Latest / The MeatEater Podcast / Ep. 508: Not Your Daddy's Farm

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Ep. 508: Not Your Daddy's Farm · The MeatEater Podcast

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listeningcast.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: You can't predict anything.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: The Meat Eater Podcast is brought to you by First Light.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Whether you're checking trail cams, hanging deer stands, or scouting
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: for elk. First Light has performance apparel to support every
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: hunter in every environment. Check it out at first light
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: dot com. F I R S T L I T
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: E dot com. Okay, everybody, this episode is dedicated to
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Doug Durn. Oh oh, he's gonna eat this up, this
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: whole thing. Oh dude, stuck Durn's dream. That's because this
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: is a special edition called Ask a Farmer, but it's
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: not any farmer. We're joined by Will Harris, fourth generation
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: farmer of white Oak Pastor in Georgia, now author of
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: a book, A Bold Return to Giving a damn One Farm,
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Six Generations in the Future of Food. Will Harris is
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: the owner of White Oak Pastures, a holistically managed, regenerative
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: ranch and farm in Georgia's semi tropical coastal plane. You
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: guys raised how many different kinds of animals? Ten lay
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: them out for me.
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  Speaker 2: Real cows, hogs, sheep, goats, rabbits, and five poltry species chickens, turkeys, skinners,
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  Speaker 2: and ducks.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: And you run your farm like a like an ecosystem.
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: Here is an ecosystem, yes, and.
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: You live recognizing that and you were We're gonna get
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: into great detail on this. But you guys, family's been
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: on the farm since eighteen sixty. Yeah, I'm the was
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: it eighteen sixty or sixty six.
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  Speaker 2: Sixty six? I'm the fourth.
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  Speaker 1: Generation, never left, never sold. You guys just been.
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: There, We've been there. My daughters are the fifth and
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: they've got five little beady children who are the sixth.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: So the sixth generation is on.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: But the six year Russian hadn't contributed it.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: They don't do nothing nothing. It's just a testament to
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: kids these days.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Right, But their parents, their parents are producers. Got it?
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Our connection? We have the same agent, Mark Gerald.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's great.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: Did Mark find you?
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: He did? He contracted us.
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: That's happened to me twenty some years ago.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: And I told him that I couldn't write a book.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: I didn't know how to read a book. But he persisted,
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: and finally going to stop him. No, he don't stop him.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: He's in it to win it. Man.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: So when I met Mark, I thought I had it
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: all figured out. I was living in uh I was
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: living in Wyoming at the time, and I was already
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: writing a book and and I got a call from
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: my editor outside magazine. She said, hey, there is this
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: agent looking for you. I was like, shit, already got
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: an agent. And he was persistent.
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: Man.
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  Speaker 1: He got a hold of me and he's basically, here's
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: how we're going to do this.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. He hasn't changed a pit.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's like, this is And I was like, oh, yeah,
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: maybe someday I won't do that. He goes, no, no, no, no, no,
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: no, no no, We're gonna do it right now, strictly like
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: week one, this will happen, Week two, this will happen,
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: Week three, this will happen. I was like, let's see.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: I actually told starting to be like work.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: I actually told him no, thank you, I'm not interested.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: Really didn't. He talk to my daughter and she was
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: interested and had me become interested.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: Mark went to my bachelor party, did he I had
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: a week long bachelor party.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't know those glomorous.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: I wasn't either. So we're gonna get into all that. Uh,
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: and it's gonna be big time, asked the farmer. I
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: got some real farming questions for you. Yeah, about land management, uh,
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: animal wealth, fair, why things? Why things were done the
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: way they're done in the agricultural landscape for a long time.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: Why the agricultural landscape changed so much in the mid
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: nineteen hundreds.
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  Speaker 2: Right? Have I got the answer for you?
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  Speaker 1: Why did things? Why did agg change so much in
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  Speaker 1: the mid nineteen hundreds, And why are farmers some farmers
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: now beginning to look and think that maybe we had
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: things more figured out in the old days than we
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: do in the modern days in some of the trade offfs. First,
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: we got to talk about a couple of quick things,
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: and I'm going to ask you about just general wild wildlife.
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  Speaker 1: I'm a cow's not cow's not condos kind of environmentally,
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  Speaker 1: I'm not you know what I mean. There's like this
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: whole faction of environmentalism that are anti Kyle. I'm not
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: among them.
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  Speaker 2: Good.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like, I'm too much more pragmatic than that.
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  Speaker 1: I want to talk about wildlife onregenitive farms, clean farm practices,
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: dirty farm practices.
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: Right up my alley.
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  Speaker 1: Great, we're gonna get to all that. Yanni. First, Yann,
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  Speaker 1: you want your daughter got her first buck. My daughter
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: got her first buck.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, yours after you kind of gave her first opportunity
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: away to your son. What do you mean she got mad?
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: That's what she likes to think happened. Is not what happens.
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  Speaker 4: That's not what happened when you told the story. That's
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: how I understood it. The buck was kind of getting away,
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: did I tell the story? Yeah, but her and yeah,
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: and as the book is kind of getting away and
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: as opposed to being like, Okay, we're just gonna let
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: him go over the ridge.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: We already did that one.
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  Speaker 4: We're gonna get on him again.
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: That already happened once.
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  Speaker 4: Okay, but you could do it.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: How many times you go bump a buck over ridge?
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: Go find it again?
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  Speaker 4: Listen? I don't know. But but instead you said Jimmy
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: and shoot him. Hadn't even come out of your lips,
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: and the gun went off, and what she thought was
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: her buck was now Jimmy's buck.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: He's kind of a wild bill though, you know, like
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: if you say get him, he's gonna get him.
• 6:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I understand. I understand. So you took her out again,
• 6:17
  Speaker 4: and she got her first buck.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: Didn't even let her big brother come. I brought her
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: and her little brother. I brought her and her little
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: brother out and we had a great little hunt. And
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: on her sixth day, her sixth day of kind of
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: more than that if you count just camping traveling, she
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: put in her sixth day of actual like real good
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: wake up before it gets light out hunting, got a
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: buck and she was ecstatic. The one mistake I made,
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: she hit a good hitting lungs, ran up there too quick.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: I should have said, let's just sit and wait to
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: come minutes.
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: Oh it's still, because it was still.
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: Then you get up there and it's like an know
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: what I mean, right, anything takes a minute to die, sure,
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, you know usually and she hit it right,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: you know, she hit.
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: It through the lungs.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: I just said, okay, now you wait a minute, then
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: we'll go up and have a look. And she'd gone
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: up and been like dead in the door nail. But
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: instead we hustled right over there and she caught it,
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: and you know, you know then I'm like this always happens.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: It's just it's it's like normally people wait and they
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: don't even see that it happens. But we came up
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: and it's it's just it happens. They're gonna breathe for
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: a minute and they're gonna expire. And it's not that
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: you did anything wrong. You did everything right, but you
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: just witness the thing that would normally be out of
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  Speaker 1: sight because it ran over the hill or you wait
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  Speaker 1: a minute.
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  Speaker 2: She got over it.
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  Speaker 1: She's pretty upset.
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  Speaker 4: Because she.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: Wounded it extra harm, didn't hit it right, because she
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: just thought they'd go like in the Westerns, you know,
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: the guy falls off the railing and he's just never
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: even twitches. I think that's what she was expecting.
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  Speaker 4: Any tears, yeah, the ones associate with that moment or
• 8:04
  Speaker 4: the tears of getting her first buck.
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  Speaker 1: No tears of that. She didn't hit it right. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: it made it softer. Yeah, but then.
• 8:14
  Speaker 4: Because I kind of started crying a little bit and
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  Speaker 4: I was like, oh no, what happened? What's going on?
• 8:20
  Speaker 4: And she's just like, I just I can't believe I
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: did it, you know, like pure joy, you know, but
• 8:26
  Speaker 4: tears of joy. So no, yeah, she I was texting
• 8:29
  Speaker 4: with Corinn earlier about it, and she's she said, well,
• 8:32
  Speaker 4: did any mixed emotions as none whatsoever, just like cools
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: of cucumber, happy and boked by it up to and
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: it was like, great, take some pictures, pet it, check
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  Speaker 4: it out.
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  Speaker 5: You know what.
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  Speaker 4: I've a couple of takeaways. This is fresh in my
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: mind because it was not even twenty four hours ago.
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: Is how when kids are around these dead animals, they've
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: seen a lot of them alive. They've seen our kids
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: a lot of them have seen a lot of them dead.
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: But they go up to them and they are just
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: touching and feeling and checking from one end to the other.
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  Speaker 4: You don't know the tale, just like so. And I
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  Speaker 4: think I don't know why, But as adults, maybe it's
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: because you know, you've already done it, seen a thousand times,
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: and so you kind of skip that part. But I
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: didn't have to tell her to like, oh, take a
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: minute and enjoy the moment, like it was just naturally.
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: She was just doing it. You know, look at the hide,
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: look at the collar. Look how it's ten different colors,
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: but when you stand away from it blends into one.
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: And you know, just all these observations and you know,
• 9:32
  Speaker 4: my daughter, you know, and she gets going. There's a
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: lot of words coming out of there.
• 9:36
  Speaker 5: Maybe she's a future scientist.
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah, artists, we'll see at some point.
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: My kids are always really eager to see what's in
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: the stomach. Oh, and no amount of checking is going
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: to ever convince them that.
• 9:49
  Speaker 4: It's the same.
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: Totally look like it's gonna look like someone pull up
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: a bunch of the slaughter.
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: She pretty much it herself. I did the I busted
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: open the sternom for so that it'd be easier for
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: her to see what she was doing, right, Because at
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: first I said, yeah, just reach in there, grab the track,
• 10:09
  Speaker 4: you cut it off with your other hand, and yank
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: it all out, and she's like looking in there, and
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: you know you can't see anything. It's gonna be all
• 10:17
  Speaker 4: done by hand. So then I said, all right, let
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: me cut it open. Then you can see what you
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: got going. But yeah, she does the whole thing, and
• 10:24
  Speaker 4: she's like, all right, let's get the heart and the liver.
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: So she got that. I point her in the right
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: direction there and it's all said and done. Buck splayed out,
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: letting him drain. I'm getting ready to go get the
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: uh of the truck, and she's like, oh, can I
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: cut the stomach open now?
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: Like it's like this to find like a little person
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: in there.
• 10:44
  Speaker 4: Or yeah, I don't know what it is, but it's
• 10:46
  Speaker 4: great to see that that curiosity.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: No, uh, I had so many observations helping my daughter,
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: but the main one is, wow, stuff gets away.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that wouldn't have gotten away.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: Normally, no opportunity.
• 11:06
  Speaker 6: You know what do you know what?
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Oh, just you name it, you name it. It's just
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: a lot, it's a lot online. It's just get you know,
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: it's like it's over there and you gotta remember this.
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: And then we did the thing too, dry firing, dry
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: firing on it.
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: On the animal, just everything. Yeah, no, it's a great,
• 11:26
  Speaker 4: great thing.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: We saw some you know, something dough too far away.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: We just dry fire on it just to Yeah.
• 11:35
  Speaker 4: It's just it's anything that you do that's uh, I
• 11:39
  Speaker 4: don't know a skill like that. In the beginning, it
• 11:42
  Speaker 4: seems like it's so complicated. There's so many moving parts.
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: There's so you know where you and I just will
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: naturally just shift our whole body as you shift behind
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: the gun. But for them it's just not natural, right,
• 11:54
  Speaker 4: It's it's that and it's just refinding the animal and
• 11:56
  Speaker 4: the scope and I mean she's an hour into the Huh.
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: She's like, I think you would have already shot one.
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: I'm like, yeah, maybe, yeah, there's just there's just a lot.
• 12:08
  Speaker 4: But I think I noticed that too. But at the
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: same time, I was watching her yesterday and I'm like, man,
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: her muzzle control is I don't want to say impeccable,
• 12:18
  Speaker 4: but it's getting there. And just like the way she
• 12:20
  Speaker 4: handles the firearm is getting really good. Like there's no
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: like looking at the bolt and going how does this
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: thing work?
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Again?
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: Right, there's just been enough repetition where it's all clicking
• 12:30
  Speaker 4: right along and you can see and even like dealing
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: with it. Even though she's never gutted one, she's been
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: part of that enough and she's skinned enough and done
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: all those little pieces that it didn't take us that
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: much longer. You know, then I would have gutted it.
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: I mean maybe twenty minutes instead of ten. But you
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: can see. I think down the line it won't be
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: too long until hopefully, if they keep practicing it, that
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: you won't even need to say anything.
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: Just hold a leg. You know, when you get into
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: a hunting technique, there's all these things like you can
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: go on and you hear people talk about, you know,
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: people instructional people to be like, oh, there's like fitness,
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: you know, there's marksmanship. I mean there's a lot of
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: other stuff that no one's put a name to and
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: no one talks about. But it's just how to be like,
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: what does a deer look like? That ain't gonna stop?
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: What's the deer look like? That's gonna stop in a second?
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you should be ready to shoot it.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: It's just all this stuff. You're like, you realize, like,
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: no one's ever put this in the way. No one's
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: ever put in the words like what is a deer's demeanor?
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: You know that deer is heading this way and he's
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: clueless that deer does that? Does that see about something
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: that happened a little while ago and he's kind of
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: getting over it?
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 13:51
  Speaker 7: I always have a I don't know what it was,
• 13:54
  Speaker 7: but when I was at hunting last week or the
• 13:57
  Speaker 7: week before, it's like every every buck was kind of
• 14:02
  Speaker 7: like tuned up, and every time I'd be like he
• 14:05
  Speaker 7: sees us, and I'm like, no, he doesn't. He's just
• 14:07
  Speaker 7: you know, but it was upset about something earlier, right,
• 14:09
  Speaker 7: Or he's just keyed up and he happens to be
• 14:11
  Speaker 7: looking in that direction, and I happened to be there.
• 14:15
  Speaker 7: And you watch him for a minute, and then all
• 14:16
  Speaker 7: of a sudden, he's looking somewhere else and he's given
• 14:19
  Speaker 7: that bush the same look that he just gave me.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we would get into that a lot. He was
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: looking she's looking at us. I'm like, well, she is,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: but she's not. Yeah, right, that's exactly. She's just looking
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: at something past us.
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: But if you wave your arms right now, right at.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: Us, it won't be coincidental. I had some other observation.
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: I was just saying, Oh, did you carry your daughter's gun?
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: I did not.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: I have okay, Ina, See, I'm so much meaner to
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: my boys than my daughter. So I was carrying my
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: daughter's gun and my older boy found out. I heard
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: him like, I heard him like, he carried your gun?
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: Are you kidding me?
• 14:57
  Speaker 6: Well?
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, nicer to hear her name to you real quick.
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: On the subject of land ownership. So to return to
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: my favorite subject, We've gotten more mileage out of the
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: Wyoming Corner crossing case than any other thing to ever happen.
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: I've gotten a lot of great feedback from that podcast,
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: just text saying how great a lawyer. Yeah, with a lawyer.
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: How great it was to hear him lay it all out.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: You know a lot of people I was noticing because
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: we have the video of that on YouTube. A lot
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: of people watch that on YouTube. The corner crossing lawyer
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: speaks out. Someone wrote in this is a land surveyor,
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: wrote in backing me up on a point. I got
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: one guy taking me to task, and I got one
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: guy backing me up and response, this is him writing
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: in response to your recent episode with the lawyer from
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: the Corner Crossers, I think it's important to get a
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: little insight from a land surveyor my profession for quite
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: some time now. There's something Steve said in that episode
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: and several other times discussing this issue that cannot be overstated,
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: he continues, and that's that this was a surveyed and
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: verified corner, Meaning the much debated, contentious corner in Wyoming
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: that led to this corner crossing case, who knows could
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: wind up in the US Supreme Court, was a certified
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: and verified corner. So when these individuals use this ladder
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: to jump corners and stay on public land while crossing
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: over two corners of private land, they were doing this
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: on a survey and verified corner. This individual, the surveyor,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: goes on to say, when most of the section corners
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: were set in the eighteen hundreds, it was marked by
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: either a nearby rock which was then carved and engraved
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: in a specific way, a pile of flat rocks they
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: found and stacked one on another, or they would cut
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: off a branch from a nearby tree and bury that
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: sticking out of the ground and dig four holes round
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: it one due north, east, south and west. Many of
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: these original section corners have been replaced with more modern monuments,
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: most often a three inch aluminum cap on either a
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: pipe or a piece of rebar pounded in the ground.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: You see these quite often, but others have not knowing this,
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: unless you know exactly what you are looking for, and
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: more importantly, where you are looking for it, you are
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: not going to find the section corner. In his career,
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: he's dealt with the buried branches sticking out of the
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: ground and has noted they last about a year or two,
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: you think. Also on Cal's comment of the surveyor's thinking
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: when setting a corner, a surveyor saying to himself, there's
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: no way anyone is going to use this. He says,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: that does happen, and I found record of at least
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: one instance where the surveyor quite literally said about here
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: surveying sections is supposed to be a perfect grid with
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: lines running true north south in east west, with intersections
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: every five, two and eighty feet, but that is never
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: ever the case. Finally, on the comment, he says, I
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: can't remember who said it of on X not being
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: one hundred percent accurate to take you to the section corner.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: I personally have witnessed on X being forty feet off
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: their sectioned corners. But what he goes on to clarify
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: not is gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna paraphrase him. This
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: isn't even a non X issue. Your phone isn't Your
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: phone isn't that accurate. Your smartphone isn't really accurate much
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: better than a sixteen foot radius. So for you to
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: be jumping corners based off of your phone, or to
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: be trusting fences, there's how I accurate the information and
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: how I accurate the phone. Sincerely, Lanserver. Another guy reached out,
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: I was saying that I could always look at a
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: feller and.
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: See hold on, I got a quick little retort to
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: him or retort him. Not so much that, but I
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: just wanted someone to clarify this. When I read that email,
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: I got to thinking, well, if the landowners there have
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: set fences, aren't they in some way saying this is
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: where I believe this corner is and sort of setting
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: a precedent of where this corner is and has been.
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: They're not.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: No, I saw a fence the other day that was
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: wildly off because for him to make it on his
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: borderline like in this case, it was to the advantage.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: It was to the the advantage of to the advantage
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: of was it. No, no, no, no, Sorry. We were where
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: BLM came up against the ranch yep, and it was
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: a bunch of it was a bunch of bad lands,
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: and he owned a bunch of the bad lands. But
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: just ran it sure along the bench and there was
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: corners in there, and it was like and you went
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: up to it thing and and it was just a
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: matter of convenience where you run fences. So I don't
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: think that. I just think that, like these things weren't
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: on anyone's mind, you know, no.
• 20:33
  Speaker 4: One hundred percent. No, I'm just trying to figure out
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: like in because everybody because they're saying, yeah, don't try
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: to cross this corner unless you have go and have
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: it surveyed. Right, But I'm just saying, if it was
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: let's say it wasn't bad Lands, and you're in a
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: prairie and someone has set these this corner to the
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: best of their knowledge, can we always agree that it's
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: to the best of our knowledge you're going to cross
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: the corner where the corner is.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: In looking at what these fellas are going through into Wyoming,
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: you would the assumptions about anything.
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: But I think what Yannis is, what Yanni is saying
• 21:07
  Speaker 5: is that, like if whether that placement of the fence
• 21:13
  Speaker 5: is in actuality, uh, the right corner or not, the
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: point is that that landowner, whether it's to the benefit
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: of the public or to the benefit of himself, put
• 21:27
  Speaker 5: something there that is like the physical signifier to anyone
• 21:31
  Speaker 5: who might be thinking to cross that. That's right. So
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: it's like the intention behind it, right, You're not to understand.
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: But if you're going to go into a court in
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: this case, going to Wyoming, and there's a guy saying
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: that he's taking you to civil court over seven million dollars,
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: I'd like to think that I was on a surveyed
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: corner and not have an added wrinkle beat buddy, that
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: that fence and even on my corner you can have
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: the landowner to Yeah, I mean I think there's two landowners.
• 21:59
  Speaker 7: I mean the fence thing is like completely arbitrary, Like
• 22:02
  Speaker 7: you could you could just build you know, if you
• 22:04
  Speaker 7: owned a ranch, you have every right to build a
• 22:08
  Speaker 7: you know, a section of fence wherever you want on it.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: Right, and in this corner was this morn is not even
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: fence that we're talking about.
• 22:13
  Speaker 7: Yeah, And it's so it's not like it's you can't
• 22:16
  Speaker 7: just assume that because the fence exists, that's where the
• 22:19
  Speaker 7: private landowner believes the boundary is.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: Like, that's a pretty big leap of Maybe it's his
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: neighbor spence. Yeah, might be his spence, or it might
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: be the governments, or.
• 22:28
  Speaker 7: The previous owner built the fence, and the previous owner
• 22:31
  Speaker 7: didn't know.
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: It's just you seem to see who they sort of
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: eventually they're gonna have to say, hey, it's someone's responsibility, Yeah,
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: to get these things surveyed.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: I can see all kinds of implications. One of the
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: implications I can see down the road is if this,
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: if this goes and it gets like just settled in
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: some outright way, Yeah, I'm not doing any corner crossing
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: because I'm too it's too it feels too up in.
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: The air.
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: Until it's further settled.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I'm saying, if it ever got settled, if it was
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: just settled and the courts decided and it was lit
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: gated and the law the land was laid out, that
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: corner crossing is legal, I would think that, like I
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: would be, I would be raising money. I would be
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: raising money to survey strategic corners, like to to find
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: to codify in very strategic locations those places. But I
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: just keep as people are getting in, you know, pushing
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: these boundaries. I just think it's I keep reminding people
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: that where this happened was a surveyed corner and that
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: you can't go by h you know, to really actually
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: be like placing your feet is very precise.
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: Have you heard from like any of our game warned
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: buddies here in this in Montana if the if corner
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: crossing or trespassing is on the rise in like this hunting.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: I haven't heard of anybody prosecuting it this year, and
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: there's no way it didn't happen this year, but I
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: haven't heard of it. Good would be a good question.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I want to move on. You find randal. Yeah, yeah, no,
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: there wasn't. There was a case up in h up
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: By Towns in a corner crossing case.
• 24:10
  Speaker 7: Yeah, there's and there's some other you know, like some
• 24:13
  Speaker 7: claims were made that the individual had trespassed. It's kind
• 24:16
  Speaker 7: of I think it was still the details were fuzzy
• 24:20
  Speaker 7: for a little bit while the while the legal system
• 24:23
  Speaker 7: sorted things out. I think the charges were dropped, but
• 24:26
  Speaker 7: that was like in the in the headlines, it was
• 24:28
  Speaker 7: sort of a corner crossing.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: Related dispute.
• 24:33
  Speaker 7: But I don't really know enough about it to get
• 24:35
  Speaker 7: into the details.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: Now, I know in this state there is an organization
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: gearing up to fight corner crossing mm hmm. And there
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: they're getting ready to spend spend money on a public
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: campaign to turn people off to the idea that you'd
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: be able to corner across. I have posited, is that
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: the right use of that word?
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: But I can look at a fell and tell these
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: snores now with with nine accuracy, do you think will
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do that? Well, I found out recently
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: that I was at a ear nose and throat doctor
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: and they measure your neck and they're measuring my neck
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: like like you're at a tailor. And I said, what
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: do you measure my neck for it? And they're like,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: has to do a sleep apne issues. I'm like, what
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: do you mean? They said, a sixteen inch neck, A
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: sixteen inch neck is more likely to have sleep apnea?
• 25:29
  Speaker 5: Wait, is that like on the smaller end or the
• 25:32
  Speaker 5: larger end, like I gather it's larger sixteen inch neck
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: like around or like six inch circumference.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: You know your waiste measurement from your parents, right, so
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: that's how Yeah, they just put it. They put a
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: tape around your neck and I was like, why the
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: hell are you doing that. Will's button his shirt up
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: and they were saying that that's a that's a they're
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: trying to they're looking at how likely are you to
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: sleep apnea? And they said a sixth that they take
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: notice at a sixteen inch neck, So I thought was
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: really surprising.
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: And but it ends there or goes sixteen in up
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: sixteen and up got it?
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, Greater than sixteen is like some marker for them
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: to be like, oh, let's ask a bunch of questions
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: about sleep apnia.
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: Average is fifteen according to the Internet.
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: Now, this guy says reaching out because Steve mentioned in
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: an episode that he can now look at people and
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: guess if they have sleep apnea or suffer from snoring.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: It's not all that far off. This is from a
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: dentist a dds. While we definitely see a correlation with
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: next circumference in sleep apnea snoring, one can also see
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: snoring in sleep apnea in the shape of the jaw,
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: which I didn't I also didn't know that's what I
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: was looking at him. Out over the past one thousand years,
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: we have seen that about twenty five percent of the
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: population has seen a gradual decrease in jaw size, both
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: maxillary and mandibler mandibular.
• 27:11
  Speaker 5: I think it's mandibular. He also didn't cite the source, but.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: According to archaeological evidence one thousand years. Well, I know
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: it's getting a little science y. I really got you, Phil.
• 27:21
  Speaker 8: Well, it's just it's mainly because Krein has it in
• 27:23
  Speaker 8: the notes that like, please say, this is just a theory.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: Well, it's getting a little sciencey because over the past
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: one thousand years we have seen that about twenty five
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: percent of the population has It's like, who a thousand
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: years ago? Oh, I guess skeletal remains. Okay, I'm gonna
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: take it him at face value. He's a sign, he's
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: a doctor. Well, dyes, you know. According to archaeological evidence,
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: he goes on. One thousand years ago, there was much
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: more room for teeth, including wisdom, and there was not
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: as much crowding in tea as we see now. The
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: working theory is that because we have domesticated the majority
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: of our food supply and have selectively bred for hyper
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: palatable and easily chewed foods, the body no longer needs
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: to build a large lower face to support chewing dense materials.
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: If you're wondering what that is, that's that plain ass,
• 28:20
  Speaker 4: boring chicken breast that we get served all the time.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: I'm finding myself clenching right now. Accentrate my jaw.
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: You don't have to because you chew on elk so much.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: I can't read like this. So the smaller jaw and
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: increase in overall size of the human Oh so, okay,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: we've gotten bigger, jaws have gotten smaller, has created a
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: mismatch that's interesting and has pushed the tongue into the
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: back of the throat, thus creating a more collapsible upper airway.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: This produces snoring and sleep apnea. We treat the disease
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: with either a sea PAP or what I do, a
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: mandibular repositioning device.
• 29:10
  Speaker 5: Hope this helps, which is a night guard.
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: I wonder if that tongue going farther back into your
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: airway there, if that makes it harder or easier to
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: to uh what's the term when you're diving and you
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: gotta oh clear clear.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah. This is an argument that if you want to
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: stop snoring in this country, cut your jerky with the grain,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: not against the grain, you know, get in the gym
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: and do whatever.
• 29:42
  Speaker 7: You get some you know, like a those band, the
• 29:45
  Speaker 7: resistance band, and train your jaw.
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, or just put jerky in the gym.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: I'm just I'm just hypothesized, and that that may be
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: why y'all talk so funny.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: Nailed it, Okay, last bit of last bit of feedback,
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: and then we're gonna get onto it. We're gonna give
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: our guests is due, is at this point overdue a
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: lotment of time. Here's my thoughts on why Steve is
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: wrong about gluten allergy and conservatives. Now, I was recently.
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: I have been saying for years, and I've been stating
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: it as though it was a fact that I felt that. Well, no,
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: I acted like I had read this somewhere.
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: You ready in your diary.
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: I felt, just by my exposure to the world that
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: I felt that the gluten allergies were decided, like like
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: the left leaning people had a far greater likelihood I
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: had in gluten allergies, so much so that I didn't
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: bother to look it up. Well, Spencer looked it up.
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: And conservatives are more likely to believe in ghosts, also
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: surprise me, And the conservatives are far more likely to
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: order their steak medium rare, and they're no more likely
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: to have a gluten intolerance. You're at the medium rare thing.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: The medium rare thing is overwhelming medium rare.
• 31:23
  Speaker 5: But you know, all of like well, in at least
• 31:28
  Speaker 5: in South Africa, everyone likes their meat cooked.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: Probably because probably because of food handling. And you know,
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: I mean anywhere you go in the in the can
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: you still say developing world? What are you supposed to
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: call it?
• 31:40
  Speaker 5: I think so.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Anywhere you go in the developing world, man, there's a
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: lot of overcooked stuff.
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah for a reason, Yeah, fall on the meat temperature scale.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: No, no, no, he just said what the most common
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: so in in the most common ordered steak is medium rare.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: But it winds up being that like like conservatives or
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: sixty four do you remember what it was? Sixty four
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: percent more likely to order a medium rare steak. Anyways,
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: this guy goes on to say I didn't know this.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: He says, there's a conspiracy theory floating around or No, no,
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: there is a conspiracy theorist level correlation. I got to
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: unpack that sentence. Yeah, Krins trying to throw in hyphens
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: to make it may more, just to put some she
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: just randomly throwing hyphens in there. There is a conspiracy
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: theorist No, you did the hyphen in the real place, right,
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: There is a conspiracy theorist level correlation between the consumption
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: and exposure to glyphosate commonly marketed as round up. Is
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: that is that? Farewell? Did I say that?
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: That glyphosate is round up? It is round up? Uh,
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: the only widely available glypho say, or is it just
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: that's just a product name?
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: They had.
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: They had the the patent that molecule for a long time. Okay,
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: and I think there may be some knockoffs, but yes,
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: they own that market.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: So like round up, you would say is gleipel.
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, which used to be Moncente. There's now bear, got it?
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: Bear? Mhmm, there's a Okay, and I can read that
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: part again. To my understanding, the more exposure to round
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: up you have. Now this now we are way into
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: areas where I am not here to verify any of this.
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's just because I'm not saying this
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: from a legal exposure standpoint. I'm just saying this from like,
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know this. This gentleman, uh Whalen. Of course,
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: this guy's name was Whalen. I love this guy. To
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: my understanding, the more exposure to round up you have
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: the higher chance of developing a gluten allergy. Then he
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: goes down to say, if we are making far fetch correlations,
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: to which I would say, are we? If we are
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: making far fetch correlations, then it is easy to assume
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: those in rural areas, farmers, land managers, and general folks
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: living around farms and ranches are at a higher exposure
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: rate of glyphosate due to farming practices and availability of
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: the chemical. I once walked into our local egg office
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: to get some mean chemical that you needed a permit
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: to buy the nice. This is not me, this the
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: gentleman that rode in. The nice lady asked me what
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: account to put it under, and after listing four different farmers,
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: we found one that had a permit. After I paid,
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: I called my buddy whose account it was on, to
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: tell him what I did, and his response was, I
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: got a barrel of it. You should have come and
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: gotten what you needed from me. To wrap up the correlation.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: If we believe, if he says, if we like bringing
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: me into this, if we believe that roundup causes gluten intolerance,
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: and by which he means it, he believes roundup is
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: widely available for rural folks. Most rural folks are conservatives,
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: then it's easy to see more conservatives would have a
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: gluten analergy. My source on my theory.
• 35:13
  Speaker 8: Here we go finally, his mother in law. Of course,
• 35:18
  Speaker 8: no one person, one subject, my source on my theory.
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: My mother in law spent twenty years living in a
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: bottom surrounded by crop farms. Now this is this is
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: the best detail of this whole letter their guard. This
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: is incredible. What they would need to tarp their garden
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: when the surrounding farmers were spraying crops because wind drift
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: would kill the garden. He goes on to say she
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: has a gluten allergy. What else could it cause that?
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: And she goes on to say that in terms of
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: her political leanings, she has three flags, a du flag,
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Old Glory, and a Trump twenty twenty case closed. That's see,
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: he's just a scent that instead of sending to us,
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: he should have sent that to the journal science.
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think the USDA.
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: Maybe he could have gotten that. He's just sent that
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: to a peer reviewed.
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: So then you know, somebody should calls attention to the
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: fact that golf courses, municipalities, parks tremendous amount around up
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: as she used in the non ag sector. Incredibles, they're
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: labels for it either, they're not AG labels. So yeah,
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: I'm sure more of it she used in the fields,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: but a lot of it she used in municipal situations.
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: Since ron that subject, let's talk about I want to
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: ask you some questions about herbicides. Uh, just on the
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: thing of Ronald, I have one's had it. Tell me
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: a guy, tell me and you might be able to
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: tell me how true this is. That one roundup became available.
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: Its promise was that it was that it was less
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: toxic than coffee, absolutely, and someone saw me that you
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: that that that people would take a sip.
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: I've seen the Monsanto rip take a sip. Yes, okay,
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: so that's true in the early seventies. Y, yes, I.
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: Heard that was true. And that was the thing is
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: like if there was dangerous you know what, I do this.
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: Well, but nobody really worried about it being dangerous in
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: that era, but they would do it just to show
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: how safe and uh benign it was. Yeah, I remember it.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: You probably used it in your career quite a bit.
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: Oh yes, a lot. And we're not without gloves or
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: masks or goggles or any of the covering. It was
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: just a matter of fact. I was in the custom
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: spraying business for a period of time when I was
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: uber industrial spraying crops, and I had people hired to
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: sprayed round up another purposide and such as pecicide you
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: know what side means, right.
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: And fanticide, fracture, sideticide, homicide, kill kill, you know, we
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: ought to start besides the round up as I think
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: we should start with the history of you guys, your farm.
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: That probably be a smarter place to start because you
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: made a very deliberate You brought your family farm through
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: a very deliberate transition. Can you lay out the trajectory
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: of your family farm over time, sure, and how it
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: naturally evolved and how it evolved somewhat forcefully under your tenure.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: So my great grandfather came to that farm in early
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: County Georgia in eighteen sixty six and farmed it, followed
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: by his son, my grandfather, who farmed it. If they
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: would have farmed, we don't know too much about the
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: way they farmed, other than just anecdotal what people did
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: in those eras, but it would have been multi species
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: with a lot of certainly without dependence upon chemistry. My
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: dad took over the farm. He's born in nineteen twenty.
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: He took over the farm in nineteen forty five, after
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: the World War Two, and that was when farming really changed.
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: My dad was part of the leadership in our part
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: of the country that industrialized, commoditized, centralized agriculture. It was
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: very successful with it and went from a monoculture of
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: a lot of different species of plants and animals to
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: a monoculture of monoculture today of only cattle, coastal monoculture.
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: You're from with poly demono.
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: Poly demono. My great grandfather and grandfather would have had
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: a lot of species. So my dad ran the farm
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: all his career. I was born in nineteen fifty four,
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: went to the University of Georgia in nineteen seventy two,
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: major National science. My dad industrialized the farm. I came
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: home and further industrialized the farm and ran it that
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: way for twenty years, and it was financially comfortable in
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: the mid nineties for a number of reasons, I started
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: to rethink things pretty quickly and did, and for the
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: last twenty five years I've been running it in a
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: man of that without intentionally copying them. But a mound
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: that resembles what my great grandfather and grandfather did a
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: hell of a lot more than it resembles what my
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: dad and I did.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: What was the what was the trick? Like? What were
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: the things you were seeing on your family property that
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: that prompted you to rethink your approach to agriculture, and
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: it also you might as well define define your approach
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: to agriculture. I mean, we can say stuff like regenitive agriculture,
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: and to be honest with you, I hear that all
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: the time. It took me a long time to figure
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: out like kind of what it meant. And you, I've
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: even heard you. I was reviewing some of the talks
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: you've given and I've heard you say that you anticipate
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: that term being hijacked. Yeah, so that it'll become like
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: other catch other agricultural catchphrases that that have a sort
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: of that their meaning becomes diminished as it gets appropriated.
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: Today we call it regenerative. That has not been co
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: opted much yet. And to me, that means emulation of nature.
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: So the the natural cycles, the industrial agriculture that I
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: used to use running a monoculture of only cattle break
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: those cycles. I ran the farmers of monocultural cattle industry
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: for twenty something years and was financially comfortable. I got
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: dissatisfied with it when I came to see the damage
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: I was doing. The admission is that while I was
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: a very industrial cattleman, I always opted on the high side.
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: If the label rate said two c c's per hundred.
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: I probably gave them three secs per one hundred pounds
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: of body weight. I said, a paint to the acre.
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: I probably put a cort to the.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: And I guess mean like if one's good, two is better.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: One's good, towo's button threes really good. And it worked
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: for me. But because I was so heavy handed, I
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: came to see the unintended consequences and it kind of strangely,
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: it manifested itself. On the animal welfare side.
• 43:12
  Speaker 5: In.
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: Nineteen ninety five, I was loading a truck load of
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: cattle to ship to the west for feeding. We did
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: that a lot. These would have been five hundred pound caves,
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: so there would have been about one hundred album on
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: the truck. So they were going to be on that
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: truck going to Nebraska for thirty hours. It got Nebraska,
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: that's where these were going. Although that's not the only state.
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: We feds. That's where these were going. That was about
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: as far as we went. Took thirty hours to get
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: to Nebraska.
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: You're basically moving them to the corn exactly.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: It's cheaper to move the cows to the corn than
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: the corner of the cow. So they would have been
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: on the now for thirty hours with the ones on
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: top urinating and defecating on the world was on the bottom,
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: without food or water or rest. And I had done
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: it dozens of times, but all of a sudden that morning,
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: it just didn't feel good. So it made me start
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: thinking about all the things I was doing that were
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: financially working for me but needed rethinking, and the animal welfare,
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: which is that was an animal welfare issue, quickly led
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: me to the environmental side. I mean, it was just like,
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: if this is wrong, this is wrong. So I fairly
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: abruptly ceased using chemical fertilizers, pesticides on my farm, de wormas, antibiotics,
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: anosaors on the cows. I only had cattle at the
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: time and tried to make a living like that, and
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: it was not nearly as financially rewarded, but it felt
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: a lot better, and it started me on this journey
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: that I've been on for twenty five years, and it's
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: really been good for us in many ways. We probably
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: have not made as much money, probably left some money
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: on the table that we could have made if we'd
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: operated more industrially and within the system. But the land
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: is way butter off the livestock is way butter off.
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: I think we've got even more. It may not be
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: a more profitable business, but I think it's more resilient.
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: And two of my three daughters and their spouses came back,
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: and I'm pretty sure they would not had I continued
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: to farm industrially. So it's been way more good than bad.
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: They might not have been drawn to it.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: Oh, they would not have been. You know, I never
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: wanted to do anything but run that arm. But my
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: daughters were raised the way people raise children in the
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: eighties and nineties, and you know it was it was
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: about ballet and gymnastics and karate and soccer and softball.
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: And they they would not have come back to the farm.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: Uh, here's gonna give you a question about raising cattle.
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: I've picked up a handful bit. I know a little bit. Primarily,
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: I know stuff about raising cattle is from hunting on
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: people's farms and ranches. And you always go like, so,
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: what's that that you know? I have zero background and
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: egg I've just picked stuff up through exposure. When we
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: talk about the system, you've now you're now capturing the
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: entire system, meaning you've got Kyle's that will they'll be
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: bread and born on your farm and you'll sell the
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: burger at your start.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: And we have and we have a slaughter plant on
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: the floor as well.
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: That is yeah, you're running the whole damn deal vertically.
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: Drew.
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: Let's go back to when when you were a boy.
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: Tell me what portion of that process you were capturing
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: as a boy, just so people can see a little
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: bit of this. What portion of a cole's life were
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: you in charge of as a boy, And then what
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: portion are you guys doing now at waite Oat pastures.
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: My dad and later me had mama cows only that's
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: the only uh crop we produced was cattle. We had
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: mama cows. We bred them initially naturally, later on through
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: artificial insemination, we gave birth to the cavs and we
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: weaned them at about six months of age and shipped
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: them through the feed lot area like we just discussed.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: And then now talk about the transformation you've had just
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: just in just in terms of cattle, because just.
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: In terms of cattle, we we've gone from being a
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: little snippet in the huge beef production system to be
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: in a tiny, tiny, little beef production system. We own
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: the mama cows. We have the caws. We finish the
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: caves on grass only grass, hey before no corn, and
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: then we slaughter them and then we sell them. We
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: sell them some wholesale to grossers, some through our little store.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: We've got a little restaurant.
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: And then you're just selling cook product too.
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: We know it's small. Yeah, well it's it's three meals
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: a day, seven days a week, but we don't feed
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: that many people.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's you know, we're but it's possible to for
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: a person to go and eat a burger.
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: It's probably probably probably.
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: We're we gotta eat a burger that was produced right there.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we got one hundred and seventy employployees and it's
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: twelve miles to the nearest place to eat, and it's
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: a fast food place. So we you know, I put
• 49:08
  Speaker 2: in the food service to feed my employees, but we've
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: expanded it. It's not big, but we do cook twenty
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: one meals a week and it's good.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: What the economics change completely? Right?
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, And I went back and looked. I
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: never from the time I graduated at University of Georgia
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy six until I started changing the way
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: we raised cattle in nineteen ninety five. I never lost money.
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: I paid taxes every year. Now we didn't make we
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: didn't make a hell of a lot of money, but
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: we lived comfortably. They were consistently profitable. I had a
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: number of years of losses when I was transitioning over,
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: and I was very fortunate. I had inherited a nice
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: paid for a farm, and made a little money my own.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: So we were able to survive it. But we had
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: to survive it.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: Now, what do you guys do talk about how you compost?
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: I understand it's be true for your book, do you guys?
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: Instead of sending ship off to a rendering plant, you guys,
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: are you guys are handling that too?
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah? We are, Yeah, so we generally.
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: How does that even? How does that work? I mean
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: I could picture dragging it out, letting it rode.
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: You wouldn't do that, Yeah, But.
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: I mean I don't picture even I can't. I don't
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: picture what it even like composting a carcass.
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: It's very different. So well, of course, well there are
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: some whole carcasses, because when we have death loss, we
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: compost them too, But most of it is packing plant waste.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: That's what USDA calls it. That would be a viscert, hooves, feathers,
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: gut fill, whatever's not marketable, skulls, central nervous system tissue
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: which we can't harvest. It's got brain spin core. So
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: but we generated about nine tons of day, five days
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: a week, and we compost it.
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: We nine tons a day.
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that sounds like a lot.
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: Pick up a cow stomach. Well yeah, and.
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: It's a lot of moisture. I mean there's as far
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: as dry material, it's probably eighty percent moisture. I see,
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: you got to deal with it. But that's so we
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: do compost. Composting is taking a nitrogenous material animal weight
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: remains and a carbaceous material in our case to be
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: peanut shells or wood chips or whatever people give us.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: That's not homeowners but you know the asplunt or the
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: peanut shelling plants and their rules.
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: You go and you say, you mean the treat the
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: big power line tree company, Yeah, Asplin and I know
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: that outfit.
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they they dump those wood chips. We make it
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: available not for anybody, but for people that we trust
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: to dump carbaceous material via.
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: I tell you quick little side tidbit about ask So
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: you know they do those big power line gas line projects.
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: I used to sell firewood and when they would go
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: through a big land owner, I'd go in there and
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: broke or deal to get all that. I'd sell all
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: that shit.
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: That's that's the same thing I do.
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: Like mostly cut up and I would go in there
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: and bucket into the sixteen inch lengths and split it
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: and sell it, and people be glad I did it.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad I found them too. And there are
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: ratios of not try material and carbaceous material that you mix.
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: They are rules you go by. You We have a
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: thermometer with a five foot handle, probe on it. We
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: stick in there or my guys sticking.
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: Are you grinding up the cow?
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: Not anymore? I used to I have a grinder, but
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: we said we struggle to keep it going. And really,
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: except for the bones, uh, it's it's this. It comes apart.
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: The bones become very porous. I should tell you this.
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: It takes six to seven weeks to compost that animal material,
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: but it has been recommended to us that we let
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: it sit for a year. If you let it sit
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: a year, the compost becomes less bacterial and more fungal
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: and it's better for the land. So we let it
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: sit a year, and not only does it become more
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: fungal and it's better fertilizer, but those bones become porous.
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: You got you gotta give it to me, like you
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: gotta give this like you're you're like like you're gone
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: out of town and you're explaining to me on the
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: phone what I need to do.
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: Okay, So my guys put the carbaceous material peanut shells
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: or wood chips into long windows. Okay on the surface,
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: not no, no, on the surface okay. And by the way,
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: we move this operation around the farm. You don't want
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: to sit in one place too long. I fear it
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: might be too much at some point, so we move
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: it around every year or so. But we uh uh.
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: The animal material goes onto a little dump truck right
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: out of the plant or right out of the plant
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: every every day, maybe twice a day, at least once
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: a day, and they'll take it up to the composting
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: area wherever that happens to be right then, and they'll
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: take a big caterpillar front end loader and build kind
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: of a bed of the carbaceous material to back the
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: truck up and dump it in so it's dumped on
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: twenty four inches of carbaceous.
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: Material, peanut shells, wood chips.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: Got it. They dump it. Then they cover it up
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: with more of the same again, eighteen twenty four inches.
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: And here's a little fun fact. If we do a
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: good job covering it up, you never smell it and
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: you never see buzzards or vulses.
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: What's my next question, My next question, it's gonna be
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: about buzz.
• 55:40
  Speaker 2: All right, So let me tell you. Sometimes something happens,
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: you know, the load is thrown up or whatever, and
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: we just can't get it covered up as quickly as
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: we want to. When that happens, you can see those vultures,
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: either red headed or black headed, just stacking up there.
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: So we we keep it covered, which.
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: We do, and that's and then you let it sit
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: a year.
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: Well you've got to you've got to mechanically stir it
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: and take temperatures and record the temperatures. But as long
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: as we do that in six eight weeks, it will
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: become posted. And then we let it sit a year.
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: We pile it up and let it sit for a year.
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: Then we spread it on our pastures. I've got a
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: spread truck with a forty eight inch bedchain so big
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: bones can come out of the back of it. We
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: put two tons to the acre and it is seriously
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: where it's magic is good. You're feeding the micro You're
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: feeding the mic That compost is feeding the microbes and
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: the soil. This is important. It's feeding the plant that
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: feeds the animal. It's turned into feces or put back
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: through the plant. So it's like magic.
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: When something has gone through the process of being composted
• 57:14
  Speaker 4: in those first six weeks, exactly what happens. It goes
• 57:18
  Speaker 4: from what to what.
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: It goes from guts and wood chips to compost, which
• 57:29
  Speaker 2: is a stable not hot anymore, stable maistubsorbing plant food
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: that contains nitrogen and phosphorus and potassium and in this
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: case a lot of phosphorus and calcium because of the bones.
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's what is supposed to happen. You know,
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: the buffalo dies and rots and it grows grass.
• 58:00
  Speaker 7: What are the what are the temperatures you're getting in
• 58:03
  Speaker 7: those piles as it's working.
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, one hundred and fifty degrees and if it's not,
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: if it's not hot enough, they stir it and oxygenate it.
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: Take the front end the load on. They make some
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: really great, expensive machines that do that. I love to
• 58:18
  Speaker 2: have one. I ain't got one.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: But does that does that process costing you money or
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: saving you money?
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: Which pile is bigger?
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: Yes? No, Well it's the right thing to do for
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: a lot of reasons. Sure.
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: No, I love it. I mean I love it like
• 58:36
  Speaker 1: just as a non farmer. I love the sounds of it.
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: I'm just curious, like, is it like a is it
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: a cost sink or is it a great way to fertilize.
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: It's a great way to fertilize. It costs money. We've
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: got some equipment and a couple of guys you know,
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: dedicated to it, and that has a cost. But the
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: uh plant, fertility, land, fertility that I get out of it,
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: you can't even you can't whe you couldn't afford to
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: buy it. God, it's wonderful, it's great our. We can
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: talk about this later. But the organic matter in my
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: soil on my farm has gone from a half a
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: percent over five percent, ten x more carbon in the soil,
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: and that no shit, I think, no shit, I think
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: there is some shit.
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: When's when do you think that? Okay, let's say we
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: knew that that if you went back to if you
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: went back to nineteen twenty three, Okay, so we go
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: back a century. Yeah, you think that it might have
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: been around five.
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean, that's a great question. I've
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: asked some people, but I don't know anybody that was
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: doing much carbon sampling in nineteen twenty thing. I guess somebody.
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: You would need a thought to look right.
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: Somebody's something we're probably who knows, But the practices that
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: my dad and I did, the tillage and use of
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: nitrogen fertilizer, maybe pesticized. I don't know if it affects
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: it much, but certainly tillagen, use of nitrogen fertilizer burns
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: up carbon in the soil, just just makes it go away.
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: So when you've got soil that's a half a percent
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: organic model, which is what mine had gotten to, it's
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: a dead mineral medium. So let me tell you this
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: one percent organic model I'm told will ab solve a
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: one inch rain event. So on an acre land, a
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: one inch rain event, it's twenty seven thousand gallons of water.
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 2: So my farm now will absorb I believe five times
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: twenty something five percent organic amount of times twenty seven
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: thousand cows. That's a lot of water, and we get
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: a lot of water. I'm in, Uh, I'm about eighty
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: miles from the Gulf of Mexico. You know. We get
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: fifty two inches a year, and a lot of it's
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: in big rain events. Not unusually have a five inch rain,
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: but I got five percent organic model. That don't mean
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: it all soaks in because it comes too fast, but
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: if it came slowly enough, we'd absorb it all.
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 5: And the benefits of that compared to soil that's minerally,
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: that pretty much what just like sifts through water and now.
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: The water just percolects. You know. I'm in the Gulf Coast,
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: the Gulf Coastal region, which is an ancient seabed, so
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: the soil is pretty sandy compared to what you've got here,
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: and just it won't hold the water and it doesn't
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: have the minerals. We're putting a lot of minerals out
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: there because of all that, the bones and whatnot. It's
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: one of the uh, the best things I ever stumbled onto.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 9: You know.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 2: We we when I first built the slaughter plant, getting
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 2: rid of a viscilant and animal waste was a problem,
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: and we had to pay somebody to come get it,
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: and I didn't have a big enough plant for them
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: to come every day. That meant I was going to
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 2: have to refrigerate it. They just had a lot of problems.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: Were you were refrigerating that stuff?
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: No, No, I never did. I was going to have
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: to got it the people do refrigerated. Of course. It
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: takes a lot of room and it's nasty, you know,
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: it's it's a lot of it's not the actual blood
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: is not in it. We drained the blood separately, which
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: we also use is fertilizer, but it's it's different. But
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of manure, a lot of fresh flesh,
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: and a lot of it's just there's just still blood
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: in the cars.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: Uh walk me through moving just from beef production into
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: producing poultry and other red meats. Was that because he
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: thought it'd be fun or did you need to do
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: that to try to hit the same finances like you could?
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: You couldn't make it work.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: With beef b so, but it wasn't just financial, I
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: mean it was it was certainly financially. Everything I do
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: is financial because I got to make it work. But
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: when I changed from the industrial production model that I
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: was deeply entrenched in to this model that I'm in now.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: I didn't realize I was gonna have to add other species,
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: but I did. Yeah. I started having weeds that I
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: you know I was previously. I sprayed it with grays
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: on p n T, which is another herbicide that we
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: didn't talk about. Uh, I had insects. I sprayed it.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: You know. I used all the sides.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: To just get what you wanted out of the land
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: and nothing else.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. So what we probably will talk
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: about eventually here is monocultural production. Monocultural production is bad.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: It's what modern food production is based on. But nature
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: are bores of monoculture. I mean, I don't believe you've
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: been all over the world. I don't believe you can
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 2: name an ecosystem of the world that's a monoculture. I
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: don't think it exists in nature. You know, nature wants
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 2: a smallish board of animals and plants and microbes living
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 2: in symbiotic relationships with each other, and that's what we
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: try to do. But I didn't know that back then.
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: So I was going to have I was going to
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 2: continue my monoculture of cattle. I was just going to
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 2: give up those technical tools that I keep naming, and
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: I found out that I couldn't do it. You know,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: the weeds came and smothered my grass. First of all,
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 2: the grass that I planted was Tifton eighty five permuta grass,
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: which is a super hybrid permuta grass bred by the
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: University of Georgia that requires incredible amounts of nitrogen to live. Now,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: it grows like crazy. It just takes a lot of nitrogen.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: And when I quit putting chemical nitrogen out there, I
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: started losing that stand you know that trall. Yeah, and
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: then all kinds of crap came. And instead of using
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: grays on P and D to take to kill the crap,
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't have that anymore. So we added
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: sheep and goats, which are ruminants like cap.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Because you needed something to eat all that jont correct and.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 2: The later I added poultry and it was poetry is tough.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 2: Now we're struggling with poultry. I'm not sure how that's
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: gonna work out.
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: But we uh, what's tough about poultry being able to
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: charge enough to make it worthwhile?
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah? That so my beef probably cost about thirty percent
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: more than industrial beef. We could argue about it, but
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 2: that's close. My poultry probably costs three hundred percent more
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: than industrial poultry.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: Because when we the smaller the specie, the more handilyd
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 2: lent itself to industrialization. So when we industrialize cattle, which
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: my dad was part of that movement, put them in
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: big hundred thousand head feed lots. He never had a
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: hundred thousand head, but they do. He had a five
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: hundred head field. Put them in those feed lots and uh,
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: you know, and and take cost out of production. So
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 2: we poultry, they're so small they lent themselves to that industrialization.
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: You can put thirty thousand of them in a chicken
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 2: house and one guy can probably handle x chicken houses
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: because it's highly mechanized. So we just took so much cost.
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: I was in Bold of Colorado, had the Boulder Rama
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: Hotel years ago, the Boulder Rama, and I say, it's
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 2: something like that. This is the Cowboy Hotel there comber
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 2: Landmark and I ate supper now. And I had just
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: built my poultry business and spent a million million point something.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna put something million dollars on the processing plant,
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: and it wasn't working financially, and I was worried about it.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 2: And I was waiting on my waiting on bringing my supper. Y'all,
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: don we eat supper?
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: No, I grew up eating supper. Now I had listen, man,
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: I had to make a decision when I started college.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: I had to train myself to stop saying supper. Because
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: I noticed that no one said that.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: We have a different I had to be like, we
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 2: had the same college experience, we had different decisions. I
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 2: went to the University of Georgia with a bunch of
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 2: my buddies. I mean just seemed as soon as we
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 2: got there, they say, hey, you guys want dinner. What
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 2: happened to y'all won't supper? So I doug a little deeper.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: It's so funny. I don't know, man, I grew up
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: in a weird little supper corner of the Did you
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: guys say dinner? Supper? We did not say dinner.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 4: We said, but Midwest, there's supper. It can't be that.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 1: We do it.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: We do it noon every day.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: So we DIVI didn't do that. We had breakfast, lunch,
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: and then you have supper. What's what supper time, breakfast
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: still supper.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 4: Was Have you ever had lunch?
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: I didn't like it.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 4: At what point in your life did you realize that
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 4: there's this other thing called lunch was the same thing
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: as dinner for you?
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: I mean, I could reading write, I knew what he
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: was talking about. I I talked real slow, I think
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: pretty slow, but I put that dunel thing because so anyway,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 2: I lost my trader thor.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: You were you were had just spent at one point
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: something milly plates and you had ordered up some poultry
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: in the restaurant, or no, you had ordered your dinner waiting.
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: On my something in the boulder. They had they had
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 2: a menus framed from like nineteen twenty three or something.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 2: I got a picture somewhere in my phone and it
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 2: said beef plate, beef dinner privately, Uh, ninety nine cent
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: pork dummer nine and nine cent chicken dinner A dollar
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: thirty cents.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: So you know, at some point in time, before.
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: We industrialize, we took all the costs out.
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: But now now that would say thirty nine dollars, yeah,
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 1: thirty seven dollars, nineteen.
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: Dollars yeah, right, something like that, so we uh, anyway,
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 2: that's uh. We we we struggle with poetry.
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: So that was like when you saw that thing, though,
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: it hit you something about the eye of wackedness of
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: where we've gotten with cheap poultry.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 2: I would say, shit, I wish I hadn't done that.
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: I wish I hadn't built it. I wish I hadn't
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: built that plant. And you know we're fixing do We
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 2: were cutting back on our poetry because we have lost
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: so much money. I still want to do it, but
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure how it's going to look.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: So you haven't turned it around.
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 4: And you can't find a market that will that will
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 4: pay enough to keep it going.
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: Not on enough birds. I'll tell something else. I don't
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: think I'm a very good poetry farmer. I'm a I'm
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: a I'm a really good beef guy. You know when
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 2: I got when I when I moved from beef to sheep,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: that was the first specie I bought. I said, you know,
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: they just like little cows. I can't do that. They're
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: not like little cows. But it's hard. So then, you know,
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: but we got reasons for good and hired some people
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: to help us. Then they got ready to put goats
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: out of there, because you know, goats and sheep are
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 2: both small ruminates. But sheep eat forbes, goats eat scrub.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 2: For the most part, you need both of them. I
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: got goats, I said, you know, I've learned how to
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 2: run sheep. I can run goats. So then we got
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 2: birds and I don't know how to do that, and hogs.
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 2: I didn't know how to do that, and I'm still not.
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: I don't think I'm real good at it.
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 1: But is the hogs making money?
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, the hogs are making money.
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 1: Is goats making money?
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, yes, let me see, you know. And the
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: reason I'm the reason I'm that says yes. But the
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: reason I'm not saying hell yeah is we you know,
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: in a in a farm like hours, where everything is
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: integrated and working together, it's really hard to identify a
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 2: single line. So let's let's talk about the difference in
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 2: linear and cyclical. We do that. Yeah, most businesses are
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 2: very linear. You're just next, next, next, next. A farm
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: is meant to be cyclical. It's close to nature. You know,
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: the inputs it's spent, It goes around and around the
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: waste stream coming off of a cyclical business like a farm,
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 2: it's a very small hour. But the complexity of it
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: is it's really hard to know. So I told you
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 2: I'm losing a lot of money on poultry, and I
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: am don't believe it. Talking of my accountant, but he's
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 2: not accounting for the additional fertility that birdman you puts
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 2: out all the feathers and carcasses. That I that that's
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 2: an extra income stream that's not showing up on my financials.
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: So it gets very difficult. You know, there are reasons.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 2: There are a lot of of cyclical farms that are
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: on the Stock Exchange. It's so it's you know, it
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 2: doesn't manifest itself in monthly reports or quarter the reports
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: or annual reports. It manifests yourself generationally.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 1: Help me understand that.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: Say that again, so most linear businesses, uh, you know,
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: you can pull a monthly report or quarter the reporter
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 2: now you're report and get a pretty good indicator of
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 2: how your business is doing financially. Can I understand I'm
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: saying in a farm, I may show I'm losing money,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 2: but if I'm moving it from a half cent organic
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: model to five percent organic model, it's not on there. Yeah,
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 2: if my herd went from being uh, where you probably
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 2: could report the numbers. I don't, but you could, But
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: the productivity of your herd doesn't show up on that.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: I understand.
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 1: I can just that all that stuff's not getting capture.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 1: You're rehabilitating the landscape future generations. That's not showing up
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: in your quarterly.
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 2: Report, and it manifests itself as wealth generationally. We we
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: we got a little management team. I used to run
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 2: that farm absolutely autonomous, just me, and as it grew,
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: we've we've brought other people in management, and we have
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: a meeting once a week Thursday afternoon my office, and
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: we talk about things we want to do. And it
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: never pays off in the month, a quarter, or a year.
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 2: It's all very long term, very generational. I love that,
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 2: but it's very problematic.
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: Since you're selling all the stuff that you produce, and
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: you know how many acres you got, you kind of have.
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: A rare.
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 1: And I know this goes against a little bit of
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 1: what you're just saying that you don't do a quarterly report,
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 1: but you probably wind up with a kind of rare
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 1: glimpse for an egg producer into this acreage spins off
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 1: this many dollars worth of food because it doesn't get
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 1: lost in some broader equation, meaning if you grow corn
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 1: and you're selling corn for ethnol, you're selling corn for feed,
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 1: You're never you would never answer the question like, oh no,
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 1: my corn helped produce x gallons of ethanol gasoline, and
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 1: my corn helped produce x pounds of beef down the road.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 1: But at the end of the year, you you know,
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 1: like like you know how many dollars worth, how many units?
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 1: However the hell you want to measure it? You know
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: what came off that place?
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: You know we do, and we know that we got that,
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 2: we got, I gotta, I got.
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's got to be an interesting number. Do
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 1: you does that number? Does that ratio as you've become
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: better and learned this has that like dollars of off
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: put per acre of land? Have you gotten better at it?
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, a lot better. And I can I mean,
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 2: I don't even need to look at those finacials. I
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 2: can tell that riding around in my jeep. I mean
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 2: it looks better. I mean, I mean I can, I
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 2: mean it looks better.
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 1: Years ago, I was with my friend Kevin Murphy down
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 1: in Kentucky and we were driving around hunting cottontail rabbits,
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: and he was telling me it was gonna be a
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: good day at hunting because we were going to an
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: Amish farm. And he said, that's where the game is at.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: The game is on the Amish farm. And he pointed
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 1: to a number of farming practices. And this is gonna
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 1: sound like horror. I don't mean, you know, it's gonna
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 1: sound like I'm generalizing. He had a call. You just
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: got there. Looked different. He's like, their practices are different,
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 1: the equipment uses different, the philosophy is different. They're they're
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 1: they're hell on predators, they have dirty fence rows. It's
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: just different. And you go there and and all the
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: time running around, man, the only quail we saw.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: Heck yeah, was on that Armish farm.
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 1: And he'd point around and be like that, that that.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: But you just knew when you got there, You're like, wow,
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 1: it is a different looking for so absolutely yeah, because
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: you'll have the vocabulary for it.
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 2: Well, so there are One of the most beneficial creatures
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 2: on my farm is a dung beetle. It's a beetle
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 2: that is flighted beetle that is drawn to fresh manure,
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: particular calmnure, and when the dung beetle gets there, it
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 2: somehow gathers the most nutrient dense part of the feces,
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: and that fresh always went as fresh. If it's been
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 2: there a while, they don't go to it. And it
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: digs a vertical eighteen inch shaft into the ground about
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: as big as that pencil, and the dirt comes up
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: in the top of the menu and it packs. It
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: lays its eggs in the bottom and packs that tunnel
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 2: with the most nutrient rich part of at manure.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 1: I know the animal, but I didn't know they did that.
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: Oh man, it's wonderful.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 1: I can pay someone to do that.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 2: Well, guess what I said. We saw dunge beatles when
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 2: I was a kid. I didn't see them anymore. There
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: was a few give cattle wormer to kill the worms
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: in the system. It's toxic to the dung beetle when
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 2: they lay the eggs and the feces. No kidding, really,
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 2: So when I saw dung beetles, I can I know
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: right where I was. I was driving along. I saw
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 2: that dirt at the top of that fresh cavity, and
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: I slammed on brakes and backed up, and it was
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 2: dung beleaedles. I got you. Yeah, and now I got
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 2: a lot of them, and it stratify.
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 1: It keeps thee because uh sorry about that, it keeps
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: the nutrients from stratifying.
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 2: You're just being on the top with the manua goes
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: the water can go down in those holes. I mean,
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: it's just and the horn flies and face flies, which
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 2: are a horrible blood sucking insect for cattle raised in
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: that fresh cattle manule. That's where they leave their eggs too.
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: When they those dung beetles aerate it, you don't get
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: the horn flies the face flies production. So it's like
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: it's like a gift from God in terms of insect control, fertility,
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: land management. We killed them and spent money to buy
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 2: cattle worma to kill them, and and list goes on.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 2: And there's dozens of technology products that I spent money
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: for that that did more harm than good. You know.
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 2: That's that's the way I really think that's the way
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 2: that works in higher culture. I'm not speaking out of
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 2: the other areas. I got it. I had the first
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: drum of anybody I know, and we don't know about
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 2: our either third or fourth one. I love. I'm not
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 2: opposed to technology. That's a good cell phone. I flew
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 2: down there because I kept beeping. I love I mean,
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 2: I love technology, but technology in a complex system does
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 2: not work well. In a complicated system that works great.
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 2: So we have to very judiciously decide.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 1: Uh, when you moved away from de Warmer? Did you
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 1: move away from you? Don't do any kind of hormones
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: on here? We're don't And that was the That was
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: the implant hormone, right.
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, mostly there are a number of them, but the
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: most common one goes in the skin behind the ear
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 2: and it slowly releases over about a used to be
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: one hundred days. I ain't used it for a long time.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 2: I don't know what you got now, Jude.
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: I got more and more friends doing that. Man, you
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 1: don't do that too it would you do it?
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 2: I did do it for a year.
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 1: You and you they do it in their butt. No,
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 1: you know you guys know about this.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 4: No, I can guess who you've been hanging out with.
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 1: I'll tell you who later. He's he's really on the
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 1: fence about it because he's got friends.
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 2: What look like I do.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: He's got friends, and there's a lot of he's got friends.
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of guys that are getting a little capsule.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 1: You cut the skin on your butt and you put
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 1: this little capsule in there, and then and then you're
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 1: you're and then you're and then you're like you know, you're,
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 1: you're whatever. You're more of a superman.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: This this this, I hope this doesn't take too long.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: I'll try to make this short.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: But you wouldn't do that.
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 2: I would. Hell, I went to university. But I'll tell
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 2: you this. When I was at University of Georgia in
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 2: the seventies, uh, steroids which just just a rumor, and
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 2: I heard about them, and I told my guy that
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 2: I thought Mike could get me some steroids, give me
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: some of that for you. Yeah, And he didn't. But
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: I happened to have reproductive physiology that quarter. There's a
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: quarter system back then. And one of the things we
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 2: did is we had one hundred mail chicks, little yellow chicks.
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 2: You have to have them sack. Somebody got it to
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: notice what they're doing. These were males and we divided
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 2: them up into ten little pens. It was not going
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 2: out of my welfare. And every day for that quarter,
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: somebody had to inject all one hundred. You signed up.
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: You know, I'll take these days and you take those days.
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: And we didn't know what we were giving them. All
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 2: of them got the same dosage of whatever was on
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 2: that bottom on top of their pen. And at the
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 2: end of the quarter we killed them and dissected them
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: and weighed their test and I was really starting to
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: want some steroids because those on the end they had
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 2: a you know, the comb that dropped off. Oh yeah,
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 2: and when you when you'd opened, when you open the pin, they.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: Come at you on the other end, souped up chickens.
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they were just still a little yellow up. They
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 2: would run from you. Said, oh hell yeah, that's that steroid.
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna kick me some of that step. I can't wait.
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 2: So the last well, I hadn't got it yet. Last
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 2: day we killed them and dissected them, and those little
• 1:24:35
  Speaker 2: birds that run from you on that end, it was
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 2: different doses all the way up from zero to whatever.
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 2: The testicles that big, those down there, they had the
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 2: comb dripping down. I couldn't find them a little a
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 2: little little gobble fat that I guess must have been it.
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 1: So I told them, my guy, I don't want to
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 1: get into this too long. But There's a couple of
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 1: details I got to add in here about this is
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 1: the guys I know are post reproductive age. I caught
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 1: wind of this and I told my wife, I'm like, listen,
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 1: if these people that I know do this and they
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: can start smoking me up a hill, I'm gonna have
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 1: a hard time not doing it. Really, Yeah, I don't
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 1: want what I don't want to get smoked up going
• 1:25:24
  Speaker 1: up a hill.
• 1:25:25
  Speaker 5: Is this human growth horm? Is this steroids?
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 1: It's probably I could start gaming people, but I don't
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 1: want to name them. But if they can, if it
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 1: turns out that they went from me being able to
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 1: smoke them up a hill to them smoking me up
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 1: a hill, it's gonna be very hard for me to
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 1: stomach this.
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 4: A little way to go.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 2: Years old, How quick you get up at hell, you're
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 2: gonna wish all your stuff is still away.
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 1: There's there's a conversation often having my kids. My kids
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 1: will laugh about you know, we'll laugh about stuff like
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 1: my dadd used to love to tell the story that
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: when he was in the in the military, and you'd
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: get your c rations, there'd be three cigarettes in there, right,
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 1: and you talk about that, you'd be on a forest
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 1: march and they would call a cigarette break right, and
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 1: then you know, and we laugh now like, oh, how stupid.
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 1: And I'm always telling my kids, I'm like you right now, us,
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 1: right now, we are doing things right now, maybe some
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 1: things that we even think are good that your kids
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 1: will sit and laugh about. How in the world could
• 1:26:55
  Speaker 1: we have been so stupid?
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 2: Absolutely?
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: What are some of the things that you look at
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 1: in our agricultural practices? What are some of the things
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 1: that you look at in the one hundred years, I'll
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 1: be like, can you believe those idiots? Not only did
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 1: that mean?
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 2: I used to so I used to artificially or artificially
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: insumminate my cattle. I would buy a semen, pay for it,
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 2: and then put it in the in the cow when
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 2: she was in estras or heat. And the semen I
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: was buying were from these big, monster, non natural bulls.
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 2: They had a you know, their claim to fame is
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 2: they had a RUBI that big, And it was like
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 2: that was the only thing that mattered, you know, And
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 2: today you know I close. Not only do I not
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 2: buy semen anymore, I closed the herd. It's a I
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 2: don't bring animals in now. I saved my own bulls,
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: and I've been to that for ten years. The herd
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 2: is so much better. You know, we we put up
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 2: you know you may have I'll get these numbers confused.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 2: But a friend of mine had a herd of a
• 1:28:17
  Speaker 2: hundred and something one hundred and ten or something cows
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 2: that he artificially assimilated with different bulls, and he was
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 2: selling bull purebred bull calves. So he had to know
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 2: who the daddy was. I don't ever do. So he
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 2: take hair from the tailhead and send it off and
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 2: they genetically sex record tell who the bulls. And he
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 2: had done that with some natural breeding, put ten bulls
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 2: in with one hundred and twenty cows, and one bull
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 2: had like fifty six calves, one had twelve, and then
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 2: some four and ones and twos and c rood. Well,
• 1:29:12
  Speaker 2: now I want my in my herd. I want the
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 2: bullet got fifty six calves. I don't care if it's
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 2: real by it's this big or this big. I want
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 2: that libid that that you know that bull felt good.
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 2: He was eating well, he was a fishing. He had
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 2: it going on.
• 1:29:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's like on the mountain around the prairie or whatever.
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: At a time like you'd have.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 2: Been siren, Siren the buffalo herd or what. So you
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 2: know that I'm I'm telling that story and reference to
• 1:29:51
  Speaker 2: you about the silly things we do, and and there
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 2: are a bunch of others. But you know, just now
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 2: that was the wrong thing, ending money too, not improve
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 2: my herd.
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 1: So that's not so much an issue of that's not
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 1: so much an issue of AI. It's an issue of
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 1: the source for the semen.
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 2: Right. No, well, I mean, are those AI I've learned
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: as artificial intelligence when I when I was, it's always
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 2: been an artificial insemination to.
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 1: Me, Oh, I still think that's what it means. Good
• 1:30:28
  Speaker 1: for you.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 2: Younger than you must be.
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 1: But in the argument for it, though, the argument for
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: artificial insemination, as I understand it, you can crack me
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 1: on this. An argument for it is that you can synchronize, correct,
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 1: you can synchronize so that your cows are calving within
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 1: a very narrow window of time.
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 2: Those two shaparate things. So I'm confusing stuff. Okay, you know,
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's all right, I get it. But they
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 2: do use hormone implants to synchronize the cow. And but
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 2: they could they could still breed them naturally. That's a
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 2: separate shot that.
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah, so you can use a hormone to bring
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 1: them into estrous heat. Okay, so that you then because
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 1: they have the same the gestation period is pretty.
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 2: Fixed two eighty six ages.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: Okay, So you use a hormone to bring them in
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 1: at the same time, and then you can breed them
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 1: naturally or breed them with artificial essemination to make sure
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 1: that then you're when it comes to calving time, you
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 1: have a narrow window, a narrower window of calving time
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: and requires less of your attention to be around to
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 1: make sure everybody births out.
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 5: You also don't do that, right.
• 1:31:43
  Speaker 2: Don't so that and and you know it does everything
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 2: say is true, But mostly people do that so they
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 2: can put together the truck load of same size, same
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 2: sex cattle. Sex is that doesn't control sex, but you
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 2: and that doesn't mean anything to me because we slaughter
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 2: cows fIF to two weeks a year. Uhh.
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 1: So that, yeah, that's interesting. You've kind of pulled yourself
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 1: away from.
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 2: That need everything. We pulled ourself away from everything.
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 1: You don't need to have everybody on such and such
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 1: day always six hundred pounds.
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 2: Don't want it, don't want it. I want to have calves.
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 2: We were so we have a herd where we are
• 1:32:26
  Speaker 2: are finishing our animals on grass, and once a month
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: we shut that herd up and pull out everything visually
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: that we think is big enough ready to slaughter. And
• 1:32:39
  Speaker 2: that's how we do it. And I don't want to
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 2: have all of them one month and eleven months nothing
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 2: going on.
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 1: Does anybody hunt on your farm?
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah? I did an employees hunting. I was. I was
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 2: an avid hunter all my life. That that that and uh,
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 2: uh cease to do that when I got so involved
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: in my career and I still have employees at hunt.
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 1: Uh, that's funny mentioned that because I was like being
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 1: brought up, we hunted different farms in our community, and
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 1: my dad was it was just an explaining why. I mean,
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 1: at that time farmers did hunt. I mean they did
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 1: not hunt in our area. My Dad's like, the last
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 1: thing these people want to deal with is a dead animal.
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 1: It's like it's just like the last the end of
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: the day. And he went going have another dead thing,
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 1: you know what, You got to mess with it because
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 1: it's just not like a fun thing for him.
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: The way that worked in my community growing up here,
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 2: when when we were kids, we were avid hunters and
• 1:33:40
  Speaker 2: fishermen and trappers because that's what you did. My dad
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: didn't know how to play baseball. He wouldn't gonna be
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 2: able to tell me how to. You know, that wasn't
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 2: something to happen. So the way we kids spent our
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 2: time was and the television was a black and white
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 2: television by Dead Big and I'm gonna watch said. So
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: we hunted and fished and trapped, and at a certain age,
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 2: your daddy said you're coming with me tomorrow ten, twelve, fourteen.
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 2: Depends on the kid and the daddy. And then you
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 2: were working. And you know, I mean, it wasn't that
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 2: I didn't have time to hunt or fish. I did.
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: I just had my interests.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 1: And oh you mean when he said you're coming with me,
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 1: he meant working, Yeah, not hunting. Yeah, he's pulling you
• 1:34:30
  Speaker 1: off hunting. Correct, that's pulling you off of hunting and
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 1: fishing to get working.
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I could still have hunted and fish, but
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 2: by that time I wanted to run the farm. That
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 2: was that was my my goal.
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 1: When you look at yeah, I don't, I know, I
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: don't I'm not asked. I don't want to embarrass you,
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 1: but you've been public about how many acres you guys
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 1: have under control.
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 2: You sharing, No, we own about two thousand acres inherited
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 2: about thoules Makers. I bought about fowles Maker. We rent
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 2: a little over a thousand acres and then we graize
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 2: soul of otake or raise about two thousand acres, so
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 2: it's a little over five thousand acres total.
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 1: As you've gone through this process, and have you seen
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 1: what have you seen in terms of wildlife?
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 2: Yet?
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 1: You have the dung beetle example, but what have you
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 1: seen in terms of wildlife habitat? Does it wind up
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 1: decreasing because you need to use so much because you
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: found ways to use so much more of the landscape,
• 1:35:38
  Speaker 1: meaning your goats and cheap have replaced deer.
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: You know, that's a good that's a good question. And uh,
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 2: but the wildlife has increased. But the sportsman and you
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 2: it's not going to like this much. When you manage
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 2: for the benefit of a specie, you do so at
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 2: the detriment of the other species. Now, we don't see
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 2: many deer on our farm. A lot of them passed
• 1:36:08
  Speaker 2: through because it's open.
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 1:36:12
  Speaker 2: They they're on their way somewhere else. But there's a
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 2: tremendous amount of life on the farm. I started mentioning
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 2: this to you. I was I was driving down a
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 2: paved road that bisects my farm three four years ago.
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 2: And it wasn't late in the afternoon. I'm dusk, but
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 2: it wasn't raining. And I went through a place of
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 2: the road was wet. I said, what was that? And
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 2: I backed up and there were millions of little toad frogs,
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 2: I mean, fresh hatched toad frogs crossing the road. And
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 2: since then, I've seen that probably three for sure, or
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 2: two maybe three other times. And that is I hadn't
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 2: seen that since I was kid.
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 1: No, I can back up on this. That's changed everywhere.
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 1: And what I mean, I said, I can back up
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 1: on that. Like amphibians. Yeah, it's just changed.
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 2: But I got. What I'm saying is I got them. Yeah, No,
• 1:37:15
  Speaker 2: I'm with you here, and they've been calm in their back.
• 1:37:20
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 1:37:20
  Speaker 2: I was raised frog gigging and catching crawfish and you
• 1:37:23
  Speaker 2: know the other things. And the amphibians, you're right, Amphibians
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 2: like the canary and the coal mine to be indicator
• 1:37:31
  Speaker 2: that it ain't right, and they're back on my farm.
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 1: Of the side.
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 2: We had seventy eight bald eagles on my farm. They
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 2: were killing me. They were eating my chickens. And I mean,
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 2: I told you chickens has not been a good deal
• 1:37:51
  Speaker 2: of for us. That's not even counting this. But there
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 2: was seventy eight. That's the d n R guy made
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 2: that estimate. I don't know how you tel, but that's
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 2: what he said. There's a bunch of them and they
• 1:38:05
  Speaker 2: were about to put me hide the chick post pasture
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 2: poltry business.
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 1: And we are very because you got your chickens running
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 1: around out in the opening.
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I mean, and you know it's not like
• 1:38:17
  Speaker 2: an eagle would go in there and get a bird
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: and eat it. I don't I don't mind. It's like
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 2: tithe into nature, you do that. But they would land
• 1:38:27
  Speaker 2: and just kill and kill and kill and eat the
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 2: ain't us out and kill another one and eat the
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 2: ants and kill another one. So a very talented polstry
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 2: manager that I had hired figured it out and our
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 2: eagles losses went way down, so we u we fenced
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 2: them so I have guardian dogs h anatole and shepherds
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 2: and ockbosh and great Pyrenees and combinations there, and they
• 1:39:02
  Speaker 2: work great on nocturnal predation, but in the daytime they
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: go to the woods and go to sleep, and that's
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 2: when the eagles come. So my postry guy figured out
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 2: how to put up that electrified webbing around the Polsier
• 1:39:22
  Speaker 2: house so they can still get out, but they can't
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 2: the dogs. It wasn't to keep the chickens in, it's
• 1:39:28
  Speaker 2: keep the dog from going to the woods. And it
• 1:39:32
  Speaker 2: was it was. It was very effication.
• 1:39:34
  Speaker 1: He was fencing his dog, fencing the dogs.
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 2: Literally, and it worked worked very well. We still have
• 1:39:40
  Speaker 2: some eagles and some predation, but it's not debilitating the
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 2: way it was.
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 1: So, how tell me about the process of doing your book?
• 1:39:53
  Speaker 1: Did you write it?
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: Uh so uh the Mark Mark Gerald.
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 2: Contacted me about solicited writing a book about us.
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 1: Did he make you your proposal? All that?
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 2: He didn't? Hm, it's in honesty, h h he uh
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 2: we we. I talked to him the first time. I
• 1:40:26
  Speaker 2: told him, I said, I can't write a book, you know,
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 2: I just not the way that works. I had never
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 2: read many books, and he uh ultimately found a wonderful
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 2: person to write it in the lady name Amy Lee Grave,
• 1:40:41
  Speaker 2: and who her we fell in love with. She's a sweetheart.
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 2: She's by the same age as my daughters, and and
• 1:40:48
  Speaker 2: uh and my daughter got involved in it, and she
• 1:40:52
  Speaker 2: wanted the book, so she I worked for my daughter.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: So then you were able to start downloading all your knowledge.
• 1:40:59
  Speaker 2: And we had a phone call every Friday afternoon for
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 2: two three four hour phone call. And she's bread. You know,
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 2: she would have a list of questions. She started asking
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 2: her questions and she would challenge you. I say, I'd
• 1:41:16
  Speaker 2: be telling my story. Responded to whatever she could asked about.
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: And she said, wait a minute, you told me so,
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 2: and so I said, I say that on July fifth,
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 2: you told me.
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 7: Getting cross examined.
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I see that ain't the same thing I told you.
• 1:41:39
  Speaker 2: You know, it was different, you know, but she she,
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 2: you know, she when when I read the book, I
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 2: couldn't believe how right she got it. Yeah.
• 1:41:51
  Speaker 1: Well no, I mean it really. I mean it's like
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 1: it's like you're telling the stuff.
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 2: It's all my stuff.
• 1:41:57
  Speaker 1: But I should know if you needed someone to help
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 1: you with the organ Yeah.
• 1:42:02
  Speaker 2: That's back on that linear cyclical. Yeah, if I start
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 2: telling you a stir, I'm probably gonna get off on
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 2: something else. Probably we know, we'll we know, we'll finish
• 1:42:11
  Speaker 2: that one unless you remind me and that that that's
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 2: the way this would have been.
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 1: How many people come you know, because how many people
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 1: come to your place every day? Like if people are listening,
• 1:42:26
  Speaker 1: they just go it. If they're in Georgia, they just
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 1: go to your place right and tour and eat and
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 1: see everything.
• 1:42:35
  Speaker 2: We uh, we got an open gate policy that you
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 2: can go. We we do tours, we know, and I
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 2: really will them do that, but you know they can't.
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 2: You know, they show up thirty minutes after you did
• 1:42:48
  Speaker 2: a tour, and my daughters do and when they got
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 2: people that work with them, that do them, but they
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 2: we we let them go in. We got maps, We
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 2: give it to you. You go anywhere you want to
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 2: ask anything, you want to Well, you know we are
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 2: we're under so much competition of greenwashed product by big companies.
• 1:43:10
  Speaker 2: That transparency is that the soul We've got to use God, yeah,
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 2: short to him. You look at it. You know, well,
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 2: we'll ask you a question and sometime.
• 1:43:23
  Speaker 1: Meaning there's no like whatever terminology you can use to
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 1: describe to a consumer what it is you're doing. You're
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 1: going to see that terminology mimicked by someone who picks
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 1: up that word.
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 2: Absolutely. Let me give you an extreme example. I'll give you.
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 2: But uh, in this country, you can import grassfeed beef
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 2: from twenty other countries and label it product of the
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 2: USA legally on the package. If value is added here,
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 2: it's cut or wrapped or ground. Is that right? Yeah?
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 1: Man, if you want to put product of the USA
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 1: on a piece of sown fabric, I'm not sure. Shit's
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 1: a lot higher bar than that.
• 1:44:11
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm telling you the law got changed. I think
• 1:44:13
  Speaker 2: it was twenty fifteen. We were doing pretty good and
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 2: the law got changed, and the suddenly you know, we're
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 2: not doing so good anymore. Huh. We had a we
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 2: had a big wholesale customer last week that my daughter
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 2: was talking to and they had a I wasn't meeting
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 2: at a video meeting online. I mean they showed you know,
• 1:44:44
  Speaker 2: the stats on how much they've drown, and you customly
• 1:44:48
  Speaker 2: picked up this was this grocer, that grocer, the other grocer.
• 1:44:52
  Speaker 2: They got down to the plan said they're going to
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 2: buy the same amount of product from us. They bought
• 1:44:59
  Speaker 2: the previous year, and Jenny's it's pretty tough. She said,
• 1:45:04
  Speaker 2: wait a minute, you just showed all these new customers
• 1:45:07
  Speaker 2: you got you gonna buy the same amount of product.
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 2: Where are you getting it? Because there aren't that many
• 1:45:13
  Speaker 2: large grass fed beef producers left in this country. And
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 2: they didn't say anything, and she just sat there and waited.
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 2: She said, are you importing grass fed beef? And they
• 1:45:25
  Speaker 2: didn't say anything. And finally what I said, yeah, yeah, okay,
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 2: we import a little bit. So why hadn't we talked
• 1:45:34
  Speaker 2: about this before? And I can tell you the name.
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 1: Because they're chasing that name grass fed beef, well, not
• 1:45:42
  Speaker 1: chasing the implication, like what the implications are?
• 1:45:45
  Speaker 2: They let the assumption be it's American. They are in
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 2: America's got a very American name, headquartered in Texas. You know,
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 2: it's a very god him.
• 1:45:55
  Speaker 1: Do you do you do you worry that the whole
• 1:45:58
  Speaker 1: thing is gonna go could put some's gonna have to
• 1:46:00
  Speaker 1: go back the other traction?
• 1:46:01
  Speaker 2: It's going it, Yes, And I worry about it a lot.
• 1:46:07
  Speaker 2: And I really think we okay, I mean White Opa,
• 1:46:13
  Speaker 2: we've been doing it longer than the others. And we
• 1:46:16
  Speaker 2: started twenty five years ago. We sell twenty five million
• 1:46:19
  Speaker 2: dollars stuff a year. We're vertically integrated. We it could
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 2: we're not doing very well, but it's okay. We got
• 1:46:29
  Speaker 2: we got we got some debt, but we got a
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 2: lot of assets. And I think we gonna be okay.
• 1:46:35
  Speaker 2: I got friends and and people I care a lot about.
• 1:46:39
  Speaker 2: That it has not been okay, and that bothers me
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 2: a lot. I thought, not day one, Day one, I
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 2: just want to raise kays different. But at some point
• 1:46:52
  Speaker 2: in that journey, I came to believe that I was
• 1:46:57
  Speaker 2: an early innovator that was helping figure out a better
• 1:47:04
  Speaker 2: way to produce at least beef, maybe maybe meet in general,
• 1:47:08
  Speaker 2: at least beef. And I liked that. I wasn't living
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 2: for it, but I liked it. It's not it hadn't
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 2: worked out that way the and and I had I changed.
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 2: I went from I've never been a sales when, I've
• 1:47:23
  Speaker 2: never tried to talk people into changing up. But if
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 2: somebody came to see me and said I'm thinking about
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 2: going to the grass fed beef business, I said, get
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 2: in the jeep, come on, I show you something, and
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 2: I show them and kind of promote it, and I consciously,
• 1:47:39
  Speaker 2: consciously made the decision. I got quit doing that because
• 1:47:43
  Speaker 2: the people got in trouble and then it could happen
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 2: with us. But we're in you know, I mean, I
• 1:47:51
  Speaker 2: think we'll be all right now. Enough enough, I allowed
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 2: two daughters to come back and have babies on the farm,
• 1:47:55
  Speaker 2: so I thought, you know, you know, if you're in
• 1:47:58
  Speaker 2: business for yourself, you never I know this is gonna
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 2: be fine. That doesn't how you know.
• 1:48:03
  Speaker 1: The sad part is there'd be a bunch of people
• 1:48:09
  Speaker 1: happy if it didn't work, because they're sitting there and
• 1:48:14
  Speaker 1: it's like, man, this is kind of challenging that here
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 1: he is talking about a bunch of stuff I'd rather
• 1:48:20
  Speaker 1: not talk about drawn making us, you know, people questioning assumptions,
• 1:48:26
  Speaker 1: and then if it didn't work, they'd be like, ah, good,
• 1:48:28
  Speaker 1: you're right, because that was getting uncomfortable.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 2: And of course, of course, the you know, the large
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 2: multi national meat processes are so big and so powerful,
• 1:48:42
  Speaker 2: and we're they're not worried about how much I sell.
• 1:48:46
  Speaker 2: They spill more than I sell, ye, but they don't
• 1:48:49
  Speaker 2: want people asking the questions. And we talk a lot
• 1:48:52
  Speaker 2: about how we do it. It just be better than
• 1:48:55
  Speaker 2: I talk about that so, and they've done such a
• 1:48:58
  Speaker 2: great job again that group. The term green washing, I
• 1:49:02
  Speaker 2: didn't come up with it, but I used it a
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 2: lot because it very accurately depicts what happens in the market.
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 1: Police years ago, I had a we were interviewing a
• 1:49:15
  Speaker 1: bison producer, and that's kind of a in the West,
• 1:49:20
  Speaker 1: that's a little bit of a touchy subject, like beef
• 1:49:23
  Speaker 1: versus bison. And they're talking. He's talking about a lot
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 1: of the heat they get, you know, the cattle and
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 1: the things. And he had an interesting statistic where he's like, man,
• 1:49:38
  Speaker 1: there's two million cows in this state. I got four
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 1: thousand buffalo. But the amount of the focus out that
• 1:49:49
  Speaker 1: is f Like, let's just look at the numbers for
• 1:49:51
  Speaker 1: a minute here.
• 1:49:52
  Speaker 2: I don't have that prejudice, but I got I got
• 1:49:56
  Speaker 2: one hundred and fifty something miles of fence on my
• 1:49:59
  Speaker 2: farm because we got it cross fenced into the thirty
• 1:50:02
  Speaker 2: acre paddocks. It's not just and uh when and I
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 2: used to be the president of the American Grassfeld Association
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 2: way back a long time ago, and the bison producers
• 1:50:14
  Speaker 2: in there, and those poor folks couldn't hardly give away bison.
• 1:50:19
  Speaker 2: But I started tess one tile of grill and seeing
• 1:50:22
  Speaker 2: other things, said, you know, I believe this bison thing
• 1:50:24
  Speaker 2: might might be all right. And I was adding those
• 1:50:27
  Speaker 2: other species. I said, maybe I'll add bison. So it's
• 1:50:32
  Speaker 2: a guy in Alabama had a herd of bison he
• 1:50:35
  Speaker 2: wanted to sell. I rode up there by myself one
• 1:50:38
  Speaker 2: Sunday afternoon, and I didn't want to talk to him.
• 1:50:41
  Speaker 2: I want to look at him. And I start there
• 1:50:44
  Speaker 2: and looked at those bison and I looked at that fency.
• 1:50:50
  Speaker 1: Looked like something from a prison.
• 1:50:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and uh, I said, you know, I'm too old
• 1:50:57
  Speaker 2: to start building one hundred and fifty something mile. I
• 1:51:03
  Speaker 2: still I still win it from the first time I
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 2: built it. I can't start by again. You never reminded
• 1:51:10
  Speaker 2: me of going seeing Daddy.
• 1:51:13
  Speaker 1: Really well, man, I do uh one. I hope your
• 1:51:18
  Speaker 1: book does good. A bold return. Make sure I get
• 1:51:22
  Speaker 1: a bolder I want to get the subtitle Bolder Turn
• 1:51:24
  Speaker 1: to giving a damn One Farm. Six Generations in the
• 1:51:27
  Speaker 1: Future of Food by Will Harris from White Oak Pastures.
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 1: I hope your book does good. It's really it's really interesting.
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 1: It's a it's an interesting informative read from someone who
• 1:51:41
  Speaker 1: observes agg agriculture from the outside. And that's me, right,
• 1:51:48
  Speaker 1: Like I spent a lot of time on farms and ranches,
• 1:51:50
  Speaker 1: have friends at farm and ranch, but I didn't. That's
• 1:51:53
  Speaker 1: not how I grew up. I just grew up in
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 1: proximity to it. So there's always more to learn, I
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 1: think from a perspective of Obviously, consumers, you know, uh,
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 1: we catch or shoot all the meat weed, but most
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 1: people in this country buy meat. So it's a great
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 1: window into what you're buying the history of what you're buying,
• 1:52:15
  Speaker 1: what you're paying for when you buy it. Reading the
• 1:52:21
  Speaker 1: book too, just when you're driving down the road and
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 1: you're looking out the window and you're driving through farm country,
• 1:52:26
  Speaker 1: you'll be like, oh, that's why that's that way. It's
• 1:52:29
  Speaker 1: just you learn a lot about about food production. And
• 1:52:33
  Speaker 1: then you also learn a lot about when you're when
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 1: you're looking at farms and ranches, how to kind of
• 1:52:38
  Speaker 1: interpret what it is you're seeing, and when you're looking
• 1:52:41
  Speaker 1: at those price discrepancies, when you're looking at those price
• 1:52:46
  Speaker 1: discrepancies in the grocery store attached to different descriptors, why
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 1: that might look the way it looks because there's a point,
• 1:52:56
  Speaker 1: like you said with chicken, you know, I mean, there's
• 1:52:58
  Speaker 1: a point you're gonna someone's gonna walk walk in. The
• 1:53:00
  Speaker 1: consumer is going to walk in and they're going to see,
• 1:53:02
  Speaker 1: you know, chickens on sale for like a buck of pound,
• 1:53:06
  Speaker 1: or they're like, well, how why is this? Holes are
• 1:53:09
  Speaker 1: selling his chicken for eight dollars a pound or whatever
• 1:53:11
  Speaker 1: the hell it is. I'm not telling you don't I
• 1:53:15
  Speaker 1: don't know how you're going to break on that buying decision,
• 1:53:17
  Speaker 1: but at least you won't feel like it's robbery. You'll
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 1: feel like, oh, that's for that, that's where that money goes,
• 1:53:25
  Speaker 1: Like that's why that's that way.
• 1:53:27
  Speaker 2: Well, there's a lot wrong with the way we produce
• 1:53:29
  Speaker 2: food in this country, sadly, and I was part of that,
• 1:53:33
  Speaker 2: My dad was part of the leadership, and my made
• 1:53:37
  Speaker 2: the decision to go on another way and have really
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 2: been pleased with the results, but ready to admit that
• 1:53:47
  Speaker 2: the financial benefit is not going to make room for
• 1:53:51
  Speaker 2: a lot of people to do it. It's sad. I
• 1:53:56
  Speaker 2: hope that changes. I don't know whether it will or not.
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 2: In this book, I tried to be as clear and
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 2: honest on that as I knew how to be and uh,
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 2: people have to make their own decisions.
• 1:54:10
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's it's it's I mean, even just talking
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 1: you today, you're I'll tell you one thing you're not.
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 1: You ain't a huckster.
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 2: M hm.
• 1:54:25
  Speaker 1: Like you seem pretty you seem pretty open to the
• 1:54:28
  Speaker 1: trade offs, you know. You know, but I think that
• 1:54:32
  Speaker 1: if we had more time, I think we would get
• 1:54:34
  Speaker 1: into and probably could just touch on it for a minute.
• 1:54:37
  Speaker 1: I mean there's also a gamble here and and and
• 1:54:44
  Speaker 1: you explained that if when people look at regenitive agriculture,
• 1:54:50
  Speaker 1: organic agriculture, whatever, and you can make the claim like, well,
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 1: how are you going to feed eight billion people on that?
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 1: And you raise some questions like, uh, I don't know
• 1:55:00
  Speaker 1: that we should feed eight billion people. And the earth
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 1: has it's not debatable there is a carrying The Earth
• 1:55:10
  Speaker 1: has a carrying capacity. There's a point at which the
• 1:55:13
  Speaker 1: Earth will not support some number, and there's gonna be
• 1:55:18
  Speaker 1: a limiting factor on how many people the Earth can feed.
• 1:55:22
  Speaker 1: If it winds up being that the limiting factor is acreage,
• 1:55:27
  Speaker 1: traditional industrialized farming is gonna be the way to go.
• 1:55:31
  Speaker 1: If the limiting factor winds up being soil, water, on
• 1:55:36
  Speaker 1: and on and on. We're gonna have to rethink ship.
• 1:55:40
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 1: It's just like like what is gonna be the thing
• 1:55:42
  Speaker 1: we run out of?
• 1:55:44
  Speaker 2: You know, you know, the the the there's so many
• 1:55:48
  Speaker 2: losers in the food production system that we have.
• 1:55:51
  Speaker 1: Now.
• 1:55:55
  Speaker 2: I've been criticized for being critical of the farmers. Really
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 2: don't intend to be. They came up in an industrial
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 2: food production system and embraced it and got good at it,
• 1:56:09
  Speaker 2: and it's taken risk and that's the way they produce
• 1:56:13
  Speaker 2: food and they see nothing wrong with it, and I
• 1:56:15
  Speaker 2: didn't either, But there there are downsides and there are risks,
• 1:56:23
  Speaker 2: and there are problems with it and their environmental you know,
• 1:56:28
  Speaker 2: I don't even talk about health and safety and all that.
• 1:56:30
  Speaker 2: I talk about the things I know about, which your
• 1:56:33
  Speaker 2: environmental out of the welfare and the rural economy, and
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 2: the way we've been producing food since World War Two
• 1:56:42
  Speaker 2: has been devastating in those three areas. Some other things too,
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 2: But I don't get into that. That's not my expertise. So,
• 1:56:52
  Speaker 2: you know, should we produce food differently? I think we should?
• 1:56:56
  Speaker 2: Are we going too? I think we are soon a
• 1:56:58
  Speaker 2: little later.
• 1:57:00
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be forced down at at some point.
• 1:57:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know how how bad it's got to get.
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 2: You know that, you know the UH. I quit using
• 1:57:11
  Speaker 2: the term organic because you can legally have certified organic
• 1:57:15
  Speaker 2: vegetables grown in a house with artificial lights and high
• 1:57:22
  Speaker 2: high gris panically no soil. It's certif out organic. Now
• 1:57:29
  Speaker 2: there's a lot wrong with that, and we could we
• 1:57:32
  Speaker 2: could go down a whole long list of things that
• 1:57:34
  Speaker 2: we do that are I think disingenuous and wrong and
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 2: and damaging and unhealthy. But until the consumer decides to
• 1:57:49
  Speaker 2: change it, change won't come from the government. Change won't
• 1:57:53
  Speaker 2: come from big multinational corperations. Change won't come from land
• 1:57:58
  Speaker 2: grant universities. I can give you a bunch of other places.
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 2: Change won't come from the usda UD. If change occurs,
• 1:58:08
  Speaker 2: it'll be because of consumers. And then it won't And
• 1:58:11
  Speaker 2: it won't happen with consumers until things get really bad.
• 1:58:17
  Speaker 2: The food costs more, I mean, my food costs more.
• 1:58:20
  Speaker 2: I hate that I do, but I can't help it.
• 1:58:26
  Speaker 1: You wish it was cheap?
• 1:58:28
  Speaker 5: Oh?
• 1:58:28
  Speaker 2: I wish? You know A question I hate is I
• 1:58:33
  Speaker 2: can be telling people, a group of people, what I
• 1:58:36
  Speaker 2: think we ought to do to farm to make food better.
• 1:58:40
  Speaker 2: For that where the land and the animal and climate
• 1:58:45
  Speaker 2: and rural communities and whatever else. And I think I
• 1:58:50
  Speaker 2: did a good job. And they say, but what are
• 1:58:52
  Speaker 2: you gonna do about all the people that are starving?
• 1:58:56
  Speaker 2: How about you handling that? I got a good idea.
• 1:59:00
  Speaker 2: Let that be your project. You know, I corrected a
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 2: bunch of stuff. You take you take that one. I
• 1:59:06
  Speaker 2: don't know, and you know I'm a I'm as sensitive
• 1:59:09
  Speaker 2: about people being hungry as anybody else. But the fact
• 1:59:14
  Speaker 2: is I simply don't have that ausole. I wrote down
• 1:59:17
  Speaker 2: all the answers I had in this book, and it's
• 1:59:20
  Speaker 2: a great start. But h you know, I can't solve
• 1:59:27
  Speaker 2: world hunger, world peace either.
• 1:59:31
  Speaker 1: Man. I hope you. I mean, it's a great book,
• 1:59:34
  Speaker 1: but I hope you're keeping more detailed notes too, because
• 1:59:38
  Speaker 1: if it's all, uh, you know, if in a hundred
• 1:59:41
  Speaker 1: years people like, holy shit, we should have listened to
• 1:59:44
  Speaker 1: that guy from Georgia, I hope he wrote them down
• 1:59:49
  Speaker 1: eighteen inches of peanuts shells, dead cow.
• 1:59:54
  Speaker 2: I give you my word. I hadn't written much. Now,
• 1:59:57
  Speaker 2: I promise you that.
• 2:00:00
  Speaker 1: How did how do identify a dung beetle when you
• 2:00:02
  Speaker 1: see one? You know, well, thanks for coming on the show,
• 2:00:06
  Speaker 1: and thanks for doing the book.
• 2:00:08
  Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. I really enjoyed it.
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 1: This is fun. Uh, you're gonna hate me because, uh
• 2:00:15
  Speaker 1: but what what is the pup date?
• 2:00:18
  Speaker 2: Sipton last September, last September.
• 2:00:21
  Speaker 1: Scrub that out, Phil. I just wanted to make sure
• 2:00:24
  Speaker 1: I had it right with available.
• 2:00:25
  Speaker 5: Now, very very available now.
• 2:00:28
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, if you don't, if you don't believe it.
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 1: Available, get it anywhere anywhere boats are sold. Boulder turned
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 1: to giving a damn one farm six generations in the
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 1: Future of food, Will Harris. If you get into the acknowledgments,
• 2:00:40
  Speaker 1: you'll see our good friend Mark Jerald listening to the acknowledgments.
• 2:00:44
  Speaker 1: Mark's good guy. But don't don't everybody go send the
• 2:00:47
  Speaker 1: Mark your proposals.
• 2:00:49
  Speaker 2: Don't.
• 2:00:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, don't send them all your proposes. It's just I
• 2:00:55
  Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know if he digs around, you know,
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 1: and publishing lingo. They call that the slush pile, and
• 2:01:03
  Speaker 1: and and I don't know that they. I can't make
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 1: any promises that he's going to dig around through his
• 2:01:09
  Speaker 1: mail and find your stuff. So if you don't hear
• 2:01:12
  Speaker 1: from him, it's not that it wasn't a good idea.
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 1: It might just be that he never looked. All right, well,
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 1: thank you man, and uh wait, Oat Pastures. They go
• 2:01:21
  Speaker 1: on your website obviously, right pastures dot Com. Make an order. Yes, yes,
• 2:01:27
  Speaker 1: they can go down there, they can look around. Please,
• 2:01:30
  Speaker 1: they can tour the compost site.
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 2:01:33
  Speaker 1: I might go in there and you might see me
• 2:01:34
  Speaker 1: out there kicking through those peanuts shells trying to find
• 2:01:36
  Speaker 1: out what exactly is going on under there.
• 2:01:40
  Speaker 2: Everybody, everybody wants to see it. It's just beautiful grass.
• 2:01:43
  Speaker 2: It's just high I mean yeah, really, yeah, it's great.
• 2:01:47
  Speaker 1: A lot of a lot of possums.
• 2:01:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, we talked about that. If you keep it,
• 2:01:55
  Speaker 2: if you keep it covered, it's incredible. How few apostles, bobcats,
• 2:02:03
  Speaker 2: raccoons very few?
• 2:02:06
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, there's no vultures undercover. If there's no vultures,
• 2:02:09
  Speaker 1: If there's no vultures, I believe it. All right, thank
• 2:02:12
  Speaker 1: you very much for coming on, and everybody go check
• 2:02:14
  Speaker 1: out the book. Thank you, thank you. All.
• 2:02:18
  Speaker 9: The sun is rising, a light up the coach making
• 2:02:23
  Speaker 9: a stand all day. There's a cold case, a long
• 2:02:27
  Speaker 9: storm out over under seven hundred second half. Please round
• 2:02:34
  Speaker 9: the dogs to the northwest corner the creek. If the
• 2:02:38
  Speaker 9: water rained down season comes, we'll find someplace to hunt. No,
• 2:02:46
  Speaker 9: they're gonna miss this ground. We're selling the farm in
• 2:02:52
  Speaker 9: the morning, all the words and the fields and the fence.
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 9: And I wish somebody could help me in a way that.
• 2:03:02
  Speaker 6: It all made sins while we're raising hell and night,
• 2:03:11
  Speaker 6: even if it's the very last.
• 2:03:13
  Speaker 9: Time, So long to the good days, because the room
• 2:03:21
  Speaker 9: has been taken it hard.
• 2:03:23
  Speaker 6: It's been fifteen years since she.
• 2:03:25
  Speaker 9: Cried our hear of birth, young who loves after the
• 2:03:30
  Speaker 9: lamb went to sleep last night and he died.
• 2:03:51
  Speaker 4: Id eyo stew the farm in the morning.
• 2:03:55
  Speaker 6: All the roads that we made in the mud, we'll
• 2:03:59
  Speaker 6: be leave been.
• 2:04:00
  Speaker 9: A lifetime behind us. The generation texts us blood.
• 2:04:09
  Speaker 6: Over raising hell and night, even if it's the very
• 2:04:14
  Speaker 6: last time, and.
• 2:04:16
  Speaker 9: So much for the good thing. There's a new bunch
• 2:04:23
  Speaker 9: of deer in the bottom. I promise to my daughters
• 2:04:27
  Speaker 9: and sons. Don't know how I'm gonna make up the memory.
• 2:04:33
  Speaker 6: I won't stop until I'm done. Don't know what time
• 2:04:38
  Speaker 6: we gotta leave here, tomorroom.
• 2:04:40
  Speaker 9: Don't know what I'm gonna say s to them? How
• 2:04:46
  Speaker 9: for upond by tonight. But we're gonna be burning one anyway.
• 2:04:53
  Speaker 9: We're selling the farm in the morning. All the bucks
• 2:04:57
  Speaker 9: send the snacks in the hogs. It's a world, this
• 2:05:01
  Speaker 9: passion memory shift in a couple of saddle songs, Well
• 2:05:11
  Speaker 9: were raising hell the knife, even if.
• 2:05:14
  Speaker 6: It's the very last time.
• 2:05:16
  Speaker 9: And then don't give up on the good days.