Latest / For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast / #346 - For Azeroth!: "Discussing Delves"

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#346 - For Azeroth!: "Discussing Delves" · For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast

• 0:00
  But I didn't feel like I was earning anything towards like my
• 0:02
  character being better for when I can play with folks.
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  And that was like a big thing that I was missing.
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  Victory for the Forsaken, for Lauderon, for the Karen Tour,
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  for Pandaria, for Calendar to the Burning Region, for
• 0:23
  Gilnaeus, but has not done for the Lich King, for the Sindori.
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  For the alliance. For the Horde, for Azeroth.
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  Hello and welcome to another special episode of For Azeroth.
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  I am one of your hosts, Manny AKA the Truvim.
• 0:44
  Manny and I am joined by the one and only Missile Dine online.
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  Hello, Missile Dine. Oh, hi, Manny.
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  Welcome back to the show. How's the World of Warcraft been
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  treating you? Oh.
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  My God, it's so good. Warthin has been such a great
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  rekindling of my love for the game and it continues to
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  impress, especially with all the midnight stuff.
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  I'm very happy with it. Yeah, I know that you, like many
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  other people, had been disenchanted with Wow for a
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  time, and you've kind of refound your your love of the game.
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  And one of the big things that I know that you have been really
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  going into is Delves. And that's what we're here to
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  talk about today. For the people who might not
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  have heard you the last time you're on the show, could you
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  tell us a little bit about yourself?
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  Yeah, my name is Corey or Missile Dyne online.
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  I've been a full time streamer content creator now for I think
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  about 8 years this this November actually, no, I'm right.
• 1:49
  Today I would have been full time for eight years.
• 1:52
  I think I went, I went full time on September 1st, 8 years, eight
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  years ago. Happy anniversary then.
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  Thanks. Yeah, I just realized that right
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  now while I'm looking, yeah. So I've been doing a lot of
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  World of Warcraft content and RPGs in some Final Fantasy 14
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  that I kind of fell out of a little bit, but still love the
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  game. Just don't play it that often
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  right now. But yeah, you can find me on
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  Twitch and YouTube and all that jazz doing stuff.
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  Yeah, like obviously games have ebb and flow, just like with
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  Wolf Warcraft, like we were just saying.
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  And Final Fantasy has some critics that are being very
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  vocal right now and some things that it needs to Polish off.
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  But we were just talking about about how part of the reason
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  that you have found your love for the game is Delves.
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  And so tell me, like what you love about Delves.
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  Yeah, so first of all, I just have to say the the the
• 2:50
  listeners can't see you right now, but that Warcraft shirt
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  that you're wearing, I love it. Like it.
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  Trust me, listeners, it is. It is.
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  It is good. I I want it.
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  I might steal it from Manny, but he's not looking.
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  Yeah, no, I so I've been a big fan of like solo content in
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  World of Warcraft. Not necessarily like that's how
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  I think the game should be played, but more I think that's
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  something that was missing in Wow was character progression
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  that you could do on your own without relying on scheduling.
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  A time where four other people can join you or, you know, nine
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  other people or 19 other people just give you something that
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  actually moves your character forward.
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  Not just in, oh, I collected these cosmetics or I've made
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  progress on this reputation, But meaningful progression for your
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  character is something that I thought was lacking a lot.
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  There were times where like I felt like playing, but I didn't
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  really want to pug. There was nobody around, but I
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  still wanted to play Wow, but I didn't feel like I was earning
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  anything towards like my character being better for when
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  I can play with folks. And that was like a big thing
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  that I was missing. And I feel like delves for me is
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  that it is that that single player progression that you can
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  still do when people are busy and you can take your alts in
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  there and you can make it as hard or as easy as you want.
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  And it's just been a breath of fresh air for me.
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  I definitely see the that appeal.
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  I am definitely somebody who pushes progression, but I've
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  always been group content. So being if I didn't have group
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  content, delves seem like exactly the thing.
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  Because I am not a person who likes the follower dungeons.
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  Because I love the ramping difficulty and at least delves
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  gives you that progression there.
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  Yeah. And one, one of the things that
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  because delves, delves are if you're somebody that's doing
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  mythic mythic plus, you know, even like a mythic 5 or higher,
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  delves are probably not going to feel that that hard for you.
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  I would say the same for raids and whatnot.
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  Maybe certain specs might struggle a little bit more in
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  delves than than other ones. I play a tank primarily and
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  tanks have a very, very easy time in delves.
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  But one of my favorite things to do with it is to take low
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  geared, low item level DPS characters and just see how high
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  I can go in a delve. I was just doing that on string
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  the other day where it's like I took a fire mage that I never
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  play and tried to do an 11 on it.
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  I was able to complete the 11, not with deaths remaining, but I
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  was able to do it. And like that was a really good
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  time. And that's something that you
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  you can't really get that in in a key or raid or anything else
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  without feeling like you've made somebody else's time worse.
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  And you don't have to worry about that with delves.
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  Yeah, you're right. There is a bit of a social
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  burden with some of the group play when you are trying out
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  characters that you're not familiar with or just learning.
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  You do say that you play tanks primarily, but I've also seen
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  you last season not with a DPS but with a healer when you're
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  trying out tank brand, trying to push through.
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  I think it was an 11 on the first week.
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  Yeah. So in terms of difficulty, how
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  has that gone through with the War Within as it was in Season
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  1, then they shifted things in Season 2.
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  I think from Season 2 to Season 3 it's been about the same.
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  But like, what's the story of like the challenge of Delves
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  being through the War Within? I think when so I had an
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  interview pretty early. It was the in between Season 1
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  and 2, I had an interview with some some Delve devs, which was
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  awesome opportunity. But one of the things that they
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  mentioned was that the first iteration, the first season of
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  Delves was kind of like no one really knew what Delves were
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  yet. Like a couple people, those devs
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  that I interviewed, they knew what Delves were, but like the
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  everybody else on the Warcraft team wasn't quite sure what it
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  was yet. And I feel like we've seen
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  Season 2 and Season 3, it started to click with the team
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  and you start to see the, the way that things are being
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  developed. And now going into midnight,
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  we've heard that like they're going to have the, you'll be
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  able to like ground mount and stuff.
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  And there might be like outdoor ones.
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  And it's, I feel like what they were saying is now the team gets
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  it. And I feel like if for somebody
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  like me who's been doing it a lot, I'm seeing that the team is
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  starting to get it too. Like taking out the the the
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  underwater delves that were like a cool in theory, but so many
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  people didn't like that that extra little mechanic or even
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  even more simple than that, just the candle mechanic in
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  waterworks Krieg balls rest like that type of thing where you had
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  to use an air purifier or candle to make sure that you can get
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  through safely. In season 1, that required
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  micromanagement of that object. Season 2 and three, they were
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  like, you know what, no, you can focus on the delve.
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  We're going to don't worry about that, that it's there, but like
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  you don't have to micromanage it as much.
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  And then one of the big things I've noticed going from season 1
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  to season 2 and now season 2 into season 3, I feel like
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  they've built so much into the delves that allow the delve
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  themselves to defeat the enemies for you.
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  So if you're struggling like I was on that I was, I'm not a
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  healer, I'm horrible, but I brought my shaman through so
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  many of the things in that delve that I did on 11.
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  The damage was coming from knowing the mechanics of the
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  delve. Like earth crawl Mines for
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  instance, has the the a story scenario where the carts are
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  coming through and if you bring mobs on top of the tracks, the
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  cart will hit those mobs, interrupt them, and do a pretty
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  significant amount of damage. Nightfall Sanctum has these like
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  blue purple lines you can cross and if you do, you get pelted
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  with these pools of of purple energy, whatever on the ground,
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  but you can also bring that on top of mobs and that will do
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  damage to them as well. And there's there's the spores.
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  There's so many different things that they have now archival
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  assault built, which is the brand new delve in season 3 that
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  even has like these pylons you can destroy that will do damage
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  to everything else. So like they're, I feel like
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  they've, they've taken that almost every Delve has something
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  like that in season 3. And that's, that's different
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  from Season 1 I, I think. OK.
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  So another part of delves are like the different items that
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  you get like little things that will like allow you to have like
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  not just more stats, but just different small little effects
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  Have have those being welcomed? Have they been something kind of
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  forgettable, or what's the story behind those in terms of your
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  own progress through delves? Yeah, I mean, even those I feel
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  like have come a long way since season 1.
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  Season 1, they were kind of like flavorful, but not that
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  impactful. Season 3, I feel like there are
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  some that are just like wildly good.
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  There's one where you beat a rare and you get a mercenary
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  contract, which randomly allows you to summon basically that
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  rare to come and defeat things for you.
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  And it that thing pumps, does so much damage.
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  And like that's one there's they take a lot of like the curious
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  that you might have had in previous seasons and like rework
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  them to be like a little bit lesser of a version and put
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  those in this one as like powers you can get.
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  So like the football, the foot bomb dispenser, if you get that
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  power and a delve, congratulations, you just beat
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  the delve. Like it's so it's so good.
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  You can just see a boss's health to just deplete when you have
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  that, even on an 11, it's amazing.
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  Yeah. But like they've done, I think
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  those powers, from my understanding and talking to
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  other people that don't really like delves, those powers are
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  always a welcome addition. I don't think anybody's ever mad
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  when they get one of those. Just kind of helps out, helps
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  them get through it. I find that most of the time
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  when people are having some struggles in delves at in these
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  later seasons, it's because they were ignoring some of the things
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  that you're talking about, not using the environment, not using
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  those items, and so you're kind of making it harder on yourself.
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  Do you think that there's a way that they could, I don't know,
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  have a tutorial to teach people, hey, these are things you need
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  to use? Or what do you think could help
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  people like remember to use these things?
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  You know, I, I don't know if I would like a tutorial because I
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  think there's something really cool about discovering something
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  organically and there's so many resources like if you're
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  struggling in a delve, I'm sure you can Google, you know, a
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  delve guide or something and someone's probably got like all
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  the tips and tricks you can do in a delve just like they do
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  mythic plus and raids and everything else, right.
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  So like I, I don't know, I, I feel like finding stuff out
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  organically is really cool of like discovering like, oh wait,
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  I can use the pools in nightfall sanctum.
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  I can use those to damage these. That's wait a minute, that's
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  really cool. Or the the spores in like we all
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  know about the spores now, but like when you first walked in in
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  season 1, you're able to use the spores to damage everything.
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  You're like, wait a minute, I can there's some strats I can do
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  with this now and I don't know, I wouldn't want to lose that
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  organic discovery. But I was going to say, I feel
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  like they're the the mechanics that do that need to do enough
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  damage that the player immediately is like, that wasn't
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  me. What did I just do that caused
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  that? And I feel like they've been
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  doing a pretty good job of that, but maybe maybe they can do even
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  more like the mine. Maybe not everybody knows about
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  like the minecarts for instance, because they just don't stand
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  near those. Yeah, maybe instead of a full on
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  tutorial, it's just like a little vignette where you're
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  like walking it, walking towards one spot and then you see like
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  just an enemy being like, Oh no, Oh no.
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  And then get hit by the card and and killed.
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  And it's like that's enough to tips a player off or something
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  like that. I mean, that's a really good
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  point. I think that we actually have
• 13:08
  the perfect tool for that and it's our companion.
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  Like I like it makes sense that Bran bronze beard of Valera
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  Sanguinar in midnight could call stuff out to us with a line of,
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  you know, or just suggest something in case like maybe you
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  didn't, you didn't notice of like if Valero says like, Oh, I
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  wonder what those will do to them.
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  Or like, you know, something like there's there's so many
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  creative ways they can just tie it into the companion as well
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  without making it feel like a like a tutorial.
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  I feel like a brand kind of already does that right, with
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  the don't stand there. Like that's a quick reminder of
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  like, oh, I'm standing in something I shouldn't be.
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  OK, little bit of gold or whatever is to a cool.
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  That doesn't help at all. You just get a little bit of
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  gold, but you you get the, you get the point.
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  Yeah, Yeah, that, that's very true.
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  And actually on that topic, speaking about our companions,
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  that has been a big part of Delves is that's having again
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  throughout the war within we've had bronze, bronze, bronze beard
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  brand, bronze beard. Wow.
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  Bronze Twister. Anyways, he's been our constant
• 14:21
  companion and each season he's been getting different abilities
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  that have been reset with this the season and each season we've
• 14:29
  had to like relearn what's like good and what's like the
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  strategies with these. You were just saying that
• 14:37
  organic discovery is is something that you enjoy.
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  Do you spend a lot of time just sort of testing out the
• 14:44
  different curious and figuring out which powers kind of work
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  together? Or are you saying like you
• 14:49
  actually it's cool to just go to like one of the websites and
• 14:55
  finding out what they're like? Tear list of curious is.
• 14:59
  Yeah. So I, it's funny you say that
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  because I actually have not looked at any other source for
• 15:05
  the curios in season 3 other than me just like trying them
• 15:08
  out and seeing what's cool. And you know, I got all my
• 15:12
  curios maxed out. Felt like can't really make up
• 15:14
  your mind without knowing exactly what the power is when
• 15:17
  they're fully maxed. And this season in particular,
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  there's one that I was like, I don't need to test any other
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  ones in in this. That one's great, which is you
• 15:29
  get 12% crit and it does like another thing where it like
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  summons a sand thing that pulls enemies into it, but that 12%
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  stacks with every single time Brand Bronsbeard finds a
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  gathering node so you can end a delve and it doesn't go away.
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  It's not time, it's just permanent while you're in that
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  delve. So if you're like looking around
• 15:54
  and getting herb, letting him get herbs or mine mining nodes
• 15:59
  or fishing nodes, you can get like 72% crit added on to your
• 16:05
  character, which is just like, why would I do anything else?
• 16:09
  Why would I go for these temporary ones that last?
• 16:11
  They might proc often, but you only get them for, you know, 4
• 16:15
  seconds and then it goes away. Why not just benefit from 72
• 16:19
  crit percent crit the entire like that's amazing.
• 16:22
  So like there's certain ones like that where I'm like, I I
• 16:25
  don't even just kind of look at the tool tip and see how you
• 16:29
  played. I kind of like that about
• 16:30
  delves. If you look at the curious, you
• 16:32
  know how you play in that delve, is that curio going to help you
• 16:36
  with the way that you play Cool. Like a lot of people didn't like
• 16:41
  the in season 2, there was the the robot that you would call
• 16:44
  down and a lot of people didn't like it because you lost control
• 16:48
  of your character like you would, you would kind of run
• 16:51
  around in this robot. You couldn't pick exactly when
• 16:54
  it was. It did tremendous damage and I
• 16:56
  loved it. But then it started to be a
• 16:59
  problem of like, you know what, my character actually does just
• 17:02
  as much damage now after getting gear and everything else.
• 17:05
  Like it was really only good in the season.
• 17:07
  But then you could also you remote piloted the robot.
• 17:10
  They made that change in Season 2, which was a good change, but
• 17:15
  it also meant that your character could be in a bad spot
• 17:18
  when you got out of the robot or like would set you pretty far
• 17:23
  back. And some people just didn't like
• 17:25
  playing with that. Doesn't matter how strong the
• 17:27
  curio is, that's just not something that people enjoyed.
• 17:30
  So they just wouldn't do it. So yeah, I think it's about
• 17:33
  like, fine, like testing it. What, you have nothing to lose.
• 17:37
  That's like the that's the coolest thing about the Delves
• 17:39
  is you're not wasting anybody else's time.
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  It's just you. You can take as long as you
• 17:45
  want. You can wait for all of your
• 17:47
  cooldowns to come back in between every pole if you really
• 17:50
  want to. It's just you have full control
• 17:52
  of how you want to handle that thing.
• 17:54
  And I don't really think there's other content in Wow that that
• 17:59
  gives you that. I mean, outside of questing, no,
• 18:03
  I I can't, I can't think of anything that is quite like
• 18:06
  that. So you were talking about like
• 18:09
  how powerful that is and how even when it's powerful, some
• 18:14
  people didn't use use particular curious, how was the curio
• 18:18
  balance overall throughout these seasons, in Season 1, Season 2
• 18:21
  and now in Season 3? Has it been relatively balanced
• 18:26
  so that you didn't feel so bad if you didn't like it using
• 18:29
  curio? Or have there been like seasons
• 18:32
  where the curios are just so out of balance that it's like you
• 18:35
  could opt not to use it, but you're putting yourself X
• 18:38
  percentage behind? Right.
• 18:41
  I would say season 1 was far more of that.
• 18:44
  There were, I don't don't even remember now exactly which
• 18:47
  curios there were, but there were definitely 2 that was like
• 18:49
  the meta. You would use those two curios
• 18:52
  because they were so good. Everything else was kind of like
• 18:55
  flavorful, but again, it was one of those things where it felt
• 18:58
  like the team didn't quite get it.
• 19:01
  Season 2, the curious were introduced.
• 19:03
  They had a lot more variety. There was still like certain
• 19:05
  ones that you would want to pick.
• 19:06
  Like if you were a healer, you'd use the if you were a healer and
• 19:10
  you were using tank Brand, you would want the pinged augment
• 19:14
  chip because it was just really good.
• 19:16
  There was no real downside. You just you could dispel Brand
• 19:20
  instead of destroying the robot if it if you use that with
• 19:23
  anything else and you keep don't have access to a dispel, you
• 19:26
  would need to destroy that robot and it had too much health, so
• 19:29
  you wouldn't do that. So like that ended up being kind
• 19:31
  of like a meta pick, I think. But outside of that, I think
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  there were a ton of curious that you could use.
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  People really liked the the one that would summon the the robot,
• 19:42
  the flaming robot T rexes. They like that one they would
• 19:47
  use. They would also use the the one
• 19:49
  that would make a copy of the elite that you damaged below a
• 19:52
  certain amount. There was a lot more variety.
• 19:55
  Season 3, from what I've seen so far, is like use whatever you
• 19:59
  like. Like they all feel fine.
• 20:02
  Like there's nothing that's like I I really like the sands of
• 20:05
  Koresh one, but like all the other ones feel like you can
• 20:08
  just yeah, if you want to use those in that moment, go ahead.
• 20:12
  OK, I would like that. Seems really good.
• 20:15
  So then the last component of Delves that we haven't talked
• 20:18
  about is actually kind of a headliner of Delves and that is
• 20:23
  like the seasonal nemesis, that one big fight that you do where
• 20:29
  it is first on question mark and then double question mark.
• 20:32
  And this is something that you've always tried to challenge
• 20:35
  quite early in in seasons. How how's that been through the
• 20:41
  seasons and how's it evolved over the course of the war
• 20:45
  within? Yeah, so Season 1 we had Zack
• 20:49
  Veer, which was annoying in a lot of different ways just
• 20:55
  because it was kind of buggy, no pun intended.
• 20:59
  There were times where like the cone would just hit you in the
• 21:03
  because it could either go on you or Bran.
• 21:05
  If it went on brand, you were fine.
• 21:06
  But sometimes it could go on you at a time that you also had to
• 21:09
  deal with the spider ad spawning.
• 21:11
  And if that happened and you didn't have a any way to get out
• 21:14
  of that, you were just kind of dead.
• 21:15
  That's it. Like your attempts over there's
• 21:17
  there's no real counter play to that outside of like you have to
• 21:20
  bait the claw before you can. And then if there were issues
• 21:24
  with like, can you even burn the AD down in time?
• 21:27
  And if you're a speck that has trouble with that burst, you're
• 21:30
  going to have a harder time. You kind of needed like specific
• 21:33
  trinkets to get it down maybe. And then healers had a whole
• 21:37
  other issue with that fight where like you as a healer, you
• 21:42
  probably weren't getting that AD down in time either.
• 21:45
  Now it was just a whole bunch of issues.
• 21:48
  You didn't have tank Brand in Season 1, so Zechvir kind of
• 21:51
  felt the most. You needed to be either like a
• 21:57
  tank spec that could do good burst damage, or you needed to
• 22:01
  be Adps and that's it. Like anything else, you were
• 22:05
  you. You're fighting a uphill battle.
• 22:09
  Got it. So the challenge was wildly
• 22:11
  different based on the spec you were playing.
• 22:14
  Totally, and then in season 2 I feel like they tried to fix that
• 22:20
  and they almost went too far with it where they made the
• 22:23
  underpin which was incredibly role agnostic because the only
• 22:28
  real thing you had to do was burn through a shield that the
• 22:31
  boss would do. Everything else was kind of like
• 22:35
  your damage on the boss was irrelevant.
• 22:37
  The ads that would spawn were your damage to them was
• 22:40
  irrelevant because all you needed to do was kick the bombs
• 22:43
  at them. And really it became more about
• 22:46
  like positioning stuff, but that also can be a little bit harder.
• 22:49
  But like you didn't need to be a tank, you didn't need to be
• 22:52
  ADPS. You could be a healer, you could
• 22:54
  be any. It felt like you could be
• 22:56
  anything. But the the problem came with
• 22:59
  like, how do you get him around the arena if tank Bran is now,
• 23:06
  if you, if you're a healer that's using tank brand and like
• 23:09
  tank brand is not the brightest. So he's just like sitting in one
• 23:12
  spot and the ads won't go there. So now the ads are going on the
• 23:14
  complete opposite side and you're just like, OK, I can't
• 23:17
  really like this is this is a mess.
• 23:21
  And a lot of people didn't know like how they thought that the
• 23:24
  ads spawning were was completely random, which it's not.
• 23:28
  It's based on proximity of where the previous bots were with him
• 23:31
  as well. So like if he was standing near
• 23:34
  the ads that you just destroyed, he wouldn't summon ads there.
• 23:37
  They'd go to the next closest spot that they would.
• 23:41
  And if you kept him in the center, then they would could
• 23:43
  spawn all over the place, which is bad news bears.
• 23:47
  But like I think people just didn't really learn that.
• 23:52
  And then you of course, like beastmaster hunters could just
• 23:55
  do the fight and not worry about anything.
• 23:57
  And then they've nailed it though in season 3, like I,
• 24:03
  they, I think they learned about, you know, role
• 24:06
  agnosticism being good for these types of fights.
• 24:09
  And then they introduced Kai Vezza, who has similar mechanics
• 24:14
  like she does in the raid in the rhubarb palace in season 1.
• 24:18
  She has similar mechanics. So like you kind of already seen
• 24:20
  like her, her base kit. She actually doesn't.
• 24:23
  She has like 3 that she'll do during the fight, but they're
• 24:27
  all one shots. Therefore it actually doesn't
• 24:31
  matter what spec you are, doesn't matter if you're a tank,
• 24:34
  doesn't matter if you're DPS, doesn't matter if you're a
• 24:35
  healer. You just need to avoid the
• 24:37
  mechanic and you'll win. Like that's it doesn't matter
• 24:42
  what brand is, doesn't matter what you are, none of that
• 24:45
  matters. So they actually, in my opinion,
• 24:47
  they succeeded with that, that role agnostic fight and it it's,
• 24:53
  it's really fun. If all of her mechanics are one
• 24:56
  shot, is there like no damage coming in at all?
• 24:59
  Does that mean that like, you should just have brand DPS ING
• 25:05
  regardless of what you're doing because you'll be able to keep
• 25:08
  yourself up at the healer or DPS or a tank regardless?
• 25:12
  She just still does like melees between those mechanics.
• 25:16
  So I guess if you have literally no way of healing your character
• 25:20
  at all, which I feel like a lot of specs, a lot of specs have
• 25:25
  some way of doing something for themselves, some type of self
• 25:29
  sustain. Now she still does those, but I
• 25:33
  just don't think they're like Zekvir could melee you in two
• 25:36
  hits and you die. Taibezza is not that right now.
• 25:41
  But like if you get hit by her daggers that she throws or the
• 25:45
  clones that she summons. If you're not looking directly
• 25:47
  at those or if you click on the wrong shadow copy that she makes
• 25:51
  when she does the the ball in a cup puzzle, those things are
• 25:57
  going to kill you. The melees don't seem bad at
• 25:59
  all. Like I know DPS that did it week
• 26:04
  1 and I think there was like a little bit of bugginess going on
• 26:07
  with the very when it like first came out.
• 26:11
  But as far as I've seen it's fine now.
• 26:16
  You could probably still you should probably still do healer
• 26:19
  brand because again, DPS doesn't matter.
• 26:22
  The only the only reason DPS matters is it's just less.
• 26:26
  The fight is faster, so therefore you there's less
• 26:30
  chances of you screwing up the mechanic.
• 26:33
  But that's that's pretty much it.
• 26:35
  So I think they like they learned.
• 26:37
  It feels like to me that they learned a lot going from season
• 26:40
  1 Zekvir to season 2 underpin and now Kybezza being the the
• 26:46
  the delve boss of the last season of war within them.
• 26:49
  I feel like they nailed it. I love it.
• 26:51
  Been looking at what they've learned.
• 26:54
  What are you hoping for for the midnight delves?
• 26:58
  Are you excited about the outdoor delves and riding?
• 27:03
  Or do you feel that being able to mount up is going to be
• 27:07
  either not impactful or too gimmicky?
• 27:10
  What? What are what are your hopes and
• 27:12
  fears for midnight? Yeah, I think it's cool that if
• 27:19
  World of Warcraft isn't going to let every single mount be able
• 27:22
  to ride Skyride, then having something where a ground mount
• 27:26
  is actually useful is good. Because I feel like every time I
• 27:30
  get a ground mount, I'm like, Oh well, all right, 'cause that
• 27:34
  doesn't there. It's just so niche when I can
• 27:36
  actually use it. But in those situations, I think
• 27:38
  it's cool. I do think like people with like
• 27:42
  if you have the Brutus or mount that you, you kind of have a leg
• 27:46
  up when it comes to the delve. If you can mount up inside of it
• 27:51
  with the auction in the mailbox, like if you need something for
• 27:55
  the delve, you can go get it, which isn't that big of a deal
• 27:58
  because you can just walk out of a delve and reset it like you
• 28:00
  don't lose anything, right. So it's like it's not like a
• 28:02
  mythic. Plus, I'm one of the things that
• 28:07
  they mentioned in the midnight stuff, and this is something
• 28:09
  that I felt should be there the whole time is it can be a really
• 28:16
  good Ave. for storytelling. And if people aren't interested
• 28:20
  in that story, they don't care. They don't have to do it.
• 28:23
  Like I don't it's it's A at most a 20 minute thing, right?
• 28:29
  Most elves if if you're going slowly on an 11, probably only
• 28:33
  takes about 20 minutes. This they said something in
• 28:37
  midnight that like they're they're having more story.
• 28:42
  They'll be telling like little a little bit more story in the
• 28:45
  delves. So that to me, I'm like, that's
• 28:48
  super exciting. I don't think it's going to be,
• 28:50
  you know, what happens to Xalatath in these, but I think
• 28:54
  it'll be like cool little side stories of like, oh, this is
• 28:57
  what this group of blood elves was doing during the the March
• 29:00
  of called de Nos and like that. I'm excited.
• 29:04
  I'm excited to see story stuff for fears.
• 29:12
  I feel like Blizzard has poor institutional memory of There
• 29:21
  are things that I feel like they have solved in the past and then
• 29:24
  given enough time that problem comes back and it's like, you
• 29:28
  solved this before. Why is it here again?
• 29:31
  Why are we dealing with this again?
• 29:34
  So I'm a little worried that they might that might happen
• 29:37
  with with Delves at some point of like there being a really
• 29:42
  obnoxious mechanic that people have to deal with.
• 29:44
  Like Krieg balls Rest had that with the with the candle that
• 29:48
  you had to place in very specific spots and you needed
• 29:51
  that and you couldn't see anything without it and you
• 29:53
  couldn't you'd take damage and blah, blah, blah.
• 29:55
  Or the underwater mechanics that nobody liked in the Tacrathon
• 29:59
  and sinkhole. I'd be worried that they would
• 30:01
  bring that type of stuff back, but other than that, I don't
• 30:07
  really think I have any like strong fears about delves except
• 30:11
  for them going away and I don't think they will.
• 30:15
  I think. I think that from my
• 30:18
  understanding, I think Blizzard is pretty happy with the
• 30:21
  implementation of this this third end game pillar.
• 30:26
  Do you have any thoughts on like?
• 30:28
  Could delves be tuned to a point where they could be more
• 30:32
  rewarding with gear eventually reaching something like just no,
• 30:36
  just no? Because it's not about the
• 30:38
  delve, it's it's not about the difficulty of the delve, it's
• 30:42
  about the fact that it can be done solo.
• 30:45
  And I think, I think right now heroic being the highest it can
• 30:49
  get that you can get from doing them is a great hero track year.
• 30:55
  I think that's a great middle ground.
• 30:56
  If you start rewarding the highest tier gear in myth track
• 31:00
  from a solo content thing that people can do, I I think that
• 31:07
  that damages that other content to my it.
• 31:12
  It becomes a point of like, why should I bother?
• 31:15
  Even if I find it fun? Why should I go through the
• 31:18
  stress of organizing 20 people to mythic raid consistently and
• 31:25
  deal with that roster boss and deal with morale and deal with
• 31:29
  scheduling and all of this other stuff when I can simply walk
• 31:32
  into a delve and get it? Even if it's really hard, it's
• 31:36
  I, I can almost guarantee there's nothing gameplay wise
• 31:39
  that's going to be harder than scheduling 20 people to
• 31:43
  consistently raid together or, you know, push mythic plus
• 31:50
  consistently together or like any of that stuff.
• 31:54
  I feel like you just you, I don't think you can do it.
• 31:58
  I think you'd have to introduce a higher tier of gear from that
• 32:02
  other content and therefore defeats the purpose of
• 32:05
  introducing that. You know what I mean?
• 32:08
  But maybe, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm not a I'm not a dev, I
• 32:11
  just like video games. Well, if people want to hear
• 32:16
  from you and your love of video games, where can they find you?
• 32:20
  Yeah, twitch.tv/missile Dine Online is where I stream
• 32:27
  Thursday through Sunday and Manny frequently joins me.
• 32:32
  Yeah, we push keys on Sunday and I bother you from chat on other
• 32:35
  days. Yeah, it's the best.
• 32:38
  And then I also do YouTube stuff.
• 32:41
  You can just look up Missile Dine on YouTube and I got a like
• 32:44
  3 different channels that I need to get back to consistently.
• 32:48
  Yeah. And if people want to catch that
• 32:50
  interview that you did with the Delve interview, I think that's
• 32:53
  on your Missile Dine Wow channel as well.
• 32:56
  Yeah, Yep, Missile Dine, Wow. And you can kind of hear some of
• 32:59
  their. I really like that because it it
• 33:00
  shared some of the thoughts that they've had about delves as like
• 33:04
  a system. And they, that's where they
• 33:07
  talked about like, well, we don't really want to put story
• 33:09
  into it because we don't want people to feel like they have to
• 33:12
  do this, like they have to wait for this specific story scenario
• 33:15
  to come up so that they can do it.
• 33:17
  And I'm kind of glad to see that of what they've talked about
• 33:20
  with Midnight, because they've kind of maybe rethought that a
• 33:24
  little bit. And then them talking about the,
• 33:28
  the fact that like the Delve team, the people very
• 33:33
  specifically crafting Delves understood what Delves were, but
• 33:36
  like the World of Warcraft team as a whole didn't.
• 33:40
  And them mentioning that like now they're starting to get it
• 33:43
  and then seeing Delves in Season 3 and like how good those are
• 33:47
  and, and everything else. I, it's, it's really cool to see
• 33:51
  them talk about that and like be able to connect it to what we're
• 33:54
  seeing in the game as well. So yeah, big fan of that, that
• 33:57
  interview. Awesome.
• 34:00
  All right, well, that is going to be it for for us again, you
• 34:04
  can check out Corey on his channels on YouTube, Missile
• 34:07
  Dine online, including Missile Dine.
• 34:08
  Wow, If you want to see that dev interview, you can also check
• 34:11
  him out on the Twitch streaming, as you said, Thursdays through
• 34:15
  Sundays. Once again, Corey, thank you so
• 34:18
  much for coming out today. Thank you, Manny.
• 34:21
  You're the best. And until next time, guys, may
• 34:24
  all your hits be quits.