Latest / Pit Talk / Jack Doohan caught up in latest silly season twist: Sao Paulo GP Review

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Jack Doohan caught up in latest silly season twist: Sao Paulo GP Review · Pit Talk

0:00
Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Pit Talk, a Fox Sports and
0:02
Speaker 1: Speed Cafe Formula one podcast. On today's episode, the driver
0:07
Speaker 1: market is in its final throws, with SAURBA ditching both
0:10
Speaker 1: its drivers in favor of a Brazilian young gun, but
0:13
Speaker 1: speculation mounting over Jack Douan's twenty twenty five debut with
0:17
Speaker 1: Alpede and Maxistafan puts one hand on the championship trophy
0:22
Speaker 1: after a dominant wet weather drive in South Paolo. My
0:26
Speaker 1: name is Michael Lamonato, motorsport rider for Fox Sports Australia.
0:29
Speaker 1: It's great to have your company and the company of
0:32
Speaker 1: my co host from Speed Cafe. He loves the South
0:38
Speaker 1: American time zone. It's Matt Cosh.
0:43
Speaker 2: Are we Cardi of our Lord something. I don't know
0:46
Speaker 2: what is going on there, but that is all manner
0:51
Speaker 2: of craziness.
0:52
Speaker 1: That's what I love about Brazilian sports broadcasting. It's totally
0:55
Speaker 1: unafraid throwing the sound effects, the music. It's very enormful.
1:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, we are missing out.
1:01
Speaker 1: You'd be, of course if you go back and look
1:03
Speaker 1: through for example, this is just completely off track now,
1:06
Speaker 1: but Brazilian Grand Prix highlights from the Brazilian broadcaster in
1:11
Speaker 1: the days of Aid and Center, they'd be full of
1:12
Speaker 1: music and sound effects and still their football coverages. I
1:15
Speaker 1: believe that was a sting from that they would play
1:18
Speaker 1: after a goal for a national match.
1:20
Speaker 3: Okay, we'll take that. I'll take that.
1:22
Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I just wanted to put it inject a
1:24
Speaker 1: little bit of Brazilian fair. I don't speak any Portuguese,
1:27
Speaker 1: don't know very much else about about the place, but
1:29
Speaker 1: I thought it'd injected a little bit of the Brazilian flair.
1:32
Speaker 2: And I think our lives would be richer for all
1:34
Speaker 2: of that just happening just out in the world. Yes,
1:37
Speaker 2: you're going to fill up your fill up your car
1:39
Speaker 2: with petrol and you get some glorious tune to celebrate
1:43
Speaker 2: your success.
1:44
Speaker 1: I think that would be good, you know, And I
1:46
Speaker 1: think it's a nice way to bid farewell to the
1:48
Speaker 1: Sow Paolo Grand Prix and this little break before we
1:50
Speaker 1: hit into those final three races of the season. But
1:52
Speaker 1: we'll be talking plenty more about not only the Brazilian
1:55
Speaker 1: Grand Prix, but Brazil's perhaps well definitely in fact side
1:59
Speaker 1: next Formula Un Star. It's a question of whether or
2:01
Speaker 1: not I have big a star. He'll be but he's
2:03
Speaker 1: certainly doing pretty well in the junior formula. But before
2:05
Speaker 1: we get to all that bad, let's go through the
2:07
Speaker 1: five big stories from the last week that you might
2:09
Speaker 1: have missed. And I want to start with something that's
2:11
Speaker 1: happened really quite recently, been bubbling along for a couple
2:14
Speaker 1: of weeks now, and that is that the Grand Prix
2:16
Speaker 1: Drivers Association has written a letter to the FIA President
2:18
Speaker 1: Muhammad Ben sula Am asking to be treated as adults
2:22
Speaker 1: in the aftermath of the sports new hardline on swearing,
2:25
Speaker 1: with charl Leclair having been fined last week with some
2:28
Speaker 1: salty language in a press conference. The drivers have also
2:30
Speaker 1: asked the transparency over what their fines are used for.
2:35
Speaker 2: That second point I disagree with. I don't think they
2:37
Speaker 2: need or deserve any visibility on that. No, for that matter,
2:40
Speaker 2: if we get a speeding fine or whatever else, we
2:43
Speaker 2: don't have any visibility really where that goes. Why should
2:47
Speaker 2: they be in a special position just because their Formula
2:49
Speaker 2: one drivers break the rules, you pay the fine.
2:52
Speaker 3: So on, as far as the sweary thing goes, I
2:54
Speaker 3: think they've got a point.
2:57
Speaker 2: The broadcast side of things. Aside broadcast, there are there
3:01
Speaker 2: are rules that are in place pretty much globally. If
3:05
Speaker 2: you swear they have to bleep it. They can't use
3:06
Speaker 2: it as broadcast. You're costing Formula one the opportunity of exposure.
3:12
Speaker 3: So there, I get it.
3:13
Speaker 2: But you know, as soon as you cross over that
3:14
Speaker 2: threshold into the written side of things, what's the harm
3:18
Speaker 2: in the odd odd F bomb? I mean, any of
3:21
Speaker 2: us really going to be offended?
3:23
Speaker 1: Well, that is the question the FIA is certainly pondering.
3:25
Speaker 1: Will wait their response. Moving to the F one side
3:28
Speaker 1: of things, F one CEO Stefano Domenicali says he'll have
3:31
Speaker 1: some news very soon on European tracks that will be
3:35
Speaker 1: rotating among themselves each year on the calendar, thereby making
3:39
Speaker 1: space for new races to join the schedule. And that's
3:42
Speaker 1: I suppose in the background of a potential race in
3:45
Speaker 1: Argentina being on the cards in the coming races, which
3:47
Speaker 1: is of course without rotation. Push us over twenty four.
3:50
Speaker 2: Yeah, twenty four is the maximum allowed under the conqueror
3:52
Speaker 2: of twenty five is the allowed maxim under the concord.
3:55
Speaker 2: But that requires unanimous approval of all the teams, which
3:57
Speaker 2: you're just not going to get at the moment because
3:59
Speaker 2: they're all stretched. Yeah, I can see Eimiler rotating. The
4:04
Speaker 2: Netherlands has made no secret of its interested in rotating
4:07
Speaker 2: as well. Spy Frankly Schanmp's as well is not the
4:10
Speaker 2: richest in terms of the promoter there, so there's a
4:14
Speaker 2: few events that sort of makes sense. But what it
4:16
Speaker 2: does is, yes, it's halves of promotion costs, but it
4:20
Speaker 2: can almost double marketing another spend because it takes you
4:25
Speaker 2: longer to amortize some of some of the investments that
4:27
Speaker 2: you need to make. So if promoters go down that route,
4:31
Speaker 2: I just hope they're very, very careful and they've done
4:32
Speaker 2: their math correctly.
4:33
Speaker 1: Let's look now it matters on track and at McLaren,
4:36
Speaker 1: which has been embroiled in another technical controversy with accusations
4:40
Speaker 1: from Red Bull Racing that and maybe some other teams
4:43
Speaker 1: have allegedly been injecting a small quantity of water into
4:47
Speaker 1: their tires to help with tire where it's Look, I
4:49
Speaker 1: know it's something they've been experimenting with in the vast
4:51
Speaker 1: but just reading that sounds very amusing.
4:53
Speaker 2: I'm no race engineered, you know, jump is that no
5:01
Speaker 2: risk of losing his job to me? But the notion
5:04
Speaker 2: of putting a small amount of water in tires to
5:06
Speaker 2: cool them down.
5:07
Speaker 3: One.
5:07
Speaker 2: You know, the temperature in these things is huge. The
5:09
Speaker 2: radiant temperature in it's huge, is going to evaporate almost instantly,
5:12
Speaker 2: so therefore have no effect. To have any sort of
5:16
Speaker 2: significant effect, you have to put a significant amount of
5:19
Speaker 2: water in there, in which case you've got all this
5:21
Speaker 2: uncontrolled weight, uncontrolled unsprung weight sloshing about in the tires.
5:26
Speaker 2: That's the sort of thing that when you know, when
5:28
Speaker 2: you pick a tire up, it's going to make it,
5:30
Speaker 2: you know, what's already reasonably heavy, bloody heavy, so you
5:33
Speaker 2: notice the pits.
5:35
Speaker 3: It just seems ridiculous.
5:36
Speaker 2: Sign There's some stories about how it all came out,
5:39
Speaker 2: and I know I know a few of them. I'm
5:43
Speaker 2: not giving it any credibility at this point whatsoever. It
5:48
Speaker 2: just seems to be a little bit of a little
5:51
Speaker 2: bit of mud throwing for the sake of mud throwing.
5:54
Speaker 3: When we're to the business end of a championship.
5:56
Speaker 1: It's been a lot of mud thrown as well in
5:57
Speaker 1: the last month or so, hasn't there. Let's look at
6:00
Speaker 1: ratters back off track, and both Honda and Alpine have
6:04
Speaker 1: agreed to pay in Australian dollars nine hundred thousand, six
6:06
Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollars respectively in fines for procedural breaches of
6:10
Speaker 1: the power unit cost cap. Both were paying fundamentally for
6:14
Speaker 1: documentation irregularities. That's some expensive paperwork malfunctions.
6:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, to the point where Honda had to redo its submission.
6:25
Speaker 2: One of the two you had to completely redo their submission.
6:28
Speaker 2: It might have been Reno actually redid theirs and the
6:33
Speaker 2: FA then look at it going okay, yes, now it's fine,
6:35
Speaker 2: but you still got it rob in the persons and
6:36
Speaker 2: so we're going to we're going to find you for it.
6:38
Speaker 2: But I mean that there's nothing sporting or performance to
6:41
Speaker 2: be gain performance games out of this. So yes, it's
6:45
Speaker 2: just dotting the eyes, crossing the tees, doing that sort
6:48
Speaker 2: of stuff first year of a of a cost cap,
6:51
Speaker 2: which is something that happened in the first year of
6:54
Speaker 2: the chassis cost gap as well. There are a couple
6:55
Speaker 2: of accepted breaches then, aside from Red Bulls.
7:00
Speaker 1: Siams is one of them. It was another one as well,
7:02
Speaker 1: but I struggle to remember, as Master Martin wouldn't happen again.
7:04
Speaker 1: You'd think with costs that high. And let's talk about
7:07
Speaker 1: williams Now and their last three races of the season,
7:09
Speaker 1: because they're counting the cost of five significant crashes in
7:13
Speaker 1: about ten days of the last two races in Mexico
7:15
Speaker 1: and Brazil, with teams team boss James val saying he
7:19
Speaker 1: isn't sure what configuration the two cars will turn up
7:22
Speaker 1: in in Las Vegas. Now these are the crashes, three
7:25
Speaker 1: of them being Alex Albons and two for Franco Colo Pinto,
7:28
Speaker 1: and they're all pretty big.
7:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, And this adds to crashes that we saw in
7:33
Speaker 2: Melbourne and then Suzuka for Albon and Logan Sargent back
7:38
Speaker 2: in the day. So you know, this isn't just a
7:40
Speaker 2: problem it's now facing. So it'll have comparatively few spares
7:44
Speaker 2: because you don't want to carry too many towards the
7:46
Speaker 2: back end of the year. But at the same time
7:48
Speaker 2: it's spent a lot of its budget on repairs and
7:52
Speaker 2: transporting chassis back and forth across the world and all
7:55
Speaker 2: that sort of stuff. So it's a significant issue. And
7:57
Speaker 2: what it will mean is, as you allude to there,
8:00
Speaker 2: the team won't be running the latest speck pretty much anything.
8:03
Speaker 2: It'll just be cobbling whatever bits it's got together, it's
8:06
Speaker 2: throwing it on the car and trying to make it work.
8:09
Speaker 2: The iron will be that it works and works quite
8:11
Speaker 2: well and they end up scoring big points or something,
8:13
Speaker 2: but that will be an awkward one for the team
8:16
Speaker 2: to deal with at that point and more the point
8:18
Speaker 2: probably the engineering department there.
8:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, and just like as to put this into perspective,
8:22
Speaker 1: there is the cost cap element of this, and Mercedes
8:25
Speaker 1: has said that it's been struggling with the cost cap
8:26
Speaker 1: and it's had comparatively fewer big crashes, had a couple
8:30
Speaker 1: in the United States or particularly one with George Russell,
8:32
Speaker 1: so it doesn't take too much to make the cost
8:34
Speaker 1: cap a factor. And Williams has had far more than
8:38
Speaker 1: you'd think. It's fair shared by percentage terms of the grid,
8:41
Speaker 1: so a bit of a struggle as they head towards
8:43
Speaker 1: the last three races of the season. Matt, I want
8:46
Speaker 1: to look now at the real big news story of
8:49
Speaker 1: this week after the South Paalo Grand Prix, and that
8:51
Speaker 1: is one of the final pieces of the driver market
8:54
Speaker 1: clicking into place, and that is at the Sauber Future
8:57
Speaker 1: Audi team where both valtrie Bot and Joe gran you
9:00
Speaker 1: have been told their surplus to requirements because alongside Nico
9:03
Speaker 1: Holkenberg from next season will be Brazilian young gun Gabrielle Bortoletto.
9:08
Speaker 1: And I had been heading this way for a little while
9:09
Speaker 1: had been the rumor that he'd been extracted from McLaren's
9:13
Speaker 1: junior driver Rosta to join the team. It's now confirmed.
9:16
Speaker 1: I want to start with the drivers who are leaving
9:18
Speaker 1: first of all, before we talk a little bit about
9:20
Speaker 1: Gabrielle borte Letter, because certainly we'll have plenty of time
9:22
Speaker 1: to talk about him and Valtarie Botas in particular, the
9:25
Speaker 1: ten time Grand Prix winner probably most closely associated with
9:29
Speaker 1: his successful time at Mercedes, where he helped the team
9:31
Speaker 1: to all the constructors' titles. Is this the end of
9:34
Speaker 1: his career?
9:35
Speaker 2: That's a big question that one, isn't it. And you're
9:37
Speaker 2: saying it's most close to our line to Mercedes. It's
9:41
Speaker 2: most closely lined to that glorious mustache.
9:43
Speaker 1: Honest, that is not the mullet.
9:47
Speaker 2: No, not the mullet so much. The mustache is just
9:49
Speaker 2: a thing of beauty. I mean that gets Nigel Manswer envious,
9:53
Speaker 2: that thing does being serious throw and yeah, look I
9:58
Speaker 2: do think it is the end of the road and
10:00
Speaker 2: Formula One for vow three, not because I don't think
10:04
Speaker 2: he's good enough. I still absolutely think he is. He's
10:06
Speaker 2: a ten time Rod Prix winner. That talent doesn't disappear
10:09
Speaker 2: over night. The fact is the last couple of years
10:11
Speaker 2: he's not had the machinery to demonstrate it. But where
10:15
Speaker 2: else is he going to go? There's this land, this
10:18
Speaker 2: wholesale shift in Formula One towards rookies. I think we're
10:23
Speaker 2: gonna have five or six of them on the grid
10:24
Speaker 2: next year. Vouchrie is thirty five, he's one of the
10:27
Speaker 2: older guard now. He can't have too many years left
10:30
Speaker 2: even if he was Winning World championships. Is the end
10:34
Speaker 2: of his career rather than the start of it. So
10:36
Speaker 2: there's that element to it, the youngsters coming through, and
10:38
Speaker 2: there's plenty of those, and the faith that teams are
10:41
Speaker 2: now showing in that, which is quite an interesting thought
10:43
Speaker 2: when you choose to really dribble into it. And that
10:46
Speaker 2: just doesn't leave anywhere for Voucher and does he swallow
10:49
Speaker 2: his pride and take on a reserve drive and the
10:50
Speaker 2: hope that he might get a Nico Holknberg style reprieve
10:53
Speaker 2: or does he accept the fact that he's had over
10:57
Speaker 2: a decade in Formula one, he's one ten, he's had
11:00
Speaker 2: a more successful career than ninety nine percent of drivers
11:03
Speaker 2: who who've ever raced in F one have had. Does
11:06
Speaker 2: he take that, be thankful for it and go off
11:08
Speaker 2: and do something else?
11:10
Speaker 3: And right now we've not really got an indication.
11:13
Speaker 2: He put a chicky post up on social media where
11:15
Speaker 2: he's sort of cuts away and he's I think he
11:17
Speaker 2: was wearing some cycling shorts or some really short cycling shorts.
11:21
Speaker 2: I hope cycling shorts. Otherwise I feel slightly awkward. But look,
11:27
Speaker 2: he's got a lot of things going on outside of
11:30
Speaker 2: Formula One. He's involved in cycling events, a couple of
11:34
Speaker 2: different businesses around the place as well, and he's got
11:38
Speaker 2: just some racing other stuff. So yeah, I think we
11:41
Speaker 2: will see Vowuchery again, and if you're in Australia, I
11:43
Speaker 2: think you'll definitely see vouchery again.
11:46
Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, ten grand Prix wins, put that into perspective,
11:49
Speaker 1: puts him equal thirty first all time in terms of
11:51
Speaker 1: Grand Prix victories. That's nothing to be ashamed of. And
11:54
Speaker 1: he's second in the Driver's Championship a couple of times
11:57
Speaker 1: ran Lewis Hamilton. People forget this fit only hard in
12:00
Speaker 1: qualifying now He's still in a percentage terms or in
12:04
Speaker 1: raw numbers, was beaten over the course of his time
12:06
Speaker 1: at Mercedes, but has a much better record than most
12:09
Speaker 1: drivers who go up against Lewis Hamilton. We shouldn't be
12:11
Speaker 1: hit that Lewis is the most prolific qualify of all time.
12:14
Speaker 1: So to run I think off the top of my
12:16
Speaker 1: head it's around a third or between a quarter and
12:18
Speaker 1: a third of the time, which is pretty good. Again
12:19
Speaker 1: against someone likes Lewis Hamilton. So the talent was there.
12:22
Speaker 1: He did get a reasonably good opportunity to show it.
12:24
Speaker 1: He's spoken quite extensively about I guess the demons he battled,
12:28
Speaker 1: particularly in his second year at Mercedes where he was
12:31
Speaker 1: walloped by Lewis and having to come back from that
12:33
Speaker 1: and find his place in the world and that kind
12:35
Speaker 1: of thing, and at least had a good first half
12:38
Speaker 1: of the year at Southa before that car took an
12:40
Speaker 1: absolute nose dive in competitive terms and hasn't recovered since,
12:43
Speaker 1: so I think also, I wouldn't say he necessarily proved
12:47
Speaker 1: of points. I don't know he had to prove a
12:48
Speaker 1: point there, but did sort of show that he could
12:51
Speaker 1: have had a very productive post Mercedes career had only
12:55
Speaker 1: the team been much better. It's also goodbye to Joe
12:57
Speaker 1: Guannu moving on relatively briefly for a driver who has
13:00
Speaker 1: not achieved the same has it had the chance to
13:02
Speaker 1: achieve the same as Valtrie Botas, how do we assess?
13:05
Speaker 1: I guess he's relatively brief time in Formula One because
13:08
Speaker 1: it's certainly had some flashes. But you've got to feel
13:11
Speaker 1: bad for a rookie who and he didn't come in
13:13
Speaker 1: relatively underrated because he wasn't one of the foremost guys
13:16
Speaker 1: in the junior categories, but came in and learned the
13:19
Speaker 1: ropes while the car was good, and then probably was
13:22
Speaker 1: at a point of showing the best of himself last
13:24
Speaker 1: year when the car was dreadful.
13:27
Speaker 3: He's made a reasonable account to himself.
13:28
Speaker 2: He's certainly not embarrassed himself in my opinion, he's again,
13:33
Speaker 2: like I just said with Botas, he's not had the
13:34
Speaker 2: machinery to really showcase what talent he does have. My
13:39
Speaker 2: interest with Joe's departure is I guess less specific on
13:44
Speaker 2: Joe and more what this means for the Chinese and
13:48
Speaker 2: Asian markets, because Joe is a superstar in Chinese. Need
13:53
Speaker 2: to only look at the attendance that this year's Chinese
13:55
Speaker 2: Grand Prix to see that what does this now mean
13:59
Speaker 2: for that event?
13:59
Speaker 3: Go for it.
14:00
Speaker 2: Okay, we had it before Formula one had a Chinese drama,
14:03
Speaker 2: but at that point in time, there wasn't the demand
14:06
Speaker 2: for events that there now is. So are the Chinese
14:09
Speaker 2: going to cough up more money when there are others
14:13
Speaker 2: out there willing to throw it seemingly willy nilly around
14:16
Speaker 2: it to get Formula One?
14:19
Speaker 3: I don't know.
14:19
Speaker 2: And the other worrying thing is that who's the next
14:21
Speaker 2: Chinese drama coming through the system. So that's why I
14:25
Speaker 2: think it's it's sad that we're losing Joe. I hope
14:28
Speaker 2: that he remains in the paddock doing something and I'd
14:31
Speaker 2: love to see him on the grid again because I
14:33
Speaker 2: think he's good enough to be there. You know, not
14:36
Speaker 2: everyone shows at junior level entirely what they're capable of
14:39
Speaker 2: for various reasons. Just look at Franko Colopinto. He's coming
14:42
Speaker 2: to Formula one after a comparatively lackluster or not the
14:48
Speaker 2: star started junior career that you know, say Oscar Piastre
14:51
Speaker 2: or Charlie Clare or even in Gabrielle Bortiletto have had.
14:56
Speaker 2: And he he's coming to Formula one and impressed. And
15:01
Speaker 2: Joe's sort of the same. He was there or thereabouts,
15:03
Speaker 2: but coming to Formula one and he's done enough to
15:05
Speaker 2: earn his drive for the last few years, and now
15:10
Speaker 2: he's no longer part of that equation, and I'm just
15:15
Speaker 2: concerned that that weakens us as a sport. I understand that,
15:19
Speaker 2: you know, you can't just look at the broader sport
15:21
Speaker 2: the markets of it in terms of your driver selection.
15:24
Speaker 2: You've got to look at ultimate performance and longer term thinking.
15:27
Speaker 2: Without his project, but the Chinese market is such a
15:30
Speaker 2: huge one that I think it's a bit of a
15:32
Speaker 2: missed opportunity that no one's picked Joe up for next year.
15:35
Speaker 1: I think it says a couple of things, though, doesn't it.
15:37
Speaker 1: And there's a funny parallel I think between Valti Potass
15:40
Speaker 1: and Joe Grannu, and that is that Valteri Botas could
15:43
Speaker 1: have had much more success in his career had he
15:45
Speaker 1: not been partnered with Lewis Hamilton, had he not rocked
15:47
Speaker 1: up in the Lewis Hamilton era essentially, and that's not
15:49
Speaker 1: an uncommon story. Plenty of drivers have that same lament.
15:52
Speaker 1: In fact, anyone in the past decade or so is
15:55
Speaker 1: the Lewis Hamilton or Sebastia or the Max's staff in
15:57
Speaker 1: the era whereas Joe Gun he's rocked up. It is
16:00
Speaker 1: a bit of an unusual parallel. But at a time
16:02
Speaker 1: when actually the grid is booming with talent, you know,
16:04
Speaker 1: maybe ten years ago or let's just say years ago,
16:08
Speaker 1: Joe when you would have found another seat on the
16:09
Speaker 1: grid because he has the backing of the massive Chinese
16:12
Speaker 1: market and the sport was so keen on it, and
16:14
Speaker 1: someone would have made some phone calls, it would have
16:16
Speaker 1: got done because there would have been room on the grid.
16:19
Speaker 1: But after last year, there being no movement in the
16:22
Speaker 1: driver market at all the year on year this year,
16:25
Speaker 1: and I thought it was actually really interesting that he
16:26
Speaker 1: said this in the press release as well. There is
16:29
Speaker 1: this push for a new generation of drivers in Formula one.
16:32
Speaker 1: It's interesting to think whether it maybe Oliver Bearman's appearance
16:36
Speaker 1: in Saudi Arabia, where he did quite well, maybe triggered
16:38
Speaker 1: teams to go, oh, actually, all these young guys actually
16:40
Speaker 1: all right, or whatever it was. Something's clicked now and suddenly,
16:45
Speaker 1: despite Joe being only three years into his career and
16:47
Speaker 1: having shown himself to be perfectly reasonable Grand Prix driver,
16:50
Speaker 1: there's no room for that because the sports moved past him.
16:52
Speaker 1: And I think that's probably going to apply in the
16:54
Speaker 1: same way even to the more experienced and successful Beltari Botass.
16:58
Speaker 1: I think it'll just be a struggle for either of
16:59
Speaker 1: them find a spot on the grid because there is
17:02
Speaker 1: just no room. Everyone there deserves it on merit or
17:05
Speaker 1: because their father owns the team, and that's a pretty
17:08
Speaker 1: big it's a big percentage of them, counts for one
17:11
Speaker 1: hundred percent of them, So I think it'll be struggle
17:15
Speaker 1: for him to come back. It is a shame because
17:16
Speaker 1: I think, you know, you never know, one more year
17:18
Speaker 1: could have done it, a one more year and a
17:19
Speaker 1: much better team could have done it. But that's just
17:22
Speaker 1: sometimes how it is. Informida on there are plenty of
17:23
Speaker 1: drivers who have the same lament, But let's talk about
17:26
Speaker 1: the guy who will replace him and get his chance
17:28
Speaker 1: Informida one slowest car next year Gabrielle bought a leto.
17:32
Speaker 1: He's currently the F two points leader. He took the
17:34
Speaker 1: lead from Isaac Hadja. I was a couple of months ago.
17:36
Speaker 1: Now I suppose been a while since they've raced, and
17:38
Speaker 1: Isaac Haadja, being the Red Bull junior who was briefly
17:41
Speaker 1: rumored to be destined for Formula One, might still be
17:43
Speaker 1: in the picture, but doesn't seem like at the moment.
17:45
Speaker 1: Comes off the back of a Maiden F three championship
17:48
Speaker 1: last year, so that in itself is pretty impressive, despite
17:51
Speaker 1: his career before that being sort of okay, nothing really
17:54
Speaker 1: popping out. So he's on the cusp essentially of winning
17:58
Speaker 1: two back to back Maiden Junior championships, which is pretty special.
18:02
Speaker 1: It's a kind of thing that Oscar Piastri did, Charlote
18:05
Speaker 1: Clak and George Russell I think as well, off the
18:06
Speaker 1: top of my head, so that would put him in
18:08
Speaker 1: pretty rarefied air as a debutante. He had to be
18:10
Speaker 1: taken out of the McLaren junior program. McLaren saw him
18:13
Speaker 1: at the end of last year and snapped him up.
18:15
Speaker 1: This is I think a quietly big debut next year,
18:20
Speaker 1: not least because as well the first Brazilian driver we've
18:23
Speaker 1: had since Felipe Massa, which is remarkable historically in Formula one.
18:27
Speaker 2: It's frightening to think that we haven't had a Brazilian
18:30
Speaker 2: for that long because Felipe's been gone a long time now,
18:33
Speaker 2: hasn't he yea, But yeah, Bortiletto. What's interesting is that McLaren.
18:39
Speaker 2: My understanding is McLaren contractually they couldn't stop him from going,
18:42
Speaker 2: but also they didn't try to block it all. In fact,
18:44
Speaker 2: quite the reverse, they worked to help him get onto
18:46
Speaker 2: the grid. And that's if that is true, then they
18:52
Speaker 2: deserve to be applauded because I think back to the
18:55
Speaker 2: Oscar Piastri saga and the way that all shook out
18:57
Speaker 2: that basically, you.
18:59
Speaker 3: Know, roles reverturs and they've done what they.
19:01
Speaker 2: Said they would do. So if that is the case,
19:03
Speaker 2: then that's a great thing. Whatever the case is, we're
19:07
Speaker 2: getting a high quality. Was he twenty year old coming
19:11
Speaker 2: onto the grid next year? A kid who he's only
19:15
Speaker 2: won two races this year, a couple of feature races
19:19
Speaker 2: in Formula two, but does lead that championship, not by much,
19:24
Speaker 2: and he could still he could still not win that.
19:26
Speaker 3: There's two rounds left.
19:28
Speaker 2: But to be at the top of that tree in
19:30
Speaker 2: your first season, having been at the top of the
19:33
Speaker 2: tree at the end of your first season in Formula
19:35
Speaker 2: three puts you into pretty rarefy there, you know that
19:38
Speaker 2: sort of did.
19:39
Speaker 3: George Russell do that?
19:40
Speaker 2: I think charl Leclair did it off from a memory
19:44
Speaker 2: some Australian kid that Alpine had briefly ended up at McLaren.
19:49
Speaker 2: He did it, you know. So there's an implied quality
19:54
Speaker 2: in all of that. And the good thing with Bortiletto
19:58
Speaker 2: is that, as you said, he's jo in the slowest
20:00
Speaker 2: team on the grid. He can't fail. If he qualifies
20:03
Speaker 2: last in every single race, it's kind of what you'd expect.
20:08
Speaker 2: If he goes out in a couple of races, you know,
20:09
Speaker 2: he's last for most of them, and in a couple
20:11
Speaker 2: of races he puts at twelfth, you sit back and
20:13
Speaker 2: you go, holy hell.
20:15
Speaker 3: You know, that's the sort of stuff.
20:16
Speaker 2: That you'll be Yankee would do back in the day,
20:19
Speaker 2: these kids when they had you know, when you had
20:23
Speaker 2: Russia and k Trum and HRT, they didn't have the machinery.
20:28
Speaker 2: But every now and then you get performances that you
20:30
Speaker 2: just sit up and go Holy hell, So that sort
20:33
Speaker 2: I think we need to look at for Bortletto, not
20:35
Speaker 2: the run of the mill stuff. It's just when everything clicks,
20:39
Speaker 2: what is he capable of doing, and then what he's
20:43
Speaker 2: like in terms of pace relative to Nico Holgenberg, who
20:48
Speaker 2: is still a known quantity, if perhaps an unfulfilled one.
20:53
Speaker 1: I think Holgenberg in many respect is an ideal benchmark,
20:56
Speaker 1: because he's been proven this year even at heart is
20:59
Speaker 1: quite quick in qualify. There's some question marks over how
21:02
Speaker 1: good a bar or consistent about Kevin Maguson is pretty inconsistent,
21:05
Speaker 1: I think is the answer, but certainly Magison can turn
21:07
Speaker 1: it on from time to time, and in any case,
21:09
Speaker 1: reaching Q three in a midfield car is always a
21:12
Speaker 1: pretty good barometer at Colgenberg's done that quite a few
21:14
Speaker 1: times this year, but as Oliver Beerman shown, he's not unbeatable.
21:19
Speaker 1: I suppose maybe that's makes him a bad benchmark, but
21:21
Speaker 1: I just think it means that it's a realistic target
21:24
Speaker 1: for Colo Pinto to reach. At the end of his
21:27
Speaker 1: first year. He can be on par with Nico Holgenberg
21:29
Speaker 1: in his first season a drive with that much experience
21:32
Speaker 1: that would be a pretty good sign, but of course
21:33
Speaker 1: there are those question marks around what the Salva car
21:35
Speaker 1: is going to look like next year. The team feels
21:38
Speaker 1: like it's a little bit of a mess. It's trying
21:39
Speaker 1: to restructure and rebuild itself. Ahead about his debut, which
21:42
Speaker 1: suddenly looms much sooner than it felt like when it
21:45
Speaker 1: was announced all those years ago, and it feels like
21:46
Speaker 1: they're running out of time to make a bit of
21:48
Speaker 1: a splash. But that'll be the background of debut.
21:51
Speaker 2: This is also Audi's you know formation foundation driver pairing.
21:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, well you assume so well, no, it is ourd.
21:58
Speaker 3: Is confirmed it. This is the thing that dripped out.
22:02
Speaker 2: It speaks to your point about the changes that are
22:04
Speaker 2: happening at the Saber at the moment because it is
22:06
Speaker 2: now owned by Audi. But you've still got the sober
22:10
Speaker 2: side of things running some aspects of it, the Audi
22:12
Speaker 2: side running out the relevents of it. So you had
22:15
Speaker 2: the There were three emails that went out in quick
22:17
Speaker 2: succession in terms of driver announcements from Salaba. One was
22:22
Speaker 2: or there were to your boy, simultaneously being Vouchery and
22:26
Speaker 2: Joe's departures, and then half an hour three quarts now
22:30
Speaker 2: later there was Bortiletto's announcement, and then an hour or
22:35
Speaker 2: so later there was an email from Audi which said
22:39
Speaker 2: that this is the driver pairing for Aridi's first season
22:41
Speaker 2: in Form one, which is of course twenty twenty six.
22:43
Speaker 2: So we know that Bortiletto's got a multi year deal,
22:47
Speaker 2: you know, the best of all deals, the multi year.
22:54
Speaker 2: So I've just stole in your line there.
22:56
Speaker 1: Mate, Yeah, like hearods, it's fine.
23:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, So you know that's the other cool thing.
23:03
Speaker 2: We now have a little bit of vision into twenty
23:07
Speaker 2: twenty six, which given where that team has been, having
23:11
Speaker 2: any sort of security is not a bad thing.
23:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's fair. They'll take any kind of
23:17
Speaker 1: reliability they can get at this point. Really, as they
23:20
Speaker 1: ramp up to twenty twenty six. Let's talk about another
23:22
Speaker 1: South American though, because this is the other element of
23:24
Speaker 1: the driver market that's become really quite interesting, and that's
23:26
Speaker 1: Franco Cola Pinto, who's replaced Logan Sergeant a couple of
23:30
Speaker 1: months ago now, just shortly after the mid season break,
23:32
Speaker 1: and has made a real splash with his first it's
23:35
Speaker 1: been five or six races, now, how many races have
23:36
Speaker 1: we had quite a few six races. Yeah, Brazil was
23:39
Speaker 1: Maybe he's only his only false note, I guess, but
23:41
Speaker 1: the conditions there were pretty treacherous and certainly more experienced
23:44
Speaker 1: drivers than him were caught out by them. So I
23:46
Speaker 1: think he's deserved to leave pass at least on the
23:48
Speaker 1: body of work he'd shown up before that. Now there's
23:51
Speaker 1: no room at Williams for him next year. They've got
23:53
Speaker 1: Alex Albon and Carlos Sciences as well established, but there
23:56
Speaker 1: is a competition to pry him away from Williams, where
23:59
Speaker 1: he has a long term deal. William's boss James Bowser
24:03
Speaker 1: said they're willing to negotiate over that. Hasn't said which
24:07
Speaker 1: teams are involved. We know though Red Bull is one
24:10
Speaker 1: of them because they've got their own driver conundrum. We've
24:12
Speaker 1: talked about a lots EDGI of Perez. It's just not
24:15
Speaker 1: doing very well. They've got Liamlawson now after sacking Downie Ricardo.
24:17
Speaker 1: They could use another driver in that mix, but it
24:21
Speaker 1: seems like Matt It's not the only team. We thought
24:24
Speaker 1: maybe Saba was in the mix and they did have
24:26
Speaker 1: some investigations, but never too seriously. It's Alpine, which is
24:30
Speaker 1: signed up next year with Pierre Gasly and Australia's Jack
24:33
Speaker 1: Dowan that has been sniffing around with Franco Cola Pinto's availability,
24:37
Speaker 1: which would be a mighty twist.
24:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is one that landed on my desk over
24:44
Speaker 2: the Southlo Grand Prix weekend. Now we know Franco is
24:47
Speaker 2: in high demand. He's shown himself to be a capable
24:51
Speaker 2: young driver in the six.
24:53
Speaker 3: Races he's had so far.
24:54
Speaker 2: As you, I think, quite rightly and fairly say let's
24:56
Speaker 2: give him a reprieve for Interlagos because condition there caught
25:00
Speaker 2: out many more experienced drivers than he, so let's give
25:05
Speaker 2: him that one as a bit of a free kick.
25:08
Speaker 2: But what he's done is delivered five points in six
25:12
Speaker 2: races for a long time ahead of our Pine getting
25:17
Speaker 2: that surprise double podium last weekend. You know, he'd really
25:20
Speaker 2: solidified William's position in the Constructors Championship, which is what
25:24
Speaker 2: he was there to do. He was challenging Alex Alban
25:27
Speaker 2: which is a hell of a thing to say, because
25:29
Speaker 2: Alex Album is no slouch. So if you can come
25:31
Speaker 2: in as a rookie and challenge Alex Album and put
25:33
Speaker 2: pressure on a guy's established as that, you know Williams
25:36
Speaker 2: famously told us the other weekend that it was his
25:38
Speaker 2: hundredth grand pre weekend, so he's been around for a
25:41
Speaker 2: little while. That's again in implied credibility. So is there
25:46
Speaker 2: any wonder that you get other teams who perhaps have
25:49
Speaker 2: an interest come knocking. Now the one that is strange
25:53
Speaker 2: is our pen Let's come back to that. Red Ball
25:56
Speaker 2: makes perfect sense of the reasons you touched on.
25:59
Speaker 3: It needs a.
25:59
Speaker 2: Solution into Sergio Perrs and it needs that at the
26:02
Speaker 2: start of this year, not the start of the next year.
26:04
Speaker 3: Really, So that's why.
26:07
Speaker 2: Liam Lawson is in the RB now, and at this
26:10
Speaker 2: stage you'd still have to say that he's the front
26:12
Speaker 2: runner for that SAT. However, I know conversations between Horner
26:16
Speaker 2: and James Vows have taken place.
26:19
Speaker 3: They met and it wasn't to.
26:20
Speaker 2: Discuss coffee, as Vows suggested it was. So that's happening.
26:26
Speaker 2: It's not imminent. It will take time to lock down
26:31
Speaker 2: a deal if they get to one. But should they
26:34
Speaker 2: land on a deal, you'd have to think that Colopino
26:36
Speaker 2: is going to go into rent Bull, whn't you because
26:39
Speaker 2: you're not going to spend some serious money and then
26:42
Speaker 2: place a kid who clearly you think are enough to
26:45
Speaker 2: spend that much money at the junior team, right.
26:48
Speaker 3: That doesn't make sense to me.
26:51
Speaker 1: It's an interesting question, and there are lots of different
26:53
Speaker 1: ways you can try and cut the rationale forward, and
26:56
Speaker 1: a good one is, as you say, it sounds like
26:58
Speaker 1: it's going to cost them a lot of money. Or
26:59
Speaker 1: William is certainly asking for a lot of money to
27:01
Speaker 1: release Franco Colopinto from his long term contract, and like
27:05
Speaker 1: you say, you're gonna spend a lot of money, you
27:06
Speaker 1: may as well try and make the most of it.
27:09
Speaker 1: If that is what happens, and he does end up
27:11
Speaker 1: taking Sergio Peis a seat the end of next year,
27:13
Speaker 1: I think there's a couple of repercussions in that one.
27:15
Speaker 1: What a massive vote of no confidence in your own
27:17
Speaker 1: driver program program that Halma Marco has been pushing increasingly
27:21
Speaker 1: hard in the last twelve months as he's tried to
27:24
Speaker 1: redirect RB to being the junior team it used to be,
27:27
Speaker 1: and it's guys as Toro Rosso and Alpha Tower, and
27:29
Speaker 1: that involved removing Downie Ricardo getting Liam Lawson back in there.
27:33
Speaker 1: It's not a great vote of confidence out well, particularly
27:35
Speaker 1: in those two guys. I mean, we already know Yuki
27:37
Speaker 1: Sonoda is not viewed as Red Bull Racing material, but
27:39
Speaker 1: Liam Lawson is in the mix there and he will
27:42
Speaker 1: be overlooked by Franco Colopinto if this is what happens.
27:46
Speaker 1: But then also massive vote of no confidence in your
27:48
Speaker 1: younger guys that are coming up through the pipeline, and
27:51
Speaker 1: that's not necessarily the way it shouldn't be viewed, because
27:55
Speaker 1: it seems doesn't really think that Isaac Cajo is quite
27:58
Speaker 1: ready for Formula one as the most senior among that
28:00
Speaker 1: junior program, and that's maybe fair enough. He's held the
28:03
Speaker 1: championship lead left two and has had a pretty dreadful
28:05
Speaker 1: run since then and has lost that lead. So look,
28:08
Speaker 1: there's maybe that element of it. But then there is
28:10
Speaker 1: that idea that you've got a guy who was thrown
28:13
Speaker 1: to formul on very last minute, has had no Red
28:15
Speaker 1: Bull connection. I guess Red Bull can they know fabd
28:18
Speaker 1: about Alex album, so maybe believe his performance has been
28:21
Speaker 1: even more impressive than they've looked even from the outside. Certainly,
28:25
Speaker 1: his mental fortitude has been quite impressive considering the ways
28:27
Speaker 1: debuted in Formula One. Throwing him straight into Red Bull
28:32
Speaker 1: Racing would appear to be a big step because not
28:35
Speaker 1: only is it one of the front runners, but you're
28:38
Speaker 1: going there. It's essentially the same conditions that would have
28:40
Speaker 1: applied to a mid season switch this year, which is
28:43
Speaker 1: to score the point Serge Pais did not score. Next year,
28:46
Speaker 1: he'll be expected to help the team win the Contructors
28:49
Speaker 1: Championship and that's quite a lot of pressure. But then
28:51
Speaker 1: you do think, and we were talking about this just
28:52
Speaker 1: before we started recording, like on that basis, my mind
28:55
Speaker 1: was like, well, then of course it should be Liam Lawson,
28:57
Speaker 1: the more experienced drive it. But they'll actually arrive at
29:00
Speaker 1: the end of the season with I think almost exactly
29:02
Speaker 1: the same number of debuts, right or within one or
29:05
Speaker 1: two race starts.
29:07
Speaker 2: I think Colopinto will have nine and Liam will have eleven.
29:12
Speaker 1: So hardly anything between last year five last year six
29:15
Speaker 1: this year for liamb then nine for Franco. Yeah, I
29:19
Speaker 1: think that sounds about right. And you know, the first
29:21
Speaker 1: one for Liam last year, the Dutch Grand Prix, was
29:23
Speaker 1: such a last minute exercise that you could almost just
29:26
Speaker 1: consider you could almost discount that one. It's almost like
29:28
Speaker 1: it's one Grand Prix really between them, and so on
29:32
Speaker 1: that basis, well, maybe it makes at least as much
29:35
Speaker 1: sense as putting Lawson in the car. And you could
29:38
Speaker 1: still say, if you're Liam Lawson who's waited quite a
29:41
Speaker 1: while to get in this car and then assume the
29:42
Speaker 1: pathway was going to be to try and take surge
29:44
Speaker 1: of Perry's the seat and needs to be served by
29:46
Speaker 1: a total outsider, that there is still this talk that well,
29:49
Speaker 1: maybe Max with staff and will leave the team the
29:51
Speaker 1: next year or two, and then he would presumably be
29:53
Speaker 1: the senior successor a lot of different ways. You can
29:57
Speaker 1: mount the argument one way or another. I think it's
29:59
Speaker 1: interesting into the mix. He waited yos for staff and
30:02
Speaker 1: always interesting when he does wade into the mix, vouching
30:05
Speaker 1: essentially for Liam Lawson as Max with Staffan's teammate next year.
30:08
Speaker 1: Says he likes the idea that he could push his
30:10
Speaker 1: son something I of think Max has ever really needed
30:12
Speaker 1: help with, but that he would be a good fit
30:14
Speaker 1: at that team. So there's clearly a little bit of
30:17
Speaker 1: it's kit, a little bit of decision making, let's say,
30:19
Speaker 1: let's put it in the most neutral way, decision making
30:21
Speaker 1: going on at Red Bull over how to finally figure
30:25
Speaker 1: out the driver lineup that's really caused so much trouble
30:28
Speaker 1: this year.
30:29
Speaker 2: This is the problem that it's been dealing with. It's
30:32
Speaker 2: really manifested itself this year, but it's been dealing with
30:35
Speaker 2: for a lot longer, really, since they lumped in for
30:39
Speaker 2: Sergio Perris because there was no one better. Alex Alban
30:43
Speaker 2: probably thrown in a little bit too early, maybe not
30:45
Speaker 2: quite as sharp as they hoped he was. Give you
30:49
Speaker 2: out after a couple of goes. Wasn't good enough. It
30:53
Speaker 2: was a ghastly Similarly, probably thrown into too early, wasn't
30:56
Speaker 2: maybe quite sharp off. You know, there's been this since
31:00
Speaker 2: Riccardo left, there's been this lull in the Red Bull
31:04
Speaker 2: program where they just haven't had that high quality youngster
31:07
Speaker 2: come through and be able to consistently win races out
31:12
Speaker 2: of their own junior program. And they're now in a
31:16
Speaker 2: posum where they've potentially got that We still don't know
31:20
Speaker 2: with Lawson Hadjar doesn't look quite the guy for the job.
31:27
Speaker 2: But you know, I remain to be convinced of that
31:30
Speaker 2: or have my mind changed, And I'm.
31:33
Speaker 3: With you in that.
31:34
Speaker 2: This is, you know, looking at Colopinto is not just
31:37
Speaker 2: looking at fixing the Perez problem. This is covering off.
31:41
Speaker 2: This is an insurance policy against Max doing something because
31:45
Speaker 2: let's look at the end of twenty five, they lose
31:48
Speaker 2: soon Oda, so that they need a driver there. Regardless
31:52
Speaker 2: of anything else that happens, they will need a driver there.
31:55
Speaker 2: So at that point you're looking at Hadja or lind
31:58
Speaker 2: Lad Who's where in the program At that stage, I
32:03
Speaker 2: actually think a year in super formula for the Haji
32:06
Speaker 2: doing a world of good. But then let's start in
32:09
Speaker 2: the mix exercises had enough and retires. Suddenly you need
32:12
Speaker 2: two drivers and suddenly plugging a gap of that was
32:17
Speaker 2: left behind by Yukisnoda, which is comparatively easy, Suddenly that's
32:20
Speaker 2: not so easy. And then you've still got a field,
32:23
Speaker 2: a competitive top tier lineup at Rebel Racing. Who have
32:26
Speaker 2: you got if you don't take Colopinton. Now you've got
32:28
Speaker 2: laws and and you're basically looking for three drivers in
32:31
Speaker 2: the next year. And they're clearly unconvinced by Hajar, so
32:35
Speaker 2: they're looking for three drivers have effectively acknowledged that they
32:38
Speaker 2: don't have one parking Lema side now because he's easy
32:40
Speaker 2: to formula one program.
32:41
Speaker 3: So I'm talking purely about juniors. So that they need
32:46
Speaker 3: three drivers.
32:46
Speaker 2: They don't have one, so at least by bringing Colopinto in,
32:49
Speaker 2: they've got two drivers and they can potentially foster their
32:53
Speaker 2: way through to get two drivers if that's what's needed.
32:56
Speaker 2: So I can see that being part of the consideration
33:01
Speaker 2: as well, because you know, there's been all this talking
33:03
Speaker 2: about Max going elsewhere and who knows whether that will
33:05
Speaker 2: happen or not. But he's also been pretty consistent in
33:08
Speaker 2: saying over the years that he's not going to race
33:10
Speaker 2: in Formula one forever. He's not going to do a
33:11
Speaker 2: Lewis Hamilton or Fernando Orlando. He's going to get to
33:13
Speaker 2: the point where he's done in a walk away. That
33:18
Speaker 2: could be at the end of this year for all
33:20
Speaker 2: we know, that could be the end of next year.
33:23
Speaker 2: So it makes a lot of sense bring in colo pinto.
33:27
Speaker 2: What doesn't make sense to me is why our pin
33:29
Speaker 2: has got any interest for a couple of reasons. The
33:33
Speaker 2: only way I can rationalize it is that our pin
33:37
Speaker 2: is interested in the money because ren I was looking
33:40
Speaker 2: to reduce its exposure. We've seen that by the closure
33:44
Speaker 2: of its power unit facility, saving it one hundred and
33:48
Speaker 2: fifty million a year. You then look out. Okay, it's
33:54
Speaker 2: got to set a driver a lineup. What does it
33:56
Speaker 2: get out of Franco colo Pinto by replacing presumably Jack,
34:00
Speaker 2: and I don't get okay. Franco has had a few
34:04
Speaker 2: racism Formula one to show himself. Jack hasn't had that opportunity,
34:07
Speaker 2: So we're not comparing apples with apples.
34:08
Speaker 3: That's an unfair comparison.
34:10
Speaker 2: It is an advantage in Franco's favor because he's had
34:14
Speaker 2: that opportunity, but it's still not a fair like for lack.
34:18
Speaker 2: What does it also say about Alpeen's junior program? What
34:21
Speaker 2: does it say about our Peen senior management? And it
34:23
Speaker 2: would be if this decision was made, it would be
34:26
Speaker 2: the same management that's effectively signed Jack dowan As will
34:30
Speaker 2: be sacking him and signing someone else. So it's a
34:32
Speaker 2: poor indictment on our Peen management. If that is also
34:35
Speaker 2: the case. If that happens, I don't believe it will.
34:40
Speaker 2: I've written a story saying that it's a possibility, and
34:43
Speaker 2: it is a possibility. I have reason to believe that
34:49
Speaker 2: Alpine is having conversations and is chasing Franco colopinto, whether
34:54
Speaker 2: it has a realistic chance completely different scenario. Personally, I'm
35:00
Speaker 2: strang I hope Jack Doing's on the grid next year.
35:02
Speaker 2: That's my unabashed, what's word patriotic standpoint on it. But
35:11
Speaker 2: that said, if Franco Calopinto isn't on the grid for
35:15
Speaker 2: some reason, that would be equally devastating, because I think
35:18
Speaker 2: he's earned the right to be there as well. I
35:19
Speaker 2: just I don't know how that would fit with our Pene.
35:22
Speaker 2: And it's a really really uncomfortable thought for a multitude
35:27
Speaker 2: of reasons. And it all goes back to our Paine
35:32
Speaker 2: announcing a young Australian and then he doesn't race for them.
35:36
Speaker 1: Just speaks to that idea that there's a lot of
35:38
Speaker 1: young guys pushing up, wasn't it, and a relatively late
35:40
Speaker 1: realization that they're all pretty good, and let's hope that
35:44
Speaker 1: Jack Dowan is not caught up in the rush to
35:46
Speaker 1: try and get as many of them on board as possible.
35:49
Speaker 1: Let's look now briefly, mat though, at the Brazilian or
35:51
Speaker 1: the South Paolo Grand Prix at the weekend when and
35:55
Speaker 1: wild probably the best way to describe, certainly the Sunday
35:57
Speaker 1: and the latter part of Saturday when qualifying was called
36:00
Speaker 1: off postponed to Sunday morning, reasonable time Australian for qualifying,
36:05
Speaker 1: not so much for the Grand Prix.
36:06
Speaker 3: So original qualifying or rescheduled qualifying.
36:09
Speaker 1: The rescheduled qualifying, the rescheduled qualifying. I should reschedule it
36:12
Speaker 1: every year. At that time, it was a seismic result
36:16
Speaker 1: as well as a seismic schedule because Max was staffened one.
36:20
Speaker 1: Now I have a bugbear with the statistics over this.
36:23
Speaker 1: He won from seventeenth on the grid. There are only
36:26
Speaker 1: fourteen cars ahead of him, I say one from fifteenth.
36:28
Speaker 1: Either way, it was a pretty good win. I think
36:29
Speaker 1: it's fair to say in the wet conditions. But the
36:31
Speaker 1: championship permutations were equally clear. That is that Lando Norris,
36:35
Speaker 1: who started from pole, had finished sixth and a relatively
36:39
Speaker 1: uncompetitive six By the end of the race, is now
36:41
Speaker 1: sixty two points off the championship leader, only eighty six remaining.
36:46
Speaker 1: He must outscore Max was stappened by at least three
36:48
Speaker 1: points in Las Vegas just to stay alive. Suddenly, the
36:52
Speaker 1: championship that might have been able to go to Abu Dhabi,
36:55
Speaker 1: maybe not competitively but just purely mathematically, could be over
36:59
Speaker 1: as soon as a couple of weeks.
37:01
Speaker 3: I called it a while ago. I think Max will
37:03
Speaker 3: win it in Las Vegas.
37:05
Speaker 1: And then Stefano Dominicali will turn into pure energy and
37:09
Speaker 1: Formula one will be closed down for good because nothing
37:11
Speaker 1: could possibly top a driver's championship being crowned in Las Vegas.
37:17
Speaker 2: I think Rene Wilm would also turn into a little
37:19
Speaker 2: bundle of energy as well. She's the she's the boss
37:22
Speaker 2: of of Las Vegas Grand Prix. She's also quite senior
37:25
Speaker 2: at Liberty Media. Actually tipped to be the next Steffan
37:29
Speaker 2: Domnicali in some corners.
37:31
Speaker 1: I like the idea that Stefano Dominicali is like a
37:33
Speaker 1: James Bond figure, like they have to change their name
37:36
Speaker 1: to that. That's the position of the title. But it's
37:38
Speaker 1: a different it's a rotating list.
37:39
Speaker 2: Of people Dominiculi, Stepano Dominica.
37:44
Speaker 3: But yeah, I've Alwaysto got the Contructor's Championship.
37:46
Speaker 2: That's a proper yes, ticularly it's a three way fight,
37:50
Speaker 2: but realistically it's only two that will go down to
37:56
Speaker 2: Abi Dabie. But yeah, it's it's it's max Is to
37:59
Speaker 2: lose at this point. He needs something pretty catastrophic to
38:02
Speaker 2: go wrong. To see the championship. Have you done the
38:05
Speaker 2: last couple of episodes, You've done your Well, Kimmy won
38:08
Speaker 2: it from here, so it's not as bad as Kimmy
38:10
Speaker 2: wonning a championship.
38:11
Speaker 3: Comparison, Have you have you done that this week?
38:15
Speaker 1: I could do some very quick.
38:17
Speaker 3: I'll do some Philly if you do some maths. Yeah.
38:21
Speaker 2: I mean what Max did in South Paolo was pretty extraordinary. Yes,
38:26
Speaker 2: there was the help of the safety car. Yes, there
38:29
Speaker 2: was the fact that he started P seventeen when they
38:30
Speaker 2: were only about four cars in front of him, and
38:32
Speaker 2: therefore it was only about that's a front rogue starting
38:35
Speaker 2: spot for him. But he started to negotiate those conditions
38:39
Speaker 2: not make a mistake. And it's not only that he
38:41
Speaker 2: got to the lead. But I don't think he breached
38:45
Speaker 2: track limits. I don't think there was ever a notice
38:50
Speaker 2: on timing about him running wide or having a laptime
38:53
Speaker 2: deleted or anything where pretty much every other driver had
38:56
Speaker 2: at least one. So to do all that and then
39:00
Speaker 2: to drive up the road to the tune that he did,
39:02
Speaker 2: which is what was a nineteen point four seconds I
39:05
Speaker 2: think at the check of flag, I mean, that's that's
39:09
Speaker 2: pretty remarkable. And okay, yes, let's clarify that it was
39:12
Speaker 2: over a couple of our penes and it wasn't you know,
39:14
Speaker 2: the Ferraris or the McLaren's or whatever, but they just
39:17
Speaker 2: didn't have the pace.
39:19
Speaker 3: He did. He used it. He standards authority on that race.
39:22
Speaker 2: I thought it was a really good, really good not
39:24
Speaker 2: one of his best, you know, two or three, but
39:28
Speaker 2: you know, certainly one of his top ten, top ten drives.
39:30
Speaker 1: I think also really important, just in the context of
39:33
Speaker 1: the last few well even last months, Christian Horner spoke
39:37
Speaker 1: to the effect on and so Max was stapping in fact,
39:39
Speaker 1: to the effect on the team which has been genuinely
39:42
Speaker 1: struggling pretty much into mid season break even a little
39:44
Speaker 1: bit before that, and not just struggling in terms of
39:47
Speaker 1: pace here and there because McLaren Ferrari's caught up, but
39:50
Speaker 1: some weekends genuinely just not understanding why it's not being
39:53
Speaker 1: competitive on Sundays. Maybe there's still a little degree of that,
39:56
Speaker 1: considering he adds such a wet race and such an
39:57
Speaker 1: unusual weekend overall.
39:59
Speaker 3: No water in the tip, that's what it is.
40:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, well there's water outside the tires. He was part
40:03
Speaker 1: of the part of the thing, but in the sprint
40:04
Speaker 1: did look genuinely competitive. The sprint is a very particular
40:07
Speaker 1: competitive field, I guess, so you can't necessarily extrapolate that.
40:11
Speaker 1: But did look good. There was obviously dominant the race,
40:13
Speaker 1: and then also for Max, forstapp and to I guess
40:16
Speaker 1: answer some critics if you want to put it in
40:18
Speaker 1: that way, after the last two races that have been well,
40:21
Speaker 1: there have been many people heavily critical of the way
40:23
Speaker 1: he's gone about his business in the last two races.
40:25
Speaker 1: It wasn't that he won this in a will to
40:26
Speaker 1: wield battle per se, but just did come out and
40:29
Speaker 1: show well, actually, I can still boss this around, and
40:32
Speaker 1: I can win this championship, and he will win this
40:34
Speaker 1: championship unless Matt go the second greatest comeback of all
40:38
Speaker 1: times to Lando Is So he needs a twenty point
40:42
Speaker 1: six to six point turnaround over the last three races.
40:46
Speaker 1: Kimmy Reichen's turnaround in two thousand and seven over the
40:48
Speaker 1: last two races twenty one point two five points impressive,
40:51
Speaker 1: tund so very very close, but not unprecedented. If your
40:59
Speaker 1: land and iris for good luck.
41:01
Speaker 2: I mean, let's face it, even if he if it's
41:03
Speaker 2: mathematically moved out of possibility in Vegas. Maxtra always have
41:09
Speaker 2: his points stripped away from him, and I mean there's
41:12
Speaker 2: precedent for.
41:13
Speaker 3: Me, isn't true?
41:14
Speaker 1: That is true?
41:17
Speaker 3: I mean who'd want to win a championship like that?
41:19
Speaker 3: But yeah, there you go. I must go back.
41:26
Speaker 2: And rewatch that two thousand and seventh season because the
41:30
Speaker 2: more I reflect on it, and it's come up a
41:32
Speaker 2: few times in recent weeks, and also two thousand and
41:36
Speaker 2: eight that was some extraordinary seasons. They really were.
41:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, well absolutely, as the numbers point out there, and
41:44
Speaker 1: just you've already touched on the constructors Championship. It's McLaren
41:46
Speaker 1: that leads Forrari by thirty six points, so not so
41:48
Speaker 1: much in the team's title picture, and Ferrari is expected
41:52
Speaker 1: to be the form team in Las Vegas as it
41:54
Speaker 1: was last year. Should still suit that car very much
41:56
Speaker 1: in McLaren certainly says it's braced to be trying to
41:59
Speaker 1: catch up with the next round, although it should have
42:01
Speaker 1: things all its own way. And Kata Red Bull Racing
42:04
Speaker 1: closed to within thirteen points of Ferrari largely more exclusively
42:07
Speaker 1: pretty much thanks to Max with Staffan's victory. Ferrari did
42:11
Speaker 1: have a pretty ropeye weekend. Wasn't quite there in the dry,
42:14
Speaker 1: but then in the wet certainly not Carlos Signs crashed out.
42:17
Speaker 1: So a bit of a messy weekend. But I don't
42:19
Speaker 1: think that's enough to dent the optimism the team had
42:23
Speaker 1: for its form leading up to this weekend, because I
42:26
Speaker 1: think conditions here were just pretty unusual. But we do
42:28
Speaker 1: wait and see. I guess we do have three quite
42:30
Speaker 1: unusual tracks and circumstances coming up, so maybe it could
42:33
Speaker 1: be mixed bag for everybody who knows. But that's the
42:36
Speaker 1: real championship, Matt. Let's talk about the alternative championship, realite
42:40
Speaker 1: in some hearts than the real championship. And that's fine.
42:44
Speaker 2: This is the one that everyone wants to win. They
42:48
Speaker 2: don't know it exists, but they all want.
42:49
Speaker 3: Yes, they just don't know it yet.
42:52
Speaker 2: I'll kick us off. I've been quite sensible here with
42:55
Speaker 2: my first pick. I've got Max with Staffan and I've
42:59
Speaker 2: given him twenty five points because he drove a good.
43:02
Speaker 3: Race and won.
43:04
Speaker 1: Hey, that is how it works.
43:05
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's yeah, I mean, that's it's kind of all
43:08
Speaker 3: I got for that one.
43:09
Speaker 1: That's okay. I'm happy with that, I'm going to take
43:11
Speaker 1: twenty five points off Lando Norris for describing Max Verstaffan's
43:16
Speaker 1: victory as being born of luck and not talent, which
43:19
Speaker 1: I thought was a little bit petty of him. I
43:21
Speaker 1: know he did expand later on to say, well, Max
43:23
Speaker 1: would have lapped everyone he was that fast, so cou'd
43:25
Speaker 1: be too critical of him. But red Flag there is
43:29
Speaker 1: a degree of luck in that, and that you get
43:31
Speaker 1: to change your ties for free. But it was an
43:33
Speaker 1: active choice of Red Bull and Max to stay out
43:35
Speaker 1: because they read the conditions and thought, well, there's probably
43:38
Speaker 1: pretty good chance it's gonna be quite a b accident
43:39
Speaker 1: in these conditions, and they took that risk, stayed out
43:41
Speaker 1: and didn't change tires when everyone else did. When Nico
43:43
Speaker 1: Holkenberg spun off the road under the VC or under
43:47
Speaker 1: the safety car, that ensued and they won big for that.
43:49
Speaker 1: So luck and not talent I think was grossly unfair
43:52
Speaker 1: for a man who's lost the Driver's Championship lead that
43:55
Speaker 1: he says sometimes was on but the team says, now, well,
43:56
Speaker 1: they're never really aiming for anyway. I thought was a
43:59
Speaker 1: little bit pity.
44:01
Speaker 3: I think that's that's that's fair enough. Yeah, I mean,
44:05
Speaker 3: the red flag rules awkward, and that has been for
44:07
Speaker 3: a long time, and it all goes to this.
44:09
Speaker 2: You know, the drivers must use two different compounds of
44:11
Speaker 2: tire and they drive with a race and all that nonsense.
44:14
Speaker 3: It's just I hate it.
44:16
Speaker 2: It's just an excuse to talk about Perelli. But yeah,
44:20
Speaker 2: let's let's move on, staying on the rewarding appropriate to
44:26
Speaker 2: the race result. I'm going to take one point away
44:29
Speaker 2: from Lance Stroll, Oh okay, because he was minus one
44:32
Speaker 2: lap in the race.
44:33
Speaker 1: Very good, didn't he didn't even his lap? I like that.
44:37
Speaker 1: I think that's fair. You know what, I'm going to
44:39
Speaker 1: go straight to mine because I took fifty points off
44:41
Speaker 1: Lance Stroll. So we might as well talk a little
44:43
Speaker 1: bit of lands Stroll here. There is now like a
44:45
Speaker 1: look in conditions like this, it is not absolutely egregious
44:50
Speaker 1: to lose your car on the formation, especially if the
44:52
Speaker 1: team says that had break problems, which always finds problems
44:55
Speaker 1: with Lancetroll's car when he makes mistakes. But look to
44:58
Speaker 1: be fair for and and made mistakes too, said some
45:00
Speaker 1: similar thing. It's not so much that he went off
45:03
Speaker 1: on the formation lap, is that he chose to rejoin
45:06
Speaker 1: by traveling across a gravel trap in wet condition.
45:09
Speaker 3: Perfectly good escape road at the back of the head.
45:10
Speaker 1: And he did this just well, probably just minutes, let's
45:13
Speaker 1: be honest, after the team completed fairly significant repairs for
45:17
Speaker 1: his car after crashing and qualifying. What a dreadful way
45:20
Speaker 1: to repay him. We can contrast that to Fernando Alonso
45:23
Speaker 1: a different circumstances, of course, but who was suffering terrible
45:26
Speaker 1: back pain. You might have seen a video of him
45:27
Speaker 1: getting quite gingerly out of his car after the race
45:30
Speaker 1: and said I would retire, but I think it was
45:32
Speaker 1: out of it. He was out of the points, wasn't he?
45:34
Speaker 1: But I want to pay back the work of the
45:37
Speaker 1: mechanics and finish the race in the car they rebuilt
45:39
Speaker 1: for me after I crashed it in in Q three
45:41
Speaker 1: or whatever it was. I just thought, it's not even
45:44
Speaker 1: necessarily like poor form from Lance. It's just so thoughtless
45:48
Speaker 1: in the context that I had to take points off him.
45:51
Speaker 1: It's just so silly.
45:52
Speaker 2: It's just on brand for him Singapore Grand Prix last year,
45:58
Speaker 2: where he crashed out a big way in qualifying, they
46:01
Speaker 2: rebuilt his current then he he was cleared medically to
46:04
Speaker 2: race and then suddenly he wasn't he was tired, Yeah.
46:10
Speaker 3: Of going racing.
46:11
Speaker 2: Apparently we didn't want to spend two hours racing at
46:14
Speaker 2: the back of the field in Singapore. Yeah, it's it's yeah.
46:18
Speaker 3: I have a lot of thoughts on that. Probably better
46:22
Speaker 3: I don't air them here.
46:26
Speaker 2: Right, Actually, speaking of thoughts that shouldn't be aired, let's
46:29
Speaker 2: move on to my third pick.
46:33
Speaker 3: Johnny Herbert.
46:34
Speaker 1: Oh, okay, yes, I'm here for this.
46:36
Speaker 3: The FIA driver Steward in Mexico.
46:42
Speaker 2: Was obviously part of the group that penalized MAXA Stappan
46:47
Speaker 2: in Singapore, was the Mexico performing the same role obviously
46:52
Speaker 2: handed Max's penalties there and then between Mexico and Brazil
46:57
Speaker 2: gave an interview.
46:58
Speaker 3: Now, a lot of these former drivers, now, oh yes,
47:01
Speaker 3: I'm glad.
47:01
Speaker 2: You has relationships with betting companies or online casinos or
47:08
Speaker 2: whatever they are. So they give interviews and they are
47:12
Speaker 2: all sort of deliberately incendiary in many respects. Johnny's given
47:19
Speaker 2: one of these in which he's made some critical remarks
47:22
Speaker 2: of Maxis Stappin and Johnny Herbert as a form of
47:25
Speaker 2: racing driver three time Grand Prix winner absolutely perfectly entitled
47:29
Speaker 2: to make those comments and criticisms. He's perfectly credentialed, that's
47:35
Speaker 2: well within his remit as a pundit, but not when
47:36
Speaker 2: he's an FIA stewart. So he's taken off the FAA
47:39
Speaker 2: shirt given this interview, and then a couple of days
47:40
Speaker 2: later he's put the FIA shirt back on, and then
47:44
Speaker 2: while he's there, called chy leclair In for swearing at
47:50
Speaker 2: a press conference and find him ten thousand euros. So
47:56
Speaker 2: for that hypocrisy with Maxis Stappin's penalty of community service
48:03
Speaker 2: and the comments that I think are wholly unbecoming of
48:06
Speaker 2: an FAA steward, regardless of his expertise as a driver.
48:10
Speaker 2: I'm finding Johnny Herbert ten thousand points, half of which
48:14
Speaker 2: are suspended depending another repeat incident.
48:18
Speaker 1: Very good. I like that a lot. I'm very much
48:20
Speaker 1: in agreement with you as well. I don't mind him
48:22
Speaker 1: being a pundit, but just don't comment on the race
48:26
Speaker 1: as you're stewarding on like I understand stewards of volunteers,
48:28
Speaker 1: which means I don't think it's fair to say he
48:30
Speaker 1: should never be able to comment on Formula one. But
48:32
Speaker 1: if you've stewarded, if you've adjudicated on that race. I
48:36
Speaker 1: think it is totally inappropriate few to then subsequently commented
48:38
Speaker 1: on it, comment on it directly as well, like you
48:41
Speaker 1: spars specifically and talked specifically about that race, not in
48:44
Speaker 1: general terms. And I think that that just I don't
48:47
Speaker 1: think that's too much to ask, even if you've got
48:49
Speaker 1: a contract with Lose my Money dot biz.
48:52
Speaker 3: Or whatever it is.
48:53
Speaker 1: I mean, every email I get from these casinos, the
48:56
Speaker 1: website names get more and more bizarre as well. It's
48:58
Speaker 1: just this lacks credibility.
49:02
Speaker 2: I keep getting emails encouraging me to look at this
49:04
Speaker 2: new study that they've just which is actually just they've
49:09
Speaker 2: tottered up the number the amount of penalties that drivers
49:12
Speaker 2: have chalked up this year.
49:14
Speaker 3: You've just looked at a bunch of documents. It's not
49:16
Speaker 3: really a study.
49:17
Speaker 2: Who's got the calculator out and pressed a few few buttons.
49:20
Speaker 1: Yes, I do like that, A little sneak behind the
49:22
Speaker 1: world of a sneak peek behind the world of press
49:24
Speaker 1: releases informdile one. To wrap things up, I'm going to
49:27
Speaker 1: end it on a positive note. Believe it or not,
49:29
Speaker 1: we got ten points to both the FIA and Formula
49:33
Speaker 1: one for being what I thought was refreshingly proactive with
49:37
Speaker 1: rescheduling the weekends running to Sunday morning and not just
49:40
Speaker 1: moving qualifying Sunday mornings. That's the easy part, but rescheduling
49:44
Speaker 1: Sunday to give themselves the maximum opportunity to get the
49:47
Speaker 1: race done. If the rain was as bad as a forecast,
49:49
Speaker 1: then it wasn't quite that bad. So everything got away
49:51
Speaker 1: without a hitch. Really, we lessually Williams or any of
49:54
Speaker 1: the teams are crashed, but generally terms, everything worked fine.
49:57
Speaker 1: And in the past, not that long ago, that would
49:59
Speaker 1: never have happened. You know, we've I think we both have.
50:02
Speaker 1: Matt sat in media centers in Japan with typhoons bearing
50:05
Speaker 1: down and everyone refusing to do anything about it. So
50:08
Speaker 1: I thought that was quite good. I thought that was
50:10
Speaker 1: quite clever. You know, broadcasters can and Fox Sports being
50:14
Speaker 1: one of them, but we can deal with it. It's possible
50:16
Speaker 1: to just take the satellite for have it well. I
50:18
Speaker 1: don't know how it works, but at a different time,
50:20
Speaker 1: and I'm glad they did pull the trigger, even though
50:22
Speaker 1: it doesn't seem like would have been affected in the end.
50:25
Speaker 1: But if anything, that's even more reason to give points
50:27
Speaker 1: because they made sure that we got the running in
50:30
Speaker 1: and the fans loved it. Look, it was a great audience
50:32
Speaker 1: there had always is in Brazil. It's good for them.
50:34
Speaker 1: They were queuing up, as I believe, from like five
50:36
Speaker 1: in the morning to make sure they were there when
50:38
Speaker 1: gates opened or some silly time. It just really worked
50:40
Speaker 1: for everyone. So it points to them.
50:42
Speaker 2: That's a fair, fair comment there, because yeah, it turned
50:47
Speaker 2: it into a torture with Sunday for us, but we're
50:49
Speaker 2: in the minority, you know.
50:52
Speaker 3: For the most part, we got qualifying, we've got a race.
50:55
Speaker 2: They were entertaining encounters, punishing encounters for some of the teams.
50:58
Speaker 3: But yeah, it was good.
51:01
Speaker 2: And that there was some common sense taken as well.
51:03
Speaker 2: It's just a it's a step in the right direction,
51:06
Speaker 2: isn't it.
51:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very good. Well done. Well done Formula one,
51:09
Speaker 1: Formula one, well done to Baku. Now well done. Anyway,
51:13
Speaker 1: that's all the time. We have a bit talk today.
51:15
Speaker 1: We'll be back in a couple of weeks to preview
51:17
Speaker 1: the Las Vegas Grand Prix. Until then, you can subscribe
51:19
Speaker 1: to Pitt Talk wherever you get your favorite podcasts, and
51:21
Speaker 1: you can leave us a rating and review as well,
51:23
Speaker 1: and stay up to date with the latestef ON news
51:25
Speaker 1: throughout the next couple of weeks at Fox Sports dot com,
51:28
Speaker 1: dot a U and Speedcafe dot Com. From Matt Cosh
51:30
Speaker 1: and me Michael Lamonado, Thanks very much for company and
51:33
Speaker 1: we'll catch you later this month.