Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Katie Woolf spoke with Police Association President Paul McCue

Transcript

Katie Woolf spoke with Police Association President Paul McCue · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Three sixty with Katie Wolf on Mixed one oh four
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: point nine thanks to Joyce main Darwin. If you're listening
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: to the show on Friday, you would have heard that
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: we'd read out the statement which was issued by the
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Northern Territory Police Association saying that they're discussed by the
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: grandstanding of the Commissioner, the IKAK Commissioner Ken Fleming QC
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: during estimates last week. Now earlier this morning, we did
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: speak to the Northern Territory Chief Minister, Michael Gunner. If
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: you miss that interview, we will have it up online
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: in just a little while. But joining us on the
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: line right now is the Northern Territory Police Association President
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Paul McHugh. Good morning to you, Paul.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: Good morning Kenny, Paul.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: What well, why exactly were those comments made by the
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: IKAK not acceptable in your ice?
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Well, I guess the fundamental I guess reason we have
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: an IKAK is is confidence and we want to know
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: there's confidence in terms of people wanting to approach IKAK
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: and report that matters at day belie if maybe of
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: corrupt behavior or should be at least assessed as whether
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: they are corrupt behavior and the whole premise of the
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: success of that process is knowing that when somebody does
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: approach the office that there's confidence those people will be protected,
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: those whistle bowers will be protected. Now, the day before estimates,
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: the IKAK Commissioner sort of states makes a statement saying,
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: as the matter is before the inspector, be inappropriate to
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: comment further, and that yet the next day, under the
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: veil of parliamentary privilege, makes a decision to clearly, clearly,
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: deliberately makes a decision to go on a rand in
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: relation to this particular individual who'd made the complaint. Now that,
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: I mean that is extraordinary when you think about what
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: his position is and what the public should expect of
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: somebody in that position, for him to make those statements
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: and it is completely unacceptable. We all know that mister
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: Fleming's moving on as soon as a few weeks time,
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: and from our perspective, it fails the pub test significantly
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: and he should stand down.
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: Did you hear the interview with Chief Minister Michael Gunner
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: a little bit earlier this morning.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: Paul, Yes, I did.
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: Yet, Now what did you make of his comments? I mean,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: do you think that it goes far enough? Him saying
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: that there is going to be an independent investigation.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, obviously he is remaining a bit hands off
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: at this stage. Well, he's also aware that mister Fleming's
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: moving on, so he's no doubt going to leave it
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: to the inspector and an independent I guess review of
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: VIKAC generally. And LOOKI has pointed out it is a
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: relatively new body here in the Northern Territory. But you know,
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: it doesn't remove the fact that the Chief Minister sat
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: there silently in estimates and allowed mister Fleming to take
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: that stand and make those comments, and that being the
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: responsible minister is not being responsible and certainly from our perspective,
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: was not good enough.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Paul, what do you think it says about the Chief
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: Minister's leadership.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, obviously it's a concern. I mean obviously, you
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: know we've said it is a new body, and obviously
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: you know everyone's trying to work out where this body sits.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: But you know this isn't you know, I haven't reinvented
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: a wheel here. Ikack's been around in other jurisdictions for
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: some time and it's clearly there for a reason. The
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: problem we have is obviously people want to go to
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: the IKAK often at times to report matters that relate
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: to government departments. For example, you've got to know that
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: body SIT's completely independently of any other department or influence. Unfortunately,
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: on this occasion, I don't think mister Fleming sits with
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: those values. Clearly. You know he's made a statement publicly
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: at estimates the day after saying he won't public publicly
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: comment urther. I think that says a lot.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: So do you stand by your comments that you think
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: the KAC commissioner needs to stand down? Yeah?
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: Completely. I mean we know he's moving on, we know
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: he's moving to retirement. There is no reason for him
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: the return on the back of those comments. I think
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: the community of the Northern Territory, you know, and look
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: at our police officers, for example, they are held to
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: the utmost scrutiny. They are governed beyond governed in terms
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: of the bodies, the oversight bodies that look at their
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: behavior and they only have to look twice. They can't
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: make a comment about anything without being scrutinized to the
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: nth degree. We want to know as a community that
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: our ARCAC commissioner is doing the job they're supposed to
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: do not grandstanding, and that's not the case on this occasion.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: So yes, Katie, he should stand down. He should move on,
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: allow the new ARCAC commissioner to come in and take
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: the rain.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: Now, we did hear from the Chief Minister earlier this
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: morning that that whistleblower will be allowed to give evidence
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: to estimates if they choose to. I mean, does that
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: along with the investigation into the ikak And you know,
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: I guess the commentary from the Chief Minister this morning,
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: do you feel that goes far enough from the Chief
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: Minister's perspective.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, it's pretty I guess it's pretty daunting to
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: be in their shoes, now, isn't it when you look
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: at the I mean, obviously I don't know anything about
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: the matter. I don't know the individuals concerned, but certainly,
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: you know, they felt the confidence to come forward, felt
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: the need to come forward and make those complaints through
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: the Ikak and to the inspector. And now they've been
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: subject to this public scrutiny because of the grandstanding of
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: the Aikak Commissioner himself, So they probably would be reluctant,
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: you would think, to come forward now, which is against
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: the whole premise of what this particular body is set
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: up to do, and that's to give people the confidence
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: to actually come forward and make these sorts of complaint.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: Paul, just in sort of wrapping up for this morning,
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: what do you think needs to happen today?
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: Well, what we'd like to see obviously, is the ARKAC
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: commissioner stand down. You know, he is moving on in
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: a few weeks time on the back of I think
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: what everyone would accept his inappropriate commentary at Estimates session,
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: he should stand out, move on and allow the next
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: phase of the ARKAK to take charge and whether that's
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: the independent review and then obviously we've got a new
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: KAC commissioner coming in and allow the community to have
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: the confidence that body's doing what it's set.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: Up to do. And if he chooses to stay in
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: that role, what impact do you think that that will
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: have on any future reports that are due to come out.
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: I mean, he said in estimates last week that there
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: are around three reports if I recall correctly, around three
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: reports that are due to be released before he finishes up.
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I guess it. You like to have the confidence.
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: I know there's some very good people that work in there.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: You like to think they have the confidence to make
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: sure those matters are dealt with appropriately. I think what
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: we're talking about here is this particular grandstanding. It's not
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: acceptable in terms of the reports that are you to
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: come out. You know, we'll have to wait and see
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: what they do, but I don't believe it's appropriate for
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: him to continue, and we've made that public statement.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: Well. Police Association President Paul McHugh, As always, we appreciate
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: your time today, Thanks so much for speaking with us.
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: Good on you Chi's Katie, Thank you and that number
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: if you are keen to get in contact this morning
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: eight nine four one one o four nine. You're also
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: able to send us a text message zero four one
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: eight nine five seven three six nine and we and look,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: we are going to see whether we're able to actually
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: get the IKA Commissioner on I think it would be
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: good to hear from Ken Fleming himself and you know,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: try to ascertain exactly I suppose you know, what what
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: he was thinking behind those comments. So mindus is that
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: he is back from leave, but we will certainly get
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: in contact with his office and allow him the opportunity
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: to respond as well to some of the commentary around
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: this but we are keen to hear from you this morning.
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, do you think that the IKAQ Commissioner's position
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: is tenable? We know that he is now in the
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: role until the fifth of next month, so it is
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: only a few weeks away. But do you think that
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: it's tenable. Do you think that he does need to
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: stand down or do you think that it is appropriate
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: that he stays in that role. We know it's been
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: a very big job setting up the IKAK, that whole
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: body itself, and you know, I am somebody who does
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: believe that we need an eye CAAC. I think that
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: we do need this body, this independent body in place
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: to be able to investigate any corruption or you know,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: any misuse of public money. I think it's a very
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: important role. But I'm keen to hear your thoughts. Do
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: you feel as though it's lived up to the expectations
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: eight nine four one one four nine, or you can
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: also send us a message zero four one eight nine
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: five seven three six nine