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The Rise of The Kwantung Army with Author Quin Cho · Asian Adjacent

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: All right you guys. Hi, everybody, welcome to an notion
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: of Asiana. Jason.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: I'm James Lajina. I'm the Asian at Jason and I have,
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: of course my monthly guest.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: She comes in. We love her.
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: We talk about all kinds of stuff from Matricia Pontific,
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: from Pacific Atrocity's education, our girl Jenny Chan. I just hello.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: As some friends were like, oh my god, I love
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: you guys. Together we was a good time. Well, she
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: brought us a guest. I thought she's a good co host.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: She brought us a guest. And his book is called
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: The Rise of the Quaintung Army Japan Japan's Empire to
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Manchuria to nineteen thirty two, because ten years, ten years
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: before the whole Pearl Harbor stuff happened, a few years
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: before World War two even happened. Japan has some stuff
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: going on that wasn't the greatest and came to her
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: army and we're gonna talk about their their genis of power,
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: about Manchuria of course, uh, just parts of the Empire's
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: philicit on some of this stuff that went on there
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: in this fascinating book. How many welcome my guests, our
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: first guest of the show Quinn Show.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: Hi, Quinn, Hi, Nice to meet you.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: Nice for you too. So I wanted to say, show now,
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: how do you? How do you enjoy each other?
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: So I met Jenny by interning at her organization, Pacific
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: Atrocities Education in twenty twenty during the summer I wanted
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: to try to find an internship. It was between my
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: summer of my freshman sophomore year of college, and I
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: found this organization that talks about the shall we say
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: less spoken of atrocities and history of World War Two
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: in the Asia Pacific region, and me being someone who's
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: very interested in the Second World War and especially in
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: the Asia Pacific, I decided that it was a good
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: idea to sign up to be an intern and I
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: wrote my first book actually about the Burma Campaign of
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: World War Two, and then Jenny and I both decided
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: that it would be a good idea to write this
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: history about the Quantung Army, which here too four has
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: not been done in English until.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Now, never heard before. I never knew about it until
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: she brought up. So that's why I'm saying this is
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: something this is something new. I've heard some things She's
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: brought up, but this one I did not know. So
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: I'm very excited to hear more about this. Okay, So
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: what is it? Are you a student? Are you what
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: do you do?
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: So?
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  Speaker 3: I'm a fellow at PAE. I have signed a contract
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: starting in the beginning of twenty twenty four, and then
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: another one in twenty twenty five. I'm writing the second
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: volume of the history of the Quantung Army as of
• 2:49
  Speaker 3: right now. The first one was published in September. It's
• 2:52
  Speaker 3: on Amazon. If you want it, you read out the
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: title at the beginning of the show so people can
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: find it. And I'm a very excited to talk about
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: the Quantum Army today. And it's various exploits in the
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: Asia Pacific region in the twenties and thirties, and they've
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: run up to World War Two.
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: Now, wol asked Jenny, how did you find out about it?
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: Did you know about it already? You're going to bring
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: it to your attention.
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: I read about the Quantum Army in like various books,
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: but then it's always like a sentence or two or
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: a paragraph or two, and you actually don't know, like
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: what is the whole story? You know that on September eighteenth,
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: China was invaded, and then you hear about the Quantum
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: Army and how it was not obeying its superior and
• 3:41
  Speaker 4: then you wonder like, oh, there must be a whole
• 3:44
  Speaker 4: story in the gap. And then I was in a
• 3:47
  Speaker 4: rabbit hole and I was thinking like, Wow, this is
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: actually a very important story to tell, but there is
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: just left out. And Quinn, why do you think that's
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: left out now that now that you have dug into
• 3:59
  Speaker 4: it for so long.
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: I think there are multitude of reasons why the story
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: of the Quantung Army has not been told in English.
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: One is just a simple historiographical explanation in that all
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: the source material, the primary source material, where a lot
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: of it is in classical Japanese, which is today not
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: even really commonly read by a lot of Japanese people.
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: That's the first point. The second point, which I think
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: is more salient in America even than that, is that
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: in the aftermath of the Second World War, during the
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: Cold War, it was not politically convenient to discuss the
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: Quantung Army and its role during the Second World War,
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: or Manchukuo, the puppet state that it founded, in its
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: role in the Second World War in East Asia, because
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: there were certain members of either who were in the
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: Quantung Army or affiliated with it in the state of
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: the so called State of Manchuquo was a puppet state
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: that rose to prominence in post war in Japan, which
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: was a US ally during the Cold War and containing
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: China and the Soviet Union and North Korea. And I
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: think that it was given that Japan became America's ally,
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: and that there were certain figures that were affiliated with
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: the Quantung Army and its puppet state Manchuquo that were
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: useful in the Japanese government. The history of the Quantung
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: Army and its various atrocities against the Chinese were swept
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: under the rug.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: And you know that, you know, like history, our history.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: You know what we're told is China's the big bad
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: wolf always and forever. Amen, Right, that's what we does
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: that we're taught to hear an opposite view that one
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: of the Japanese came in and did this to it,
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: came to did this to them. That's a that's an
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: eye opener for many of us, like what h what.
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: This is right? This is right? So was it? I
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: was it outputting for you two when you were when
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: you were learning about this.
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: For me in particular, no, because I've had a long
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: standing interest in the history of the Second World War
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: and military history and the Asia Pacific theater.
• 6:38
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: But I think for a good many people, you know,
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: it would probably be a surprise given the image many
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: people have of Japan as this land of pokemon and
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: anime and soft power exports. And maybe for perhaps those
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: were more than no they know of Article nine of
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: the Japanese Constant Tuition, which essentially prohibits Japan from making
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: aggressive war. But the reason Article nine exists in a
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: sense is directly because of Japan's previous extreme aggression in
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: the Asia Pacific region, especially during World War Two, but
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: even before that. And my book actually kind of delves
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: into the previous history before the Second World War with
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: regards to Japan's takeover of Korea and then the Aldolan Peninsula,
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: the First Sino Japanese War of eighteen ninety four ninety five,
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: Russell Japanese War of nineteen oh four and five, and
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: all the I guess you might say political intrigue in
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: geopolitical intrigue in Manchuria in the nineteen tens and twenties
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: before the big event on September eighteenth, nineteen thirty one.
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: I want to folks to read the bok. So we're
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: gonna give everything away, but I want I want to
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: ask you a few questions about the book. So I
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: want people up. I want you to just give it
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: like a cliff Notes version or a few things. But
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: I want folks to actually get the book. I right
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: know somebody who I saw them about this. They're interesting,
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: so they probably up higg the books below. I will
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: put the leak to go to Amazon, you know, go
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: get it. Welle of things want to ask you about
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: it's just actually them coming to power. So I mean, like,
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: how long did it takes them to come of power?
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: It wasn't a short time, you know. Just talk about that.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: The beginnings, the beginnings of this.
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a very good question. When is the beginning right?
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: This was actually a question that I had to grapple
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: with as I wrote the book. And actually it was
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: in September of twenty twenty four I told Jenny, I
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: actually think I need some more time here to write
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: this kind of beginning to the book, to kind of
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: contextualize everything that happens, and just and I talk about
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: actually things going back to the eighteen fifties and sixties,
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: even the eighteen forties with the First Opium War, and
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: why China, despite being this large civilization with a long
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: continuous history, was so weak for a period of about
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: one hundred years in more recent times, right, and why
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: Japan was relatively stronger than China. But we're to answer
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: about the Quantung Army specifically. I think that the first
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: I guess it kind of I get a set to
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: power of the Quantung Army. You might say it's kind
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: of birth into existence occurs in nineteen oh six after
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: the Russo Japanese War, when it's created to defend this
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  Speaker 3: area that Japan got as a part of the Treaty
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: of Portsmouth. It had been a Russian called Nialdom Peninsula
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  Speaker 3: and also the South Manchuria Railway, and the Quantung Army
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: was supposed to defend these installations and make sure that
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: they didn't get attacked by the Russians in particular, or
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: even the Chinese. But various events, most notably the Chinese
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: Revolution of nineteen eleven and the subsequent fracturing of China
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: and its division into a variety of different warlord states,
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: made it vulnerable and made it a tempting target for
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: the Quantung Army, which gained greater independence from Tokyo in
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: nineteen nineteen because of an administrative reform by the then
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: Japanese Prime Minister Hada Ki, who dismantled the previous system
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: that had a governor general as the head of the
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: administrative apparatus that ran in the Album Peninsula and the
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: Quantung Army as well, and he actually separated the military
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: and civilian spheres into separate commands. And basically what this
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: did was this gave the Quantung Army greater independence and
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: less oversight from the civilian government in Tokyo, and this
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  Speaker 3: gave rise to even more shall we say, political intrigue
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  Speaker 3: throughout the nineteen twenties and culminating in nineteen thirty one.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: I want to ask Jenny a question, Greg and I'll
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: get back to you with a second.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: And you know, Jenny, as you as you're collecting all
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: of these stories because you're because you're collecting, you for
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: your network and even for yourself, you want to learn
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: this stuff. Why isn't it fascinating that a lot of
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: this stuff happened around nineteen hundred to like nineteen fifty.
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: I think it's just interesting to me that a lot
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: of things happen that we don't even know about. Some
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: things we don't know about, some we don't know about,
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: Like for the first like fifty years of that century,
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of stuff that happened within the Asian
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: region and everything did that.
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And it's also interesting that a lot of I was,
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: we're making Instagram posts about, for example, the Philippines, and
• 12:19
  Speaker 4: a lot of that actually happened in the beginning of
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: nineteen hundred, at the end of eighteen hundred. And at
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: the same time, I think Quinn can go more into it.
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: Like what Quinn was saying, a lot of these powers
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: in the West were basically seeking to in a way
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: seek hegemony in like the world is kind of a
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: not world domination, but more like seeking regional power. And
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: their way to do it is to well, I don't
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: know if that's a correct word, but dominate others and
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: kind of enslave other you know, to kind of colonize
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: other regions in the world to get it done. And
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: so there's a lot of things that was happening in
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: the late like nineteen hundred. And I was also reading
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: not late nineteen hundred, late eighteen hundred, and I was
• 13:14
  Speaker 4: also reading about open door policy. America did not quite
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: have the skill set to, for example, really dominate this
• 13:25
  Speaker 4: race to take advantage of China, and so then they
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: cut it up like a melon, and so all the
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: European powers were taking advantage of it. And of course,
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: like what Quinn was saying, there was also the opium factor,
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: so a bunch of people were a drug addicted and
• 13:42
  Speaker 4: so then it was not the strongest country. And so
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: then on top of that you have all these foreign powers.
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: It was just a ripe situation to basically be colonized
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: in a sense. And they didn't even take the opium
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: habit until like nineteen forty nine, right until I would
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: say that Mao took over China and was basically like okay,
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: China for the Chinese and no more of this nonsense.
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, it was the Communist Party of China
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: that did have the most effective anti drug campaign. There
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: were nominal, I guess pretenses towards eliminating the drug trade
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: in previous years and decades. Even the Quantung Army, which
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: was actually very much involved in trafficking drugs in the
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: nineteen thirties in Manchuquo and utilized the opium monopoly it
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: established to legally distribute opium and raise funds for the
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: construction of a military industrial complex in Manchuquo, its puppet state.
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: Even it was ostensibly against the drug trade and in
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: favor of limiting the drug trade, but in practice this
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: was not the case. The monopoly, as well as official,
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: i guess subtly sanctioned, elicit channels of trade also existed
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: and this was actually a key source of revenue for
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: the Quantung army and a great source of peril and
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: oppression for China. More generally, it was the forcing of
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: these drugs on China throughout it up until nineteen forty nine.
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: That was kind of how it was for China.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: Don't we include the whole thing with Hong Kong and
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: Britain and all that is now.
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: Part of the eff Yes, so seventy percent of the
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: opium trade was with Britain, and so if you think
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: about it, Queen Victoria was basically like the biggest you know,
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: dealer in the whole, in the whole modern history. And
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: then you also have you know, this is what I
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: recently found out did you know that like John Carrey's
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: granduncle and like FDRs grandpa were friends, they were professional
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: friends because they were both trading opium in China and
• 16:29
  Speaker 4: like America at the time, also, you know, it's not
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: quite innocent in this drug trading because America in the
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: Revolution needed money, the industrialization needed money, and so in
• 16:42
  Speaker 4: order for them to kind of uh to make that money,
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: they need to sell dope. Crazy, isn't that crazy?
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: What's even crazier is that the Quantum Army was the
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: one who eventually took up the mantle of selling drugs
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: in the thirties. In particular, that there was the British
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: who yes started the trade, and the Americans as well
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: were involved throughout the eighteen forties and throughout the nineteenth
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: century and into the twentieth, but then the Quantung Army
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: really took up the bantle of the opium trade and
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: was growing it and selling it and mat chukwuo and
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: also smuggling it into northern China. That it was a very,
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: i guess, rather very serious and dire time for China
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: the century between or roughly the century between eighteen forty
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: two and nineteen forty nine.
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: And there's also this situation where they basically took over
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: the Qing dynasty, but then there was actually not really
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: a central leadership. There all kinds of light warlords emerging,
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: and certain warlords wanted to involve more with Japan and
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: take more of the Japanese money, so then there were
• 18:11
  Speaker 4: more of a puppet than others. And when you want
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: to go into that, you want to go into that, yes,
• 18:18
  Speaker 4: of course.
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: So one of the most important warlords in the nineteen
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: tens and nineteen twenties in China as a fellow by
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: the name of Johan du Lin or the Old Marshall
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: in English might be a more easy to remember name.
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: The Old Marshal was the head of this clique called
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: the Funk ten Click was a clique of warlords that
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: had a large army behind it, and it was based
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: in Manchuria, northeast China and was near the Kwantung Army
• 18:51
  Speaker 3: and the Yaldong Peninsula which I mentioned the beginning of
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: the show and the after the instruction of this other
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: warlord named Duan Chi Rey's Army in nineteen twenty in
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: the Anhui Juli War of which the Funk Keen Click
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: took part, Jongs Warden went to the Japanese and went
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: to the Quantung Army and reached out and basically sought
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: their support and sought their sponsorship. The Japanese up to
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: that point had primarily, though not entirely, supported Duantiray and
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: his so called Anhui Click and thereafter Jong did get
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: the support of the Quantung Army in the Japanese throughout
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: the much of the nineteen twenties, most notably in the
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: Second funk Ken Juli War. So he started fighting the
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: Juli Klik who had been his allies, I want to
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: say nineteen twenty five, and then also in the it
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: might have been nineteen twenty four, you have to the
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: fact check beyond that. And then also the guals owning affair,
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: which was this rebellion by his subordinate and these in
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: these instances, the Quantung Army came to jung Zwodin's aid.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: They supported him, despite actually the government in Tokyo not
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: approving of this. However, by nineteen twenty eight, Dung Zwardein
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: had done a variety of things that were threatening the
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: Quantung Armies in Japan's position, as the Quantung Army perceived it,
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: most notably building Chinese owned railroads, infrastructure, and also Chinese
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: sponsoring Chinese owned industries and enterprises. And what this meant
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: was that the Quantung Army, or a colonel within the
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: Quantung Army named Komoto Daisaku unilaterally took it upon himself
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: to assassinate Jong. He dissassinated him in nineteen twenty eight,
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: unilaterally without permission from his own government.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: But I mean, so, okay, wait a minute, this is
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: this is almost comparable to the wild wild West. Basically, yes,
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: very much. So yeah, I mean I could use the
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: word West because we call it called the Orient the East.
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: But you know what I mean, Like, it's basically people
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: are going rogue and do what they want power people,
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: and well besides something today people do what they want
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: and want power and that that's it.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: It's all about power. That's all there is there. Ye.
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: Well, and also you know, quinn I when I first
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: when I first came across the word warlord, I didn't
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: understand what it is. So maybe some of the listeners
• 21:38
  Speaker 4: don't understand what, yeah, what a warlord is. So can
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: you can you go into.
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: That of course? So a warlord basically is someone who
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: doesn't have the nominal recognized political authority of a central
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: government in generally speaking, but they have an army and
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: have de facto if not did your control over a
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: certain region of a country, and they do so because
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: they have an army and the very in the command
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: and control infrastructure, in the military industry, or support from
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: foreign powers to maintain their army and maintain their political
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: authority over territory. That's, in short, what a warlord is.
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: And Johns winning was definitely the old marshal. It's definitely
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: a warlord. I think that it is important to talk
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: about what the Quantung Army. The most notable thing they did,
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: the most notable instance of them going rogue was the
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: so called Mukden incident, where again it was two colonels
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: in the Quantung Army, not generals. Colonels are the rank
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: immediately below general. They weren't even the commander of the
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: Quantum Army. They were on the Quantom Army's staff, a
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: guy named lieutenant Colonel Ishiwara Kanji in another named Colonel
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: Itagaki se Shiro. They planned and for two years to
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: basically invade Manchuria, and on September eighteenth they brought their
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: plan to fruition in the form of conducting a false
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: flag attack on the Japanese owned South Manchuria Railway. They
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: blamed the old Marshall's son, jiangsu Yan, who inherited his
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: father's position as the head of the funk ten clique
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: and the warlord of Manchuria, and they proceeded to use
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: their supposed Chinese destruction of this their Japanese owned railway
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: to invade Manchuria, which it did progress series of kind
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: of fits and starts, but eventually this is basically what happened.
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: It was a false flag attack used to justify the
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: quantung Arby's unilateral, largely rogue invasion of Northeast China in
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: nineteen thirty one. This is by far the most important
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: thing the quantung Arby did. It is the reason why
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: everything else happens that eventually happens in the thirties that
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: I'm writing about right now. It leads to the foundation
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: of Manchukuo, leads eventually to the Second Sinal Japanese War,
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: and then eventually it leads to the Second sign Sinal
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: Japanese War, leads to Pearl Harbor. This book den incident
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: in September nineteen thirty one is the beginning of a
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: long road that ends in Pearl Harbor. The war in
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: the Asia Pacific region.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you'll thinking back for when do you finished
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: that bulling to come back for that one?
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: Forgot about that one?
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: And can you imagine, like, you know, just state is
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: so weak and I just wanted to chime in on this.
• 25:11
  Speaker 4: The state is so weak that like overnight, you know
• 25:14
  Speaker 4: that you can stage someone can go stage your attack,
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: and then like overnight, then you're a suddenly a colony
• 25:22
  Speaker 4: and you're an occupied country. Yeah, it's it's a very
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: like it's a very interesting thing to think about because
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: it could happen.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: And the thing what I think about this is what
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: are you saying?
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: Jennikins I and I chuckled because I feel like all
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: over the world we seen this happen, and it's it's
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: it's a system of like who thinks about stuff like
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: this and wants to overtake things and colonize and folks
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: just live their lives. They're just like have a good time,
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: you know, doing their you know, doing their own thing.
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: And so it's kind of like a contrast of both
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: of both kind of worlds where there's some worlds where
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: also abody expansion expansion. I just want to, you know,
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: overtake everything, and other folks like, well, our it's our area.
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: We're happy here and we live our lives whatever. So
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: it's kind of a it's funny that Jenny says that,
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: I say, it's so true.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: It happens.
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: I was all over the place where people there's some
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: folks just like I'm driving forward and I want this
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: and I want that land, and they go they go in.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: It's like and and I guess in some of these
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: instances there's no.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: True equality in it.
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: The one state is because then the other gets gobbled up, right,
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: it gets totally gabbled up and overtaken. That's been interesting
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: for you, Quinn, to read about the things they were doing.
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: They're like they're coming in region and now that you know,
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: like they fight out and they all of a sudden
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: they won or whatever.
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: It's very interesting, wasn't it to read it? To research
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: all that.
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was definitely interesting to read about and to
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: write about.
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: For certain.
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: It was a big undertaking, of course, and it took
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: a lot of time and a lot of effort. But
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: I'm i think it's worth doing because this is the
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: first English language history of this. Really, this is I
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: think something that is a you know that is original.
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: So how are you, well mentionin your question, sorry, how
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: this match? Just this? How are you getting through the
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: old text and that's from the old classical Japanese or
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: or I don't think I don't even find things in Chinese. Also,
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: my my, my, my mom's from Cantonesean. You speak Mandarin, and.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: It's always always all you know people at home, the
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: different kinds of languages in China. I'm just like, it's so, yeah,
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: how are you getting through that in your research?
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: Well?
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: I had the help of a translator. That's notable, but
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: it was very interesting to see the translated documents on
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: my computer and see them kind of come to life
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: in English. There aren't many Japanese people today who can
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: read classical Japanese. I think that's a very important nuance.
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: Hasn't got that, No, it's quite It's quite interesting because
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: I asked someone who knows Japanese and know Chinese, and
• 28:20
  Speaker 4: like the current day Japanese is closer to English in
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: the way that like they spell things in Katakana. So
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: then when I go because the US had occupied Japan,
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: and so then if I go to like Japan, I
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: would like read the katakana and then like try to
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: sound it out. And it sounds silly, but.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: That's what I do.
• 28:39
  Speaker 4: But then in like, the classical Japanese is actually closer
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: to Chinese, and they use more of Chinese words. So
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: if you like, if someone understands Japanese and understand Chinese,
• 28:52
  Speaker 4: then they may be able to dissect it and like
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: just be patient and like try to dissect it. Do
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: you think that's like, uh, that's accurate to describe.
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that in a sense it is. I
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: think that there are a few people who can read
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: classical Japanese, my translator being one of them, but I
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: think that it is on the whole very difficult. There
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: aren't many Japanese people who can read it today. And
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: given that that's the case, I think that you know,
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: in history, this goes back to kind of the first
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: constraint that we talked about earlier to writing a book
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: about the quantum army. In history, there is a very
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: in the discipline, there is a very kind of ironclad
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: professional sense of like, well, if you can't read the
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: original text language yourself, you can't write a book about
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: the subject. And to me, and I think to Jenny
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: as well, I think that it was very that's a
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: very narrow and ridge view, and that's I think something
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: that is maybe could be you could find even if
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: you can't read the original text yourself. I think that
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: it is useful still to write a work that is
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: about an army that has never that is very important,
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: that has literally never been written about in English. There's
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: an element of originality in that. And if you're able
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: to piece together the right primary and secondary sources to
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: your ability, I think that you can do a reasonably
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: good job. And if someone can do better and build
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: off what I did and they know they can read
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: classical Japanese and they have an angle and angles that
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: I do not, I think that would be excellent. I
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: think that would be a great thing for the proliferation
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: of this history in general.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: I I just want to say, I mean, we have
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: to actually wrap up and say so fact, it's by
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: so fast. The thing is, I want people out there
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: because I have a lot of people who watch who
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: we who are of Japanese descent or Chinese descent, or
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: and you don't speak you don't speak any of the language.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: Does the mean you can't write a book on something
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: and it's still it's still your history, it's still our history.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: It's still history. It's like it doesn't matter. You get help,
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: You get someone to help you with that. That's how
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: you do it. I mean, you know, so I agree
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: with you guys on that it shouldn't It should not matter.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: The point is you're getting help, you're bringing it to life,
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: and you're doing something Quinn's. I mean, I mean, I'm
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: gona give you some points there because you're doing something.
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: That's so it's the first, but how many times can
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: we get to be the first of something? I mean,
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: you're being you're being the first of somebody bringing us
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: to an English language, and you're brought to me now
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: and now bring it to my viewers and my listeners,
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: so now they're gonna hear about it.
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: And I think that's that's a great thing, Quinn. So
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: thank you for all the hard work you're doing.
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having me on.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: Jenny's the best. I mean, it was, it was great.
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: So I mean, thank you Jenny also for bringing it
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: to our attention, because I think it's I don't want
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: to say the book out loud again. And I'm gonna
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: share by gus this and I'm gonna put the leak blow.
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: It's the Rise of the Quainton Army in Japan's Empirementaria
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: to nineteen thirty two. It's on Kendle, It's on audiobook,
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: it's on paperback. Quinn Show is the author who is
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: our buddy. Right here, you have to leave your house.
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: Just go on your phone, your tablet, get it. You
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: don't go nowhere.
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: You don't need to sit in traffic. Yeah, that's right.
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: It's in your hands and we'll have them back again
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: for later for when you have that, when you find
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: you the second book done and all that out you
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: think on the show talk about it. So thank you
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: Quinn and Jenny, of course, I mean you're the best,
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: and thanks for bringing him to our attention. Jenny and
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: I will be back next month with another subject we'll
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: talk about with the subject will be we find we
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: will figure it out.
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: But we were.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: She's here with us once a month on the show
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: and we talk about all such interesting stuff that you
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: should know about. You should know about this kind of stuff. Jenny.
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: A last words before we signed.
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: Out so much for having us, That's.
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: My pleasure, you guys. I'm James Junior.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: Jason is on all the streaming service platforms from Apple Audible,
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: there's no Google, Apple Audible, cast Box, Deezer, iHeartRadio, Spotify,
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: and of course this video is on the granddaddy of
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: them all, YouTube at jail j Media, my channel. She
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: got off our previous week put outposts every week. I
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: have an episode coming out about presidential candidates who are
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Asian in America that's coming out next uh, and then
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: this will be out after that, so stay tuned for those.
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: I'm James Eugenia. We'll talk to you next time.