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From Refineries to Retirement: Peter Harriman’s Recipe for Healthy, Happy, Wise, Wealthy Leadership · Healthy Happy Wise Wealthy

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  Welcome back to Healthy, Happy, Wise, Wealthy. I have with us today someone
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  who I have known, let's say, my entire life, so.
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  Because that's accurate. This is my cousin, Peter Herriman.
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  So he has, he is a leadership consultant coach
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  right now, but he has been working
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  at the top levels in the oil and gas
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  industry for his whole career and was
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  leading things. And we're going to go into a little bit of what he, what
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  he did there, living around the world. But I wanted to have
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  him on because he has a lot of wisdom in terms of leadership because he's
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  been there and in some ways he's lived the American dream because he
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  retired at 50 and now can do with the work that he wants to
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  do when he wants to do it, which is, in, you know, in a way,
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  that's the American dream. Right. Which I'm, I
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  imagine that's not necessarily what you set out to do.
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  No, I never imagined that things would go the way they did 30 years
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  ago. But happy to share what I've learned
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  along the way and, and for sure, God's blessed me tremendously,
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  no doubt about it. And I've been given
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  some great opportunities and I've made the most of them and very
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  thankful for that. So I'm just an extremely thankful person at this
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  stage of my life. Yes. Yeah. And a wonderful person,
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  too. So tell us a little bit about your work history.
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  So to give listeners kind of a background on what you did all these years.
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  Sure. You know, that's a great question, and that's one that
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  many people ask me often. Right. What's your work background? And did
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  you have a career plan that you
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  mapped out and that you followed? And to be honest, the
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  answer is no, I didn't have a plan. When I finished high school, I really
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  wasn't sure what I wanted to do. I knew I didn't want to
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  study something for four years and then not use it or
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  not enjoy it. And I just, I needed some time to
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  just really explore and understand what the options were.
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  And so there was a local community college
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  nearby where I lived, and it offered a program that essentially
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  trains people and how to become entry
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  level technicians at a refinery or a power
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  plant or a gas processing facility. And I
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  took that course and completed it. And through that
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  I was able to get a job as an operator, a
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  technician with Amoco in southwest Wyoming,
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  in the small town of Evanston, Wyoming, and went to
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  work there and took what I had learned in school and learned
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  a lot more there at that gas processing facility.
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  A really Big one, worked with some great people and
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  had a chance to really get a perspective on what
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  engineering was like because I had a chance to work with engineers at
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  the facility. And it was the first opportunity
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  that I had to really visualize and understand and picture what an engineer
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  does. And I thought, you know, I, I think I could do that
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  and I could see myself doing that and I saw
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  the potential that it had and I liked that potential.
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  And so not long after my wife and I got
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  married, we moved to Denver, Colorado and I
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  studied chemical engineering at Colorado School of Mines.
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  It's a great school. And
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  graduated and joined BP British
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  Petroleum and
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  Amoco and BP merged in 1999. And
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  so essentially I've worked with BP
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  Amoco since January of
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  1994. And once I joined
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  BP as an engineer, I worked various engineering positions,
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  some in Wyoming. I had a chance to go work in Egypt and
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  be based in Cairo, but work out in the Western desert
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  and help manage, improve
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  and rebuild facilities out in the Western
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  desert. That was quite an adventure living in Egypt, which
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  and I really enjoyed. Then I had a chance to move to
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  Houston and go work offshore in the Gulf of Mexico.
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  That's what it was called at the time. I know it's changed names here recently.
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  It's, it's hard for me to get used to the new name because I worked,
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  I worked in the Gulf of Mexico, Gulf of America for many, many years.
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  But I worked as an engineer on a platform
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  called Mad Dog. It's an offshore floating facility.
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  I helped get it online, I helped get it
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  commissioned, started up and online. And
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  it's an amazing feat of engineering and it was a real privilege to be
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  part of helping get that brand new facility started up.
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  And that took about three years of my career. And
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  then I had a chance to move into an engineering team leader position
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  with a team that was getting ready to start up another really,
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  really big facility out in the Gulf of Mexico. In fact,
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  it's the world's largest offshore floating production
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  facility called Thunder Horse. And it's
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  truly, truly a feat of engineering and it
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  was a tremendous privilege to be part of helping get that facility up and
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  running online. And
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  unforgettable, it was just an unforgettable experience being part of that.
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  I worked there for about three years and then my family and I
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  moved to Baku, Azerbaijan and
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  I worked there as an engineering manager
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  for about three of the four years that we lived there. The last
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  year I moved into an operations manager role
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  and I had accountability for three really large
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  offshore fixed facilities in the
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  Caspian Sea. So BP is in
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  Azerbaijan supporting the Azerbaijani government and helping develop
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  the natural resources that are available that are
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  needing to be discovered and developed and, and processed
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  there in Azerbaijan. So that was a fantastic experience
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  to be part of that culture and, and just be part of
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  that team and that whole work environment there in
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  Azerbaijan for about four years. Then we moved
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  back to Houston and I worked as a, the operations manager for
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  the Thunder Horse Field and the Gulf of Mexico and
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  had accountability for all the activity that was taking
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  place there at the time. It was very, very busy. We
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  had some major projects in progress, a lot of
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  drilling activity in progress. And so it was
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  good to get experience in a significantly
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  high responsibility role. Right. With a lot of accountability for people
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  and budget and safety and
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  regulatory compliance as well. So did that
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  for about three years and then we were very
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  blessed to be able to move up to Alaska. And I
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  worked in Anchorage and was an operations manager
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  for Prudhoe Bay field. And
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  Alaska, without a doubt is the greatest place in the world
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  as far as a place to live. There's no better place.
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  The, the scenery, the mountains, everything,
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  everything. Nature is just on a whole nother scale there and
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  so is Prudhoe Bay. It's an amazing feat of engineering that
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  was first developed in the early 70s and is still going today.
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  It's the largest oil field in the western hemisphere
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  in Alaska. Yeah, that's Prudhoe Bay is way,
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  way up north on the north coast of Alaska right up against
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  the Arctic Ocean. And it's,
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  it warms up a little bit in the summer and gets really, really cold
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  in the winter. And
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  yeah, I've been up there when it's 80 below zero
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  and that's insane. Want to stay inside? You just want to
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  stay. Anyway, after
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  that we moved back to Houston. I worked as the
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  operations director for BP for all of BP's upstream
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  sector for about two years and then transferred to
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  Angola where I was accountable for all of
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  BP's operations in Angola.
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  And in 2022 was part of helping
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  form a new independent joint venture called
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  Azule Energy which essentially combined all
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  of BP's assets and any or
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  ENI's assets that they had also
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  developed in Angola. So ENI is an Italian
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  based, Italy based energy company and they
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  had done a lot of work to develop resources offshore in
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  Angola and BP and ENI made a decision to form an independent
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  joint venture which started up in 2022.
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  And I worked as the COO for Azule
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  Energy up until the point I retired in
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  February of 2024. So
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  that's a bit of a summary of my career and
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  a little bit impressive. Well,
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  many, many different things. There's a lot of variety in
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  my career, and I've met just amazing people and just
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  had endless wonderful
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  experiences working with great teams and great people all over the world.
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  Yeah. And I. And, you know, of course, since I've known you this whole time,
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  I remember back when you graduated high school and, you know, our
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  mother's talking or however I heard about, you know, Pete isn't going
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  to college, and we didn't know. You know, it's like, wow, he's not going to
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  college. It's like, what is he doing? Well, he's not sure what he's gonna do.
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  And. And I feel like that in and of itself is something
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  that's. There's people out there that need to hear that. Right. That, you know, you
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  don't have to know from the time you're in, you know, 5
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  years old or 10 years old, 18 years old, what you're going to
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  do with your life. It might take a few steps, and
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  you took a few steps and figured some stuff out, and
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  then you started in on the career that really, you
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  know, you've spent the good part of your working years doing.
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  Yeah. And, you know, there are people who have a
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  plan and it's very well mapped out, and. And they do
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  progress their career and their work life along that plan. But I would
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  say that's a small minority of people. What I think
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  is the key to success is just to make the most of every
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  opportunity that you have here today, right now,
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  and let that guide your interest and let that guide
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  what you're good at. Right. What your strengths are and how you can continue
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  to build those strengths and continue to
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  build those interests that you have. And typically that will lead
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  to a place and a role and a career that can
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  be quite rewarding. It'll open up more opportunities as you go
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  forward. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like that. That
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  reminds me of some life advice. When you don't know what to do, do the
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  next obvious thing. Did you ever hear that growing up? Yeah.
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  And it's actually really true. Yeah, it's very
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  practical. But I. And what. And you said. What
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  did you say? Take the advantage of the opportunities that are right in front
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  of you. Because. Is that kind of what you'd said? I felt like that was
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  really good and I wanted to highlight it. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think so
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  many people, they. They're desperate for a plan
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  and they want to map out a career that. That extends out
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  5, 10, 20 years into the future. But,
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  you know, to me, the best way to proceed is just to
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  take advantage, make the most of every task, every
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  role that you have, every opportunity that you encounter.
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  And, and, you know, I've,
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  I've. I've often been asked, you know, what does it take to be
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  successful at work? Or what does it take to
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  be successful in your career? And I've got a few things that
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  I've learned about what the answer is to that question. And,
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  but that's one of them is to make the most of every opportunity
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  that you have today in your current role, in your current
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  situation. Yeah, I love that. And you have
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  spent your whole life at various points and a lot of points,
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  living abroad. So I just want to have you tell
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  a little bit about growing up because you are fluent in Spanish.
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  Yes. Completely fluent in Spanish and English. And
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  didn't even in your growing up years live the whole time in the United
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  States. So tell us about that a little bit. Yeah, you're exactly
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  right. So I was born in Bolivia, and.
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  I don't think I knew that. I don't think. Oh, wow.
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  But I was young then, so I probably forgot that little note. No,
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  I think you were probably a year, year and a half old when I was.
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  Yeah. So, yeah, my parents were working
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  in Bolivia as missionaries when I was born,
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  and when I was six months old, they transferred with their
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  organization to Argentina. And
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  so I grew up in Argentina. And it's a
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  fantastic country. It's a fantastic culture,
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  beautiful people. In. In just so many ways,
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  I was very, very blessed to be able to grow up in that environment,
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  learn Spanish at the same time as English. We
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  would speak English at home whenever we were together in the house, and then
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  whenever I was outside running around with my friends, you know, I just would
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  speak Spanish. And so I didn't ever take any classes or
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  anything. I just learned Spanish and English at the same time as a
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  kid. And, and it just came natural. And
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  thankfully I've. I've not forgotten it, especially the
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  accent. That's the most important part.
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  You know, your vocabulary can get a little bit rusty if you don't use Spanish
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  for years on end. But what
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  matters most is the, the accent. You know,
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  that's. That's the most critical thing. I didn't know
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  that. So now that's new information to me. Oh, yeah, yeah. Accent
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  matters, especially in Latin America. You know, you could know where someone
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  is from almost instantly based on
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  their accent. Yeah. So what would you, what do you think are the Big
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  culture differences between Argentina and the US from, from
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  the years when you were there. Yeah, but you
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  know. Yeah, that's, that's a, that's a really good question, I think.
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  See, that's a really good question. So in
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  terms of values,
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  I think people in Argentina do value
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  family a lot.
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  So family means a lot. Family is tight knit.
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  I do think that in Argentina people take more time to
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  just enjoy time together and
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  they're maybe in less of a rush to be busy
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  and get things done. So the culture may not
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  be as, you know, hyper productive as we see here in the United States,
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  but people may enjoy their day
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  to day life maybe a little bit more just because of the fact that they
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  do take some time to enjoy the smaller things in life or
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  the conversations that you may have with people that you know every day.
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  And it's a little bit slower pace. But
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  it's, it's a really interesting culture. A lot of European influence in
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  Argentina combined with a lot of the
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  native, you know, native South
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  American cultures, it combined in a really interesting
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  way in Argentina. So yeah, it's a country
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  of many cultures and you know, a lot of different traditions and foods
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  and. But one thing that's for sure a top priority in Argentina
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  is football. And I'm talking soccer,
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  right? Yeah, you don't, you don't call it soccer
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  there. It's, it's football that's real football according
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  to people in Argentina. And it
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  is, it's on a whole nother level in terms of the
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  fanaticism. On a whole nother level, it's as if you took the
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  NBA, the NHL, the Major League Baseball and NFL
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  and college football here in the U.S. and combined it into
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  one. When the national team plays, for
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  example, in the World cup, which is coming up next year,
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  it is, it is all in intense.
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  Yeah. Yes. And, and I think I remember you saying some of
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  that. And, and when I lived in Atlanta, I went with a friend who
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  is, you know, grew up in Africa. So she,
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  she, I don't think she grew up watching soccer, but she, we
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  went anyway and that place was packed where we went. There's a
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  huge line around the block and it was for Atlanta, it was really, really
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  cold out that time too. We had double
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  winter coats on because we're not used to. But waiting in line to get
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  in to watch the World Cup. So yeah, you know, you saw a little bit
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  and it was an international crowd there that was so
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  it is not caught on yet in the United States. I mean, a little bit,
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  but not like that. Not quite. Not quite. But, yeah,
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  I had. I had the privilege of being in Argentina when they won the World
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  cup for the first time in 1978 and then
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  also in 1986. And
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  in both cases, the country just,
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  you know, for an entire week, just basically shut down to
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  celebrate and. Yeah. Have big
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  parades and big celebrations and everything just stopped and
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  everyone was having a big party for an entire week, you know.
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  Yeah. Yeah. I just can't even, you know, the
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  productivity, you know, what you're supposed to do in the United States, it just
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  can't. Can't even imagine us shutting down for a week. We'd be. We wouldn't
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  even being enjoying it. We would be in a panic.
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  I mean, some people would be enjoying it, but I think in
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  general, our culture doesn't allow that. So. So how old were you when you moved
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  to the US then? 15 years old. Yeah.
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  High school. Is that kind of the reason? Yeah. So where we lived
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  there, there was, you know,
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  an American certified school all the way up through eighth grade, but beyond that,
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  there was not anything local. And so my parents were
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  faced with the choice of either sending my brother and I off to boarding school
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  in another country or staying together as a family and
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  living in the US and so I'm really thankful that they chose
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  to stay together, keep us together as a family. And
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  we moved to North Dakota, which is quite a contrast to Argentina,
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  but that's where. That's where mom grew up and
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  where we had. That was a familiar place. Right. Because of
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  family and times that we had been there visiting.
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  Yeah. Yeah. And that's, you know, most of the times I've seen you in
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  life has been in North Dakota. It's definitely a sweet. Most
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  people have never been there, which is what you kind of realize in the United
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  States. There's probably a very low population of people that have been to North
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  Dakota. But it's beautiful and, you know, amazing,
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  amazing memories in a home that's been in the family now. And now you own
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  the home that's been in the family for how many years is it,
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  like, 70 years? It's been in the family for 70 years, right? Yeah.
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  So our grandfather, he purchased the home in
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  1955. So. Yeah, that's 70 years
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  now, isn't it? That's crazy. Isn't that crazy?
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  I don't think there's probably too many people that can say that they've have a
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  house in the family for 70 years. So that's. I'm very thankful for that,
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  for sure. Yeah. So do you Think this, this time in
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  your early life when you were, you know, did the expat, like, experience
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  and how that was formative, do you think that made it easier to say yes
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  to these different roles and adapt easier with all the travel you
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  did? Absolutely, absolutely. You know, one of the,
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  it was a tremendous gift to me to be able to grow up in another
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  culture. Right.
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  And to learn two languages. But one of the ways
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  that it was most beneficial is
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  you had to learn how to relate to people that maybe
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  didn't think the way you do or have the same habits or
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  same, you know, values as you
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  do or traditions. And, and so it
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  causes you to be open minded, right. To how to relate to people.
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  And the other good thing about growing up overseas is,
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  you know, for all my life or most of my life growing up, I
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  was a minority, right. As opposed to a
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  majority. And it
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  caused me to get better and more
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  capable in the space of getting to know people and relating
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  and understanding and listening. And those are some things that
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  really were tremendously valuable to me later when I
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  worked in Egypt or Azerbaijan or Angola.
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  Yeah. Just knowing that.
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  Just, just some basic things like listening well and respecting people
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  and not treating people differently because
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  of their job title or their family background or their,
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  you know, their work history or personal history. You know, treating everyone with,
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  with value and with respect. That goes a long way. That goes a long
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  way. That does. The last couple guests that I've had on, we've
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  literally touched on exactly these things you, you've said about how listening
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  is, is so key and being respectful of people of
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  different. Who aren't, who aren't like you. Yeah. Different
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  culture, different belief system, different values,
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  whatever it is. So you know that we can all be
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  respectful. Oh, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And,
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  and, and that's one of the things I've enjoyed the most about
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  working in different places. Just
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  learning how people tick. Right. And what is it that
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  motivates them? What, what is it that they value? And
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  in the work environment, that's really important to know as a leader. Because
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  that helps you communicate better. It helps you
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  bring people together in service of a plan. It helps, it
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  helps you rally people together in service of solving
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  problems or improving performance.
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  Relating in a way that's genuine is
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  extremely important. If you can't connect in a genuine way, it's going
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  to be very hard to be successful as a leader, especially in an
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  overseas environment where you're a foreigner. And,
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  and maybe people,
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  their first instinct is not to trust you or fully open
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  up and, and and so if you
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  can show yourself to be genuinely caring, it can
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  go a long way, a long way toward making a difference and being an
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  impactful, successful leader. Yeah, I heard a story about you.
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  I'm wondering if you remember this and, and can say more about
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  it. But, and this is, you know, through our mom's talking, I'm sure. Again,
• 24:23
  but it was about how you were in
• 24:27
  charge of a group and it might have been in the Gulf of Mexico in
• 24:29
  that time frame, I'm not even sure. But you were in charge of a group
• 24:32
  of, of guys. I think it was mostly guys who were not work out there
• 24:36
  and everyone and came into the, to the meeting and
• 24:39
  you go around and, and you wanted them to say something that they did
• 24:43
  well that week and they would talk about the things that they did wrong.
• 24:47
  Like, you know, and, and you say, let's start over again. You have to say
• 24:50
  what you did. Right. Do you remember that or is that accurate?
• 24:55
  Well, that's something that, that I tried to do
• 24:58
  intentionally as a leader. Right.
• 25:02
  I think communication really does matter a lot if you want to be a
• 25:06
  successful leader. And
• 25:10
  one of the things I tried to do as a leader, not just in one
• 25:14
  on one conversations, but also in team meetings or in, you know, a big
• 25:17
  setting like a town hall meeting is really
• 25:21
  celebrate success and recognize not just what people
• 25:25
  did, but more importantly how they did it. Okay.
• 25:29
  And you know, there's many people who consistently, day
• 25:33
  in, day out, carry out their job really well.
• 25:37
  And in fact they do it so well that it's, it's silent running.
• 25:41
  Right. They, they keep things
• 25:45
  running the way it should be. They follow process, they follow procedure and
• 25:48
  they do it so well that it doesn't create a crisis. Often we celebrate
• 25:52
  people who come in and resolve a crisis. We celebrate
• 25:56
  firefighting. But yeah, what I've
• 26:00
  tried to do, and it's really impactful is
• 26:03
  recognize people who
• 26:07
  are consistently doing work
• 26:11
  really well, delivering results, but not just describe what they
• 26:15
  do, highlight how they do it. Because when
• 26:18
  people hear that recognition of how you work, they tend to want
• 26:22
  to copy and paste that in, in, in their work style
• 26:26
  too. So I don't know if that
• 26:30
  links back to the, the exact example that you gave,
• 26:33
  but I've tried to do intentionally. Yeah. And you
• 26:37
  know, I don't think, I think what you just said is very brilliant. And I'm
• 26:41
  not even sure that I've ever heard anyone in the leadership space
• 26:45
  talk about that. I'm really not even sure. A
• 26:48
  lot of managers or leaders in business in general get kind
• 26:52
  of training on how to speak to people is. I just feel like
• 26:56
  that based on what I've seen and what, you know, you hear from people.
• 27:00
  It's not about being a bully or is it?
• 27:04
  No, no, it's not. And in fact,
• 27:09
  I have done everything I possibly can to not
• 27:12
  leverage my title. You know, I've had roles where I've
• 27:16
  had a lot of seniority, a lot of delegation of authority,
• 27:20
  and if I had chosen to, I could have leveraged it and
• 27:24
  just told people what to do. But I intentionally never, never
• 27:28
  did that. Instead, I tried to focus on
• 27:35
  leveraging the power of a plan. And,
• 27:38
  you know, that may sound a bit strange, but
• 27:43
  most situations that I've run into that are
• 27:47
  a mess or underperforming or
• 27:51
  where a group of people is demotivated or where
• 27:55
  business performance is below
• 27:58
  expectations, it is almost
• 28:02
  every single time the result of there being no clear
• 28:05
  plan that people know about and
• 28:09
  can relate to. And it's. It's amazing how
• 28:12
  many times throughout my career I've come into these situations that
• 28:16
  are very poor, underperforming
• 28:20
  people are demotivated, morale is in the tank.
• 28:24
  And, you know, the main
• 28:28
  reason why is because there's just no plan, right?
• 28:32
  Human beings like to rally around a clear
• 28:35
  plan that focuses on how to win, right? I don't care if
• 28:39
  you're in the military or in sports or in business.
• 28:43
  Human beings like to win, and they like being part of a team that wins.
• 28:47
  And so if a leader can describe what winning
• 28:51
  looks like and path the plan to
• 28:55
  get there and can describe how each person on the team
• 28:59
  or each team in the organization contributes to that
• 29:02
  plan, that will get us to a winning place. People come
• 29:06
  together, right? It's amazing what can happen
• 29:11
  when you do that as a leader. And that's probably one of the most
• 29:15
  leveraging things that have. That's helped me
• 29:19
  be a successful leader in my career. And then, you know, once you've defined the
• 29:23
  plan, you got to communicate it, right? Where are we? Right.
• 29:26
  Where are we on this journey? What have we done?
• 29:30
  What's still remaining? What, what's what? What are the priorities going forward?
• 29:36
  And recognize people for the progress that's been made so far
• 29:39
  and keep people informed, keep people up
• 29:43
  to date on our status, right? And so I've
• 29:47
  made winning. A big. Theme
• 29:51
  in how I communicate and how I
• 29:55
  try to lead an organization. Winning is a very, very
• 29:58
  motivating thing. And I don't care what culture you're in,
• 30:02
  everywhere in the world, people like to be part of A team that wins.
• 30:06
  And if you can describe that, people rally around it and
• 30:10
  morale goes up, performance goes up, and you end up getting the results that you're
• 30:13
  looking for. Yeah, I feel like everything you just said sounds so
• 30:17
  simple that I. I just want to make sure any. Everyone listening realizes how
• 30:20
  revolutionary if that. At least I feel like this is. And I
• 30:24
  honestly hope you write a book on it, because I feel like this world needs
• 30:28
  it. But from what I heard you say, you. You have. You.
• 30:32
  You define the plan. So if there's a low, you're coming into a situation that
• 30:35
  maybe. Maybe you don't know if you're going to get respected just because of your
• 30:38
  title. But you're the leader. You have to manage people.
• 30:42
  And, you know, so you define the plan. You find
• 30:46
  a way to make it actionable. I don't know if you use that word.
• 30:50
  And everyone on the team knows what their role is and how they
• 30:53
  can be a part of this. And then the plan is defined as how
• 30:57
  we win and how we win together as a team. And then you
• 31:01
  call attention to people who are just doing a good job at
• 31:05
  their job day in and day out. Maybe the Steady Eddie kind of person
• 31:08
  that doesn't get recognized normally because they're just going about it
• 31:12
  quietly and not making a lot of noise or. Look at me. Is that. Is
• 31:16
  that a good summary? That's a really good summary, and
• 31:20
  you captured it really, really well. One. One other thing that is
• 31:24
  really important in that equation is
• 31:28
  I think many leaders overlook the fact that their job description
• 31:32
  is to make their team
• 31:36
  successful, to enable, to equip, to provide
• 31:40
  everything that their team needs to be successful. Right. Your team
• 31:44
  is not in service of you being successful. Your team is not in service
• 31:47
  of serving you. Your job is to serve them.
• 31:51
  And obviously, if. If they win, you're gonna win.
• 31:55
  Right. If they're successful, you'll be successful. But
• 31:59
  you know, that. That's something that I think a lot of people struggle with.
• 32:03
  You know, they. They get into a leadership role and. And they
• 32:07
  think it just entitles them to. Yeah.
• 32:10
  And to use a mandate and. And to be served.
• 32:15
  And that's certainly not the case. I mean, if you want to be
• 32:18
  successful quickly and
• 32:21
  continuously, the way to do that is to look
• 32:25
  at every possible thing that your team needs to be successful and do everything
• 32:29
  you possibly can to equip them with what they need.
• 32:33
  If it's training, if it's tools, if it's
• 32:36
  materials, if it's. Whatever it is,
• 32:40
  be aware of what they need to Be successful. Right. Yeah. And
• 32:44
  visibly provide it. Because if they see you as someone who
• 32:48
  serves them in that way, they'll double down on their efforts even
• 32:52
  more. Right. Yeah. I think in some
• 32:55
  it's called. That might be called servant leadership. I feel like
• 32:59
  you've taken it, defined it, and maybe even, you know, taken it to
• 33:02
  a higher level. I don't know that a lot of I've not.
• 33:07
  I wish I would have seen more leaders who follow that. I've seen some,
• 33:11
  certainly have seen some, but I think for the most part,
• 33:15
  leaders are. A lot of them are maybe
• 33:19
  don't know how to do the skill set required of
• 33:23
  managing on top of the skill set they're required to do to get there in
• 33:26
  that role. Or they're, they're. I mean, maybe
• 33:30
  they're just, you know, feel a little entitled for whatever reason. I want to take
• 33:34
  advantage of that, but it doesn't. Or maybe they haven't learned the
• 33:37
  listening skills and to just, you know, I think a lot of times maybe they
• 33:41
  just haven't been trained in exactly what it takes to. To
• 33:45
  lead people so well. What,
• 33:49
  What I've done from as far back as I
• 33:52
  can remember, I've. I've intentionally observed
• 33:57
  leaders that I admire. Yeah.
• 34:01
  And I try to copy and paste what I see them
• 34:05
  do, how they work, how they communicate.
• 34:09
  And so I've. I've been very intentional about observing.
• 34:12
  Right. It may be my boss
• 34:16
  or it may be someone who's. Who's not. But I really enjoy.
• 34:20
  And I've always been intentional about observing how
• 34:24
  someone who's in a leadership position is effective and
• 34:28
  successful and engaging. But I've also
• 34:31
  observed how people are
• 34:35
  not engaging and not successful with
• 34:39
  their team. Right. And so it's good to observe those things and copy and paste
• 34:43
  the good stuff, the best of what they do and apply it to how you
• 34:46
  lead, how you work, how you communicate, but also,
• 34:50
  you know, observe how people lead poorly,
• 34:54
  make a note of that and be sure to not copy that. Right.
• 34:59
  And I think, you know, I've learned. That's probably where I've learned most of
• 35:04
  what I'm sharing with you now is just by observing people who are
• 35:07
  effective and people who are not and
• 35:11
  trying to apply those learnings to how. How I work.
• 35:15
  Yeah. And observing is a different form of listening, really, don't you think?
• 35:19
  Just like you're looking at body language, maybe, and, and
• 35:24
  body language is very telling. It's a. It's a
• 35:27
  probably maybe even more important than what the words that come out.
• 35:32
  Yep. And I would say that
• 35:36
  that is just as valuable, if not more than formal training. I think a lot
• 35:39
  of people think that for me to grow as a leader, for me to
• 35:43
  be effective as a leader, I need, I need more formal training. And, and to
• 35:46
  be honest, it's, it's really good to have that right. There's, there
• 35:50
  is truly an endless array of
• 35:54
  books you can read about how to be an
• 35:57
  effective leader or how to be successful at work. There's a lot of great
• 36:01
  training. You know, I went to MIT and
• 36:05
  I graduated from MIT's Sloan School of Management.
• 36:10
  They had a program that was specific to BP
• 36:14
  called Operations Academy. And that was very, very, you know, useful to
• 36:18
  get that formal training and kind of see the
• 36:21
  reasons for how people think, the
• 36:25
  way they do, how they tick the way they do and what works and understand
• 36:29
  the reasons why. And that was, that was useful. But
• 36:32
  to be honest, just observing leaders in action and
• 36:36
  copying and pasting the very best of what they did
• 36:40
  was, was probably one of the most effective things I've done. Yeah.
• 36:44
  And also just to kind of, just for anyone listening, it's like
• 36:47
  you started out as someone, you graduated high school and you weren't sure what you
• 36:50
  wanted to do and you have MIT training. So let's just bring those two
• 36:54
  things together, you know, and from what I'm hearing, you just
• 36:58
  took advantage of the opportunities in front of you.
• 37:02
  Yeah, yeah. And, you know,
• 37:05
  I think many people are obsessed with
• 37:09
  being promoted and obsessed with moving up the ladder and their career.
• 37:13
  Obsessed. And I think it's good to be motivated. Right. I think, I think it's
• 37:16
  good to want more. I think it's, it's good to want to move into
• 37:20
  a position of higher responsibility. But
• 37:24
  to me, it's an output versus an input. It's an
• 37:28
  output of how you work. It's an output of how you solve problems, Right?
• 37:32
  Yeah. It's an output of delivering results.
• 37:36
  And
• 37:40
  it's not the result of
• 37:45
  necessarily working harder. I think a lot of people
• 37:48
  think, well, I worked really hard, I tried really hard, but at the end
• 37:52
  of the day, all that really matters is results. Right. So it's important to be
• 37:56
  a results driven person. A results delivering
• 37:59
  person. Yeah. And a problem solver. Problem
• 38:03
  solver.
• 38:08
  Right. That's why we're all paid. I don't care what industry you're in, I don't
• 38:11
  care what, what job you have. If you're
• 38:15
  getting paid to do something, you are getting paid to solve a
• 38:19
  problem or prevent a problem. Yeah. And so if you do that well, if
• 38:23
  You're a good problem solver. It'll go well with you. Yeah, that's, that's
• 38:26
  awesome. And I was going to say, I didn't mean to infer that just because
• 38:29
  you didn't go to college right away that you are highly intelligent. So you're, you're
• 38:32
  highly intelligent and you're a hard worker and you know how to listen well
• 38:36
  to people and observe body language and talk to people who aren't like, you
• 38:40
  know, the same background as you are. And you took advantage of
• 38:43
  everything that was in front of you. So I think it's not one, it's kind
• 38:46
  of all those things. Yeah.
• 38:50
  So another question would. What, how did you do this when you have,
• 38:54
  obviously you're working for a very large corporation that, you know, everyone's heard
• 38:57
  of. How do you manage what their company
• 39:01
  mandates coming to you are, this is what you have to solve
• 39:05
  with the people that you're, that you
• 39:08
  have leadership over and getting them on board with
• 39:12
  that while kind of like still making sure that they're okay, that their
• 39:16
  needs are met. How do you balance the two of those? Sure.
• 39:20
  Well, fortunately, I've never been
• 39:23
  in a situation where I've had to
• 39:26
  compromise anyone's safety
• 39:30
  in service of any business objective. I've never,
• 39:35
  I've never been in a situation where I've had to
• 39:39
  unreasonably ask people to
• 39:42
  allocate more time to work than
• 39:46
  is. Is reasonable to expect.
• 39:50
  You know, there are times where work does get intense. Right. There are periods where,
• 39:55
  hey, we, we've, we maybe have a big project that's coming
• 39:59
  to its culmination and
• 40:03
  finishing well really matters and it's going to take a lot of work. And you
• 40:06
  know, folks, we're going to need to, for the next
• 40:10
  two months, you know, we need everyone on deck and
• 40:13
  you know, we, we can't be having people, you know, going off on
• 40:17
  extended vacations during this period of time next year where we're going to have
• 40:21
  this really intense period of time. So
• 40:24
  I guess
• 40:29
  is there a balance that needs to be struck in terms of the
• 40:33
  amount of time that an employee commits to work
• 40:37
  versus time with family? Absolutely right. That
• 40:40
  matters a lot. I think the way to properly
• 40:44
  balance that is not to guess or go with a gut feel.
• 40:48
  I think the best way to manage that is through a
• 40:52
  really structured and well documented performance
• 40:56
  review process. So what I've seen work
• 40:59
  effectively and what I've leveraged effectively is,
• 41:04
  hey, at the beginning of the year, January, sit
• 41:07
  down with each member of my team that reports to Me
• 41:11
  and not only discuss, but document what
• 41:15
  is expected. What, what are, what are your business
• 41:18
  objectives for this year? And I
• 41:22
  would invest myself tremendously in that process.
• 41:26
  Right. Because if we can define what is expected
• 41:30
  upfront and early, the individual can then
• 41:34
  better manage their work life balance to
• 41:38
  not only meet their personal priorities, but also deliver on
• 41:41
  business priorities. And I like doing that
• 41:45
  early, like in January, say, hey, here are the objectives that we have
• 41:49
  for the year. Here are your personal business objectives for the year.
• 41:53
  And then meet in the middle of the year and say, how's it going? Right.
• 41:56
  And perhaps there's a, you know, maybe there's one
• 41:59
  or more business objectives that are suffering because of a personal issue that they're
• 42:03
  attending to. You know, maybe their spouse is sick
• 42:07
  or one of their kids is dealing, you know, with a crisis, or
• 42:10
  maybe one of their parents has cancer and they're, they're needing
• 42:14
  to allocate more time. Well, we can adjust, right? We can adjust. But
• 42:18
  having a starting point that sets expectations around
• 42:22
  what the business needs from an individual early in
• 42:25
  the year, it gives them the opportunity to
• 42:29
  allocate their time and allocate and balance out their own work
• 42:32
  life balance and priorities. Rather
• 42:36
  than me coming to them with short or
• 42:40
  no notice and say, hey, I need this, I need,
• 42:44
  I need you to do this and I need you to allocate all your time
• 42:48
  over the next two or three weeks to help with this
• 42:51
  crisis. Right. And are there crises? Are there important
• 42:55
  things that come up unexpected? Yes, but again, that goes back
• 42:59
  to having a good plan. If you have a good plan, you tend to have
• 43:02
  fewer crises that need,
• 43:05
  that require people to prioritize work over home life
• 43:09
  balance. So. And also,
• 43:13
  I. Sorry to interrupt you, I would say too, like,
• 43:16
  crises that interrupt work life balance. You are talking about an industry that
• 43:20
  is probably, if there's a crisis, it is a crisis. It is a
• 43:23
  massive crises. And also one where like, you know, the work can
• 43:27
  be, you know, by its nature, away from family for several months. So I
• 43:31
  think, you know, if, if you're in an industry that, you know, in other
• 43:35
  industries, it feels like that could transfer. You know, like you could
• 43:39
  instead of just changing the direction every other week because
• 43:43
  it's, you know, and a lot of people do that. It's
• 43:46
  just like, oh, well, everything is changing so quickly. Well, yes, it is. And
• 43:50
  also not, not every other week, it's not changing. So
• 43:54
  you could still have a clear path forward with better
• 43:58
  communication. So I think
• 44:03
  the two things that can really help create, create a proactive
• 44:06
  versus A reactive work environment is having a plan.
• 44:09
  Yeah. That's well defined and that people understand and can
• 44:13
  rally around and then translating that plan
• 44:17
  into personal objectives. You know, what.
• 44:20
  What are your personal objectives for the
• 44:24
  year that support this plan? And if people have those two things,
• 44:28
  most people are really good at balancing their work life
• 44:32
  priorities themselves. Right. Without
• 44:36
  intervention or support. Yeah. Yeah. When
• 44:40
  it's just clearly defined and they know it's expected and they can
• 44:43
  plan ahead for months and maybe a year in advance. Yeah. That's.
• 44:47
  That's great. And of course, you. You
• 44:51
  are a. You know, you've made sacrifices for your career
• 44:55
  and, you know, those are choices that you make and,
• 44:59
  and you can weigh one way or another. But I know, you know, I
• 45:03
  imagine. And I. And I know just from different conversations with you that
• 45:07
  living abroad, you know, away from family, that's in the States,
• 45:11
  was had. It was stressful at some points.
• 45:17
  What do you. So you lived in several different countries,
• 45:20
  and Azerbaijan was actually the first one
• 45:25
  time when you lived there, when you moved to Azerbaijan, it was the first time
• 45:27
  I'd heard of that country and it took me. So now I can say
• 45:31
  it Azerbaijan, but I just love to hear
• 45:35
  a little bit about these countries. Like what? I mean, what was it like living
• 45:38
  in Azerbaijan, for example? Sure. Well,
• 45:42
  Azerbaijan is a. I didn't say it right. Well,
• 45:46
  you were really close. I wasn't going to say anything. Wow. And then you said
• 45:49
  it right. Okay. So Azerbaijan is this
• 45:53
  small country that's just north of Iran, south of
• 45:56
  Russia, right on the Caspian Sea. And
• 46:00
  it used to be part of the Soviet Union until the Soviet union
• 46:04
  collapsed in 1991. And since
• 46:08
  then, it's become its own independent nation. And
• 46:13
  I had a chance, the opportunity to live there for four years and get to
• 46:16
  know the people and the culture really well. It's a really
• 46:20
  pretty country, lots of mountains, it's fun to
• 46:24
  explore. Most people live in the capital city of Baku,
• 46:28
  and it's a city that's
• 46:32
  been changing a lot, you know, so when I first
• 46:36
  got there in 2008, it felt like
• 46:39
  I'd stepped back in time about 50 years. You get off the plane and
• 46:43
  it just. It felt like we had gone back in time
• 46:47
  50 years. But so much
• 46:51
  has changed there. And it was interesting while we lived there to see just
• 46:55
  the drastic and dramatic improvements that were taking place in
• 46:59
  the city. And a lot of it
• 47:03
  had to do with the funding that was coming through from the oil production
• 47:07
  coming out of the Caspian Sea facilities.
• 47:12
  And it was fun to Just get to know that culture.
• 47:16
  Right. And, you know, travel around the country. Yeah. You know,
• 47:19
  it's a country that, you know, when I lived there, had a lot of
• 47:23
  unseen, unrealized opportunities, like, you know, the
• 47:27
  big mountains, and it would snow in the winter. And I think, man, you know,
• 47:30
  this is. This would be great for a ski resort. And, well, guess what? Now
• 47:34
  they have a ski resort. Oh, that's cool. And, you know, different
• 47:38
  areas where you think, man, this would be. This would be a great place to
• 47:40
  have a golf course. And, well, now there's golf courses there,
• 47:44
  unlike when I lived there. But so
• 47:47
  that's cool. We really enjoyed living there, my family and I. My kids were
• 47:51
  in, what was it, third and fourth grade when we
• 47:55
  moved there, or second and third grade when we moved there. So they made so
• 47:58
  many friends, not just with expat families, but
• 48:02
  a lot of Azerbaijani families as well.
• 48:05
  And so, I mean, I could. I could go on for a long time about
• 48:09
  some of the stories of living and working there,
• 48:13
  but it's a really neat place. It's. It's definitely worth visiting and
• 48:17
  has a very unique culture. That's awesome. What language do they speak there?
• 48:21
  I don't even know Azerbaijani. They do. They have their own language.
• 48:25
  Okay. So it's similar to Turkish,
• 48:29
  but there's. There's probably enough differences to be unique.
• 48:34
  What's interesting about Azerbaijan is every empire that
• 48:38
  has dominated the world has come through there, through
• 48:42
  that real estate at some point in time. You know, so the Romans were there,
• 48:45
  the Babylonians were there, the Greeks were there, and
• 48:49
  they all left their. They all left their mark.
• 48:52
  And. And, you know, the most recent
• 48:56
  empire was the Soviet Union, and it definitely left a mark
• 49:01
  on the culture, for sure. It was very notable. Very notable.
• 49:05
  Oh, no, I don't know if that was. Would be good.
• 49:08
  Well, in some ways, it was really good. I mean,
• 49:14
  so let me give you an example. So here in the US
• 49:18
  One of the things that we have is a very creative kind of
• 49:22
  entrepreneurial culture. Right. And it's one
• 49:25
  that. Where most of the time, people don't like
• 49:29
  to follow a procedure. Right. If you. If you tell someone, hey,
• 49:33
  here's a procedure that you need to follow to carry out this
• 49:37
  scope of work. People's first
• 49:41
  reaction Most. Most people's first reaction here in the US
• 49:45
  Is, yeah, I'll. I'll look at it, but
• 49:49
  I think I can figure it out, and I'll do it my way. Right. I
• 49:53
  have a better way. Right. Yeah.
• 49:56
  Whereas in. In Azerbaijan, it's a very Compliant
• 50:01
  culture. Right. And I think it had a lot to do with the Soviet Union.
• 50:03
  You, you did what you were told. Right. And if you were given a procedure,
• 50:07
  you follow the procedure. And in
• 50:11
  an industry that's hazardous,
• 50:15
  like industry, following procedure matters. Right. And it's, it's
• 50:18
  a, it's an expectation you will follow procedure
• 50:22
  and it's there for a reason. And so from that
• 50:26
  standpoint, that culture has an advantage. Right.
• 50:29
  Compared to, say, a more
• 50:33
  creative culture like we have in the US So when I worked in Azerbaijan,
• 50:37
  it was neat to see the mix of British
• 50:42
  kind of a procedural culture, the
• 50:45
  Azerbaijani conformant culture and the American.
• 50:49
  Hey, we, there's a better way to do this. Let's, let's be creative.
• 50:53
  Let's think of how we could do this better. It was a, it was a
• 50:56
  fantastic combination that worked really well and I think as a result, that business
• 50:59
  has been very, very successful. Yeah. Oh, wow. Well, that's a
• 51:04
  really interesting answer. I love it.
• 51:08
  And so in Europe, if someone was going to go to there, are they.
• 51:11
  It's, it is more in Asia or is it. Well, it's
• 51:15
  right in the middle. Right. So if you
• 51:19
  asked Azerbaijan what they would prefer, they would, they would love to
• 51:22
  be part of the European Union, but that has not yet happened. Okay.
• 51:26
  But I think they have a much stronger tie with Europe than
• 51:30
  any other continent. Yeah. Yeah, that seems to be what I remember. But
• 51:34
  I haven't looked at the map lately, you know, and I have not visited. So
• 51:38
  did you, did you do some traveling through Europe? Is there, like, if someone was
• 51:41
  like, I really, I want to go to that part of the world.
• 51:45
  Recommendations for them? Yes, yes.
• 51:49
  Some of the highlights for me. Christmas in Germany.
• 51:53
  Oh, Christmas time. If you have a chance to go to
• 51:57
  Munich or to tour
• 52:00
  Austria at Christmas time, it is
• 52:05
  a beautiful, unforgettable thing. They have
• 52:08
  Christmas markets everywhere
• 52:12
  and it's just so well done and you know, so much history, so much tradition
• 52:15
  that we know of here in the US Goes back to
• 52:19
  those places. Right? Yeah. So that, that was very fun.
• 52:23
  Also.
• 52:28
  I, I visited
• 52:32
  Normandy in the west coast of France. Okay. And
• 52:35
  that is a, that is a life changing experience to go
• 52:39
  and see firsthand what took place there on D
• 52:43
  Day and the,
• 52:48
  the heroic, unbelievable bravery that
• 52:52
  it required for that day to be successful for the
• 52:56
  Allies and how many people sacrificed their lives. And
• 52:59
  that's, that's on full display there. And it's very moving. It's very,
• 53:04
  and it's something that I would highly recommend
• 53:09
  also. Italy has so much to See there, that's very
• 53:13
  historic. Of course, Rome, you
• 53:16
  know, the Coliseum, the
• 53:20
  Leaning Tower of Pisa.
• 53:24
  It's just a fun place to go. I think one of the best ways to
• 53:26
  see Europe is by train. You know, it's far
• 53:30
  more convenient than renting a car. You can get anywhere on a train.
• 53:33
  Yeah. And just walk where you need to go.
• 53:37
  And it's, it's very, very friendly, very easy. It's
• 53:41
  very visitor friendly and just endless things
• 53:44
  to see and do. Of course, we've been to England as well, and
• 53:48
  there's just so much history there to visit and experience in London, but
• 53:52
  also north of London all the way up through the
• 53:55
  English countryside and up into Scotland. It's just
• 53:59
  beautiful. Most people don't think of England as a. They think of
• 54:03
  London and the big city. But my favorite part of
• 54:06
  England is the countryside. It's just unbelievably beautiful.
• 54:10
  It really is. Yeah. Oh, that's great. Great answer. And
• 54:14
  this, this is from Spain right here. That's my,
• 54:18
  that's my big expat experience is living for 14
• 54:22
  weeks in Spain in college. But that's fun. That's a fun place.
• 54:26
  Yeah, it is. But yeah, for sure that. And I think I did.
• 54:30
  I think I traveled on so many trains in that 14 weeks, I don't know
• 54:34
  that I ever wanted to set foot on a train again. But
• 54:38
  it is just such a different. It's like you don't even realize that if you've
• 54:41
  only lived in the United States and, and not traveled outside of the
• 54:45
  United States, it really is quite a eye
• 54:49
  opening, life changing experience to go to a culture like in
• 54:52
  Europe where it's just, you're like, whoa, you know, everything is,
• 54:56
  you know, a new building is 350 years old, you know, in some places.
• 55:00
  Yeah, yeah. It's incredible. You know, you go to places like Egypt
• 55:04
  or Italy and you add on another zero to the
• 55:08
  age of history there. Oh, you know, I think here in
• 55:12
  the U.S. right. The oldest thing you could maybe go see and visit is the
• 55:14
  Alamo, maybe in San Antonio. That's maybe one of the oldest buildings
• 55:19
  in North America. And I think it's 3 or
• 55:23
  400 years old or something like that. I mean, but if you go to Europe
• 55:26
  or even Egypt, you tack on another zero
• 55:30
  and more and that's crazy. Tell me about
• 55:34
  Egypt. I've not been there and that. I can't imagine how interesting
• 55:38
  that probably was there. Yeah.
• 55:41
  I would highly recommend for anyone watching this podcast or anyone
• 55:45
  listening, go visit Egypt. It is a super
• 55:49
  friendly place. And it is safe. It has this,
• 55:54
  there's this assumption that many people have that it's a high
• 55:58
  risk place to visit. It's not, it's not. It's very safe. People are super friendly.
• 56:03
  And if you want to see some of the best, nicest beaches in the
• 56:07
  world, Egypt has them on the Red
• 56:10
  Sea. Beautiful beaches. They have some of the best
• 56:14
  scuba diving that you can find in the world
• 56:18
  in a place called Sharm el Sheikh. It's on the southern
• 56:22
  peninsula of the Sinai Peninsula.
• 56:26
  Okay. And then the history is unbelievable.
• 56:30
  You can go on a Nile cruise and stop along the way to
• 56:34
  different historic sites, see Pharaoh's
• 56:37
  tombs, see these different temples that were built and are still
• 56:41
  in extremely great condition.
• 56:45
  And of course, the pyramids are
• 56:48
  basically engulfed by the city of Cairo, which
• 56:52
  I think I checked last time, has 23 million people that live
• 56:56
  in Cairo. So it's a huge city, very, very crowded.
• 57:01
  And things that used to be on the edge of the city or outside the
• 57:04
  city are now just part of it. Like the pyramids, right?
• 57:08
  Yeah. You see pictures of the pyramids and you think it's out in the middle
• 57:11
  of nowhere. Well, it's, it's, it's in
• 57:14
  Cairo. The city proper itself.
• 57:18
  Yeah. I wouldn't have known that. Yeah. Wow, that's very interesting.
• 57:22
  So you do some travel in that region that you thought was
• 57:25
  interesting and worth going to?
• 57:29
  Oh, yeah. I mean, going down to
• 57:33
  Luxor, that's. It's a city, a small city
• 57:37
  south of Cairo. You can
• 57:41
  easily fly in there. And that's where they have an
• 57:45
  unimaginable number of unbelievable historic
• 57:49
  temples and tombs you can go visit.
• 57:54
  And I would highly recommend Luxor if you want to see history.
• 57:59
  The Egyptian Museum in downtown Cairo is also
• 58:03
  mind blowing. They have so many different
• 58:06
  mummies that are on display and just
• 58:10
  unbelievable artifacts from throughout history that are on display that you can
• 58:14
  just see up close. Wow.
• 58:18
  But I'd also definitely would go to some of the nice beaches
• 58:22
  on the Red Sea. Beautiful beaches.
• 58:25
  Yeah. God, I love the beach. You know, you gotta love it. Yes.
• 58:29
  Some of the, you live, lived in Africa in a couple places, and then you've
• 58:32
  lived in Alaska. So Alaska is your
• 58:36
  favorite. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Why? Why? And what,
• 58:40
  what, why should people go to Alaska? What should they see?
• 58:45
  Nature in Alaska is on a
• 58:48
  completely different scale.
• 58:52
  The mountains are huge, the wildlife's
• 58:56
  huge. Alaska makes you feel
• 58:59
  very small. And that, that does something
• 59:03
  good for me. I think it does something good for most people that
• 59:07
  go visit Alaska. You feel very small.
• 59:12
  It also is called the last frontier.
• 59:16
  And it's true,
• 59:19
  Alaska is so massive and relatively
• 59:22
  uninhabited that if you want to go truly, truly
• 59:26
  out in the middle of nowhere, you can. And
• 59:30
  there's a lot of nowhere up there. But it's so big. I
• 59:34
  mean, you could take Texas, California and Montana, it would all fit into Alaska. We
• 59:38
  with extra room left over. Wow. And I think Alaska only
• 59:42
  has what, 600,000 people for its population.
• 59:46
  So I, I love the, I love nature there
• 59:51
  and just so many different experiences you can enjoy. You know,
• 59:54
  going to see the bears, the moose, fishing,
• 1:00:00
  skiing, hiking, rafting.
• 1:00:05
  If you like outdoors, it is the best. Yeah,
• 1:00:10
  yeah. There's a lot of continents, and I think I'm
• 1:00:13
  counting at least four continents. You lived on
• 1:00:17
  my. Is it five? Well, let's see. South America,
• 1:00:21
  North America, Africa,
• 1:00:24
  Asia, technically, Azerbaijan's in Asia. So
• 1:00:28
  we have lived and worked in four. I've visited a few
• 1:00:31
  more, but one place I haven't mentioned
• 1:00:35
  that I just think is spectacular
• 1:00:39
  is Cape Town, South Africa. Okay. Yes. And
• 1:00:42
  you went there when you lived in Angola. Yes, by. Right. Yeah. Okay,
• 1:00:46
  so Cape Town's on the very, very southern tip of the
• 1:00:51
  continent of Africa. It's in the country of South Africa,
• 1:00:55
  and it is one of the most beautiful cities in the
• 1:00:59
  world. Oh, wow. It's so visitor friendly and there's
• 1:01:02
  just so much to do there. And any,
• 1:01:06
  any chance we had to go visit, we would. And
• 1:01:10
  I think an ideal living arrangement would be to live in Alaska
• 1:01:14
  from May to October and then Cape Town from November to
• 1:01:17
  April.
• 1:01:21
  And here you are in Ohio. So. Yeah,
• 1:01:26
  very, it's, you know, that's very, very, very American.
• 1:01:30
  Yeah, right there in the Midwest. So. Yeah. And I know you're,
• 1:01:33
  you're having your adventures and in retirement, you're not, you're
• 1:01:37
  not bored yet. No, no, no, I'm not bored at
• 1:01:41
  all. And, you know, I'm enjoying the coaching that I do.
• 1:01:46
  But, you know, the main reason I retired, the main
• 1:01:50
  driver, was I wanted to be able to help take care of my
• 1:01:53
  parents, especially my dad. You know, he was diagnosed with Alzheimer's
• 1:01:57
  in February of 2021.
• 1:02:01
  And I was in Angola at the time. And,
• 1:02:04
  you know, the plan was to continue working there, you know,
• 1:02:08
  indefinitely or at least through
• 1:02:12
  the end of this year or even further.
• 1:02:16
  But I just, I just couldn't continue to sort of see his
• 1:02:19
  situation unfold. And I knew I couldn't live with myself
• 1:02:23
  if I hadn't stopped.
• 1:02:28
  I didn't want to continue to watch all this unfold long distance seven
• 1:02:31
  time zones away from the opposite side of the world. Yeah. And
• 1:02:35
  so I wanted to be more available. I wanted to be more present,
• 1:02:40
  not just for him, but for mom. And she's doing a great job of
• 1:02:44
  caring for him, an excellent job of caring
• 1:02:48
  for him. But there's things that just
• 1:02:51
  need to be done that I can help with, and it's really good to
• 1:02:55
  have that flexibility. Right. To be. To be there
• 1:02:59
  and. And I have no regrets about that whatsoever. And
• 1:03:04
  I. I see them often. I also enjoy
• 1:03:08
  volunteering with Samaritan's Purse, and that's been one of the most
• 1:03:12
  rewarding things I've done in retirement. Going to
• 1:03:16
  places where there's been a crisis or a natural disaster, like
• 1:03:20
  North Carolina following the flooding or Tampa,
• 1:03:24
  Florida, following the hurricanes that they had their last fall.
• 1:03:30
  I was also in northern Los Angeles earlier this year,
• 1:03:34
  helping with the fire response, you know, and helping
• 1:03:37
  homeowners try to recover things,
• 1:03:41
  items that were of personal value and just.
• 1:03:44
  It's just really satisfying to come alongside people who've been
• 1:03:48
  through and just
• 1:03:52
  completely unexpected, unbelievable crisis and help
• 1:03:56
  them. Right. And also to, you know, share the gospel with
• 1:03:59
  them and share the love of God and hope with
• 1:04:03
  them in their time of need. And it's just something that I've
• 1:04:07
  really enjoyed and I'm going to continue to do it. Yeah.
• 1:04:10
  Yeah. And you have you carpenter skills because you learned that
• 1:04:14
  from your dad, right? Yeah, yeah.
• 1:04:18
  I've put it to good use. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome.
• 1:04:22
  And you have just. And you've always been as, you know, as a family member.
• 1:04:26
  I know. Just someone who's always looking out for people and willing to
• 1:04:30
  sacrifice, you know, for what. What is needed. So. And
• 1:04:34
  of course, not just I appreciate you for that. I think everyone does.
• 1:04:38
  Well, it's just a good thing to do, and I get a lot of satisfaction
• 1:04:41
  out of it, so it's certainly not a burden to me at all.
• 1:04:44
  Yeah. Well, thank you so much for coming on. It's been such
• 1:04:48
  a fun time for me to. Even though I. I know you,
• 1:04:52
  but I don't know you in. In respect for all the. The work that you
• 1:04:56
  do. I honestly hope you at least write one book on leadership.
• 1:05:00
  I really do. That's. That's a. That's a good challenge, you
• 1:05:03
  know, and I definitely have a lot of stories that can support
• 1:05:08
  the main themes that I would probably capture in a book.
• 1:05:12
  Yeah. Many, many stories. Yeah. And I think you have a way where you could
• 1:05:16
  present it without people feeling called out too
• 1:05:20
  much. It could be, you know, it would be probably well
• 1:05:23
  received and, and well respected, I imagine, too, so. Oh, thank
• 1:05:27
  you very much. I appreciate that. Yeah. Was there anything you want
• 1:05:31
  to kind of add or summarize? I didn't ask a question on.
• 1:05:35
  I can't think of anything. It's been really fun to be part of this and
• 1:05:39
  to have this conversation and, and to
• 1:05:43
  share, you know, about different things that I've
• 1:05:46
  learned and that hopefully can be useful. Right. To whoever might
• 1:05:50
  listen to this and, and
• 1:05:54
  yeah, so it's been a lot of fun. I've really enjoyed it. I appreciate you
• 1:05:57
  inviting me. I really appreciate you too. And I, and I, I really
• 1:06:00
  appreciate being able to share your wisdom with the world
• 1:06:04
  because I was, you know, we were talking before we hit record on this, and
• 1:06:07
  I said, is there a way for people to get a hold of you, or
• 1:06:09
  am I now your agent? Yes, you are now my
• 1:06:13
  agent. So, because, you know, the, the leadership coaching you do is a lot
• 1:06:17
  of referrals. You don't have your necessarily your website or
• 1:06:20
  marketing it or anything like that. So unlike almost most of my guests
• 1:06:24
  who are, I'm like, here's all the ways you can find, you know, Peter Harriman
• 1:06:28
  on socials and go to his website. And it's, it's. You really
• 1:06:32
  are enjoying the things you're doing. And I, I'm so
• 1:06:35
  grateful that the world can hear some of this leadership wisdom from you.
• 1:06:39
  And I, I, I love the thought of, of
• 1:06:43
  you sharing it formally in whatever way that comes. So,
• 1:06:47
  great. No, that sounds good. And if, if
• 1:06:51
  you or anyone would like to get in touch with me, my email
• 1:06:55
  address is
• 1:06:56
  pdharriman@gmail.com.
• 1:06:59
  Perfect. You're gonna get an email. I love it. Okay. Yeah, here we get
• 1:07:03
  so many emails. No, I'm kidding. At least put out the email.
• 1:07:07
  So, thank you, Pete. I'm gonna call you Pete. And I appreciate you. Love
• 1:07:10
  you. And thank you for all you do for the world, for the family.
• 1:07:16
  Thank you, Mary. I really appreciate this. It's been great to be part of
• 1:07:19
  this podcast and I appreciate you inviting me. It's been fun.
• 1:07:23
  Thanks. All right, we'll talk soon. Okay. Very good. Thank you.
• 1:07:27
  Yeah.
• 1:07:30
  Thanks for joining us on Healthy, Happy, Wise Wealthy. If you believe in
• 1:07:34
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• 1:07:38
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• 1:07:41
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• 1:07:45
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• 1:07:49
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• 1:07:52
  next time, you all have a wonderful week. And
• 1:07:56
  keep on keeping on Just
• 1:08:06
  keeps on turning I can see Searching
• 1:08:09
  for one escape.