Latest / The Schmidt Show PDX / CEI Hub-Bub

Transcript

CEI Hub-Bub · The Schmidt Show PDX

0:05
SPEAKER_03: A quick word from our show sponsor,
0:07
SPEAKER_03: Dr. Adam Moret at Corbett Hill Wellness Center, people I know and trust.
0:10
SPEAKER_02: Hi, I'm Dr. Moret from Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
0:13
SPEAKER_02: A lot of people know us for chiropractic, but we're much more than that.
0:17
SPEAKER_02: We offer chiropractic,
0:18
SPEAKER_02: massage,
0:19
SPEAKER_02: acupuncture, naturopathic medicine, laser treatment, shockwave therapy, and more.
0:24
SPEAKER_02: Why so many options?
0:26
SPEAKER_02: Because everyone is different.
0:27
SPEAKER_02: We look at the whole person and help you find the care that makes sense for you.
0:31
SPEAKER_02: Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
0:33
SPEAKER_02: Move well, feel well, live well.
0:36
SPEAKER_02: Visit corbethill.com.
1:02
SPEAKER_03: Welcome back.
1:03
SPEAKER_03: I'm Mike Schmidt, former Multnomah DA, French Bulldog owner.
1:07
SPEAKER_03: Shout out to Hoagie Roll, our geriatric Frenchie rescue slash incredible money pit.
1:14
SPEAKER_03: And also, of course, your favorite part-time podcaster.
1:17
SPEAKER_03: Here's a question for you.
1:18
SPEAKER_03: The next time you fill up your car in Oregon or board a plane at PDX,
1:22
SPEAKER_03: where do you think that that fuel came from?
1:25
SPEAKER_03: Because for about 90 percent of it,
1:27
SPEAKER_03: the answer is a six-mile stretch of northwest Portland along
1:30
SPEAKER_03: the Willamette River just below Forest Park.
1:33
SPEAKER_03: Hundreds of storage tanks,
1:34
SPEAKER_03: most of them built before Oregon had modern seismic building codes,
1:38
SPEAKER_03: sitting on soil that geologists expect to turn Thank you.
1:55
SPEAKER_03: But not anymore.
1:56
SPEAKER_03: Over the past month, Portland City Council has deadlocked 6-6 on it more than once.
2:01
SPEAKER_03: Last week,
2:02
SPEAKER_03: the mayor had to cast a tie-breaking vote to approve handing one of
2:05
SPEAKER_03: the hub's most controversial terminals to a Miami-based investment firm.
2:09
SPEAKER_03: And the council is now deciding how much fuel should be allowed to sit on
2:13
SPEAKER_03: that riverbank for the next decade.
2:15
SPEAKER_03: My guest today has been in the middle of that fight.
2:17
SPEAKER_03: Marnie Glickman is the executive director of the Braided River Campaign,
2:21
SPEAKER_03: a group started by Portland teachers and has become one of the loudest voices on
2:25
SPEAKER_03: the CEI Hub.
2:26
SPEAKER_03: We're going to talk about what the Hub is,
2:28
SPEAKER_03: why it has split our council right down the middle,
2:31
SPEAKER_03: and what's coming up for a vote and what you can do about it.
2:34
SPEAKER_03: That's what's coming up.
2:35
SPEAKER_03: But first,
2:36
SPEAKER_03: we turn once again to our trash news correspondent,
2:38
SPEAKER_03: Eleanor Jones, for a recurring segment called In the News.
2:43
SPEAKER_03: Eleanor, what is in the news this week?
2:46
SPEAKER_00: Well, Mike, I am so glad you asked.
2:48
SPEAKER_00: There is a lot going on right now.
2:51
SPEAKER_00: So the pop culture world had experienced some pretty major losses this year,
2:55
SPEAKER_00: but we have some really wonderful news,
2:57
SPEAKER_00: which is that both Lena Dunham and Lady Gaga have dropped new babies over
3:02
SPEAKER_00: the last couple of weeks.
3:04
SPEAKER_00: Exciting.
3:04
SPEAKER_00: Rather, they've dropped the baby announcements.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: They haven't actually dropped
3:06
SPEAKER_03: the babies.
3:07
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
3:08
SPEAKER_00: As far as we know.
3:09
SPEAKER_00: So this is really exciting news,
3:11
SPEAKER_00: not just for millennial women and gay men who like to see their faves thriving,
3:15
SPEAKER_00: but for humanity as a whole.
3:18
SPEAKER_00: Earlier this year, Vice President J.D.
3:20
SPEAKER_00: Vance and former White House Press Secretary Carolyn Levitt both had babies,
3:26
SPEAKER_00: resulting in pretty negative aura points for America.
3:30
SPEAKER_00: So we're hoping that the Dunham and Gaga baby announcements balance things out exactly.
3:34
SPEAKER_00: The force.
3:36
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
3:36
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:36
SPEAKER_00: Things should be leveled.
3:37
SPEAKER_00: So and also future ultra elite preschools might just have
3:40
SPEAKER_00: a little bit more swagger moving forward.
3:43
SPEAKER_00: And it's great news for the teachers at those ultra elite preschools
3:47
SPEAKER_00: who probably aren't going to be getting Starbucks gift cards for Christmas
3:50
SPEAKER_00: from Lena Dunham and Lady Gaga.
3:51
SPEAKER_00: And they'll be like, oh, another Warhol you shouldn't have.
3:56
SPEAKER_00: Hey, Mike, you know, it's interesting.
3:58
SPEAKER_03: What's that?
3:58
SPEAKER_00: When Lady Gaga's baby says Google Gaga, she's saying Google mom.
4:02
SPEAKER_03: Isn't that cool?
4:04
SPEAKER_03: That baby's going to be able to speak right away.
4:05
SPEAKER_00: Do you think she thought of that when she picked her name, her stage name?
4:08
SPEAKER_03: Probably.
4:09
SPEAKER_03: She seems brilliant.
4:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
4:11
SPEAKER_00: In other great news for humanity,
4:13
SPEAKER_00: Celine Dion returned to performing for the first time in six years
4:16
SPEAKER_00: since getting diagnosed with stiff person syndrome.
4:20
SPEAKER_00: And she didn't just return to the stage.
4:21
SPEAKER_00: She performed for over two hours and she sang 25 songs.
4:25
SPEAKER_00: So I've been talking today for about a minute and a half so far,
4:28
SPEAKER_00: and I'm going to have to lie down for several hours when this is done.
4:31
SPEAKER_00: And I don't have stiff person syndrome.
4:32
SPEAKER_00: If anything,
4:33
SPEAKER_00: I have like loose person syndrome or like floppy person syndrome, if that's a thing.
4:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
4:39
SPEAKER_00: So she's doing the performances in France.
4:41
SPEAKER_00: She's doing like a residency there and over 9 million people entered the lottery for tickets.
4:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, pretty amazing.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: But what I also think is really interesting is that she's doing the shows in France,
4:53
SPEAKER_00: but she's actually French Canadian.
4:54
SPEAKER_00: A lot of people forget that.
4:55
SPEAKER_00: So this would be like an American singer staging a comeback in London.
5:00
SPEAKER_00: And I don't think Celine Dion can claim being French just because she speaks French.
5:05
SPEAKER_00: She is New World trash, just like the rest of us.
5:09
SPEAKER_00: And she doesn't even wear a single beret in her show, so I'm not buying it.
5:15
SPEAKER_00: Speaking of performances,
5:17
SPEAKER_00: some attendees at the Americana Music Honors and Awards show were shocked last week
5:23
SPEAKER_00: when Dolly Parton appeared by video to accept a Lifetime Achievement Award.
5:27
SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
5:28
SPEAKER_00: So people were worried that it was AI.
5:30
SPEAKER_00: However, Dolly Parton had recorded the video before she passed away.
5:33
SPEAKER_00: The intention was for her to present it or to share her speech in absentia,
5:39
SPEAKER_00: but it ended up being posthumous because she passed away.
5:42
SPEAKER_00: But I was worried it was going to be like the thing
5:44
SPEAKER_00: when Ozzy Osbourne had passed away and they made that AI video of him dancing
5:47
SPEAKER_00: with like Jimi Hendrix and Janis Joplin.
5:50
SPEAKER_00: But I think it's interesting to think about with everything that's happening
5:54
SPEAKER_00: within AI,
5:54
SPEAKER_00: because now celebrities are going to have the right into their will what can
5:59
SPEAKER_00: and cannot be done with their likeness when they passed away.
6:02
SPEAKER_00: So they don't have to accidentally be shown shaking hands with Donald Trump or doing
6:06
SPEAKER_00: a duet with someone lame.
6:07
SPEAKER_00: Oh,
6:08
SPEAKER_03: my God.
6:09
SPEAKER_03: You probably saw the Tupac Shakur coming back on stage in different iterations.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:16
SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot that can be done that's pretty damaging to people's legacies.
6:20
SPEAKER_00: But I think I'm going to have my will specify that I'm going to be included
6:23
SPEAKER_00: in all important things happening in the future.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: I want it to be like a Forrest Gump thing where I'm in the background of all of
6:30
SPEAKER_00: the cultural touchstone moments from here on out.
6:34
SPEAKER_00: And so people say like their goal is to leave the world a better place.
6:40
SPEAKER_00: And I kind of adjusted this over the last years and to just like not leave the world
6:43
SPEAKER_00: a worse place.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: I don't think that we're really in a trajectory where the world's getting better, unfortunately.
6:49
SPEAKER_00: But my new goal is just not to leave the world.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: I'm going to be everywhere.
6:53
SPEAKER_00: I don't have to worry about rebalancing aura points for my family if I never leave.
6:58
SPEAKER_03: It's going to be like, where's Eleanor?
7:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this is going to be a new where's Waldo thing.
7:02
SPEAKER_00: It's just going to be like a white lady with bangs and glasses.
7:04
SPEAKER_00: But that could really be most women in Portland.
7:08
SPEAKER_03: Well, we'll look forward to that future.
7:11
SPEAKER_03: I will be looking behind all iconic moments to see if I can find you in the background.
7:14
SPEAKER_00: I'll be there.
7:16
SPEAKER_03: Eleanor Jones, everybody.
7:17
SPEAKER_03: Eleanor, where can people find you?
7:18
SPEAKER_00: You can find me on the Portland Mercury.
7:20
SPEAKER_00: My column is called The Trash Report.
7:21
SPEAKER_03: All right.
7:22
SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
7:22
SPEAKER_03: Thanks a lot.
7:23
SPEAKER_03: Thanks, Eleanor.
7:24
SPEAKER_03: OK, let's get into it.
7:25
SPEAKER_03: Marnie Glickman, welcome to The Schmidt Show.
7:27
SPEAKER_01: Good morning.
7:28
SPEAKER_03: Good morning.
7:29
SPEAKER_03: Thank you for being here early on a Saturday morning.
7:32
SPEAKER_03: Tell us a little bit about yourself and the organization that you are the head of.
7:37
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
7:38
SPEAKER_01: I live in Northeast Portland in one of
7:40
SPEAKER_01: the least known best neighborhoods called Saban neighborhood.
7:45
SPEAKER_03: Oh, Saban.
7:46
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
7:46
SPEAKER_03: Like the Alabama football coach.
7:49
SPEAKER_01: Not sure I'll pass on that.
7:51
SPEAKER_01: I am an attorney and an environmental advocate,
7:55
SPEAKER_01: and I run a cool nonprofit called Breeded River Campaign.
7:59
SPEAKER_03: And you're a Lewis and Clark Law School alum.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
8:02
SPEAKER_03: As am I. Oh, cool.
8:03
SPEAKER_03: I actually went there to be an environmental lawyer, which you are doing and I am not.
8:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, what happened to you?
8:09
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I fell off along the way.
8:11
SPEAKER_03: I didn't love it.
8:13
SPEAKER_03: But I'm glad that you're doing it because actually what you're doing is kind
8:17
SPEAKER_03: of what I was inspired to want to do when I attended law school.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: Well, I actually went to law school after working in politics a long time in DC.
8:25
SPEAKER_01: I was working for some One named Ralph Nader.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Glickman, you'll never get out of politics unless you go to law school.
8:33
SPEAKER_01: So I quit my job working for Ralph and moved back to Portland and went to law school.
8:38
SPEAKER_03: Oh, that is so cool.
8:39
SPEAKER_03: Well, so here you are and you're running an organization called Braided River.
8:43
SPEAKER_03: Tell us a little bit about that.
8:44
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
8:44
SPEAKER_01: Braided River Campaign was founded in 2021.
8:49
SPEAKER_01: And the purpose is to help river communities get involved in city politics
8:54
SPEAKER_01: and city decision making and the decisions that affect their lives.
8:58
SPEAKER_01: And, you know,
8:59
SPEAKER_01: most people live in Within five miles of the Columbia River or the Willamette River
9:04
SPEAKER_01: in Portland.
9:04
SPEAKER_01: So we are trying to orient folks that, you know, we need access to the river.
9:09
SPEAKER_01: We need safety.
9:10
SPEAKER_01: And it's not just about clean air and clean water.
9:13
SPEAKER_01: It's about clean land and safety.
9:16
SPEAKER_03: Well, it's kind of a perfect amalgamation of your political savvy
9:19
SPEAKER_03: from your Ralph Nader days and your law school environmental has now come together
9:24
SPEAKER_03: for Braided Marnie to read the River campaign.
9:28
SPEAKER_03: What's that name mean, Braided River?
9:30
SPEAKER_03: Where does that come from?
9:30
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
9:31
SPEAKER_01: Well, rivers can be kind of described in many ways.
9:34
SPEAKER_01: And the Willamette River actually was a braided river.
9:37
SPEAKER_01: Right.
9:38
SPEAKER_01: Long before we dredged the river and tried to push as much heavy industry
9:45
SPEAKER_01: on our riverbanks, there were meandering streams.
9:49
SPEAKER_01: There were marshes.
9:51
SPEAKER_01: There were islands.
9:52
SPEAKER_01: Swan Island was a real island.
9:54
SPEAKER_01: There were lakes, too.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: We know about Smith and Bybee Lake, but you might not know about Giles Lake.
10:00
SPEAKER_01: Have you heard of Giles Lake?
10:00
SPEAKER_01: I don't, no.
10:01
SPEAKER_01: Well, Giles Lake was a 400-acre lake.
10:06
SPEAKER_01: In Northwest Portland, kind of on the, you know where Montgomery Park is?
10:10
SPEAKER_01: So it was between Montgomery Park and where the riverbanks are now.
10:13
SPEAKER_01: And so it used to be- It was a lake.
10:15
SPEAKER_01: It was a lake.
10:16
SPEAKER_01: It was the home of the 1905 World's Fair Exposition and millions of people came
10:22
SPEAKER_01: and it was,
10:23
SPEAKER_01: you know, it was a beautiful place before we dumped all our dredge on it.
10:29
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
10:30
SPEAKER_03: Well,
10:30
SPEAKER_03: and that's kind of going to get us into some of the things that we're talking today
10:34
SPEAKER_03: about.
10:36
SPEAKER_03: What does the organization do day to day?
10:38
SPEAKER_03: I mean, are you reaching out to Portlanders and education?
10:42
SPEAKER_03: I mean, you were started by some educators.
10:44
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
10:45
SPEAKER_01: Well, we do public education first and foremost.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: So we actually have a gallery, the Bridge River Gallery.
10:51
SPEAKER_01: It was located in Lloyd Center Mall for many years.
10:55
SPEAKER_01: And we just relocated to Fifth and Harvey Milk downtown.
10:59
SPEAKER_01: So people can go in and learn about Marshes,
11:04
SPEAKER_01: lakes that have now been disappeared by heavy industry.
11:08
SPEAKER_01: You can learn about land use planning, how that can be really exciting.
11:12
SPEAKER_01: Our city's comprehensive plan is for all ages.
11:16
SPEAKER_01: And that's the main part of our public education.
11:20
SPEAKER_01: And we try and do stuff online, but we're really in-person people.
11:24
SPEAKER_03: You know, I lived before I moved to Portland.
11:27
SPEAKER_03: I lived in New Orleans and I had never I was young and I was teaching middle school
11:32
SPEAKER_03: at the time and I had never really thought about land use planning right at all.
11:37
SPEAKER_03: And then Hurricane Katrina came through and I had moved at that point just
11:42
SPEAKER_03: before it hit New Orleans to Portland.
11:45
SPEAKER_03: But I looked at the destruction of that hurricane and I was like,
11:48
SPEAKER_03: isn't it strange that all the poorest neighborhoods were the ones
11:52
SPEAKER_03: that were seriously impacted?
11:54
SPEAKER_03: Like what's the odds of that,
11:56
SPEAKER_03: that the mansions were okay, but the poverty stricken neighborhoods were decimated.
12:01
SPEAKER_03: And then I started to learn, oh, actually that's intentional.
12:05
SPEAKER_03: There was design elements in the way that the city was planned that led
12:10
SPEAKER_03: to those types of outcomes.
12:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we are also telling stories that even
12:14
SPEAKER_01: the most excited Portland historians don't know about.
12:20
SPEAKER_01: Like, for example, where the CEI hub is now, there was social housing in World War II.
12:28
SPEAKER_01: Tens of thousands of people lived there.
12:30
SPEAKER_03: Was that the Vanport?
12:31
SPEAKER_01: No, it was called the Giles Lake Neighborhood.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: That makes sense.
12:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
12:36
SPEAKER_01: There are people who worked in the harbor, people who couldn't afford living other places.
12:42
SPEAKER_01: And now we know it's just an industrial devastation zone.
12:49
SPEAKER_03: Well, that gets us into what I really wanted to talk to you
12:52
SPEAKER_03: about today is your work around the CEI hub.
12:57
SPEAKER_03: So first of all,
12:58
SPEAKER_03: just for people who maybe are slightly aware or maybe not aware at all of
13:03
SPEAKER_03: the CEI hub, what is it?
13:04
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
13:05
SPEAKER_01: Well, it's called the CEI hub.
13:07
SPEAKER_01: It's the critical energy infrastructure hub.
13:11
SPEAKER_01: I just call them those dangerous tanks in northwest Portland.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: So there's a six mile stretch of tanks basically from Linton neighborhood all
13:20
SPEAKER_01: the way six miles south.
13:22
SPEAKER_01: So real close to Linton.
13:25
SPEAKER_01: The Northwest Industrial District or,
13:27
SPEAKER_01: you know, that people could think of in their minds
13:30
SPEAKER_00: is off the highways.
13:31
SPEAKER_01: You can't really see can't really see these tanks,
13:34
SPEAKER_01: Mike, unless you're like in a canoe on the river.
13:37
SPEAKER_01: So there's hundreds of aging tanks.
13:41
SPEAKER_01: They hold up to 350 million gallons of fossil fuels.
13:48
SPEAKER_01: They are located on liquefiable soil.
13:54
SPEAKER_01: On the river, and they're just really too dangerous.
13:57
SPEAKER_01: They're out of sight and out of mind.
13:59
SPEAKER_01: And so we're working real hard right now,
14:02
SPEAKER_01: not just to explain what those tanks are and where they are,
14:06
SPEAKER_01: but how we can make them safer.
14:08
SPEAKER_03: Well, I know that especially I think this time of year,
14:12
SPEAKER_03: many of us Portlanders are driving out to Savvy Island
14:16
SPEAKER_03: for various fall related activities.
14:18
SPEAKER_03: Pumpkin patch for me and my family and driving that stretch up 30 past going through Linton.
14:24
SPEAKER_03: I mean, you can see them from that stretch of road,
14:28
SPEAKER_03: but maybe not the full breadth and depth of how many there actually are.
14:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's hundreds and hundreds of tanks.
14:35
SPEAKER_01: 90% of them were built before we knew about seismic standards.
14:42
SPEAKER_01: And some of them are rusty, they leak.
14:45
SPEAKER_01: And it's also dangerous for another reason,
14:50
SPEAKER_01: which is we now know that there is a Cascadia subduction zone fault.
14:57
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
14:57
SPEAKER_01: That's nearby.
14:58
SPEAKER_01: And when there is a big earthquake, those tanks are unsafe.
15:03
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we have a cup of coffee here,
15:05
SPEAKER_01: you know, I'm not going to spill it for effects and ruin all the gear.
15:08
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
15:09
SPEAKER_01: But, you know,
15:09
SPEAKER_01: it's like empty,
15:10
SPEAKER_01: you know, cups of coffee that can, you know, spill and make a big disaster.
15:17
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, the scale, it's hard to talk about because the scale is humongous.
15:22
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
15:25
SPEAKER_01: If there is a giant earthquake and those tanks rupture,
15:32
SPEAKER_01: the damage will be greater than the Deep Horizon spill.
15:38
SPEAKER_01: Billions of dollars of damage to our economy.
15:44
SPEAKER_01: Thousands of lives can be lost and wildlife devastation.
15:49
SPEAKER_01: And I don't like to talk about it that way in a doomy, gloomy way.
15:55
SPEAKER_01: It's real.
15:56
SPEAKER_01: And the scale is really big.
15:58
SPEAKER_03: Well, you've used the term already liquefiable soil.
16:02
SPEAKER_03: And I've heard liquefaction is, you know, same word, different conjugation.
16:07
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
16:07
SPEAKER_03: But what does that mean?
16:09
SPEAKER_03: I mean, I walk on soil.
16:11
SPEAKER_03: It's not quicksand, is it?
16:12
SPEAKER_01: Well, so we can talk about the Braided River.
16:14
SPEAKER_03: Perfect.
16:14
SPEAKER_01: When Portland
16:20
SPEAKER_01: started as Harbor, the...
16:24
SPEAKER_01: Industrialists wanted to make it deeper so we could have more shipping, right?
16:29
SPEAKER_01: And so they dredged soil from the bottom of the river and they put it on the riverbanks.
16:37
SPEAKER_01: They filled up Giles Lake.
16:38
SPEAKER_01: And so I think of it as like mushy soil, as soil from the bottom of the river.
16:44
SPEAKER_01: So now the river is about 40 feet deep and all that dredge was piled on ground.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: And we built tanks on that soil.
16:54
SPEAKER_03: I'm imagining as you're describing it.
16:56
SPEAKER_03: Tell me if this is a good analogy.
16:58
SPEAKER_03: Like when I go to the coast with my family,
17:01
SPEAKER_03: we go to the beach and they dig out sand from the beach.
17:05
SPEAKER_03: Right.
17:05
SPEAKER_03: And then they pile the kind of wet sand together to make castles and other things.
17:10
SPEAKER_03: It quickly kind of melts almost if water touches it or,
17:15
SPEAKER_03: you know, just if anything kind of vibrates around it, just kind of fires.
17:19
SPEAKER_03: Sinks right back in.
17:20
SPEAKER_03: Is that kind of a similar concept?
17:22
SPEAKER_01: I think it's a similar concept.
17:24
SPEAKER_01: I am not an engineer, so that's about as deep as I want to go into what liquefiable soil is.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: But we have many dangers.
17:32
SPEAKER_01: So we have the liquefiable soil.
17:34
SPEAKER_01: We have old tanks that are not seismically upgraded.
17:39
SPEAKER_01: Right.
17:39
SPEAKER_01: And we also have this all located inside.
17:44
SPEAKER_01: On the river on the Portland Harbor Superfund site.
17:48
SPEAKER_01: So where this is on the river is already a dangerous polluted place.
17:53
SPEAKER_01: And it's a another disaster waiting to happen.
17:58
SPEAKER_01: But I'm sounding like a disaster freak again.
18:01
SPEAKER_03: Well, and you also mentioned that.
18:04
SPEAKER_03: So there's the worst case scenario, right?
18:06
SPEAKER_03: The Cascadia event happens and I got to work on putting a report together about this.
18:11
SPEAKER_03: And this was part of our report was the liquefaction that would occur not only for
18:16
SPEAKER_03: the CEI hub, but for some of our bridges and other infrastructure.
18:19
SPEAKER_03: So the worst case scenario,
18:21
SPEAKER_03: there might be some people say, oh, well, that only happens every 400 years.
18:25
SPEAKER_03: So let's keep rolling the dice.
18:26
SPEAKER_03: I know we're getting close to 400 years.
18:28
SPEAKER_03: Right.
18:29
SPEAKER_03: But what is the less worst case scenario?
18:32
SPEAKER_03: You mentioned some of these tanks leak.
18:33
SPEAKER_03: I mean, that can't be good for our environment.
18:35
SPEAKER_01: Well, there's leaking.
18:36
SPEAKER_01: Let's talk about a fire example, right?
18:39
SPEAKER_01: So these tanks are located between the river, Highway 30, and at the foot of Forest Park, right?
18:46
SPEAKER_01: And so one fire, accidental fire, that leaps to Forest Park, we can imagine...
18:53
SPEAKER_01: That little fire can become big real quick.
18:57
SPEAKER_01: You know, we know wildfires can spread up to 14 miles per hour.
19:01
SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is not just Forest Park, Washington Park.
19:06
SPEAKER_01: So that's an example for you.
19:08
SPEAKER_03: That's yet another.
19:10
SPEAKER_01: The doom and gloom,
19:11
SPEAKER_01: I think,
19:13
SPEAKER_01: is not as important as the fact that the city of Portland can take steps
19:21
SPEAKER_01: to protect people.
19:22
SPEAKER_01: Portlanders from these disasters and protect wildlife in our air and water.
19:27
SPEAKER_03: Well, good.
19:28
SPEAKER_03: I mean, one of the first things that occurs to me and probably anybody thinking
19:32
SPEAKER_03: about this is why don't we just move it?
19:36
SPEAKER_03: Like, why does it why wouldn't we say, oh, this is on this is in a bad spot.
19:40
SPEAKER_03: Why?
19:40
SPEAKER_03: Why not move it?
19:41
SPEAKER_03: And maybe that'll get us into some of the conversations about what the city of Portland can do.
19:45
SPEAKER_03: But but just why not?
19:47
SPEAKER_01: Also, first of all, we don't want this danger in anyone's backyard.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: So at Braid River Campaign and our allies, we don't want to, you know, say, put it over there.
19:58
SPEAKER_01: Those people aren't as important.
19:59
SPEAKER_01: So we start there with that problem.
20:03
SPEAKER_01: How do we keep people safe and not add this to someone else's backyard?
20:10
SPEAKER_01: I think we need to reduce demand for the fossil fuels.
20:13
SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's really the correct solution that we shouldn't rely on them.
20:19
SPEAKER_01: And
20:21
SPEAKER_01: We also know that there just really aren't many communities who want these things, Mike.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm talking myself in circles.
20:31
SPEAKER_03: Well, it makes sense, right?
20:32
SPEAKER_03: I mean, you mentioned the number of gallons,
20:35
SPEAKER_03: but as I mentioned at the outset,
20:37
SPEAKER_03: the fuel that we all use in this state or at least region,
20:43
SPEAKER_03: 90% of it is going through that hub.
20:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
20:46
SPEAKER_01: And there's also limited places where the tanks can go because we have a pipeline.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: So our oil comes through the Olympic pipeline and goes through Portland down to Eugene.
20:59
SPEAKER_01: And so putting tanks out in Coos Bay isn't going to help us too much.
21:05
SPEAKER_03: Got it.
21:06
SPEAKER_03: Well, this...
21:08
SPEAKER_03: Topic has been in the news quite a bit lately,
21:10
SPEAKER_03: and it's probably going to continue to be in the news.
21:13
SPEAKER_03: I've been to City Hall a few times in the past couple of weeks and not
21:18
SPEAKER_03: on this issue, but I couldn't help but overhear the people chanting behind me.
21:23
SPEAKER_03: What do folks want or what is the issue in front of City Hall and our counselors?
21:26
SPEAKER_03: What could the city be doing?
21:28
SPEAKER_03: Well, the city of Portland
21:48
SPEAKER_01: Can regulate these fossil fuel terminals that are owned by
21:53
SPEAKER_01: the biggest fossil fuel companies in the world.
21:57
SPEAKER_01: And so there are zoning code improvements that are being discussed right now,
22:06
SPEAKER_01: as well as adding a fuel reduction program.
22:11
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
22:12
SPEAKER_01: And that's a way to require these fossil fuel villains to find other solutions.
22:19
SPEAKER_01: So there's zoning code and then adding a new program.
22:24
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
22:26
SPEAKER_03: This past week or couple weeks,
22:28
SPEAKER_03: there's been a lot of conversation about ownership of some of these tanks.
22:34
SPEAKER_03: Talk to us about that.
22:35
SPEAKER_03: What is the whole Zenith versus I-square?
22:38
SPEAKER_03: What was that whole debate about?
22:40
SPEAKER_03: And it seemed divisive from the outside.
22:43
SPEAKER_03: The mayor had to come in to break the tie in terms of allowing...
22:48
SPEAKER_03: Well, the CEI Hub is owned by 11 different corporations.
22:51
SPEAKER_03: One of them is Zenith Energy.
23:06
SPEAKER_01: And we've heard about Zenith Energy for a long time in this town.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: They have a long history of breaking rules and not really caring about Portlanders
23:16
SPEAKER_01: or air and our water.
23:17
SPEAKER_01: And so another fossil fuel company,
23:22
SPEAKER_01: I Squared Capital, it's kind of a weird name, is trying to buy Zenith Energy.
23:30
SPEAKER_01: And we have been in City Hall saying, hey, Zenith Energy has this terrible track record.
23:37
SPEAKER_01: I squared's not any better.
23:40
SPEAKER_01: Let's add a provision to allow third-party enforcement of the agreement
23:51
SPEAKER_01: between Zenith Energy, I squared, and the city.
23:57
SPEAKER_01: And so it was divisive because
24:05
SPEAKER_01: I think we don't have enough counselors yet in City Hall who are willing
24:11
SPEAKER_01: to
24:14
SPEAKER_01: be seriously proactive in protecting Portlanders and our rivers.
24:21
SPEAKER_01: That's the kind of general summary of it.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: It would be a legal addition to the franchise agreement.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: And I don't want to go into that nerdy stuff unless you want to.
24:34
SPEAKER_03: Well, I mean,
24:35
SPEAKER_03: on its face,
24:37
SPEAKER_03: one might think, well,
24:38
SPEAKER_03: if everybody thinks that Zenith is a terrible company and they've done a bad thing.
24:44
SPEAKER_03: Allowing a sale to go through to a different company might lead to somewhat different results.
24:50
SPEAKER_03: So on its face, you might think that.
24:51
SPEAKER_03: But what I hear you saying is that wasn't actually what the debate was about.
24:55
SPEAKER_03: It was about giving Portlanders that kind of party right to enforce some of
25:01
SPEAKER_03: the safety regulations and things that we would like.
25:04
SPEAKER_03: Is that?
25:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:05
SPEAKER_01: So we were not trying to stop the sale.
25:07
SPEAKER_01: We were because a sale.
25:10
SPEAKER_01: We were trying to encourage our council to be proactive at that moment
25:16
SPEAKER_01: when they could add a provision for Portlanders to be able
25:20
SPEAKER_01: to enforce more regulations more easily.
25:23
SPEAKER_03: And the city could enforce those regulations.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
25:27
SPEAKER_03: But we are suspicious that they might not exercise that ability.
25:33
SPEAKER_03: And that's why it would be important to give Portlanders the right to do that.
25:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Part of this new change of government,
25:40
SPEAKER_01: I believe,
25:40
SPEAKER_01: is to allow people in Portland to have more direct impact on what's happening
25:46
SPEAKER_01: in our city, more voices and decision making.
25:49
SPEAKER_01: And this is one example of why this debate happened and why we're going to continue
25:57
SPEAKER_01: to ask our new city legislators to stand up for Portlanders.
26:02
SPEAKER_03: I'm going to ask you a really challenging question.
26:05
SPEAKER_03: Oh, geez.
26:07
SPEAKER_03: If you were one of the six plus the mayor who voted against allowing Portlanders
26:12
SPEAKER_03: to have this ability to enforce the safety provisions in this agreement,
26:18
SPEAKER_03: what would be their case?
26:21
SPEAKER_03: What would they say is the reason that they were against that?
26:25
SPEAKER_01: One of the reasons I heard is that some of the counselors thought
26:30
SPEAKER_01: that they didn't have the power as a city council.
26:37
SPEAKER_01: To negotiate an additional term to the franchise agreement.
26:42
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
26:42
SPEAKER_03: So legally they felt like we, we can't do this.
26:45
SPEAKER_01: Correct.
26:45
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
26:46
SPEAKER_01: And so guess what?
26:47
SPEAKER_01: I read the franchise agreement myself is actually not that long as,
26:50
SPEAKER_01: and this was a,
26:53
SPEAKER_01: you know, the city attorney said, no, you don't have the power to do it.
26:58
SPEAKER_01: But another,
26:58
SPEAKER_01: you know,
27:00
SPEAKER_01: legal analysis was,
27:02
SPEAKER_01: yeah, of course, of course, when the, Agreement between the city changes hands.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: It's a time to do this.
27:12
SPEAKER_03: Well, and you know, this is a perfect example of the old law school axiom.
27:17
SPEAKER_03: Well, the answer is it depends.
27:20
SPEAKER_03: And you ask one lawyer and another lawyer, you're going to get two answers.
27:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
27:23
SPEAKER_03: The courts sometimes are used to sort those things out.
27:26
SPEAKER_01: Well, and one of the dynamics I see in City Hall is that,
27:29
SPEAKER_01: you know,
27:29
SPEAKER_01: the city attorneys work for the administrative executive branch
27:33
SPEAKER_01: and our legislative branch.
27:34
SPEAKER_01: Our city council doesn't have its own legal counsel.
27:37
SPEAKER_01: Some cities that have our form of government, actually, the city council has its own attorney.
27:44
SPEAKER_01: And so that's some of the things that maybe we can make happen.
27:49
SPEAKER_03: So maybe structurally our legislative branch needs their own legal counsel.
27:53
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: Yes, definitely.
27:55
SPEAKER_03: Were there any other arguments or is that really kind of boiled down to
27:58
SPEAKER_03: that six plus one that felt like, oh, we just were not allowed to do this.
28:01
SPEAKER_03: So we won't versus the six.
28:03
SPEAKER_03: We're like, let's try it.
28:04
SPEAKER_03: We're hearing from some in the legal community that we can do this.
28:07
SPEAKER_03: I think that's the way
28:09
SPEAKER_01: I would sum it up.
28:10
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
28:11
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
28:12
SPEAKER_03: Well, that's very useful.
28:14
SPEAKER_03: So that vote happened and the six counselors plus the mayor were successful
28:21
SPEAKER_03: in not adding that third party right to Portlanders.
28:25
SPEAKER_03: So that sale is going through.
28:28
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
28:28
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
28:29
SPEAKER_03: So, but there's still more coming in front of the council on the CEI hub.
28:33
SPEAKER_03: That wasn't it.
28:35
SPEAKER_03: What else is going on?
28:36
SPEAKER_01: Well, Zenith Energy owns one of the tank farms.
28:41
SPEAKER_01: So there's 11 tank farms.
28:44
SPEAKER_01: And so Zenith Energy owns the biggest one, but it's only one owner of the 11.
28:50
SPEAKER_01: And so the city council is right now considering...
28:56
SPEAKER_01: A set of measures to make the CEI hub safer that would apply to all 11 tank farms.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: So we, you know,
29:06
SPEAKER_01: Zenith Energy,
29:07
SPEAKER_01: some people know about,
29:08
SPEAKER_01: but some of the owners are even more common names like Chevron owns a tank farm.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: BP owns a tank farm.
29:15
SPEAKER_01: Shell owns a tank farm.
29:17
SPEAKER_01: So we're talking about the CEI hub infrastructure.
29:22
SPEAKER_01: Tank farms that are owned by the biggest global corporations.
29:25
SPEAKER_03: Just so I'm thinking of this correctly.
29:26
SPEAKER_03: I mean,
29:27
SPEAKER_03: this makes sense now that you're describing it to me because it's like, well,
29:30
SPEAKER_03: obviously Chevron,
29:31
SPEAKER_03: they have their own fuel distribution that happens and so does BP and so does Shell.
29:37
SPEAKER_03: And so that's why they each have their own tank farm.
29:39
SPEAKER_03: They receive the shipments of gasoline and oil from the pipeline and other places,
29:45
SPEAKER_03: store it there,
29:46
SPEAKER_03: and then they distribute it out to their locations across our region.
29:49
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
29:50
SPEAKER_03: That's accurate.
29:50
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
29:50
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
29:51
SPEAKER_03: Let's take a break right there to listen to a word from our sponsors.
29:54
SPEAKER_03: A quick word from our show sponsor,
29:56
SPEAKER_03: Dr. Adam Moret at Corbett Hill Wellness Center, people I know and trust.
30:00
SPEAKER_02: Hi, I'm Dr. Moret from Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
30:03
SPEAKER_02: People ask me, how do I know if I really need a chiropractor?
30:06
SPEAKER_02: The truth is, you may not.
30:08
SPEAKER_02: I'll listen, figure out what's going on, and recommend care only when I think it can help.
30:13
SPEAKER_02: And with chiropractic,
30:15
SPEAKER_02: massage,
30:16
SPEAKER_02: acupuncture,
30:16
SPEAKER_02: naturopathic medicine, laser treatment, shockwave, and more, you have options.
30:22
SPEAKER_02: It's about finding what's right for you.
30:24
SPEAKER_02: Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
30:26
SPEAKER_02: Move well, feel well, live well.
30:29
SPEAKER_03: Visit corbethill.com.
30:31
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
30:31
SPEAKER_03: So this actually sounds like it might be more impactful than what was just in front
30:36
SPEAKER_03: of city council, the third party regulation between this one transaction.
30:40
SPEAKER_03: Cause now we're talking about all 11 major companies.
30:44
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
30:45
SPEAKER_03: That's it.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: That's it.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: I, you know, I, I try to keep putting this Zenith fight.
30:52
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
30:53
SPEAKER_01: I'm in the minority on this one, but like the Zenith fight is just one of the 11 corporations.
31:01
SPEAKER_01: So what's going on right now?
31:03
SPEAKER_01: City Council right now is considering amendments to our city's comprehensive plan.
31:10
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: Of fuel held in the tank farms.
31:24
SPEAKER_03: That's the whole enchilada.
31:25
SPEAKER_03: I mean, that's the big picture, right?
31:27
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
31:27
SPEAKER_03: Where do these recommendations that they are going to be considering come from?
31:31
SPEAKER_03: I imagine there's some analysis or something.
31:33
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
31:33
SPEAKER_01: That's an important question.
31:36
SPEAKER_01: So over the past year and a half,
31:38
SPEAKER_01: the Bureau of Planning and Sustainability has been working
31:42
SPEAKER_01: with community members like me,
31:45
SPEAKER_01: the tank farm owners like Zenith and Shell and Chevron.
31:49
SPEAKER_01: And Yeah.
31:50
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:12
SPEAKER_03: And I can imagine there might be a counter argument to don't do anything
32:16
SPEAKER_03: because it'll increase our gas prices.
32:19
SPEAKER_03: Is that part of the argument that we anticipate to be in any kind
32:24
SPEAKER_03: of regulation conversation that the city is going to be undertaking?
32:29
SPEAKER_01: I haven't heard that one yet, actually.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: Right now, I'm hearing the fossil fuel companies argue that This is our right to do business.
32:40
SPEAKER_01: It's our interstate commerce.
32:42
SPEAKER_03: It's our First Amendment right as corporations.
32:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right.
32:46
SPEAKER_01: And that our safety measures are good enough.
32:50
SPEAKER_01: And I don't think they've made the affordability argument yet because they can't back it up.
32:57
SPEAKER_03: Good.
32:58
SPEAKER_03: Good.
32:59
SPEAKER_03: Well, so you said that this study that has come through
33:03
SPEAKER_03: that is now making these recommendations worked with both the owners
33:07
SPEAKER_03: and also community groups.
33:09
SPEAKER_03: You have been obviously on the community side of things.
33:15
SPEAKER_03: How do you feel about the recommendations report?
33:17
SPEAKER_03: Do we like them?
33:18
SPEAKER_01: That's a good question.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: So I keep saying that you're the podcaster.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you.
33:22
SPEAKER_03: I appreciate it.
33:23
SPEAKER_03: You can always compliment me.
33:24
SPEAKER_03: Go ahead.
33:27
SPEAKER_01: The policy proposal will make us a little safer.
33:31
SPEAKER_03: Okay, a little bit.
33:33
SPEAKER_03: That little seems to be doing a lot of work in this answer so far.
33:37
SPEAKER_01: And so we need much stronger safety measures.
33:41
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
33:42
SPEAKER_01: And so we have persuaded five counselors to put together an amendment package
33:50
SPEAKER_01: to make it a little more safe.
33:53
SPEAKER_03: All right, now we've added a little to a little more.
33:55
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
33:57
SPEAKER_01: Because for my personal opinion, it's not good enough, right?
34:03
SPEAKER_01: The danger is so great.
34:07
SPEAKER_01: We need to put safety first.
34:12
SPEAKER_01: Our council isn't quite set up in a way yet where they're wanting to make it a lot safer.
34:22
SPEAKER_01: I mean, just super disappointed and it pisses me off,
34:24
SPEAKER_01: but we're going to make it a little more safe.
34:27
SPEAKER_03: Hopefully a little plus a little.
34:28
SPEAKER_03: So take us into the first little, the plan.
34:32
SPEAKER_03: What is making it slightly safer that is a good thing?
34:36
SPEAKER_01: So the proposal involves a reduction of capacity at the CEI hub, a reduction of 20% by 2036.
34:47
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
34:47
SPEAKER_01: Within a decade.
34:53
SPEAKER_01: So that's a little better.
34:55
SPEAKER_03: So if we have 1100 tanks, we're going to shut down 110 of them within a decade.
35:02
SPEAKER_01: Well, it's not going to be about just taking tanks down because we're talking
35:10
SPEAKER_01: about liquids and fuels passing through in pipelines.
35:17
SPEAKER_01: But putting that aside, the proposal is to reduce capacity by 20% in 10 years.
35:22
SPEAKER_01: Not good enough.
35:24
SPEAKER_01: And so we have an amendment package.
35:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, tell us about the amendment.
35:28
SPEAKER_01: That was put together by Counselor Mitch Green and Counselor Alana Partal Guinea.
35:33
SPEAKER_03: Great.
35:33
SPEAKER_01: Along with Counselors Kinal, Koyama Lane, and Olivia Clark.
35:38
SPEAKER_03: Well, that actually seems,
35:39
SPEAKER_03: I mean, in this city council makeup, you might consider that bipartisan.
35:43
SPEAKER_01: Yes, definitely.
35:45
SPEAKER_01: And one of the changes in their amendment package as it exists today can change, right?
35:52
SPEAKER_01: Is to also add reduction of volume of the fuels and to measure it on an annual basis.
36:05
SPEAKER_01: So instead of waiting 10 years to have more benchmarks and reductions along the way,
36:13
SPEAKER_01: And so that's the biggest change that might happen.
36:18
SPEAKER_03: So if I get this, just so I understand.
36:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
36:21
SPEAKER_03: So it's reduced by 20% within a decade.
36:24
SPEAKER_03: Would I have that right?
36:25
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: That's capacity.
36:28
SPEAKER_03: The math I did earlier was 10%, but I'm a lawyer, so you can't hold me to math.
36:32
SPEAKER_03: All right.
36:32
SPEAKER_03: So 20% in a decade is capacity.
36:35
SPEAKER_03: The amendment would actually kind of set benchmarks along that 10 year path
36:40
SPEAKER_03: where we're checking the volume and we want to see progress to reduction in volume.
36:47
SPEAKER_03: Which is the actual fuel that's there, not just capacity within.
36:52
SPEAKER_01: Yes, because these tanks, oh, I'm doing it.
36:56
SPEAKER_01: The tanks aren't filled to the top.
36:59
SPEAKER_03: So reducing capacity might not actually mean nothing.
37:03
SPEAKER_03: I get it.
37:04
SPEAKER_01: Yes, because the tanks need air, like safety again, not an engineer.
37:09
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
37:10
SPEAKER_01: And so this is really important that we pass this amendment package
37:14
SPEAKER_01: because reducing capacity wouldn't affect the amount of coffee in this coffee cup.
37:19
SPEAKER_03: I get it.
37:19
SPEAKER_03: So there's already a gap.
37:21
SPEAKER_03: So if you've got a fuel tank, there's already an empty space in there.
37:26
SPEAKER_03: So just reducing that capacity by 20% doesn't actually change the fuel that's in the tank.
37:31
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
37:31
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
37:33
SPEAKER_03: Well, that seems like a pretty important thing because just making
37:36
SPEAKER_03: the tanks slightly smaller coffee cups doesn't seem to change the amount
37:41
SPEAKER_03: of coffee that's already being stored in them.
37:44
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
37:45
SPEAKER_01: So that's a big part of the amendments on the table.
37:50
SPEAKER_01: There are other...
37:52
SPEAKER_01: Pieces that would close loopholes in the existing proposal.
37:58
SPEAKER_01: Because as you might guess,
37:59
SPEAKER_01: those corporations like,
38:01
SPEAKER_01: oh, you know, we want limited expansion of the storage of aviation fuel.
38:07
SPEAKER_01: So this is something.
38:09
SPEAKER_01: So in the current proposal without amendments.
38:14
SPEAKER_01: We can we could see actually an increase in aviation fuel.
38:21
SPEAKER_01: Which increases danger.
38:24
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
38:25
SPEAKER_01: So there's that, you know, there's that little piece.
38:28
SPEAKER_03: So another piece we've talked about how and now I get it.
38:32
SPEAKER_03: Now I get that the the original report makes us maybe slightly a little bit better,
38:38
SPEAKER_03: but also maybe changes nothing.
38:41
SPEAKER_03: Actually makes us slightly safer because there actually would be a reduction
38:45
SPEAKER_03: in volume of these fuels.
38:49
SPEAKER_03: So I understand that.
38:51
SPEAKER_03: But it sounded like in your that'll make us a little safer.
38:55
SPEAKER_03: You had some ideas for things that might actually meaningfully make us more safe.
39:01
SPEAKER_03: What are some of the other ideas out there?
39:03
SPEAKER_01: Well, first of all, we absolutely need emergency planning for a CEI hub disaster.
39:10
SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm going to give you a terrible example.
39:13
SPEAKER_01: We have a preschool located inside the CEI hub area.
39:19
SPEAKER_03: Holy smokes.
39:20
SPEAKER_01: In Linton.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: Those children and those teachers do not have a CEI hub related emergency plan or gear.
39:31
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
39:32
SPEAKER_01: And so that has to happen.
39:35
SPEAKER_01: And budget woes be damned.
39:37
SPEAKER_01: They have to find some money to take care of people who live and work and go to school.
39:43
SPEAKER_01: Not just inside that six mile stretch, but in the neighborhoods adjacent to it.
39:47
SPEAKER_01: You know, I live in city council district too.
39:50
SPEAKER_01: My friends in St.
39:51
SPEAKER_01: John's neighborhood,
39:52
SPEAKER_01: Cathedral Park,
39:53
SPEAKER_01: Portsmouth,
39:54
SPEAKER_01: they are at risk and they have their own emergency challenges in
39:59
SPEAKER_01: the North Peninsula,
40:01
SPEAKER_01: as well as,
40:01
SPEAKER_01: you know,
40:02
SPEAKER_01: other folks who live in Linton and right adjacent to the hub,
40:05
SPEAKER_01: like in the Pearl District.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we are woefully underprepared.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: For even one fire at the hub.
40:14
SPEAKER_03: Wow.
40:15
SPEAKER_03: So a meaningful step could be we need to actually plan for some of
40:20
SPEAKER_03: the potential contingencies if something goes wrong.
40:23
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
40:24
SPEAKER_03: So that's not even happened?
40:25
SPEAKER_01: No.
40:26
SPEAKER_03: Wow.
40:27
SPEAKER_03: So when we talked about how a fire could jump and be a major disaster,
40:33
SPEAKER_03: we don't have a plan if that was to transpire.
40:36
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
40:37
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
40:38
SPEAKER_03: Well, that seems like something we should do.
40:40
SPEAKER_03: How is that controversial?
40:41
SPEAKER_03: Why would we not incorporate that into this amendment?
40:45
SPEAKER_01: I am not feeling like these things are controversial.
40:51
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
40:51
SPEAKER_01: I think it's a matter of our counselors and mayor.
40:58
SPEAKER_01: Adding their focus and attention to problem solving at this time.
41:04
SPEAKER_03: Is this a little bit like if I plug my ears and close my eyes, it maybe doesn't exist?
41:08
SPEAKER_01: Is that what's happening?
41:10
SPEAKER_01: Earlier this year,
41:11
SPEAKER_01: Mayor Wilson said in an interview to the North Peninsula Review,
41:16
SPEAKER_01: we have to take down tanks.
41:20
SPEAKER_01: Like I described, taking down tanks that might not reduce the risk.
41:26
SPEAKER_01: And so we have to Spend more time dealing with these real problems
41:35
SPEAKER_01: and working together, I think.
41:37
SPEAKER_01: I take a pause.
41:38
SPEAKER_01: It took us a lot of work to get Counselor Green and some of the people on
41:44
SPEAKER_01: the more progressive side to work with Counselor Portal Guinea and Counselor Clark.
41:48
SPEAKER_01: And so I'm really happy that the five of them are working together,
41:53
SPEAKER_01: but that's only five of the 12.
41:57
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
41:59
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
41:59
SPEAKER_03: So one other thing that we could do would be
42:02
SPEAKER_03: to actually have some safety planning contingencies for scenarios.
42:08
SPEAKER_03: What's another thing that we could do to make our communities more safe vis-a-vis the hub?
42:15
SPEAKER_01: We have to reduce the demand for fossil fuels.
42:18
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
42:18
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
42:18
SPEAKER_03: You mentioned that at the outset and, and,
42:20
SPEAKER_03: you know,
42:20
SPEAKER_03: I think we all are,
42:23
SPEAKER_03: we've been talking about global warming since,
42:25
SPEAKER_03: you know, at least for me, since Al Gore came on the scene, right.
42:27
SPEAKER_03: And needing to reduce the demand for fossil fuels.
42:30
SPEAKER_03: And it's always seemed like, yes.
42:32
SPEAKER_03: And boy,
42:33
SPEAKER_03: that's like pie in the sky,
42:34
SPEAKER_03: but it sounds like you have some like ideas about how we could be doing that
42:39
SPEAKER_03: for our region.
42:40
SPEAKER_01: Well, yes, we have to continue in the city.
42:44
SPEAKER_01: First of all, to take our, our climate change.
42:48
SPEAKER_01: Our climate action plan seriously and to electrify our buildings and our transportation.
42:54
SPEAKER_01: This involves Portland becoming a global leader again in cycling,
42:59
SPEAKER_01: in having electric ferries, for example.
43:03
SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's many more steps that the city can take that we haven't taken yet
43:09
SPEAKER_01: because I think people are really navel gazing too much.
43:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: For example,
43:16
SPEAKER_01: we're spending time talking about Tomacall Park and adding more concrete
43:21
SPEAKER_01: to Tomacall Park to make it a better park.
43:24
SPEAKER_01: Instead,
43:24
SPEAKER_01: we have PCEF and we have to protect PCEF and have those funds spent in a way
43:30
SPEAKER_01: that will help us reduce the demand and need for these fossil fuels.
43:35
SPEAKER_03: So naturally,
43:36
SPEAKER_03: obviously,
43:36
SPEAKER_03: if our region used less fuel,
43:38
SPEAKER_03: the corporations who own the hub would have less desire and need to pass more fuel
43:45
SPEAKER_03: through is the simple idea.
43:47
SPEAKER_03: How realistic is it that in
43:49
SPEAKER_03: the next decade we could be reducing our fossil fuel reliance in this region?
43:56
SPEAKER_03: That's a tough question.
43:58
SPEAKER_01: How possible it is.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: It is possible and needed and we can do it, but this is where we're in the election time, right?
44:05
SPEAKER_01: And so every decision that the voters make is the way right now for us
44:11
SPEAKER_01: to elect climate champions and not just people who talk about climate,
44:16
SPEAKER_01: not just people who say, oh,
44:17
SPEAKER_01: I have a bicycle,
44:19
SPEAKER_01: but people who know are willing to fight, for example, for climate.
44:24
SPEAKER_01: A massive expansion of protected bike lanes in Portland as one example.
44:30
SPEAKER_01: And so it's possible and needed.
44:35
SPEAKER_01: And I think we have to believe we can do it, right?
44:37
SPEAKER_01: Portland was a leader, a global environmental leader, and we can do that again.
44:41
SPEAKER_03: Well, that's good.
44:44
SPEAKER_03: So let's pretend because it is election season.
44:47
SPEAKER_01: It is.
44:48
SPEAKER_03: And in previous episodes, and I'm always an advocate for Mm-hmm.
44:53
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
45:11
SPEAKER_03: And you have candidate X that don't even need to name a candidate.
45:15
SPEAKER_03: What is a what is a question that you would encourage folks out there listening
45:19
SPEAKER_03: to be like, hey,
45:20
SPEAKER_03: here's the questions you need to ask them,
45:22
SPEAKER_03: because we need to find out if they're a real climate champion,
45:25
SPEAKER_03: not just like you said,
45:26
SPEAKER_03: wearing a bicycle lapel pin, but like they're an actual climate champion.
45:30
SPEAKER_01: Well, are you going to vote to reduce the volume of fuel at the CEI hub?
45:38
SPEAKER_03: That's an easy one.
45:39
SPEAKER_03: Yes or no.
45:40
SPEAKER_01: And if yes, how much volume are you willing to have?
45:49
SPEAKER_01: How much volume do you want to decrease?
45:52
SPEAKER_03: Right now it's 20% on the table.
45:55
SPEAKER_01: 20% on the table.
45:56
SPEAKER_03: But maybe we could do 30 or 40.
45:57
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
45:58
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
45:59
SPEAKER_03: Excellent.
46:00
SPEAKER_01: And so I,
46:01
SPEAKER_01: you know,
46:02
SPEAKER_01: I'm interrupting you because obviously I start getting a little excited
46:05
SPEAKER_01: when we're talking about doing things bigger and stronger for the sake of safety.
46:10
SPEAKER_01: It's climate safety, personal safety, environmental safety.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: And so 20%, you know, I guess I would ask a counselor candidate, like,
46:22
SPEAKER_01: how is 20% enough?
46:25
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
46:25
SPEAKER_01: I just said that it's not enough.
46:28
SPEAKER_01: To be honest, everyone, it's not enough.
46:30
SPEAKER_01: The answer is, it's not enough.
46:32
SPEAKER_01: The answer is, am I excited about this?
46:35
SPEAKER_01: No.
46:36
SPEAKER_01: But it's going to make things a little safer.
46:38
SPEAKER_03: Well, I think a lot of times,
46:40
SPEAKER_03: and I see this when I go on social media,
46:44
SPEAKER_03: I see people saying, oh,
46:46
SPEAKER_03: when city council candidates talk about environmentalism,
46:50
SPEAKER_03: it's kind of just a drop in the bucket because our global environment
46:54
SPEAKER_03: and things like global warming are international.
46:58
SPEAKER_03: And we need international cooperation and meaningful steps to be made.
47:01
SPEAKER_03: And so I feel like a lot of times the counter argument is like Portland can't do anything.
47:05
SPEAKER_03: But what I hear you saying,
47:06
SPEAKER_03: which is so important is,
47:08
SPEAKER_03: yes, of course, there's the big environmental thing where that's important.
47:12
SPEAKER_03: But there are things that we can do to protect the safety
47:14
SPEAKER_03: of our community right here that are incredibly meaningful to the people who live
47:20
SPEAKER_03: in those communities.
47:21
SPEAKER_03: And, you know, most of us who live within five to six miles of our waterways.
47:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
47:27
SPEAKER_01: I often think about freeways when I think about our river,
47:30
SPEAKER_01: and I think about how Portlanders stop
47:33
SPEAKER_00: the Mount Hood freeway.
47:35
SPEAKER_01: Right?
47:36
SPEAKER_01: There is a freeway plan, folks, from Portland all the way to Mount Hood.
47:40
SPEAKER_01: And over years, we got together and we stopped that thing.
47:44
SPEAKER_01: That's amazing.
47:46
SPEAKER_01: Tomacall Waterfront Park was a highway, right?
47:49
SPEAKER_01: And we're like, mm-mm, we want to park downtown.
47:52
SPEAKER_01: We don't want this highway downtown.
47:54
SPEAKER_01: And so we actually have an amazing history of doing amazing things.
47:59
SPEAKER_01: And so this CEI hub...
48:03
SPEAKER_01: Disaster in waiting, we have to drastically change what's there.
48:09
SPEAKER_01: That's why in the beginning, I tell you, there was social housing there.
48:12
SPEAKER_01: There was a 400 acre lake.
48:14
SPEAKER_01: We had a World's Fair exposition where the CI hub is, and that was less than 150 years ago.
48:22
SPEAKER_01: And so we can take it back from, you know, right now it's called also a industrial sanctuary.
48:30
SPEAKER_03: That's an interesting term, an industrial sanctuary.
48:33
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
48:34
SPEAKER_01: In 2001,
48:35
SPEAKER_01: whatever crazy pants is in city council decided to make it
48:40
SPEAKER_01: the Giles Lake Industrial Sanctuary.
48:42
SPEAKER_01: So they named this sanctuary after a dead lake that they killed.
48:47
SPEAKER_01: And so we can take it back.
48:48
SPEAKER_01: We don't need to have an industrial sanctuary there.
48:51
SPEAKER_01: We can have housing.
48:52
SPEAKER_01: We can have schools.
48:53
SPEAKER_01: We can have crosswalks, right?
48:56
SPEAKER_01: Right.
48:57
SPEAKER_01: It's a food desert right there in the city.
49:00
SPEAKER_01: So there's the vision, but also having the chutzpah on city council to make it happen.
49:07
SPEAKER_03: So let's dream big.
49:11
SPEAKER_03: We've talked about bike lanes.
49:12
SPEAKER_03: We've talked about reduction from 20 to 30 or 40%.
49:15
SPEAKER_03: Those are things that we could do.
49:18
SPEAKER_03: Let's dream really big.
49:20
SPEAKER_03: Let's say you had the perfect candidate out there right now who was championing this cause.
49:25
SPEAKER_03: What's the...
49:26
SPEAKER_03: What is the big picture look like?
49:30
SPEAKER_03: Is it just the hub does no longer exist there?
49:32
SPEAKER_03: It's completely removed?
49:33
SPEAKER_03: Is that the outcome we're hoping for?
49:35
SPEAKER_01: Well, we are a city that loves plans.
49:40
SPEAKER_01: And so I believe that it's important to ask community members who live there,
49:45
SPEAKER_01: community members who have been forced out.
49:49
SPEAKER_01: We want business owners of all sizes and shapes to come together and have a vision
49:54
SPEAKER_01: for that part of town.
49:56
SPEAKER_01: We often call it the North Reach of the river.
50:00
SPEAKER_01: So we have a North Reach River plan and envision it together.
50:04
SPEAKER_01: And I believe when community comes together with businesses of all sizes,
50:09
SPEAKER_01: we want economic prosperity.
50:11
SPEAKER_01: We want environmental health.
50:13
SPEAKER_01: We want equity.
50:16
SPEAKER_01: Make a plan for that part of the city and do it.
50:19
SPEAKER_01: We did it, you know, the Pearl.
50:24
SPEAKER_01: Down, Portland doesn't stop at the Pearl District.
50:29
SPEAKER_03: I've heard that.
50:30
SPEAKER_01: Portland doesn't stop at the Moda Center.
50:32
SPEAKER_01: So we call this the North Reach of the Willamette River is from about
50:38
SPEAKER_01: the Broadway Bridge to the confluence with the Columbia.
50:40
SPEAKER_01: This 12 mile stretch of a place that we can dream big.
50:45
SPEAKER_01: So what does it also look like?
50:47
SPEAKER_01: It also looks like the end of the Portland Harbor Superfund cleanup.
50:55
SPEAKER_01: So the Portland Harbor Superfund is a 10-mile stretch of the river
51:00
SPEAKER_01: in this same place as the CI Hub.
51:03
SPEAKER_01: And cleanup is starting in 2028 years.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: And so what it looks like is a clean river we can swim in.
51:13
SPEAKER_01: It means there's public access to the river.
51:17
SPEAKER_01: It means that we have trees.
51:19
SPEAKER_01: Did you know, Mike, that the CEI hub actually is the biggest heat island in Portland?
51:23
SPEAKER_01: It isn't,
51:25
SPEAKER_01: you know,
51:25
SPEAKER_01: there are serious heat island problems in East Portland,
51:29
SPEAKER_01: but the biggest one, the hottest one is the CEI hub.
51:32
SPEAKER_03: That seems dangerous.
51:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:33
SPEAKER_01: So that's back to danger.
51:35
SPEAKER_01: But what it looks like is greenery, shade,
51:38
SPEAKER_01: Wildlife,
51:40
SPEAKER_01: schools,
51:40
SPEAKER_01: housing,
51:42
SPEAKER_01: and thriving,
51:42
SPEAKER_01: a thriving economy that contributes to everyone's benefit now and crazy into
51:48
SPEAKER_01: the future.
51:49
SPEAKER_01: Right.
51:50
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, we need a vision, not just for today, but for our kids.
51:56
SPEAKER_03: Well, that is a beautiful vision.
51:58
SPEAKER_03: Think about kayaking up the river or a lot of people do other water sports,
52:04
SPEAKER_03: boating, other things, swimming, fishing.
52:06
SPEAKER_03: I mean, that would be incredible.
52:09
SPEAKER_01: And I would also add,
52:10
SPEAKER_01: since you gave me the dream big question,
52:12
SPEAKER_01: is I dream of a city and city leadership that knows that downtown – Isn't just
52:19
SPEAKER_01: in Southwest Portland along the river that our city actually crazy enough is on
52:26
SPEAKER_01: the other side of the river too, right?
52:28
SPEAKER_01: We, you know, it's not just downtown the way the big pink owners think about it.
52:35
SPEAKER_01: We have, you know, amazing things happening in Albina neighborhood.
52:39
SPEAKER_01: We can also do that.
52:40
SPEAKER_01: You know, they're dreaming big there.
52:42
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, absolutely.
52:43
SPEAKER_01: We have to dream big also for the North Reach.
52:45
SPEAKER_03: I love that.
52:46
SPEAKER_03: All right.
52:47
SPEAKER_03: For people out there listening,
52:49
SPEAKER_03: I hope that now,
52:51
SPEAKER_03: and thank you so much because now I have a better understanding of what's at stake
52:55
SPEAKER_03: in this upcoming vote.
52:58
SPEAKER_03: When is that upcoming?
53:00
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
53:01
SPEAKER_03: And how could people who maybe are convinced we've convinced them,
53:05
SPEAKER_03: hopefully, or at least convince them to learn more?
53:07
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
53:09
SPEAKER_03: How do they get involved?
53:10
SPEAKER_03: What's what's coming up?
53:11
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
53:12
SPEAKER_01: On Thursday,
53:13
SPEAKER_01: October 1st,
53:14
SPEAKER_01: our Portland City Council is going to discuss amendments
53:19
SPEAKER_01: to make this policy proposal better.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: So on Thursday,
53:24
SPEAKER_01: October 1st,
53:26
SPEAKER_01: is a big day and people still have time to submit written testimony and to write
53:34
SPEAKER_01: and call their counselors.
53:36
SPEAKER_01: I'm also encouraging people to call Old Fashioned because they listen to the voicemail messages.
53:42
SPEAKER_03: How does one submit written testimony?
53:45
SPEAKER_01: So the easiest thing to do is if you go to braidedrivercampaign.org on our homepage,
53:52
SPEAKER_01: there's very basic directions on how to submit testimony
53:56
SPEAKER_01: and some basic talking points if you want to go deep about volume versus capacity
54:01
SPEAKER_01: and zoning code X versus Y.
54:04
SPEAKER_01: But the most important thing is to tell your counselors to vote for amendments
54:09
SPEAKER_01: to make this safer.
54:12
SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
54:13
SPEAKER_01: There's still time.
54:14
SPEAKER_03: There's still time.
54:15
SPEAKER_03: And this show will come out just the day before October 1st when people actually hear this.
54:20
SPEAKER_03: So if you're listening to this on Wednesday,
54:22
SPEAKER_03: get going and Thursday, hopefully get things submitted for them to consider.
54:28
SPEAKER_03: Other things that folks should do, like this is coming up closely to us next week.
54:34
SPEAKER_03: What about long term?
54:35
SPEAKER_03: How do people engage?
54:37
SPEAKER_01: Well, long term,
54:39
SPEAKER_01: there are many local organizations like Braided River Campaign who are working
54:45
SPEAKER_01: on city focused environmental policy and education.
54:51
SPEAKER_01: You can come to our organization's website, sign up.
54:54
SPEAKER_01: We have a newsletter.
54:55
SPEAKER_01: But I also encourage people to get involved in what they really care about.
54:59
SPEAKER_01: Your neighborhood association, that still matters in our town, right?
55:03
SPEAKER_01: Your faith-based organization, your school organizations.
55:07
SPEAKER_01: And really, it's a time right now where...
55:11
SPEAKER_01: Getting together in person and enjoying the activism is the most important part
55:18
SPEAKER_01: in finding your place.
55:19
SPEAKER_01: And so I encourage people to find that human connection that brings you a little bit of joy.
55:25
SPEAKER_03: I love that because, yes,
55:27
SPEAKER_03: you could get involved and join Braid River and everything else,
55:30
SPEAKER_03: but you might already be a part of some other organization.
55:34
SPEAKER_03: Put it on the agenda for your next meeting or talk to the leadership of
55:37
SPEAKER_03: that organization and say, hey, this matters to all of us.
55:41
SPEAKER_03: I think when Portlanders come together across organizations,
55:44
SPEAKER_03: across the spectrum and say, hey,
55:46
SPEAKER_03: this is something we can all get behind,
55:48
SPEAKER_03: that can be a very powerful group of people coming together.
55:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I would say ask yourself the question, like, what kind of river access do you want?
55:57
SPEAKER_01: Like, where do you want to go see the river?
55:59
SPEAKER_01: Where do you want to go jump in and swim?
56:01
SPEAKER_01: And think,
56:01
SPEAKER_01: you know,
56:02
SPEAKER_01: go down to the river and put your foot in,
56:05
SPEAKER_01: put your finger in,
56:06
SPEAKER_01: whatever you want to do and connect with the river that's right next to you or
56:10
SPEAKER_01: the Columbia.
56:12
SPEAKER_03: Marty Glickman, thank you so much for coming on the Schmidt Show.
56:14
SPEAKER_01: You're welcome.
56:15
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
56:16
SPEAKER_03: Here's what we covered today.
56:17
SPEAKER_03: We heard how a group of Portland teachers started the Braided River Campaign
56:20
SPEAKER_03: and why they named it after what our rivers used to look like.
56:24
SPEAKER_03: We learned what the CEI hub is,
56:26
SPEAKER_03: six miles of fuel tanks holding most of Oregon's fuel supply,
56:29
SPEAKER_03: sitting on ground that won't hold in a big earthquake.
56:32
SPEAKER_03: We dug into why this issue has split city council 6-6 and why the mayor had to break
56:36
SPEAKER_03: the tie on the Zenith transfer.
56:39
SPEAKER_03: We talked through the safety rules council is taking up on October 1st,
56:42
SPEAKER_03: including the fight over whether to cap storage capacity or
56:45
SPEAKER_03: the fuel actually sitting in those tanks.
56:48
SPEAKER_03: And Marnie told us how you can learn more and make your voice heard.
56:51
SPEAKER_03: Whatever you think about the CEI Hub,
56:53
SPEAKER_03: this is one of those decisions that will shape Portland long
56:56
SPEAKER_03: after this council is gone.
56:58
SPEAKER_03: So get informed and let your councilors know where you stand.
57:01
SPEAKER_03: A big thank you to our show sponsor, Corbett Hill Wellness.
57:05
SPEAKER_03: Please support the sponsors that support this show.
57:08
SPEAKER_03: And if you want to support independent civic media in Portland,
57:10
SPEAKER_03: subscribe,
57:11
SPEAKER_03: leave us a review and share this episode with a neighbor who drives Highway 30.
57:16
SPEAKER_03: Thanks to Eleanor Jones for keeping us current on the local trash beat.
57:19
SPEAKER_03: I'm Mike Schmidt.
57:20
SPEAKER_03: This has been Schmidt Show PDX.
57:21
SPEAKER_03: Stay curious, stay engaged, and I will see you next week.
57:27
SPEAKER_03: A quick word from our show sponsor,
57:29
SPEAKER_03: Dr. Adam Moret at Corbett Hill Wellness Center, people I know and trust.
57:33
SPEAKER_02: Hi, I'm Dr. Moret from Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
57:36
SPEAKER_02: Your back hurts, so where do you start?
57:39
SPEAKER_02: First, we'll figure out what's going on.
57:41
SPEAKER_02: The answer isn't automatically an adjustment.
57:44
SPEAKER_02: It might be chiropractic,
57:45
SPEAKER_02: massage, acupuncture, laser, or shockwave therapy, or another approach.
57:50
SPEAKER_02: That's the advantage of whole person care.
57:52
SPEAKER_02: We have options, and we'll help you find what makes sense for you.
57:56
SPEAKER_02: Corbett Hill Wellness Center.
57:57
SPEAKER_02: Move well, feel well, live well.
58:00
SPEAKER_02: Visit corbethill.com.