Latest / The PAUSE with Ari Clibe / Listening for Footsteps: A Ten-Year Old Singer on Attention and Play, with Virginia Sexton (S4E1)

Transcript

Listening for Footsteps: A Ten-Year Old Singer on Attention and Play, with Virginia Sexton (S4E1) · The PAUSE with Ari Clibe

• 0:14
  Asmr. Asmr. I bet you don't even know what it
• 0:18
  stands for. A satisfying.
• 0:29
  Radio.
• 0:32
  Okay, asmr.
• 0:39
  You're listening to the Pause, providing sanctuary
• 0:44
  for the Wild Ones, streaming worldwide at www.radiokcn.com
• 0:51
  in Knoxville.
• 0:55
  I've been thinking a lot about what it means to really
• 0:59
  listen to someone without deciding too quickly
• 1:03
  who they are, what they're trying to say,
• 1:07
  or where the conversation is supposed to go.
• 1:10
  This is the first episode of season four of the Pause podcast,
• 1:14
  and it felt right to begin with Virginia Sexton.
• 1:19
  You know her as Ginny, who was on the show last year
• 1:23
  and is now 10 years old. We recorded this conversation
• 1:28
  outside in Denver on a bright sunny day a
• 1:32
  few hours before heading to Red Rocks to hear Trevor Hall.
• 1:36
  Ginny sings, she acts,
• 1:39
  she dances, she performs,
• 1:42
  and she has ideas about who she is
• 1:46
  becoming. And I came into this conversation, as I often
• 1:51
  do, with a few ideas of my own about where we might go.
• 1:54
  But one of the things I'm trying to understand this season is what
• 1:58
  happens when the person in front of me doesn't go where I expect them
• 2:03
  to go. There's a temptation when you're
• 2:07
  hosting a conversation to keep steering,
• 2:10
  to keep asking the next question, to keep making
• 2:13
  meaning, to quietly insist that the guest follow
• 2:18
  whatever structure you've imagined. And with Ginny,
• 2:22
  that doesn't work for very long. She changes the subject.
• 2:26
  She eats a brownie, she sings a song,
• 2:29
  she notices something I didn't notice, she decides
• 2:33
  she wants to act. And eventually I
• 2:38
  find myself trying to teach her something about listening,
• 2:41
  which is already a little dangerous because
• 2:45
  the person who thinks they're teaching listening may be the one who needs
• 2:49
  to listen themselves. That's where this episode
• 2:52
  became interesting to me. Not because Ginny gives some polished answer
• 2:57
  about creativity or growing up. She doesn't.
• 3:00
  She's 10. She's moving, she's trying things.
• 3:05
  She contradicts herself, she gets bored,
• 3:08
  she gets excited. She wants to start over.
• 3:11
  And somewhere inside all of that, the form of
• 3:15
  the conversation begins to change. Season four is going
• 3:19
  to be an inquiry into listening but not listening as politeness
• 3:24
  and definitely not listening as extraction,
• 3:28
  but listening as a willingness to be altered by
• 3:32
  another person. The Pause has always asked you
• 3:36
  to listen with. I think this season I'm asking myself to
• 3:40
  do the same. Here's Virginia Sexton.
• 3:45
  Maybe we could just start by having you talk a little bit about,
• 3:49
  you know, a little bit about your background. You didn't do much of that last
• 3:52
  time you were on. No, not really. And I think you're almost a year older.
• 3:56
  And we're sitting in a beautiful sunny
• 4:00
  day in Denver, Colorado. We're preparing to listen to
• 4:05
  Trevor Hall. It's an annual pilgrimage
• 4:09
  or two that we make as well as Trevor's guests at
• 4:13
  Red Rocks, which is a great listening amphitheater. So maybe
• 4:18
  tell us, Ginny, a little bit about you.
• 4:21
  It's so great to be back, Ari. So, yeah, I was born
• 4:26
  February 24, 2016, and Sheboygan,
• 4:30
  Wisconsin, which makes you now 10. Makes me,
• 4:34
  yeah. 10 now. Wow. So you completed what grade of school?
• 4:38
  Fourth grade. Fourth grade. Okay. And that means you have how many
• 4:42
  years left of elementary school? One. Just one left.
• 4:48
  You want to tell us a little bit more about what it's like to be
• 4:52
  in the summer break going into fifth grade?
• 4:55
  Awesome. Working on my tan.
• 5:00
  I see you smiling. What's that smile about?
• 5:04
  I don't. I don't know,
• 5:11
  But yeah, just. I like being on summer
• 5:15
  break. Like I can finally hang out with my family. No homework,
• 5:19
  no reading assignment, no writing.
• 5:22
  God, I hate writing. You hate writing? I hate writing and reading class.
• 5:26
  Really? Well, I. I hate writing like pair,
• 5:30
  like. Like multi pair paragraph papers.
• 5:35
  Oh, you mean like writing essays at school?
• 5:38
  Like if I'm writing. Like, I hate when people tell me you
• 5:43
  have to write this, but, like if I like. Like if I'm writing a
• 5:47
  book. Yeah, that's. Yeah, that's different. So that's creative writing.
• 5:51
  Yeah. So you love creative writing? It's not really, like.
• 5:54
  I wouldn't say it's. I don't love it, but I can
• 5:58
  do it sometimes. Okay. Have you ever written a song?
• 6:03
  No. No. Okay, but.
• 6:07
  So what are we talking about today? Love.
• 6:11
  We're talking about. How about your love Life?
• 6:17
  Well, I'm 10, so maybe. No,
• 6:22
  maybe, like about just like my
• 6:26
  life. Life in general. Like, you know, all that. You want to talk
• 6:30
  about school more? Sure. I'm gonna be fifth grade and
• 6:34
  I'm gonna be sad that next year I'm leaving my school. I can imagine.
• 6:38
  You've been there for how many years now? Five? Six? Yeah. This year when
• 6:43
  I go back, it'll be six. Yeah. It's a good long time. You probably have
• 6:47
  a lot of friends. Yeah. Do you know where you're gonna go after?
• 6:51
  No. No? Is that on your mind or you
• 6:55
  don't really care? It's on my mind. What's it like to be here
• 6:59
  right now in Colorado?
• 7:02
  Pretty nice. What'd you do last night?
• 7:05
  Last night I went to the
• 7:10
  Holiday Inn in Boulder and
• 7:14
  went to the concert there with my mom. And they did this whole
• 7:17
  thing where there's like a backdrop and everybody. They went
• 7:21
  row by row and everybody got a picture with Trevor and they're sending it to
• 7:25
  them. So. Yeah, that was pretty cool. How did Trevor
• 7:29
  sound? Good. Per. Use.
• 7:32
  Funny. Oh, he's funny. Yeah, he's very funny.
• 7:36
  He has a good sense of humor. I remember
• 7:40
  you said something to me about what people do after they're sad.
• 7:44
  Yeah. What did I tell you? You told
• 7:48
  me. Oh, yeah.
• 7:52
  After nine, 11, whenever they. They sing, they sing.
• 7:55
  They do. It's actually very. It's natural.
• 8:00
  Like, they don't think about it, they just do it. Yeah.
• 8:03
  So those songs are usually come from singing. Comes from sadness,
• 8:06
  and it can come from happiness, too. So how about I sing a couple songs
• 8:11
  for you? Oh, yeah, I have. I'll have to pull up
• 8:15
  the lyrics. So I will be right back. Okay, sure.
• 8:34
  She's very poised this year, I have to say. You know, while she's going
• 8:38
  in to get her probably some tablet device so
• 8:43
  she can read the lyrics, I'm noticing a distinct
• 8:47
  change in her. Guess we're all changing at some point.
• 8:51
  Ginny, she's coming from a different place.
• 8:56
  So I really like starting our seasons with Jenny
• 9:00
  here. And now she's here. She's got her tablet.
• 9:03
  You want to come here in the shade? Yeah, it might
• 9:07
  be better. Yeah. The sun and tablets are not the best.
• 9:11
  No, not really. Okay. So we're sitting on pretty comfortable little
• 9:16
  outdoor patio furniture. He's wearing a very beautiful
• 9:21
  color. Pink. My favorite pink Trevor hall shirt,
• 9:25
  my favorite. Which says, my love is just a reminder
• 9:29
  from the song. A reminder you want
• 9:34
  me to. I'm gonna sing two songs. One of them is by Rainbow Kitten Surprise.
• 9:38
  And one of them is by Cat's Eye. Beautiful. Okay,
• 9:42
  so I'll sing the Rainbow Kittens first. It's called
• 9:46
  Mr. Redundant. It was made in 2013.
• 9:50
  Do you need me to hold tempo or anything like that? No, I think I'll
• 9:53
  just do it. Okay, cool. Is my mic slow?
• 9:56
  Yeah. Okay. Got on you down
• 10:01
  to Kings Cross station Where the cross kids was smoking
• 10:05
  in the street Mr.
• 10:08
  Redundant's got a boy in London
• 10:12
  Asking questions no one had a right.
• 10:37
  I saw the crosses of the empty cathedrals
• 10:41
  with prospects hanging out in bars Mrs.
• 10:46
  F got a man who preaches with the Beatles
• 10:50
  Believed love is all you name.
• 11:06
  D.
• 11:15
  I've come to say hello
• 11:20
  to curling up with the ball still feeling
• 11:24
  better than you do Better than you do
• 11:28
  oh, what you say here come to
• 11:32
  Right now A little junk But I'll let you know Said
• 11:37
  I'll let you know.
• 11:48
  Well, the pre game was bad but the postman
• 11:52
  was worse than the president Kept saying stuff
• 11:56
  that we've already heard so we kept the TV off and
• 12:00
  I got done right now songs and I know you come to
• 12:04
  hate if you ever knew what they were about so don't
• 12:08
  shout at me like I'm across the room when right
• 12:12
  here when you're right this time
• 12:16
  we'll do better in another life in
• 12:21
  another time with another.
• 12:39
  Hello they're curling up with the
• 12:43
  bar they're feeling better than you Better
• 12:47
  than you do oh, what you
• 12:51
  say Here comes right now A little junk
• 12:55
  But I'll let you know Said I'll let you know
• 12:59
  Will you step inside right now?
• 13:02
  We're doing fine but we'll let you know Said
• 13:06
  we'll let you know Got on
• 13:10
  you down to Kings Cross station Where the Cross
• 13:14
  kids were smoking in the street Mr.
• 13:19
  Redundant's got a boy in London Asking
• 13:23
  questions no one had a right to be.
• 13:50
  So. Yeah, and then I have also. Yeah.
• 13:53
  Let me just give you some feedback on that. Yeah.
• 13:56
  Because, you know, this season I'm focused on interviewing
• 14:01
  and having conversations around, listening. And I want you to just look up at the
• 14:05
  tree right there, Ginny. Okay.
• 14:10
  Yeah. And see, like, how the leaves are moving and
• 14:14
  creating that kind of movement, like,
• 14:19
  picture, like all those are, like, your fans listening
• 14:23
  and responding. Like they're waving to you and they're blowing in
• 14:39
  Were you able to hear them when you were singing?
• 14:44
  Yeah, I also heard
• 14:48
  a plane overhead. What? Did you hear the plane overhead?
• 14:52
  No. And did you hear the saw, Electric saw
• 14:55
  over there? Yeah. You heard that, right? Thank you. I got
• 14:59
  a cosmic brownie. Ginny's sister Layla just walked in and now
• 15:04
  enjoying a brownie together. An ASMR brownie.
• 15:09
  Layla's very shy, but she's responsible for most
• 15:13
  of the social media posts. So just everyone
• 15:17
  knows who she is. She's smiling now.
• 15:22
  Leia's very generous. She's bringing important
• 15:26
  sustenance to Ginny.
• 15:29
  So you want to tell us a little bit about the mood of that song
• 15:34
  by. By Rainbow Kitten Surprise.
• 15:37
  Yeah. Rainbow Kitten Surprise. Yeah, it's kind of feel good,
• 15:41
  like upbeat, but at the same time,
• 15:47
  like slow dance,
• 15:52
  you know? Yeah, I got a little bit of,
• 15:55
  like, a feeling of sort of going with the flow.
• 15:59
  Yeah. I'm not good at that. You were not good at that.
• 16:03
  Well, you sung it really beautifully. I was. I love the song.
• 16:07
  Thank you. You're just saying the rest of your life, that's not easy for you
• 16:11
  to go. Go along with the flow.
• 16:15
  Yeah, but I can relate to that. The next song is
• 16:19
  My Way by Cat's Eye. This song is kind of like.
• 16:22
  Like, even if I get in trouble, even if I everything falls apart,
• 16:27
  I did this my way and I'm proud of it, you know? Kind of like
• 16:29
  that. I like that. Yeah, like that. Yeah.
• 16:32
  Okay.
• 16:50
  This episode of the Pause podcast is
• 16:54
  supported by Knoxville Community Media,
• 16:57
  helping make space in community for independent
• 17:01
  conversations, creative risk, and the kind of listening
• 17:05
  that takes its time. Learn more@Knox CM.org
• 17:10
  and now back to the Pause.
• 17:30
  Okay, guys, I'm gonna eat. I'm gonna eat a baby Bell.
• 17:35
  Stop. Stop. You don't have to actually go
• 17:38
  like this all the time. You can just, like, talk. Okay. You don't have to
• 17:42
  do this. Okay. Seriously, you just don't.
• 17:47
  ASMR. ASMR.
• 17:51
  Do you know what ASMR is? No,
• 17:54
  you don't. ASMR.
• 17:58
  ASMM. Listen to that
• 18:01
  baby. Okay, let's see if it worked. So the next song
• 18:06
  is called My Way. It's by Cat's Eye. So. Yeah.
• 18:11
  Wake up, mama's mad cause I stayed
• 18:15
  up sneaking out trying to meet with someone I
• 18:18
  shouldn't see Picking up what's wrong with
• 18:22
  me My house sometimes
• 18:26
  it gets too loud so I wait till my girls pull
• 18:30
  up in their dads and threes Careful that we don't
• 18:34
  lose those keys Never
• 18:38
  want to do what I'm told Even if I mess it
• 18:42
  all up and make a million mistakes at
• 18:48
  least I can say that I did it my way
• 18:53
  glass pedal like 95 flowing
• 18:59
  me down and if I.
• 19:06
  Like a firework showing up over your top Even
• 19:11
  if it opens oh, I did it in my way Big
• 19:17
  cat, big girls in the all stare yeah
• 19:22
  I tried to fit in your box of pink Barbie dolls
• 19:25
  But I still couldn't win them all I
• 19:29
  kind of miss being I'm the knife cuz I now I realize
• 19:34
  growing up growing up being what it seems and now I just live for today
• 19:39
  and if I make a couple mistakes I'd only stuck inside that
• 19:45
  I did it my way yeah, that's better.
• 19:49
  And that's better. Like 95 flying eastbound
• 19:53
  hands up, no slowing me down I
• 19:59
  know this I can like a firework showing
• 20:03
  up over your town Even if it
• 20:07
  opens down I did it my way awesome.
• 20:13
  Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful.
• 20:16
  Yeah. I love the way you just riffed
• 20:20
  that in a way that felt just so heartfelt,
• 20:24
  like real yeah. And then they look
• 20:29
  like. Take your time, Take your time. We don't need you choking on
• 20:33
  the. On the pause here. That brownie just needs to go in
• 20:37
  your belly. That's it. Another riff that I want to do. It's like a riff,
• 20:41
  and I just like it because it. It's like a vocal warm
• 20:45
  up. Warm up. I do. Okay. It's like, it's Lush or not Lush Life.
• 20:50
  It's Stateside by Zara
• 20:54
  Larson, and it has a riff at the end that I really like. You want
• 20:58
  to do that next? Yeah, just real quick. It's just like a couple years.
• 21:00
  Okay, cool.
• 21:08
  Hey, I've been touring stateside,
• 21:10
  kissing my Swedish boy over FaceTime.
• 21:14
  Oh, no. Opening up and making my head
• 21:18
  a line boost. That's my ego boost. Scheduling bills
• 21:23
  for a minute. I'm that girl up in.
• 21:32
  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Nice. That was really,
• 21:36
  like, up and down your vocal registry. Yeah.
• 21:39
  Register. I'm sorry? The registry. Register. Yeah. That was cool.
• 21:42
  I like that one. So that was a little warmy. Just a warm up.
• 21:45
  I do. Yeah. Nice. Warm up.
• 22:05
  A quick thank you to Knoxville Community Media for
• 22:09
  supporting this season of the Pause podcast. Their support helps
• 22:14
  us keep making these conversations and sharing them with
• 22:17
  you. You can find them@KnoxCM.org
• 22:21
  and RadioKCM.com now
• 22:26
  back to Ginny.
• 22:34
  I also like doing acting. I thought we would do
• 22:38
  some acting. Oh, sure. Remember we used to call Mike Mikey,
• 22:43
  Mikey, Mike. You can still call Mikey Mike, Mikey,
• 22:46
  Mike, unless you feel that's too. Baby, there's a lot
• 22:50
  of change going on in you.
• 22:53
  I've noticed a lot of change since last year.
• 22:57
  I'm not going to talk about it. Right.
• 23:01
  It's that Wisconsin. I don't like to talk about stuff.
• 23:08
  So. Yeah, okay. Some acting challenges. Yeah, we're gonna do some acting
• 23:12
  now. So first of all, it's. We're gonna
• 23:16
  start with some simple syllables. It's like a little
• 23:20
  warm up thing. Okay. And our goal is to. We were doing it a little
• 23:23
  bit earlier with the asmr.
• 23:28
  So you can say. Here's the rules. You can say A,
• 23:31
  A, S, S, M, M,
• 23:35
  R, R in any order you want. You don't have to say
• 23:38
  them in A, S, M, A, R. Right. You don't have to say them.
• 23:42
  And you can say them any tempo you want. And our
• 23:46
  goal is to see if we can synchronize so that we can guess the
• 23:50
  next letter that each of us say. I just wanted to do some acting.
• 23:54
  That's like a warm up. So we're practicing our pronunciation
• 23:59
  so we can understand each other clearly,
• 24:02
  and we're just trying to listen and riff off each other.
• 24:06
  But you can't look at me. You need to look at
• 24:10
  me. You need to look at me. In order to
• 24:13
  act, you must look at each other. You must see each other.
• 24:17
  I was looking at the bush. Saw something in the
• 24:20
  bush. Oh, no. Oh, no, no. I was looking at them.
• 24:24
  No, no. Is there. Is that. Is that moving? No,
• 24:28
  I think it is. Is this acting? Are we
• 24:32
  doing acting? We are. Okay. I think the bush moved.
• 24:38
  I think I saw something in the bushes. I see
• 24:42
  what you're seeing, and it's making me kind of a little bit creepy.
• 24:48
  Yeah, yeah, you got me morbid
• 24:52
  kind of stuff now. Where are you going?
• 24:56
  Okay, okay, let's restart. How about we do some
• 25:00
  acting challenges? You got.
• 25:07
  Yeah,
• 25:11
  well, I have to. Oh, okay. I got it.
• 25:15
  How about I'm, like, in,
• 25:19
  like, with my girlfriend, you know, and we're
• 25:23
  going through a corn maze at the abandoned
• 25:28
  creepy farm for Halloween,
• 25:32
  and you're like,
• 25:35
  the creepy farmer that comes and gets us,
• 25:39
  and it's scary. Who's us?
• 25:42
  Me and my friends. You and your friends?
• 25:46
  Yeah, we're going to the corn maze. Where are they, these friends? The corn
• 25:50
  maze at the corn maze with me.
• 25:55
  Okay, go.
• 25:59
  And, like, I'm the friend who's like, guys, we shouldn't be doing this. This is
• 26:03
  kind of scary. Like, this is. You know, I'm the scary cat.
• 26:06
  Okay, so tell me when at him.
• 26:11
  Cameras rolling. Action. Guys, I really don't
• 26:15
  think we should be going down this corn maze. You know, the guy is,
• 26:18
  like, 80. Okay, maybe his.
• 26:22
  He is blind, but he can aim.
• 26:26
  Did you guys hear that? I'm not a scaredy
• 26:30
  cat. See, I just heard it again.
• 26:35
  Whatever. What you doing? My corn maze.
• 26:40
  Did you guys hear that? It sounded like a voice.
• 26:44
  Guys, do you hear those footsteps?
• 26:47
  Okay, guys, I hear footsteps.
• 26:52
  There's somebody changing. Guys, I think
• 26:56
  that was the old farmer. We should probably leave now. Guys, we have
• 26:59
  to go. He's right there.
• 27:08
  You're eating my corn. No.
• 27:12
  What are you doing here? This. Ah.
• 27:18
  Run. Hide.
• 27:22
  Hide. Ah. He's coming to get me.
• 27:27
  Why does he not run? He's so old.
• 27:39
  Teach these little ones never to
• 27:43
  come to my maze.
• 27:47
  Leave me alone with my corn.
• 27:49
  Leave us alone with your corn.
• 28:09
  The Pause podcast with Ari Clive is made possible with support
• 28:13
  from Knoxville Community Media, serving Knoxville since
• 28:18
  1975 as a public forum for local voices,
• 28:22
  free expression, and community storytelling. Learn more.
• 28:26
  Make something or support local media@Knox
• 28:30
  CM.org I
• 28:34
  keep thinking about how much of that conversation was me trying to make
• 28:38
  something happen, and how much more interesting it became when
• 28:43
  I stopped insisting on the form. You know,
• 28:47
  Ginny didn't really want any of my acting exercises.
• 28:53
  She wanted to make one of her own.
• 28:57
  And once she did, there we were in
• 29:02
  a corn maze with an old farmer,
• 29:05
  listening for footsteps that weren't there.
• 29:09
  That feels like a pretty good place to begin this season.
• 29:14
  Listening maybe isn't about becoming passive.
• 29:19
  It's maybe about staying available long enough for
• 29:24
  something you didn't plan to arrive. I thought
• 29:29
  I was helping Ginny listen, but by the end, I'm not
• 29:33
  so sure who was teaching whom. This is the Pause
• 29:37
  with Ari, Clive, and thanks for listening.
• 29:47
  Foreign,
• 29:53
  You've been listening to the pause on radio kcm knoxville.