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I Used to Hate Meta: Muse Wonder Changed My Mind · In the Loop AI

• 0:00
  Ejaaz: I don't know how he did it, but Mark Zuckerberg and Meta might have just pulled
• 0:04
  Ejaaz: off the biggest comeback in AI ever.
• 0:06
  Ejaaz: They just released their new model called Muse Wonder.
• 0:09
  Ejaaz: It's basically the largest AI model that they've ever released,
• 0:12
  Ejaaz: and it competes directly with Claude Opus 5.5, GPT-6 Astra, and Fable 5.1 from
• 0:19
  Ejaaz: Anthropic, basically the most powerful AI models that exist today.
• 0:22
  Ejaaz: And this is crazy because 18 months ago, Meta's models would come in last place
• 0:27
  Ejaaz: pretty much every single time for video generation, image generation, general LLM context.
• 0:33
  Ejaaz: It just sucked overall. They also torched billions of dollars on fire,
• 0:37
  Ejaaz: spent $25 billion to hire one 29-year-old individual to head up their new meta
• 0:42
  Ejaaz: superintelligence labs, and it just seemed like Zuck had kind of lost the plot.
• 0:46
  Ejaaz: But with this new model, codenamed Watermelon, now officially called Wonder,
• 0:50
  Ejaaz: they have a real competitor to compete against Anthropic in open air.
• 0:54
  Ejaaz: You see, the AI race up until yesterday was pretty much a two-horsed one and
• 0:59
  Ejaaz: now there's a third major player in the works.
• 1:01
  Ejaaz: And the last thing I'll say is Meta's entire AI strategy seems to be very different
• 1:06
  Ejaaz: from that of Anthropic and OpenAI.
• 1:08
  Ejaaz: They seem to be focusing just on personal agents and I think that's a much larger
• 1:12
  Ejaaz: advantage than I actually gave it credit for and this is coming from a former
• 1:16
  Ejaaz: hater of Meta products now actually someone who enjoys using them.
• 1:20
  Ejaaz: So I'm going to get into all of this and more the brand new models on today's
• 1:24
  Ejaaz: episode of in the loop brought to you by qualcomm.
• 1:30
  Ejaaz: Okay, so let's start with the model itself. Meta actually released two models,
• 1:34
  Ejaaz: but it's both called Muse Wander.
• 1:36
  Ejaaz: But there's two varying degrees of effort across both of these models.
• 1:40
  Ejaaz: So the standard one is called Muse Wander. And this is basically their Claude Opus 5.5 competitor.
• 1:45
  Ejaaz: And it actually comes in at exactly the same price.
• 1:48
  Ejaaz: It's $4 per million tokens input in, $10 per million tokens output.
• 1:53
  Ejaaz: So it's very clear that they're trying to compete with Opus 5.5.
• 1:56
  Ejaaz: And it's actually quite good.
• 1:57
  Ejaaz: But before I get into the benchmarks, the second model is their max model,
• 2:01
  Ejaaz: their Fable 5.1 model, their bigger competitor, which is actually kind of behind
• 2:07
  Ejaaz: closed doors right now, but you can access it if you get a $50 subscription.
• 2:10
  Ejaaz: But the idea here is, can Meta's second model compete directly with Fable 5.1?
• 2:15
  Ejaaz: Well, the answer is a bit of a mixed bag. If you look at this tweet from Aaron
• 2:19
  Ejaaz: Levy, he kind of shows the progression of Meta models over the last year and a half or so.
• 2:26
  Ejaaz: When they started, Meta's models weren't very performative.
• 2:29
  Ejaaz: We're looking at the Artificial Analysis Intelligence Index,
• 2:32
  Ejaaz: which is basically the best way to assess the general intelligence of a model.
• 2:36
  Ejaaz: Think of it as like the ultimate human exam, but for AI models,
• 2:41
  Ejaaz: they're tested through a mixture of maths, reasoning, coding,
• 2:44
  Ejaaz: literature, creative writing, basically the stuff that humans are tested on
• 2:48
  Ejaaz: when they're kids growing up through high school, college, blah,
• 2:50
  Ejaaz: blah, blah, but for AI models.
• 2:51
  Ejaaz: Now, back in the day, they used to score pretty low scores. You're seeing on
• 2:54
  Ejaaz: the right-hand side of the screen around 31 to 34.
• 2:57
  Ejaaz: And now the massive leap over a year and a half, leapfrogging often some very
• 3:01
  Ejaaz: prominent names and models, have now put them in second place,
• 3:05
  Ejaaz: just within striking distance of the flagship model from Anthropic Claude Opus 5.5.
• 3:10
  Ejaaz: And when we look at the benchmarks, at least from the numbers that Meta's showing
• 3:13
  Ejaaz: us, this model seems to be quite good. It's really good on personal superintelligence
• 3:17
  Ejaaz: index. It's pretty good at long-term coding, especially for agents,
• 3:19
  Ejaaz: because this is a model designed for AI agents specifically.
• 3:22
  Ejaaz: It's really good at automation, general work.
• 3:25
  Ejaaz: But it's also really good at legal stuff. I was looking at this Harvey Lab AA,
• 3:30
  Ejaaz: which basically tests the model's capability to replacing or automating a bunch of lawyering work.
• 3:35
  Ejaaz: And it's more than double the second place, which is Claude Fable 5.1 Max. It's called 13.1.
• 3:42
  Ejaaz: And I'm mentioning this because Zuck specifically said that the models that
• 3:46
  Ejaaz: Metis is putting out Muse Wander, Muse Wander Full, which is their Max version,
• 3:51
  Ejaaz: the entire focus around these models is that they actually are useful to you.
• 3:55
  Ejaaz: And I mean that specifically, just you. It's not meant to be this kind of generally.
• 4:00
  Ejaaz: Widely available LLM that is weirdly applicable to anyone and everyone.
• 4:05
  Ejaaz: It's trying to optimize for the types of work that the majority of the people face.
• 4:09
  Ejaaz: Now, that's not to say that anyone and everyone in this particular example is
• 4:13
  Ejaaz: a lawyer, but anyone and everyone typically gets involved with some kind of
• 4:18
  Ejaaz: lawyer or contracting or reviewal thing, whether you're signing a new employee
• 4:22
  Ejaaz: contract to join a new company.
• 4:24
  Ejaaz: Or if you're dealing with a contract with an insurance company or whatever that might be.
• 4:29
  Ejaaz: And this is just one snippet of what's going on inside Zuck's mind and Meta's entire AI strategy.
• 4:35
  Ejaaz: Something that's also net new for them is DeepSwe 1.1 and coding in general.
• 4:40
  Ejaaz: This model is a major leap up from its predecessor. Now, is it as good at coding
• 4:46
  Ejaaz: as Claude Code, Fable 5.1, as GPT-6 Astra Codex? Would you or should you drop
• 4:52
  Ejaaz: your subscriptions there and start using Meta?
• 4:55
  Ejaaz: Some people, and this is genuinely a mixed camp, would say, yes, I saw a review from
• 5:01
  Ejaaz: Theo GG, who I love his videos, I love his content in general,
• 5:05
  Ejaaz: and he got early access, and he's been playing around with this for a few weeks.
• 5:09
  Ejaaz: He's strictly extremely disciplined when it comes to just giving his very honest
• 5:13
  Ejaaz: review. He doesn't hold back. And he's historically hated on Meta.
• 5:17
  Ejaaz: And his comeback to this entire thing was, I hate to say it,
• 5:21
  Ejaaz: but it's actually quite good.
• 5:22
  Ejaaz: Now, it's not quite good in terms of like creating new apps and websites when
• 5:26
  Ejaaz: it comes to coding, but it's good at detecting flaws and security bugs that
• 5:32
  Ejaaz: other models may not have picked out.
• 5:33
  Ejaaz: And he actually showed a few examples where he was like, listen, I tried Claude, I tried.
• 5:39
  Ejaaz: GPT and it wasn't able to figure out my problems but Meta, Muse,
• 5:43
  Ejaaz: Wonder figured it out for me.
• 5:45
  Ejaaz: So that's enough of an excuse to at least incorporate it into my workflow.
• 5:48
  Ejaaz: I don't need to replace any of my other subscriptions but if this is free and
• 5:53
  Ejaaz: or cheap I'm going to use it.
• 5:55
  Ejaaz: But putting the benchmarks aside there is actually another good reason why you
• 5:59
  Ejaaz: should be using this model.
• 6:00
  Ejaaz: The first is called active memory. This is basically a reference to the model's
• 6:04
  Ejaaz: capability of pulling the most context about you and carrying it forwards in
• 6:10
  Ejaaz: every single conversation and interaction that you have with the model.
• 6:14
  Ejaaz: Memory and AI models isn't something new. If you look at Chad GPT,
• 6:18
  Ejaaz: who basically were the ones that pioneered this entire personal memory AI assistant
• 6:24
  Ejaaz: type thing, you would be familiar with, okay, cool, my AI knows more about me,
• 6:28
  Ejaaz: I'm more likely to use it.
• 6:29
  Ejaaz: But what Meta has been able to achieve here with this model is something a little
• 6:33
  Ejaaz: bit more, It's something a little bit more proactive, but also more intelligent
• 6:38
  Ejaaz: in terms of pulling the right bits of memory.
• 6:40
  Ejaaz: You see, it's not as simple as telling an AI model to understand everything it can about you.
• 6:46
  Ejaaz: It's also about making sure that the models actually know what right bits of
• 6:50
  Ejaaz: information to pull about you.
• 6:52
  Ejaaz: And OpenAI has had all the time in the world to try and figure this out.
• 6:56
  Ejaaz: And yet they haven't been able to put out an agent or a model that I think truly
• 7:02
  Ejaaz: sticks Xen feels loyal to me, if that makes sense.
• 7:06
  Ejaaz: And Meta's come along and they put out their personal agent Muse a few weeks
• 7:10
  Ejaaz: ago, literally two and a half weeks ago.
• 7:12
  Ejaaz: And they have 6 million downloads so far. And I think around 3 million weekly
• 7:16
  Ejaaz: active users, which of course is only a drop in the ocean when you compare it
• 7:20
  Ejaaz: to the likes of Anthropic and OpenAI.
• 7:22
  Ejaaz: But the feedback is where the distinction is. Meta has been able to create a
• 7:26
  Ejaaz: very compelling product.
• 7:27
  Ejaaz: As I said before, I have typically hated Meta products and I'm the first to
• 7:32
  Ejaaz: put my hands up here, but it's actually quite a good feature.
• 7:35
  Ejaaz: So the fact that they're bringing this and pairing it with a Fable 5.1 worthy
• 7:40
  Ejaaz: model can only yield, in my opinion, what I could expect to be a much better
• 7:46
  Ejaaz: personal agent experience.
• 7:47
  Ejaaz: So I'm going to play around with Muse going forwards, but my guess is it's going
• 7:50
  Ejaaz: to get a hell of a lot better.
• 7:52
  Ejaaz: The second thing, though, is the one that I'm most excited for and something
• 7:55
  Ejaaz: that I haven't seen in any other AI lab.
• 7:58
  Ejaaz: Something called active focus, which basically means that if an AI model or
• 8:02
  Ejaaz: if their AI model comes across a challenge or an obstacle, one which
• 8:07
  Ejaaz: it can't typically surmount and it needs to usually come back to you and say,
• 8:12
  Ejaaz: hey, I can't figure this out. Let's.
• 8:14
  Ejaaz: Kind of approach this in a different way. It just does it itself.
• 8:18
  Ejaaz: Now, you might have heard versions of this from ChatGPT, from Claude.
• 8:23
  Ejaaz: They were only coding specific. That's the difference here.
• 8:27
  Ejaaz: Typically, if you use ChatGPT or Claude and it's doing the relentless thing,
• 8:31
  Ejaaz: you know, it's like trying to fix and solve a problem.
• 8:33
  Ejaaz: It's usually on coding projects. When you look at Muse Wander specifically,
• 8:37
  Ejaaz: it's for any and every task.
• 8:39
  Ejaaz: If it's like, okay, I think he's trying to figure out a gift for his wife or
• 8:44
  Ejaaz: try to figure out how to plan a specific trip and it comes up against an obstacle like hey
• 8:49
  Ejaaz: i can't get access to this website there's a cloudflare issue or i can't get
• 8:53
  Ejaaz: access to certain bits of information because it's behind a paywall
• 8:56
  Ejaaz: it'll start to intuitively try to figure out okay maybe i'll go to a secondary
• 9:00
  Ejaaz: resource what secondary resource should i go to what's reputable that i know
• 9:04
  Ejaaz: i can rely on and not have to ask.
• 9:06
  Ejaaz: To kind of verify or check and it starts to become this weird but very useful
• 9:11
  Ejaaz: personal assistant that applies to, and this is the most important part,
• 9:15
  Ejaaz: 99% of the rest of the world.
• 9:16
  Ejaaz: I've explained this in a previous episode, but Meta's models are starting to
• 9:20
  Ejaaz: feel like models that your grandma would love. And I mean that in the most complimentary
• 9:25
  Ejaaz: way ever, because it's just easy and simple to use.
• 9:28
  Ejaaz: I speak about AI every day, and I think my mom watches the majority of my episodes,
• 9:33
  Ejaaz: and I kind of gauge how good an episode is by the reaction that she gives me,
• 9:38
  Ejaaz: or whether she reaches out and says, wow, I had no idea that blah,
• 9:41
  Ejaaz: blah does blah, blah, blah.
• 9:43
  Ejaaz: Or I didn't know this model did this. I'm going to go use this.
• 9:46
  Ejaaz: I've never heard so much feedback from her for one single topic.
• 9:50
  Ejaaz: Than MetaMuse. And Meta has this product DNA, something that I haven't seen
• 9:55
  Ejaaz: in any other AI company when it comes to AI, at least since ChatGPT and the rise of Chatbot LLM.
• 10:00
  Ejaaz: So there's something unique here. It's not just about the model,
• 10:03
  Ejaaz: it's about who they're designing it for.
• 10:04
  Ejaaz: And ActiveFocus is just something that helps them get there.
• 10:08
  Ejaaz: Now, when it comes to pricing and accessibility, they gave API pricing for the standard model.
• 10:12
  Ejaaz: So I think it's $4 in and $20 out which is exact same competitive pricing to opus 5.5
• 10:19
  Ejaaz: but for the larger fuller model the max version the model that is meant to compete
• 10:23
  Ejaaz: directly with gpt 6.1 astra and fable 5.1 they haven't really given a general
• 10:29
  Ejaaz: price point they've hidden it actually
• 10:31
  Ejaaz: behind their coding subscription which costs 50 bucks a month so compare that
• 10:36
  Ejaaz: to the pro plans of anthropic and opening eye way you have to pay top dollar like.
• 10:41
  Ejaaz: $200 to $300 a month, this is a pretty good deal.
• 10:44
  Ejaaz: But I also do wonder whether Meta is doing this, restricting the model usage,
• 10:49
  Ejaaz: because they may not have enough compute to actually serve the models at large scale.
• 10:55
  Ejaaz: At the end of the day, Meta has a crazy distribution of, I think,
• 10:58
  Ejaaz: 3.3 billion users across all of the different platforms.
• 11:02
  Ejaaz: And it's no secret, they're trying to plug their AI models into every single
• 11:05
  Ejaaz: platform. You can use Meers on WhatsApp, you can use it on Facebook Messenger,
• 11:09
  Ejaaz: or Facebook Marketplace or Facebook in general.
• 11:11
  Ejaaz: And you can use it on Instagram. If they wanted to roll it out to anyone and
• 11:15
  Ejaaz: everyone, they would have done it already, but they haven't.
• 11:18
  Ejaaz: They've only released it to the US.
• 11:19
  Ejaaz: And then again, in a very limited fashion. So none of my friends in the UK can even use this.
• 11:24
  Ejaaz: So I have a feeling that there's a bit of a restriction happening here because
• 11:27
  Ejaaz: of a strain on resources.
• 11:29
  Ejaaz: But what I would say is don't ditch your ChatGPT subscription,
• 11:32
  Ejaaz: certainly don't ditch Claude, but try out Meta's new model.
• 11:36
  Ejaaz: I think you're able to access it through Metamuse, their personal agent,
• 11:40
  Ejaaz: which is free for now, 100 million tokens a week. From when I last checked,
• 11:44
  Ejaaz: I'm using it every single day and I'm burning quite a few tokens, so it's useful.
• 11:47
  Ejaaz: I sense that that's where the most distribution or most people will get access
• 11:51
  Ejaaz: to it, but you can also access it directly if you just sign up for the average
• 11:55
  Ejaaz: subscription with Meta, which I believe is $20 a month, so pretty competitive.
• 11:59
  Ejaaz: Before I made this episode, I took a step back and I was thinking a year and a half ago, 18 months.
• 12:05
  Ejaaz: Meta had the worst AI model on the market, but they'd also just torched $25
• 12:12
  Ejaaz: billion to hire this guy called Alexander Wang.
• 12:16
  Ejaaz: He was the head or CEO, founder of Scale AI, 29 years old, to head up their
• 12:23
  Ejaaz: new Meta superintelligence lab, which they'd just created because they'd fired their ex-AI team.
• 12:30
  Ejaaz: So it was a very tumultuous occasion and Zuck seemed like he was just going
• 12:34
  Ejaaz: in complete war mode but having no idea what he was fighting for or a strategy
• 12:38
  Ejaaz: to win and then Meta started to release a bunch of various different AI type.
• 12:44
  Ejaaz: Products if you want to call it that I remember Meta Vibe which was their Sora or AI video
• 12:50
  Ejaaz: app competitor AI TikTok style competitor that sucked completely flopped I remember
• 12:55
  Ejaaz: when they launched a public news feed of their AI model this was like,
• 13:00
  Ejaaz: one of the craziest features ever where people would have private conversations
• 13:04
  Ejaaz: with Meta's chatbot and it would be publicly posted on a feed,
• 13:08
  Ejaaz: much like the Facebook feed or Twitter feed, for anyone and everyone to see.
• 13:12
  Ejaaz: They thought it would be really useful. So again, many blunders have been made
• 13:16
  Ejaaz: from Meta since back then, but then they had started to turn things around.
• 13:20
  Ejaaz: I remember when they had announced that they were acquiring Manus,
• 13:24
  Ejaaz: who is an AI agent company founded in China, but then they moved and domiciled in Singapore.
• 13:30
  Ejaaz: They acquired this company for $2 billion.
• 13:33
  Ejaaz: Now, back then, AI agents wasn't really a thing, but Zuck made it very clear
• 13:37
  Ejaaz: when he put up the money for this company.
• 13:40
  Ejaaz: He said he believes the future is everyone and anyone should get their own personal agent.
• 13:47
  Ejaaz: And his whole emphasis around personalization, I guess, is the entire moat and
• 13:52
  Ejaaz: strategy behind Facebook and all of the meta social media products like Instagram,
• 13:56
  Ejaaz: WhatsApp, or whatever that might be, is that it appeals directly to you and.
• 14:00
  Ejaaz: I, or rather you individually.
• 14:03
  Ejaaz: It's trained on your own individual data, and it's optimized around figuring
• 14:07
  Ejaaz: out what your preferences are.
• 14:09
  Ejaaz: And him combining this with a Fable 5.1 type AI model, I guess, makes a lot of sense.
• 14:15
  Ejaaz: Now, of course, that Manus acquisition was reversed two months ago when China
• 14:21
  Ejaaz: came in and said, you can't do this.
• 14:22
  Ejaaz: We're going to reverse the entire transaction. But by that time,
• 14:25
  Ejaaz: Meta had already got enough information and data that they required to build
• 14:29
  Ejaaz: their own personal agent.
• 14:30
  Ejaaz: And hey, presto, two or three weeks ago, you have their first super intelligent
• 14:35
  Ejaaz: personal agent called Metamuse launch. And it's been a massive success for now.
• 14:40
  Ejaaz: So then the final question is, what is Meta's AI strategy and how does it differ
• 14:45
  Ejaaz: to Anthropic and OpenAir? And the reason why I want to talk about this,
• 14:49
  Ejaaz: well, there's many, but the main reason is there's some pretty big IPOs coming up.
• 14:54
  Ejaaz: Anthropic is rumored to be IPO-ing at a $2.2 trillion valuation.
• 14:58
  Ejaaz: And then OpenAir is coming in at, I think, a $1.3 to $1.5 trillion valuation.
• 15:03
  Ejaaz: So those two alone combined with SpaceX, I think makes up for 64,
• 15:09
  Ejaaz: no, sorry, 67% of all capital raised from IPOs since the 1980s.
• 15:17
  Ejaaz: That is a heck ton of capital raised by three companies alone.
• 15:22
  Ejaaz: So obviously Meta's looking at this and I think they're at a,
• 15:25
  Ejaaz: what's it, a 1.5, 1.7 trillion valuation.
• 15:29
  Ejaaz: So if I'm Zuck, it's not only good enough for me to compete on the same territory
• 15:35
  Ejaaz: that these guys are doing, generalized LLMs.
• 15:37
  Ejaaz: It's important for me to leapfrog them, to beat them at a different,
• 15:42
  Ejaaz: but just as important game. And that's what I'm excited to get into on today's
• 15:46
  Ejaaz: episode brought to you by Qualcomm.
• 15:51
  Ejaaz: So my first take is Zuck and Meta are building an AI model for you that is personal
• 15:58
  Ejaaz: to you, that knows you the best.
• 16:01
  Ejaaz: Now you compare that to Anthropic and OpenAI, and they're building the best brain for everyone.
• 16:07
  Ejaaz: And Meta is building the best brain for you, individually you.
• 16:11
  Ejaaz: It's a very slight nuance, but it is an extremely important and differentiated one.
• 16:17
  Ejaaz: Because when you look at Anthropic and OpenAI, they're going for general artificial
• 16:21
  Ejaaz: intelligence or super intelligence, whichever term you prefer.
• 16:24
  Ejaaz: And the idea here is one model that serves anyone and everyone.
• 16:29
  Ejaaz: But in my mind, a general model can never eventually be as good at doing specialized
• 16:35
  Ejaaz: work as a model that is just trained on specialized data.
• 16:39
  Ejaaz: Makes sense when you talk about it, but has not been proven as much given that
• 16:43
  Ejaaz: Anthropic and OpenAI has had such a lead.
• 16:45
  Ejaaz: Until we had the likes of models that were trained locally in the open source
• 16:50
  Ejaaz: world, especially with the Chinese LLMs that were really good at doing specific
• 16:53
  Ejaaz: things versus the general LLMs from Anthropic and OpenAI. And then you had MetaMuse
• 16:57
  Ejaaz: come out, which was the personal intelligence.
• 17:00
  Ejaaz: And that's the hint at where Meta and Zuck are going.
• 17:03
  Ejaaz: They see a new territory that they want to break into and own.
• 17:08
  Ejaaz: And that is the medium or the vector that 99% of the rest of the world who aren't
• 17:14
  Ejaaz: AI nerds, who aren't in the bubble, who aren't crazy software engineers using
• 17:18
  Ejaaz: cloud code to spend on multiple agents to, I don't know, build a billion dollar company.
• 17:21
  Ejaaz: They just want to focus on the average normal person. Okay, so how do you build
• 17:26
  Ejaaz: the best general intelligence for 99% of the world? Well, you don't.
• 17:31
  Ejaaz: You build the best personal AI model for them.
• 17:34
  Ejaaz: And that's what Zuck figured out. That's what he realized. And so if he could
• 17:37
  Ejaaz: own that conduit to do that, then he will own the best frontier model.
• 17:43
  Ejaaz: For years, we've been grading these AI models on random arbitrary benchmarks
• 17:47
  Ejaaz: for general intelligence.
• 17:48
  Ejaaz: And Zuck just came along and said, just make a product that people actually like.
• 17:52
  Ejaaz: And it got me thinking about this a bit more, which is kind of like my second thesis.
• 17:56
  Ejaaz: I've never viewed meta in a favorable light, If I'm being completely honest,
• 18:03
  Ejaaz: there's the whole thing around data transparency issues, them taking our data
• 18:06
  Ejaaz: and creating extremely addictive products.
• 18:08
  Ejaaz: I believe they had to settle like a multi-billion dollar court case recently
• 18:12
  Ejaaz: because it was proven that they were doing exactly that.
• 18:15
  Ejaaz: But since then, Meta has also had a strong pivot, especially when it comes to
• 18:18
  Ejaaz: the AI stuff around privacy and owning your own keys. There's a version of Metamuse
• 18:22
  Ejaaz: that's actually coming out a month from now that is going to be even more private
• 18:26
  Ejaaz: than the one that they have right now.
• 18:27
  Ejaaz: And that stems from what I'm guessing to be is good product DNA.
• 18:32
  Ejaaz: I mean, it's obvious when you kind of like just look at the numbers,
• 18:35
  Ejaaz: Meta owns some of the most engaging, lucrative, high network effects,
• 18:40
  Ejaaz: social media platforms ever.
• 18:42
  Ejaaz: When you look at WhatsApp, Instagram, Facebook, Threads, which is their most
• 18:47
  Ejaaz: recent launch, and now Meta Muse, they're all viral hit products.
• 18:51
  Ejaaz: So Meta basically knows how to build a product that can connect to many different
• 18:55
  Ejaaz: people. So they were to try and build the best AI model for 99% of the rest
• 19:00
  Ejaaz: of the world that aren't AI nerds.
• 19:02
  Ejaaz: They probably have the chops to build it. So I'm realizing they have the right product DNA.
• 19:06
  Ejaaz: But who could be the competitor to Meta? Well, I was talking to producer Luke
• 19:10
  Ejaaz: before I started recording this episode, and I realized that
• 19:13
  Ejaaz: one thing that OpenAI has done extremely well is build all the necessary features
• 19:18
  Ejaaz: to have the best AI agent, like what Meta is doing, for themselves.
• 19:23
  Ejaaz: They have amazing voice capabilities. They have amazing image capabilities.
• 19:28
  Ejaaz: Amazing frontier general intelligence with GPT-6 Astra, really sick at coding.
• 19:33
  Ejaaz: But combining all of them together hasn't been something that they've been able to pull off.
• 19:38
  Ejaaz: OpenAI, in my opinion, is one good product person away from building the best
• 19:42
  Ejaaz: AI agent product, and I'm still holding out that they're able to do it.
• 19:45
  Ejaaz: Now I look at Anthropic, and I'm like, okay, these are the nerds that are focused
• 19:49
  Ejaaz: on coding, and they are very, very good at it. They're staying in their lane.
• 19:52
  Ejaaz: I don't expect a good AI agent that's intuitive for 99% of the rest of the people, but that's okay.
• 19:57
  Ejaaz: Anthropik is going off to a different market. Then I look at Google and I think.
• 20:01
  Ejaaz: Google is the only other company that has arguably more or better data and distribution than Meta has.
• 20:09
  Ejaaz: Think about it. Like Google touches search, they touch work productivity across
• 20:14
  Ejaaz: the entire G Suite. They have Google Maps, they have the Android hardware side of things.
• 20:19
  Ejaaz: That data moat is so lucrative and yet they still haven't been able to put out
• 20:24
  Ejaaz: a frontier model, let alone a brand new AI agent, or even come up with the idea of doing that.
• 20:29
  Ejaaz: They haven't been able to pull it off. And that comes down to product DNA.
• 20:32
  Ejaaz: So the final point I'll make is, when it comes to strategy, I think Meta has
• 20:38
  Ejaaz: been able to tap into a brand new source that none of these other AI companies have found.
• 20:44
  Ejaaz: Even OpenAI, who has all the necessary components, still doesn't have as wide a distribution as Meta.
• 20:50
  Ejaaz: Meta has business building at scale for a large number of users,
• 20:55
  Ejaaz: OpenAI is still a private startup which requires a lot of cash up front in order to fund compute.
• 21:01
  Ejaaz: And that brings me to my final point, which is compute. Meta is in a world where
• 21:06
  Ejaaz: I guess they've proven that if you pay enough money,
• 21:09
  Ejaaz: you can definitely play at the frontier, which then gives me hope that SpaceX
• 21:13
  Ejaaz: AI or SpaceX SI, I think he renamed the entire company to SpaceX Superintelligence,
• 21:19
  Ejaaz: Elon Musk will still be able to compete because there's a lot of capital.
• 21:21
  Ejaaz: I think they're raising around $40 billion to do exactly this right now as I'm
• 21:25
  Ejaaz: recording this episode. And so it becomes a wall between, do you have the right product DNA?
• 21:32
  Ejaaz: Do you have the right resources? Are you spending those resources in the right way?
• 21:36
  Ejaaz: And do you have enough cash to fund this entire thing? It becomes a cash game
• 21:41
  Ejaaz: when you actually know what you're doing.
• 21:43
  Ejaaz: Meta's got all of that going for them right now, as well as going after a brand
• 21:47
  Ejaaz: new territory. And I wonder if Anthropic or mainly OpenAIR will follow suit.
• 21:52
  Ejaaz: But anyway, that is basically my thoughts on this entire thing
• 21:55
  Ejaaz: if i sound a little frantic or if my hair looks a little frazzled or if you're
• 21:59
  Ejaaz: unhappy with the lighting i'm sorry i am in kyoto i'm in japan i'm here on a
• 22:05
  Ejaaz: family holiday but i was chatting to luke every day this week and i was like dude,
• 22:10
  Ejaaz: there's just too much going on and we need to put out episodes i want to put
• 22:14
  Ejaaz: out episodes i actually promised him that this is going to be a short episode and.
• 22:18
  Ejaaz: I doubt this is sorry luke if you're in the process of editing this right now but the idea here is
• 22:23
  Ejaaz: messes change things around and when i look at their stock from an investment
• 22:29
  Ejaaz: perspective when i look at how people are treating them or at least viewing them in the,
• 22:35
  Ejaaz: I think it's largely asymmetric at this point.
• 22:38
  Ejaaz: I think people still look upon
• 22:40
  Ejaaz: Meta unfavorably, and obviously there are other reasons than is just AI.
• 22:44
  Ejaaz: But Zux made it pretty clear that he wants to go all in here,
• 22:48
  Ejaaz: and that is the future of Meta.
• 22:50
  Ejaaz: So it makes sense to at least talk about it, at least for a bit on a single
• 22:53
  Ejaaz: episode, whilst I'm jet-lagged as hell. Anyway, that is the end of the episode.
• 22:57
  Ejaaz: Thank you so much for listening.
• 22:59
  Ejaaz: If any of you have been to Kyoto or Japan before, please give me Rex.
• 23:03
  Ejaaz: I'm going to be here for another four days. So you're going to be getting more
• 23:06
  Ejaaz: jet lagged episodes at odd hours of the night. You don't even want to know what time it is over here.
• 23:11
  Ejaaz: And yeah, let me know about the feedback for this episode and previous episodes.
• 23:15
  Ejaaz: If you haven't checked out any of the previous episodes that we've started releasing,
• 23:17
  Ejaaz: please let me know. The feedback, by the way, from you guys have been astounding.
• 23:21
  Ejaaz: There's been so much support coming from you guys, a bunch of really helpful
• 23:26
  Ejaaz: bits of feedback. I'm trying to figure this whole solo thing out.
• 23:29
  Ejaaz: But it's helpful to know that like you know being out of a studio and just kind
• 23:32
  Ejaaz: of like talking to you face to face which is something actually that i personally
• 23:36
  Ejaaz: enjoy a hell of a lot more is good so.
• 23:38
  Ejaaz: I'm just going to start doing more of that but if you enjoyed this episode and
• 23:42
  Ejaaz: you're listening to it on youtube spotify apple or wherever you listen to and
• 23:45
  Ejaaz: you aren't subscribed or you haven't given us a rating or you haven't given
• 23:48
  Ejaaz: us a thumbs up or if you haven't turned off notifications
• 23:51
  Ejaaz: please do so it helps us out massively and yeah if you want to share it with a friend please do
• 23:56
  Ejaaz: and what else oh yeah we're spinning up our newsletter back twice a week hopefully
• 24:01
  Ejaaz: very soon getting the x thing sorted as well and you know trying to iron out
• 24:05
  Ejaaz: a few other kinks before we kind of get into our stride but
• 24:09
  Ejaaz: i love hearing from you guys please dm me please let me know anything and everything
• 24:12
  Ejaaz: if you disagree with me i would love to hear from you as well and yeah i will
• 24:16
  Ejaaz: see you on the next one thank you so much for listening see you guys on today's
• 24:19
  Ejaaz: episode of in the loop brought to you by qualcomm.