Latest / How To Protect The Ocean / The War on Science: Why NOAA and the EPA Are Under Attack
Transcript
- 1:00:00There is a war on science right now in
- 1:00:02the US government that are
- 1:00:03targeting NOAA, the National
- 1:00:05Oceanographic and Atmospheric
- 1:00:07Administration and the EPA, the
- 1:00:09Environmental Protection Agency,
- 1:00:11by the Department of Government
- 1:00:12Efficiency, Doge, headed by Elon Musk.
- 1:00:15He's not even an elected
- 1:00:16official. Congresspeople and senators are
- 1:00:18not happy with the way
- 1:00:20things are going. And on this
- 1:00:21episode of the How to Protect the Ocean
- 1:00:23podcast, we're going to talk about the
- 1:00:24cuts that we've seen
- 1:00:25this in the past, not only at the other
- 1:00:27Trump administration, but
- 1:00:28also in Canada back in the
- 1:00:30early 2010s. We're going to talk about
- 1:00:32that on today's episode of
- 1:00:33the How to Protect the Ocean
- 1:00:33podcast. Let's start the show. Hey,
- 1:00:38everybody, welcome back to another
- 1:00:39exciting episode of the
- 1:00:40How to Protect the Ocean podcast. I'm
- 1:00:41your host, Andrew Loew. And
- 1:00:42this is the podcast where you
- 1:00:43find out what's happening with the ocean,
- 1:00:44how you can speak up for
- 1:00:45the ocean and what you need to
- 1:00:46live for a better ocean by taking action.
- 1:00:48And I'll tell you, all three
- 1:00:50things need to happen right
- 1:00:51now. We are seeing a lot of just
- 1:00:54dismantling of infrastructure and funding
- 1:00:57that has been put into
- 1:00:58place for decades for a lot of ocean
- 1:01:01protection. And that's why
- 1:01:03we're talking about this today.
- 1:01:04The Trump administration has allowed Elon
- 1:01:07Musk and his Department of
- 1:01:10Government Efficiency, Doge,
- 1:01:11to go into various departments and go in
- 1:01:14and just essentially dismantle
- 1:01:16everything. It's a really
- 1:01:18interesting yet scary situation for a lot
- 1:01:21of the people. There have been
- 1:01:23accusations and these are
- 1:01:24only accusations at this point. I haven't
- 1:01:26seen any evidence of intimidation like
- 1:01:28this being accused of
- 1:01:29by Doge officials to essentially bully
- 1:01:32people into giving up
- 1:01:34whatever they have. There's been
- 1:01:36accusations of eliminating documents.
- 1:01:39There's been accusations of freezing
- 1:01:41funding. And there have
- 1:01:43been a lot of accusations of just these
- 1:01:45employees that are actually
- 1:01:46showing up on the department,
- 1:01:48like the EPA's staff list, and just kind
- 1:01:51of integrating
- 1:01:51themselves into the Environmental
- 1:01:53Protection Agency. Whether they qualify
- 1:01:55to be in the Environmental Protection
- 1:01:56Agency or NOAA or any of
- 1:01:58the other departments, we're not sure. We
- 1:02:00don't know who the people
- 1:02:01are. There have been a number
- 1:02:02of videos that have come out showing
- 1:02:04government officials trying
- 1:02:05to get into the EPA, trying to
- 1:02:07get into the Department of Education, and
- 1:02:10they're not allowed.
- 1:02:11They've been denied by security.
- 1:02:12They've been told, "Hey, we're going to
- 1:02:14get somebody. We'll figure this out, but
- 1:02:15you have to stay here.
- 1:02:16You have to stay outside and you have to
- 1:02:18wait." Obviously not ideal
- 1:02:19when members of Congress,
- 1:02:21members of the Senate cannot get access
- 1:02:23to find out what's happening
- 1:02:24with all of these departments.
- 1:02:26What cuts are happening? Where's the
- 1:02:28money going? Is it even
- 1:02:29legal to do some of these cuts?
- 1:02:32That's what's really happening here. And
- 1:02:34that's the scary part of
- 1:02:35this situation. So I'm going to
- 1:02:37run through some of the things that I've
- 1:02:38been able to gather and
- 1:02:40figure out what's been happening.
- 1:02:42So there's been a takeover at NOAA's
- 1:02:44headquarters in Virginia,
- 1:02:45highlighting a number of different
- 1:02:47concerns with potential impacts on
- 1:02:49weather forecasting,
- 1:02:49cybersecurity, and employee morale.
- 1:02:52It also touches upon the removal of
- 1:02:53diversity and inclusion materials and the
- 1:02:56broader implications
- 1:02:57of public access to crucial safety
- 1:02:59information during disasters.
- 1:03:01So there's been a lot of just
- 1:03:02things that have been happening that's
- 1:03:04kind of crazy. So with NOAA,
- 1:03:06some of the things that they
- 1:03:07look after, they look after the weather
- 1:03:09system, like weather forecasting, they
- 1:03:11look after sustainability
- 1:03:12and economics fisheries monitoring, they
- 1:03:14look after the Marine
- 1:03:15Mountain Protection Act falls
- 1:03:16under there, the Marine Sanctuaries Act
- 1:03:18also falls under there,
- 1:03:20ocean protection in general falls
- 1:03:22there. Not only within the exclusive
- 1:03:24economic zone of the US, including
- 1:03:26Alaska, including Hawaii,
- 1:03:28including the Gulf of Mexico, the
- 1:03:29Atlantic, and the Pacific, but also
- 1:03:30abroad. There's a lot of
- 1:03:31international work that's been done that
- 1:03:33have as of now has been halted. And I
- 1:03:37want to go through
- 1:03:37with some of the things
- 1:03:38that's going to happen. And I'll do that
- 1:03:40in just a sec. Before I want
- 1:03:41to just talk about the overall
- 1:03:42things, I talked about employee morale
- 1:03:44bring down the government wants to slash
- 1:03:4650% of NOAA employee
- 1:03:48staff. Doge, headed by Leland Musk, wants
- 1:03:51to slash 50% of the workforce for NOAA.
- 1:03:55So that's the 13,000
- 1:03:56people work there approximately, they
- 1:03:58want to bring it down to approximately
- 1:03:596,500. That eliminates
- 1:04:01one, a lot of jobs, but also
- 1:04:03eliminates a lot of the work that's been
- 1:04:05done by all those people. NOAA is a
- 1:04:07leader in research, in
- 1:04:09monitoring, in conservation.
- 1:04:11They set a lot of the times the standard
- 1:04:13because they have so much funding,
- 1:04:15because they have access to so many
- 1:04:17different types of oceanographic
- 1:04:18instrumentation. They work with other
- 1:04:20governments in international waters to
- 1:04:22understand not only their
- 1:04:24waters and what's happening
- 1:04:24in their waters, but also just understand
- 1:04:26weather patterns and climate change
- 1:04:27around the world. All of this is going to
- 1:04:30be eliminated. We're going to talk a
- 1:04:32little bit about what's happening in a
- 1:04:33bit. But yeah, essentially all these
- 1:04:35international government programs have
- 1:04:37been stopped. And I'm going to talk a
- 1:04:39little bit about that right now. So
- 1:04:40climate change and climate modeling. So
- 1:04:42NOAA collaborates, like I said, with
- 1:04:43international partners to do modeling and
- 1:04:45monitoring climate change systems. The
- 1:04:47studies include impacts of greenhouse
- 1:04:49gases, ocean heat uptake, sea level rise,
- 1:04:52and climate variability.
- 1:05:05So NOAA is a major role in monitoring the
- 1:05:08health of international waters through programs like the Argo Float System, which collect ocean temperature, salinity, and current data. Also collaborates in global initiatives such as the Global Ocean Observing System, GOOS, to track ocean health currents and the global climate change.
- 1:05:23They also take care of like monitoring
- 1:05:26shark populations. So we just did an
- 1:05:28interview over on the beyond jaws podcast
- 1:05:30talking about the updates to the sort of
- 1:05:33the overall stock assessment of the Ocean
- 1:05:36White Test. This is to make sure that everybody understands how the metric of ocean
- 1:05:36congrats could go. And so we historically just said this disconnect between the over target you mentioned down top, ocean perception, the andTrack defeated report that just won't happen. So we have a much better understanding of how this can be more common in therey compared to the ocean joint filming system, the first question one, so throughout this visit on ONLY This is to make sure that everybody
- 1:05:38understands how the white tip is doing
- 1:05:40all across the Pacific.
- 1:05:41So partners with various governments that
- 1:05:43may or may not have the resources to
- 1:05:45dedicate to finding such information.
- 1:05:47That helps in understanding the
- 1:05:49population of ocean white tips as well as
- 1:05:51the ecosystem health within those areas
- 1:05:53because they start to look at everything
- 1:05:55and it goes into more modeling,
- 1:05:57it goes into more shark population
- 1:05:58studies other than the ocean white tip.
- 1:06:01So having that ocean and coastal
- 1:06:02monitoring is very important.
- 1:06:03Fisheries and marine biodiversity, I just
- 1:06:04kind of touched upon that with the ocean white tip.
- 1:06:05NOAA conducts joint research on
- 1:06:08sustainable fisheries management,
- 1:06:10addressing overfishing and illegal,
- 1:06:12unreported and unregulated IUU fishing
- 1:06:15studies also focus on migratory fish
- 1:06:17stocks, marine biodiversity, coral reef
- 1:06:19health, particularly
- 1:06:20in shared ecosystems.
- 1:06:22They also take care of weather
- 1:06:23forecasting and severe weather research.
- 1:06:25All hurricane watches, all the tsunami
- 1:06:27watches, all those alert systems.
- 1:06:28All those alert systems, NOAA takes care
- 1:06:31of that, collaborates with international
- 1:06:33meteorological organizations to improve
- 1:06:35forecasting models for hurricanes,
- 1:06:37typhoons and other
- 1:06:38extreme weather events.
- 1:06:39Studies include atmospheric dynamics,
- 1:06:42storm patterns and global
- 1:06:43weather prediction models.
- 1:06:44The fifth one that they look at is the
- 1:06:46polar and Arctic studies, research on
- 1:06:48melting ice caps, changes in polar
- 1:06:50ecosystems and their implications of
- 1:06:53Arctic warming on the global climate.
- 1:06:54NOAA works closely with Arctic nations
- 1:06:56through the Arctic Council.
- 1:06:57The sixth is marine
- 1:06:59population and debris.
- 1:07:00They conduct studies on the sources and
- 1:07:02impacts of marine pollution, including
- 1:07:04microplastics and oil spills,
- 1:07:06collaborates with international partners
- 1:07:08on solutions to mitigate pollution, such
- 1:07:10as cleanup marine debris and monitoring
- 1:07:12ocean acidification.
- 1:07:13And then we talk about ocean
- 1:07:14acidification, which
- 1:07:15is the seventh program.
- 1:07:16Studies the impact of increased CO2
- 1:07:18levels on the marine ecosystem globally,
- 1:07:20including coral bleaching, shellfish
- 1:07:21survival and broader ecosystem impacts.
- 1:07:24Disaster preparedness and
- 1:07:25mitigation is the eighth program.
- 1:07:26They participate in studies on tsunami
- 1:07:28generation, propagation and impacts to
- 1:07:31improve warning systems and disaster
- 1:07:33response in coastal areas worldwide.
- 1:07:35Partnerships with countries in the
- 1:07:37Pacific and Indian oceans and strengthen
- 1:07:39early warning systems.
- 1:07:41Remember the tsunami of 2004? All those
- 1:07:43alert systems, even though they did a lot
- 1:07:45of damage, all those alert systems saves
- 1:07:47thousands and thousands of lives.
- 1:07:49And it's really important. All this
- 1:07:50elimination makes no sense.
- 1:07:51The Marine Mammal Endangered Species
- 1:07:53Conservation is the ninth program,
- 1:07:55conducts international research on the
- 1:07:56migration patterns and population
- 1:07:58dynamics of marine mammals like whales,
- 1:08:00sea turtles and other endangered species.
- 1:08:01Works to reduce bycatch and protect
- 1:08:04critical habitats across international
- 1:08:06waters. And last one,
- 1:08:08international capacity building.
- 1:08:09So NOAA supports capacity building
- 1:08:11initiatives in developing nations by
- 1:08:13sharing technology, training and
- 1:08:15expertise in oceanographic and
- 1:08:17atmospheric sciences.
- 1:08:19Provides support for regional
- 1:08:20organizations like the Caribbean
- 1:08:22Community Climate Change Center, the
- 1:08:23CCCCC, and others in
- 1:08:27the Pacific and Africa.
- 1:08:28So some of their key partnerships, United
- 1:08:30Nations Framework Convention on Climate
- 1:08:32Change, World Meteorological
- 1:08:33Organization, International Oceanographic
- 1:08:36Commission, the IOC, International
- 1:08:37Whaling Commission, the IWC, and the
- 1:08:39Global Earth
- 1:08:40Observations of Systems, the GEOES.
- 1:08:43That's a lot. That's a lot of
- 1:08:46international work that is essentially
- 1:08:48has been halted for the time being.
- 1:08:50I can't say if they are going to
- 1:08:51eliminate this on a permanent basis. It
- 1:08:53doesn't look like they want to help out
- 1:08:55things internationally.
- 1:08:56Let's talk for real here. This is going
- 1:08:59to affect a lot of things. I just talked
- 1:09:01a little bit about just to summarize
- 1:09:02going to fisheries monitoring,
- 1:09:03sustainability, economics of fisheries.
- 1:09:05It's going to affect weather forecasting
- 1:09:07and warning of natural disasters. It's
- 1:09:10going to affect the Marine Mammal
- 1:09:10Protection Act, which we'll get into in
- 1:09:12just a second. It's going to affect the
- 1:09:13Marine Sanctuaries Act. No new marine
- 1:09:16sanctuaries will be designated.
- 1:09:17It's also going to affect ocean
- 1:09:19protection in general. Now it's also
- 1:09:22going to affect the EPA. So we're looking
- 1:09:24at the EPA. They had their area stormed.
- 1:09:27It's going to affect the Clean
- 1:09:28Water Act, the Clean Air Act.
- 1:09:30We know that Trump went after this act
- 1:09:32before. He's taken away funding for the
- 1:09:35Inflation Act that was put in by Biden,
- 1:09:37which we don't even know if this is
- 1:09:39legal. We don't even know if the court
- 1:09:40systems will uphold this or not.
- 1:09:42There's going to have to be lawsuits.
- 1:09:43It's going to have to be settled in
- 1:09:44court. I have seen other things that the
- 1:09:47Trump administration has tried already. I
- 1:09:49know for like the DACA, I guess they call
- 1:09:51them dreamers, the people who are born
- 1:09:53here where their parents were not
- 1:09:54citizens. They tried to say that the
- 1:09:56people who were born here were not
- 1:09:58citizens and that didn't get upheld in
- 1:10:00court. It got shot down. Obviously
- 1:10:02there's a lot of different things that
- 1:10:04are going on, which makes it really,
- 1:10:05really dangerous when we start talking
- 1:10:07about these things in human rights. But
- 1:10:08we're talking about the environment
- 1:10:09today. We're going to focus on that.
- 1:10:10So hopefully the courts will uphold all
- 1:10:13of these mandates as they are in law.
- 1:10:16There's a reason why there's laws. You
- 1:10:18can't just go in and just cut at will and
- 1:10:20just say, hey, we've cut everything. We
- 1:10:22just did it what we thought was the best
- 1:10:24way to cut. And that's the way we did it
- 1:10:26without going through the rule of law,
- 1:10:28without going through ways to ensure that
- 1:10:30the stuff that was put in law before just
- 1:10:32can't be taken away with one swell swoop
- 1:10:34of a pen stroke or even just coming into
- 1:10:37an office and intimidating people. Right? That's a real problem.
- 1:10:39I've heard a number of different people
- 1:10:41talk about how this is a focus on
- 1:10:43fisheries and yes, this is a focus on
- 1:10:45fisheries. Fisheries will be affected and
- 1:10:46impacted by Noah. But the other thing
- 1:10:48that will be impacted is going to be oil
- 1:10:51and gas development. There are a lot of
- 1:10:54regulations within the exclusive economic
- 1:10:55zone with oil and a big part of that is
- 1:10:58the Marine Mammal Protection Act.
- 1:10:59You cannot harass or alter the direction
- 1:11:03of the migration route or just harm
- 1:11:06marine mammals that includes orcas that
- 1:11:09includes humpback whales, baleen whales,
- 1:11:11toothed whales, seals, sea lions and so
- 1:11:14forth and polar bears with oil and gas.
- 1:11:16So that means there's a lot of
- 1:11:18exploration that needs to happen.
- 1:11:19They have certain rules in and around
- 1:11:22those projects where they cannot harm or
- 1:11:25harass or change the route of a marine
- 1:11:28mammal. I've been on those before in
- 1:11:30Canada. It's actually even more strict in
- 1:11:32the US where you can't even mess around
- 1:11:34with sea lions or seals.
- 1:11:36That means the instrumentation that they
- 1:11:37use the big guns I've talked about on
- 1:11:38this podcast before they shoot sound down
- 1:11:40into the water, hit the bottom and
- 1:11:42reverberate back to see a picture
- 1:11:43underneath the water.
- 1:11:44Once they find those hydrocarbon
- 1:11:46deposits, that's a place where they're
- 1:11:48like, oh, maybe we can make a drill area
- 1:11:50here. You have to be careful in what you
- 1:11:52do. Like I said, you can't have any
- 1:11:54marine mammals within those areas.
- 1:11:56If they are, you have to shut off the
- 1:11:57guns. You have to wait until they leave.
- 1:11:59That would seriously hinder the
- 1:12:01development of oil and gas. And it has
- 1:12:02done in the past. Also, the drilling that
- 1:12:05is actually going on in the Arctic or
- 1:12:07anywhere in the exclusive
- 1:12:08economic zone of the US.
- 1:12:09You have to be careful of marine mammals
- 1:12:12and you have to make sure that they don't
- 1:12:14alter the migration path of these mammals
- 1:12:17or even seals like mammals, including
- 1:12:19polar bears, whales, seals and sea lions.
- 1:12:21There's a lot of regulation and the oil
- 1:12:23and gas industry hate it. And in fact,
- 1:12:25it's actually stopped them from doing
- 1:12:27certain things at certain times. Taking
- 1:12:29away or stripping the marine mammal
- 1:12:30protection act of its regulations will
- 1:12:32allow this oil and gas exploration to
- 1:12:34happen on a more regular basis without
- 1:12:37those types of regulations.
- 1:12:37It's really interesting because the Trump
- 1:12:39administration heavily criticized the
- 1:12:42offshore wind industry for causing noise
- 1:12:44for marine mammals and stop the offshore
- 1:12:46wind industry from developing further
- 1:12:49projects while they're allowing for
- 1:12:52approval harmful projects that emit noise
- 1:12:54on a regular basis within the ocean to
- 1:12:57affect marine mammals.
- 1:12:57The hypocrisy is just flowing like crazy.
- 1:13:02It's insane. But that's exactly what
- 1:13:04they're going for. No marine sanctuaries.
- 1:13:06That means you can explore oil and gas
- 1:13:08within any of the new proposed marine
- 1:13:10sanctuaries. It looks like the
- 1:13:13sanctuaries that are in now are free and
- 1:13:16safe from these types of disturbances and
- 1:13:19extraction for now. Who knows what they
- 1:13:22decide to do later on. So a lot of this
- 1:13:24is a big problem, right? A lot of this is a big problem.
- 1:13:26A lot of this is something that just
- 1:13:28screws with everything. And I wanted to
- 1:13:31touch upon something quickly. There have
- 1:13:33been times where we've seen this before.
- 1:13:36We've seen a cut in staff. Not to this
- 1:13:39amount, but we have seen it with the last
- 1:13:41Trump administration where they cut some
- 1:13:43programs or defund some programs, but not
- 1:13:45to this level. Again, not to this level,
- 1:13:48but happened in Canada under the Harper
- 1:13:49administration for Prime Minister Harper,
- 1:13:51where they went through and they decided
- 1:13:54to redesign and restructure the oil and gas industry.
- 1:13:55And they decided to redesign and
- 1:13:56restructure the programs because they
- 1:13:58want to change something within the
- 1:14:00fisheries act, which is fish habitat that
- 1:14:02we had to protect fish habitat. They just
- 1:14:04said rolling in to protect fisheries that
- 1:14:06have been established for more than 30
- 1:14:07years. And it could be for commercial
- 1:14:09recreational or aboriginal fisheries. So
- 1:14:11indigenous fisheries and they effectively
- 1:14:14changed the law with that change the law.
- 1:14:16They restructured the entire science
- 1:14:17sector and government sector within the
- 1:14:20environment Canada at the time and
- 1:14:21Department of Fisheries
- 1:14:22and Oceans at the time.
- 1:14:24I was there at the Department of
- 1:14:26Fisheries at the time working out of
- 1:14:27Burlington where I live now and I
- 1:14:29witnessed the change and it was horrible.
- 1:14:32They would bring people in like 2550 at a
- 1:14:35time. They would bring people in to an
- 1:14:37office and said your position has now
- 1:14:39been affected. In other words, we're not
- 1:14:41funding this position anymore because
- 1:14:42they were unionized. They were able to
- 1:14:44find other positions within the
- 1:14:46government, whether it's under the new
- 1:14:47department or the new sectors or if it's
- 1:14:50something older or somewhere else, but
- 1:14:52they would potentially have
- 1:14:53to move across the country.
- 1:14:53To be able to be a part of those sectors
- 1:14:56made it very difficult. Employee morale
- 1:14:59was very, very low and it wasn't until
- 1:15:01the Trudeau government came in had
- 1:15:03mandates where they actually read out the
- 1:15:04mandate for each of the departments and
- 1:15:06say, Hey, you know what? You are know
- 1:15:08exactly what you're doing. It sucked and
- 1:15:10it's going to suck for a lot of the
- 1:15:12people. Now, if you know somebody who's
- 1:15:13in the government, reach out to them.
- 1:15:14Sam, sorry you're going through this. I
- 1:15:16hope that it gets better over the next
- 1:15:18four years, but who knows what will
- 1:15:20happen. Well, the courts will hold it up or not. I'm not going to.
- 1:15:21But that's it for my time on today's
- 1:15:25episode. Obviously not good news that we
- 1:15:28see and hopefully it will get better.
- 1:15:30Hopefully, like I said, the courts will
- 1:15:31uphold the laws of the land and the laws
- 1:15:33of the sea and hopefully the funding will
- 1:15:36get back and people can get back to their
- 1:15:37jobs. But we're going to have to see. I'd
- 1:15:39love to hear your questions and comments
- 1:15:40on this episode to hit me up on Instagram
- 1:15:43at how to protect the ocean. Of course, don't forget to subscribe and hit that notification bell to hear all of the stuff that's coming out, not only the US, but worldwide of ocean.
- 1:15:51Thank you so much for joining me on
- 1:15:55today's episode of the how to protect the
- 1:15:57ocean. I'm your host, Andrew from the
- 1:15:58true North strong and free. Have a good
- 1:16:00day. I'll talk to you next
- 1:16:01time. Happy conservation.