Latest / Deep Tech Germany – AI, Robotics & Frontier Innovation by Startuprad.io™ / Raising US VC: JC2 Ventures' Yvette Kanouff

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Raising US VC: JC2 Ventures' Yvette Kanouff · Deep Tech Germany – AI, Robotics & Frontier Innovation by Startuprad.io™

• WEBVTT 1 00:00:48.915 --> 00:00:52.410 This is Joe from Startupradio dot Joe, your startup podcast and 2 00:00:52.410 --> 00:00:55.629 YouTube blog from Germany, bringing you another 3 00:00:55.850 --> 00:00:59.469 interview in startuprate. Io. 4 00:00:59.769 --> 00:01:03.525 But this time, we don't have a guest who has 5 00:01:03.985 --> 00:01:07.585 a big relation to Germany. But we do 6 00:01:07.585 --> 00:01:11.140 have Yvette here, a VC based, as I 7 00:01:11.140 --> 00:01:14.680 just learned, on the outskirts of New York City. Hey. How you doing? 8 00:01:15.300 --> 00:01:18.494 Hi. How are you? Good to have good to be here. Thank you so much 9 00:01:18.494 --> 00:01:21.295 for inviting me. It's a pleasure to have you here. 10 00:01:22.255 --> 00:01:26.000 Be before we get into what you did, 11 00:01:26.000 --> 00:01:29.440 and there there's a lot of interesting stuff you did and what we can talk 12 00:01:29.440 --> 00:01:33.040 about, I would like to put the 13 00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:36.325 interview in perspective because a lot of German, 14 00:01:36.945 --> 00:01:40.625 Austrian, Swiss based Startupradio, tech startups, they 15 00:01:40.625 --> 00:01:44.325 need to look abroad when they want to raise serious money, 16 00:01:44.600 --> 00:01:48.439 serious a, serious b stage around that. So that's why 17 00:01:48.439 --> 00:01:51.880 we thought today we do an interview with a US based 18 00:01:51.880 --> 00:01:55.315 investor and get your perspective from the outside 19 00:01:56.255 --> 00:01:59.935 in, what is interesting in this industry, what is 20 00:01:59.935 --> 00:02:03.490 not interesting, and the few how we can 21 00:02:03.490 --> 00:02:07.170 approach investors like you. Happy to talk about it. Yes. 22 00:02:07.170 --> 00:02:10.709 But first, let me introduce you a little bit because, 23 00:02:11.555 --> 00:02:15.235 you are very interesting. You received numerous industry 24 00:02:15.235 --> 00:02:18.055 awards. I I have to look it up because there are a lot. 2020 25 00:02:18.755 --> 00:02:22.250 lifetime Achievement Emmy for Engineering and Technology, 26 00:02:22.790 --> 00:02:26.409 National Cable and Television Association, Wengard Award 27 00:02:26.470 --> 00:02:29.944 for Leadership in Science and Technology, named industry 28 00:02:30.004 --> 00:02:33.525 pioneer and Emmy for your work in video on demand at c 29 00:02:33.525 --> 00:02:36.600 change, named an industry 30 00:02:37.720 --> 00:02:41.420 one of the 11 most influential women in television industry, 31 00:02:41.800 --> 00:02:45.580 and consistently being ranked as one of the top 32 00:02:45.995 --> 00:02:49.675 100 industry executives. And I when I read 33 00:02:49.675 --> 00:02:53.135 this, I had two observations because first, what completely 34 00:02:53.355 --> 00:02:57.060 astonished me is you have 2 degrees in mathematics. No 35 00:02:57.060 --> 00:02:59.080 production, no filming, no camera. 36 00:03:00.660 --> 00:03:03.815 How did you end up in the, 37 00:03:04.275 --> 00:03:08.035 more or less, video on demand TV industry? And, of course, 38 00:03:08.035 --> 00:03:10.570 you're a mathematician. Can you tell us a good math joke? 39 00:03:12.810 --> 00:03:16.570 You know, by default, when you're a mathematician, you you have to 40 00:03:16.570 --> 00:03:20.345 have no sense of humor. They don't allow us to be able to tell jokes. 41 00:03:20.585 --> 00:03:23.165 It's one of the requirements before we graduate. 42 00:03:24.665 --> 00:03:28.345 We're very dry. So, but what I will 43 00:03:28.345 --> 00:03:31.870 say is that, I'm very much a deep technologist. 44 00:03:32.090 --> 00:03:35.870 I was working on AI long before it was cool 45 00:03:35.930 --> 00:03:39.745 recently, a very, very long time back when we had to do our 46 00:03:39.825 --> 00:03:43.424 own algorithms and we didn't have all the amazing AI toolsets that 47 00:03:43.424 --> 00:03:46.805 exist today to make it so easy to low code, no code. 48 00:03:47.670 --> 00:03:51.510 But, but I went into the television industry. I was 49 00:03:51.510 --> 00:03:55.050 working as a as a serious mathematician doing pattern recognition 50 00:03:55.270 --> 00:03:59.004 algorithms for the Department of Defense. And, and 51 00:03:59.004 --> 00:04:02.705 I heard that the that we were trying to, go to digital 52 00:04:02.925 --> 00:04:06.760 get digital signals and lay fiber. And, and and I 53 00:04:06.760 --> 00:04:10.360 thought well, I that's all mathematics to figure out how to get digital signals through 54 00:04:10.360 --> 00:04:13.900 fiber. And, and so that's what led me to the television 55 00:04:14.040 --> 00:04:17.845 industry. And I am very proud of having a Lifetime Achievement Emmy, 56 00:04:17.845 --> 00:04:20.904 which is usually people think of for actors and actresses, 57 00:04:21.820 --> 00:04:25.200 but mine is truly for television engineering and technology 58 00:04:25.420 --> 00:04:29.180 development. So streaming, DVD, App Store, many 59 00:04:29.180 --> 00:04:32.985 things that everybody uses today that I'm quite proud of 60 00:04:32.985 --> 00:04:35.805 having a piece of, of the development of. 61 00:04:36.665 --> 00:04:40.470 Just out of curiosity, you have a Emmy. How high would you rate your 62 00:04:40.470 --> 00:04:43.830 acting skills? I don't have any of those. Yes. I I 63 00:04:43.830 --> 00:04:47.565 guarantee that my acting skills had nothing to do with my 64 00:04:47.565 --> 00:04:51.245 Emmy. Yes. But I'm very I'm very proud of the 65 00:04:51.245 --> 00:04:54.880 academy because the academy is of television arts 66 00:04:54.960 --> 00:04:58.580 and sciences, and we typically watch the arts part on 67 00:04:58.640 --> 00:05:02.195 on, on the award shows. But the science is 68 00:05:02.435 --> 00:05:06.215 is very important, for for for signal, for compression, 69 00:05:06.275 --> 00:05:09.235 for delivery, for creating streaming, for for for, 70 00:05:10.530 --> 00:05:14.050 cameras, all of that, plays a role in the, 71 00:05:14.289 --> 00:05:17.650 on the sciences side. And it's the same Emmy, so quite proud of 72 00:05:17.650 --> 00:05:21.085 that. Yes. When when I read when I read all of 73 00:05:21.085 --> 00:05:24.865 that, I was expecting to see a lot of TV 74 00:05:24.925 --> 00:05:28.670 outlets in this v, like NBC, ABC. Okay. I have to 75 00:05:28.670 --> 00:05:32.510 admit I found Time Warner and PBS, but I was quite 76 00:05:32.510 --> 00:05:35.730 surprised that you started your career as a senior 77 00:05:35.950 --> 00:05:39.315 radar engineer for radar systems at Lockheed 78 00:05:39.315 --> 00:05:42.854 Martin. You also have been a senior 79 00:05:42.914 --> 00:05:46.730 VP, senior vice president at Cisco, and you have been a president 80 00:05:46.730 --> 00:05:50.490 at NASDAQ listed SeaChange, a supplier of video 81 00:05:50.490 --> 00:05:54.295 delivery systems. Would you say you're a tech 82 00:05:54.295 --> 00:05:57.815 geek? Yes. No doubt. I'm definitely I am 83 00:05:57.815 --> 00:06:01.030 definitely a geek. Yeah. That's for sure. But, 84 00:06:01.730 --> 00:06:05.410 but I, I start you know, I think that when you 85 00:06:05.410 --> 00:06:09.010 when you when you rise up to a president level from, 86 00:06:09.465 --> 00:06:13.065 from from pretty serious technology and it ties in with 87 00:06:13.065 --> 00:06:16.825 investments and being a VC as well. It's always good to 88 00:06:16.825 --> 00:06:20.540 really understand the technology, and it's really it's really good to be 89 00:06:20.540 --> 00:06:24.380 able to dive in deep with the technical teams. And, of course, if you're too 90 00:06:24.380 --> 00:06:28.065 technical and you don't understand the business and the finances and and and 91 00:06:28.065 --> 00:06:31.824 and those trade offs, that's not good 92 00:06:31.824 --> 00:06:34.485 either. So I I just I just learned the latter, 93 00:06:35.330 --> 00:06:38.770 later later in life, you know, to how to run a business, product 94 00:06:38.770 --> 00:06:42.130 management, of all of the all of the other aspects 95 00:06:42.130 --> 00:06:45.955 of of, running a company. I see. So I 96 00:06:45.955 --> 00:06:49.735 assume you run your your complete home on a raspberry pi. 97 00:06:51.155 --> 00:06:54.960 Yeah. Or or or, or or alternatives. Right? You have to 98 00:06:54.960 --> 00:06:58.740 have some, you have to have your fault tolerance built in. 99 00:06:59.039 --> 00:07:02.884 I see. So now that, we have kind of set the 100 00:07:02.884 --> 00:07:06.645 frame, who you are, what you did, pretty impressed. Actually, you're the 101 00:07:06.645 --> 00:07:10.229 first Emmy award winner ever on my show. I do have a lot of 102 00:07:10.229 --> 00:07:13.990 other winners of, prestigious award. But Emmy, that's the 103 00:07:13.990 --> 00:07:17.805 first one. I'm I'm still short of an Oscar winner, so 104 00:07:17.965 --> 00:07:21.645 maybe we can talk about this later. Yes. There's 105 00:07:21.645 --> 00:07:25.405 always tomorrow. You have, and and, maybe a Grammy. You 106 00:07:25.405 --> 00:07:28.760 should just really diversify. Oh, yeah. 107 00:07:28.820 --> 00:07:32.600 Yes. Exactly. You're here, 108 00:07:33.380 --> 00:07:37.015 because you're an US based investor and you already 109 00:07:37.475 --> 00:07:41.175 have an investment here in Germany. It's called Ditron. 110 00:07:41.315 --> 00:07:44.695 It's in Kassel in in the state of Hessen in the north. 111 00:07:45.560 --> 00:07:49.320 A little bit off the beaten path, but I do believe they 112 00:07:49.320 --> 00:07:52.895 are making some pretty cool stuff there. Can you talk just a 113 00:07:52.895 --> 00:07:56.675 tiny bit about what they are doing? So Ddrone is an anti drone company. 114 00:07:56.735 --> 00:08:00.335 Very, very interesting. You know, when we talk about drones, we think about this kind 115 00:08:00.335 --> 00:08:03.320 of drone or that kind of drone. We don't tend to think about the drone 116 00:08:03.320 --> 00:08:06.840 threat. And so what the drone is, if you if you, 117 00:08:08.360 --> 00:08:12.185 they, Menninger. So take an airport, for example. 118 00:08:12.185 --> 00:08:16.025 You remember that there have been several incidences where drones have have 119 00:08:16.025 --> 00:08:19.625 interrupted air traffic. An airport can can see 120 00:08:19.625 --> 00:08:23.190 drone activity in the area. They can actually triangulate the 121 00:08:23.190 --> 00:08:27.030 drone source. In defense cases, you could actually 122 00:08:27.030 --> 00:08:30.685 take action on the drone. Right? So so, the need 123 00:08:30.685 --> 00:08:33.904 for drone, realization, understanding, 124 00:08:34.365 --> 00:08:38.059 using artificial intelligence to do things like this tree triangulation. 125 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:42.780 Very, very interesting company to as an anti drone, 126 00:08:43.640 --> 00:08:47.405 as an anti drone company. So they are based in Kasia 127 00:08:48.025 --> 00:08:51.785 and, and, very, 128 00:08:51.785 --> 00:08:55.550 very, very interesting technology. So we we 129 00:08:55.550 --> 00:08:59.310 can already tell you are interested in deep tech and 130 00:08:59.310 --> 00:09:03.010 green tech. Do you see a future for the German and overall 131 00:09:03.070 --> 00:09:06.514 European Startupradio in this direction? Well, 132 00:09:06.894 --> 00:09:10.415 I do. I think that especially in Germany, I mean, you 133 00:09:10.415 --> 00:09:13.970 have government subsidies and help for start ups in the 134 00:09:13.970 --> 00:09:17.329 green side. I mean, there's a big energy push, that 135 00:09:17.490 --> 00:09:20.690 that's very, very strong in Europe. And, 136 00:09:21.250 --> 00:09:25.005 so I I think that that that's a that that's a a real opportunity. I 137 00:09:25.005 --> 00:09:28.045 think that there are a lot of, there's a lot of focus on that both 138 00:09:28.045 --> 00:09:31.500 from the government and the start up side. So clean energy, 139 00:09:31.800 --> 00:09:35.560 I think, manufacturing optimization. There's 140 00:09:35.560 --> 00:09:39.075 certain things that I really think are are are strong 141 00:09:39.215 --> 00:09:42.815 where you're at, Joe. And, and I think that in 142 00:09:42.815 --> 00:09:46.400 general, in the world, it will continue to be to be more, 143 00:09:46.820 --> 00:09:50.420 and more important. And maybe a mix too. Let's let's be 144 00:09:50.420 --> 00:09:52.280 honest. Right? Maybe it's it's also, 145 00:09:54.115 --> 00:09:57.714 optimizing or automating or making more efficient and green 146 00:09:57.714 --> 00:10:01.175 energy. I think that that mix is also valuable. I see. 147 00:10:02.060 --> 00:10:05.899 We we here to talk about the 148 00:10:05.945 --> 00:10:09.660 StartupRadio from, your outside perspective as well 149 00:10:09.660 --> 00:10:13.485 as the outside in perspective, meaning the outside 150 00:10:13.485 --> 00:10:17.324 perspective, what you see of the German German speaking StartupRadio 151 00:10:17.324 --> 00:10:21.140 scene, and also how start ups from here can 152 00:10:21.140 --> 00:10:24.360 approach you. What are some 153 00:10:24.740 --> 00:10:28.495 interesting trends you see you kind of have an eye on if we 154 00:10:28.495 --> 00:10:31.475 talk about Germany or the the the broader 155 00:10:32.175 --> 00:10:36.010 area here in terms of startups. We we already 156 00:10:36.010 --> 00:10:38.510 talked about the drone, drone defense. 157 00:10:40.010 --> 00:10:43.850 Anything else? Maybe video compression, video on 158 00:10:43.850 --> 00:10:45.855 demand discussed. 159 00:10:47.995 --> 00:10:51.675 Well, I think that video on demand when when I was on 160 00:10:51.675 --> 00:10:55.510 the on the, team creating that, you 161 00:10:55.510 --> 00:10:59.110 know, think about it. We had nothing. It wasn't now streaming, everybody 162 00:10:59.110 --> 00:11:02.870 opens their phone and their laptop and starts streaming. Every time they do, 163 00:11:02.870 --> 00:11:06.464 I'm very proud. But at the time, 164 00:11:06.925 --> 00:11:10.605 you have to invent things before you know you need them. 165 00:11:10.605 --> 00:11:14.430 I remember very distinctly people telling me, Yvette, you're silly. People 166 00:11:14.430 --> 00:11:18.190 don't wanna watch video when they wanna watch it. People are fine waiting till 167 00:11:18.190 --> 00:11:21.755 8 PM on Tuesday night to watch that show. And, 168 00:11:22.154 --> 00:11:25.595 and you have to believe and you have to to to to push for a 169 00:11:25.595 --> 00:11:29.435 change. So, and I'll talk about it in a minute, Joe, because 170 00:11:29.435 --> 00:11:33.000 it does matter. Creating a better compression to get just a 171 00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:36.540 tiny bit better signal is very less disruptive 172 00:11:37.160 --> 00:11:40.775 than changing an industry and changing the way that we would that we 173 00:11:40.775 --> 00:11:44.535 watch content. Right? So that disruption becomes more important. Today, 174 00:11:44.535 --> 00:11:48.340 people are looking for something big disruptive as opposed to moving an inch 175 00:11:48.340 --> 00:11:52.100 to a better product that was disrupted yesterday. So so the 176 00:11:52.100 --> 00:11:55.800 example you brought up is a good example, but we could come up with 1,000. 177 00:11:55.945 --> 00:11:58.925 Right? Which is, are you really disrupting a market? 178 00:11:59.545 --> 00:12:03.385 And, you asked me about Germany. So I think 179 00:12:03.385 --> 00:12:06.980 that, you know, things I think about with Germany, love 180 00:12:06.980 --> 00:12:10.820 Germany, by the way. Fun fact. I was raised in 181 00:12:10.820 --> 00:12:14.245 Germany. And, clean 182 00:12:14.245 --> 00:12:17.925 energy, I think, that you already brought up, I think is very strong 183 00:12:17.925 --> 00:12:21.493 in manufacturing. Matter of fact, Germany, the country, very strong in manufacturing and on the 184 00:12:21.493 --> 00:12:22.105 industrial side. 185 00:12:26.410 --> 00:12:29.630 Fintech. There have been a lot of Fintech focus and 186 00:12:30.010 --> 00:12:33.845 successes. And I think health also, also, 187 00:12:33.845 --> 00:12:37.445 I mean, as a as a United States based, just 188 00:12:37.445 --> 00:12:41.110 person, I would say beyond tech. Right? Everybody knows knows what, 189 00:12:41.350 --> 00:12:45.050 what happened there, some years ago. So so, 190 00:12:45.670 --> 00:12:49.395 you know, it's it's on the radar of, of 191 00:12:49.395 --> 00:12:52.835 of people in general, but I wouldn't say that, 192 00:12:53.154 --> 00:12:56.835 your Silicon Alley is is is yet is known as the 193 00:12:56.835 --> 00:13:00.660 Silicon Valley. Right? Joe, so that that 194 00:13:00.660 --> 00:13:03.540 that at a high level in terms of you know what? The other thing I 195 00:13:03.540 --> 00:13:06.840 think of consumer goods, you do a lot on on the, consumer 196 00:13:07.535 --> 00:13:11.215 delivery and optimization and even health care delivery. They'll you've had 197 00:13:11.215 --> 00:13:14.895 some successes there too. Mhmm. Yes. Yes. Yes. 198 00:13:14.895 --> 00:13:17.900 Yes. Yes. Interesting perspective. 199 00:13:19.080 --> 00:13:22.460 You said But, Joe, you have to tell me you can't ask me the perspective 200 00:13:22.520 --> 00:13:26.315 without commenting. Do you disagree? If you disagree with me, I'd love to 201 00:13:26.315 --> 00:13:29.995 know. No. No. I I I actually, would completely agree. 202 00:13:30.235 --> 00:13:33.639 BioNTech actually is not too far away here, in the 203 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:37.160 city of Mainz, and they're using the tax proceeds to 204 00:13:37.160 --> 00:13:40.759 really build a biotech hub. And we 205 00:13:40.759 --> 00:13:44.005 already had 2 of the companies 206 00:13:44.145 --> 00:13:47.985 there, already established in the interview. 1 of 207 00:13:47.985 --> 00:13:51.620 them is already listed on Nasdaq, and the other one is 208 00:13:51.620 --> 00:13:55.380 very early stage. A very smart lady. She's a 209 00:13:55.380 --> 00:13:58.920 professor at University of Mainz, and she is working 210 00:13:59.460 --> 00:14:03.135 on a technology to, make 211 00:14:03.135 --> 00:14:06.755 it easier to transplant, organs, 212 00:14:07.055 --> 00:14:10.640 to transplant, stem cells, in order 213 00:14:10.640 --> 00:14:14.240 to therapy, leukemia, for example. But 214 00:14:14.240 --> 00:14:17.935 she's still waiting for her first for 215 00:14:17.935 --> 00:14:21.615 her first patient, at the stage of the interview. But 216 00:14:21.615 --> 00:14:25.215 there's a lot of activity going on. And I do 217 00:14:25.215 --> 00:14:28.640 believe that is something that doesn't always grab 218 00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:32.240 the headline attention, but it's something we do 219 00:14:32.540 --> 00:14:36.115 except for appearing on StartupRadio. How 220 00:14:36.115 --> 00:14:39.795 would a start up get your attention? Well, you just answered. 221 00:14:39.795 --> 00:14:43.635 It's you, Joe. But, I 222 00:14:43.635 --> 00:14:47.190 think, it's a really good question because 223 00:14:47.410 --> 00:14:50.769 because I think, creating that that 224 00:14:50.769 --> 00:14:54.444 that interconnection is 225 00:14:54.444 --> 00:14:58.045 magical. And and it's the right question to ask because, 226 00:14:58.365 --> 00:15:02.200 startups wanna know who who do I go pitch. Right? I have my pitch deck. 227 00:15:02.200 --> 00:15:05.960 How can I get in front of more people? And to your 228 00:15:05.960 --> 00:15:09.775 question of, you know, looking at the US VC market, 229 00:15:09.775 --> 00:15:13.295 how can I especially get into US VCs? Right? And, 230 00:15:13.935 --> 00:15:17.570 NVCs are bombarded with everybody. Right? You're always getting 231 00:15:17.570 --> 00:15:21.250 an email with somebody's pitch deck or a one pager. Right? And, 232 00:15:21.730 --> 00:15:25.170 it is impossible to keep up with all the people that email me and say, 233 00:15:25.170 --> 00:15:28.915 read this, read this, read this. So I think that that the the the 234 00:15:28.915 --> 00:15:32.675 the magic I'm gonna I'm going to give you the answer in 235 00:15:32.675 --> 00:15:36.410 a different form, which is instead of just trying 236 00:15:36.870 --> 00:15:40.550 to crowdsource or trying to just say, I'm I'm throwing 237 00:15:40.550 --> 00:15:44.329 it out there and seeing what will stick. It's creating meaningful relationships. 238 00:15:44.495 --> 00:15:47.935 It's the same as your customer base. How do I find customers? I have a 239 00:15:47.935 --> 00:15:51.775 great product. Why won't everybody buy it? Because you have to 240 00:15:51.775 --> 00:15:55.480 create meaningful relationships. And so you should look at UVC community the way that 241 00:15:55.480 --> 00:15:59.000 you look at your sales community. It's a network. It's something that you invest in 242 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:02.665 long term. It's something you invest in before you need funding. Funding is 243 00:16:02.665 --> 00:16:06.185 hard. It's become more and more difficult in in the US as well as 244 00:16:06.185 --> 00:16:09.385 Germany worldwide. It's, it's it's it's it's, 245 00:16:10.650 --> 00:16:14.030 it's been it's been a very difficult, last year. 246 00:16:14.410 --> 00:16:17.530 And so, so being at all of the, 247 00:16:18.250 --> 00:16:22.065 being at the events, it's not something about where can I send my deck 248 00:16:22.065 --> 00:16:25.425 to or how can I get the right introduction when I need it? It's it's 249 00:16:25.425 --> 00:16:29.200 about, creating long term relationships with VCs at 250 00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:32.880 VC events, but being in the communities. I 251 00:16:32.880 --> 00:16:36.464 think that, take Germany, for example, 252 00:16:36.524 --> 00:16:40.365 and and, I'll take a couple of companies that I'm close with like 253 00:16:40.365 --> 00:16:44.210 Siemens. Right? And Siemens is very very, caring 254 00:16:44.210 --> 00:16:47.910 about the StartupRadio community, and they reach out to the start up community. 255 00:16:48.050 --> 00:16:51.730 But go one step further. Have relationships with your companies. By the way, many 256 00:16:51.730 --> 00:16:55.535 companies have have VC arms. Right? They do they do here. Right? 257 00:16:55.535 --> 00:16:58.975 And they and, they do there. So it's not just investing in 258 00:16:58.975 --> 00:17:02.790 them. It's it's networking beyond them with several companies 259 00:17:02.790 --> 00:17:06.150 and then extending that into the US market, into the VCs in the 260 00:17:06.150 --> 00:17:09.905 US. Most people just look at it at a very tactical way. You 261 00:17:09.905 --> 00:17:13.424 have to look at this strategic, and you have to grow that network. It's it 262 00:17:13.424 --> 00:17:16.005 takes time, effort, and it's worth it. 263 00:17:18.349 --> 00:17:21.890 And the the the kind of, the bottom line that I see, it's easier 264 00:17:22.190 --> 00:17:25.950 to get a, like, a first meeting in person at an 265 00:17:25.950 --> 00:17:29.465 event with you or one of your colleagues, then 266 00:17:29.465 --> 00:17:33.085 just, sending out, like, a gazillion of emails. Because 267 00:17:33.145 --> 00:17:36.820 personal experience, there there is not a lot of 268 00:17:36.820 --> 00:17:40.500 people who would reply to those emails. I 269 00:17:40.500 --> 00:17:44.245 think that I I I agree everything you said is is is 270 00:17:44.245 --> 00:17:47.845 exactly my point. But why do so 271 00:17:47.845 --> 00:17:51.529 many send the emails and go that route? I get so many a day and, 272 00:17:51.529 --> 00:17:54.809 Joe, you have to know what I'm talking about. I'm sure you see the same. 273 00:17:54.809 --> 00:17:58.585 Right? It is the easiest way. I do something once I put it 274 00:17:58.585 --> 00:18:02.285 into a into, you know, mail bombardment. But, 275 00:18:02.825 --> 00:18:06.585 many of these VC events, and, again, go start with the 276 00:18:06.585 --> 00:18:10.200 German one. Right? Because the German ones can expand. People know 277 00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:14.040 people. You have one person there. You'll get invited to 1 in the US. And 278 00:18:14.040 --> 00:18:17.625 I think that if you start that cycle and you understand how to network, many 279 00:18:17.625 --> 00:18:21.385 of these include speed dating, is is what we call it in the US. 280 00:18:21.385 --> 00:18:24.905 Right? Where you get 15 minutes with the Startupradio you actually take the time to 281 00:18:24.905 --> 00:18:28.110 say I'm doing 15 minutes, 15 minutes, 15 minutes, 15 minutes. 282 00:18:28.330 --> 00:18:31.870 Practice a really tight pitch that's 15 minutes 283 00:18:32.170 --> 00:18:35.950 and see if you get that follow-up. And those kind of events are magical 284 00:18:36.010 --> 00:18:39.725 and much, much better. And even if you don't get invited 285 00:18:39.725 --> 00:18:43.405 to 1 of the 15 minute sessions, be there at the dinners, be there for 286 00:18:43.405 --> 00:18:47.130 the for the discussions, Again, it's a long term investment, 287 00:18:47.190 --> 00:18:50.389 and everybody knows everybody. It's a small community. So, 288 00:18:51.029 --> 00:18:54.675 so so that network is very worthwhile. 1st, did a 289 00:18:54.675 --> 00:18:58.275 a a a a little geeky detail here. I 290 00:18:58.275 --> 00:19:02.090 know speed dating works not only for online dating. Actually, I do 291 00:19:02.090 --> 00:19:05.530 have a friend who's a very geeky computer scientist. We gave him a 292 00:19:05.530 --> 00:19:09.290 birthday present to go for speed dating. Somebody had to watch him. That was 293 00:19:09.290 --> 00:19:11.935 me, and I actually met my wife there. Oh my goodness. 294 00:19:13.035 --> 00:19:16.415 Congratulations on that too. Well, this would be VC 295 00:19:16.563 --> 00:19:19.775 Startupradio dating, and let's assume it's the same. Exactly. 296 00:19:20.155 --> 00:19:23.250 Exactly. But for me personally, 297 00:19:23.870 --> 00:19:27.470 it was it will be also interesting to find the 298 00:19:27.470 --> 00:19:31.125 right events because as we talked about the emails, like, 299 00:19:31.125 --> 00:19:34.265 there there are a million emails, there are a million 300 00:19:34.485 --> 00:19:37.945 events. How would I find the right ones, 301 00:19:38.399 --> 00:19:41.600 the interesting ones? Right. And so and so, 302 00:19:42.240 --> 00:19:45.600 I have my I have my favorite. You have your 303 00:19:45.600 --> 00:19:49.435 favorite, which we we won't we won't share. But, 304 00:19:50.155 --> 00:19:53.935 but I think that, you have to get into 305 00:19:54.395 --> 00:19:57.800 the right area first. Right? It's the it's the same as networking. 306 00:19:58.100 --> 00:20:01.700 It's the same as as as sales. You get as close as you 307 00:20:01.700 --> 00:20:05.544 can and you leverage that network to get to the next step. So I 308 00:20:05.544 --> 00:20:08.985 said I would say, let's say for example, you're very tight with, 309 00:20:09.625 --> 00:20:13.360 a good venture group in Germany. You start with that venture group and go to 310 00:20:13.360 --> 00:20:16.799 those events and you really look at the attendee list and you see who's there 311 00:20:16.799 --> 00:20:19.575 that's in the group that you'd like to be invited to and then you go 312 00:20:19.575 --> 00:20:22.294 talk to those people and see if you can get invited to that group the 313 00:20:22.294 --> 00:20:25.655 next time. Let's say you're not in that venture circle in 314 00:20:25.655 --> 00:20:29.490 Germany, but let's say you have, a good customer circle. 315 00:20:29.710 --> 00:20:33.470 Ask to be introduced to your customers venture arms and go to their events, right, 316 00:20:33.470 --> 00:20:36.530 because they have the right people. All of again, it's a small community 317 00:20:36.995 --> 00:20:40.835 and, and and and it's and it's truly worthwhile to network 318 00:20:40.835 --> 00:20:44.515 in that community. The the job of a CEO is hard. 319 00:20:44.515 --> 00:20:48.130 Right? Because you're trying to sell. You're focused on your technology. 320 00:20:48.590 --> 00:20:51.870 You need to find the right product market fit. You're focused on marketing and you 321 00:20:51.870 --> 00:20:55.250 need to focus on your investments. You need to be looking at your prior rounds, 322 00:20:56.545 --> 00:21:00.305 always as as opposed to, you know, don't look at it just 6 months 323 00:21:00.305 --> 00:21:03.825 in advance. You should be close with that with that industry. So it's, 324 00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:08.320 something to add to your to your day to day job for sure. And when 325 00:21:08.320 --> 00:21:11.975 you attend those events, is it more important to have? I 326 00:21:11.975 --> 00:21:15.495 already know the answer, but I I I want to have it again from 327 00:21:15.495 --> 00:21:19.335 you. Is it more important to have 70 pages of pitch deck 328 00:21:19.335 --> 00:21:22.809 with you, a one pager or business card or both? 329 00:21:23.270 --> 00:21:27.050 I think that, now you just do an electronic LinkedIn connect. 330 00:21:28.025 --> 00:21:31.625 So so no business card. And, I think 331 00:21:31.625 --> 00:21:35.005 that, you wanna capture somebody's, interest. 332 00:21:35.360 --> 00:21:38.480 So the biggest thing is what you can say with your words. You don't need 333 00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:42.160 a deck. 1 pager to leave somebody with is fine, but it's 334 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:45.025 all about the story. Have your story well and crisp. 335 00:21:45.985 --> 00:21:49.745 Joe, if I can just if I can just pivot for a second about that 336 00:21:49.745 --> 00:21:53.540 story. Right? Because the key is what 337 00:21:53.780 --> 00:21:57.480 makes a VC interested? Forget US 338 00:21:57.540 --> 00:22:01.300 or or or if you're if you're in India or if you're in 339 00:22:01.300 --> 00:22:04.615 in in Germany, why do I like you? Right? 340 00:22:05.075 --> 00:22:08.455 And and for for for us, our criteria, 341 00:22:09.075 --> 00:22:11.890 and I think for most VCs, the very first thing 342 00:22:12.450 --> 00:22:15.970 is, the people. Right? You have a 343 00:22:16.130 --> 00:22:19.910 I'm a serial entrepreneur. I've taken I have this many unicorns 344 00:22:19.970 --> 00:22:23.805 in my, in, in in my past. Right? Or I'm a first it's a 345 00:22:23.805 --> 00:22:26.945 first time and I just finished sending out 50,000 346 00:22:27.725 --> 00:22:30.980 emails and they didn't work. So that's my first pitch to you and I'm not 347 00:22:30.980 --> 00:22:34.740 succinct. Right? All of those things matter. So you really need to 348 00:22:34.740 --> 00:22:38.100 get your story about the people right as to why I should trust you and 349 00:22:38.100 --> 00:22:41.385 your team. I have the best team. I have a proven team. 350 00:22:42.245 --> 00:22:46.005 My team has lots of experience and I and I believe in 351 00:22:46.005 --> 00:22:49.630 you. That's the first criteria. If you show up with a 352 00:22:49.630 --> 00:22:53.330 bad pitch or you show up with 75 pages to your question, Joe, 353 00:22:53.550 --> 00:22:57.195 it's a tough, It's it's an uphill battle. Right? You're probably not gonna 354 00:22:57.195 --> 00:23:00.174 get very far, and you're saying, I finally was invited to the party, 355 00:23:01.274 --> 00:23:05.050 and I failed. Right? So so do your homework for the party. 356 00:23:05.050 --> 00:23:08.490 Call Joe. Joe will Joe will help you. He knows what to do at the 357 00:23:08.490 --> 00:23:12.225 party. What, but I think the second 358 00:23:12.225 --> 00:23:15.825 part is that you have to be in a market transition. Right? The 359 00:23:15.825 --> 00:23:19.350 market transition is very important to us. So so, 360 00:23:19.590 --> 00:23:22.970 I say that because because you said earlier 361 00:23:23.430 --> 00:23:27.210 better compression for video versus versus inventing 362 00:23:27.270 --> 00:23:31.015 streaming. Inventing streaming changed the world. Better compression? I 363 00:23:31.015 --> 00:23:33.895 don't know if people care. I don't know what people would pay. Are you gonna 364 00:23:33.895 --> 00:23:36.955 pay more for your streaming every month because it's a better compression? 365 00:23:37.620 --> 00:23:41.380 Maybe, maybe not. Right? It's difficult that somebody every day comes up to 366 00:23:41.380 --> 00:23:44.659 me to say, I'm going to make streaming better because I have a better user 367 00:23:44.659 --> 00:23:47.885 interface, because I have a better compression, because I have a better this. I have 368 00:23:48.045 --> 00:23:51.485 I can we I have, technology to share videos, to do video 369 00:23:51.485 --> 00:23:55.080 parties. There are so many things to make it one step better, 370 00:23:55.220 --> 00:23:58.820 but is it disruptive enough like the first invention was? 371 00:23:58.820 --> 00:24:02.425 Right? And, and so that 372 00:24:02.425 --> 00:24:06.025 disruption is really, really important. You have to have something different. You have to 373 00:24:06.025 --> 00:24:09.440 differentiate yourself from everybody else, and then we go way 374 00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:13.120 deep. We we will go to the customer base. We'll talk to our 375 00:24:13.120 --> 00:24:16.895 friendly customers because we have a huge connection. I work with 376 00:24:16.895 --> 00:24:20.335 John Chambers, who's a legend in Silicon Valley, and, 377 00:24:21.855 --> 00:24:25.550 and we use our own connections to to to to say, is this a 378 00:24:25.550 --> 00:24:29.150 right market fit product market fit? Would you buy this? Even 379 00:24:29.150 --> 00:24:32.825 though you don't even know the Startupradio yet. So so all of those 380 00:24:32.825 --> 00:24:36.505 things matter, and you have to have all of the things that you're trying to 381 00:24:36.505 --> 00:24:40.345 accomplish in your pitch deck, in your mind, and say I 382 00:24:40.345 --> 00:24:43.980 have to have an elevator pitch. I'm on the 383 00:24:43.980 --> 00:24:47.740 elevator between floor 1 and, say, floor 5, not 384 00:24:47.740 --> 00:24:51.425 floor 25. Floor 5 floors. Do I have a pitch 385 00:24:51.425 --> 00:24:55.265 short enough to answer those questions? I'm super the best team. 386 00:24:55.265 --> 00:24:58.930 I have a disruptive technology for a market transition that's going to rock your 387 00:24:58.930 --> 00:25:02.450 world. Five stories. You gotta practice that. Then you've gotta do the 388 00:25:02.450 --> 00:25:06.244 15 minute pitch, you know, for the, 389 00:25:06.244 --> 00:25:09.765 for, for that type of speed dating environment, right? Where you're doing 390 00:25:09.765 --> 00:25:13.605 VC after VC after VC and, and then have your 391 00:25:13.605 --> 00:25:17.060 longer deck. But if you always have the 80 pages, you you you you 392 00:25:17.060 --> 00:25:20.740 won't you know, you'll be lucky to get far. It's it's it's an uphill battle. 393 00:25:20.740 --> 00:25:24.495 But does that make sense, Joe? I mean, that that criteria Yeah. Yeah. It does. 394 00:25:24.495 --> 00:25:27.855 It quicker and tougher. It totally makes sense. And 395 00:25:27.855 --> 00:25:31.695 actually, that is something that has gotten easier over the 396 00:25:31.695 --> 00:25:35.160 years because many people it 397 00:25:35.280 --> 00:25:38.340 it's very easy to come up with a 80 slide presentation. 398 00:25:38.800 --> 00:25:42.405 It's much harder to come up with an 8 slide presentation. 399 00:25:42.865 --> 00:25:46.705 But when I was talking about this, it's gotten easier. There 400 00:25:46.705 --> 00:25:50.290 are a lot of tools out there to help you first do an very 401 00:25:50.290 --> 00:25:53.890 impressive presentation. I know that matters a little bit. And 402 00:25:53.890 --> 00:25:57.730 secondly, also, tools like Chat GPT who help you just to 403 00:25:57.730 --> 00:26:01.445 summarize 80 slides into 8 slides. They can help you 404 00:26:01.445 --> 00:26:05.205 with that. Because if you're an entrepreneur by yourself, 405 00:26:05.205 --> 00:26:08.990 it's very, very, very hard to really cut down 406 00:26:08.990 --> 00:26:12.770 all the things you you thought about, all the all the details 407 00:26:12.830 --> 00:26:15.970 you want to include that highlights, what makes you different. 408 00:26:16.590 --> 00:26:19.855 But actually, a really good trick that, 409 00:26:20.175 --> 00:26:24.015 somebody told me, one of my former bosses, was try to 410 00:26:24.015 --> 00:26:27.529 explain it to your grandma. Yeah. 411 00:26:27.529 --> 00:26:31.289 Yeah. As a mathematician too. Yeah. She doesn't 412 00:26:31.289 --> 00:26:34.970 get the details here and there and this, and she doesn't even know Disney 413 00:26:34.970 --> 00:26:38.795 plus. But if you could explain it to your grandma that 414 00:26:38.795 --> 00:26:42.475 she'll understand, you're set. That is a that it 415 00:26:42.635 --> 00:26:46.000 that is good advice, Joe. That is very good advice. When I 416 00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:49.360 started, I I, you know, I started on the super 417 00:26:49.360 --> 00:26:53.200 techie, geeky side. And, when people told me I need to bring 418 00:26:53.200 --> 00:26:56.794 it to 1 page, I would just change the font size. I've learned much since 419 00:26:56.794 --> 00:27:00.315 then. You know? So the grandma is a good idea, and I 420 00:27:00.315 --> 00:27:03.914 think, Joe, the other thing that's really changed is the financial criteria has 421 00:27:03.914 --> 00:27:07.390 gotten, much more, stringent. So 422 00:27:07.610 --> 00:27:11.210 it used to be that, I would believe in you, Joe, and you're 423 00:27:11.210 --> 00:27:14.906 pitching to me, and I've and I've been through 2 startups with you in the 424 00:27:14.906 --> 00:27:18.508 past. And I think now there it's a show me instead of 425 00:27:18.508 --> 00:27:22.160 believe me stage. It's gotten worse over the last 24 months. 426 00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:25.280 You have to show me your growth. You have to show me your growth in 427 00:27:25.280 --> 00:27:29.040 much more stringent time periods. You have to show me a 428 00:27:29.040 --> 00:27:32.565 much more aggressive growth. It's, 429 00:27:32.804 --> 00:27:36.644 people would like to see a, I 430 00:27:36.644 --> 00:27:38.885 think that VCs in general are are, 431 00:27:40.410 --> 00:27:44.010 the you know, you you you know well. Right? The growth is is 432 00:27:44.010 --> 00:27:47.770 different for different size of of of of revenue. But, but, 433 00:27:47.770 --> 00:27:51.245 again, that that criteria gets gets stricter and stricter. And, 434 00:27:51.805 --> 00:27:55.645 and so I think really focusing on the financials in addition to the 435 00:27:55.645 --> 00:27:59.060 grandmother stories is is very 436 00:27:59.060 --> 00:28:02.820 important because a lot of pitches to me focus 437 00:28:02.820 --> 00:28:06.365 on how cool my technology is. And then I talk about the money, and they 438 00:28:06.365 --> 00:28:09.245 say, well, Yvette, you're gonna help me with that. And I just think, wow. If 439 00:28:09.245 --> 00:28:12.845 you don't have that ready and you don't understand that, that's a that's a big 440 00:28:12.845 --> 00:28:16.110 miss, especially on early seed. Mhmm. And, 441 00:28:16.590 --> 00:28:20.350 also, what what I've experienced in my 442 00:28:20.350 --> 00:28:23.795 life is a lot of the people who have, like, the 443 00:28:23.795 --> 00:28:27.575 technical details and all the stuff, the product hammered out, 444 00:28:27.795 --> 00:28:31.360 they completely believe you just need 1, 2, 445 00:28:31.360 --> 00:28:35.120 3,000,000. You throw them into marketing. The marketing guys will 446 00:28:35.120 --> 00:28:38.625 do something with it and then you're good. That doesn't work 447 00:28:38.625 --> 00:28:42.385 anymore. Right? That is so right. You are so right. And which is why 448 00:28:42.385 --> 00:28:45.980 I say, think about all the answers before you do your presentation 449 00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:49.580 and make sure that you can give all those answers in the various 450 00:28:50.360 --> 00:28:53.914 sizes, extra small, like an elevator pitch 451 00:28:54.135 --> 00:28:57.815 to to to small, like 15 minutes to medium and 452 00:28:57.815 --> 00:29:01.575 large and extra large. And, and, and it's amazing 453 00:29:01.575 --> 00:29:05.080 how most of them will be smaller medium pitches. And you have to 454 00:29:05.080 --> 00:29:07.500 capture you have to capture a VC's, 455 00:29:09.240 --> 00:29:13.054 interest in that short period of time because your only goal is 456 00:29:13.054 --> 00:29:16.815 to follow-up. Your goal is not to let them understand the detail of slide 457 00:29:16.815 --> 00:29:20.230 number 157. It's really just to get the 458 00:29:20.230 --> 00:29:23.830 follow-up meeting. Actually, I do believe if you can 459 00:29:23.830 --> 00:29:27.370 make a VC sit in to slide 157, 460 00:29:28.424 --> 00:29:32.025 he or she is already very interested. This is 461 00:29:32.025 --> 00:29:35.725 true. I don't know if I've ever seen that, though, Joe. Have you? 462 00:29:36.105 --> 00:29:39.690 157. That's a lot. He gave me a very, very 463 00:29:39.690 --> 00:29:43.050 new way to think about the pitches. So you 464 00:29:43.050 --> 00:29:46.495 have x s. It's like the one pager, you have the s 465 00:29:46.495 --> 00:29:50.335 pitch, the m pitch, and maybe somewhere there's the x l 466 00:29:50.335 --> 00:29:53.919 pitch. But basically, you just use it as, 467 00:29:54.320 --> 00:29:58.080 in German, we would say, as a collection of slides that you 468 00:29:58.080 --> 00:30:01.840 can throw together, to make shorter pictures. Yes. Yes. That's 469 00:30:01.840 --> 00:30:05.595 right. And and and, not just the sizes, but 470 00:30:06.135 --> 00:30:09.815 but know what your goal is of the meeting because many people think I'm 471 00:30:09.815 --> 00:30:13.519 looking for that technical depth. I need to get that into your head about how 472 00:30:13.519 --> 00:30:17.200 amazing my solution is. And, that should not be your goal. 473 00:30:17.200 --> 00:30:20.500 Right? So when we look at things, I gave you that criteria, the people, 474 00:30:20.905 --> 00:30:24.745 the market transition, the total disruption as to why you're gonna be 475 00:30:24.745 --> 00:30:27.785 successful and how am I gonna make money and how long is it gonna take. 476 00:30:27.785 --> 00:30:31.500 Right? Joe so so you have to look at it from my perspective and 477 00:30:31.500 --> 00:30:35.259 give that and and and think of that as you create those size 478 00:30:35.419 --> 00:30:38.235 sized, decks. Also, for me, 479 00:30:39.415 --> 00:30:43.115 many people, when they start out in the Startupradio scene, like the 480 00:30:43.175 --> 00:30:46.270 very first month of fundraising. 481 00:30:47.290 --> 00:30:50.890 They believe they have, like, as we talked about, a very long 482 00:30:50.890 --> 00:30:54.684 extensive pitch check. They have one scheduled appointment 483 00:30:54.985 --> 00:30:58.825 with the VC, and at the end of the pitch, the VC will get 484 00:30:58.825 --> 00:31:02.200 out his checkbook and write a check. That's not working 485 00:31:02.200 --> 00:31:05.799 anymore. How how would you say you should be 486 00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:09.019 prepared? Because for me, personally, I would approach it, 487 00:31:09.399 --> 00:31:12.605 get to know them in person, like attend the right events. 488 00:31:13.065 --> 00:31:16.445 Then you go and, do, like, an online presentation, 489 00:31:16.905 --> 00:31:20.240 like the s or the m pitch deck as we talked about. 490 00:31:20.620 --> 00:31:24.299 And then maybe you should also, kind 491 00:31:24.299 --> 00:31:28.000 of, get to know the the people in person. 492 00:31:28.445 --> 00:31:31.905 Visit them again, Silicon Valley, New York, 493 00:31:32.365 --> 00:31:36.205 Chicago, wherever they are. Yes. That's right. That 494 00:31:36.205 --> 00:31:39.750 that would make a lot of difference if you visit 495 00:31:39.890 --> 00:31:43.650 the VCs again. And and then at one point, they'll get 496 00:31:43.650 --> 00:31:47.434 out the checkbook, but it will be a long process. Yes. As a 497 00:31:47.434 --> 00:31:50.975 matter of fact, I don't I don't, I mean, we're a we're a very 498 00:31:51.434 --> 00:31:54.815 close community and and, you know, in the VC 499 00:31:56.190 --> 00:31:59.410 world. So we all we all talk to each other quite often. 500 00:31:59.950 --> 00:32:03.710 But, but but that is, that's not the way 501 00:32:03.710 --> 00:32:07.375 we do it at all. Right? So we have we have, you know, a 502 00:32:07.375 --> 00:32:11.135 100 to 1, rejections of 503 00:32:11.135 --> 00:32:14.810 of ones that we even, show interest in. So you have to 504 00:32:14.810 --> 00:32:18.170 come in looking at a very high failure 505 00:32:18.170 --> 00:32:22.010 rate probability. And, and I think 506 00:32:22.010 --> 00:32:24.615 that what you do is you want in the first meeting, you want a second 507 00:32:24.615 --> 00:32:28.155 meeting. In the second meeting, you'd like to have a meeting with a larger team. 508 00:32:28.295 --> 00:32:31.415 Right? And in the third meeting, you'd like to have a second meeting with the 509 00:32:31.415 --> 00:32:35.220 larger team. In the in the next meeting, you'd like to have somebody that falls 510 00:32:35.220 --> 00:32:38.660 in love with this technology product, market 511 00:32:38.660 --> 00:32:42.265 disruption, whatever it is that's that's super exciting about your 512 00:32:42.265 --> 00:32:45.485 about your particular pitch. It's gonna take many meetings, 513 00:32:46.265 --> 00:32:49.920 and and and and it almost always involves a larger team. 514 00:32:50.720 --> 00:32:54.400 And and like I said, from our standpoint, we then wanna talk to 515 00:32:54.400 --> 00:32:57.840 customers and then we talk to our own customers that we know 516 00:32:57.840 --> 00:33:01.645 are are our friends and family and we'll say, 517 00:33:01.645 --> 00:33:05.325 let me introduce you to to to somebody that we're thinking of investing 518 00:33:05.325 --> 00:33:09.000 in and and tell me, what would you what what's your 519 00:33:09.000 --> 00:33:12.360 honest thought about their sales pitch, not not the investment 520 00:33:12.360 --> 00:33:16.025 pitch? So there there's a lot of steps there, Joe. It is not an easy 521 00:33:16.025 --> 00:33:19.865 it is not an easy journey. And again, the financial criteria has 522 00:33:19.865 --> 00:33:23.705 gotten much stricter. You can't just do yesterday's thing better. I mean, I'm not 523 00:33:23.705 --> 00:33:27.530 saying you can't. Of course, any startup can do anything. But, but 524 00:33:27.530 --> 00:33:31.370 but we really look for true disruptions in a market transition. It's it's 525 00:33:31.370 --> 00:33:35.115 it's, it's it's it's been a difficult market. And then if you wanna 526 00:33:35.115 --> 00:33:38.394 go outside of Germany and say, I would like to have that US, you have 527 00:33:38.394 --> 00:33:41.900 to do all the same things in in in the 528 00:33:41.900 --> 00:33:45.680 USBC environment. Mhmm. Yes. Exactly. 529 00:33:46.620 --> 00:33:50.075 Plus you have to show 530 00:33:50.615 --> 00:33:54.235 why they should invest because as you were saying, 531 00:33:54.455 --> 00:33:58.230 there are certain economics to VC fund. That 532 00:33:58.230 --> 00:34:01.909 means you you can't just, make 2, 533 00:34:01.909 --> 00:34:05.370 3 times profit on your investment, then the economics 534 00:34:05.665 --> 00:34:09.505 don't work because a lot of failures are always included in a 535 00:34:09.505 --> 00:34:13.339 VC fund. That means the successful startups, they have to 536 00:34:13.339 --> 00:34:17.179 make up for all the other failures. So you're looking really for the big 537 00:34:17.179 --> 00:34:20.965 moonshot there. Yes. You are. Always. Always. Well said, 538 00:34:20.965 --> 00:34:24.405 Joe. That's exactly the way it works. You are you are spot 539 00:34:24.405 --> 00:34:28.085 on. You know, the only other thing I'd add to to to to this 540 00:34:28.085 --> 00:34:31.449 whole discussion of of Germany that you just brought up is that, 541 00:34:31.989 --> 00:34:35.530 and not specific to Germany, but but specific to the US. 542 00:34:35.909 --> 00:34:39.485 One of the big disruptions right now in the VC market is of 543 00:34:39.485 --> 00:34:43.245 course the economy. And the second one that's worth mentioning is of 544 00:34:43.245 --> 00:34:47.005 course, all of the regulatory changes, geopolitics and things that 545 00:34:47.005 --> 00:34:49.030 are happening. And so, 546 00:34:50.449 --> 00:34:54.290 maybe an important thing to to add to to the whole 547 00:34:54.290 --> 00:34:57.765 discussion we just had in terms of pitching is also 548 00:34:58.404 --> 00:35:02.105 those those two things. Right? Because, the VC community 549 00:35:02.164 --> 00:35:05.560 sees things as a slower payout right now and as a high risk 550 00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:09.560 with regard to regulatory changes. And in another 551 00:35:09.560 --> 00:35:13.080 country, you're dependent on the regulatory changes in that 552 00:35:13.080 --> 00:35:16.785 country and and what's happening. And, so much 553 00:35:16.785 --> 00:35:20.545 with with the geopolitics, with artificial intelligence, with the 554 00:35:20.545 --> 00:35:24.369 ongoing privacy considerations and trust, and, and it's 555 00:35:24.369 --> 00:35:28.150 just seemingly never ending as as to how regulatory 556 00:35:28.290 --> 00:35:32.130 changes are being implemented. So I would add that to a 557 00:35:32.130 --> 00:35:35.715 level of complexity for for, in a a cross 558 00:35:35.715 --> 00:35:39.395 country investment because you're making an investment not just in the 559 00:35:39.395 --> 00:35:43.130 technology, but in all of that as well. Never ever forget 560 00:35:43.130 --> 00:35:46.970 the taxes. Yes. Yes. And and and and, you know, 561 00:35:46.970 --> 00:35:50.625 if you have something that's that's you want me to invest in something that's 562 00:35:50.625 --> 00:35:54.065 strong in country that, had that 563 00:35:54.145 --> 00:35:57.905 that's, you know, in country that's a different country from where you're investing 564 00:35:57.905 --> 00:36:01.619 in, then, you know, is that something we're all familiar with? 565 00:36:01.619 --> 00:36:04.760 Is that is that regulatory risk going to, 566 00:36:05.299 --> 00:36:07.559 going to potentially impact your success? 567 00:36:09.075 --> 00:36:12.455 And so much on privacy even if you're doing grocery delivery. 568 00:36:12.515 --> 00:36:16.035 Right? You know, what do you do with the data? How do you address the 569 00:36:16.035 --> 00:36:19.619 data? Where is it stored? Can you store it in the cloud? You know, how 570 00:36:19.619 --> 00:36:23.140 are you addressing all of the privacy factors when you go across a country 571 00:36:23.140 --> 00:36:26.495 line? Are we technically savvy enough to address 572 00:36:26.495 --> 00:36:30.095 that? All of those are more difficult when you're investing in another 573 00:36:30.095 --> 00:36:33.730 country to understand what those regulations are and how you cross those 574 00:36:33.730 --> 00:36:37.190 bridges. So there's definitely another level of complexity. 575 00:36:37.809 --> 00:36:41.494 And I would think about we talked about Dedron based in Casa. 576 00:36:42.194 --> 00:36:45.394 You know, they were they were their their headquarters was in in in in, 577 00:36:45.875 --> 00:36:48.955 in San Francisco, and our headquarters is in San Francisco. Joe, 578 00:36:49.660 --> 00:36:53.440 or in, Palo Alto, I should say, Silicon Valley. And, 579 00:36:54.619 --> 00:36:58.285 so so think about, are you going to have a presence in the US? If 580 00:36:58.285 --> 00:37:01.905 you're if you're seeking US, investments, 581 00:37:02.340 --> 00:37:05.860 are you planning to expand? Do you have US customers? You have 2 US 582 00:37:05.860 --> 00:37:09.080 customers. One thing that we do, Joe, is we 583 00:37:10.155 --> 00:37:13.835 we actually help with customer expansion. So we have a 584 00:37:13.835 --> 00:37:17.275 very, very, very large customer base that we're close with, 585 00:37:17.515 --> 00:37:21.130 and where we know their their executive teams. And we set 586 00:37:21.130 --> 00:37:24.670 up jc2days. And in jc2days, we might invite 587 00:37:25.529 --> 00:37:28.805 between 5 10 startups to do this speed 588 00:37:29.425 --> 00:37:33.105 presentation to to to a customer with the goal to see which one 589 00:37:33.105 --> 00:37:36.810 the the the customer would like to follow-up with. And, and 590 00:37:36.810 --> 00:37:40.330 so we actually help with sales introductions so so much. 591 00:37:40.330 --> 00:37:44.090 But if you're only in country, then that so much of that 592 00:37:44.090 --> 00:37:47.434 would not be applicable. Right? So how how good of a fit are you with 593 00:37:47.434 --> 00:37:51.115 the culture of the VC and how they run? Because we take such an active 594 00:37:51.115 --> 00:37:54.795 role and we help with introductions. If you're only in country 595 00:37:54.795 --> 00:37:57.840 in Germany, then that would be very limiting. I see. 596 00:37:58.780 --> 00:38:02.400 To get towards the end because we're talking for over 597 00:38:02.540 --> 00:38:06.245 35 minutes for now, That will be on the little bit longer side, but 598 00:38:06.245 --> 00:38:10.025 I do do believe there's a lot of entertaining and also 599 00:38:10.085 --> 00:38:13.920 interesting content in here. There are a lot of there there 600 00:38:14.059 --> 00:38:17.420 are benchmarks out there, in terms of 601 00:38:17.420 --> 00:38:21.055 series a sizes, valuations, and so on and so forth. If 602 00:38:21.055 --> 00:38:24.495 you Google a lot, benchmarks, how much 603 00:38:24.495 --> 00:38:28.255 investment do series a stage Startupradio, what at 604 00:38:28.255 --> 00:38:31.640 what valuation, the same for series b, valuation 605 00:38:31.940 --> 00:38:35.540 investment size. Would you expect the 606 00:38:35.540 --> 00:38:39.000 founders to know that and not be completely off the charts? 607 00:38:39.325 --> 00:38:43.085 I think that founders would behoove themselves to look up 608 00:38:43.085 --> 00:38:46.765 some of the art there are some great articles out there on on what 609 00:38:46.765 --> 00:38:50.560 your multiples expectations are, 610 00:38:50.560 --> 00:38:53.600 what the ranges are for it, what what is the right, 611 00:38:54.400 --> 00:38:58.115 growth expectation on various aspects of growth, 612 00:38:58.115 --> 00:39:01.795 right, for for various sizes 613 00:39:01.795 --> 00:39:05.540 of revenue. I think that all of that is something that that that, I 614 00:39:05.540 --> 00:39:09.220 would recommend you you familiarize yourself with because that's what you'll be compared 615 00:39:09.220 --> 00:39:12.900 to, for sure. Joe if they don't know, I 616 00:39:12.900 --> 00:39:16.645 mean, Joe, you tell me if they know or not, but but, but 617 00:39:16.645 --> 00:39:20.485 they should. Yeah. They they should. And, as you said, 618 00:39:20.485 --> 00:39:22.920 it's just your homework you need to do. And, 619 00:39:24.660 --> 00:39:28.440 getting finally to you guys, what kind of startups 620 00:39:28.500 --> 00:39:32.200 are you looking for and how could startups pitch? We we already, 621 00:39:32.744 --> 00:39:36.205 we already noticed you you get way too many emails. 622 00:39:37.145 --> 00:39:40.984 But I've seen you have security and trust 623 00:39:40.984 --> 00:39:44.119 engagement, energy infrastructure and sustainability 624 00:39:44.900 --> 00:39:48.579 as broad investment topics on your website. Could 625 00:39:48.579 --> 00:39:52.005 you elaborate a little bit what you guys are doing and 626 00:39:52.005 --> 00:39:55.605 how start ups can make the first contact there? Joe, so I would say that 627 00:39:55.605 --> 00:39:59.000 we're highly biased towards AI, have been for for many, many years. 628 00:39:59.240 --> 00:40:02.760 You know, since the beginning, we've been very biased towards AI and 629 00:40:02.760 --> 00:40:06.395 transformations as an underlying technology. The 630 00:40:06.395 --> 00:40:09.915 areas that you just mentioned, I would say security. There's so much 631 00:40:09.915 --> 00:40:13.515 happening in security and with the change of quantum computing and 632 00:40:13.515 --> 00:40:17.280 and, and and and new technologies that really 633 00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:21.040 affect cyber, cyber risk quantification and 634 00:40:21.040 --> 00:40:24.735 and and things that address some of the SEC regulations that are happening 635 00:40:24.735 --> 00:40:28.415 here. Lots of interesting things on the cyber side, and 636 00:40:28.415 --> 00:40:32.095 that has to continue to change because, with AI, we now 637 00:40:32.095 --> 00:40:35.770 have AI driven cyberattacks. So that is going to continue to be 638 00:40:35.830 --> 00:40:39.590 top of mind for for a very long time. So so that's 639 00:40:39.590 --> 00:40:43.045 one area. The next I would say is AI for, customer 640 00:40:43.185 --> 00:40:46.785 experience. I think the call customer experience needs a complete 641 00:40:46.785 --> 00:40:50.325 transformation. I think AI is gonna drive call calls 642 00:40:50.450 --> 00:40:54.290 to a call center. Bots are gonna become better. They're gonna be more 643 00:40:54.290 --> 00:40:57.650 speakable as opposed to the the the IVRs that exist 644 00:40:57.650 --> 00:41:01.395 today. Lots of transformation happening in that, which is a big 645 00:41:01.395 --> 00:41:05.075 interest. And then I think that you can't get rid of our roots of 646 00:41:05.075 --> 00:41:08.840 infrastructure, probably continue to to stay in there and things like 647 00:41:08.840 --> 00:41:12.380 network as a service. I'll stop there, Joe, but there's a couple of ideas. 648 00:41:12.440 --> 00:41:16.045 Right. And everybody who would like to learn more, you can go down here in 649 00:41:16.045 --> 00:41:19.724 the show notes. There will be, of course, a link to your LinkedIn profile and 650 00:41:19.724 --> 00:41:23.480 to Joe investments. Thank you very much. It was a pleasure 651 00:41:23.480 --> 00:41:27.240 having you here. Likewise. Thanks for having me, Joan. Totally much. Pleasure. 652 00:41:27.240 --> 00:41:29.260 Have a good day. Bye bye. Bye.