Latest / Beyond Fulfillment Podcast / Surviving the Startup Rollercoaster: Purpose, Timing, and Mental Health with Ashwin Gulati

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Surviving the Startup Rollercoaster: Purpose, Timing, and Mental Health with Ashwin Gulati · Beyond Fulfillment Podcast

• 0:00
  Today we sit down with Ashwin Galati, a seasoned entrepreneur, investor and coach.
• 0:06
  With nearly three decades in the startup trenches, Ashwin has helped launch and scale multiple ventures.
• 0:13
  Known for his expertise in both the business mechanics and the human side of building something from nothing, we'll discuss his powerful new book, Soul A True Life and Death Journey into the Startup Culture.
• 0:27
  Ashwin doesn't just talk business, he he explores the internal battles, the mental health challenges and the importance of timing, co founder relationships and building the right support system.
• 0:39
  He'll challenge conventional wisdom about passion, share hard won insights on failures, and introduce his own concept of scrit, a blend of grit and scrappiness.
• 0:51
  As always, if you found value from this content, please please like and subscribe in today's business environment, optimizing your efficiency is critical.
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• 2:40
  All right, Ashwin Gulati, welcome to Beyond Fulfillment.
• 2:45
  Thank you.
• 2:46
  Thank you Dave.
• 2:47
  Great to be here.
• 2:48
  Absolutely.
• 2:49
  We appreciate you taking the time.
• 2:51
  So Ash Ashwin, we're here discussing your new book that you just released and it's a business book and of course this show is all about business but your book and for everyone, the book is called Soul A True
• 3:07
  Life and Death Journey into the Startup Culture and it's a very different business book and based mainly about things people don't talk about in terms of business and startups.
• 3:22
  So can you just give us a breakdown of what the book's about?
• 3:26
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 3:28
  So yeah, as I say in the book, it's not just a business book.
• 3:31
  Right?
• 3:31
  It's a little bit More.
• 3:34
  And I wrote this book over a course of a very long time, I would say close to 20 years, believe it or not.
• 3:40
  And I've been in the entrepreneurial trenches for almost three, three decades.
• 3:45
  And the book is about both the internal sort of journey that an entrepreneur goes through that we don't talk about and they can't fully admit it in public or share the details with investors, and also the outside journey,
• 4:00
  the real business challenges and what I call the X factors that a lot of people don't talk about.
• 4:05
  Right.
• 4:06
  So I kind of put all that together in kind of a hybrid memo and a business sort of knowledge share book.
• 4:14
  And it's been really well received and I'm really proud of it, actually.
• 4:20
  Okay.
• 4:21
  And so let's dive into that because I feel like, like you said, it's really not talked about enough.
• 4:31
  And you know, I have heard and even some guests on the show have recently have talked more so about the mental health aspect and depression and all these other things that maybe at one point were taboo, but there's
• 4:44
  certainly talked about more now.
• 4:46
  But why don't we just dive into that?
• 4:48
  So the internal journey of a startup founder, how would you characterize that?
• 4:54
  The first question I ask, even myself and everyone actually I talk to that are founders is, why are you doing this?
• 5:02
  Why are you starting this business?
• 5:04
  And obviously the answer is great product idea, great market opportunity, always wanted to start my own business, et cetera.
• 5:11
  But when you start going down in the theirs and you try to figure out exactly why someone is starting a business, because, you know, there are a lot of studies that show it's, it's an exercise in insanity.
• 5:23
  Right?
• 5:23
  I mean, you're gonna not make any money for a lot of years, you're gonna not sleep, and yet, you know, you're all in.
• 5:30
  What I've learned is, you know, there's a lot of like, personal drivers that people don't talk about.
• 5:35
  You know, some, you know, they call trying to find meaning in life or kind of make an impact in the world.
• 5:41
  And, and I think all those are great.
• 5:43
  And I've learned that there's a lot of drivers, you know, from, you know, not being able to fit in or wanting to do something special or make an impact that they don't want to really talk about.
• 5:54
  So I think it's called shadow work in today's world.
• 5:57
  And there are a lot of consultants that do that.
• 6:00
  So part of the, the part of the book is about really looking inward and trying to figure out why you're doing it.
• 6:07
  And then, you know, go ahead and do it, but then surround yourself with the right people.
• 6:11
  Not just business, but personal sort of core support team that can help you.
• 6:16
  And you know, today, you know, in Silicon Valley, not everyone has an executive coach and, you know, support and advisors.
• 6:24
  And in my view, it's kind of like a glorified therapy sessions.
• 6:28
  And I think every, every founder should have a therapist and a coach and a nutritionist, you know, you know, next to them from the beginning.
• 6:37
  Right.
• 6:38
  So I feel that there's a lot of things that founders should look into.
• 6:42
  And, and you're right, there's a lot of mental health issues related to startups.
• 6:49
  You know, if you studies show a very large percentage, you know, have, you know, either bipolar disorder or adhd, and, you know, there's a lot of things in there which are not necessarily bad, but just need to be
• 7:01
  sort of aware of the fact that those are drivers too, not just business drivers.
• 7:07
  Right.
• 7:07
  So that's, that's kind of the internal side of it and the external side of it is, you know, business plans have a sort of a formula to them.
• 7:19
  And you know, there's the technology, there's a product market fit, and there's, you know, there's a lot of, you know, IP and funding on the things, the key components of, of, of a business that you need to put
• 7:30
  together, you know, is very, very standard.
• 7:34
  And sure, every business has its nuances, but then what I talk about in the book is a lot of the X factors or a lot of things that kind of people underestimate or overestimate.
• 7:45
  And I really, I really spend a lot of time on it.
• 7:50
  And so I brought in things that, unconventional things people don't really talk about, things that I've learned from my experience as why, you know, a lot of startups that I've been involved with and worked with, founders have failed,
• 8:05
  even though they checked all the boxes.
• 8:08
  And I put it all together in this book and I think it's, it's kind of a good hybrid.
• 8:14
  Okay, so let's, let's dig a little deeper into that.
• 8:18
  So, you know, clearly you said there's, there's stuff that's underestimated, right?
• 8:23
  Or overlooked.
• 8:24
  I mean, what do you think the, the number one in your experience and the people you've, you've worked with, what do you think the number one aspect of starting and growing a business that, that most entrepreneurs, I guess,
• 8:39
  overlook or underestimate.
• 8:43
  So let's say I think there are two sides to this.
• 8:46
  One is.
• 8:47
  Depends on the stage of the company.
• 8:48
  Right.
• 8:49
  But in the beginning, I'd say that, you know, a lot of the founders I've worked with have partners.
• 8:59
  And partners are like, you have like the inside guy and the outside guy, right?
• 9:02
  And you have the tech, the sales you have, and those are very important to have.
• 9:08
  And one of the things I've noticed is as the company grows, you know, that relationship really needs to get more and more solid because anything that happens in that relationship is like the foundation.
• 9:19
  And so I think there's a, there's a lot of, lot to be said about making sure that the founders don't get into a disagreement or a fight or.
• 9:29
  Because when that happens, I mean, you can really kind of kiss the startup goodbye for a while at least, because those are, that's the foundation.
• 9:37
  But then I ask myself, you know what, if you check all the boxes, you've got all the money, you've got, you've got all the, you know, the product and product market fit and investors.
• 9:50
  One thing I think everyone really kind of overlooks is the timing of their idea and their product.
• 9:59
  Right.
• 10:00
  And sometimes they're either too early and they are spending their time educating the customers and the sales cycle is very long, or they're too late and they're in this competitive battle.
• 10:12
  And so I think being able to dial in what needs to be done, given the timing of the solution actually has been something that I've seen as the number one criteria for sort of the bumpiness in the road.
• 10:26
  People are like, my God, I've got five customers and the product works and why aren't more people buying it?
• 10:33
  And I think there's a lot to be said about timing of the product and the solution.
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• 11:06
  Ah, so that's interesting.
• 11:07
  Yeah.
• 11:08
  So, and like, I mean, we hear so much too, as far as like the, let's just call it the cliche business advice out there.
• 11:19
  Like so much of it is about it's, it's the founder, right?
• 11:22
  Obviously the business, but the founder itself is so important and their grit and their persistence and their ability to endure pain and you know, etc.
• 11:32
  Etc.
• 11:33
  Right.
• 11:33
  Especially endure pain.
• 11:35
  Yes.
• 11:35
  100%.
• 11:37
  Yeah.
• 11:37
  So but now, when you say the timing, how.
• 11:41
  Because so many times, right, Businesses, right, It might be in a category, a large category where there's numerous businesses, and it's a legacy category, and it's been going on for, for a number of years or decades.
• 11:53
  So how, how, what, what's the best way, I guess, to.
• 11:57
  If that's the number one element that's overlooked, like, how would someone dial that in and make sure that they're starting this or this.
• 12:06
  It is the right timing.
• 12:07
  Now that, that is a really good question.
• 12:10
  And, and it's the holy grail, in my opinion, for an established company going into market.
• 12:15
  Right?
• 12:16
  Let me give you some examples, right, about timing.
• 12:18
  Like, it's, it's part of my book.
• 12:20
  But some of the companies that didn't really have a very good business plan made it huge because of their timing, you know, like, like, you know, Uber or Airbnb, you know, I mean, their timing was perfect.
• 12:34
  2008, you know, I mean, it was just like perfect timing.
• 12:37
  And other companies back, you know, going back 10, 15 years that had like the perfect product and, you know, hundreds of millions in funding like Webvan and, you know, pets.com, all those companies were just too late to the
• 12:51
  game, right?
• 12:52
  So the one way I think timing, it's hard to figure it out perfectly, but one way is, you know, and this is not, you know, my, you know, my invention, but I, There's a thing called the 9x effect
• 13:06
  that I, that I read about and I talk about in my book, and it is that the customer and the entrepreneur or the founder are like nine times removed from reality.
• 13:16
  And here's what I mean by that.
• 13:18
  The founder believes genuinely and has like, data points to say that their product or service is three times better than what the customer is currently doing.
• 13:30
  Saves them time, saves them money and so forth.
• 13:34
  The customer, on the other hand, feels, but doesn't always share it, that, you know, I don't really want to change things.
• 13:43
  Or they're three times okay, you know, three times more removed from the founder that they're okay with their current solution, right?
• 13:51
  So that whole time of, of trying to close a deal that they think is going to take three months, the founders do end up taking six and nine months.
• 13:59
  And that turns into this big, huge Runway battle or how long can the company keep going before the sales come in, right?
• 14:07
  So one way of going about that is to really, really make sure that I call it, you know, nail it before you scale it is, you know, just make sure you have at least 10, 15 customers in different
• 14:19
  categories that you've been with for a while and you've got the case studies and their references and then go for it.
• 14:26
  Right.
• 14:27
  And lot of, a lot of founders pulled the trigger very soon because they're excited about getting to market and, and investors want them to.
• 14:36
  So that's kind of a tricky balance in my opinion.
• 14:41
  Okay, you also talked to about.
• 14:48
  Most people aren't prepared for what a startup will do to them.
• 14:55
  Right, right.
• 14:55
  Can you, can you just talk more, more about that?
• 15:00
  You know, it's an all consuming lifestyle and it's very exhilarating.
• 15:06
  You know, it's exciting.
• 15:07
  It's like you wake up in the morning and there's so much to do.
• 15:11
  You know, I think what it does to, to someone is that it's kind of becomes an addiction and adrenaline and you're excited about, you know, your, your company, but it really throws you off balance.
• 15:26
  Right?
• 15:27
  It's, it's, you're spending long, long hours, sometimes you know, 15 hour days and you end up working a lot in the company and not as much on the company.
• 15:37
  And so you kind of get into this vicious cycle that you can't really grow and until you have some sort of attraction and at the same time you need help to grow, it really has an effect mentally.
• 15:49
  I've seen this, you know, in many, many founders.
• 15:51
  They don't really share this in business meetings, but I've noticed that, I always say that the reason people want to get into a startup is because they want freedom.
• 16:01
  They want freedom from working for somebody and freedom of their own schedules.
• 16:08
  And two years into it, they realize they don't have freedom.
• 16:12
  In fact, the reason they want to get out of the startup is because they want their freedom back.
• 16:15
  Right?
• 16:16
  Because now they have 20 investors.
• 16:18
  That's 20 bosses instead of one boss before.
• 16:21
  And there's so much to do.
• 16:23
  So it really, I mean, you really have to be quite mentally strong and surround yourself, as I said earlier, with some personal support as well.
• 16:32
  That I think is very, very key.
• 16:34
  And a lot of people, including myself, I wish I had done that earlier, didn't do in the past because we're like, you know, why am I going to spend time on personal support?
• 16:42
  I need, you know, I need a marketing expert, I need a tech expert.
• 16:46
  Right.
• 16:46
  And I need investors.
• 16:48
  So I think that's one of the things that I definitely suggest in my book.
• 16:53
  Now why do you think that's not talked about and, and not even publicized as much in terms of this internal battle and this I guess this, I don't know how I'd call it this, this vicious cycle of what
• 17:11
  it's really like to build a startup.
• 17:14
  I think it's getting more and more talked about now.
• 17:17
  I see it, you know, even like investors, corporate investors, advising on coaching and so forth.
• 17:24
  But the main reason is, as you pointed out earlier, which was, you know, people want that go getter, you know, can take, do it all, no matter what, against all odds type of a person to lead a startup.
• 17:37
  And that's what they're looking for.
• 17:40
  And I think the founders want to also show a really strong front.
• 17:45
  They want to be the front person and strong and they can take it.
• 17:50
  And I think that's kind of a human way of just getting ahead in so many ways.
• 17:59
  Right.
• 17:59
  And I think, but in the quiet moments, as I say, when you're doing the dishes, you know, it hits you right when, when it's, it's like what am I doing and how do I get help?
• 18:09
  Right.
• 18:09
  And I.
• 18:11
  The most successful entrepreneurs I've worked with are the ones that have advisors that are actually not business advisors as much more on the personal side to help them navigate sort of the day in day out of lifting a
• 18:23
  new venture like this.
• 18:25
  Okay, and so if someone, and you pointed out the stats, I think we were talking on it, maybe you could just tell us how.
• 18:36
  What percentage of startups fail within five years?
• 18:41
  Well, there are a lot of stats out there, but you know, and I focused a lot on tech and Silicon Valley and on some of the companies that are, you know, game changing.
• 18:52
  I mean the stats out there are, you know, over 97% will, will fail or will, will putter out in the first five years.
• 18:58
  Right.
• 18:59
  And, and you know, people want to be this unicorn, you know, company one day.
• 19:05
  And I read recently that of all the startups to be a unicorn, which is like a billion dollar company, right.
• 19:13
  I think the number, and I just read this recently was 1 in 10,000 or something like that, you know, has, you know, it's like 0.006% or something like that.
• 19:24
  And so one of the things I say in the book is, you know, there's a time to exit a startup and sometimes it's a personal exit or sometimes it's a business exit.
• 19:35
  And you don't have to wait for the big exit, you know, you can always exit in pieces.
• 19:41
  And you know, that's one of the things that I think a lot of founders fall in the trap is they just want to go big.
• 19:49
  You know, you offer them $10 million.
• 19:51
  There's like, no, no, no.
• 19:52
  This thing is worth, you know, $250 million.
• 19:54
  So we're going to wait it out.
• 19:56
  And I think that's one of the things I've seen a lot happening because there's so much success driven content out there as well, you know.
• 20:06
  Right.
• 20:06
  And do you see that?
• 20:09
  I know you talked about people wanting to be strong and put on a solid front and maybe it can look like weakness if you start, you know, talking about kind of what, what, you know, the feelings and going
• 20:22
  through on the journey.
• 20:26
  Do you think that this.
• 20:31
  I guess, what would you say to someone, too, right.
• 20:34
  Like you said, it can be an exercise in insanity.
• 20:36
  But someone, they've got a great idea, they believe in it, they're starting this company and they're convinced that they're going to make it successful.
• 20:44
  What, what advice, you know, if they're doing that this month in 2025, given, you know, the current landscape out there, you know, aside from what you've said already in terms of the support staff and all that and the
• 21:00
  personal support, what advice would you give to somebody in terms of, you know.
• 21:05
  Well, I mean, it depends on the type of business.
• 21:07
  Right.
• 21:07
  So let's say that it's a product business.
• 21:11
  And I would say, well, you know, make sure that you've done just so much research and talk with the potential customers.
• 21:20
  It is so important to partner with the customers upfront.
• 21:23
  And in fact, developing a product with the customer is so much better than developing a product and then getting a customer.
• 21:28
  Right.
• 21:29
  So I think that's something I've noticed is the companies that have partnered and spent sometimes the first year in actually developing the technology or the product with a potential customer is so much better off.
• 21:41
  Right.
• 21:42
  Secondly is on the business side, you've got to get help on the finance side as well.
• 21:49
  You can't just put in all your money.
• 21:51
  I mean, sure, it's okay to do that, but, you know, try to get some support and don't try to cling on to 100% of the company.
• 21:58
  And, you know, it's okay to, to have a smaller percentage of a larger vision than a larger percentage of something that'll take a lot longer.
• 22:09
  You know, on a service business, it's also the same, right?
• 22:12
  It's.
• 22:12
  It's kind of just make sure that before you go out and launch, you know, your offerings, you know, get a few projects.
• 22:19
  And I just think this, the funnel has sort of shifted in the world.
• 22:24
  It used to be like this, you know, where the Ideas come in and now it's more, you know, kind of flat.
• 22:30
  There's so much more going on that you want to spend a little bit more time before you pull the trigger into the market.
• 22:36
  That's like the number one thing I would tell, tell the entrepreneurs today.
• 22:40
  And of course on the personal side, I, you know, it's overlooked and you know, if you have really thought through why you are doing this and what, how long you're willing to do it for, that's also a question
• 22:55
  to ask yourself.
• 22:57
  What would be a end game?
• 22:59
  I mean, is it a lifestyle business that you want or you want to, you know, build it and exit and you know, pick a number, pick a timeline, you know, have some sort of, you know, goal up front.
• 23:10
  You can change it all the time, but, you know, at least have that conversation with yourself before diving into it because it's, it's going to be a rough road and an exciting one.
• 23:21
  I mean, I, I say sure, do it, but as long as you've really, you know, thought it through on both the personal and the business side.
• 23:29
  Okay.
• 23:29
  And another, another common trait of entrepreneurs too is this, this bias towards action and almost you could call it this ready, fire, aim, type approach.
• 23:41
  Approach.
• 23:41
  Right, right.
• 23:42
  And it sounds like, although that's valuable in many ways because you can get an emotion and get things done, like what you're saying in terms of partner with some customer to develop the product and make sure the timing
• 23:55
  is right and you know, wait a little bit before you go all.
• 23:59
  It sounds like that's a very thin line and you really have to balance those, those action traits with some, some actual prudence to really thread that needle.
• 24:10
  Right?
• 24:11
  No, 100%.
• 24:11
  And here's the problem.
• 24:13
  Let's say that you are, you're thinking that way and you have outside investors and they want you to move faster.
• 24:23
  Maybe there's a business plan that said, year one, we're going to do this, year two, we're going to do that.
• 24:27
  So there's always this push and pull going on for the founder to make a judgment call.
• 24:31
  Right.
• 24:32
  Where maybe it's the right thing to go slower or faster, but you have external forces that are kind of pushing you in a different direction.
• 24:40
  And that's a very difficult position to be in.
• 24:42
  Right.
• 24:43
  Because I've been in meetings where what are we doing here?
• 24:48
  I mean, we've got the product, we've got five customers.
• 24:50
  Why aren't we now just building a sales team and going fast?
• 24:54
  And we're saying, Well, I think five customers is not enough.
• 24:58
  We should have 15.
• 24:59
  And there's a lot of push and pull happening there.
• 25:02
  And that's where the founders acumen and ability to really thread that needle, as you say, comes in.
• 25:08
  And this is where the art is, right?
• 25:10
  This is where that nuance is of figuring out the speed at which you move.
• 25:18
  I always use this analogy.
• 25:19
  It's like a race car.
• 25:21
  People think that race cars move really fast, and it's true.
• 25:25
  But 50% of the time you're accelerating, but 50% of the time you're actually braking around the corners.
• 25:31
  So you have to know when to accelerate, when to break.
• 25:34
  And it's, it's that type of a mentality, I think, that, that founders need to have and the ones that have it are very good at it.
• 25:44
  Okay, so now another concept you touched on in the book was the importance of script when hiring.
• 25:54
  Can you expand on that topic and tell our audience what is script?
• 25:59
  Yeah, this is a word I coined a while back.
• 26:03
  And so, you know, people say you got to have grit, you know, and grit is the way to go.
• 26:08
  And it's true.
• 26:09
  And there's like a great book written on grit as well.
• 26:12
  And then I've noticed that you also have to be very scrappy in business.
• 26:17
  Right.
• 26:17
  You have to be like.
• 26:19
  And the difference is, you know, scrappy.
• 26:21
  You can do a lot with less and grit is you really don't give up for long term goals.
• 26:26
  And, and I've seen a lot of scrappy people and a lot of gritty people, but the ones that can do both at the same time, which is what I call skrit, really, really are successful because they're very much
• 26:39
  have perseverance for the long term goal, but they will do it in a way, you know, it's like thinking big and acting small and, and try to have that dollar stretch as far as possible.
• 26:49
  And investors love, you know, scrappy and Squiddy, you know, founders, because they, they make sure that they're very prudent.
• 26:56
  So the script in my mind is really the combination of, of the two, of having grit and, and doing day to day in a very scrappy way, which I believe in the first year of a startup is extremely
• 27:09
  important.
• 27:10
  Right?
• 27:11
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 27:13
  Absolutely.
• 27:14
  Okay.
• 27:14
  And another idea that you challenged in the book was, was a notion that was popularized by Steve Jobs, is that passion is the key to success.
• 27:28
  So can you just talk about your take on, on that subject?
• 27:33
  Yeah, you know, I just read this article, it got a lot of publicity because I, it was titled Steve Jobs was wrong.
• 27:41
  And what I meant by that was, yeah, Steve Jobs was all about passion, and he would talk about the.
• 27:49
  You know, about the importance of it in.
• 27:51
  In new ventures.
• 27:52
  And I don't disagree with that.
• 27:54
  I'm not saying it's not important, but I.
• 27:56
  I feel like nowadays it's.
• 28:00
  And there's so much talk about passion versus purpose versus calling and so forth.
• 28:04
  Passion is kind of like, in my mind, it has, like, a shelf life, you know, and.
• 28:09
  And it's something that.
• 28:10
  That helps you get things started, but what really keeps you going is.
• 28:16
  Is purpose.
• 28:17
  And I think the Japanese actually have a good way of looking.
• 28:21
  I think it's called ikigai.
• 28:23
  It's like they look at passion's one piece of the puzzle, but the core of it is what makes you wake up in the morning and what makes you kind of wake up the next day and so forth.
• 28:35
  So I think there's a.
• 28:37
  You can't go into an investor meeting and talk about, I have a calling.
• 28:42
  Or you can, of course, but.
• 28:43
  Or, you know, moral obligation.
• 28:45
  But I hear the word passion almost like a prerequisite in every pitch deck I have seen and every presentation I've seen.
• 28:51
  Right.
• 28:52
  And I kind of started losing interest a little bit because I.
• 28:55
  I feel that it's overused.
• 28:58
  It's kind of.
• 29:00
  I think it has to be a little bit much more a deeper calling, you know, and purpose.
• 29:04
  And if someone's been working on some hobby for 10, 20 years and then they decide to do that into a business, you know, it's kind of like a.
• 29:12
  I feel like there's a little bit of a purpose driven to that.
• 29:14
  Right.
• 29:14
  And a lot of people use passion a little too much and too often, because I believe people want to hear it and they feel that there's a little bit of a personal connection with the audience because it's something
• 29:26
  more deeper than just a business venture.
• 29:30
  So I think that there was a time when passion was great, but now it's gone, I think, to another level, given the amount of startups we have, you know, on a daily basis, that deeper purpose, and that'll get
• 29:42
  you through the dark times, I think, you know, and passion, sometimes, I feel, has a shelf life.
• 29:48
  Okay.
• 29:49
  And so with this book, Soul Venture, what.
• 29:53
  What compelled you to write it, and what do you hope that readers take away from it?
• 30:00
  Yeah.
• 30:00
  You know, this was a.
• 30:02
  A hard decision for me to publish it in many ways, because it's, as you probably read it, which is.
• 30:08
  It's very, very personal.
• 30:10
  It's very revealing.
• 30:11
  I talk about things from my own personal experience.
• 30:14
  You know, I was originally from India.
• 30:16
  I came to the U.S.
• 30:17
  and then, you know, I tried to, you know, go on this startup success path for decades.
• 30:26
  And it's not like one day I woke up and I said, I got this idea for a book.
• 30:30
  It's kind of been in me for decades.
• 30:32
  I've been writing essays for a long time, and I put it all together in this book in the last couple of years.
• 30:40
  And my goal was really to share both the internal and business side of the startup culture and kind of dive into the unspoken truths, as I call it, from the startup trenches.
• 30:55
  And.
• 30:56
  And both on the business side and the.
• 30:58
  The X factors, the human side.
• 31:00
  And I.
• 31:00
  I kind of laid it out there, and for me, it was a.
• 31:04
  It was kind of a risk in some ways because of how personal the book really is.
• 31:09
  You know, I share about some really personal things in there, and I'm very happy.
• 31:15
  It's doing very well.
• 31:17
  It's.
• 31:18
  It's a different business book.
• 31:19
  And to answer your second question, what I hope to get out of it, you know, I never really thought of it that way.
• 31:26
  It was almost like I needed to get it out into the world.
• 31:29
  And I just hope.
• 31:31
  I just hope that a wide, you know, wide range of people can read it.
• 31:36
  It's been out for a couple of months now, and the feedback I'm getting is.
• 31:40
  Is very, very positive.
• 31:41
  I've been in a lot of, you know, podcasts like yours, and, you know, I've written articles, and I feel like there's this conversation that's happening about the startup culture and how we can actually really continue on, but, you
• 31:55
  know, talk about the certain things that in the past, we didn't fully talk about.
• 32:01
  Right, okay.
• 32:03
  Yeah.
• 32:03
  And that's.
• 32:04
  That's.
• 32:04
  That's certainly very noble as far as getting this conversation out there and bringing these topics, like you said, that have been taboo maybe in the past and certainly are, you know, slowly but surely kind of getting out into
• 32:17
  the mainstream.
• 32:19
  And what's been the best part of this whole experience, releasing this book?
• 32:25
  I mean, things like this.
• 32:26
  Right.
• 32:26
  I mean, these conversations.
• 32:29
  I've been, you know, I've been.
• 32:31
  I've been.
• 32:31
  I've done a few speaking engagements in person as well, and I think the Q and A is very interesting.
• 32:38
  Right.
• 32:38
  It's kind of like people now are digging into their own experiences and both as investors who have invested in companies, and also as entrepreneurs that have done their own companies.
• 32:48
  And I've learned a couple things.
• 32:51
  First is a lot of People that felt that they could have or should have taken a different path, I feel, felt better about it because they learned that the path they're on was fine.
• 33:07
  Maybe they didn't do a startup or they.
• 33:09
  They sold it too early or something like that.
• 33:12
  So I think the best part has been just listening to the readers and the questions and.
• 33:17
  And actually it's been a very, you know, deep conversations that I actually have had with a lot of the readers, and I've really enjoyed that.
• 33:28
  Right.
• 33:29
  All right.
• 33:30
  And, Ashwin, if people want to get the book or connect with you, find out more about the work you do, the coaching you do, and.
• 33:38
  Or just connect for any other reason, what's the best way that can reach out to you?
• 33:43
  You know, you can get the book online, anywhere, and you also go to my website for the book, which is soulventurebook.com and that actually links to my.
• 33:53
  My website as well.
• 33:55
  I'm also on social media.
• 33:57
  You know, LinkedIn is a very good source.
• 34:00
  And to connect with me on LinkedIn, I would love for people just to reach out if, you know, if they have any questions, if they've read the book.
• 34:07
  I would love to hear.
• 34:08
  I think that the website souldentrybook.com and LinkedIn would be the best ways to connect with me.
• 34:16
  Okay.
• 34:16
  All right, we'll link all that in the show.
• 34:18
  Notes for everyone.
• 34:19
  All right.
• 34:20
  Well, Ashwin, thank you so much for taking the time to be here sharing all the concepts from this book and these other lessons from your journey with our audience.
• 34:27
  We greatly appreciate it.
• 34:29
  Thank you so much for having me on.
• 34:30
  All right, that's all the time we have for now.
• 34:32
  We will see you next time.
• 34:34
  It.