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Justice Withheld: Fornethy Residential School Survivors Speak Out | UK Column Interviews · UK Column Radio

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Hello everyone, this is Diadress Missing with UK Colin. I'm
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: here with some of the survivors of the for netthew
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: residential school case which we've been covering for quite some time,
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: and the update from the past few days, unfortunately, has
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: been that Patricia Robertson, who as we know, was found
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: guilty of eighteen charges of what was called cruel and
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: unnatural treatment of girls when they were attending for Nettie.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: That was then appealed and the Crown has withdrawn the appeal.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: We don't know why yet. We just know that some
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: solicitors looked at the case and decided that it wasn't
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: going to go ahead with the appeal. Again, we don't
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: know why. So I'm just having a conversation today here
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: with some of the survivors that we've been working with
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: over the last couple of years, just to get their
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: thoughts about what happened. And of course it's completely shocking
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: and disgusting. So now that I've got you here, ladies,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: thanks for joining us again here in UK column. I'm
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: really happy to be at least getting your thoughts because
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I think it's so important.
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: To hear from you and your voices.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: The ones who have been affected by this about how
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: you feel about what's happened. So I'm just going to
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: go around and just get some initial thoughts from each
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: of you first. If that's okay, going around my screen,
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: I will start in the corner first with Kelly Fox.
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: Hi, Kelly, Hi.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: So, yeah, we.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: Haven't had a chance to catch up you and I
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: haven't since this came out. So if you just like
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: to maybe tell us your reaction to the withdrawal of.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: The appeal, Well, first of all, disbelief.
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: I think the lack of communication from anybody is absolutely deplorable.
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: I spoke to the PF and she said that the
• 1:51
  Speaker 4: three judges that were going to look at it had
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: looked at it. Somebody in front of them had looked
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: at it and decided that it wouldn't that far because
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: they would find the same as the judge found. I
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: did ask for a that apparently the judge had written
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: a big appeal, a big sorry, a big statement about
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: why he had given a that sentence, and so I'd
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: asked if I could see it, because that's what we
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: use to decide whether the peel goes ahead, and I
• 2:21
  Speaker 4: was told it won't be in the freedom of information
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: because it's a court document, so it's confidential. So it's
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: a stone wall. So I don't really know where we
• 2:32
  Speaker 4: go from here. But I don't know about anybody else.
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: But I'm not finished.
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: I'm not leaving it at this at the end of
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: the day. We've been writing this five or six years.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: If they think we're just going away, well it's not
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: going to happen. Yep, that's good to hear it.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Do you know anything about whether or that we can
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: access the transcripts from the trial, because that's something I'm
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: interested in getting if I can, Well, I.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: Would imagine that would also be confidential.
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: But the asking but I did ask the PF I
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: spoke to on a phone call, but.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: She never brought upon the back.
• 3:03
  Speaker 4: She just sent me a text telling me that what
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: I thought was I'm pretty sure the way to treat people,
• 3:10
  Speaker 4: you know, it taking five months at a day. But
• 3:13
  Speaker 4: she decided just to text, and I was that disgusted,
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: kind of leaving both to take her back.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I noticed on the days that I attended court,
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: and including the days of some of the testimonies, was
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: that I wasn't even allowed to take notes. They wouldn't
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: even let me have a notebook out. I couldn't do
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: any recording. I couldn't even you know that that's part
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: of the control and part of the fear of the
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: you know, getting the word.
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: Out about what's actually going on.
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: Was I remember just reaching into my bag and the
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: police coming over and saying, oh, you can't do that.
• 3:47
  Speaker 4: So again we're just seeing there was other pres there
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: taking notes. Yeah, I don't know if you had to
• 3:54
  Speaker 4: maybe put in your price pass.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: Well, the day that I was there, I don't know
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: if he who he thought I was, or or what
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: was happening, but that was the one day I was.
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: I was there.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: He wouldn't even let me open my bag. But no,
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: he just said he didn't. He didn't tell me why.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: He just said, you can't do that. I think I
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: was getting some hand motioned or something, and he wouldn't
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: even let me yet because as you know, they weren't
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: even letting people have bottles of water. But I was
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: there for just the one day of the the sentencing, as.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: Well as the one day of the test. But I
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: just found.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: The the the atmosphere of just the fear and the control,
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: and it was all the shaping howl thing was experienced,
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: making you feel like, you know, trying to make people afraid.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: I think, yep, yeah, it's all part of the control. Yeah.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: So let's see who's on my screen next. Let's go
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: to Lynn Sharon. Hi, Lynn, Yeah, how I would ask
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: how you're doing that? I can see you on your
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: face understandable. Do you want to share your.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: Thoughts and about the withdrawal of the peel?
• 5:08
  Speaker 5: First of all, like most other woman who we're involved in,
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: for Messie, I just think it's a severe.
• 5:20
  Speaker 6: To them, for the.
• 5:22
  Speaker 5: Eating guilties, for the girls that owned up as witnesses.
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: Just can't imagine how they must be feeling. And I
• 5:32
  Speaker 5: feel so angry and that the whole time that we've
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: fought for this, to get her on that dock, and
• 5:39
  Speaker 5: then she walks away, we're nothing, were a slap in
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: the ris and then we get built up thinking okay, right, yeah,
• 5:48
  Speaker 5: appeal again, we'll get her back in the dock again,
• 5:52
  Speaker 5: and we'll get a proper sentence. Been plenty, plenty of
• 5:56
  Speaker 5: evidence to apply for that appeal in the first place.
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: So I don't see how and under what jurisdiction that
• 6:06
  Speaker 5: they can pull that appeal. Why I mean, what's the
• 6:11
  Speaker 5: reason for it, Because we haven't been told nothing. So
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: they're telling us left in the newspaper, they're reporting on
• 6:18
  Speaker 5: the paper, they're reporting on the SCV, nows, they're reporting
• 6:21
  Speaker 5: and ave other newspaper media that we have all been told.
• 6:25
  Speaker 7: Why we know nothing? Do you know what I mean?
• 6:29
  Speaker 5: The same as I mean we don't know what we're
• 6:31
  Speaker 5: going to get for Christmas this year.
• 6:32
  Speaker 7: It's the exact same. We know why that appeal was
• 6:36
  Speaker 7: spout it.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: Yep, we want to know m hm.
• 6:39
  Speaker 7: Because it's not done a thing.
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: You'll get a right to know, absolutely, one hundred percent
• 6:44
  Speaker 5: two percent. It's the whole thing is just one big
• 6:46
  Speaker 5: cover up, but we've got to uncover up mm hmm.
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: And and the other thing i've heard through Sharon Cruden,
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: who is another lady of course i've been working with
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: who's not here on the call, that nobody has received
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: the ridiculous thousand pounds that you're supposed to get a compensation,
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: That nobody's even heard anything about it, which again, you know,
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: what does it mean in terms of the sentencing if
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: she's not even being required to pay. And I think
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: they gave her a limited amount of time to pay
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: it didn't she didn't.
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: It was like, well, yeah, must be needle to buy. Now.
• 7:24
  Speaker 5: What we saw was she's either no paid that, refusing
• 7:27
  Speaker 5: to pay it, or she's asked for more time, which
• 7:30
  Speaker 5: means she can pay installments and she can pay like
• 7:34
  Speaker 5: only a fraction after benefits every week or every month
• 7:37
  Speaker 5: whenever she gets them. So she could basically say to
• 7:39
  Speaker 5: it in, oh, I can only get you one hundred
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: and eighty pounds a month, ten pounds a.
• 7:44
  Speaker 7: Month per person.
• 7:45
  Speaker 8: Sorry for button in, but that was too cold for savings. Sorry,
• 7:49
  Speaker 8: but that should at the quote. That's what her savings were. Yeah,
• 7:53
  Speaker 8: so they were coming out at that one. He was
• 7:55
  Speaker 8: coming out as savings. It wasn'ty coming to our benefit.
• 7:58
  Speaker 8: I'm supposed to be coming to her evens she had
• 8:01
  Speaker 8: three months to pay it, and it's still I might
• 8:03
  Speaker 8: get Somebody had says to me, I don't know who
• 8:04
  Speaker 8: it was, that it might have been kind of put
• 8:07
  Speaker 8: back a bit because obviously there was appeal in it.
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: Everything was suspended because of the appeal.
• 8:13
  Speaker 8: Yeah, including see if she was should that go against
• 8:20
  Speaker 8: all the pensions and stuff like that, But what conductions
• 8:23
  Speaker 8: against children abusing wens? You know what I mean, yeah,
• 8:27
  Speaker 8: you'll still get over the next title. To us, it's
• 8:31
  Speaker 8: just as if it's just slap slap. Oh there's another one,
• 8:33
  Speaker 8: but the door.
• 8:37
  Speaker 5: She doesn't get a pension anyway, I should have spent
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: one day in jail. She have used child children mm hm,
• 8:44
  Speaker 5: no titles a pension for that.
• 8:47
  Speaker 8: You know that that day of the court, we were
• 8:48
  Speaker 8: all happy over that that she get eighteen and stuff
• 8:51
  Speaker 8: like that, and then after that it was just everyone
• 8:53
  Speaker 8: is all deflated.
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: You know. It's just it's horrible feeling. It's as sad.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: But can I tell you something.
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: I was clearing the planner on the sky thing the
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: other night and came across one of the news articles
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: and I sent it to a mean Jenny and it
• 9:12
  Speaker 4: was when they were leaving the court and that man
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: was with her. I don't know if that's her husband
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: or her brother, because it depends who I'm speaking to.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: Some people I said it's her husband. Some people I said, I.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: Thought I thought it was a brother. That's what I
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: was told.
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: But if you if you watch it, he's he's making
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: all sorts of gestures with his tongue and actually figgering right.
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: And I must have watched about five times and I
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: was sitting here on tears and I sent it to
• 9:38
  Speaker 4: my husband. He was in bed, and he was like,
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: why are you watching this stuff? It's just upset and
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: I was like, but this.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: When I sent it to.
• 9:44
  Speaker 4: Carol, my cousin, she said to me, that was him
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: that leaned right into her face.
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: I said, good morning into Carol.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: You see if I don't know all about that, mm hmm.
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: I put that man in the backside m hmm.
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: So he's there, perfectly able to intimidate us our time,
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: intimidate us, I said about it. But before we get
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: into the court, we got a big run down what
• 10:06
  Speaker 4: we're allowed to say, allowed to dress, how we're allowed
• 10:09
  Speaker 4: to conduct ourselves, where we're allowed to look, who we're
• 10:12
  Speaker 4: allowed to speak to, We're not allowed to speak to
• 10:14
  Speaker 4: each other. And this man is here quite openly intimidating people.
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: And I was like, you know that last.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: Thing on the news. I never seen it.
• 10:27
  Speaker 4: But it was the day the appeal decision commit that
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: it was going to appeal, or was it the day
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: that they said it's not going to appeal?
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: And I said, I've not seen.
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: This and he was like, well, it's been there and
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: I was like, oh, I've missed it obviously, but when
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: I watched them and I thought.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: It actually made me feel physically sick.
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: And I thought, well, looks like.
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'll send you it's disgusting.
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: It's actually disgusting, and I thought, how he's conducted his
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: self in that manner, it just shows a complete contempt
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: for everyone of us and for the court and for
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: the fact that they don't give a damn.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: That's what.
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: The court mm hm.
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: When I think all he was asking questions and and
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: I just was like, you know what, and she's kind of.
• 11:18
  Speaker 6: Like, shut up, you know, mm hmm.
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: But disgusting, absolutely disgusting. But I just think it's it's
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: a Tello that we are silenced again.
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: That's what it's like. And it just yeah, again, it
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: is totally wrong, totally.
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: It's disgusting, is what it is. Writing.
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: It's so destroying.
• 11:43
  Speaker 8: I spoke to the k and after all this time,
• 11:45
  Speaker 8: you wish you would never even have started.
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: I don't feel I feel these people need to be
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: held accountable.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: But tell me this, what does that tell victims that
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: haven't came forward.
• 11:59
  Speaker 8: Don't bother Botherer, she has your life into this yes,
• 12:05
  Speaker 8: another going forward if they think there's money, but I'm
• 12:08
  Speaker 8: no willing a storing.
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: But the thing is this was neither a bit of money.
• 12:12
  Speaker 8: Well, if I was even a thousand pounds, see if
• 12:16
  Speaker 8: I would see if I and as god honest truth,
• 12:19
  Speaker 8: see if I was one of the ones to get
• 12:20
  Speaker 8: a thousand pounds, my thousand pounds would have been gone
• 12:24
  Speaker 8: straight to a charity of some sort, some sexual abuse charity.
• 12:27
  Speaker 8: Because I would not accept a penny. No, I wouldn't
• 12:30
  Speaker 8: expect I would accept a penny. They would have been
• 12:35
  Speaker 8: better to founder and give them money to woman's head
• 12:36
  Speaker 8: or something. But if there's any woman and that might
• 12:43
  Speaker 8: be relying on that money.
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: Well that's that. So could be a different you know.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: What I mean? But I just felt that.
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: I mean I phoned the PF and I said, look,
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: I want to know what the breakdown of these charges are.
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: We should have been given that as a matter of courtesy.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: So she gave me the breakdn. There was six.
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: Charges against me alone and they were all find guilty
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: and every one of them mm hmm. See for the
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: girls that get are not guilt or are not proven.
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: I was like, I actually can believe this, and I
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: felt I couldn't feel elated for the eighteen guilties because
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: of the six or seven not provence.
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: Who must say girls they feeling you know what I mean.
• 13:23
  Speaker 8: I don't think I either any disrespect to anybody that
• 13:26
  Speaker 8: was there. I'm no meaning that, but there was other
• 13:29
  Speaker 8: people way, maybe stronger stories mm hm would maybe like
• 13:35
  Speaker 8: I don't mean me. But there's a few things that
• 13:37
  Speaker 8: I can see eye, you know, because I should be
• 13:39
  Speaker 8: in somebody's wedding picture. Yes, and Leslie Scott actually got
• 13:44
  Speaker 8: the marriage certificate because he was in August, so that stuff,
• 13:48
  Speaker 8: So that is proof that.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: I was there.
• 13:51
  Speaker 6: H Do you know what I mean?
• 13:52
  Speaker 8: You know, when she get married, And I'm not saying
• 13:54
  Speaker 8: I should have been, but I can remember. It's like Jane,
• 13:58
  Speaker 8: Jane can't remember of I can't, but of course I can.
• 14:00
  Speaker 8: Couldn't remember Endy's name. I can remember, and there's a
• 14:03
  Speaker 8: lot of teachers that I remember, not just one or two.
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: I was yeah that yeah, but she was.
• 14:10
  Speaker 8: And because I couldn't remember her name, So how did
• 14:12
  Speaker 8: they actually go about get the people to be up
• 14:17
  Speaker 8: there as witnesses?
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: How did they pick them?
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: But I did ask that question, you know, I said,
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: I mean, at the end of the day, it depends
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: on whose story is more believable, whose story is more
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: But they said, no, there's there's more of the psychological
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: aspects that they have people and read your body language
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: and they can tell if you're lying, and.
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: Blah blah blah. And I was like, well, okay, enough.
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: I can't think that you would put yourself through that
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: to go and in a court on the Bible and
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: take the oath and then sit there and lie to
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: your teeth exactly.
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: And then I know that you were one that didn't
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: get your your time to testify.
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: It's really really unfair.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: I know how much work you've done over the years
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: for the group and all of it, and for you
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: to not be able to get up that was ridiculous.
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Harold, Carol remembered after.
• 15:12
  Speaker 5: She'd been to the place, I feel about being pulled
• 15:16
  Speaker 5: for there at the last manner. No, because the other
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: work have done, I've not thought to be any work
• 15:22
  Speaker 5: I've done, or because everybody else what just as hard
• 15:26
  Speaker 5: is what I did. But just to be pulled and
• 15:31
  Speaker 5: I had a private meeting way al for the court
• 15:36
  Speaker 5: and the PF and then excuse for me, No, you
• 15:41
  Speaker 5: know that zand was absolutely fucking ridiculous. They couldn't be
• 15:44
  Speaker 5: back it up, They couldn't show me any evidence. I
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: was many less hush hush and away you go at
• 15:52
  Speaker 5: the door, because my last words to them was this
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: is just one big coverer mm hmm cover. And I
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: did think at the beginning, well, this has got something
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: to David, these letters that Marion Reads wanted on. And
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: I was adamant that that was maybe one of the
• 16:10
  Speaker 5: reasons why that I was pulled up. And I thought, right, well, okay,
• 16:15
  Speaker 5: if that's the case, then maybe it's because I've worked
• 16:17
  Speaker 5: alongside her, because there in media, because I've been in
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: media stories, whatever.
• 16:24
  Speaker 7: But according to them, no, it was nothing to talk
• 16:26
  Speaker 7: to do with that.
• 16:27
  Speaker 5: It was all to day way a third statement that
• 16:30
  Speaker 5: they kind of show me marit statement because I know
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: for a fact you don't date three statements. You don't
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: live with that abuse for over fifty years. Time you're
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: on the last bit of the statement and you get
• 16:47
  Speaker 5: something wrong. Impossible night talking my sleep, and I can
• 16:52
  Speaker 5: tell you what for word everything that happened to me
• 16:56
  Speaker 5: for Bessie. Ask me again when I've got dementia and
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: I'm sitting for I'll tell you the same story.
• 17:04
  Speaker 6: Do you know what I mean?
• 17:04
  Speaker 7: It's yeah, it's just one big I signed, you know
• 17:12
  Speaker 7: it just if I think that they kind of show
• 17:16
  Speaker 7: me where's the thought one that statement? Where is it?
• 17:22
  Speaker 7: Until they showed me that No, the line backstops. Sorry
• 17:28
  Speaker 7: about the language, but.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: No, it is that right if I I'm not sure.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: I don't remember which of you were in court the
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: day that I was there on the day the day
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: of the testimony. Is one thing that stood out to
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: me was when they brought up that the one who
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: was I think she was a student or a placement
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: student or something at the time when she was there,
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: not a full teacher, and I think she was the
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: one who broke down crying say she saw the force
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: feeding and the treatment times it was do you remember that,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: l or was that? I think you left during the
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: day that day, but I remember seeing that it was
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: towards the end of the day when when I was there,
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: and it kind of you know, we're talking about controlling
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: the narrative and the story and the and the media,
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: and of course we do a UK column. But one
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: of the things that I that I thought at the
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: time was because the force feeding had been out so
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: much in the in the public before this, so it
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: enforced the force feeding story, and obviously that's that's awful,
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: but it also distracts from the.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Other things that happened.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: So it's like, Okay, so this lady made someone eat
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: eggs or made someone you know, you know whatever it was,
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: the porridge, the soup, the all those foods. But so
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: if it's in the public's mind that oh, this lady
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: force fed somebody and forced some girls, that's horrible, but
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: it's not as bad as some of the stories that
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: you all know and yeah happened. And I think that's
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: part of what happens is it's a way in silence
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: the true, the truth of what happened.
• 19:07
  Speaker 8: I think that's what I was trying to Can I
• 19:08
  Speaker 8: say yeah, yeah, uh, I.
• 19:12
  Speaker 4: Mean I never talked about anybody getting taken it for
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: they never talked about the men coming in, they never
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: talked There's so many things that they never talked about.
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: And when you look at the feedback when either Express
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: or Facebook or whatever, and people are like, oh, that
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: was just the sixties and seventies, that's what.
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: Happened, wasn't he No, But that's what Diane saying.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: I know that's no I know.
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: It was covered by one witness, and I says, well,
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: there was more than one witness that was sex.
• 19:44
  Speaker 8: We abused coffees don't even know mean there I was
• 19:48
  Speaker 8: in Fletcher's car and I've always said it was a
• 19:51
  Speaker 8: nonge car when it was cream inside, and I can
• 19:55
  Speaker 8: still see it.
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: I was took the Fletcher. Where I was took, I
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: don't know.
• 19:57
  Speaker 8: I just remember walking back in and then I was
• 20:00
  Speaker 8: too put to a swimming pool in somebody's hoose. They've
• 20:06
  Speaker 8: ben't have their permission to take me out of that
• 20:08
  Speaker 8: building and go into somebody's house.
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: But listen, my sister and my brother and will come
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: up to visit me, and they wouldn't let them in.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. So take that weight you will, Why would
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: you let you know They've traveled up for Glasgow to
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: see me.
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: Now, I don't know if pox, I don't know, chicken pox,
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: gen and measles, I'm not sure. But that there's so
• 20:29
  Speaker 4: many things that want I talked about, and it's almost like,
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: I mean, I was very clear when I gave my
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: statement that it wasn't just her. This is systematic abuse.
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: Of course, I think the avenue they were trying to
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: go down was that. Oh well, I mean if it
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: was just her that was doing it, how did no
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: elsee her? How did you get time to do with us?
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: No? They were all it.
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: They were all doing it.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: It was a systematic thing. It wasn't it just this
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: one evil birdy? Yeah?
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: Right, And and I've been saying that all lag is
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: that that's what that's what they've done with the story,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: even this week, and and when the you know, the
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: sensing happened. Was the one evil woman that did this
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: one thing? Well, no, it was. And basically they're almost
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: using her as a cover up for the whole system.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, yep.
• 21:15
  Speaker 7: Th one abusual stile alive.
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: Right, he's the only one that still alive.
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: Can you imagine if they had done this, you know,
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: five years ago, ten years ago, when when Pearl Fletcher
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: was still alive, they probably wouldn't have done it because
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: she was.
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: The one too. You know, they were not people to
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: bring her in. Was brotton for question?
• 21:41
  Speaker 5: You got questions apparently what was that our mental health
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: or dementia whatever she was supposed to add?
• 21:49
  Speaker 7: Couldn't they take it any.
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: Father, and they spoke very much either, which is it
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: blows my mind that me and Silent that the men
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: book George.
• 22:00
  Speaker 8: No, I remember dog and I also remember and he
• 22:04
  Speaker 8: was attached to the fan because one of the teacher
• 22:08
  Speaker 8: was the daughter of the farmer, and that's why we
• 22:10
  Speaker 8: could walk through all the fields.
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: So I'm sure it was all George and young George.
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: I just remember the older George.
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: I don't remember old George.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: Peter.
• 22:21
  Speaker 8: Also, when you were in the showers, the window was
• 22:24
  Speaker 8: painted painted dot doc so as you couldn't shut up,
• 22:29
  Speaker 8: you always felt though somebody was looking in there.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: And just for people who might be watching this who
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: don't know the story, George was the caretaker of the
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: yeah of the building, and pro Fletcher of course was
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: the head teacher for several years. Just so that people
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: know who we're talking about.
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: And George died because I remember he died as well.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: I found his obituary. We have all those records from
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: the people, as much as we've been able to find,
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: and as you said, there they're all past right now,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: which you know, it's it to me kind of adds
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: the cover up to be able to say, well, here's
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: the seventy seven year old women, you know, way down
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: south of England. She's the only we can find and
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: yeah she did some some bad things and like okay, but.
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: She's not the only one that's still alive, because I
• 23:19
  Speaker 4: know of at least one another.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: Oh really, I don't.
• 23:22
  Speaker 8: Know any you do know that one that asked name.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: Mayor we're just Gladgow housewives and we can find it.
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: These kind of things, you know, straf Cloud police with her,
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: very many investigators could have uncovered very many more than
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: we could have if they were invested.
• 23:47
  Speaker 8: You just felt was well when you gave your statement
• 23:49
  Speaker 8: that the police it was just a right, we'll go
• 23:51
  Speaker 8: to well see when I had nothing else when I
• 23:54
  Speaker 8: had phoned for because I had to phone before we
• 23:56
  Speaker 8: went to the lawyers for a crime number m hmm.
• 24:00
  Speaker 8: And I asked it and it was beginner away, at
• 24:02
  Speaker 8: the beginning away you taught four year ago or whatever
• 24:04
  Speaker 8: whenever I gave my statement four or five year ago,
• 24:07
  Speaker 8: and they says that it doesn't have a crime number,
• 24:10
  Speaker 8: but it has a name, and it was Operation Large
• 24:13
  Speaker 8: Heath because it was larger than just a crime number.
• 24:19
  Speaker 8: That was what I was told. And that was four
• 24:21
  Speaker 8: or five years ago. But I've never I've started an
• 24:24
  Speaker 8: interview with Brian. I've never done one yet. Okay, we
• 24:28
  Speaker 8: can get you on because I think I was nailed
• 24:31
  Speaker 8: the last week.
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and then took something else.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: Now, yeah, we'll get your arm as well.
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: Has anybody had anything from the lawyers. I would have
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: thought that that would have been our next protocol. We
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: can't get some information that would thought they would have
• 24:47
  Speaker 4: been able.
• 24:48
  Speaker 8: To the only thing that we've had for the lawyers
• 24:51
  Speaker 8: is your lawyer's quite good. It's a human ret human
• 24:54
  Speaker 8: right lawyer. We've she's really good, but I think they've
• 24:56
  Speaker 8: been working together. But she had emailed it or obviously
• 24:59
  Speaker 8: Ami old Is after the trial in which she says
• 25:02
  Speaker 8: was she sent us all the forums again to be
• 25:06
  Speaker 8: signed so she could end up with police records. So
• 25:10
  Speaker 8: the last we heard she did have for some medical records,
• 25:15
  Speaker 8: but they were all mixed up, so she had to
• 25:16
  Speaker 8: fix them and once they go on kind of some
• 25:19
  Speaker 8: kind of order and once to get something back, then
• 25:21
  Speaker 8: they'll be notified.
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: So that's what we've heard for your lawyer. But that
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: was that was what just leftter Christmas, just.
• 25:32
  Speaker 7: Eighteen guilties.
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: Then you need to contact your lawyer, because the lawyers
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: are arrangined for.
• 25:41
  Speaker 7: The eighteen victims first mm hmm to speak to.
• 25:44
  Speaker 6: You, Oh my god, you.
• 25:52
  Speaker 5: I can't remember the name now, but contact your lawyer.
• 25:55
  Speaker 5: Your lawyer will tell you one of the eighteen guilties.
• 25:58
  Speaker 5: Then they're dealing with them first have to speak to you.
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: It's not a psychologist, that right, But it's just like
• 26:05
  Speaker 5: to go away back.
• 26:08
  Speaker 8: And you've spoken to them that I used to used
• 26:11
  Speaker 8: to do the same lawyers I used to be talking
• 26:13
  Speaker 8: still Thompson's.
• 26:16
  Speaker 7: H Emma dials. I think it iss.
• 26:23
  Speaker 8: See I felt, even when I was with Thompson is
• 26:25
  Speaker 8: that they never done and it was a she hearn
• 26:27
  Speaker 8: let us know.
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: We were having to keep them updated.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: Well I felt that as well.
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: But when I spoke to I spoke to Laura outside
• 26:34
  Speaker 4: the court and she said, we couldn't do anything because
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: we don't have your medical records.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: We don't have any other records of the club.
• 26:43
  Speaker 4: I don't left it because nobody's got any records, so
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: we could the access anything.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: Well, it was an ongoing trial.
• 26:51
  Speaker 8: But now that that's right, that's right, guilty and all
• 26:54
  Speaker 8: the stuff. But I put to us again, but that
• 26:56
  Speaker 8: was just before that she said something that's just to
• 26:59
  Speaker 8: get the stuff for the trial or something that then
• 27:01
  Speaker 8: she needed it knew that she had been.
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: Sentenced or knew that she had been found guilty. I am,
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: they needed all the mandates.
• 27:08
  Speaker 8: But when we asked for the medical records a few
• 27:12
  Speaker 8: years ago, we did different doctor practices in Erskin. I
• 27:16
  Speaker 8: ever existed until nineteen seventy seven. That's all they could
• 27:20
  Speaker 8: go back, and that's when I moved to Erskin and
• 27:22
  Speaker 8: Jeane was the same as another practice. But Meghan the
• 27:24
  Speaker 8: lawyer says that she's because we've told her that that
• 27:27
  Speaker 8: we couldn't get anything fa before we moved to Erskin.
• 27:30
  Speaker 8: It was all Glasgow then. But she says that she's
• 27:33
  Speaker 8: got once get back till sixty good. So she's got
• 27:39
  Speaker 8: doing medical records gone back. So I saw them obviously,
• 27:42
  Speaker 8: because she's not been back contact with us, but you
• 27:45
  Speaker 8: say she will want to, and she will because she's good.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: She's really nice. I've been really good.
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: Access my mad corks through gart Naval because that's where
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: all of the records are kept. But apparently not so,
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: because I spoke to my practice has been taken over
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: and so she contacted me about something else and I
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: asked them and she said, then, oh, if you give
• 28:04
  Speaker 4: us sign the consent phone, we can do it.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: And I was like, oh, I got my records, I
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: can't and she went, no, what your little little boat
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: was in the like skamual photo.
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: H So they' you've phoned down the back off They've
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: got up on the records and I was like, oh,
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: that was before Christmas.
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: So mhm yep.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: So this also brings me to remind me that I
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: wanted to talk a little bit about the well the
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: Red Dress and the Tarlopeas inquiry, which is still ongoing,
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: which will be I think potentially the next thing for
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: you all to face, because I've been told that they're
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: doing local authorities now as part of the current phase
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: of the Scotch Trolopey's inquiry, and that for nephew will
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: be in May and then and that's something that if
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: I can, I'm going to try to make it up
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: to see some of that. If it's possible for one
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: of those days to come to end. Here what happens,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: and you know, it's kind of as to I believe
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: it was, to show how long this takes. I believe
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: it was last June when Kate Forbes got up on
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: the floor Parliament and said that you are going to
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: be included in the inquiry.
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: We're going to work with you. So that was June
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: of last year.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: So it's taken almost a year for people to come
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: in and be able to be witnesses and inquiry of
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: whoever gets asked to do this. It just shows how
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: how long they try to distract and draw out the process.
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: It takes a year, thing is Diane.
• 29:34
  Speaker 4: What they're also doing is that they invite and select
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: groups of survivors.
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: They need to put a public invite.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, how do you know how they're being selected, Kelly,
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: you know how they're deciding comes in?
• 29:50
  Speaker 7: No?
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 29:51
  Speaker 7: No.
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: I know that there's another group of survivors who had
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: a meeting with Caate Forbes reading stuff.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: We knew nothing about it, and she's done the berbel apology.
• 30:06
  Speaker 4: To room when maybe eight people in it, which is
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: wrong when you consider there at one point it was
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: over two hundred and that group m we haven't died,
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: you know, some of us have been somehow the rest
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: of us are very much still alive.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: We deserve an apology. Also, yes, it needs to be
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: an open bruss aboard.
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: Open invite to people that even if the only invite
• 30:30
  Speaker 4: the people that have persistently been at Hollywood.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Mm hm, which was us, Yeah, there was. There was
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: so many of you the times I've been in Parliament
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: with you. There've been maybe through or forty of you
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: the days when I was there.
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, m hm.
• 30:46
  Speaker 8: We have.
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: I emailed Alex Cole Hamilton, but a fortnight ago haven't
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: heard anything from and I've re emailed them again. I mean,
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: I'm actually beginning to wonder if I fell off the face.
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: Of the earth and.
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: That's coming across anything.
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: So we don't know.
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: That's nothing.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: I mean, we're not going to hear the colin smythe obviously, no,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: they don't even know where he.
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: Is, excoose the language. I don't even want to say.
• 31:13
  Speaker 4: No best, no best left best left time. So our
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: only blink with Parliament is Alex Cohantle. I think when
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: he decides to clud and he promised me, I've.
• 31:25
  Speaker 8: Got it in an email somebody says he promised that
• 31:29
  Speaker 8: everybody would be involved in it.
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: Absolutely categorically, and I said that's fine. And do you
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: know what if you have to email ten different people
• 31:35
  Speaker 4: and they ten different people. Let the people know that
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: they're still in touch with you know, there's a lot
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: going around people's lives. You know, I've got a brain
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: in your brother, my wee. Mom's ninety five.
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: No doing very good, so mama, life's taking up with
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: them in a minute.
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: But I'm still.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: I can make myself available.
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: But to just be like that was left in limbo.
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: Then he don't know what's next or that's it? Would
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: we do it? We know not what ye up? No?
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: But would you go Well, I'm going.
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: Back to PF again. I'm going to ask you for a.
• 32:13
  Speaker 4: To send me some kind of document what you discussed
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: on the phone, because I'm just getting the vibe that
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: if you don't get it and writing mm hmmm. So
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: moving forward, that's my plan for me and everything in writing,
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: because it seems to be that, you know, it gets
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: blown out of the wind after it's said. It might
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: it might have been said, you know, in the spur
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: of the moment, or maybe somebody spoken at a turn
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: and shouldn't really divulge that information that they have. So
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: now I'm looking for things to have in writing because
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: nothing seems to come to completion. It seems to be
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: your jip feed a wee bit here, and a wee
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: bit here, and a wee bit just enough to keep
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: you quiet.
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: H it's not working for me.
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: Where I just a read bit all the time.
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: Probably you get away what I'm going to keep looking for,
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: and I'll of you let me know if you if
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: you find it first, if they send it to you.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: Is the reason for the withdrawal of the appeal Alice
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: saw was that some solicitors looked at it and decided
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: to withdraw, but they didn't say why.
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: I wonder.
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: She said it was a deputy advocate.
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: She said he looked at it and said no, he's
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: looked at other cases similar and the sentence wasn't changed,
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: so it's no point going ahead. But I said, so
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: you kind of get a second opinion. So what he
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: says goes, yeah, he's the highest man in the land.
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: I was like, right, So, I mean, I don't understand
• 33:47
  Speaker 4: why it's not being on the US WI STV or
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: whatever has the contact the Daily Record papers, nothing being.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Don't worry.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: What I noticed was the Daily Record was it was
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: in the print Daily Record a couple of days ago.
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: And one of you said it to me.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: I think it was Lynn, and it should Sharon Cruden
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: and basically again I showed it to Brian actually, and
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: Brian said, well, what this show is showing here is
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: the it's not the right message that they're putting out.
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: It's just again it's just blaming the un evil teacher
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: and understandable outrage from Sharon and all of you, but
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: it's still it's still not giving me this entire story
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: that we're talking about.
• 34:36
  Speaker 8: Well after sort after court, the BBC had approached us,
• 34:40
  Speaker 8: we didn't know who they were and until we were
• 34:42
  Speaker 8: just kind of talking about it talk and then we spoke.
• 34:45
  Speaker 8: But she said, obviously with stuff, as she says, I
• 34:48
  Speaker 8: can't put it on camera. Obviously that can't you see that?
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: Can you see this?
• 34:53
  Speaker 8: But Dad says it's the elite. I say, it's everybody,
• 34:55
  Speaker 8: the Senate and the no One And that says it's
• 34:57
  Speaker 8: one big.
• 34:59
  Speaker 6: Cover up.
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: And I said, and you're talking about the men and
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: the tweed jack.
• 35:03
  Speaker 8: It's smelling a cigar smoke and pipe smoke. I said,
• 35:06
  Speaker 8: goes as deep as that says. Also the church is involved,
• 35:09
  Speaker 8: I says, because there was something to be a minister
• 35:11
  Speaker 8: where we kid as well. I said, you've got your church,
• 35:14
  Speaker 8: your police, your government, everybody's involved in a week candy
• 35:17
  Speaker 8: print that I thought, no, but that's BBC. That's what
• 35:21
  Speaker 8: I feel is the truth.
• 35:22
  Speaker 4: See, if you remember Annie a lot of times that
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: ministers in her dining hall during meals.
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. So he's seen what went on as well, exactly.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: I mean they weren't scared of anybody, like they were
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: hiding it. You know, it was nobody. See, it was just.
• 35:40
  Speaker 8: The school last You just pop them up there every
• 35:43
  Speaker 8: and just bring send them back and then and it's
• 35:45
  Speaker 8: looking up just in seeing court.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: I think the thing that hit me more than ending
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: was when she said that we didn't know how to
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: use cutlery. I think we had no clothes. We were
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: crawling the lice. That's say.
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: Can the difference for a sheep and a cow can
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: tell you something.
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: The house that we lived on at the time, we
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: didn't have a bath, but we had a big tin
• 36:09
  Speaker 4: bath that used to come down every Sunday.
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: Night and we were washed in front of the fire
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: every Sunday night.
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: And our hair it was bath right, but every single
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: night my mum used to sit us in the standards
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: in the sink.
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: At the window, and there was like a geezer. People
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: up brought up yeah water a long kind of hose
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: and the boiling hot water come out of that. So
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: she filled the basement of that and stands in it.
• 36:38
  Speaker 4: But if your bun touched that, oh, Boston, that was
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: every single night, every single night except a Sunday, because
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: you have a bathna Sunday.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: Sunday. Yeah, it looks through because that was her day.
• 36:51
  Speaker 8: There bad lotion washing on in the morning and you
• 36:54
  Speaker 8: played a book and then you gear bath and your
• 36:56
  Speaker 8: hair all looked through with a fine comb.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: And that obviously was a thing that everybody had and
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: then and.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: We certainly knew how it used cutlery. Oh certainly knew
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: the difference between sheeps and cows. No sheep sheeps. It
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: was just they were trying to portray us. Yes, I
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: saw that.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I saw that on the day when I was there
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: for the testimonies that they said, well, you had to
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: be de laust. That was the other thing, right, he
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: last when you arrived as though you had a shower, you.
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: Don't how to eat.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, it just it's all part of the story.
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: And and and the solicitors working on your side of
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: the case were doing the same thing, which saying, well,
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: you know these girls were I understand that they eat
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: anything other than fish and chips because they never they'd
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: never seen a steak before.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: We never seen a steake from Athan either, and we've
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: never seen because they were.
• 37:51
  Speaker 7: There, not exactly.
• 37:53
  Speaker 8: Now do you say, do you know what my ambition
• 37:55
  Speaker 8: was when I got older? Well, they have a ten
• 37:57
  Speaker 8: of suit you because we were brought up. There was
• 38:01
  Speaker 8: niney us, but we were brought up. They were vege,
• 38:03
  Speaker 8: potatoes were mate. Soup was homemade the oven. So that's
• 38:08
  Speaker 8: what I wanted a ton of hind soup because what
• 38:12
  Speaker 8: I did was get homemade soup.
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: They didn't know what end.
• 38:17
  Speaker 4: We must have been portion and you because we used
• 38:19
  Speaker 4: to get a ton of soup. But that's because my no, no, no, no,
• 38:22
  Speaker 4: my mother was a boocher and nest treads.
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: Do you want suit and pudding tonight? So we get
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: a ton of soup and kind of rice pudding the fruit.
• 38:33
  Speaker 3: They get suit and.
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: Listen. But we got that in a good night because
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: we used to say, did you want suiting pudding? Yes?
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: Because she was a rotting cook. Brilliant, brill.
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: Making clothes, but cooking, we used to say, because she
• 38:51
  Speaker 4: would say, whoever makes the meals the whole week, I'll
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: meet your dress or a suit.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: At the weekend, I'll be fighting s. That's how we
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: can cook.
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: It was like.
• 39:01
  Speaker 8: It, but like that way, apparently couldn Jenne get any
• 39:07
  Speaker 8: ten sold were just scum.
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: It was too coup today?
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: Is that why we were offered a thousand pounds? Can
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: I tell you something? That are women? There are survivors.
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: I've got their own business, their own companies, the CEOs
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: of their own yea certain, there's Fetti women that have
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: got multiple properties.
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: You know, there's a Fretty woman that's still.
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: Working that who We know what we are and we
• 39:36
  Speaker 4: don't need any of them. A thousand pounds is not
• 39:39
  Speaker 4: going to make any difference, you know what I mean.
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: I don't know money.
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: I don't know how many for Neetti women that that
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: would make a difference. I'm sure there might be one.
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: Or two mm hmmm, right, But don't insult us by
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: offering us one thousand pounds and collectively. I mean in
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: the paper it said, oh she's been fined, she has
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: to pay out eighteen thousand pounds. She had to pay
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: that to every single person that didn't. But do you
• 40:03
  Speaker 4: know what that difference that would have made. She might
• 40:05
  Speaker 4: have had one lessls potato on her plate when she
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: has a Christmas dinner.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: By what she'd do in the night. To her, she
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: shouldn't have been able to sit there family for Christmas dinner.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: As it's just all did you say it's zip?
• 40:19
  Speaker 8: It's still all following so for years and years ago,
• 40:22
  Speaker 8: you know, she does that and then she gets her
• 40:25
  Speaker 8: she gets like she's done with the waiting charges, and
• 40:29
  Speaker 8: then she still gets light off. She getslipped back to
• 40:32
  Speaker 8: her house. You see, it has a Christmas dinner, gets
• 40:34
  Speaker 8: a wat's pension and all that isn't you.
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: U suw me a synty six yearl that goes it.
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: I mean she's she's in house and I mean was
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: she going to go after midnight?
• 40:48
  Speaker 3: I'm on frus. I can't even get it. That's me.
• 40:58
  Speaker 7: Well, I just just wrap this up.
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: Thank you for others.
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: I just want to go around to each of you
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: and wrap this up and just ask if you have
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: any final things, because I want everyone to make sure
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: that they've had their voices heard.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: Because you didn't. I'll get your turns to the court.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: So if you have anything, I'm just going to go
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: around again once again, and this time I think I
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: will start with the two ladies. I didn't get to
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: start with them at the beginning, so I'll start with Jean.
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: Anything you are to add, No.
• 41:26
  Speaker 8: I just feel it's just totally too muddly and again
• 41:30
  Speaker 8: you're getting your hopes built up and you know for
• 41:32
  Speaker 8: a fact what had happened or the years ago, and
• 41:35
  Speaker 8: there's only eighteen cases against her, No, just her a
• 41:39
  Speaker 8: lot of people, you know, and it's she's got away
• 41:43
  Speaker 8: bit and away bit again, and it's just a picnic
• 41:46
  Speaker 8: taste disgusting.
• 41:49
  Speaker 3: It makes you just feel down totally.
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, any just like that as well.
• 41:56
  Speaker 8: I feel as though she got away a bit all
• 41:58
  Speaker 8: the years ago, no way, wait now and drubbed our noses.
• 42:00
  Speaker 8: And that's how I feel. It's it's happened, they've got
• 42:04
  Speaker 8: she got away with and rubbed her noses in it.
• 42:06
  Speaker 8: But that gudge, I thought he was kind of no
• 42:08
  Speaker 8: bad all the way kind I threw And then just
• 42:11
  Speaker 8: at the end.
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: M hm, I felt.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: That's the surprising part of the set, that very surprised.
• 42:17
  Speaker 8: That surprised me because all along, yeah, obviously you get
• 42:20
  Speaker 8: weaking of vibes and things like that, but I did
• 42:23
  Speaker 8: think he was willing to listen.
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: And the sentence is absolutely diabolical.
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was like you felt the whole the whole
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: thing flip and you could just feel.
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: The shaft room.
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and every single one of us when we come
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: out with I think we were speechless as well, and
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: just like that's great, but I punched in the gut
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: mm hmm, chopping.
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: Killy, anything you'd like to add.
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: She went over at the Fat Lady sings and I'm
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: keeping my mouth shut.
• 42:55
  Speaker 9: Okay, No, I think there's there's definitely more of this
• 43:05
  Speaker 9: to come, whether they don't, I mean there.
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: Needs to be you canna just a one person saying
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: that's over mm hm and we'll just go back as
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: the word before that can happen. But I actually expected
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: more press coverage.
• 43:19
  Speaker 4: I expected there would be an outrage because when you
• 43:22
  Speaker 4: look at the comments, a lot of the comments were.
• 43:24
  Speaker 6: Like that can be it.
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: It's the same you know when I when I was
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: sharing the story on my own social media face when
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: when the sensing happened, everyone was disgusted, so everyone can
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: see it. It's just but you know, when you look
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: at the comments now of what happened the last week,
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: there's not very much because.
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: I don't think it's getting that much coverage. So well,
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: you know, we'll try to do what we can. From
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: the calum.
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: That well, there was one guy crowdfunding for protests and things,
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: and I was like, so there are.
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: There are people out there that are behind us. You've
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: got behind you.
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: It's just getting because.
• 44:05
  Speaker 8: People are going to the splinter groups and this one's
• 44:08
  Speaker 8: gonna talk to that one or whatever. But see if
• 44:09
  Speaker 8: everybody I know, I will probably never happen. But see
• 44:12
  Speaker 8: the body could just put theffence's aside just for one day,
• 44:16
  Speaker 8: for everybody just to get together and have a big,
• 44:18
  Speaker 8: massive sure people.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: Then then I think I'll finish with you.
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: You've you've been there.
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: I'd say the best behavior of everyone today.
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: She's quite quiet day, Oh quiet?
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: Did you have anything to add?
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: Lin?
• 44:34
  Speaker 5: I just feel the same as everybody else. I'm feel empty,
• 44:39
  Speaker 5: absolutely empty cut. Yeah, I could certain I could certain
• 44:44
  Speaker 5: quite easily get when I heard what has happened.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
• 44:49
  Speaker 5: There's going aheads So I don't know which way we
• 44:54
  Speaker 5: go for here, but I'm sure of that yellow brick
• 44:59
  Speaker 5: road and will get there.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Maybe somebody watching with bable to advise us.
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Maybe somebody watching with people advisers exactly.
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we're all that's that.
• 45:17
  Speaker 7: I think we're all feeling the same.
• 45:18
  Speaker 5: It's just so raw to leave that building in September
• 45:22
  Speaker 5: knowing that she we got that guilty against her guilties.
• 45:25
  Speaker 7: That was amazing.
• 45:28
  Speaker 5: And then to go back there in December, be her
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: a Christmas present or wrapped up in a nice wee
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: boat and where we get ours right out the hap? Yeah,
• 45:38
  Speaker 5: I mean there was there was nothing for us we
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: left there Christmas was tempted to our families Christmases or
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: because of her, yeah you know what I mean, and
• 45:47
  Speaker 5: sitting in her laughing at us because there's an appeal.
• 45:52
  Speaker 7: We're all in it for financial gain.
• 45:54
  Speaker 6: Come on.
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: There was no remorse of that one either whatsoever.
• 45:59
  Speaker 5: She refused to So the questions, don't you see the
• 46:02
  Speaker 5: power and that woman when she was walking away through
• 46:04
  Speaker 5: that for you watch the news clips and our body
• 46:10
  Speaker 5: when she's walking away from there. It's not that we
• 46:13
  Speaker 5: struggled to get there. Mm hmmm, was in a wheelchair
• 46:20
  Speaker 5: because of the pain in our back. We couldn't there
• 46:23
  Speaker 5: have that and her body, but she did.
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: She had a great life kicking of wings and do
• 46:33
  Speaker 5: you know what I mean, it's just I don't know,
• 46:41
  Speaker 5: but they can shut up all the big wigs, but
• 46:44
  Speaker 5: they kind of shut us up.
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: No, no, no, And that's that's the that's the great
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: thing about too. Even when you all have your differences,
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: you're all heading the same direction, even when there are
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: things that happen. And I know how hard it is
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: and how incredibly strong you evolved and through this, and
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: but I think that can happen when we're all strong
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: and you want to fight, and then that that creates
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: other things that can happen, which you know, it's almost like,
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: but but I think it's that strength and that stubbornness
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: and that bravery that you've all had. You know, as
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: Brian says, gutsy women, you know, and I mean I'm
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: one of his gutsy women as well. But if you
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: look at the women on his Gutsy Women website, I
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: mean we're a force, all of us together.
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: And they just watch out for all of them.
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: But you know, I we'll see what happens. It seems
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: like in terms of time that the inquiry or you're
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: the local authorities, part of the tall Aby's inquiry is
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: going to be the next thing that will face and
• 47:47
  Speaker 1: we'll see who they call witnesses there. But we'll see
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: what happens between now and then. But that's coming up
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: in Bay, so that's relatively soon.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: We'll see what they do.
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: And that's where you know, I think all inquiries our
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: cover ups because they're investigating themselves.
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: And so what does that mean.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: Well, it means that they're going to make it look
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: like it's not as bad as well, we'll be well, yeah,
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: it's still happening today to children today, and so yeah,
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: to continue to watch what they're doing. And I'm interested
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: in trying to attend some of that if I can
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: get up for the days when whatever the for Dethew witnesses,
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: if I can find out when that's happening.
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: So and if you get called or let me know
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: and I'll try. Yeah did not everyone did, but you know,
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: if if.
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: Carol is one of the for Neete Residential School survivors
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: who's been very active since the result of the trial
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: with Patricia Robertson and has her own story to tell
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: that she shared with Brian about social work and what
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: happened with her own children during her life. But today
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: we mostly want to catch up. I'm the result of
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: the appeal based on the sentencing of Patricia Robertson, and
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: we were hoping that the Crown would look at whether
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: or not we could give her some prison time as
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: she deserves, as we know she deserves, but unfortunately they
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: withdrew the appeal. So I wanted to catch up with
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: Carol today and get her thoughts on what's just happened.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: So Carol, welcome again to the UK column. Do you
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: want to share your thoughts about what has happened just
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: in the past few days with this result.
• 49:29
  Speaker 6: No, it's quite disappointing on that she's not going to prison.
• 49:35
  Speaker 6: The initial disappointment came from the sentencin but when we
• 49:41
  Speaker 6: thought that it was going to go for an appeal,
• 49:44
  Speaker 6: you thought there was going to be a second chance
• 49:46
  Speaker 6: of being sentenced, and now it's happened again. It's just
• 49:53
  Speaker 6: been another disappointment. Would you do from that?
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: It When I attended the day of the sentencing, there
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: was a general feeling from all of you. I think
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: that that was the hope, the only hope that you
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: had left in this whole situation, was there would be
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: an appeal and they would decide to send her to prison.
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: And I remember the shock that was just.
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: In the room when the judge announced that there would
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: be no prison, and that was really the only thing
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: that it felt like you had left was a possibility
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: of an appeal. Now to hear that the appeal has
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: been withdrawn for answers that we don't know why yet,
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: other than what I saw in one of the mainstream
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: media sources that said that some specialist solicitors had looked
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: at the case and decided it wasn't appropriate, which to
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: me isn't really an answer.
• 50:47
  Speaker 6: No, they're considering our age, but as it has been said,
• 50:51
  Speaker 6: many times were forced in consider all those week ols
• 50:53
  Speaker 6: age it is, and that would have been thousands and
• 50:57
  Speaker 6: thousands of girls. It's not just about the people that
• 51:01
  Speaker 6: got found she got found guilty for She's been doing
• 51:04
  Speaker 6: that for years, so maybe that should have been looked
• 51:07
  Speaker 6: into as well. I mean, she was found guilty for
• 51:11
  Speaker 6: historical abuse and on children, so she should have went
• 51:18
  Speaker 6: to prison.
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: I think some people have thought that maybe part of
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: the excuse for it was because she's seventy seven and
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: therefore she you know, she's because of her age, she
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: shouldn't have to go to prison.
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: But how do you feel about that?
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: It seems to be the abuse is abuse, regardless of
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: how old they are when they finally figured out.
• 51:37
  Speaker 6: Well, it's disgusting because when she was younger, she wasn't
• 51:40
  Speaker 6: thinking about our ages and she did what she did.
• 51:45
  Speaker 6: What age was she when she was doing all that?
• 51:49
  Speaker 6: I mean, at what point does it start and stop?
• 51:53
  Speaker 6: She shouldn't have started it in the first place, so
• 51:56
  Speaker 6: for stars, we shouldn't have been abused. In for nethe
• 52:00
  Speaker 6: the whole catalog of it all, and then go through
• 52:04
  Speaker 6: the court case, we get the guilties. She goes back
• 52:08
  Speaker 6: for sentencing, which that would comes up sentence and you
• 52:12
  Speaker 6: think prison and the sentence was nothing, but then you
• 52:17
  Speaker 6: hope for this appeal to happen and then nope.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: It just seems that the entire system is the problem,
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: which you mentioned in the interview that you did with
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: Brian days ago, that we can kind of see the
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: whole system and the corruption that is happening.
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: Is that what you're seeing as well.
• 52:38
  Speaker 6: Get a lot. And I mean there's been cases after
• 52:42
  Speaker 6: Finetti as well. The whole system needs a good shake
• 52:46
  Speaker 6: up and things need to change. I mean there's been
• 52:50
  Speaker 6: cases after Finetti where nuns have went to court, foster
• 52:54
  Speaker 6: girls have went to court, some of them have been sentenced.
• 52:58
  Speaker 6: And missus Robertson shouldn't have what away she'd have been
• 53:02
  Speaker 6: sent She should have been sentenced just like the rest
• 53:04
  Speaker 6: of them. And it wasn't like it was two or
• 53:08
  Speaker 6: three of us. So there was many of us, plenty,
• 53:12
  Speaker 6: plenty of women that stood the stand and told but done,
• 53:18
  Speaker 6: and others beyond that.
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: And there were so many more. The two days when
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: I was in court one day from when there was
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: witnesses testifying as well as sentencing day, there were so
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: many of you there who were there. The room was packed,
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: especially for the sentencing day.
• 53:36
  Speaker 6: Yeah, that was.
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: And then there are the tens of thousands more of
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: girls all over Glasgow that were there who might not
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: even know that this is going on. And the extent
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: and the size the number of girls that were at Frinity.
• 53:53
  Speaker 6: I don't realize how many people went, well, girls went
• 53:56
  Speaker 6: now thousands and thousands over the year.
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: It was over the course of thirty one years, when
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: you were there for six weeks at a time year round,
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: that does we If you do the maths, it adds
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: up quickly to thousands, thousands of girls over thirty one years.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: It just that, you know, the number of girls that
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: were in the courtroom that day of the sentencing, even
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: though it was full, it was just a tiny, tiny
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: percentage of the number of you that we're ATFINI and
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: under the hands of the abuse of Patricia Robertson as
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: well as every other teacher who was there who have
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: now passed away, and we can't we can't do anything.
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: About that now.
• 54:36
  Speaker 6: But I mean, there was a lot of teachers there
• 54:40
  Speaker 6: lie in too, wasn't there saying that they there was
• 54:43
  Speaker 6: none of that happening up for and then monstered up
• 54:46
  Speaker 6: and says it did happen in for So that should
• 54:49
  Speaker 6: have went for something as well. The teacher that couldn't lie, Well.
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: What I did notice the day that I was that
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: I was in court listening to some of the witnesses,
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: there was one teacher who was there sort of as
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: a placement. I think she was a young I don't
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: know if she wasn't actually a teacher. She was, but
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: she was doing something related to education and children, and
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: she's the one I saw that used the most emotion
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: where she broke down and I think talked about the
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: force feeding by Robertson and how the things were handled
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: during the meal times, which is one of the things
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: that Robertson was found guilty of. She was found guilty
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: of the force feeding, but that falls under the sort
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: of cruel and unnatural treatment, not the actual abuse, not
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: the sexual abuse allegations. Those were not proven, but the
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: ones that were still serious but not as serious were
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: the ones where she was found guilty. And so that
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: really lines up well with what that witness was doing
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: when she broke down in tears saying she saw the
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: force feeding. But it also, in our view from when
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: and I have had these conversations, kind of it diminishes
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: the extent of the serious abuse that she was not
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: feel guilty for. So, yeah, she was, she did these things,
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: she force ard, she slapped things of the cruel treatment,
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: but the sexual abuse allegations were we're just ignored and
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: those women were not allowed to take the stand who
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: had the most serious ones and those weren't proven.
• 56:24
  Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, it was because George, George is gone, right,
• 56:29
  Speaker 6: that's right. George isn't about so they couldn't prove about George.
• 56:35
  Speaker 6: But Robertson was must have been involved in all that
• 56:39
  Speaker 6: as well, so they should have implicated her and everything
• 56:43
  Speaker 6: because it's so down to her now. But at the
• 56:48
  Speaker 6: end of the day, everyone knows what she is. She's
• 56:53
  Speaker 6: been on the news, she's been out there, she's been
• 56:57
  Speaker 6: dragged through the court. But you find yourself thinking that
• 57:01
  Speaker 6: and then you still come back to that. But which
• 57:04
  Speaker 6: she wasn't sent this knipsticks, So it's like going round
• 57:08
  Speaker 6: in circles.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Well, I know there are some potentially some
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: civil cases coming up, some of the things that we
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: can't necessarily talk about yet, but it sounds like we're
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: still you're still all in the fight.
• 57:25
  Speaker 6: There's still things going to be happening with Fnehan, There's
• 57:28
  Speaker 6: still things going to be going on. But unfortunately, I
• 57:32
  Speaker 6: think that's the closest closure to court unless other survivors
• 57:37
  Speaker 6: come forward and maybe in new cases open who knows,
• 57:42
  Speaker 6: can just hope and pray for the other survivors to
• 57:45
  Speaker 6: maybe get justice. There's always that, just maybe a different judge,
• 57:54
  Speaker 6: just time.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that judge was unbelievable because the statement where he
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: said this is what you've done, this is this was horrible,
• 58:05
  Speaker 1: and then he surprised us all I think everyone, I'm
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: sure you are surprised as well to hear.
• 58:12
  Speaker 6: Going to give you everything was clear to see, wasn't it.
• 58:17
  Speaker 6: It was clear to see. It was clear to see.
• 58:19
  Speaker 6: And then year's probation, bet three year probation and the
• 58:27
  Speaker 6: one thousand pounds compensation where he's kind of contradicting himself
• 58:33
  Speaker 6: because he said about that the survivors all looking for money,
• 58:36
  Speaker 6: and then he does compensation. Think that insult tendre because
• 58:40
  Speaker 6: that is insom What other way would you say it.
• 58:46
  Speaker 6: It's just she should have just went to prison.
• 58:49
  Speaker 8: M hmm.
• 58:51
  Speaker 6: And a lot of people probably won't never ever get
• 58:53
  Speaker 6: their head round it because of the damage that woman
• 58:56
  Speaker 6: has done to people. And it's been little gal. She's
• 59:02
  Speaker 6: done it too. She's not done it to us an
• 59:04
  Speaker 6: adult adulthood. So it's caused trauma for the remainder of
• 59:08
  Speaker 6: our lives. Oh no, not.
• 59:12
  Speaker 7: So.
• 59:12
  Speaker 6: Really, she should have an impact to it as well. Well.
• 59:17
  Speaker 6: At the moment, she should be setting in a cell
• 59:20
  Speaker 6: and present at our friends.
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: You talked about that so well in your interview with
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: Brian talking about uh, the trauma throughout your life and
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: how that has impacted. And I believe Brian said in
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: the interview and I agree with him that if we're
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: talking about redress in terms of financial conversation, that the
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: minimum should potentially be something like a million pounds. The
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: impact it has on your whole life and your ability
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: to have make incomes and all of the emotional.
• 59:56
  Speaker 6: The emotional trauma it's caused peop. It's hard to put
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 6: a price on a child's life because they put that
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 6: much impact on it. So what price could you put
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 6: on it? It's priceless. So I don't know. The government
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 6: are going to have to start thinking what they're doing,
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 6: because I do believe that the Farinetti women should get
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 6: some sort of compensation, not the redress, not that, but
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 6: there should be some sort of scheme for people for
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 6: short term care, because they're going to pacify it with
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 6: you're not long term care. You can't get this, so
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 6: come up with something else for short term care people.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 6: Because there's people that go into emergency care and things
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 6: happen to them, and there is people that go into
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 6: short term care as well where abuse can happen to
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 6: them and they'll be in the same boat boat as
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 6: Benetti survivors. And there's probably other that residential schools out there. Sorry, no, no,
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 6: that's fine.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: No, it's just the that was part of the issue
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: with the redress criteria, which is why the petition has
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: been in Parliament for so long m hm saying well,
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 1: because you were in short term care that you were
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: in eligible for redress and then I'm afraid what's going
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: to happen as well is that because it was run
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: by Glasgow Corporation or Strathquinde Regional Council, that means it's
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: Glasgow City Council now has direct responsibility for it.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: It's not it's not the government. Uh, it's it's not government,
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: it's the council. Yeah, because they were the ones who
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: in it.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: So Glasgow City Councils is going to say, well, we
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: don't have that kind of money to give financial compensation
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: to thousands of women.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 6: They're going to have to thanks for something, aren't they
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 6: very will?
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 6: The city at first been when it was brought out
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 6: that they tried to deny that establishment exist and when
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 6: I first came on a SCV. They said it didn't happen,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 6: it doesn't exist. That is wrong because as soon as
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 6: you open that door in forer Neette there's a picture
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 6: of the coach's sister and underneath it it says this
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 6: is Foreti Residential School. It's been becreathed from Lord Goltana
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 6: to Glasgow Glasgow District Council or something like that. So
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 6: that means that place did exist and it was through
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 6: them as well. Of course it came for Lord Katana
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 6: to Glasgow District and they sold it on. They should
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 6: not solved that property on either.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: It does. Yeah, and those of us who are in
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: the UK column team have done that research and we
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: found all of the documents that that show exactly how
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: that happened and how Lord Tana Facility facilitated the donation
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: of the building to Glasgow Corporation and how that all happened.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: They have direct responsibility. It was all under the Education
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: Committee and under Glasgow Corporation and so now they have
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: the director responsibility now Glasgow City Council. But of course
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: all councils like to say they broke regardless of how
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 1: much we pay in council tax.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 6: And oh maybe it's time to pay back.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, exactly exactly.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 6: We're also entitled to her written apology because we went
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 6: there and they're saying we didn't. So now it's time
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 6: for the written apology to apologize to us for what
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 6: we went through and for them saying it never happened,
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 6: because it happened, all right, it was proven then court.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 6: Yeah that she done that. Even though it's eighteen guilty shoots.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 6: She should have got a lot more than that, a
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 6: whole lot more than that.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, And now we're seeing the Scott's Child Abuse Inquiry
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: taking this on. I know that the local authorities are
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 1: part of the current phase of the inquiry, which will
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: of course include for Nephi and several others that fall
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: under the City of Glasgow Council following under said of
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: Edinburgh councils all over Scotland that are part.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 6: Of the whole shebang, the whole shebang, they should be
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 6: all bought up and held accountable. Yeah, because a lot
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 6: of trust was put into these places and they broke
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 6: children's trust. And that's the worst trust you can break,
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 6: as a child's trust. Absolutely, because if they can't trust adults,
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 6: who else can they trust?
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly right, So we will see what happens. But unfortunately,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: it seems though inquiries tend to not really get to
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: what's actually happening because they're investigating themselves.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 6: Uh huh. I think they're more on the basis of
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 6: logging it and to make sure that it doesn't happen
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 6: again and to let it know that it did happen
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 6: in historical it was historical that happened, and letting it
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 6: known that that happened. Yeah, it's accepting it happened. So
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 6: that's another issue for Glasgow District because that's another acceptance
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 6: that it happened.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: Right, And the responsibility between Scottish Government and the Parliament
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: compared to the Council is separate and so well, the
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: Scottish Government says that they're responsible for the redress scheme
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: because it does sort of report to Scottish Government. Then
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: that's a separate issue though from the local authorities that
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: ran for DEATHI and all of the other schools that
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: were in operation. So that you know, the responsibility falls
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: in a couple of different places depending on what you're
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: looking at, and so that that creates a very complicated
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: picture for those of you that went to schools that
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: were run by local authorities rather than by the the
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: overall government Scotch government, So we have multiple layers of
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: responsibility and different things for different reasons.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 6: Yeah, that will look interesting when it all comes to
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 6: the end where and it does come out that it
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 6: actually has happened and when they have got to apologize
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 6: for it all. M hmm, yeah, because there has been
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 6: different places that have received the apology. It was like
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 6: they tried to say it never happened in Quardias and
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 6: it did.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: Of course.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 6: Nazare ath House and different different places. So this denial,
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 6: maybe they need to stop the denial, deal with it
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 6: and actually stop it for happening in other establishments because
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 6: it's still happening at that stay.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: Right, And you know there's there's some other ones that
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: UK Colin will be looking into shortly, you know. Following
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: for example is College in Edinburgh, which is where Tony
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: Blair went to school and yeah, yeah, and Loretto which
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 1: is in mussel Brough.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 2: There are a few others. They're all over, but there
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: are a few.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: That I'm I'm personally interested in looking into, you because
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: the current administrators of some of these schools that I've
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: just mentioned are now coming out and saying, well, we weren't. Necessarily,
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: we can't be reflexible for the past. We can't change
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 1: the past, and this is what happens. So even now
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: that the current head teachers are not taking responsibility for
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: what happened in the past to the previous previous pupils.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: So there's this is an ongoing battle that we have
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: obviously where they're still and they're still trying to deny.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 6: They're still trying to not deny it. They're walking about blindfolded.
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 6: Don't you open their eyes and see what's happening right
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 6: in front of them, because it's still happening. It's still
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 6: happened today. Of course I've seen it with more children,
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 6: my son going into a unit that was just round
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 6: the corner from me. So no, no, it still happens
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 6: today as a creatures are still at it, do you know?
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 6: I mean? And what to the education department? They can
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 6: take them out the school, put them into the education
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 6: board to work because they hide the fact because why
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 6: would they admit that?
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 1: Mm hmm right, right, So was it was your sign
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: in a residential school or was it a what type
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: of school was it?
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 6: I would say it was it was a man's stream
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 6: school and it was from one man's stream school. They
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 6: moved another teacher, they moved him from the Clyde to Renfrewshire,
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 6: and then for Renfrewshire he got moved to another one
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 6: and then it all crept up on him and that's
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 6: when it got removed out the school in and put
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 6: into Renfrewshire Council building to deal with education inside the building. Oh,
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 6: my son he was he was in a carehl maha,
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 6: he was in a unit. Sorry, a picture up wrong.
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 6: I thought you were talking about a teacher. Yeah, oh no, No,
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 6: my son went into care. It was the same time
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 6: my two sons went into care and they got separated
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 6: and the oldest one, when they got separated, they put
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 6: him into a unit and it was an area that
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 6: we used to stay in and it didn't go well,
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 6: and I think he suffered a lot of trauma in there,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 6: but his behavior went down. Hell as soon as they
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 6: got worse. It did have behavior, I shuwed, but it
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 6: got worse and it wasn't It wasn't nice for him
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 6: and that sort of trigger, isn't. It reminded me of
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 6: different things that I went through. But when we stayed
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 6: in that area. I did used to say in my
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 6: children's place to go into the care home, and it
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 6: wasn't towards the children, it was towards the cares. I
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 6: didn't like the care as it ran the care home.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 6: So when my kids were, when my son was in
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 6: that place, I had to deal with their people. It's
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 6: a bit ironic that I had to speak with the
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 6: people about my son. And you do get you do
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 6: get pushed out these places. You don't know what's happening
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 6: your children in these places, so they can disappear at
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 6: ten o'clock at night and nothing happens where you should
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 6: really protocol tells you your phone, the police. Children can
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 6: disappear in that they don't know what's happening with the
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 6: children in there, which can be quite scary.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: That's something that I think we see a lot where
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: you know, and in the case of for Nethi, I
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: did find evidence that said that when children were sent
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 1: to for Dethie, they were taking out of the custody
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: of their parents and put in the custody of the state,
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: which means that you know, whatever happens, that they were
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: entirely responsible because you were taken out of the care
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 1: of your parents at that time.
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 6: Well, and my mum had paid the state money for
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 6: a holiday, so that meant she was in trusted in
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 6: the state to look after me for those those six weeks.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 6: So technically they broke her trust. It stole the money
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 6: as well, offer if you think about it, technically, because
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 6: why do that for money?
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: You know, I mean how much do you know how
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 2: much she had to pay?
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 6: Forty pounds? I can remember the letter from the school
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 6: to this day because I was just suggesting that there
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 6: was a holiday there, that it was a big adventure
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 6: and for forty pounds it would be a wonderful adventure.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 6: I would see the great outdoors. It did describe outside
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 6: for Nettie at the Ranger Sound Sanctuary and all that,
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 6: that we'd see a lot of wildlife. Yeah, we've seen
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 6: wildlife alright. That was Robertson wildlife. That was huh. But no,
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 6: we were always locked in or it was a waltz.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 2: That was it.
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 6: That was as good as it got. So it wasn't
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 6: a big adventure. And a lot of girls have told
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 6: me that missus Robertson's she would tell them if they
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 6: ran away that then it was something like if you
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 6: run away, you're always gonna get brought back kind of thing.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 6: I think the farmer brought them back. No, if they
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 6: ran away, they got caught, so they got brought back.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 6: So there was no way of escape. So the girls
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 6: were absolutely petrified over.
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: Well, it would be very difficult to escape out there.
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: I've been to FORNIVI. Oh, you have to go a
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: long way to get anywhere.
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 6: Because it's like fields and fields and fields, and then
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 6: you've got all those trees. Well, now I can't walk
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 6: through the woods, walk through grass because it just goes
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 6: right through me. I just can't. I can't do it.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 6: It's indesting with that because of the I used to
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 6: call trees, but that tall trees. And it realized till
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 6: I got up there and seen the place again, I
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 6: was like, that's why I can't walk through woods and
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 6: I can't do this and I can't do that because
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 6: of this place. And there the long walks I used
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 6: to take because as well, the.
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: Long walks I've heard were I don't know, you might
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: remember this as well, that the long walks were sort
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: of you would get these wellies that were uncomfortable, and
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: we made to walk for miles.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: It wasn't just a nice walk in the country.
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 6: It was no, no, yeah, I think it was seven miles.
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 6: You had to walk up was there and back seven
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 6: miles and the wellies they marked the top of your leg.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 6: The ring would catch a leg. They were horrible.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: They were just.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 6: They burnt the top of your leg. No where you
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 6: have is it's not there. And they want the most
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 6: comfortable wellies to wear at all. And then you're asked
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 6: me if I had my pack lunch when we went
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 6: for a walk, and I went no. I was absolutely sad.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 6: But that was I think we had our lunch and
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 6: went for a walk, or we went for a walk.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 6: I had a lunch that they did two things and
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 6: they kind of mix up. But I always remember being
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 6: hungry and forty, but yet I was force fed h
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 6: m hm. And the food was absolutely revolting, as you
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 6: could imagine because they had to force read us it.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 6: But to turn around and say that the food there
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 6: like the jelly, and that that we cried when we
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 6: seen the food. We were probably crying because we were
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 6: scared to eat the food more like it because I've
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 6: never seen it and so disgusting in my life. We
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 6: were give them food when we were younger, Yeah, but
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 6: nothing like that.
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 1: Do you remember some of the foods, because well, was it.
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: I've heard about the eggs.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 6: The eggs. I can't eat the eggs. I can't eat
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 6: eggs to this day because of the eggs and for Nettie,
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 6: and they were absolutely disgusting. And I remember they used
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 6: to try and cover it with a sauce and I
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 6: just could not eat them. So she hostfed me. Then
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 6: they'd give you soup as well, which was it was
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 6: paying ham soup, but it was all blended in and
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 6: it was a greeny color. So she first read me that,
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 6: and that came that went in my mouth and down
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 6: the throat and then back up the nose. But either
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 6: way you were, in her eyes, you were going to
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 6: eat that soup. There was no way out. You were
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 6: going to eat the food that she put down to
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 6: And it wasn't a case of what it said in
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 6: court that she was saying just try it might be. No,
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 6: it was eat that, eat that, because I remember when
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 6: we got there, it was lunchtime and her and Missus
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 6: Fletcher were running around the tables screaming in me girl's
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 6: faces screaming, eat it, eat it, eat it, and the
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 6: two of them were laughing at each other while they
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 6: were doing that. So it started as soon as we
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 6: walked in and continued on. And I think they probably
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 6: got to be a bit more friendly with us just
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 6: before we got home, because they didn't want us to
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 6: tell parents what happened. M But when you came home
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 6: and told that kind of story, it's a hard story
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 6: to believe.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it would be, especially if your mother thought
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 1: you were coming for a holiday and then.
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 6: And then when it was top top day, my mum
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 6: would send postal orders and I was told no, nothing yet.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 6: So a lot of girls never got tuk or they
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 6: were told they were on punishment for some other reason,
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 6: because it was continuous punishment for other girls as well.
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 6: So realistically she should have been punished. She set out
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 6: and punished girls, complete strangers she didn't know, technically, missus
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 6: Robinson's strangers to us. So she has been sent down
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 6: that day, you know what I mean?
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 6: Wait did what wait? What way did she treat her own? Yeah?
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 6: My mother sent us sent us up there. We were
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 6: somebody else's children and she sent my mom sent me
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 6: up there. We trust we were somebody else's children. We
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 6: want their children. They had no right to abuse us.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 6: How would they feel if it was done to their children.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: There's no words for it.
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: When you think about the number of girls that she
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 1: would have done these exact things too, over many years,
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: and then to be told her she doesn't need to
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 1: go to prison just because she's later in life that
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: it's just it's just absolutely unbelievable.
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 6: But she actually just sitting pretty just now, isn't she.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 6: She's in the house, so she's got a home comfort. Yeah,
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 6: which is wrong.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 7: It is.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 1: Well, I thank you for your time today. Is there
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 1: anything else that you wanted to say that we haven't
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 1: talked about.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 6: I just I think it's discussed and considering what the
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 6: girls have been put through that we should have got
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 6: more that the court, but the judge that originally should
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 6: have sent stuff. We shouldn't have went through the trauma
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 6: of the appeal for it just to be no, not happening.
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 6: But it is what it is. But there's other avenues
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 6: and I'm sure we can continue another path and find
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 6: other ways of dealing.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, and I know you will because you're all
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 1: very strong, brave ladies, and and and I know this
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: will keep going and UK call them as I keep saying,
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: it's here to support you and get your story out
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 1: as much as we can, so we will not abandon you,
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 1: and we will continue to think after that.
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 6: I appreciate your help. Thank you very much, Thank you
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 6: so much for your time. You take care.
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so thank you again, ladies for your time, and
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 1: as always, thank you for your strength and your bravery
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: and for sharing. I know this is hard, but I'm
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 1: hoping this can help us get it out a bit
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 1: more so more and more people can see what's going on,
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: because we want people to see the overall SYS and
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 1: how it's all working against you and it's not just
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 1: this one teacher and that is actually part of the
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 1: cover up, as you've correctly said. So thank you again
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: for your time and we really appreciate it, and thank you.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 6: Thanks bye, Thank you