Latest / Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast / Justin Verlander, bullpen battles and tough decisions

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Justin Verlander, bullpen battles and tough decisions · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

0:09
Speaker 1: And welcome into another episode of Tiger Territory, part of
0:12
Speaker 1: the Foul Territory Network. At the Tiger's Podcast, I'm Kieren Steckley.
0:15
Speaker 1: With me is always a man who was good in
0:17
Speaker 1: a pinch, but not so much for a pinch.
0:21
Speaker 2: He's Cody Stavenhagen.
0:22
Speaker 3: How you doing doing all right here? And now?
0:24
Speaker 4: Are you.
0:26
Speaker 2: Doing well? Doing well?
0:27
Speaker 1: Hope everybody's had a safe and happy Saint Patrick's day
0:31
Speaker 1: and enjoyed the World Baseball finale.
0:34
Speaker 2: We obviously don't know what happened.
0:35
Speaker 1: We were recording this before the game, but it's been
0:38
Speaker 1: a fun tournament and hopefully the finale uh.
0:40
Speaker 2: Lived up to the billing.
0:43
Speaker 4: Uh.
0:43
Speaker 1: Something that has lived up to the billing so far,
0:47
Speaker 1: Cody is the return of Justin Verlander, and so we're
0:50
Speaker 1: recording this, you know, a couple hours after his latest
0:53
Speaker 1: spring training start. The game was not available via television.
1:00
Speaker 1: You could listen to Dan and Dan and of course
1:03
Speaker 1: they do a great job, but it's a little bit
1:05
Speaker 1: different when you're trying to scout these things to see
1:07
Speaker 1: it with your own eyes, which you did. Verlander, in
1:10
Speaker 1: case anybody missed it, went four and two thirds, about
1:12
Speaker 1: three hits home run was his last was his last batter,
1:17
Speaker 1: and that was his loan run and earned run with
1:20
Speaker 1: six strikeouts. So since we couldn't see it, Cody, but
1:24
Speaker 1: you could tell us, how did how did Justin Verlander look?
1:28
Speaker 3: Yeah? It looked really good.
1:29
Speaker 4: It was I think easily his best performance of the
1:32
Speaker 4: spring so far. I think Justin would agree. He was
1:35
Speaker 4: quite pleased after this one. He said it was a
1:38
Speaker 4: lot better. I think his body felt more insane. He
1:41
Speaker 4: talked of he could kind of feel his misses, so
1:44
Speaker 4: if he threw a ball, he kind of knew how
1:47
Speaker 4: to adjust, whereas his prior outings maybe hadn't quite been there.
1:51
Speaker 3: Beyond that, it just looked good.
1:54
Speaker 2: You know.
1:54
Speaker 4: It was esthetically pleasing to see Justin Verlander punching some
1:57
Speaker 4: people out. The fastball was definitely good, had a little
2:00
Speaker 4: sizzle on it at times. He touched ninety six in
2:04
Speaker 4: a few different instances, missed some bats with the fastball,
2:07
Speaker 4: and then also a reminder of how smart or how
2:10
Speaker 4: crafty Justin Verlander, especially at age forty three, can be
2:15
Speaker 4: mixed in some slider, mixed in some sweeper, mixed in
2:17
Speaker 4: some right on right changeups.
2:19
Speaker 3: Some of this might not be.
2:20
Speaker 4: Things he's gonna do as much in the regular season.
2:23
Speaker 4: He was clearly working on things. He actually said if
2:26
Speaker 4: it were a real game, he probably just would have
2:28
Speaker 4: leaned on the tighter version of his slider more because
2:31
Speaker 4: it was pretty good. But it was encouraging to see
2:34
Speaker 4: him use multiple weapons, to see him all look pretty sharp,
2:37
Speaker 4: to see him get out of an outing almost unscathed.
2:40
Speaker 4: We did have one more home run ball, his last
2:42
Speaker 4: battery of the day, cinder cut fastball.
2:44
Speaker 3: Brian Romos hit it out of the park.
2:46
Speaker 4: So he has struggled with the home run ball this spring,
2:49
Speaker 4: and that's kind of the type of pitcher he's been
2:51
Speaker 4: throughout his career. But if there was any concern that, oh, like,
2:56
Speaker 4: is he not going to be able to get ramped
2:57
Speaker 4: up you know for the regular season, that concertain is
3:00
Speaker 4: alleviated big time because I thought he had a really
3:03
Speaker 4: nice outing.
3:06
Speaker 1: So there's actually two versions, And again, obviously I couldn't
3:09
Speaker 1: watch the game, but just like listening to how Dan
3:11
Speaker 1: Dickerson like described everything that was going on, there's like
3:14
Speaker 1: two versions of like the ramp up that that I've
3:17
Speaker 1: been curious about. Obviously, there's the physical piece of it,
3:21
Speaker 1: which which which you laid out there, and then there's
3:24
Speaker 1: the like mental slash like approach, slash like kind of
3:30
Speaker 1: gamesmanship ramping up that I was just curious about, like
3:33
Speaker 1: what it would look like from Verlander at this stage
3:37
Speaker 1: in his career. Like it's not like I had doubts
3:39
Speaker 1: that he would, you know, go out there and try
3:41
Speaker 1: to be justin Burlander, but given sort of like the
3:45
Speaker 1: camp narrative, which I think is we've gotten.
3:47
Speaker 2: To the point maybe you could tell me if I'm wrong, Cody,
3:50
Speaker 2: where it's so like.
3:50
Speaker 1: A little overplayed like this like this hunky dory justin Burlander,
3:54
Speaker 1: because I'm listening to the game on the radio and
3:56
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, he throws you know whatever, it
3:59
Speaker 1: is changed, and like Dan is like describing Verlander as
4:04
Speaker 1: like Visceral a little bit on the mound, knowing that
4:07
Speaker 1: he didn't hit his spot, knowing that that's not you know,
4:09
Speaker 1: the movement that he was looking for, and he didn't
4:12
Speaker 1: execute it to where he wanted to be. So he's
4:14
Speaker 1: so like the ramp up mentally, the ramped up justin
4:18
Speaker 1: Verlander gamer was something that I was just again wanting
4:23
Speaker 1: to see before the season started, and I think we
4:26
Speaker 1: got it there and.
4:28
Speaker 2: And also like you know, the.
4:29
Speaker 1: Age thing, age forty three, he knows exactly where he
4:34
Speaker 1: needs to be, and like, so I'm not doubting him.
4:37
Speaker 1: But again, it was nice to kind of see like
4:39
Speaker 1: bits and pieces of old Verlander vert you know, both
4:42
Speaker 1: like physically and then just kind of like how he is.
4:45
Speaker 1: And so so that was that was really reassuring for me.
4:48
Speaker 1: And and a question that I have had with a
4:52
Speaker 1: lot of guys and Verlander included, is like, Okay, so
4:55
Speaker 1: we're just a tad more than a week away from
4:59
Speaker 1: the regular season starting, and obviously he's not going to
5:03
Speaker 1: be pitching on an opening day, but you understand what
5:05
Speaker 1: I'm saying. And so the term, the word that's bouncing
5:08
Speaker 1: through my head with a lot of guys is ready.
5:11
Speaker 1: Now there's a relative term to that. It's on it's
5:13
Speaker 1: on a curve a little bit for a lot of
5:15
Speaker 1: these guys. But does but does Verlander seem ready? I
5:19
Speaker 1: guess would be the question that would be the most
5:21
Speaker 1: important question in my mind.
5:22
Speaker 2: Does he seem ready? You know?
5:25
Speaker 4: To this point, Well, he's a lot closer, you know,
5:28
Speaker 4: And I think this outing was a big step forward,
5:31
Speaker 4: a big, big step toward having the confidence say all right,
5:35
Speaker 4: he's he's almost ready. He's I would imagine, going to
5:38
Speaker 4: get one more outing. I guess I'm probably in one
5:40
Speaker 4: of those exhibition games against the Rockies, and I think
5:45
Speaker 4: the hope will be that he can, you know, go
5:47
Speaker 4: a little deeper into the game, build that pitch count
5:49
Speaker 4: a little more, maybe push that VLO a little bit higher.
5:53
Speaker 4: He's been through this so many times that there does
5:56
Speaker 4: have to be a certain innate trust in Verlander to
5:58
Speaker 4: see him take this step forward. I don't know if
6:01
Speaker 4: he's all the way ready, just because he hasn't pitched
6:03
Speaker 4: in games it's on this spring. I think every outing
6:05
Speaker 4: is going to count, so he probably needs this last
6:07
Speaker 4: one before we can.
6:08
Speaker 3: Say all right, he's ready.
6:10
Speaker 4: But he is certainly on track to being ready, and
6:13
Speaker 4: I feel a lot better about that again after watching
6:16
Speaker 4: him go out and turn up the volume a little
6:18
Speaker 4: bit this pastime.
6:22
Speaker 1: You know, we are also on conclusion watch here at
6:25
Speaker 1: this point of Tiger's camp, and you know, there's only
6:29
Speaker 1: a few conclusions that we're kind of waiting for, and
6:33
Speaker 1: number one on that list is Kevin McGonagall. And he's
6:37
Speaker 1: another one that you could we could spend a whole
6:40
Speaker 1: episode and we're probably gonna get some mileas out of
6:43
Speaker 1: it on this one. The kind of debating the notion
6:47
Speaker 1: as to whether Kevin McGonagall is quote unquote ready. And
6:54
Speaker 1: I feel good that we're doing this on a day
6:56
Speaker 1: that he went over three, because I don't want to
6:58
Speaker 1: be like kind of overreacting to like another you know,
7:01
Speaker 1: another bomb which obviously was uh, you know, which are
7:04
Speaker 1: impressive whenever he connects like that. But based on videos
7:09
Speaker 1: on X and what people are saying yet stolen base
7:13
Speaker 1: today he had what appeared to be quite an amazing
7:15
Speaker 1: play at third base today. I like his approach. I
7:20
Speaker 1: like that he's you know, getting walks. Obviously, when he connects,
7:23
Speaker 1: he connects. He's seen different types of pitching that he
7:25
Speaker 1: than he did early in spring training. I'm ready to
7:28
Speaker 1: declare Kevin McGonagall ready. I mean, I'm making the official
7:33
Speaker 1: prediction he's making the team, but I'm declaring him ready.
7:37
Speaker 1: Where do you land Cody on the ready scale for
7:41
Speaker 1: Kevin mcgonagal.
7:45
Speaker 4: I'll put it this way. I don't know what else
7:47
Speaker 4: he could possibly have done this camp to prove his readiness.
7:52
Speaker 4: He has shown you everything. Defensively, he's looked good, moves
7:57
Speaker 4: over to third base, makes a terrific play, struggles for
8:03
Speaker 4: a few days with off speed breakers, hits a lown
8:06
Speaker 4: En slider that was not really a hitter's pitch, takes
8:09
Speaker 4: it four hundred and thirty seven feet. He's made hard
8:13
Speaker 4: contact consistently. He's had a good at bad good played
8:16
Speaker 4: approach consistently. He's taken walks even when he's not getting
8:19
Speaker 4: great pitches to hit. I don't know if that means
8:23
Speaker 4: he's gonna be on the team, but clearly, as I've said,
8:25
Speaker 4: the Tigers are looking long and hard at this.
8:27
Speaker 3: He wouldn't be in this lineup every day. They wouldn't
8:30
Speaker 3: be building lineups around.
8:31
Speaker 4: Him every day if they weren't seriously seriously considering putting.
8:35
Speaker 3: Him on this team.
8:37
Speaker 4: And like, if you want my opinion, I do think
8:39
Speaker 4: if you're gonna take it down to the wire, you
8:40
Speaker 4: should probably just put him on the team because it
8:43
Speaker 4: would be easy to say, all right, we've loved you,
8:46
Speaker 4: you've had a great camp. We think it's in your
8:48
Speaker 4: best interest to go to TRIPAA for a little bit,
8:51
Speaker 4: So we're just gonna option you right now because we
8:54
Speaker 4: think that's best. Clearly, he has given them enough to
8:57
Speaker 4: think about that they want to see every little bit.
8:59
Speaker 4: If you're to take it this far, it's it's hard
9:02
Speaker 4: to say he's not ready. It's hard to say there's
9:05
Speaker 4: anything else you could possibly want to see.
9:09
Speaker 1: All right, so we can get to the point that
9:13
Speaker 1: is obviously in the remal possibility, and even in the
9:16
Speaker 1: history of this podcast, we've experienced top notch prospects get
9:20
Speaker 1: up and struggle offensively, you know, once they see daily
9:25
Speaker 1: major league pitching. So this is a question on X
9:30
Speaker 1: from at Hobby Baia's underscore Curry, So not not Hobby Bias,
9:36
Speaker 1: but Hobby Baya's underscore Curry.
9:39
Speaker 4: Hobby maybe Hobby maybe maybe everything.
9:44
Speaker 2: He's like wondering if his jobs in jeopardy.
9:48
Speaker 1: The question was, let's say he makes the team and
9:50
Speaker 1: then he starts him being McGonagall makes the team and
9:53
Speaker 1: starts the season one for twenty, what do you do.
9:55
Speaker 1: So my opinion on that is like, if you have
10:02
Speaker 1: a whole you have several seasons of data and first
10:06
Speaker 1: hand experience dealing with Kevin McGonagall. Now, obviously he's ever
10:10
Speaker 1: been a major league player before, and I understand that
10:13
Speaker 1: that is different. But if you bring him up to
10:17
Speaker 1: start the season and he does indeed start.
10:19
Speaker 2: One for twenty.
10:22
Speaker 1: Like then he started one for twenty and you're and
10:25
Speaker 1: then and it's just not like the storybook start to
10:28
Speaker 1: a prolific career. I'm riding this out as long as possible,
10:32
Speaker 1: and I don't foresee the need just to put him
10:36
Speaker 1: in Triple A, because, as we talked about with Parker Meadows,
10:39
Speaker 1: as we talk about with a lot of these guys,
10:41
Speaker 1: if you put them down to Triple A, after he
10:43
Speaker 1: sees major league pitching, he's probably gonna go twenty one
10:47
Speaker 1: for twenty two, and then then you're gonna then we're
10:50
Speaker 1: gonna get into this cycle. Right, So, so that would
10:53
Speaker 1: be my opinion that, like, if you feel comfortable enough
10:56
Speaker 1: to bring him up on the opening day roster, then
10:59
Speaker 1: I think I think you have to be comfortable with
11:01
Speaker 1: enough that he is going to be able to deal
11:03
Speaker 1: with dry spells. I don't necessarily foresee that being advantageous
11:09
Speaker 1: for him to have anything other than like the longest
11:14
Speaker 1: leash possible, because he's Kevin McGonagall and he's earned it.
11:17
Speaker 1: But that is something that has to be taken into consideration.
11:20
Speaker 1: You obviously don't want to call him up to calm
11:21
Speaker 1: him down. So what are your kind of thoughts on, Like,
11:24
Speaker 1: let's just say he gets off you know, as as
11:26
Speaker 1: as cold as a as a as an early Michigan
11:29
Speaker 1: winter or or early yeah, early Michigan winter.
11:32
Speaker 2: Yeah.
11:33
Speaker 4: In addition to how much the Tigers decide to value
11:36
Speaker 4: the prospect promotion incentsive, I think this is the one thing,
11:41
Speaker 4: the second thing that could possibly prevent McGonagall from making
11:46
Speaker 4: the team. It's that this is you can't undo the decision.
11:50
Speaker 4: It's easier to wait than it is try to undo
11:53
Speaker 4: it if things go poorly. And that's where it's tough,
11:55
Speaker 4: because no one can really predict what the first month
12:00
Speaker 4: of his career is going to be. Like, we can
12:02
Speaker 4: predict what type of player he is, what type of
12:04
Speaker 4: player he's going to become, what type of career he's.
12:06
Speaker 3: Going to have.
12:07
Speaker 4: No one knows what he's going to do the first series,
12:10
Speaker 4: or the first week or the first month. This is
12:13
Speaker 4: just too random, too volatile of a game. Willie Mays
12:17
Speaker 4: started oh for twelve and was crying in the dugout.
12:20
Speaker 4: Alex Bregman started one for thirty one. That's got mentioned
12:24
Speaker 4: in aj Hinch's tenure before when other prospects have come
12:28
Speaker 4: up and struggled. These things happen even to really good players.
12:31
Speaker 4: It's entire, entirely possible. It could happen to Kevin McGonagall.
12:35
Speaker 4: And that's just to say he's got You got to
12:39
Speaker 4: give him more than twenty at bats.
12:40
Speaker 3: But where would you draw the line?
12:42
Speaker 4: Is it? You know, I got to think it's at
12:44
Speaker 4: least one hundred at bats? But you know, is it less,
12:48
Speaker 4: is it more? How much of that is depending on
12:51
Speaker 4: how things look, how he's handling it. There are a
12:54
Speaker 4: million questions.
12:56
Speaker 3: It's got to be more than one for twenty.
12:57
Speaker 4: But it is interesting to think, what if he comes
13:00
Speaker 4: out and he's ten for one hundred?
13:02
Speaker 3: Do you send him down?
13:04
Speaker 4: And that's probably a bridge you can only cross once
13:08
Speaker 4: you get there, and you're certainly hoping you don't get there.
13:12
Speaker 4: But I do think the Tigers would like to avoid
13:14
Speaker 4: that because they don't want to start the clock, send
13:17
Speaker 4: him up and then see his confidence take a hit.
13:20
Speaker 3: Now, there's also the thought that maybe this kid is
13:23
Speaker 3: just so good that that's not gonna happen.
13:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, the way I would like answer that question is
13:32
Speaker 1: as long as the other stuff is not suffering. Now
13:36
Speaker 1: Obviously we know his career will be made by the bats.
13:40
Speaker 1: But as long as the other stuff is not suffering,
13:42
Speaker 1: as long as his defense is not suffering, as long
13:43
Speaker 1: as his attitude is not suffering, his confidence is not suffering,
13:47
Speaker 1: then I'm okay riding it out until I kind of
13:51
Speaker 1: get evidence that like it just like needs to happen.
13:54
Speaker 2: Now.
13:54
Speaker 1: Of course I've thought that before about other guys and
13:57
Speaker 1: probably been more wrong than right on it, but that's
14:00
Speaker 1: just how I feel about it. And I feel more
14:02
Speaker 1: strongly about McGonagall and his ability to contribute at the
14:06
Speaker 1: plate than even some of those other guys because there's
14:09
Speaker 1: just there's just too much evidence, there's too many smart,
14:12
Speaker 1: way way smart people than myself that that, you know,
14:16
Speaker 1: put him on this pedestal die. At a certain point,
14:18
Speaker 1: you just got to trust everything that's around you, and
14:21
Speaker 1: that's where I'm at with Kevin McGonagall. All Right, we
14:25
Speaker 1: are going to take a quick break and then afterward
14:29
Speaker 1: we're going to get to some other guys on the
14:31
Speaker 1: team and determine are they ready.
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15:40
Speaker 1: All right, coming back here, just want to make a
15:44
Speaker 1: quick another quick note on un Ken McGonagall to illustrate
15:48
Speaker 1: Cody your point about just how many opportunities they're giving
15:52
Speaker 1: him and how they're kind of constructing the lineups in
15:54
Speaker 1: a way that get him on the field. If you
15:57
Speaker 1: go to the Tigers like official spring training stats for
16:00
Speaker 1: this year, he's a leader in all like the percentage
16:04
Speaker 1: categories like average and on base and slugging because he's
16:07
Speaker 1: one of the few that actually has enough at bats
16:09
Speaker 1: to qualify h for all this stuff. Number two in
16:13
Speaker 1: batting average among qualified hitters would be Parker Meadows. So
16:16
Speaker 1: that gives you an idea too. It was like, you know,
16:18
Speaker 1: they're giving guys, they're giving guys like that that they
16:22
Speaker 1: want that need the at bats in order to you know,
16:25
Speaker 1: be to be as ready as possible. Those are the
16:28
Speaker 1: ones getting the at bats. So I just wanted to
16:30
Speaker 1: make note of that. And and also if you guys
16:32
Speaker 1: are subscribe to The Athletic, which obviously you should, Cody
16:36
Speaker 1: has a nice story about Kevin McGonagall and sort of
16:38
Speaker 1: the uh still learning the ins and outs of being
16:42
Speaker 1: a pro ballplayer just uh, just you know, just the
16:45
Speaker 1: stuff they don't teach you at in uh in school.
16:48
Speaker 1: I will I will say, so, uh, he's still green
16:51
Speaker 1: around the ears when it comes to off the field stuff,
16:53
Speaker 1: but he looks he looks pretty advanced on the field.
16:55
Speaker 2: So that is a good thing.
16:59
Speaker 1: Somebody that we've talked about, just like in theory, and
17:02
Speaker 1: then sort of had to reconcile with being an All
17:08
Speaker 1: Star last year and then really falling off the table
17:11
Speaker 1: a little bit offensively. And that's that's hobby, hobby or bias.
17:15
Speaker 1: Speaking of bias quietly, Cody though, having like a really
17:20
Speaker 1: productive spring, and you know, obviously everything's knock on wood,
17:25
Speaker 1: but like you know, he's been healthy. He had the
17:28
Speaker 1: I forget what it was that he had to miss
17:30
Speaker 1: the the exhibition in the Dominican Republic, but that was
17:32
Speaker 1: obviously short lived. And this is a player that, depending
17:38
Speaker 1: on how you construct this team, could get a lot
17:40
Speaker 1: of time at center. He's obviously going to get some
17:42
Speaker 1: time at short, could be at third, Hell, could be
17:45
Speaker 1: at second. If something, you know, weird happens, He's going
17:48
Speaker 1: to be on this team. But I don't know if
17:50
Speaker 1: anyone really knows or is at least comfortable predicting like
17:54
Speaker 1: what his like what his playing time will be.
17:58
Speaker 2: But I think it is worth noting.
18:00
Speaker 1: If you're looking for positive elements here, you want to
18:03
Speaker 1: go out and spring and produce. He has gone out
18:05
Speaker 1: and spring and produce, and if he really falters when
18:08
Speaker 1: the regular season starts, it might be the epitome of
18:11
Speaker 1: why you don't trust springs training stats. But right now
18:13
Speaker 1: he looks he've had like three hundred. I mean, you know,
18:15
Speaker 1: give him credit, give.
18:16
Speaker 4: Him credit, he's hitting two eighty. Hard to know what
18:21
Speaker 4: to make again of just spring training stats. But I think, hey,
18:25
Speaker 4: you'd rather see a productive Hobby bias than an unproductive
18:28
Speaker 4: Hobby bias.
18:29
Speaker 3: And I was thinking, you know, we know we talk
18:31
Speaker 3: all the time.
18:32
Speaker 4: Hobby thrives on emotion and he plays well in big
18:35
Speaker 4: games in front of big crowd. So how's he done
18:38
Speaker 4: lifetime in spring training? And it turns out the answer
18:42
Speaker 4: not great. He's had a couple of good springs twenty
18:44
Speaker 4: nineteen and twenty twenty, but two thirty lifetime hitter, six
18:48
Speaker 4: fifty six lifetime ops in spring So this year his
18:52
Speaker 4: ops is seven twenty. He is doing better than he
18:55
Speaker 4: normally does in spring training, even back when he was
18:59
Speaker 4: in his prime. I'm well, that translates to the regular season.
19:02
Speaker 4: This is Hobby bias. Man who knows? But yeah, I
19:06
Speaker 4: think it at least helps push back on maybe the
19:09
Speaker 4: notion that okay, Hobby turned it on for the end
19:12
Speaker 4: of the regular season and the postseason. But he might
19:15
Speaker 4: just go back to being one of the worst qualifying
19:17
Speaker 4: hitters in baseball. If you want some hope that that
19:20
Speaker 4: won't be the case, looks no further than the facts.
19:23
Speaker 4: It's had a pretty nice spring.
19:27
Speaker 2: So he's ready. I think I think Hobby is ready
19:30
Speaker 2: to be Hobby, like.
19:31
Speaker 3: Hobby's always ready.
19:32
Speaker 4: I think Hobby would find skipping spring training and just
19:35
Speaker 4: playing on the big stage and he'd be all right.
19:39
Speaker 2: I'll tell you who else is ready.
19:40
Speaker 1: Jami Jones is ready, fresh off, fresh off playing in
19:44
Speaker 1: the World Baseball Classic, and and kind of you know,
19:47
Speaker 1: people like us talking about like what his roster spot could.
19:52
Speaker 2: Be, how safe visit you know, all the speculation.
19:55
Speaker 1: He's like, what you think, I'm just some sort of
19:57
Speaker 1: like basher of left handed pitching. Let me let me
20:00
Speaker 1: laid out a bunch against I guess the writy and
20:04
Speaker 1: and and show you that I got more to my game.
20:06
Speaker 1: So Jami Jones is ready? And and what about what
20:10
Speaker 1: about Parker Meadows? So there's a there's a weird there's
20:13
Speaker 1: I have. I'm gonna ask people to kind of like
20:16
Speaker 1: stay with me for a second when we talk about
20:18
Speaker 1: Parker Meadows because we've done the whole Wenzel Perez versus
20:23
Speaker 1: Parker Meadows thing. And I don't know if it's that simple,
20:26
Speaker 1: but that's just kind of how like I that's the
20:29
Speaker 1: lens of which I've viewed it. And you know, Cody,
20:33
Speaker 1: obviously I read your reporting, and I read Evan wood
20:36
Speaker 1: Berry's Evan Petzel, Chris Pokowski, Jeff, like you know, Roger,
20:41
Speaker 1: like all these guys, I consume all the content, all right,
20:44
Speaker 1: and it and it doesn't seem to me. And even
20:47
Speaker 1: just like listening to the stuff that Dan Dickerson says
20:50
Speaker 1: on the radio broadcast, because you know a lot of
20:51
Speaker 1: times he lays little nuggets in.
20:53
Speaker 2: There because he knows stuff.
20:56
Speaker 1: I'm just not getting, like any smoke to let me
21:01
Speaker 1: assume that there's like a fire in the fire being
21:04
Speaker 1: Parker Meadows Roster case.
21:07
Speaker 2: Does that make.
21:07
Speaker 1: Sense where it's like I feel like we're at this
21:09
Speaker 1: point Camp and it's not like he's torn it up.
21:12
Speaker 1: You know, if you look at the numbers were at
21:14
Speaker 1: this point he Camp, Jason Beck. I want to mention
21:15
Speaker 1: Jason back too. Among the writers. I won't forget anybody,
21:18
Speaker 1: you know, like it doesn't feel like people are putting
21:23
Speaker 1: pressure even just with public discourse on Parker Meadows, And
21:29
Speaker 1: to me that is either two things. One we're just
21:33
Speaker 1: all not doing a good enough job of saying there's
21:35
Speaker 1: a lot of pressure on Parker Meadows, or two, he's
21:39
Speaker 1: the seats a lot cooler than maybe some people would
21:44
Speaker 1: think and thus and that's why it hasn't been getting
21:48
Speaker 1: that much attention. So I don't know where you kind
21:50
Speaker 1: of align on this, but to me, I feel like
21:53
Speaker 1: if there was like Real Jeopardy on March seventeenth, that
21:57
Speaker 1: on March twenty six he wasn't gonna be in San Diego,
22:00
Speaker 1: I feel like we would be like leading podcasts with
22:03
Speaker 1: this a little bit more so that I don't know,
22:05
Speaker 1: what do you think?
22:06
Speaker 4: Well, I don't think the seat is cool, and I
22:08
Speaker 4: don't think there's no pressure. I think part of it
22:11
Speaker 4: is just a little bit of uncertainty. No one knows
22:13
Speaker 4: for sure. We don't know for sure if McGonagall is
22:17
Speaker 4: going to make the team, if it does come down
22:20
Speaker 4: to let's say, Parker Meadows versus WINSL Perez, we don't
22:24
Speaker 4: know what criteria the Tigers are really going to judge
22:27
Speaker 4: that one. But I think This conversation has cooled some
22:31
Speaker 4: even in recent days, for a pretty simple reason. Parker
22:34
Speaker 4: Meadows started to look a little more comfortable at the plate.
22:36
Speaker 4: He had hits in three straight games. He didn't have
22:39
Speaker 4: a hit Tuesday, but he had a couple at bats
22:42
Speaker 4: that just he's looked a lot more comfortable. Monday, he
22:47
Speaker 4: was two for three, he drew two walks. Like if
22:50
Speaker 4: you wanted to see something, if you wanted to see
22:52
Speaker 4: a little push at the end of camp to make
22:54
Speaker 4: this team, I think you've seen that from Parker Meadows.
22:57
Speaker 4: You haven't seen that quite so much from wins Paris.
23:02
Speaker 4: It's not as simple as like, oh, Parker had two
23:04
Speaker 4: good games at the end of spring, now he's back.
23:06
Speaker 3: On the team. But I think it helps his case.
23:10
Speaker 4: I think you wanted to see this guy show some
23:12
Speaker 4: positive signs, and if you're in a tight competition, maybe
23:16
Speaker 4: that's enough to tip the scale. I think we've started
23:18
Speaker 4: to see that a little bit from Parker. It seems
23:22
Speaker 4: like maybe that's allowed him to exhale. I think that's
23:24
Speaker 4: allowed everyone else to kind of exhale. I put Parker
23:28
Speaker 4: over Winsol on my roster projection. I don't know that
23:30
Speaker 4: I had a crazy high degree of confidence we've talked
23:33
Speaker 4: about on this pod. I just thought I think his
23:35
Speaker 4: defense would win out in that discussion, and even just
23:39
Speaker 4: a couple of days removed from that, seeing Parker strike
23:42
Speaker 4: the ball a little better, look a little more competitive
23:46
Speaker 4: at the plate, I just think that all puts the
23:50
Speaker 4: scales in his favor. I think he does too many things. Well,
23:53
Speaker 4: all you're asking is for these little glimmers of hope.
23:57
Speaker 4: Now he's still gonna have to do it in the
23:58
Speaker 4: regular season if he gets.
23:59
Speaker 3: Up to a slow start.
24:01
Speaker 4: I'm not sure that the ramp is going to be
24:03
Speaker 4: super long. But go on Parker for making some adjustments.
24:08
Speaker 4: Looking a little better here in crunch time.
24:13
Speaker 1: Well we know that defensively, and the legs are always
24:17
Speaker 1: they're ready, They're ready for a regular season. They are impactful.
24:20
Speaker 3: So young on the basis two days ago.
24:24
Speaker 2: That was that was hilarious.
24:27
Speaker 1: And I guess, in a little bit fairness to jas
24:29
Speaker 1: like Parker had a better you know, easier to read
24:32
Speaker 1: to make so he could get a little bit of
24:33
Speaker 1: a lead, But he definitely could have laped him.
24:36
Speaker 2: If he wanted to.
24:37
Speaker 1: I think that is hard, that is fair to say,
24:42
Speaker 1: all right, let's get to you know, and you know,
24:45
Speaker 1: unfortunate news here, Cody, and that's Bo Brisky. It was
24:48
Speaker 1: kind of teased that after he did not pitch on
24:50
Speaker 1: Monday that something might be wrong with him, and was
24:54
Speaker 1: announced on Tuesday that he has a left growing strain
24:59
Speaker 1: and and man, you just feel for the guy, because
25:03
Speaker 1: I mean, I think we I think you and I
25:05
Speaker 1: are aligned about if you just love what sort of
25:09
Speaker 1: like peak or close to peak Bowbriskie can be as
25:12
Speaker 1: a weapon in your bullpen. And now we're going on,
25:16
Speaker 1: you know, we're going on a year of just like
25:19
Speaker 1: not being able to see that version of him, and
25:22
Speaker 1: he won't be ready for the opener. Obviously it's too
25:24
Speaker 1: soon to tell anything else, but really unfortunate because again
25:28
Speaker 1: I think this guy's an asked for the organization if
25:31
Speaker 1: he can be healthy.
25:33
Speaker 4: Yeah, certainly a tough break, a tough spring really for Bo.
25:36
Speaker 4: Coming off the flexor injury that costs him most of
25:39
Speaker 4: last season.
25:40
Speaker 3: He seemed to feel healthy, feel.
25:42
Speaker 4: Confident in camp, but then it's just been a broken
25:45
Speaker 4: camp with some weird little things.
25:47
Speaker 3: Back spasms.
25:48
Speaker 4: You know, he has to kind of build up again,
25:50
Speaker 4: and then he has a really nice outing he hits
25:52
Speaker 4: ninety six, he's starting to look a little more like
25:54
Speaker 4: the guy we know. You know, Brendan Hannafee hasn't been great.
25:58
Speaker 4: You start to wonder, okay, maybe he could make this
26:02
Speaker 4: team after all. And then it sounds like he's doing
26:05
Speaker 4: a routine drill. He's working on his delivery, and he
26:09
Speaker 4: slips and he strains a left adductor in his groin.
26:14
Speaker 4: He's not going to be ready for opening Day. I've
26:16
Speaker 4: assume he starts the year on the IL. I guess
26:19
Speaker 4: good news, it's a groin. The way aj first made
26:22
Speaker 4: it sound sounded kind of ominous, but it's not an
26:26
Speaker 4: arm injury. But you do have to wonder if this
26:29
Speaker 4: guy's had, you know, just kind of some freak occurrences
26:32
Speaker 4: even before the flexer injury last year, it was an ankle,
26:36
Speaker 4: and he has theorized maybe the ankle injury made him
26:39
Speaker 4: tweak his mechanics which led to him hurting his arm.
26:43
Speaker 4: It's really important that he get right, he get his
26:46
Speaker 4: whole body together, and you certainly hope that he avoids
26:50
Speaker 4: anything else like this. If it's you know, a month
26:54
Speaker 4: and he can get back and go through a proper
26:56
Speaker 4: ramp up in Toledo.
26:57
Speaker 3: Maybe this guy is.
27:00
Speaker 4: Back in the fold for contributing by early summer, but
27:03
Speaker 4: certainly a setback and certainly kind of reopens a lot
27:07
Speaker 4: of questions in this bullpen. Like I said, if you're
27:10
Speaker 4: looking for one more right hander to make it, it's
27:12
Speaker 4: not gonna be brisky. Is it Hanna Fee? Could it
27:15
Speaker 4: be someone else? We'll talk about it in a little bit.
27:18
Speaker 4: Bert Smith has had a really nice camp. There's some
27:20
Speaker 4: other guys, Ricky Vanasko, The Tigers keep throwing them out there.
27:24
Speaker 4: There are some other candidates who are not out of
27:26
Speaker 4: this fold yet. And unfortunately Bo's injury kind of makes
27:31
Speaker 4: that an even more open discussion.
27:36
Speaker 1: You know, we we haven't done a lot of flarity talk.
27:40
Speaker 1: And he pitched on on on Monday, and you know,
27:43
Speaker 1: you just look at the line. It's obviously nothing real impressive.
27:47
Speaker 1: He went five innings, five hits, a lot of fives
27:49
Speaker 1: in there, five earned runs, He had three strikeouts in
27:52
Speaker 1: a walk. Is Jack Flaherty ready, Cody? Yeah?
27:59
Speaker 3: I mean I I think so. I think Jack and
28:01
Speaker 3: another more veteran guy. At this point.
28:04
Speaker 4: He doesn't treat spring training completely like he treats a
28:08
Speaker 4: regular season game. He was throwing a lot of change
28:10
Speaker 4: ups his last time out. I believe he used the
28:12
Speaker 4: change up like three percent of the time last year.
28:15
Speaker 4: I said, are you interested in using it more? He
28:17
Speaker 4: kind of said something to the effect of like, well,
28:20
Speaker 4: I don't know, it's a pitch in my arsenal. I
28:22
Speaker 4: have to throw it at some point. This is a
28:24
Speaker 4: good time to throw it. So he was coming out,
28:26
Speaker 4: he was wearing on some stuff. You'd always like to
28:28
Speaker 4: see Jack's VLO take a little bit higher, but it's
28:31
Speaker 4: also not totally uncharacteristic for him to just not have
28:35
Speaker 4: his best velocity, and he has good enough command, good
28:37
Speaker 4: enough slider secondary stuff. He can get by decently even
28:43
Speaker 4: if he is even though we know kind of that
28:44
Speaker 4: ninety three ninety three and a half is a little
28:47
Speaker 4: bit of a magic number for him, he can still
28:49
Speaker 4: find ways to get by even when.
28:50
Speaker 3: He doesn't have that. Yeah, I mean, I think I
28:55
Speaker 3: think Jack has.
28:56
Speaker 4: A proven enough commodity that I have no concern about
28:58
Speaker 4: him right now going into the regular season.
29:03
Speaker 1: All right, let's uh, let's wrap up with this here, Cody.
29:07
Speaker 1: You mentioned Burt Burt Smith, and I believe that's the
29:10
Speaker 1: first time we probably mentioned him on on this on
29:13
Speaker 1: this podcast.
29:14
Speaker 4: And I think one time said I said, we haven't
29:17
Speaker 4: talked about Burt Smith very much. That he's having a
29:19
Speaker 4: nice camp, and that's all we said. We stated the
29:21
Speaker 4: fact that we had not talked about him. It might
29:23
Speaker 4: be time to start talking about Smith.
29:26
Speaker 3: He could make this team.
29:28
Speaker 1: Well, tell me about him, tell me about him, like
29:30
Speaker 1: I like, you know he yeah, So I was just
29:32
Speaker 1: looking at the transaction log, you know, little early Christmas present.
29:35
Speaker 1: He is December twenty third, he signs a minor league
29:39
Speaker 1: contract with the Tigers. And you know, there, this is
29:42
Speaker 1: what they like to do. They like to sign guys
29:44
Speaker 1: to minor league contracts, and they like to uh, you know,
29:48
Speaker 1: put them in in their machine and and spit out,
29:51
Speaker 1: you know, an effective and an effective reliever. And and
29:55
Speaker 1: so like what what do we need to know about
29:58
Speaker 1: about Burt Smith? That like, like, yo, because if he
30:00
Speaker 1: does make this team, people are gonna be like, oh,
30:02
Speaker 1: first bit, you know, so what do they need to know?
30:04
Speaker 3: I know, Well, he's been around the block. Number one,
30:07
Speaker 3: he's thirty five.
30:08
Speaker 4: He made his major league debut in twenty thirteen, pitched
30:12
Speaker 4: thirty six innings. Didn't pitch in the big leagues again
30:15
Speaker 4: until twenty eighteen, bounced around Royals, Brewers, Giants as never
30:22
Speaker 4: really had sustained success, went to Japan, went to Korea,
30:25
Speaker 4: came back, Marlins Orioles time in the minor leagues. One
30:30
Speaker 4: of these guys who's had just enough intriguing stuff that
30:34
Speaker 4: he keeps getting opportunities. And here he comes minor league
30:38
Speaker 4: deal with the Tigers. It's easy to see what they liked.
30:41
Speaker 4: He has a fastball, some pretty good carry, He has
30:43
Speaker 4: a diverse arsenal, has a pretty good cutter so he can.
30:47
Speaker 3: Spin it a little bits. Still hard to get too
30:50
Speaker 3: fired up about him.
30:51
Speaker 4: I mean, he has a five to seven to nine
30:53
Speaker 4: career er in the major leagues, all these different stops.
30:56
Speaker 4: He's just never put it all together. But here in
31:00
Speaker 4: Camp two five seven ERA, nine strikeouts and seven innings,
31:05
Speaker 4: the fastball has looked good, the secondary stuff has looked good.
31:10
Speaker 4: I think it helps that Brendan Hanafy, like I talked about,
31:14
Speaker 4: I still think there can be room for a guy
31:15
Speaker 4: who's right handed sinker ball specialist.
31:19
Speaker 3: But the flip side of that argument, how many lineups are.
31:21
Speaker 4: There really where you can insert handa fee think you're
31:25
Speaker 4: gonna see three right handed hitters in a row and
31:27
Speaker 4: no left he's coming off the bench. If the Tigers
31:31
Speaker 4: want to just have a guy with a more diverse
31:33
Speaker 4: arsenal to attack righty's to attack lefties, maybe give you
31:36
Speaker 4: a little bit of link. Bersmiths could certainly be that
31:39
Speaker 4: guy again. Venasco's in that discussion. We'll see what they
31:43
Speaker 4: do with in Manueldajesus also note Sean Gunther, dude's thrown
31:47
Speaker 4: up nothing but zero's this spring. He is not allowed
31:50
Speaker 4: and earned run. I think the stuff has kind of
31:52
Speaker 4: been typical Gunther, which we've seen in small doses, has
31:56
Speaker 4: been pretty good for the Tigers. So on s Ballpitton
31:59
Speaker 4: decision and is going down to the wire. There are
32:02
Speaker 4: some guys who are still in this conversation, and I
32:05
Speaker 4: think Burch Smith's name jolted at the top of that list.
32:08
Speaker 4: Aj Hinch seem pretty effusive in his review of Birch
32:13
Speaker 4: and said, yeah, he's very much still in this conversation.
32:18
Speaker 4: I think he has done enough this spring where maybe
32:20
Speaker 4: he could push himself over Brendan Hannafee and get a shot.
32:23
Speaker 4: It's more of a matter of what the Tigers value,
32:26
Speaker 4: how they want to construct their bullpen.
32:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, some of these back end decisions are the epitome
32:34
Speaker 1: of the phrase that I'm just gonna kind of make
32:37
Speaker 1: the theme of these last couple of weeks of camp.
32:39
Speaker 1: Opening day is a false deadline because we just know
32:42
Speaker 1: that these you know, everybody with options is going to
32:45
Speaker 1: be exercise in some way.
32:48
Speaker 2: It's just how the Tigers like to see.
32:51
Speaker 4: Most of those names that I just mentioned profession, so
32:54
Speaker 4: it might not even matter a whole lot what.
32:57
Speaker 1: Order, Yeah, exactly, and then we'll the you know, just
33:00
Speaker 1: kind of shake them all up, and then we'll see
33:02
Speaker 1: like who's like left standing in September and you know,
33:06
Speaker 1: obviously ideally October.
33:09
Speaker 2: Uh, all right, that was fun.
33:11
Speaker 1: Anything else, Cody before we jet out of here?
33:14
Speaker 3: No, I think that covers it.
33:15
Speaker 4: We are down to the nitty gritty the last few
33:18
Speaker 4: days here in Lakeland. We got the spring breakout game
33:21
Speaker 4: coming on Friday.
33:23
Speaker 3: We'll see it.
33:24
Speaker 4: Sounds like some of the guys who are still in
33:25
Speaker 4: Major League camp might not even play in that game,
33:28
Speaker 4: and Bryce Rayner won't be playing in that game, so
33:30
Speaker 4: it might be kind of a boring Spring Breakout from
33:32
Speaker 4: the Tiger's side. We'll see if the Pirates bring Connor
33:35
Speaker 4: Griffin to add to the excitement.
33:38
Speaker 1: All right, yeah, we shall see, and then we'll get
33:40
Speaker 1: to we'll do an episode here pretty soon where we
33:43
Speaker 1: try to like sort of encapsulate everything that you know
33:48
Speaker 1: has gone well, some of the guys that made good
33:50
Speaker 1: names for themselves that you know potentially you want to
33:53
Speaker 1: like have in the back of your mind here either
33:55
Speaker 1: not necessarily this season, but you know here moving forward, because.
33:58
Speaker 2: It has been a pretty deep camp.
34:00
Speaker 1: I would say this year for the Tigers in terms
34:01
Speaker 1: of guys as showing like, oh, you know, there might
34:03
Speaker 1: be something here, so we want to make sure we
34:05
Speaker 1: give them their due due diligence as well.
34:09
Speaker 2: So you can follow us on X for me no
34:10
Speaker 2: on Twitter at Cody Stavenhagen.
34:12
Speaker 1: I am at Kieran Underscore Stecty pod page at Tiger Territory,
34:15
Speaker 1: Underscore Tiger Territory shop dot com for your Tiger Territory
34:20
Speaker 1: merch needs, YouTube, Apple, Spotify, you guys know.
34:23
Speaker 3: What to do.
34:24
Speaker 2: We appreciate all of you. So for Cody Stavenhagen, I'm
34:26
Speaker 2: Kiri Stckley. There we have