Latest / Coffee People Podcast / James Shepherd from Bombora Coffee + Water Supplies drops salesman wisdom.

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James Shepherd from Bombora Coffee + Water Supplies drops salesman wisdom. · Coffee People Podcast

0:01
Hey everyone, welcome to another episode of the Coffee People
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podcast presented by Rostar Coffee Packaging.
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I'm your host, Ryan Wolt. We're in the middle of season
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context from the episode. OK, now that that is out of the
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way, I hope that you have a good cup of coffee at the ready
0:56
because we're going to get into the conversation with the new
0:58
guest today. Thank you for being here with me
1:01
on the Coffee People podcast. Cheers.
1:43
More interested I was. I tried not to learn too much
1:45
because I want to learn it today.
1:48
You know, on the show it was actually pretty easy not to
1:52
learn anything about you. There are a lot of James
1:55
Shepherds. I made a list even recently.
1:58
There was a James Shepard spelled the same way, by the
2:01
way. I had it spelled right in my
2:02
notes. Who is an attorney.
2:05
He was charged with conspiracy to defraud the government of
2:07
Turks and Caicos. I'm assuming not you.
2:10
There's a Scottish professor who was a leading pioneer in the
2:14
investigation and prevention of coronary heart disease.
2:18
There's a real estate agent in southeast England.
2:21
In America, you got the founder of what became North Carolina
2:24
Central University, one of the first black universities in the
2:27
Southeast. Also a pharmacist.
2:31
Right down the street, there's a lecturer for the Christian
2:34
Science Church named James Shepherd.
2:37
All the same spelling. I mean, it's a.
2:39
It's a. All the same spelling, very
2:40
specific. There's a guy who makes pop arts
2:44
focusing a lot on Cheetos. His name is James Shepherd and a
2:49
champion cornette playing musician from north Umberland,
2:52
also James Shepherd. I did have to look up what that
2:55
was. That kind of sounds about right.
2:57
That definitely sounds about right.
3:00
So the point is, is you have a name that people know and if you
3:02
wouldn't mind introducing yourself to the audience with
3:06
your name and where you work and kind of what your title there
3:08
is. Sure, no problem.
3:10
No problem. Just tell us now.
3:12
Like go for it. Yeah, sure.
3:17
My name is James Shepherd and I work for Bombora Supplies.
3:22
I look after kind of sales definitely around the North
3:26
American market. That's that's my kind of
3:29
position and role. Bombora Supplies, they kind of
3:32
do coffee supplies and obviously water filtration and cleaning
3:38
and everything in between. We're kind of a we're a company
3:41
that try to be neutral. We try and supply everything
3:44
apart from coffee beans and coffee machines.
3:46
We try and supply everything else in between.
3:48
That's Bombora supplies. I like neutral.
3:51
You're like the Switzerland. We don't judge your coffee, we
3:54
just provide you the means to to make it and drink it.
3:57
You can. You can roast it as dark or as
3:59
light as you like. We're there.
4:01
To help support you. You mentioned that you're you're
4:05
kind of in charge of the North American market for for Bombora,
4:09
but where are you based? Yeah, I'm based in Ireland, in
4:12
Dublin, Ireland. So thankfully we're not too far
4:15
away. Sometimes people question that
4:17
and they kind of say, so you're in Ireland and you're looking
4:19
after a market that's already behind time frame wise.
4:23
But just to confuse it even more, the company I work for
4:26
represents are actually Australian based in Australia.
4:29
So again, a completely different time zone, but I think my kind
4:33
of day would start very similar time zone to obviously East
4:36
Coast. So of course, like I'd maybe
4:38
start a little bit later and obviously carry on through.
4:41
And then I would take maybe a gap or an hour or two.
4:43
And then I'd still be online doing calls at my 10:00 PM, my
4:48
10:30. But that kind of works in in
4:50
favor then obviously for the for the morning time if I want to
4:52
spend time with the family or do car runs or drop offs that kind
4:56
of thing. Sure.
4:58
Do you do you do most of your job virtually then?
5:02
I mean, I, I, I've met you in real life here on the West Coast
5:06
in Portland not long ago that. Was lucky for me, not so lucky
5:10
for you. I gave me someone to talk to you
5:13
that I could curse in front of, you know?
5:16
How often are you traveling back and forth over the ocean there?
5:20
So we're very much in person. We want to deal with people and
5:23
to have a physical presence, not just be virtual and not just be
5:28
an e-mail or a website. We actually want to deal with
5:30
people face to face. We kind of, we, we kind of see
5:33
that approach, that old style, that old fashioned approach as
5:36
still the way to do things. I think that I would be in the
5:39
US or Canada or wherever, every five to six weeks we normally
5:43
plan a trip and so on. On that kind of planning aspect,
5:47
you're kind of making sure of what area you're going to, what
5:50
customers do you have there, make sure you've got
5:52
appointments obviously organized and then follow up calls.
5:55
We try and keep it as light hearted as possible and of
5:58
course now we've built up good relationships, we've got
6:01
friendships. So it's more about friendships
6:03
and network and relationships. Hence hence where we met in Ross
6:06
Summit. You know, I have all these
6:09
questions kind of about your back story, but that leads me
6:11
into something I want to make sure that we get to, which is
6:16
we're at a weird time in the world politically.
6:19
I think everybody thinks they're always at a weird time.
6:22
But this one feels like travel is a little bit more confusing,
6:25
especially people traveling to the United States for work.
6:28
Has that impacted what you do or how you have to think about your
6:32
trips and your travel and your work stuff or how you are
6:35
because you're you're importing product kind of all over the
6:38
world. So I would imagine there's kind
6:40
of a daily, OK, what's our status today, which is not
6:43
necessarily how it's been. Yeah, without a doubt.
6:46
I think obviously we're in challenging times.
6:49
There's no one in our industry, not just in North America, but I
6:52
think across across the globe that are being impacted by
6:56
challenges, whether it be shipping costs or whether it be
6:58
tariffs or the price of coffee. You know, even even if you take
7:02
that subject away, but we're a manufacturer.
7:06
We manufacture products and we we export them and we obviously
7:10
import them around the world. I think obviously a lot of our
7:14
products that we do make are, are made in China.
7:17
And if we're obviously importing them into the US, then of course
7:20
there has been recent challenges right now, but nothing that we
7:24
haven't faced before. I think it's more a case of
7:26
reviewing that, looking at that and assessing it Day by day.
7:30
It's changing, week by week it's changing.
7:32
But I think that we're not alone.
7:34
I think that anyone who is doing what we do are in a very similar
7:38
boat. We could talk about competitors.
7:41
Of course, our competitors are in exactly the same boat.
7:44
I think it's it's frustration, but I think we just want to make
7:47
sure that it's more personal. And I think that that
7:50
relationship comes down to making sure you have a
7:53
connection with people. We're fortunate in the fact that
7:56
Ireland has a good relationship with, with the US.
7:59
And when I say we have a good relationship, you pre clearance
8:02
in Dublin, Ireland. So of course, when I, when I
8:05
leave Dublin, I'm, I'm clearing US immigration in Ireland.
8:09
So as soon as I land in the US, I'm landing as a domestic
8:11
flight. So of course that just takes it.
8:13
Thankfully there's good relationships there.
8:14
It also saves on time. I'm not standing in a queue and
8:17
say Chicago airport for three hours.
8:19
I'm straight on through, just like you.
8:23
Right. Didn't they just announced, I
8:24
think as we're talking like yesterday, Europe, the EU is
8:29
going to a biometric system for American citizens.
8:32
So we'll have to get fingerprinted on our way in if
8:35
we want to continue on. So I've been, we just got back
8:39
from an overseas trip and so that was, you could see the
8:41
machines were being set up as we were there for that purpose.
8:45
So it's going to be, it's just an interesting time for people
8:49
who like to travel, people in an industry that requires a you
8:54
weren't always in sales with Bambora.
8:57
I mean, it'd be impressive if they could have you like the
8:59
second it came out and you just put you to work.
9:01
But I don't think that's how it works.
9:03
Do you have any first memories of coffee or your first coffee
9:08
experience? You mentioned to me that you
9:09
didn't drink coffee until you kind of got into the industry,
9:12
but when, when was that? Where was that?
9:15
Yeah, sure, I worked. So initially there was a job
9:17
that popped up. I was working for a, for a
9:20
company and I was looking to complete career change.
9:23
I was selling kind of smoothies and slush drinks and wanted a
9:28
complete career change and wasn't really enjoying it.
9:30
And of course, I was with a recruitment company and they
9:33
sent me a note and said there's a job As for representing a
9:37
coffee roaster in Scotland, in Glasgow, Scotland.
9:39
And they're saying they're looking for a salesperson and
9:42
would you be interested? And I, I didn't drink coffee.
9:44
I had no interest in coffee whatsoever.
9:46
That was about 20 years ago and I went for an interview, met a
9:50
guy and we got talking and obviously he invited me to the
9:53
roastery and we kind of hit it off early on.
9:56
And he said, would you like a coffee?
9:58
And my wife had said to me before I went for the interview,
10:00
what are you going to do If he asked you for a coffee?
10:02
I couldn't tell you what a latte was.
10:04
I couldn't tell you what an espresso was.
10:05
And I said lie. So of course he said, what would
10:08
you like? And I said, whatever you're
10:09
having and he said, I'm going to make a latte and I said I'll
10:12
have one of those. So he he produced a double shot
10:15
espresso and I was like, what is that?
10:17
And of course he then foam the milk and steamed it and he
10:20
wobbled his head as he did it. And then very carefully, we both
10:23
went back into his office and he sat down.
10:25
I sat down, he lifted his cup and he missed his mouth and the
10:29
coffee went. All down.
10:31
His chin all over his tiny shirt and that just broke the ice.
10:35
I put my cup down, didn't have to drink it, and the rest is
10:37
history. I got the job.
10:39
So yeah, that's that's a true story.
10:40
That's a true story. So you take that job with the
10:43
roaster, but you know obviously you've continued on the
10:46
industry. You mentioned that was 20 years
10:47
ago. How did your kind of coffee
10:51
education progress then? And I, I have notes here like
10:55
you that you were a barista at some point or you were competing
10:58
as a barista. Yeah.
11:00
So the, the company that I did work for at the time, they were
11:03
a Scottish roaster. They were 140 years old as a
11:06
family business and they were like the 6th generation.
11:09
The, the, the person who owned the company at the time, he was
11:12
a massive innovator, leader and just a forward thinker.
11:16
He, he created a website calledcoffeepolice.com and
11:20
you're talking in the, the early 2000s, even before that.
11:24
And it was basically to, to report coffee crime.
11:26
I mean, and it was basically it was, it was breast the trainers.
11:29
That's brilliant. And you could obviously report
11:32
coffee crime. His whole model was if you were
11:35
a customer, if you're a customer facing, then you had to be able
11:38
to be able to pull good shots of espresso, steam, good milk.
11:42
And over a period of time, then he would encourage the staff
11:45
members to get their customers to enter barista competitions.
11:49
The downside was I tried to encourage my customers, but none
11:52
of them were really willing to, to enter the, the, the, the
11:54
Scottish competitions. But I then kind of fell into
11:58
obviously competitions. And then after competing for a
12:01
few years, you, you really, you get absorbed into this thinking
12:07
and feeling that your coffee and what you're doing is the best.
12:10
And it's not until you probably start competing that you're able
12:12
to mix with others that are doing exactly what you're doing
12:15
that you're able to taste other coffees and you're able to
12:18
obviously experience that. And after two years of
12:20
competing, I still didn't have a clue what I was doing.
12:23
And I thought I would go forward.
12:25
I thought I'd go forward to judge.
12:26
And I was, I was really fortunate to, to judge for the
12:29
UK for the Irish championships. And that was a really
12:33
interesting time in Ireland because we'd, we'd moved from
12:36
Scotland over to Ireland with the same company.
12:39
And it was very much what was happening in the Irish coffee
12:41
scene. And that was, which is now one
12:43
of the most, one of the most dominant in Europe right now is,
12:46
is, is the Irish coffee scene. But I was lucky enough to to
12:49
judge in the world and then by that all through volunteering, I
12:53
was invited then to to take part with the World Coffee
12:56
Championships, which which what people know now and then on the
12:59
back of that invited onto onto the European board.
13:03
And that was literally before the two organisations merged,
13:06
before the two European, European and the US
13:10
organisations merged. So yeah, that's part of that.
13:13
I would like to point out that you said something that I feel
13:15
like I have also said numerous times in my life, which is I
13:19
didn't know what I was doing. So I went on to judge other
13:21
people and what they were doing. Well, competing, competing.
13:26
So of course, it's more a case of go and learn about the rules
13:30
of the competition in a way. And, and I think that there's,
13:33
if you've ever competed, if anyone's ever competed, and then
13:35
they've gone into judging, I think there's, there's an awful
13:38
lot more empathy there because you've, you've been on the other
13:41
side. There's an awful lot of people
13:42
that just go straight into judging.
13:44
And, and of course they haven't had that experience of being
13:47
behind a bar. They've not had the experience
13:48
of shaking like a leaf trying to, trying to, you know,
13:53
memorize your coffee descriptions and presenting your
13:55
coffees. So of course, it's, it's an
13:57
extremely intimidating things. Anyone who competes.
14:00
And of course, Milan is coming up this this Friday.
14:03
And that's where the world's briefs, the championships are
14:05
taking place over the next four days, five days over the next
14:08
little while. It kind of reminds me of, you
14:13
know, somebody who grows up and gets a job in a bar, restaurant,
14:16
a coffee shop when they're young.
14:18
They work their way through that, versus somebody who goes
14:21
to college, gets a hospitality degree, and then they're both up
14:24
for the same job and it's different skill sets.
14:27
It's not to say one path is better than the other.
14:29
It's just the experience of having been there on the ground
14:32
when everything goes wrong creates a foundation I don't
14:36
think you get necessarily just from theory.
14:39
Definitely not again, back to what you said originally like a
14:43
part of our induction and part of our training, no matter where
14:46
you were working for that coffee roaster, the, the roaster the,
14:50
the owner actually had a few coffee shops called Tinderbox in
14:53
Glasgow. And he would encourage the staff
14:55
to put their hands up and say, hey, go and do some shifts
14:58
experience this. So when you are talking to
15:00
customers, you've, you've got some knowledge on this.
15:02
And yeah, I was lucky enough to do a few shifts, probably
15:05
enjoyed it more than than than others in terms of that, that,
15:08
that chaotic side. But it was, yeah, a good
15:11
learning curve and one you try and take.
15:14
Yeah. I think regarding all of this, I
15:16
think the most important thing you could bring it back to what
15:19
we discussed earlier on. It comes down to that face to
15:22
face contact that we, we talked about earlier.
15:24
And there's nothing more engaging than than being able to
15:28
interact with somebody on, on a one to one, whether it be in a
15:31
group. You can only do so much when
15:33
you're online. And I think we kind of learned
15:35
that from our, our pandemic time when everybody went virtual.
15:38
And that's pretty much where our company right now stands.
15:41
And that is that they, they've, they've realized, yes, you can
15:44
do so much from afar, but you have to be face to face.
15:46
You have to be able to go and see people and present and talk
15:49
and, and educate. It's all about education.
15:52
Well, and it's harder to say no to someone who's putting in the
15:54
time and the effort to come and see you.
15:57
I mean, it's easy to say no to an e-mail.
16:01
Yeah. You know, and it, but a lot of
16:04
times it's not necessarily a no because they don't want or need
16:08
or you know, a product or a company, but it's there's no
16:11
context in an e-mail. You can't ask an e-mail a
16:14
question. You can, but you know, you're,
16:16
you're not getting that instant response and back and forth,
16:19
which is so important. You know, in sales, sales to me,
16:23
there's some competitive aspect to it.
16:26
You were a birdies competitor. Did you compete when you were
16:29
young, Sports or activities or anything like that?
16:32
Yeah, of course, really badly, but I still competed, you know,
16:35
that way. But yeah, but not, not on any
16:37
high level whatsoever. Like I even now I try and play
16:39
golf. I'm absolutely terrible at it.
16:41
I I would run and that's that's my thing.
16:43
But yeah. I was talking to someone in the
16:47
coffee industry yesterday and they said that they were going
16:49
to take up golf so that they would get used to losing money
16:52
and feel comfortable with it, which I thought was pretty
16:55
funny. You know, you're out and and
16:58
meeting you mentioned the board that you were on as part of I
17:03
don't think you're doing that now, But what value do you find
17:08
in in groups like that or not? Or where do they get it right or
17:11
wrong? And in because the barista
17:14
circuit and the championship circuit and the festival circuit
17:17
that you and I have been on in some cases is different than the
17:22
day-to-day of coffee. So where what's their purpose in
17:26
the world? What you know, what is their
17:27
value to the to the greater, the greater good of coffee.
17:31
Yeah, really good question. I think I think if, if you
17:35
obviously there's standards, isn't there, I think there's
17:38
through every industry, there's standards through any sport,
17:41
there's a federation or there's an organization, there's a group
17:45
of people that would probably try and and set those former
17:48
standards, whether that be in the building construction
17:51
industry, whether it be in the mechanical motor industry,
17:53
whether it be soccer or or NFL. So I think regarding our side of
17:58
things, when you talk about the, the coffee industry, the the
18:01
coffee association is pretty much seen as that kind of a,
18:05
that, that go to in terms of writing programs or education or
18:10
certifications. I think there has to be a
18:14
standard. There has to be kind of a, a
18:16
level. It doesn't mean to say you have
18:17
to follow it. I think there's, there's a great
18:19
way in saying that just because someone's telling you how to do
18:23
something doesn't mean to say it's right.
18:25
Does it make sense like you could It's yeah, there's,
18:28
there's, there's definitely some pluses and some benefits
18:31
regarding what, what the education system would be and
18:34
what the standards are. But of course there's, there's
18:36
others. And I would kind of be on on
18:38
that side as well that it's not to say you have to do it that
18:41
way. Usually if someone says I have
18:45
to do something a certain way, my instinct is to view into
18:48
that. Yeah, yeah.
18:49
However, however, I, I'm of that, I'm probably more of that
18:52
now, but I think if you're starting off and if you're, if
18:56
you're kind of view into the industry or if you're looking
18:59
for some form of a career path, then it, then there's a great
19:02
opportunity regarding what the, what that education system
19:04
offers in terms of what the SCA offers.
19:07
If you're looking for that barista basics or if you're
19:09
looking for the the roasting aspects, there's certain aspects
19:13
definitely be improved. I mean, for instance, if you
19:15
look at all the competitions, the one competition that
19:18
probably doesn't get the same attention and it's probably far
19:21
superior is my experience is cup tasters.
19:24
The Cup Taster championship is all about skill on the pallet.
19:29
There's no judges, there's no presentation.
19:31
It's a spoon and it's, it's down to then tasting the triangular
19:35
of coffee in speeds. And obviously only one is the
19:38
odd one out and you have to try and guess what the odd one out
19:40
is in, in 8 rounds and it's the fastest 1 to do that.
19:43
That's an incredible competition.
19:45
That's that's to me, it's the best competition.
19:47
No judges. I don't even think I could just
19:50
do that with the coffee that I have in my hand right now.
19:53
And it's such a unique skill set.
19:57
I find that tasting coffee in particular is something that I
20:01
really have to focus my intention on.
20:03
I have to kind of block out the rest of the world and just this
20:08
is the thing I'm thinking about. But the second something else
20:10
breaks into my brain, I've lost it, which is why I don't do
20:14
coffee tastings as a general rule.
20:18
You mentioned Ireland as being kind of a dominant force of the
20:22
coffee industry in Europe. You're spending a lot of time
20:24
between both North America, Western Europe.
20:30
What do you see as being maybe cultural differences as in the
20:34
in the coffee area specifically, I mean, what is trending over
20:37
there versus over here? Or do you see it all being kind
20:41
of homogeneous because of the Internet, because of the Tik
20:44
Toks of the world? Yeah, there is a homogeneous
20:48
effect. This this happening.
20:49
There's no question. I think I would.
20:52
I would say it depends on what region you're talking about.
20:55
It depends on what state you're talking about.
20:57
Regarding the USI think that certain states have more of the
21:02
chains. There's a huge amount of chains.
21:04
Of course, you have a number of chains that you don't just have
21:07
the Starbucks, you have the seven brews you have.
21:09
You have various others as well, obviously.
21:13
And whereas in Ireland we literally have maybe maybe one
21:17
independent chain, if that makes sense, which is completely
21:19
independent. It's an Irish chain.
21:21
It would be known as Insomnia Coffee versus the other brands,
21:25
which obviously which, which we'd all know, which would be
21:27
Starbucks. That's pretty much it.
21:30
I mean, there's a big, there's a big thing here in Ireland where
21:33
it's about independence. There's a big thing here about
21:36
supporting local and that's obviously we're counties as
21:40
well. There's a number of counties in
21:41
Ireland, there's County Dublin, County Cork, County Galway,
21:45
obviously a number of them including the counties in the
21:47
north. And, and I'd like to think that
21:49
there's a huge regard to those that are roasting.
21:54
There's an awful lot of those that are roasting, which of
21:56
course there's always a little bit of competition, but there's
21:58
more kind of synergy in terms of sharing knowledge more about the
22:01
community. If there's events happening, if
22:03
there's a public cupping or if there's the air press
22:06
championships, everybody gets together.
22:08
There's still one kind of large Irish roaster and they would
22:13
still, they've always kind of LED through education.
22:15
They're over 150 a 160 years old and they're kind of like a hot
22:19
household name, if that makes sense.
22:21
So if you go to someone's house and they have that brand of tea
22:24
or they have that brand of coffee, there's a nostalgia
22:26
there, if that makes sense. But of course the micro roasters
22:30
and some some other larger roasters as well have done a
22:33
very good job in in obviously helping to develop that market.
22:37
I would say that I if if my understanding of basic history
22:41
is right, independence has always been a big deal in
22:43
Ireland and Scotland and in England.
22:46
Yeah, I think people are proud. I mean, obviously, yeah, they're
22:48
very, very proud of of where they live, where they're from
22:51
and, and also that would come down to their their county as
22:55
well. So it'd be extremely loyal to
22:57
that particular area. Of course they'll love Ireland,
22:59
but they live in a particular area like County Meath for
23:02
instance, which the neighbor County Dublin.
23:04
They'll be very protective of the of the county that they live
23:07
in and don't be vocal about it in a friendly way, but still
23:10
very vocal about it. Sure.
23:11
That's an interesting thing that I think a lot of Americans are
23:14
going through right now. I know, you know, I am the pride
23:17
of place. Even if you disagree with things
23:19
or or agree, you don't have to necessarily be proud of the
23:25
place. You are at the detriment to
23:27
others. You can just be proud that, you
23:29
know, I represent this place. You know, there's a there's a
23:31
coffee roaster in Wisconsin, which is the state that I'm
23:34
from, called Ruby Coffee. And they do such a great job.
23:39
And I'm very impressed with the business they've built in a very
23:41
small community. And it makes me proud to be from
23:44
a place where someone is doing that has nothing to do with
23:47
anyone else's. Is, is game.
23:49
And that's kind of how I relate to it.
23:53
You know, you've been doing this now for, you said almost 20
23:57
years. Yes, 20 plus.
23:58
Yeah, 20 plus, how has your percept, how is your, your
24:04
perspective changed as a salesperson from then to now,
24:10
knowing that it's going to be impacted both by outside
24:14
factors, but also you growing as a person and your family growing
24:18
and, and what you want out of life?
24:22
Yeah, I think, I think the most important thing there is you.
24:28
You cannot get cynical. I think it'd be very easy when
24:31
you're in an industry, any industry for so long, it's hard
24:34
not to get cynical and be pessimistic.
24:37
It's it's probably not within my make up to be that kind of
24:41
person. I'd be very much an optimist.
24:44
I'd always look to see what the positive is and, and kind of be
24:47
grateful for for the opportunities that we actually
24:49
have. I think literally today we had a
24:53
call with a new startup, for instance, in South Carolina.
24:56
They're looking to start up a business.
24:58
They're looking to have a physical store, like an actual
25:02
walk in store, look at the products, whole products as well
25:05
as having an online presence. And they're not going to be a
25:08
roster, but it's trying to speak with them and actually allowing
25:13
them the, the knowledge, allowing them the opportunity to
25:17
say that this is an, an extremely good industry.
25:20
They've not come from the industry.
25:21
They've come from a medical background in terms of selling
25:24
medical supplies. And they've taken the, the path
25:27
because obviously they see something interesting what the
25:29
coffee industry is. And from a very short space of
25:32
time, they've actually recognized that the willingness
25:35
of people in our industry to help and to support is second to
25:38
none. And I think that that's not just
25:42
in in Ireland, it's not just in North America.
25:45
Thankfully, that is global. And I think that when you
25:48
consider the challenges that we're all going through, whether
25:51
they're personal, whether they're business, the great
25:53
thing is that we all come together for what is a cup of
25:56
coffee and we can talk about it until the cows come home.
26:01
And we can, we can also, we can learn from each other.
26:04
And I think that even when you consider we went to Ross Summit,
26:08
you look at people there and you had all different ages, you had
26:12
all different experiences and you had those that were in their
26:15
infancy at those that maybe been five years of industry or 10 or
26:18
15 years of industry, everybody was supporting each other.
26:21
And that's what is really, really impressive.
26:23
So it's hard to be demotivated by that.
26:26
You kind of get uplifted. I would almost consider that to
26:30
be like good coffee, smarter advice, you know, for somebody
26:34
in the industry. I'm wondering if you have a
26:37
piece of life advice outside of coffee, just something that you
26:40
kind of live by or that you've heard over the years that has
26:43
stuck with you and, and you apply to your, you know, your
26:45
day-to-day. Yeah, help help people, like
26:50
help others like generally, like there's so many times where
26:54
people try and crawl over others, but it's, it's kind of
26:58
it's, it's a good thing to help other people.
27:00
And whether that be in our industry.
27:02
I think like I've got, I've got kids, my kids were like, I think
27:08
it's, it's, we can offer something if that makes sense.
27:11
And I think there's an opportunity for youth to get
27:14
more involved. And I think that like a youth
27:16
project for coffee is, is definitely something I'm
27:18
passionate about. And I'd like to be able to have
27:21
a, have some form of impact with.
27:23
And because you're, you're helping people at the starting
27:25
stages to say, hey, OK, there's something definitely here,
27:28
whether you go in to be a barista, whether you go in to be
27:31
a coffee tech, if you want to be front of house or back of house,
27:34
there's, there's something along there.
27:36
If you want to take it with you on your travels, if you want to
27:39
go and study and do whatever that degree might be, if you
27:42
want to come back to coffee, coffee will always be there for
27:44
you. When you say youth, I assume
27:47
youth is anything younger than me by one day I OK, well.
27:52
I would consider. I consider maybe 2 days maybe.
27:55
OK, OK, two days. How does your family feel about
27:58
your international community? Do they think that's cool?
28:02
Do they miss you? Do they are they happy you're
28:04
gone for a week every now and again?
28:05
I mean, what's the thing? How do you manage that balance?
28:08
Well, I get 5 weeks back at home in the house, like when I'm not
28:12
travelling between 5:00 to six weeks where I'm, I'm physically
28:14
here as a, as a person. And, and of course, I can also
28:17
be that annoying guy, very annoying guy.
28:19
And so there's definitely times we're like, please go.
28:22
And then there's other things like, hey, like welcome back.
28:25
But yeah, there's always a balance.
28:27
I've, I've probably, I've been more present in, in physical
28:31
like person in this, in this job than I have in previous.
28:35
And, and yeah, I think that's, that's important as well.
28:38
I think thankfully some people in the house find me funny.
28:42
Not everyone, but some people find me funny.
28:44
And when they don't, then I try and keep my mouth shut, which is
28:46
kind of hard. Not a good piece of advice.
28:51
My wife and I are about to celebrate our 20 year wedding
28:54
anniversary and congratulations. I learned a long time ago that
28:58
it doesn't matter if I'm funny to everyone else, it only
29:01
matters if I'm funny to her. Yeah, yeah.
29:03
So as long as she's laughing, I'm OK and. 100% hundred.
29:08
Percent, that's my only advice to anyone thinking about getting
29:11
married or in a long relationship.
29:14
I'm drinking a a local roaster called Sisters Coffee today.
29:20
It's a lighter roast than maybe I would normally go for, but I'm
29:23
really enjoying it. And even though I'm not terribly
29:27
effective at brewing coffee every morning, my question for
29:32
you, and it's a question I've been starting to ask people, is
29:36
what makes for a good cup of coffee for you?
29:41
Is it the coffee? Is it the extraneous, you know,
29:43
what is it that makes it? So for me, it's yes.
29:47
It's just the fact that it exists is always nice.
29:50
And, you know, in the morning, it's a, it's a routine for me,
29:54
but that is almost more important to me than the coffee
29:57
itself. So I'm I'm curious as to where
29:59
you land on that line. Yeah, I can be totally honest
30:03
with you and I'll tell you obviously I drink a lot of
30:05
coffee. I try and stick it to 1 cup a
30:08
day and it just I always try and have a coffee in the morning.
30:12
I would generally do what needs to be done and then enjoy my
30:16
coffee before having food, before I have to leave the
30:19
house. If I have to leave the airport.
30:21
I'm very fortunate. I've got an Espress machine and
30:23
it's a good Espress machine, a good grinder.
30:27
And obviously I would always have a flat white.
30:30
That's kind of my coffee of choice.
30:32
There's a roaster who's literally a stone's throw from
30:34
us. He's less than a mile away.
30:37
He roasts, he's got the Studio Coffee Roasters and they
30:40
actually supply a national chain of, of stores and I can walk
30:44
into our national chain of stores and pick up two of his
30:47
bag of beans and throw them in my hopper and I've got good
30:49
coffee. Does that make sense?
30:51
So they get also really lucky that that people will give you
30:54
coffee whenever you go to visit them.
30:56
Not always but, but, but a lot of the time that you can come
30:58
back and you can maybe share that amongst your friends who
31:00
probably won't appreciate it in the same way that that we might.
31:03
But yeah, I'm, I'm lucky. I've got a good Aspers machine
31:06
and a good grinder and I've generally always got some good
31:08
beans. So and a flat White's my choice.
31:10
That's my choice. What, what's the future for
31:13
Bambora? I mean, are you guys growing or
31:16
actively trying to grow or, you know, what is the there's always
31:21
going to be a need for supplies, but we're in an interesting time
31:24
of contraction as well, or consolidation rather maybe not
31:27
contraction. You know what's the future hold
31:30
for your company and for your role in it.
31:33
Yeah, sure. I think obviously we're AI mean
31:36
without sales pitch, but we are a 20 year old, 21 year old
31:40
company based at Australia and the first products we ever
31:43
started to sell were water filtration and coffee machine
31:48
cleaning. They were the two products that
31:49
we started with. And then that allowed us to
31:53
create and develop the brand which is known as Rhino Coffee
31:56
Gear and it allowed us to create the other brand which we have,
31:59
which is ours, which is known as Brewer.
32:02
And on the back of that we've got some lifestyle brands behind
32:05
us, which we represent not just in Australia, but also in the
32:09
North American market. The machine cleaning and the
32:14
water filtration still accounts for about 60% of our business.
32:18
We have, we make we manufacture close to 7000 skews in our
32:22
product line. It's about being innovative.
32:25
It's about being something's first to the market and you can
32:28
be first to the market with the products that you know is going
32:31
to catch on and you know it's going to be copied.
32:33
But it's very important to be first to the market at a good
32:36
price before everybody else copies it.
32:39
Does that make sense? And I think we've been fairly
32:41
innovative when it comes to that.
32:43
I think not setting back and just resting on the products
32:47
that we've created. We're always trying to invent
32:49
the next thing and that might be from a stainless steel milk
32:52
pitcher to a range of different colors in terms of those milk
32:57
pitchers. So everyone else might just
32:58
bring up the stainless steel or the white and the black.
33:00
Does it make sense? It's just it's what's next,
33:02
what's next. And it's, it's obviously we
33:05
listen to our customers. It's nicely important to listen
33:08
to our customers, get that feedback, try and have the
33:10
products. But for the future and us in
33:13
North America, I think it's a long game.
33:17
We've been in the US for over nearly nine years now and we've
33:21
got obviously warehousing, we've got staff on the ground.
33:24
We'd love to invest more time. I think that's the most
33:28
important thing. But the most important thing for
33:30
us right now is to be there to support our staff, to support
33:33
our customers at #1 and making sure we have the product for
33:37
them as well. I don't know that I really
33:40
understood before we talked today that your company was
33:45
manufacturing the products as well as selling them.
33:48
I, you know, looking at the website, you see all the
33:51
different things, but I didn't quite understand that part of
33:53
the story. And I could be wrong, but maybe
33:56
that gives you as a salesman a better understanding of how the
33:59
product works and the history of it and why it has value beyond
34:04
than just, oh, it's a skew on my list here.
34:07
Yeah, without I think we're very fortunate to work with some some
34:12
really good partners as well, which we have exclusive with
34:14
exclusives with, if that makes sense.
34:16
So Commodansy hand grinders, the Gevetto cleaning and of course
34:20
Nucleus coffee tools. There's some product lines which
34:23
are we kind of talk about the goods better, best and you know,
34:27
there's, there's the ones that you definitely should have nice
34:30
to have or, or could have people kind of forget about the
34:34
cleaning. They they, they don't really put
34:36
it on the radar, but it's a product that has to be used
34:38
every single day. Like if you want to have
34:40
obviously functional cleaning hygienic machines, then
34:43
obviously cleaning is the is the thing they kind of forget about.
34:46
They almost look at what's the new hand tamper with the with
34:49
the needles on it or what's the vibration tool known as the NCD
34:52
pulse. And but they forget about the,
34:54
the practical side of things. So it's making sure we have more
34:56
practical things and and just being relevant is is slightly
34:59
important. I have a question for you from
35:04
an interested third party who sent this to me and wanted me to
35:09
ask very specifically, but they were wondering if you could
35:11
speak to how good you are at the arcade game Duck Hunter.
35:16
Well, I would say if I've had a beep pursuit, I'm I'm really,
35:20
really good. And if I'm really focusing, then
35:24
then I would say I'd probably be terrible.
35:26
Yeah, let's let's be honest. You know, I was thinking about
35:31
this this morning and just a little bit on the arcade thing,
35:35
But I grew up in the late 80s, early 90s as a kid going to play
35:40
video games at the bowling alley or wherever I was going.
35:43
And it was my first lesson in finite resource and also
35:49
budgeting. And it was because there was
35:52
this transition between when video games cost 1:45 or three
35:57
or four quarters. And so I can play one, there'd
36:01
only be 1 video game. And if that's the game I wanted
36:03
and someone else had it not available, finite resource.
36:07
But on the other side of that, if the game I wanted to play,
36:10
say NBA Jam was $0.75 but Miss Pacman was 1/4, did I want one
36:16
game versus 3? You know, over the course of a
36:18
morning and quarters weren't always easy to come by.
36:22
So a little less than you can find as you get old.
36:26
This is my advice to anyone listening.
36:28
You will find lessons from your past everywhere.
36:32
That is especially when it comes to budgeting on how many games
36:34
you can play. We, we never had them in the
36:37
bowling alleys. Our, our amusement arcades were
36:40
called Puggies. Puggies.
36:42
It was a shall we go down to the Puggies and you jump on your
36:44
bike literally and not have quarters.
36:46
We'd have obviously 50 pence species or 20 pence PCs and but
36:51
we probably I was never as good at the budgeting as what you've
36:54
just suggested. I had no regard or thought.
36:56
I just put it in. It was, it was Kickboxer or
36:59
whatever Street Fighter it was we were trying to play.
37:01
Yeah, I was always. Fashion going 2 fingers with the
37:04
with those buttons. We just stayed in an Airbnb that
37:07
had a Miss Pac-Man machine and it was the first time I think my
37:10
wife has ever seen me so focused.
37:13
She's like, you should focus like this when you're like
37:15
cleaning and stuff. And I was like, it's different.
37:19
Anything that I missed today or anything about coffee or the
37:21
industry or Bambura that you wanted to share that I didn't
37:24
get to? Yeah, I think I, I'm, I'm really
37:28
bad, believe it or not, you might not know this, but I'm
37:30
really bad at answering questions.
37:33
I'm much, much better at asking questions just because I'm
37:36
normally on the other side as a salesperson, you, you're, it's
37:41
good to keep people talking and to get information from them in
37:43
terms of that extraction. So it's, it's, it's, it's not
37:47
natural for me, if that makes sense, because we're, it's not,
37:49
it's not the norm. It's not the norm.
37:51
That's probably what I'm trying to.
37:52
Say sure. Well, I think you did just fine
37:54
and I could, you know that accent.
37:56
No problem. Smooth.
37:57
Well, I didn't say that. James.
38:05
A real pleasure to chat and learn more about you.
38:10
Anyone listening, you can head to bomboresupplies.com.
38:13
That link will be in our show notes and in our newsletter.
38:16
And if you need coffee supplies, reach out to James Shepherd.
38:22
Thanks a lot, Ryan. Appreciate it.
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