months, that's right, not now, not in a week,
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: not in a month, but.
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: Two months from now, the Victorian government will legislate so
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: that police can remove multiple phones from people they deem
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: a threat. In terms of organized crime, this smacks of
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: the machete law that was instituted by the same government
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: just recently.
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: It's got some great similarities.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: Firstly, they instituted a ban on machetes that will take
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: place in September. Of course, they quickly ran through a
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: little bit of that legislation a few weeks ago after
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: a machete attack in a shopping center. But again, the
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: Victorian government may badly needed laws that will come into
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: effect a little later. It begs the question, if the
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: Victorian government are so tough on crime, why didn't they
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: do this years ago, If it's not right to allow
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: gangsters to have multiple phones, and they only just realized
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: that yesterday rather than a couple of years ago. And
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: of course, do we really think that gangsters, when told
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: by Victorian police you can only have one phone, or
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: will remove your phone completely, will not five minutes later
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: arrange for another phone.
• 33:17
  Speaker 5: I'm sure they will.
• 33:18
  Speaker 6: But the point of the law is that you can
• 33:20
  Speaker 6: then doll out a higher punishment for having the phone.
• 33:24
  Speaker 5: It's the same as far arm prohibition.
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: Orders require trust in Victorian courts to actually uphold the law.
• 33:30
  Speaker 6: Well, sure, but having a law. Having a law is
• 33:33
  Speaker 6: better than no law as far as I'm concerned. It's
• 33:35
  Speaker 6: the same as far arm prohibition orders. I mean, you
• 33:37
  Speaker 6: can't tell me the around people walking around, and they
• 33:38
  Speaker 6: have FPOs across the country. Every state has their own
• 33:41
  Speaker 6: version of them. You can't tell me the around people
• 33:43
  Speaker 6: with the FPOs not owning guns. But if they get
• 33:47
  Speaker 6: caught with the guns, they will face serious penalties for
• 33:49
  Speaker 6: doing so, so that the point of the law is
• 33:52
  Speaker 6: not necessarily to prevent them in the first instance from
• 33:55
  Speaker 6: getting the phone, because they can run the risk of
• 33:57
  Speaker 6: getting the phone if they want. But if they are
• 33:59
  Speaker 6: found with a second phone, we can hit you with
• 34:01
  Speaker 6: a heavy penalty.
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: And I think that's fair enough.
• 34:04
  Speaker 6: Notwithstanding the fact they could have done this yesterday, or
• 34:06
  Speaker 6: they could have done it five years ago, or they
• 34:07
  Speaker 6: could have done it twenty years ago, because of course
• 34:09
  Speaker 6: Victoria was the home of Underbilly right, there are many
• 34:11
  Speaker 6: points at which they could have done this. But as
• 34:13
  Speaker 6: far as I'm concerned, they shouldn't be allowed to have
• 34:15
  Speaker 6: phones at all. If you've been proven to be a
• 34:18
  Speaker 6: bikey gangster, whatever, go the whole hog and ban them
• 34:22
  Speaker 6: from having any kind of communication to us.
• 34:25
  Speaker 7: Well, that would be the ideal, But the problem is,
• 34:27
  Speaker 7: as James said, how on earth do you do it.
• 34:29
  Speaker 7: You can just walk into any Apple store and buy
• 34:31
  Speaker 7: a phone. So do we now require people to have
• 34:33
  Speaker 7: identification to prove that they're not a criminal when they
• 34:36
  Speaker 7: buy a phone.
• 34:37
  Speaker 8: I mean, you just can't do that.
• 34:39
  Speaker 5: You need ID to get a simcar, don't you.
• 34:41
  Speaker 8: Yeah, well oh.
• 34:42
  Speaker 7: Yeah, But the problem is you can do online messaging
• 34:45
  Speaker 7: forums that are often encrypted, and that's how a lot
• 34:47
  Speaker 7: of these organized crime gangs are really being operated.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Now yeah, well we'll see how they go.
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: I take your point. Whatever you do to crack down
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: on crime, fair enough. But for the Victorian government, and
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: they've been doing a lot of this, they've been grand
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: standing tough on crime, tough on crime because clearly just
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: senta Ellen knows this is a massive issue, and so
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: all of a sudden she is all about being tough
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: on criminals.
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: And I just think anyone who buys this, I mean,
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: you know, well.
• 35:15
  Speaker 5: They'll be buying more phones'll be what they're doing very quickly.
• 35:18
  Speaker 6: Before we get to the break, they're changing the rules
• 35:20
  Speaker 6: for the Reserve Bank when they make decisions about the
• 35:23
  Speaker 6: interest rate for the first time ever. Now this has
• 35:25
  Speaker 6: been agreed to by the Treasurer and the Reserve Bank
• 35:28
  Speaker 6: Governor Michelle Bullock.
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: They will reveal the vote count.
• 35:31
  Speaker 6: It won't have names next to it, so it's not
• 35:33
  Speaker 6: going to be ratting anyone out for the way they voted,
• 35:36
  Speaker 6: but we will for the first time be able to
• 35:38
  Speaker 6: see what the actual vote was, whether to keep the
• 35:41
  Speaker 6: infstrate on hold or to move it up or.
• 35:43
  Speaker 5: To move it down. I think fair enough.
• 35:45
  Speaker 6: Anything that is done to promote transparency and in a
• 35:50
  Speaker 6: way of looking at the way the system works, I
• 35:52
  Speaker 6: think is a good thing.
• 35:53
  Speaker 5: It's good for us to see whether or not these.
• 35:55
  Speaker 6: Are unanimous decisions or ones that were very close, because
• 35:59
  Speaker 6: it gives an idea of how the RBA works, and
• 36:01
  Speaker 6: I think that's earning a good step.
• 36:02
  Speaker 7: I think the risk here, though, is that we have
• 36:04
  Speaker 7: seen repeated moves from Jim Chalmers to.
• 36:06
  Speaker 8: Restructure the RBA.
• 36:08
  Speaker 7: In fact, the reforms he's introduced are the most radical
• 36:11
  Speaker 7: since the RBA was created. And these reforms all sort
• 36:15
  Speaker 7: of lead in the direction of removing or whittling down
• 36:18
  Speaker 7: slowly their independence through more hand picks to go onto
• 36:22
  Speaker 7: the board. And also he said that putting union members
• 36:27
  Speaker 7: on the board of the RBA is not a controversial
• 36:30
  Speaker 7: proposal at all, and other economists are actually saying this
• 36:33
  Speaker 7: reform doesn't go far enough. We should list names as
• 36:37
  Speaker 7: well of how board members voted, which I think sets
• 36:40
  Speaker 7: us down even further. This path of politicizing the RBA,
• 36:44
  Speaker 7: and we've already seen a bit of that in the election.
• 36:46
  Speaker 7: Chalmers does not want to take responsibility for inflation. He
• 36:49
  Speaker 7: tries to blame the RBA, and this will entrench that.
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: Think when Jim Chalmer says this is not political, this
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: is about transparency, you can be sure it's political.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: We're going to go to a break.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: When we come back, look at what's making news to borrow,
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: including warnings that Australian needs to prepare for war.
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: A't siting just a moment.
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: Welcome back to the program. Well, some incredible stories in
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: tomorrow's newspapers. We're going to have a look at them tonight.
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: Calub we've got the Australian.
• 37:19
  Speaker 5: Indeed, it says US China war we would be in.
• 37:23
  Speaker 6: Acting Prime Minister Richard Marles says the nation will inevitably
• 37:26
  Speaker 6: be drawn into a US China conflict, with the continent
• 37:30
  Speaker 6: now more relevant than ever to the contest between the
• 37:32
  Speaker 6: world's great powers. As America ratchets up its military presence
• 37:36
  Speaker 6: on Australian soil. The stark warning came as the Chief
• 37:39
  Speaker 6: of Defense Force, David Johnston, said Australians needed to prepare
• 37:43
  Speaker 6: for more regular Chinese naval exercises off the nation's coastline,
• 37:47
  Speaker 6: as Beijing's powerful navy owns its war plans.
• 37:51
  Speaker 5: I mean that is the most directly.
• 37:54
  Speaker 6: This has been put to us thus far, that we
• 37:57
  Speaker 6: will end up in a war, and all the modeling
• 38:01
  Speaker 6: and whatever out of the US in particular has been
• 38:04
  Speaker 6: that at this point, now, by the end of the decade,
• 38:06
  Speaker 6: it's likely that there will be some kind of major
• 38:09
  Speaker 6: conflict with China, probably them going into Taiwan, and if
• 38:14
  Speaker 6: that draws in the United States, which would be highly likely,
• 38:17
  Speaker 6: it would then draw in necessarily Australia and the United
• 38:20
  Speaker 6: Kingdom and Canada, etc. We are heading towards war. It
• 38:26
  Speaker 6: is now clearly admitted by the government.
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: It's an interesting admission by the Defense Minister, because Anthony
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: Albernezi has been very coy about suggesting that there's any
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: sort of remote possibility of conflict. But of course Richard
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: Miles was at a defense symposium where other speakers were
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: very blunt about what Australia is facing. Former US National
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: Security advisor, former General hr McMaster said, quote unquote, China
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: is preparing for war and they're probing signs of weakness
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: in Western nations, and Radia should be quote unquote very
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: concerned about what's coming. So I think that Richard Miles
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: didn't have much option but to admit what everybody knows
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: privately and to say it out loud.
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: And they do need to talk about it because otherwise
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: you have.
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: A public who are completely unprepared in the event that
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: all of a sudden we're involved in a major conflict
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: and big sacrifices have to be made.
• 39:21
  Speaker 7: But this is so embarrassing for Anthony Albanesi for your
• 39:25
  Speaker 7: Defense minister to be saying we're going to war soon,
• 39:29
  Speaker 7: and then the Prime Minister to be saying we're going
• 39:31
  Speaker 7: to be neutral third party negotiating between China and the US.
• 39:37
  Speaker 7: We don't want to take sides too early. I mean,
• 39:40
  Speaker 7: do they realize how out of sync they are?
• 39:43
  Speaker 6: Well, it's funny how Richard Miles seems to get things
• 39:47
  Speaker 6: done when Anthony Albanizi.
• 39:48
  Speaker 5: Is out of the country, to be true, because the
• 39:50
  Speaker 5: last one I remember.
• 39:51
  Speaker 6: Was during the n zyq business and he was acting
• 39:55
  Speaker 6: Prime Minister, and the coalition came in with a bunch
• 39:59
  Speaker 6: of amendments to the legislation that was going to be
• 40:01
  Speaker 6: put through in order to get these people redetained, and
• 40:05
  Speaker 6: Richard Marles had it all fixed in five minutes flat,
• 40:08
  Speaker 6: which I don't think would have happened if.
• 40:09
  Speaker 5: Albow was there on the day.
• 40:11
  Speaker 6: But while we're talking about defense and how we're likely
• 40:14
  Speaker 6: heading towards war with China, other story on the front
• 40:17
  Speaker 6: of the OS that well tells us exactly how well
• 40:19
  Speaker 6: that might go. Lack of certainty on defense spend a
• 40:22
  Speaker 6: super dilemma. A lack of certainty around defense spending plans
• 40:26
  Speaker 6: is preventing investment in Australia's military industrial base, especially from
• 40:30
  Speaker 6: the four point two trillion dollars superannuation industry, says South
• 40:33
  Speaker 6: Australian Premier Peter Malanowskis as preasure builds on the Albanzy
• 40:37
  Speaker 6: government to increase defense spending as a percentage of GDP.
• 40:41
  Speaker 6: Industry participants say greater commitment on contracts is needed, especially
• 40:46
  Speaker 6: if the government's calls for superannuation funds to participate are met.
• 40:50
  Speaker 5: Once again. It proves how far behind the eight.
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: Ball we are.
• 40:55
  Speaker 6: And once again it takes either Chris Mins or Peter
• 40:59
  Speaker 6: Malinowskis the two most sensible labor leaders in this country
• 41:02
  Speaker 6: to call out exactly how bad a state we are in.
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: It's funny, isn't the government always going on about investment certainty.
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: Business needs investment, certainly when it comes.
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: To their pet project renewables, but.
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: When it comes to defending the country, investment certainty is
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: nowhere to be found.
• 41:18
  Speaker 7: And also how they always seem to turn to superannuation
• 41:22
  Speaker 7: as the thing that's going to save Australia. Who's going
• 41:24
  Speaker 7: to buy the Port of Darwin's superannuation, Who's going to
• 41:27
  Speaker 7: build all the renewables superannuation? Who's going to save our
• 41:30
  Speaker 7: defense superannuation? But super is just our money, so it's
• 41:34
  Speaker 7: another way of using our money to fix their problems.
• 41:39
  Speaker 7: But let's move on to the Herald Son now. Speaking
• 41:41
  Speaker 7: of we spoke about youth crime earlier. They've finally introduced
• 41:45
  Speaker 7: some new laws around post and boast. You'll pay dangerous
• 41:49
  Speaker 7: criminals who share videos of violent home invasions, carjackings and
• 41:54
  Speaker 7: stolen card joy rides online will cop an extra two
• 41:57
  Speaker 7: years behind bars with the Victorian government and set to introduce.
• 42:01
  Speaker 8: Tough post and boast laws.
• 42:03
  Speaker 7: The Alan Government will today announce the introduction of this
• 42:05
  Speaker 7: specific offense for bragging about crimes online that will keep
• 42:10
  Speaker 7: thugs in jail for longer. I mean initially when I
• 42:14
  Speaker 7: read this, I thought, wow, Victoria's finally doing something about
• 42:19
  Speaker 7: youth crime. But actually New South Wales introduced these laws
• 42:24
  Speaker 7: last year. Queensland has already introduced these laws, and the
• 42:27
  Speaker 7: Northern Territory as well, So once again Victoria is lagging.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a good law.
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: It's just amazing it hadn't been implemented a lot earlier,
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: particularly when you.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: Look at all what's going on in Victoria.
• 42:39
  Speaker 6: Well there's a state election next year, sir, you know,
• 42:41
  Speaker 6: get your skates on exactly right.
• 42:44
  Speaker 7: Another story in the Herald Sun, the headline is Albo's
• 42:47
  Speaker 7: aids fly high. Aid senior bureaucrats inside Anthony Albanese's Prime
• 42:52
  Speaker 7: Minister and Cabinet department with membership to the exclusive Quantus
• 42:56
  Speaker 7: Chairman's lounge enjoyed almost ninety fly over a year, with
• 43:01
  Speaker 7: an independent senator claiming the continued acceptance of gifts by
• 43:05
  Speaker 7: politicians and staff was deeply concerning I don't want politicians
• 43:10
  Speaker 7: or bureaucrats to, you know, not have a pleasant experience.
• 43:14
  Speaker 7: They work hard, they should be rewarded for that. But
• 43:17
  Speaker 7: I think the challenge comes in when these are the
• 43:20
  Speaker 7: same people who are making billion dollar decisions around flight timetables,
• 43:24
  Speaker 7: which airlines can operate in Australia, and then they're getting
• 43:28
  Speaker 7: free perks on the side.
• 43:29
  Speaker 8: It doesn't exactly stack up.
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you've got to ask yourself, do Quantus give these
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: chairmen's lounge passes just out of.
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: The goodness of their hearts?
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: Or is there a hope that, you know, when push
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: comes to shove, Quantus will be looked on favorably. I
• 43:43
  Speaker 3: think we all know how human nature works, and the
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: Independent Senator is right, it's deeply of course.
• 43:48
  Speaker 6: And I mean there are some people I know of
• 43:51
  Speaker 6: in entertainment and media who do have membership to the
• 43:55
  Speaker 6: Chairman's Lounge. I'm not one of them, but I would,
• 43:58
  Speaker 6: you know, without trying to be too egotistical about it,
• 44:01
  Speaker 6: I'm far more recognizable than any of these people who
• 44:04
  Speaker 6: would work for.
• 44:04
  Speaker 5: The Prime Minister.
• 44:06
  Speaker 6: So when you're making a decision about who do you
• 44:08
  Speaker 6: admit to the chairman's Lounge, it's who can I get
• 44:11
  Speaker 6: the most influence out of who is it most worth
• 44:14
  Speaker 6: having in the lounge to get towards the decisions that
• 44:18
  Speaker 6: can be made. So if you are the top of
• 44:20
  Speaker 6: the tree when it comes to media in this country,
• 44:22
  Speaker 6: you might get an invitation in there. Or if you
• 44:25
  Speaker 6: happen to be a faceless back room person, a bureaucrat
• 44:28
  Speaker 6: who works in the Prime Minister's department, but someone who
• 44:31
  Speaker 6: gives advice to the Prime minister, will you're in for
• 44:35
  Speaker 6: membership of the Chairman's lounge.
• 44:37
  Speaker 5: I think that tells you why they give the memberships.
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: But it will continue to happen because most politicians enjoy it.
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: So I don't see that they're going to vote to
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: not be part of that club. Let's go to the
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: Newcastle Herald. Wind knocked out of sales, reads the headline.
• 44:51
  Speaker 3: Of course, this is in reference to Labour's green fantasies.
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: Climate Change and Energy Minister Chris Bowen has ruled out
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: adding more project to the Hunter offshore wind Zone, a
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: move that reflects growing uncertainty about the offshore wind industry's future.
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: This comes as Norwegian energy giant Equinor continues to deliberate
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: on whether to take up a feasibility license for the
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: Novocastrian Wind project, which aimed to generate two gigwats of
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: offshore renewable energy. By the way, this same company declined
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: to take up the offer in the Illawarra zone, where
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: a feasibility.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: License has still not yet been issued.
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: The Labor government ANOWT six offshore wind zones that would
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: be crucial for them providing the power that we need,
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: and energy companies are very reluctant to take them up
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: without massive government subsidies, which should tell you something.
• 45:43
  Speaker 6: Indeed, let's just get rid of it all, I think
• 45:45
  Speaker 6: is probably what it's telling us. But I don't think
• 45:47
  Speaker 6: mister Bowen will be going down that line very quickly.
• 45:50
  Speaker 5: Before we get to the break.
• 45:52
  Speaker 6: Tragic story on the front of the Mercury down in
• 45:55
  Speaker 6: Tasmania tomorrow.
• 45:56
  Speaker 5: It'says killed in line of duty.
• 45:59
  Speaker 6: Tasmania's lead have called Monday a dark day after a
• 46:02
  Speaker 6: well respected and seasoned police officer was shot and killed
• 46:06
  Speaker 6: in the line of duty, the first fatal police shooting
• 46:08
  Speaker 6: in the state in twenty six years. The officer was
• 46:11
  Speaker 6: executing a court issued warrant to repossess the home when
• 46:16
  Speaker 6: police say the resident opened fire.
• 46:18
  Speaker 5: I mean, you know, the police do a lot of great.
• 46:21
  Speaker 6: Work in this country and we should never forget the
• 46:25
  Speaker 6: family and friends they have. Don't think when their family
• 46:28
  Speaker 6: and friend Copper wakes up in the morning that they're
• 46:32
  Speaker 6: not going to come home alive. But sometimes these things
• 46:35
  Speaker 6: happen when they are simply doing their jobs.
• 46:38
  Speaker 5: What an awful case.
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, well, we're going to go to a break.
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: When we come back, you will know what happens when
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: people see a sign saying fresh paint, don't touch.
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: So what do you think happens in a museum.
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: When a priceless crystal incrusted chair has a sign attached
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: saying don't sit down.
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: You know what happens.
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: Will show you after the break. All right, welcome back
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: to the program. We've got our dope of the day, Freyo.
• 47:05
  Speaker 8: Let's hear it for our dope of the day.
• 47:12
  Speaker 7: A pair of tourists at a museum in Italy were
• 47:15
  Speaker 7: caught on security footage sitting on a chair that had
• 47:19
  Speaker 7: a big sign do not touch. This was a crystal
• 47:23
  Speaker 7: Swarovsky crystal encrusted chair, and they specifically waited for security
• 47:29
  Speaker 7: to leave before making them move. Obviously, they immediately realized
• 47:35
  Speaker 7: we've messed up, and they fled the scene. And now
• 47:38
  Speaker 7: the museum is looking for tips to find this mystery couple.
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: This incident happened in April.
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: The museum have only just released the footage a to
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: try and find who wasn't that destroyed this priceless piece
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: of art, but also as a warning to future tourists,
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: maybe just look at the exhibits.
• 47:56
  Speaker 5: Don't touch like they should have put something around round it.
• 48:00
  Speaker 6: I suspect because you're right, James, when you said earlier
• 48:03
  Speaker 6: that it's like, you know, don't touch you when it's
• 48:05
  Speaker 6: almost encouraging people to go and do it. It's meant
• 48:09
  Speaker 6: to be a tribute to Van Go's chair painting, of course,
• 48:14
  Speaker 6: the total opposite of his painting, which was far more
• 48:17
  Speaker 6: to day. It was a wooden chair, this one covered
• 48:19
  Speaker 6: in this were obsky crystals, but.
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: It was helped to going to buy tinfoil.
• 48:22
  Speaker 6: I know, come on, people, can we just follow the
• 48:26
  Speaker 6: rules for the sake of everyone else?
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: Now?
• 48:28
  Speaker 6: Today is not only has Paul told you in his
• 48:31
  Speaker 6: program the day that ten years ago Donald Trump descended
• 48:34
  Speaker 6: down the escalator to tell us he was going to
• 48:36
  Speaker 6: run for president.
• 48:37
  Speaker 5: It's National Vigiamte Day. We all remember this.
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: Ad today more than ever. Bgier might help, might yeast
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: extract with all the goodness of those essential B Group vitamins.
• 49:05
  Speaker 5: I love veggie Mate, what about you lot?
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: I just remember that ad from nineteen eighty. I'm thinking
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: where all the mobile phones?
• 49:11
  Speaker 7: I don't remember that ad from nineteen eighty, but I
• 49:14
  Speaker 7: love it anyway, and I love Veggiemite.
• 49:16
  Speaker 3: That's all we've got time for is stick around? Coming
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: up is the Read a Penny Show.
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: Good Night,