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CJP #20 Carlos Alvarez-Aranos Pt 1 · Coconut Justice

• speaker-0: Hey, what's good? His name is Carlos Alvarez Aranos, and he is the founder of American Opposition. American Opposition is a nonprofit, non-connected political action committee created to counter the rise of fascism in the United States of America. I can't believe that we need a an organization like this in the United States. I can't believe it. Carlos is also a globally renowned strategic communications professional who has a knack for adventure. But adventure, in my opinion, might be a little bit of an understatement to describe him. C4 Explosives joins me for this conversation with Carlos Alvarez Aranos. Before we get into it, remember to go to coconutjustice.com to get you some clothes that I think would look good on you. Let's go. All right, folks, we're gonna get right into this because something tells me that this young man just can't wait to get a lot off his chest and every speech I have seen him do, he gets it moving and he gets it moving quick. So you guys, welcome to the show, Carlos Alvarez Araños. speaker-1: Hey guys, how are you? Thank you for having me. speaker-0: Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule. And we're going to get into that. But first, let's also welcome C4 Explosives. What's tracking everybody? Yes, sir. So yeah. I had a little extra time before the show and I started doing a little research and everything. And this is the first time on this channel that we're going to do a wardrobe change because my boy Carlos comes out looking clean as hell. So I'm going to slip this off. I'm slipping this on. we're about to go to work, son. That's nice. Damn, bro. I gotta put mine on. No, put that away. yeah. Come on, see. speaker-1: man. Damn, that looks good on you, man. Properly good hat. speaker-0: yeah, sir. Sorry. When I put this on, everybody knows I showed up to me to do business. you got a little epic Russell Cleveland. Shout out, Russell. Hell yeah, dude. There we go. yeah, so I have been watching a lot of videos and catching up with what Carlos is doing and everything that speaker-1: It's time for business. speaker-0: He's trying to put together in the movements and the and the momentum that he's been trying to put together. But the first thing I want to talk to him about is family. I have family in Santo Domingo, aka the Dominican Republic, and that's where you come from. speaker-1: It is, yeah. My family's still there too. It's actually one of the one of the things that allows me to do this job without too much worry, is that I I don't have I'm not married, I don't have kids, and that my my most of my family's in the Dominican Republic. So I feel less worried about those elements, right? and again, it it's interesting that you mentioned family, because for me growing up in the Dominican Republic. Under ho a guy named Joaquim Balaguer who was he was exactly what Donald Trump wishes he could be, right? An elected fascist. and so when people ask me like how do you know it's fascism, I remember. Yeah. It's an interesting, it's an interesting experience to like come at this from the perspective of memory. and you talk about Dominican politics. Dominican politics is a gift. I have a a bachelor's and a master's in political science and political management. But everything I learned about politics, I learned from living in the Dominican Republic. Because you see it very clearly. I also was a I was a part of an oligarchical family. My my uncle was Oscar de Lorenta, the fashion designer. My father was the most successful investment banker in maybe in the history of Latin America. Very a genius guy who got recruited to go to MIT from the Dominican Republic. And they called him Little Gray Cells at MIT. The dude was genuinely a genius. but he made a he became very successful and then was became part of a political process where the president basically took everything from him. So it's interesting to to have witnessed to have witnessed politics in its naked form, to have grown up in an oligarchy and understand what drives the oligarchs. To have grown up under fascist dictator who was elected which is what Trump. So again You s you know, it's funny to to to look at my condition of life, the fact that I don't have a wife or kids, that the that my family's abroad. And I'm not a big believer in destiny, but you start putting all these things together. The fact that I did this before, and we'll talk probably about my work in 2020, but like I've done this before, I've beaten Donald Trump before. All of the conditions of my life have sort of brought me to this place where I don't have to guess at what I'm doing. I know exactly what I'm doing. I know the danger we face. I've lived it. and and to find myself in a position to be able to help and to leverage all of that experience is really surprising, frankly. And like honestly, in some ways you just kind of pinch yourself separate from the from the the work itself. Like, man, I get to ex I get to exist in this moment and in this place, and I get to contribute in this way. And like if that's not a good thing for a A piece of carbon from the Dominican Republic that is you know what I'm saying? Like it's kinda it's kind of surreal, you know, it's got an element. speaker-0: And who was it? Wasn't it wasn't it? I I don't know if it's the same dude that that you're talking about, but Santo Domingo or the Dominican Republic had someone who was acting like a Donald Trump, but they broke into the Capitol and dragged his ass out into the street and they took care of business. speaker-1: Well, yeah, no, so that your Trujillo was the and then but he had a vice president named Joaquin Balaguer who was his vice and when Trujillo was deposed from power, another government was put in that had nothing to do with him. Balaguer, who had been his vice president, was elected president a few times. And Balaguer was blind and old as dirt, so physically not very capable. speaker-0: Trujillo. But eventually while I Yeah. speaker-1: But mentally, mentally all there. And he he ran that country in in a unique way that you know it was interesting because like you grow up and you know there are limits to your freedom and you know where they are, and you don't really cross them, but you know they're there, and it's it that's all it takes. It's literal fear. Yeah. I I will never forget one time I saw, and I didn't know who the guy was, but I saw a dude walking. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And suddenly I see a motorcycle cop pull up next to him. And then I see a pickup truck pull up behind the motorcycle cop. And the guy the cop gets out, shoots the guy in the head, they throw him on the back of the pickup, and then they drive away. And that was it. That was the disappearing of this person. And I guarantee you, like no book in history will ever have that person's name, the reason why they were disappeared. They just were not there anymore. And so speaker-0: One hundred percent. speaker-1: it's an interesting thing to come from to like learn this shit in a lived experience way. But the opportunity to deal with it is a really interesting speaker-0: So yeah, So you see this playbook played out like your entire life. So what does your family say that the role that you're playing over here trying to I don't want to say save save the day, but you know, to lead the lead the charge, you know what I'm saying? Literally you're saving you're trying to save the country right now. Yeah. speaker-1: well, first my dad is probably more on the Republican side. there is a that's another thing I understand sort of from lived experience is that we Latinos are not in are not simple creatures. Right. And when it comes to racism, when it comes to oligarchy, when it comes to a lot of these things, we're actually way I I use the word sophisticated, but I don't mean it in a positive way. We are our racism. looks at America's racism and goes, I'm gonna triple down and I'm gonna do it in ways in ways that are much more subtle. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: And more systemized and like harder to eliminate because it's it's not as simple as we brought over slaves and we you know, the Dominicans and others have created huge constructs to justify horrible behavior for generations. And in some ways the they don't face the same pressures towards greater justice or greater accountability that we do here in the US. So like those systems are not changing anytime soon in Latin America. They're much more endemic. They're much more connected to how things function. it's like a caste system, like they have in India, where you're kind of born in your station and there's very little ability to ever leave it. but you don't notice that you're right, you're existing within it, and you're locked on an island with other people. So there's also the island mentality and a lot of other shit. So it's interesting because in some ways I feel like the American version is the simple version. Of this problem. And I say that on many fronts. Like, dude, I've seen politics, man. I've seen politics, politics. You know, my father was a conductor of politics, and I would see the sh I've seen the deals be made and the sausage be made. Like right. And and even though my dad and I have never agreed politically and re at certainly in you know since probably the first Bush administration, I still speaker-0: Do think speaker-1: I I I I'm thankful that I learned from him what that actually looks like, what the world actually runs like in a sense. because you can't fake that. there's a lot of things you can't fake. You know, we talked my uncle was Oscar de Lorenta and people talk about sophistication. You know, I was just having a conversation with somebody about this, about this idea of in in Spanish we call it concepto. but what it is is vision, is creative vision. Like why is Anna Winter The editor of Vogue and why is she good at her job? Can't other people pick pretty pictures or create a unifying theme for a magazine, right? And the problem is it's kind of like stupidity. Smart, you have to be smart to know you're stupid. And you kind of have to have creative vision to understand what it is, right? Because otherwise people will tell you, well, we can do the same thing you just did. I just ordered the same people to do the same things. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: And once you start to deconstruct things, you realize relationships matter, experience matters, wisdom matters. And we're living in an age now where like this generation wants to be influencers. And if you think of the design of an influencer, it's somebody who can't really do the thing, right? So, like, or they can't do it well enough. So you can make more money being hot and playing golf than playing golf professionally on the PGA tour. You're gonna go and be hot and play golf, or whatever, whatever the cost are. speaker-0: Right. Yeah, yeah. Not for anything, but there's way more money being a golf influencer, but that's beside the speaker-1: Well, no, and there's definitely more money versus practice time. Input output. It's speaker-0: Right, right, right. Like way ahead. Yeah, yeah, right. Right. speaker-1: But we're living in an influencer culture. And so when we talk about all the shit that we're starting to talk about, which is like where I come from and why I bring to this, I can't I grew up in the Dominican Republic. I grew up in sort of the right family to understand the other side because our fight isn't against Trump, it's against an oligarchy. it's about entrenched politics, which I've seen. I know how the sausage is made. you talk about having some sense of a creative vision for how to produce right, how to produce a resistance. It's not it doesn't happen automatically. It requires work and you have to manifest it and you have to put the right pieces together and you have to leadership is is ten percent public, 90% private, right? It's about what you can do on the phone when you're are you able to create a coalition in three days and get it out the door and all that kind of stuff. And nobody sees that. And so but what I'm lucky is that I was gifted the experience. speaker-0: Create You particularly. speaker-1: on all of the levels and all of the areas to be able to do this job. Leading up to like 2020 and last year when I did other organizations that were related kind of. And I just feel very interestingly blessed to have been put in a position to be able to re leverage all of that in service of other people. I really think that's a privilege that it would have been crazy for me to assume would have happened once, let alone twice. Because in twenty twenty I played a similar role and we can talk about it. But but it's interesting to have like this two cracks at the same problem, from different perspectives, but leveraging all of that experience is so you you know, to to to your point, I think it's it's weird and it's it's I'm very lucky, I think, that I get to like live my life in a way that that influences whatever happens. at the same time, I very, very, very clearly understand the sort of the consequentiality of that, right? The whether it's a death threat or the the constant pressure or or you know of the speaker-0: Is that a problem? Is that threats and all that stuff? Is that a problem? speaker-1: Yeah, I get I I get about between seventy five and two hundred death threats a week. It's not a problem. I mean, it's just it's my life. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Is it a problem? I don't think it's a problem. Like I'm not afraid that way. I've been shot at a lot. I've worked in six conflict areas. I've taken I've taken fire from a tank once. That wasn't fun. In Georgia, yeah, and when the Russians invaded. I took tank I took incoming from a Russian tank. And and yeah. No, and it's funny because the main thing you learn is that it's not like the movies. speaker-0: where was that? Can you say? Hey, for the record, I was in the military. Never did I get they only proc it they only practiced dropping bombs on us. That's all they did. They never shot a tank at us. speaker-1: You know. Yeah, and it wasn't to be fair, I don't think they were shooting at me. They just got it very reasonably close, you know. And what you realize is like in the movies, whenever something blows up, you're like, no, that's not right. That's not right. Because I have felt my bones shake inside my body. And I don't know how to explain that. I have physically felt my bones literally speaker-0: Yeah, I don't care. Yeah. Be cool. Rap. Yeah. And you go. speaker-1: None of that is supposed to be happening inside of me. Like, you know, that's the feeling that I speaker-0: How quickly how quickly after that did you grab a glass of milk? speaker-1: No, to be honest, I I passed out for a while. I was and I came to and I was about a block and a half away, so I didn't even take the brunt of it. I yeah, it was I've I've seen too many things. In the Congo, I saw a lot of things I didn't want to see. I in Guinea I was there doing a coup d'etat and horrible shit, man. But again, you you realize like how much worse things could get. Because part of what I what I always think about is like speaker-0: I bet. Damn. speaker-1: You know, in Gaza, the situation happening in Gaza, I worked in Lebanon, I negotiated with Hezbollah to get eye and ear checks for all the kids of Lebanon at one point in my career. And and it's funny because like you're in a war zone and you're a block away from the fighting and if and cafes are open and you're just having lunch. Very wild thing. speaker-0: That's just wild. That's what's wild. Right. speaker-1: And what's what's funny to me is like like you can't be an and going back to my original point in this answer is you can't fake that. You can't go back and change that to make it something it's not. You can't you you can't be an influencer or be full of shit and do the real work because the real work requires or at least demands real experience, real wisdom derived from real experience. what have you done? Where have you been? Have you I mean, I I distinctly remember I was heading down to Guinea and I had a document from the Guinean Embassy in Paris saying what I was doing, my mission, kind of my mission. And I had another document from the charity I was representing, and that was my mission statement. And and I'm supposed to be protected by these things. And I'm at the airport in Paris, and I get a phone call from the embassy saying, Don't go because we can't guarantee your safety anymore. And I'm like, but I already checked my bag, so I'm just gonna go. speaker-0: yeah. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Were you dressed up like Rambo? Like were you ready to go? speaker-1: the thing no it gets worse because then i i forgot to go to the atm because i had wanted to pull out three hundred dollars in cash so that i would have cash because when you land in guinea you need cash yeah i didn't even know if anybody was meeting me and the only the only person that met me was the a four percent christian country or something like that but the priest of the local catholic mission happened to show up at the airport guys i landed in conakry guinea speaker-0: shit. speaker-1: at like seven or eight PM at night from Paris. I've been told that they can no longer protect me. Don't go. The only real reason I went is my bags are already checked. And and I'm just being real with you. That was the main thought in my head was that would be a very inconvenient thing for me to try to pull my bags out. 'Cause I was connecting. I was living in Monaco and so I connected from Nice to Paris and I'm like if I if they don't get my bags then they're in Guinea and I'm speaker-0: nice was your luggage? He had Oscar Deloran luggage. speaker-1: No, no, I my luggage has always been nice, but it wasn't even about the luggage. It was, I mean, I mentioned that only to say like that's who I was at 26 years old, and whatever age I was, and 27 or something like that. and if you haven't been in the airport and gotten that phone call with that actual situation, and then done the stupid thing and gotten on the plane. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: And then gone and worked during a coup d'etat and talked to generals who were trying to remove the president and eventually put their kids in your school so that they wouldn't blow up your school and then gotten sick from like food that while you were watching them prepare it, you went, That is a bad idea, and then you ate it anyway. Then you ended up with like six months of mono, but it wasn't mono, it was related to mono, some you know and Like there's no replacing life. And even when you're a fucking moron like I was at that moment, that serves me now. And so my point is like experiences, we can't we're living in an age of bullshit when we need experience more than ever. speaker-0: Yeah, I just wrote that down. Life prepares you for now. So everything, every situation that we're in, we're man, why the hell am I in doing this? Why am I going through this right now? It's you're prep God's preparing you. You're getting prepared for the next. Right. Every situation. For some reason, somehow, I I just added a tool to my my toolbox. Right. And then when shit hits the fan, like you said, in those split seconds, you know how to react. And not just that, but a lot of times, a lot of times I think speaker-1: We just never guess. Yeah. You can speaker-0: A lot of times on this channel we say that. We say, How do you know how you can how you're going to respond to a situation unless you put yourself in that situation? You you can't have chat GBT, that's for sure. Right. speaker-1: And the and the worst part is like if you haven't made real mistakes where your life is on the line. You don't want to be practicing the with the first time out when it's serious. Like I got on a plane, but yeah, if you land in the airport in Konakri, you're still at an airport. Like it's not the situation doesn't degrade from 100 to zero. There are levels of degradation. and being able to know early on where the decision points are that actually change the conditionality for you. speaker-0: Yeah, for real. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Is super important because you want to get close to the problem, otherwise, you can't solve it. You don't want to get so close that you become part of it. And it's an interesting challenge. Like operating in war zones, I learned a lot about getting super close to the problem without being in the fight. Because as soon as you're in the fight, then your problem becomes surviving the fight. If your task is to end the fighting or to in some way improve conditions on the ground. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: You have to learn how to come up to it but not join it. And that's an and and sometimes you're very passionate about one side or the other, or whatever the case may be, and you feel that you want to. But I wasn't a soldier in those moments, and that wasn't my task. And so it's important to remember it's important to be able to contextualize yourself and your goals when the when no when the plan is out the window because the f shots have been fired, or whatever the case may be. Sure. and I find that that kind of wisdom Again, it's it it's sadly learned in hardship, but it can't be practiced. The first time out shouldn't be when there's real consequences on the on the table, especially in a situation like today where like the future of the United States is literally the stakes, right? And my God, man, so many people are coming to this without knowing what the fuck they're doing or with self-interest as their primary driver. And I'm like, with stakes like that, man, we gotta get rid of that. speaker-0: quickly as possible. So so when you got when you got remove the regime, no kings, when and and every every step that led up to you know the first the first the first rally march protest and you have all these all these people that have been in those situations that you have been through like those types of situations. You got veterans, you got people that led coalitions, you got activists, you got all kinds of people that that have life prepared me for this moment moment. So how how do you how do you get your Like delegate, like or how do how do you come up with that plan with all these ideas? speaker-1: So what's nice about it is that people tend to to to connect strategy with operations and those two things are not the same thing. the first thing I knew was that we needed a strategy to defeat Donald Trump. And by the way, that is a very different thing than a strategy to pretend or to represent the problem or to whatever. So the way this normally works, just for the edification of everybody. I'm a strategist by trade. This is what I do for a living. Usually that means I do it behind the scenes. The difference now is that I'm operating in public and that changes it actually kind of changes a few things in terms of how I do it, but it doesn't change what I do. The key is I had a very clean vision for how to remove Donald Trump. that is not a single the way to think about a strategy is strategy is where you want to end up and tactics are how you get there. That's the way I think about it. So if I speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: If I was giving you guys a strategy for living your lives, I might say, I see for I want you to imagine the coolest old man you can imagine, and then make every decision he would have made, regardless of context, from here until the day you reach whatever age he is in your imagination. If you do that your entire life, let's say you start at the age of 10, because your father tells you that, and you do it until you're 90. There's really as long as you don't make an exception, you're guaranteed to become the guy, because the guy. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And the decisions are connected to each other. If we are the product of our decisions, then keeping faith with your goal is like a compass that corrects your course at every decision point, right? So that's the way to think of strategy. And so what I, you know, when I started building the American Opposition Project, the thing it was before it was anything else was a vision of where I wanted us to end up. And that was and and and the most important element of that is that Donald Trump is not the problem. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: Donald Trump is actually a very helpful representation of the problem. He's literally orange. He's literally ridiculous. And by the way, we are the luckiest nation in history that we got this buffoon. if we had gotten Barack Obama, but like evil Obama, this speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah, much harder. It'd be a wrap. Absolutely. speaker-1: Right. But my understanding of this problem is more about like what is it that is impairing people? What is it that's causing us to be this way to and you know, and you see other symptoms. A Kim Kardashian country, a country that is entertained by Kim Kardashian elects Donald Trump. Right. So it's a it's an it's an atmospheric problem. It it's it's all of us in this together. speaker-0: Right. Yep. speaker-1: And the main conditionality that has happened is that people have forgotten the purpose for their lives or they never had one in the first place. And they feel exposed by a competition that was thrust upon them that was global. And it was an ego competition. So if you think about it, when when I went to high school. My problem, if I chose to think can't school in Connecticut. well, so I came to the US to bo to go to boarding school when I was nine years old. Okay. I was a gifted tennis player and I went to a place called Harry Huffman Tennis Academy. I was two years ahead. speaker-0: Where did you go to high school? Literally do everything. speaker-1: No guys, all I will say is nobody's ever actually asked me these questions about my where I come from. But my life is the craziest fucking story possible. It's unbelievable. Even I look at it and go, that's not unbelievable. speaker-0: You know what I mean? speaker-1: Thank God I have photos and shit because the none of it. But I was two years ahead. I went to high school at first in a boarding school in Connecticut because my uncle Oscar lived in a place called Kent, Connecticut. And so I I went to the school down the hill from his house. Three semesters in they kicked me out and I went to Ohio Valley School in Oha, California for one semester because my brother had gone. And they allowed me to finish the year, but I got kicked out so that I wouldn't lose it. speaker-0: He kicked you got kicked out all the way across the other side of the country. speaker-1: Yeah, literally. I got kicked out of school in Connecticut and went to California. And I walked onto campus and I saw these two girls who were because in Kent you have to wear a tie and shit. And then suddenly I get there and there's these two beautiful girls. And the one of them was blonde and the other one was Latina. And I just my dad was like, Are you gonna be okay? And I went, I am gonna be just California. I was in a t shirt and it was amazing. speaker-0: It's just fine. speaker-1: Then I went to b back to the Dominican Republic for my junior and senior year of high school. And I ended up publishing the largest newspaper in the country, which is also the largest newspaper in the Caribbean, on the internet. And this was in 1995 before before like the New York Times was online. I mean, I'm not sure what year they went on, but it would have been right around there. So I I was a brainy kid. I was two years ahead in school, but I, you know, I lacked discipline partly because I was too young. and I went to college. speaker-0: I was gonna say there's a word for that. It's called travieso. speaker-1: Yeah, yeah, I was definitely that. I was many things, but I was also hyperlexic. I'm a bit I'm I'm hyperlexic and as my therapist says, probably on the spectrum, but nobody would have diagnosed it at the time. I tend to interrupt people, I tend to talk a lot, I tend 'cause my brain like finishes their thoughts for them and they don't know that I'm listening very carefully. But in my own speaker-0: Sorry, Mike. I was playing. That's why Mike feels uncomfortable. He's like, Yep. Damn it. speaker-1: That's why it's very No everything they know the start and finish. All the all these fucking Carlos man that they're So no, I so I went to I d I forget where I was in the story and why I was talking about speaker-0: You were you were just leaving California. And you went back to the online. Yeah. speaker-1: Publishing and then I went on and then I went to college in Massachusetts and and no, but I was talking about something before this, which led me into talking about school, which I forget. anyway. But graduated from high school in the Dominican Republic, went to the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and that's where my life started to get really weird because my my my family basically had a Like a permanent stay arrangement at the Carlisle Hotel, which is the nicest in New York. I found that I could just go and stay there basically whenever I wanted. So I commuted, I took all my classes on Tuesday and Thursday at UMass and I commuted and lived in New York City from Thursday night to Monday night. Like my and not all the time and not perfectly, but that was sort of the design of my college life. And I had this duality where on the one hand, I was Oscar's nephew in New York. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: With access living at the Carlisle Hotel, which I mean again, you talk about dude. I used to sit like I used to sit next to Daniel Patrick. I used to sit next to Daniel Patrick Moynihan, who was the senator from New York, because he liked to use me as a buffer. He would sit at the end of the bar at Bembleman's bar and he would sit me next to him so that, and then if a constituent came and tried to talk to him, my main job was to sound like I was talking to him so that. speaker-0: Okay. speaker-1: They would he wouldn't be bothered. And then if the constituent made it through me, he would just mumble and pretend to be drunk. And I learned more about politics from Daniel Patrick Moynihan and from the Dominican Republic and from this world. And again, like my uncle used to introduce me to all my girlfriends. So they were all models. And I was like, going to college at UMass and being a regular college kid at UMass, and then on the weekends, let's go out with a supermodel to go to, you know. speaker-0: And speaker-1: To Daniel for dinner, and then I would bring him back to the hotel and go to the Cafe Carlisle where Bobby Short was this great cabaret singer, and he would watch me come in. And if he liked the girl, he'd be like, Honey, Carlos asked me to sing this for you. And I was like, I had got Bobby Short with my closer, you know what I'm saying? And like I mentioned I mentioned all of this because it's like this is the irreplaceable shit. And you like I know how the oligarchy works. By the way, I know Donald Trump is in the context of New York society, because I got to live that society at that time. I used to go and sit at Elaine's and talk to, you know, the Norman Lears of the world, all the great writers, Christopher Hitchens, all of these people were part of my universe in that. And it sounds like bragging, but it's not, I promise you. What it is is that there is some shit in this life that if you if you don't live it, if you don't know it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Nobody can teach it to you. And some of it requires money and you can't get access to it. But then again, some people with money never get access to certain things. Because a lot of life can't be bought. and it's about other people being invested in you and taking you places. I always found that like I lived at a lot of hotels over the years, and you know, knowing the general manager is great, but if you want your life to be amazing, the valets. speaker-0: One hundred percent. Yeah. speaker-1: The bell hops and the concierges are the key people who right because if they if they're in it with you, then your travesia can become much more acute. And and in a way that helps you in my situation now, I know who Donald Trump is. I know what society he was trying to cater to and how he was doing it. I know. speaker-0: The workers. Right. And the fact that he's angry because they didn't let him into that society. Right. That's what you're seeing. speaker-1: Exactly. And my point to you guys is like when I I don't say it lightly when I say that all of these crazy experiences of life for for many of which I can't claim much credit, other than having been there and having been game, and I'm Dominican, so I'm always there and I'm always game. but like the awareness to understand. Why the oligarchs exist, what they're trying to do, how politics is run in real life, how all these systems work. I'm a narc in a sense. But I'm using that experience, I'm narcing to myself. I'm saying I've had this duality throughout my life of living, I've been a cabbie for real, and I've been broke off my ass and I've gone to bed hungry for lack of money. And I've also had I've looked at my bank balance and seen two million dollars. Like speaker-0: How speaker-1: Those two realities have been part of my existence. I would have never thought that those things would have helped in this way. If you had asked me, I would have said, Well, I can tell you where all the great nightclubs are. I can walk like I have the confidence to walk up to any woman and ask her out. All of these things are skill sets that I would have assumed would have helped me in finding a wife or in becoming more social when I moved to a new town or whatever. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: The fact that those things are actively helping me fighting the president of the United States and the and some of the richest people in the world is is kind of ludicrous. But it also goes to show that you can't ever really prepare yourself for what you're doing. You just have to absorb and absorb and absorb and because you just never know what the context is gonna be, man. speaker-0: people. Whoever you whoever you believe is driving the the bus, whether it's God, Allah, whatever, you have to like you said, you have to collect that information and be prepared for something because you don't know. I used to think in in high school, even though I was doing algebra and I thought it was fun, I'm like, I'm never using this again. And then I became a programmer. And I was using algebra almost every day of my life. speaker-1: Yeah. Thank God I've never had to use algebra every day in my life. I was a computer science major for exactly one semester and a half. And then the and then I looked at the calculus. You know, it's funny because I'm a pretty smart guy, but there I reached a limit on calculus. Like there was a day when I went, I no longer understand what we are talking about. speaker-0: Yeah. Sparks came out and you were like, going to Spanish class. speaker-1: I'm gonna go study politics, bro. Yeah. speaker-0: Those girls that that welcome me in here. Yeah, where's that piano player? But what was it like growing up growing up in in the way that you did and being able to experience life like you did? What was it that made you be like even though I can fit in I'm speaker-1: Bobby, I need you. Yeah. speaker-0: I'm I'm making big assumptions, but it seems like you were you had the possibility of maybe hanging out in those cliques, but then you decided to be like, no, no, no, no. We gotta make this an even playing field for everybody. What was it that made you think that way? speaker-1: To be fair, the duality I'm talking about goes back to my early life. When I was so my mom and my dad divorced when I was three years old. Now keep in mind, my the my mother was the daughter of a Hungarian engineer who had been sent by the Soviets to work in the Dominican Republic under Trujillo when he was building structure and a Dominican woman. My father was the son of a Dominican engineer who was exiled to Venezuela by Trujillo. So my father was born in Caracas and eventually made it back to the Dominican Republic. So we're a natively Dominican family, but my parents were unique in a couple of ways. My dad went to MIT on a scholarship. He was so smart. They called him Little Grey Cells at MIT. And I don't know how smart you have to be to be called little gray cells at MIT, but you gotta be pretty fucking smart. speaker-0: Yeah. Okay. To walk through the door is number one and then to get a nickname. Holy shit. speaker-1: And he was offered a scholarship. So it was like he was that smart. And they found him in the Dominican Republic. He was that guy. but my mother was probably a more impressive human in a sense, because my mom was a single mother who raised four kids. one from a previous marriage to my dad, and then three from the marriage to my dad. Well, she started selling she would do, she was a secretary because she had only been able to go to secretarial school. so she was a secretary to the head of a bank. That's how she met my dad. He actually went for a loan. But then she she developed a very strong interest in new age shit and started reading about it. And my mom was also hyperlexic. that's that's a trait I notice now looking back at the time. I just wonder why has my mom read like a million books for real? Like the house is full of books and she's read them all. but again, these these questions get answered by modern psychology when at the time Dominicans we didn't even have psychologists. That was called rum. And so but my mom read everything and she started. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: selling quartz crystals in our living room and eventually five stores in a country that called her a witch. I grew up living with my mom, going to a the same school that my father had gone to because even though my father had become pretty successful by this point, not like absurdly so yet, but he was on his he was on the uprise. But he wanted us to get like a proper education and he had gone to a Jesuit school in Santo Domingo that was the equivalent of like a poor but top school in America. I don't know the I don't know what the exact analogy is. It was really good education, but it was no frills, right? And in the Dominican Republic, no frills means no fucking frills, right? So my buddies at school were kids who were walking around without shoes on, obvious sometimes. You know what I'm saying? Like that this speaker-0: Right. And I think people I don't think people understand how desperate. speaker-1: No, there is literally no comparison because if you say to me the lower ninth ward in New Orleans, I go there are still elements of the nicer because you guys have power all the time or hot water. Like we didn't have hot water. if the we didn't even have hot water when the power was on, but I I grew up with no electricity about half my life, and I was privileged, meaning I was living with my mom, she was lower middle class, but she wasn't rogue. speaker-0: They're still a little bit better. speaker-1: Right. She was doing things and my dad would help out and stuff like that. But my point to you guys is that what it netted out at in me is I the drive like my all in the Dominican Republic families tend to have a driver and a housekeeper. And the driver in my house stayed with us for like 24 years, a Gandhi Mortis, who raised me functionally in a lot of ways. He was my second father. He was a a black man in the Dominican Republic who was b trying to get his kids an education. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: I lived his struggle. We were particularly close. he and I used to go buy rubber together, meaning tires, old tires, because when he would go home from working for us, he would set up barricades. When we would strike the huelga, Dominican huelga, which is a form of national strike. When people talk to me about general strike today, I think of Ortiz and I think of buying tires. Right? And what's funny is like that was my education in at in in this work that I'm doing now. If you really trace it back, I learned it from Ortiz, who was a big follower of Peña Gomez, who was the the black man who was constantly wronged by the white president. Like these dynamics, guys, I have lived them. I have lived them in so many ways. I knew Obama before there was an Obama because Peña Gomez was the original Obama. He was of Asian descent, he was an erudite man. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: He was a man of the people. The most they ever allowed him to be was mayor of Santo Domingo. And that was barely, they barely allowed it. One election he most definitely won, and they took it away from him. Like, and my point is, like, you get this political education from real fucking life. And it's hard to even talk to Americans about it because even as I'm telling you this story, it's hard for me to mind meld with people and explain what I'm actually fucking talking about. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: 'Cause if you haven't lived it, I can't show you. There's no speaker-0: It just seems like a taken. Like it just seems like a movie. You have a specific set of skills. Right. No. speaker-1: And in some ways, because I can't explain it to you, it frustrates me. And it in some ways robs it in that frustration of trying to figure out how to communicate it, you lose a lot of the substance of what I'm trying to say. And so, what I try tend to do is not to talk about it as anecdotes, but to say very simply, to a degree that I can't even verbalize, I can will never be able to verbalize every element of the challenge before me, I understand from Place of deep understanding. When I come at this from a duality of life where I lived with my mom in a school where my dad was a backup, but I didn't know that net was there. As a kid, I just felt like I'm a kid from Santo Domingo. I learned how to navigate the streets of Santo Domingo. And by the way, I now do adventures. I drove a smart car through 22 countries, basically around the world. I drove a rickshaw. 3,000 miles across India. And people ask me, like, how do you navigate these moments? I'm like, dude, I if you can survive in Santo Domingo, if you can learn to drive a car in Santo Domingo, you will never crash anywhere else because it's just not gonna happen. To this day, I've I've never been at fault in a traffic accident. I don't think it could happen because I learned to drive in Santo Domingo to make a republic. You know what I'm saying? speaker-0: You gotta be like a hundred and forty years old, man. For real. speaker-1: That's kind of what it feels like. And so, yeah, what it feels like is like I've been on deck with a bat that's been weighted. And now when I come to America, I'm holding a light bat. And I feel it I feel invincible in a degree because the experience that I bring to this, even the people that are in this against me, it's not a fair fight. Because they don't know what I know. Yeah. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yeah. speaker-1: The the only part that frustrates me is that some of my allies don't understand where my grounding is on this. And so they tend to question things that I know for sure because they don't know them for sure in the way that I know them for sure. speaker-0: Because I was gonna I was gonna say real quick because unfortunately humans don't that they just can't take your word for it. They don't understand that being poor sucks. It if you would take my word for it, you wouldn't have to live through that. speaker-1: Right, and no, because people the people look, the highest form of intelligence is to learn from the experience of others. I came up as a hugely privileged child, but in a very underprivileged place. It gave me access to both views in a real way. Yeah, I don't have to pretend to be a full-on Dominican. You throw me in link in our main street is I mean the main strip down the street. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: You'd send me to a colmado, which is our version of a bodega, or you send me to the local sandwich cart, and I sit, and none of those people would ever think this guy is has a map. I I I belong there. That is what one of my core places of belonging. It's my country, it's my place, it's my people. I can navigate that world. It's my world. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yeah. speaker-1: But I'm also this other person in this duality is like I'm also my father's son. And I've lived at the Carlisle for Christ's sake. And Oscar De Lorenta was my uncle. And I lived in Monaco for three years and partied in Saint-Tropez and literally had the most fun anybody's allowed to have in the world. I bought a boat topless. I said nobody can wear tops on my boat. I was a young idiot. speaker-0: Name the time. Yeah. speaker-1: I I I went through a f I have diplomas over there. The bottom one is from Ferrari for their driver, one of their driver development programs. I drove with Ferrari. I had two Ferraris at one point, one old one from 1964. That was I would drive to Conn with girls. Like, guys, it was ludicrous in the way that it was ludicrous. And I'm not even apologizing for it because there's nothing to apologize for. But in some ways it doesn't, if you looked at it from the surface, you might think. This guy is not connected to this shit, right? And then the an interesting thing happened in my life, which is the financial crisis took most of my money. I've moved to Washington to work for the Obama administration. I worked at the Department of Defense on issues of Iraq and Afghanistan, which I understood because I had worked the Middle East. I'm one of the few non Muslims who has visit visited Mecca and Medina. I am I've I've visited Iran and understand it really well. So I came to this job in the Obama administration through a guy named Chuck Minat who knew of my writing and wanted me to to sort of provide that input. And I he was also the chairman of the board of trustees at GW. So I went and got my masters there on his recommendation. And like And suddenly I don't have a lot of money, but I'm working in politics, right? And I'm and I was gifted at the consulting, the con communications thing, which I had already started doing. But now I could bring it to bear on issues that mattered. Then I ended up working for very prominent people that I can't mention on the consulting side for a couple of years in New York. and I really ran out of money. And what I mean Ran out, ran out. I was dating one of the Victoria's Secret models and she wanted to go to St. Bart's every weekend. And I was like, Hell yeah, we're doing that. And before you knew it, no amount of salary was enough. I ran out of money, straight up. Whatever money I had left, I paid for school. I I ended up selling my apartment. I was like, I have no money, so I'm just gonna take whatever I can get for the apartment and and figure it out. But I ran out and I signed with a literary agent and the idea was to come to Boulder to write a book. And I live in Boulder, Colorado, and I moved here, but Looked at my bank account. I did that trip to India where I crossed all of India on a rickshaw. And I looked at my balance and it was like negative $35,000. And I'm like, I need to make money. And I speaker-0: I can't get away with being speaker-1: 50 under. Dude, I'm st I'm still more than fifty under. 50 is rookie numbers. speaker-0: No, I meant fifty dollars, yeah. speaker-1: No no no I fifty zero to the fifty, it's still fucking No no dude totally. No no it's rookie, it's fucking rookie. Just think things with no problem. Try hard. Try hard. You're gonna get fucked. Get fucked, fucked. You know what I'm saying? Like come on. But no, but my point is then but I had taken a cab. speaker-0: I'm like beat me in the rookie league on that one. Yeah. speaker-1: the airport for that India trip. And I was, I'm a naturally curious person and I don't talk it to the cabbie. I'm like, what's your deal? And he goes, I pay a lease. It's weekly. And then I keep whatever I I whatever's over the lease, you know. Yeah. And I said, How much, how much do you net out? He goes, two, two to three hundred a day. And this was pre-Uber lift, right? So I got back from India and I went to yellow cab and I'm like, I would like to drive for you. And the guy goes, I need your resume. And I'm like, I give him my actual resume. He goes, You're probably overqualified for this. speaker-0: Ha ha ha. speaker-1: And I'm like, no, exactly the right job. speaker-0: Dude is looking around, where's the cameras? speaker-1: Right. Dude, I ended up becoming the most successful taxi driver in the history of Colorado. speaker-0: shit, man. speaker-1: Two people pooped in my cab, four people peed in my cab. and you talk about like a life reset coming out of the White House and working for literally one of the 10 richest men on earth to suddenly driving a cab in Boulder, Colorado, and and you give people a modicum of power in the backseat of a cab and they will fucking abuse it. And and you talk about grinding your ego down to nothing, right? it was the most important formative experience of my life. Not that I didn't. Up until that point, I theoretically knew I was a sort of a guy's guy, because I'm I'm Dominican and I've always known that I'm planted firmly on the ground. But I had gone on this journey of Monaco and life and boats and Santrope and I and I and I did that really fucking well. I was yeah put it this way. My name is my name is Carlos Alberto, which is Charles Albert, and I was named after Prince Charles and Prince Albert. speaker-0: Victoria's secret box. speaker-1: Of England and Monaco, and I've met both of them. And Albert's a friend of mine, I would classify him as a friend. But the people that I was named after who were like way over there, right? Yeah. Now I'm suddenly in social circles running with William and Harry at Bougie's on Tuesday night in London, you know, and all that shit. And then I'm in a cat. Good. speaker-0: Two people are pooping in your cab. And speaker-1: Couple of people pooped. No, one of them was totally catatonic until she spoke. She she was a from the, you know, we used to have to transfer people from the alcohol and recovery to the jail. And and this woman just did not want to go and she stopped me halfway. She's like, I need to get out. I'm like, we're two blocks away. And then by the time we got there, she had she had put out a dookie. but point is speaker-0: That's not cool. speaker-1: My point is that, like, I've learned life in both the duality that continues to this day. I'm the most successful I've ever been, the most broke I've ever been, probably in real life. but I don't really care because ultimately, like that duality that the fact that you can't categorize it, the fact that and by the way, from the taxi, I built Boulder Transport into a fairly significant transportation company. And then the pandemic destroyed that. And it's still alive, but I don't make any money out of it. So my daily the daily grind is mostly about keeping my employees fed, which is enough. But like I run a nonprofit for profit, you know, which is like a full-time life that I live on top of this other full-time life of trying to run a movement and then on top of the other full-time life of trying to make enough money consulting. To pay for the other two lives, you know what I mean? And so like I'm always in trouble. And I'm always challenged. It's never easy. And so it what's fucking funny is that when people look at me, they always get a sense that I am perfectly in control. I have confidence. They think this guy never needs help. That's it, man. People think I'm all set. Yeah. And and the truth is that none of that is speaker-0: Look at the hat, man, like speaker-1: True. And I don't I don't lie. I don't, you know, people ask me, I tell them, but they don't seem to want to believe it. And so, in an interesting way, in kind of the same way that it's hard to explain my life because I would have to mind meld, and I it was hard to explain how all of this experience serves me in this moment. Because again, if you don't have it, it's hard to explain it. People already read me as arrogant, which is not a thing, I think, but people read it that way. So it's especially hard for me to. talk about myself without sounding like an asshole. right. She has a strong opinion. Right. But I say all of that to say like, dude, it's crazy how I had to take such a wild journey to get to a place where like there are no gaps in my knowledge here. I know exactly what I'm doing. I know the problem completely. I know what I'm doing. I know the oligarchy. I know the political problem. I know speaker-0: Marjorie Marjorie Taylor Green. Big difference. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: I understand the lay of the land. The battlefield awareness is 100%. The theater is clear to me. My battle assets are clear to me. I just have to get people motivated and put them in the right place. So when to go back to very long-winded answer to your question, how do I do this? I know where the pieces need to be and I know what motion they need to be taking. My only challenge is generating that reality. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And for example, the fact that I suck at fundraising. I don't suck at fundraising because I don't know how to ask strangers for money. I suck at fundraising because I have a very difficult time even asking my friends for money. Yeah. Yeah. For real. I just I have something about that and about my myself come into direct conflict. And by the way, I have a lot of friends that could help me. I just don't know how to ask them. Nor would I. I I consider it outside the parameters of friendship for some speaker-0: Yep. Right. speaker-1: But I wish I could because the problem I have is not a lack of a strategy or that it's worth look, people always ask me, where are the results? When is something gonna happen? And what I tell them is we just had a unanimous election. Democrats won everything they could have won, and they have a party approval of 22%. Yep. So that wasn't them, that was us. The Epstein files almost unanimous, one vote, short. That was us. A minute ago, they were ungettable. The Democrats were trying. They couldn't get him. Changing the conversation and it's working. If I had $10 million to get this thing done right, it'd be a matter of months because the way the when we built the strategy, it's all about creating probabilistic changes. So, for example, he is unhealthy generally. So we have a very clear strategy for stressing him the fuck out. speaker-0: Yeah we've Yeah. speaker-1: I literally have a council of psychiatrists who help me stress them the fuck up. I also have a military council that helps me understand where the Pentagon is at. I have I've built an infrastructure for dealing with this problem, not to represent it the way that charities do. Charities don't exist to ex to solve problems. They exist to fundraise off the problem. They represent the problem. Think about it. The market dimes was originally about polio or something, then polio was solved. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: The market dimes did not stop existing. They said, we need a new disease, motherfuckers, right? speaker-0: They kept on marching. Yeah. speaker-1: The difference between me and the March of Dives is that as soon as Donald Trump is dead and removed and we we land this plane, I gotta get the fuck out. I don't need another thing to march about ever again. Yeah. Partly because I'm so fucking broke that I gotta go fix that problem immediately. Like but my point is that I'm not here to represent the problem. And so I've built a strategy, three phases. Phase one was national protests, get people out the door and activated, create the kind of momentum. speaker-0: But speaker-1: That generated the election result. Now we're politically aligned. The entire country is moving in the same direction. Forty-three percent of Americans identify as members of this movement. That is a greater share of Americans that than the ones that identify as Democrats, Republicans, or MAGA. So we have the highest identification rate of any political organization in the country, the movement as a whole, right? That's part one. Phase two, direct action. We started that on September 2nd. The idea is to put pressure directly in people's faces, make sure they feel us. What is that leading to? Along with the political reality, now you're putting pressure in people's faces. Their kids are asking them, Dad, mom, why are a bunch of people outside the house calling you a Nazi? That changes the conversation. And it's leading to a bunch of retirements on the Republican side. Because those two realities are compounding. Marjorie Taylor Greene being a perfect example of that. speaker-0: Mm. speaker-1: But we're seeing it and we're gonna keep seeing it because even at though afton lost in Tennessee, that's a 12-point swing. So if you won by less than 12 points, you have you have problems, right? Never mind that this is pre-Epstein files. Yeah. Which was also a conversation that we engendered during the campaign. They talked about pedophilia. I happen to know that about 30 to 40 percent of Americans know what that word means. So when we brought it back, we started talking about child rape, and I think you've seen. I don't know if you guys remember that game where the you would pong the ball into the little area and it would just destroy as many squares as it could, and then it would come back out and you'd try to get it back in. So Epstein is the little ball that keeps giving because we're talking about child rape. And the moment people understand it that way, it's a tougher moral problem to overcome. And we saw a near unanimous vote on that. All of these things, my point, guys, is whether or not we have done them directly or indirectly. speaker-0: yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. speaker-1: Strategy, what it does is it creates greater probabilities of certain things happening and conditions for things to happen. So we push him on his health, we push him on Epstein, we push him on the politics, right? We try to change that one by one. As these dominoes fall, the probabilities for our our outcomes go up and it the probabilities for his outcomes go down. And we just keep making decisions in keeping faith with the strategy. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And the outcome manifests. And what's funny is when you do my job right, it feels like it happened organically. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: It just you don't win an election, you win an election. Meaning if you do the a good if you do this electorally, your candidate was always gonna win at the end. It never felt in doubt. But the reality is it's very clear thinking. And the best part about it is I don't have to recruit the entire squad to execute it. Cause if I'll give you an example. If you went to Google and you connected with every manager of every department in Google in a single email, and you said the new strategy at Google is Google is data. That's it. Three words, Google is data. Now go execute that strategy. Everybody who makes a physical device would replace that with building the data backbone, right? Rather than building the self-driving car, Google would build the data backbone for the self-driving car or whatever. changes it would make. Now, in a decentralized way, if every manager responsibly implements the same strategy, the entire organization changes and and looks like that strategy. But there doesn't need to be even centralized management driving that. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: It's about getting the molecules to reorder themselves because of new DNA. Does that make sense? All you have to do is give the right instruction, and the entire organism reshapes. So the beauty of being me is that I don't have to have everybody working directly for me. All I have to do is create incentive structures for them to join our strategy. So, for example, in the case of Indivisible, which is an organization that I don't even talk to. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: For many reasons. But most recently, first they were doing national protests, then they kind of carried on in that one too long. And then they were like, what are we going to do next? And then they announced the No Kings Alliance, which is an effort to do direct action. And then they said that they were going to have an election season primary program, which is phase three of our strategy. And basically now they have the same strategy. Now, did I motivate them to do that? Probably because. People had written about our strategy and they probably read it and thought, good idea, right? But I'm not, but even if I even if they hadn't. The fact that my vision was so clear that they have come to it is affirming that my vision was the right one. And that's what's happening organically. And to be honest, not only do I not need ownership, I don't give a fuck whether I get credit for anything I do. 90% of the work I do today, for example. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yeah. speaker-1: involves like opposition research where we literally put most of the shit you read that's horrible about Trump officials is put there by somebody in in many cases me. Nobody will ever find out it was me. Because I'm used to operating fully behind the scenes. I'm a right hand guy. I make other people look good. I started as a speech writer, as a consultant, everything I do is tuned to getting other people to earn credit. That I have been directly involved with two New York Times number one bestsellers. I've never written a book. Damn. Do you know what I'm saying? And so my point is, even that part of my personality and of my history, the fact that I don't need credit, that I don't care. I just don't give a fuck. I really don't. I'm also smart enough to know that if we win the fight, credit is gonna be a a radical resource that everybody's claiming. And speaker-0: Okay. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Frankly, like the satisfaction of knowing you did a job is way better than anybody telling you you did a good job. Once you know, you know what you did, you know what you did. And honestly, I can that's plenty for me. But my point is, guys, all I'm trying to do is I have a very clear vision of how we beat Donald Trump. What I lack is resources. And part of the reason I lack resources is because this conversation that we're having, this is the first time I've had it. Because nobody's ever bothered to ask me, hey Carlos, where are you coming from on this? Now think about it. If your guys are the first ones to be engaging in this way, how am I gonna earn the trust of the broader community so that people say the woman, the racist woman at Cinnabon has outraged American opposition? She in a day she raised more money than we have raised since we started. And what's funny is when I first started, I thought. This sucks because I have no money. Now I'm like, check out what we've done with like eighty grand. And now it's a weird thing because I'm not sure I want money anymore. It just makes it it makes it fucking harder. speaker-0: Hey, here's a lesson. Here's a lesson right now. Shut up. Let the money come in. You be quiet. I'm your business manager. speaker-1: All kidding all kidding aside. All kidding aside, I need no, we we really do need money. I want to do a billboard campaign, and that's and it's expensive. I you have to build an app and it's expensive. But my point to you guys is no, it is interesting because strategically, from like a challenge perspective, the fact that we've done this with a week of what protect democracy spends, yeah, and that if you compare our results, there you can't you can't compare our results. speaker-0: Is it isn't this what Latinos do though? Like just like from the the inner streets, no matter what streets you are in, you find a way to make speaker-1: Just made you find a way to make shit happen. That's it, but you know, that's a cultural thing that you just referenced. That is very true. But if I went to a white American and I said exactly what you just said, they would they would not know what you're referencing. yeah. And what I tell people is what's the main difference between the Dominican Republic and Puerto Rico? In Puerto Rico, when you had a natural disaster, the US money would come in to help prepare it. speaker-0: Yeah. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: When you had a hurricane hit the Dominican Republic, we were on our fucking own. speaker-0: Is Dominican Republic? Yes. Is Dominican Republic and the Dominicans in the streets of Chicago? I was I was shaking hands trying to collect money for yeah. Where when when it happened to Puerto Rico, when it happened to Santo Domingo, I was out there hustling. Right. Yeah, dude. speaker-1: We have we have to look out and we have to make things out ultimately right. And ultimately all those things are like hard to disassemble. But that's what drives and that's why I can do this with money or without money. Cause sure dude, it doesn't I mean, I I would much prefer to wake up every day and not be need based, because that's where I am now. Like fifty percent of my thinking or more has to go to like how am I gonna pay my bills, which I'm not doing very well. speaker-0: Family bro. Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: But if I could wake up tomorrow with a budget of 10 million dollars to do what I think we need to do, I think Donald Trump wouldn't last two months. No, for real. And I'm not like dooting my own horn. I just know what I could do. And it's Stephen Miller has a hundred million, and I'm not asking for a hundred million like Stephen Miller. I'm saying if I had 10 million, fuck you, Donald Trump's gonna gonna die of the stress. speaker-0: All these guys have unlimited money, they make money. They they literally print money and and and guys that are scraping and scraping trash and got and got bubble gum and tape and we're making shit happen. Like Yeah. Yeah. I had to explain to people. I'm having a conversation with Carlos. And it's not this is not a hobby. speaker-1: It happened, man. No. This is this is a speaker-0: job this is why am trying to build a company i am trying to i don't have i have a camera and a nice computer screen that's all i got all i got right next to me is my my speaker-1: Right. No, and we have no but that what's funny is you but you have your personal handler. speaker-0: But my AC unit is right here and I gotta you know, I'm in a two by two. speaker-1: No, no, no. Mine is listen. It's a six hundred square foot room. And the one is on the window behind that TV is the air conditioner. And it's a six hundred foot square foot room. The only thing Stephen speaker-0: And then Miller's on TV. Steven Miller's on TV talking about you don't make anything. You know, no, no, no, bitch. You don't make anything. We make speaker-1: It's not just that. It's not just that. We make shit happen, but more importantly, people fucking like us. That's too. And I'm not gonna like get too deep into it, but the culture is strong. Meaning, yeah, when I go dancing, when I go enjoy myself, when I disconnect, I don't get to disconnect very often from this shit. But when I do, I I belong somewhere, man. I'm Dominican. Superpower. I come from a place. I know where I matter. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: My family every time I go back to the Dominican Republic, people are like, I knew your grandfather and your great grandfather helped my great grandfather. And like there's there's ties that bind us here. Yeah. it's the greatest gift I ever got was to be born in that majestic place, that mess of a fucking country that is also a prodigy country. Because Dominicans were 10 million, but we every city in the world dances our music every night. It's a culture of we think we also know. speaker-0: You can't go to a Mexican restaurant without hearing Sansa music. speaker-1: No, exactly. It's our our world is we're we're cultural superpower, 10 million people. Everybody in the world is following our lead on a lot of different things. And and it it and it's funny because like if you were to try to disassemble that, you think to yourself, like being in America and it's one of the sources of empathy. If you think about growing up white in in the US, you know. It's like imagine growing up without those challenges, without the power outages, without the lack of clean water. So you always had to boil everything. You had to I can tell you when water is ready, bro. I I don't nobody needs to tell me because I used to have to deal with with the parasites, you know, and take it that was my life. That's part of my life, right? I know things now. and when you know these things. You also know how to relate to other people and how to need people and how to connect with people and how that works and how it takes a village when they talk about that. How, like my my best friend's mom could spank me, and then I would complain of my mom, and my mom would in front of me call her and go, Thank you. You know what I'm saying? There was trust. There was trust. Yeah. and and it wasn't abusive, it was love, and you know, it was just speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: the Dominican way. Yeah. And so to have been privileged enough to grow up in that and to know the things that I now know. You know? How to enjoy a meal, how to enjoy friendship, how to make friends and not lose them, how to invest in people. speaker-0: How to not take how to not take things so seriously and so personally. speaker-1: Right. How to let go? How to forgive. Being speaker-0: and being called names and stuff like that. That's just that's just part of the game. speaker-1: Dude, if in the Dominican Republic, whatever your biggest flaw is will become your nickname. So I mean I love speaker-0: yeah. I'm not Dominican, but I get it. I get it. speaker-1: No, no, no, no. Dude, whatever you No, no, no. There's a there's a true story. I'm not gonna name names, but this is a true story. There was there was a guy I knew, and he was known for having a a long a big dick. He was the guy with the big dick when I was a kid. And one day there was a girl who was on top of. Yeah, exactly. speaker-0: Telling my story. speaker-1: no, this is a true story. So the guy, the girl was on top of him and she like fell to the side quickly without really considering things. He basically broke his dick. No, it wasn't me. No, yeah, it was Carlos Gomez. That guy to this day has never lived that down. Like that is he's a broken dick. speaker-0: Yeah, sorry, Carlos. speaker-1: For the rest of his existence. So part of part of what I appreciate about the Dominican Republic is that we are not dealing in constructs. Americans deal in construct. Because Americans are a social security number as far as they're concerned. They are part of such a big thing that they don't in the Dominican Republic, everybody's special. Primarily because they think they're special, but also because other people reward that. speaker-0: Yeah. huh. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: by making them feel special, even by insulting them sometimes. It's like I care about you and I care about your broke dick story. And now your nickname is is gonna be a reflection of the fact that I'm never gonna not remind you of this, you know. speaker-0: You don't if you don't have a nickname, you don't you nobody loves you. Right. Let me let me tell you, if you don't have a nickname, chances are nobody likes you. speaker-1: Right. Right. My nickname was Turpencito. My brother was called the Turpeng, and I was the Turpencito. And to this day, a lot of people, if you say Carlos did such and such, they would Who? And then you go Turpencito and they yeah. My other brother was Archie. My brother looked like Archie in the comic book, and he's Archie. His name is Eduardo. And there are legitimate people who do not know his actual name. They just know Archie. You know what I'm saying? speaker-0: In my family my my nickname was Cabeza de Torpedo. speaker-1: There you go. Did you go bald early? That usually means you went bald early and they don't want to ever free make you forget. speaker-0: Torpedo head. No, it's 'cause my my head is huge. My head is huge. speaker-1: I have that problem too. Again, whatever you're secure about, they're gonna turn into once you learn to love people, once you learn to love people and to give them the grace of love, you take them warts and all. One of the things that bothers me about our culture today, which actually bothers me on the left, is that we're canceling people. This idea of people saying something and you disagree with them and you never want to talk about them again, or you want them to lose their job or whatever. Fuck you. Pick your friends, make them your friends. speaker-0: They're gonna get you. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Take a morts and all. If they say something stupid, try to talk to them. But don't even make it that big a deal either, because we're all in this fucking thing together and nobody's perfect. And stop demanding that everybody's perfect because it is a form of tyranny to require everybody to agree with everything you think, even if you're right about everything. It doesn't fucking matter. speaker-0: And speaking politically, you're turning off half the country. speaker-1: Even even if you're right. You're just saying, dude, my way or the highway. You know, I I was given shit two weeks ago because of Gaza, right? And one of the things that I've looked I may not have earned much in this life, but I've earned the right to have an opinion about activism, in my opinion. And somebody was asking me about Gaza, and I said, Well, the I've worked in Gaza. I speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: I can't tell you how much I love that region and how much care I have for the people and the victims of this heinous crime. and I need it to stop yesterday. And I need Benjamin Netanyahu to be put in prison for war crimes along with his entire cabinet. And I need Israel as a country to make a determined attempt to try to repair this, not just for their own people, but also for Jews around the world that are facing anti Semitism because of the government's actions in particular around Gaza. So that's where I sit on Gaza. I need it to end tomorrow. Like now, this minute. I've lived it. I've been on the ground. I've helped negotiate for solutions for the people of Gaza. But I see this activism now that is pretending to be about Gaza, but doesn't actually do anything for the people of Gaza. They just turn it into a purest around like they they start throwing language around, like they know what it means. They start using the term Zionist. They start accusing people, including by the way, me of being a Zionist. And I'm like, First, I don't think you know what that means. Secondly, I think you're using it to mean Jew, which I think is a problem because that's generating anti-Semitism here for people who have nothing to do with what's going on. But but separate from all of that, like I don't even think you've been to Gaza or know what that's all about. Like, I don't understand. I don't think you understand the complexities enough to try to solve the problem properly so that it solves all rather than just. Talking out your ass and saying whatever you think and thinking that you're right because you're using language that sounds specific. What I want is better activism for the people of Gaza so that the results start now. And under Donald Trump, yelling at Democrats is not going to get you anywhere because Democrats can't even fix their own situation, let alone fix a global situation. So any anger you direct at Democrats right now from an activism point of view is anger that should be better aimed at other things. Like uniting Europe against what Israel is doing, or getting China on board, which would be a massive game changer. Or you know what I'm saying? Like tangible shit that can be done. You could even convince the Russians more easier than you're gonna convince Trump to try to effect some positive change in Gaza. And all of those things, if you think asymmetrically, may lead to better results for the people of Gaza. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: But what they're actually doing is pressling themselves into a place where they're not only not doing activism for Gaza, but they're alienating people politically here in the US, and they're undermining Democrats like Kamala Harris took a hit in Michigan and in other places because of it. So, like all bad, right? None no result is better. And the only they'll tell you, well, Democrats are just as bad as Republicans. No, they're fucking not. Even the most APAC. Corporatist Democrat is still better than the Republicans on the issue of Israel, period. I don't care what your position is. If you if you that is a true statement, that doesn't mean to say that we can't get rid of all the APAD corporatist Democrats. We have to. But right this minute, we need to do something for the people of Gaza on the ground. And people are giving shit about this. And I'm thinking to myself, like, if I haven't earned the right to have an opinion on activism. Right. Then who the fuck has earned the right to any opinion, let alone the people that are accusing me or misrepresenting my opinion to try to make me seem out to be the bad guy. Dude, I'm I'm the greatest ally you can have. I agree with you on everything, but apparently I can't agree with you hard enough. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: And my point is, like, whether it's in friendship or in politics, you gotta meet people where they are, and you gotta be able to take incremental progress, and you gotta right and relate to everybody and figure it out and say, How do I deliver better results for the people of Gaza? Well, I'm gonna have to swallow some some shit because I'm gonna go talk to evangelicals. Because it turns out that the evangelical church may have speaker-0: Relate to them. speaker-1: Some open areas where we may be able to negotiate for humanitarian access because Christians have been hugely supportive of the state of Israel and they have a lot of say so. And maybe you should be meeting with every fucking pastor who has significant influence, and you're they're gonna be MAGA and they're gonna you're gonna hate them. But if it helps you deliver a better result or get some humanitarian aid in, it might be worth making a deal. There is no room for that in the current paradigm. And so my point to you guys is it sucks sometimes to be the real deal in a world where most people are full of shit because I'm sitting here going, I know exactly I've always felt about the people of Gaza. I love them. I need their misery to end this minute. I'm also keenly aware of the complexities of the issue because I've worked in the region. I've worked in Israel, I've worked in Lebanon, I've worked in Jordan, I've worked in in Gaza and in the in the West Bank. I understand Iran's position. I understand the Saudis' position. I've been there and nobody's been able to solve it. Not for lack of trying. It's a fucking complicated problem. You always end up at Jerusalem. And what are you going to do with Jerusalem? And nobody other than one book by a fictional book written by a British author. No one has ever had a really good idea on Jerusalem, other than one dude writing fiction. That's how bad this problem is. The guy chanced upon it. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: In a book called First Among Equals, there's actually a pretty decent pr potential solution. But other than that, like nobody we it's an intractable conflict for a reason. And like to see influencers take it and run with it as if they know just reminds you of how full of shit this generation is is and allows themselves to be, which is a very frustrating place to sit where I'm sitting because the stakes here are the death of America. Yeah. And I'm still arguing with people over whether I meant it enough when I said that I wanted the situation in Gaza to get better. And like me personally dealing with that charge after all I've done, rather than having those people come to visiting speaker-0: Yeah. The play. Starting different coalitions here. speaker-1: And I'm st I'm no I there. speaker-0: You don't believe me? Yeah. And again, this falls on this falls on like people don't believe that that stuff is terrible. You don't need to see a city that has been bombed and people dead for you to acknowledge the fact that that situation sucks. And it's happening. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. Not only that it sucks, but ideally, and it's kind of my point is Look, we can be a Kim we can enjoy Kim Kardashian's reality shows. We can even elect Donald Trump. But if you want to solve this problem, it's going to require real wisdom and solutions to problems that have existed long before Trump. In the context of Gaza, it's about fixing the Middle East at an age where it's never been more broken. So it's harder than it was when Clinton was trying to solve it or when speaker-0: Yep. speaker-1: Reagan was dealing with it or when you know, Nixon was dealing with it. so it's harder. But the approach we're taking to everything, including Trump, is an influencer approach. Most of the people, like for example, and that's look, one day I posted something negative about Aaron Parnas. And my my thought was the kid's like 20 something. And he's the most trusted news voice in America. And I don't have a problem with Aaron Parnas as an influencer trying to develop a news career. I think that's fucking amazing. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: But there what is the difference between Aaron Parnas and Walter Cronkite? About 40 years of making tough decisions, which give you wisdom, experience, life experience that you distill into wisdom so that you know better. And Aaron Parnas cannot get that without having done it because you can't cheat it. And I got dude, it was like half the world turned on me. It's like a cult, kind of like how MAGA's a cult. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: The Parnas cult came after me and go, How are you talking shit about Aaron? I'm like, what are you? It is undebatable. The kid is 20 something years old, has been doing this for exactly three years. Yeah. Like, what the fuck are we talking about? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. And honestly, if we think that Aaron Parnas is prepared to be the voice of news, when the stakes are the future of the United States of America. Then we are video gaming real life in a way that doesn't fucking comprehend the severity of what we're talking about. And are we so spoiled that if this country were to fall to fascism and therefore the world might end because of the this destabilizing impact that that would have on literally everything else, if we can't understand the consequentiality of what we're dealing with and the adulthood that we need to bring to it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And the lack of ego, because if you're not the right person, you gotta be able to step out of the way and say, I am not the right person for this. speaker-0: That's one of the big problems. speaker-1: And I'm telling you, man, we are thinking that we can because of this culture where that the influencer rather than the real thing, we are thinking that we can do real things without knowing real things. And that's a real fucking problem. And I don't know how to fix it, man. But if we don't fix it, we're gonna have a serious issue getting this this fight done. speaker-0: Yeah. Like it's like thinking you know how to fly and you just jump, you know, you jump out of a window and speaker-1: Right. No, it's it's there's a better analogy, which is you've been playing Microsoft Flight Simulator your whole life, but you never got in a plane. And you just think I know how to fly. And by the way, on paper, hypothetically, yeah, you've been in a simulator, but you don't know what a fucking wind gust feels like at the exact moment of landing and what to do physically to tune yourself to that to make sure the plane lands safely. Right. And it's that problem. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: By the way, that problem may not appear 99 times out of 100, but the number 100, you're fucking dead. And so my my my thing is like I don't I feel it feels a little bit crazy to me that I just don't get how people have not internalized the severity of the problem. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: The consequentiality of the problem is allowed to continue to grow unabated, the fact that they voted for this fucking guy in the first place. And whatever the fuck is going on with those people and their lack of seriousness about the country and about themselves and about their vote and about their responsibility as citizens. Like, are we just in a fucking video game where nothing matters? Because the reality is I can solve Trump. I'm pretty sure I can solve Trump. I got lucky. And when I say I, I mean I don't need to. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: trust that anybody else can. I think I can. With the right strategy and the right coalitions and the right thing, I know I can guide us out of this. But is it gonna be good for anything if we continue to be a team Kardashian country? Because we've gone from Duke Ellington to Michael Jackson to Justin Bieber. We've speaker-0: Exactly. Yep, tell them. And now and now AI. And now AI. speaker-1: From Shakespeare to Fifty Shades of Gray, from fucking John F. Kennedy to Donald Trump. And to make it more specific, from Abraham Lincoln to Donald Trump is the history of the Republican Party. speaker-0: Sor F. Yeah. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And we're still claiming progress. speaker-2: Thanks speaker-1: And I'm sitting here going, I get the progress. speaker-0: Probably we've been arguing the same points for hundreds of years. speaker-1: Yeah, because it progress the the oppression doesn't end because we're existing within the system. You have to uproot the system to uproot the oppression. It just gets redesignated. speaker-0: Exactly. I was just watching something about I was just watching something, but I didn't mean to interrupt. I was just watching something with Jordan Peel, how he's talking about the the originator of cowboy and how they were black people. Okay and and then how everything just like man, it's cool to be a cowboy all of a sudden. How did they talk about did he talk about how cowboy was actually like a disparaging term? Right, yeah, there you go. speaker-1: change. Yeah. They were black. speaker-0: And all of a sudden they they it was it was you know, the everything became cool and like, man, like speaker-1: And I would I would venture further, guys. Most of what we consider American culture is derived from the African American experience. And I'll tell you why. Culture, culture is a mechanism for societal coping. Culture is how we deal with the fact that we're fucked. The reason Dominicans are 10 million, but we're a cultural superpower is because we've been fucked since 1492. And the entire time we've been locked on an island that at many times has been split between Haiti and the Dominican Republic. So there's internal strife. And we've never had an out. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. France is still fucking Haiti. speaker-1: France is Haiti, Spain is the US, and the Americans are everywhere invading us at one point. And like we've been fucked the whole time. And at some point, Dominicans came together and said, We're not gonna be fucked all the time. We're gonna find joy. So, as a society, in order to have an exhaust valve for all the shittiness, we're gonna find music and we're gonna find food and we're gonna find each other and we're gonna build a society together. Now, America. If you're a white American historically, the struggle was wrapped up in progress. So when the first settlers arrived, Western expansion, you think of all of the progress that was made. And while a lot of people didn't win, right, there were a lot of poor white people, and there always have been and there always will be. But the general cultural thrust was progress, right? So after World War II, when American white people suffered tremendously, a young A generation of young white men, particularly, went to war and saw horrible things and they came home. Rather than build a culture together, they built the interstate system and the modern economy and all these things. After the Civil War, similarly, the railroad and all of that, right? Economic progress became the American way to cope. And I mentioned that because there was one insular group of people that suffered the whole fucking time, and that was black people. speaker-0: Hm. speaker-1: And in their suffering, they created barbecue, rock, blues, jazz, country. They literally provided the entire country. Yeah, very much. All of those sounds are derived from African cultures. Down to the mu you think about the musical scales, you think about the drums, you think about all of these things as descended from an speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. They agree. speaker-1: From the African American experience. And so I laugh when Americans talk about American culture because I think to myself, the hamburger is German. The you know, one of the few things that white people have real claim to is film as an art, as an art form. But even then, some of the greatest developments in film came from the African American experience and some of the the dances and the early days of swing dancing and all of that. All of that was being derived from that experience, including by the way, the fact that the first real integration that happened was at dance clubs in places like New York and Chicago where you where they could where it could happen. And so How can you be so ungrateful to a population of people that have provided your cultural backbone and your way of dealing with the shit? And the interesting thing about the Trump period to me is that now that because again, because we lived in a closed kind of system, we're not uprooting the system and removing the oppression. We're just reallocating it. And right now, for about the last 40-50 years, more. Suffering has been allocated to white people than at any point in our history, and they lack the cultural mechanisms to deal with it because they don't culture is a product of an experience that is unique to you. When I'm Dominican and I grew up in Dominican culture, it's my way of channeling things. I can't just give you my culture and you use it to channel your shit because that doesn't speak to your unique experience and to your unique suffering, right? So it's like your culture is tuned to your experience. If you have a population of people who are suffering for the first time in history in a way that they can't grow out of, meaning they can't build interstates, and they need a mechanism for coping. And the one that they think is theirs is pro was provided by black people and brown people. Yeah, they are not getting better because they're not actually dealing with their own issues. They're trying to deal with their own issues with black and brown medicine. It's not the same disease. The disease is tailored to their unique struggle. And that's not to say they're not struggling. Right. Because they are. And in their own minds, they are victims. And that is also a fair judgment from a first person perspective. speaker-0: Let's sprinkle this in there. There's a lot more poor white people than there are rich white people. speaker-1: One million person and the struggle is real. The problem is that you you look, they had to introduce crack in the black communities to keep black people under control after redlining. So that was done to black people. They were the victims of that experience. speaker-0: And they were raising money for militia dying. speaker-1: No, but but but my point is that was created outs that was brought into that community. Right. And it was a challenge that that community, an external challenge that that that community had to deal with. speaker-0: Right. That wasn't part of their culture. speaker-1: No, my point is that the opiate epidemic is a very different animal because it is the product of a lack of a proper functioning coping system because they don't have they don't genuinely have a culture that's native to their experience. And we don't in America so big that you have like some people like the Mennonites or whatever that are small communities that that serve each other and that are, you know, the Amish, et cetera. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: But as a general country, white people have many different cultures. Appalachia is very different from California, very different from Oregon. So you can't just port over. Yeah. And because the people around you keep changing, because people keep moving and moving in, you don't really know the people around you. They're not invested in you in the way that they might be in the Dominican Republic, because they don't get to move. They've lived next to your family forever, and they're gonna live next to your family forever. And they're in it with you. You know what I'm saying? And so this is not to Cast as Persians on white people. In fact, I feel a lot of strong empathy for the white community that is struggling and turning to Trump or turning to opiates because I know what the problem is. And the problem is that they don't have a healthy mechanism for socializing their pain, which is very real. And we can't build one on the spot. It requires them turning inward and turning towards each other and building those bridges. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And you can't do it for them. And those of us who know what it feels like to have a cultural backbone can clearly diagnose the problem, but we can't solve it because I can't lend you merengue because you're gonna think it's too loud and obnoxious. You know what I mean? It's like speaker-0: Hey, these these fuckers have been going to Puerto Rico complaining that the coquet makes too much noise. Then don't fucking go. speaker-1: Right. Too much noise. Well, but here's the thing. You talk about noise. Noise is the exact right word. Think about this. When Americans want a condition of peace, what are the words that they use? They say, I want peace and quiet. I don't know a single Dominican that would identify peace with quiet. Nope. Those two things. That's a really fucking problematic one. Because we are not quiet. We exist in a constant volume of 10 and it goes to 11, bro. In honor of Rob Ryder, it goes to 11, bro. Because batata can only be played at a volume or they can hear you three times over. speaker-0: If they shake the bows in your body there's an extinction answer, I live in Colorado, which speaker-1: Right. And so it's an overwhelmingly white city, and people pursue peace and quiet. And I've seen my neighbors complain literally have arguments over the roots of a tree growing from one yard into the next yard. Like that's a real and my point is that my culture is not gonna address the challenges faced by those people, it's just not, and I can't build on one. But until we solve for that problem. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: the Kardashians, Justin Bieber. All of this degradation that we're seeing, I see it as a direct result of that unresolved frustration being used to undermine everything and destroy it all rather than surrender. speaker-0: Mm, mm, mm. speaker-1: rather blow it up than fix it because fixing it is daunting. speaker-0: You know how many times I've said they would rather break it than play fair? speaker-1: Right. And then wanna but that's not but I just want to be very clear. From their perspective, it seems like the easier option. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Playing unfair is the easiest way out. So let's not be so limited to say we don't understand why. We get it. speaker-0: It and that's why they don't want to detach from this this this cult. speaker-1: They they not just the cult of Trump. The cult well, no, to be fair, they're not winning, and that's what's happening. And they're not winning at a rate that's actually kind of quick. And and and but the problem is that if they would rather fight a war than uproot the system or redraft the system, then they will they can cause a war. So the question of how strong white supremacy is going to hang on. speaker-0: they're winning. speaker-1: determines the outcome. speaker-0: And all you need to do is play baden. That's all you have to speaker-1: If I had a if I had a way to mind meld with every American and send them one message, I would just want them to understand what it feels like. To be part of something with other people. What it feels like to be Dominican. No, not even. What it feels like in my case to be Dominican. Because the cultural sustenance that I get from belonging in a country that I no longer live in still carries me to this day and allows me to be empathetic towards people that are not like me. Because I have a healthy mechanism for dealing with my frustrations. And for socializing my frustrations. I have a lot of friends I can call. I have a lot of music I can listen to. I have a lot of words I can write or read. There's a there's a famous Dominican poem called Hay un país en el mundo. There is a country on earth. It was written by the poet Laureate of the Dominican Republic. And I swear to you guys, every once in a while I just pull it out and I read it out loud because it reminds me of who I am. And If everybody had that, just that one thing, a mechanism for socializing and channeling their pain constructively. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: We would not be where we are today. Because part of our problem is the lack of surrender of what they know as culture is dominance. But dominance is not culture. And culture isn't dominant. Culture is inherently non-dominant. The idea is I'm down and others will pick me up. speaker-0: Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. speaker-1: Or somebody else is down and I'm gonna pick them up. And whether we do it directly or indirectly, I buy the CDs that feed the musician that makes the music that makes another peep person feel better. And we're all in it together. And if I don't buy the CD and a bunch of other Dominicans don't buy the CD, by the way, we're only 10 million. The CD sales are limited. So we all have to really be in it to get a musician. Right. You gotta support. You know what I'm saying? You gotta support. speaker-0: Yeah. You better make a banger. speaker-1: Because when I was a kid on Tuesdays they would issue the new albums and you have to support your people. And you have to buy them without listening to them. You have to have faith. speaker-0: It's gonna be hard. speaker-1: That's no no, yeah. And then you listen to it on the radio. I already have this one. And it was part of like being together and connected. And so the problem we have is that we have to build a culture for particularly for poor white Americans. We have to build a mechanism for them channeling their anger, frustration, and hurt constructively together in a healthy fashion. Yeah. Otherwise, this problem will continue to haunt us and will eventually defeat us. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Because we cannot control the outcome if a bunch of disillusioned white people decide they'd rather burn it all down than share. speaker-0: There's so many layers, man. There's the there's a we have to like everybody's angry about something, right? Like everybody's black or brown people are mad at white people, you know, for for for all the everything that's that's gone on in the past. But we have we of course have to be the the ones that say, okay, we know you fucked up. I'm gonna help you for a minute. I'm gonna help I'm gonna help I'm gonna heal help heal you. And then we and then we do what we do. We we navigate. We help them navigate and then we bring them along and then we we all we all flow together and this is how this is how that culture develops where it's actually a culture. speaker-1: Here, right. Right. And and and my point to you is though, and this is the question, is that what we're doing? And so I look at us too. Meaning us in the movement, for example. There's a lot of people that insult MAGA all day, every day. That's all they do. And I'm one of those people sometimes. I fall prey to it, particularly when it's Marjorie Taylor Green. But if you notice, when you speaker-0: Right. Mm-hmm. speaker-1: You know, Carlos, you watch some of my speeches. I don't talk about I don't call people names. That's not my MO. Because I don't want to be practicing the wrong thing. And now sometimes I get very angry and I call somebody a name and sometimes it works. And I break Marjorie Taylor or whatever. According everybody thinks it was me, because she started behaving more reasonably the day after my mod my diatribe to Don Lemon. yeah. And I that and to be fair, I enjoyed every minute of that. But my point to you guys is we're also culpable. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Because we are losing track that the solution here has to be rooted in us, understanding that whether we like it or not, they control enough to destroy us all. And I don't know if you guys have watched that movie's TV show Silo, but I was thinking of Silo is on Apple TV, it's a fantastic show. But there's a there's an analogy from the show, which is at the bottom of the silo, there are the mechanical people that fix all the machines and the generator, and they keep the entire they keep the power and the water running. So they're keeping the silo alive. And there's this allegory in the in the show about everybody thinking that they are the reason that the silo works, right? Managers think that it it's them because they're managing it and everybody thinks that their part is the most important part. And part of my message to you guys and to this world is it doesn't really matter. Because whether we're right or not will not matter if they destroy our side. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: There is no additional satisfaction from being right. In fact, it's worse. Because if you're right and you get fucked by fascism, you're truly the worst person positioned for it. Because you're sitting there going, I was right the whole time and I still got fucked. In some ways, you're the in some ways being one of the bad guys is is in some ways a better way to fall because then you're like, We're winning, we're winning. shit, we're all dead. You know what I'm fucked. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: You know what I'm saying? So I promise you, no amount of arrogance or self-confidence or Self-blockage of saying we're not going to listen to them, we're not going to deal with them, we're just going to vote them out, and that's oppression. We're going to restrain them or restrict them. That's oppression. That's what we're fighting against. And the problem with the going to tie this all together, the problem with the perspective that we are right and they're wrong is that. It makes us immature in thinking that we can just call them names, insult them, and then push them to a corner. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Which actually perpetuates the problem and makes us the bad guys in real life. Cause we're then the ones oppressing them and then we just speaker-0: Yeah. And we haven't fixed it either. speaker-1: And we haven't fixed a fucking thing. So my and but the adult version of this, which is a much harder problem. It's a much more sophisticated problem. Because it's multidimensional and it exists in a continuum where time is also a factor. So it's not just what problems do you fix, is in what order do you fix them. To make so that you can create a solution that is not imposed but is adopted. And that addresses with problem problems as they emerge and creates opportunities as those problems are solved to solve other problems and to do it with intention. So that you're doing, you're fixing what needs to be fixed so that other things become possible, but you're doing it in a sequence that unlocks everything rather than siloing some problems and creating speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: The lack of access issues, right? I watched this. speaker-0: Speech of yours, and you said something that said, You said, stop thinking of things in terms of change, but in terms of innovation. speaker-1: Right. So think of d innovation is a continuum where you're you it's not just what happens, guys, it's in what order it happens, is what does A leading to B create for C. What becomes possible, and we're a democratic society, which means we don't think as a hive mind. We don't think in a unified way. So sometimes we chance upon the right sequence, but for the most part, we're not thinking intentionally about how to solve problems. The challenge for this movement, as I see it, is that I would rather solve these problems forever. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's the innovation. speaker-1: That's the innovation. It has to, because if we don't solve it forever, then we're just gonna have another Trump at some point. Even before the next Trump, we will fall to the Kardashians. Because what I mean by that is we are not taking ourselves seriously enough to continue to exist. And part of part of what you're about to see, which we haven't experienced yet, is the United States was number one in public education up until 1976, and it has fallen, it is no longer in the top thirty. We haven't yet fully felt. Right. But that generation's still working. The ones that new shit are still working. Right. The replaceability problem for that generation is a massive fucking problem. Especially in an age of technology where China is graduating 12 engineers for every one of ours. speaker-0: That's what I've been saying. speaker-1: Right, but but my point is think about the layering of all of our problems. Then think about the even if you had absolute power, you would still have to think very carefully about what do I solve first and second and third so that fourth becomes possible, fifth becomes possible, sixth, and so that I'm covering for everything and thinking for everything and accounting for everything, or at least as much as I can, so that the result. Із uly an uprooted system that is better. And then to do that in the midst of Trump, with Trump as president and controlling the levers of power, to do it in an international situation where Russia is ascendant, where China is ascendant, where Israel's lost its goddamn mind. Like all of these challenges are happening. This is a fucking impossible task. And all I can say is I feel very lucky to be the guy or one of the guys thinking about and girls, I should say, and it's not a sexist thing, but I am a man. but I feel very lucky to think to be in the position to try to help direct us. The reason is not just because I'm a strategist by trade, it's because I I think the thing that I see growing up in my circumstance is how serious this is. Because my original appreciation for America was a Dominican's appreciation for America. The fact that we have power all of the time, it still blows my f The fact that you can drink the water is speaker-0: Crazy. I have a cousin that I got to meet, or not meet, but I got to hang out with over Thanksgiving, where he grew up in Cuba. And though he, when when he was lucky, he got to go to the rich lady's house to take a shower. Right. And they knew that she was the rich lady because she had hot water. And the way she had hot water was a pipe coming out of the wall and an electric wire. Tapping that pipe, heating it up so it would heat up the water. speaker-1: There you go. No, listen, I grew up under very privileged circumstances and we still had to boil we had to heat up a bucket of water. Hot shower to exist. There was no native hot water coming from the pipes. That never that was never my experience in the Dominican Republic. I don't think up until recently I hadn't taken a hot shower in the Dominican Republic. To this day, when I go to my mom's house, a hot shower can only last about three minutes because that's the the amount of hot water that's available. speaker-0: In order for Yeah.