Latest / Open Tabs / 🎧 Lo-fi is having a moment (and so is messy internet drama, thank God)

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🎧 Lo-fi is having a moment (and so is messy internet drama, thank God) · Open Tabs

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to our Thursday edition of Open Tabs,
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: our Substack Live,
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_02: where we hop on and talk about the stories taking up space and our tabs,
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: our feeds, and our brains.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, Melissa.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, Megan.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Hi.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Hello.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, guys.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: We have some fun topics today, so we're just going to jump straight into it.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: The first thing I wanted to talk to you guys about is this New York Times article
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: about this short form Instagram show that I've been loving recently.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's called Aaron's.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: And the whole shtick is that it's the most boring show on the internet because he's
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_02: an NYU film student grad.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: He just follows his funny friends around New York City as they do actual errands.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: So one episode is following his friend who needs to buy a new AC unit and
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: then install it herself.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: Others are going to the post office and mailing something.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: Some are going to Target to pick something up.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's very funny.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's like very, very lo-fi bare bones.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: These people are not celebrities at all.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: And it kind of reminds me,
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if you guys are fans of like Broad City
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: or like these New York based shows where it's just about the chaos
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_02: of living your life in New York City.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because a lot of times when you are running errands in New York City,
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: it hardly ever goes as planned.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_02: And the show documents that.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's very fun.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: And he did an interview with the New York Times and I thought,
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: what I thought was interesting about it is how he talks
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: about purposely keeping it super lo-fi.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's really just him, whoever he's following that day, his camera.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: And he is purposely keeping it like super duper low budget.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_02: He doesn't want any celebrity casts.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: He doesn't want to do any sponsorships or ads in it because he thinks
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: that would take away from the magic that he's creating.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: And he also talks about how he was very much inspired by subway takes,
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: which we've talked about before,
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_02: that like New York City lo-fi, in his case, you're just on the street.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_02: In Subway Takes, you're just sitting on the subway with your one guest.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I feel like we've talked about this.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's been a theme throughout of people wanting more lo-fi, less produced content online.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I just wanted to get your all's thoughts.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: This reminds me of a show that I've seen on my FYP where it's a girl saying,
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: how long does it take?
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: And she's helping her friends with tasks that they've been putting off.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then they're like, how long does this actually take?
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like, she's been meaning to like update her passport.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: And then they're like, What do you need to do?
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's basically just like an accountability buddy.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I think this is like a fun narrative way into one of the like core use cases of
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: the internet is just like, how do you get stuff done?
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like how to, like what are the steps?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also like productivity is like such a thing,
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: but this is like productivity narratives
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: in a really interesting way.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: And also like that human element.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I think this is really fun and it's like,
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: Shows that people are just looking for, like, more, like,
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: the humanity and the personality than they are looking for the content themselves.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like,
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: if you can build something compelling on top of something this simple,
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: like, you can make whatever content interesting, you know?
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: I agree.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: I also think that, like...
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: There's a couple things that come to mind with this.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's also,
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: creating relatability with the audience,
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: because going through the task of running errands is something that,
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: you know, we all have to do.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: And it's always sort of seen as this, like, you know, like, it's chores, right?
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's, like, stuff to get done.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: And, like,
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: if you've ever lived in New York City,
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_01: you know, like, doing anything can be, like, really challenging.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, all you need to do is, like, be commuting home and, like, the rain starts.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: And you're, like, great.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: This is now going to be like a,
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: on a scale of one to ten,
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: like this could have been a seven getting home and now it's like a one.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you won't have an umbrella.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the subway will be packed.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: You will be, it'll just, everything goes wrong.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing that brings to mind for this too,
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: it's like, you know, the fascination of like mundaeity, I think, is that a word?
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: Or the mundane?
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's nothing new either, right?
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's what Seinfeld is completely built on, right?
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's like just, you know, regular people and it's a comedy like built on that.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: I also think like I was just looking at the Instagram account too.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like one of the top videos that they have,
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: more recent videos that they publish is like a girl going
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: to get her driver's license.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: It totally looks like The Office, like the way that it's shot.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that's sort of funny too.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and I think it's,
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: this idea of like, Obviously, office culture has been examined and poked at.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: And then, like,
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: you know, obviously, like, entertainment content has been built off of that, right?
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like, even back rooms, right?
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and there's all just, you know, or what's the one on Apple TV?
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, Severance.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: Severance, right?
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I can see, like,
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: And it's actually so funny too because I have a couple friends of mine
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: that are talent agents and they're all following this account.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I feel like what people are like taking note of, it's like, oh, there's interest in this.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: And like literally just imagine 10 Steps Ahead where this becomes like a game show.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: It becomes a You know,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: office type of show where there's like,
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: you know, faux documentary Portlandia kind of thing.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: Imagine it becoming a horror show.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: like you can see all of those things,
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: like, you know, like things that could permeate from this.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: it's really.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you go, Megan.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: I was going to say,
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: I think it reminds me too of like something Emma and I were always talking about
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: of like YouTube kind of being like just something to hang out with.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like people want content that they can just sort of like hang out with
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: that doesn't demand their full attention.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like podcasts do that.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: But if you want something with like,
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: and I literally,
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: since I think about content this way,
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: I find myself being like, I need something on while I work.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: It can't be a podcast, but it needs to have a narrative.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like, but I don't want it to, I don't want to have to like hardcore follow a narrative.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like,
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm craving like the TLC or like Home improvement shows
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: where it's like I can look up and see a little vignette and then go back
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: to what I was doing.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like this type of content perfectly fills that void of like I want
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: to hang out and just like exist with these people versus like I want
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: to be entertained by these people.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, that's actually how I consume it a lot.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: I will have it on with the dishes.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_02: Because I want something on, but I'm not going to be paying close attention to it.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I want something quick.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: It takes me like 10 minutes.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_02: I need something quick that's funny.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_02: I enjoy and doesn't take up too much of my attention.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not surprised also that your talent agent friends follow because it feels like
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_02: A funny Vogue 75 questions for like incoming artist types in New York City
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: because these are all people he went to like NYU with.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's like all his friends.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: And it's very, very funny.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: And another thing while we're still on this topic that just popped up today
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: a similar like lo-fi vein,
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_02: Olivia Rodrigo just announced like three,
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: maybe five hours ago that she is doing a surprise concert in Brooklyn tonight.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: Tickets are only $25 and you can only buy tickets in person at the theater's box office.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_01: Are the tickets
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: on sale now?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: Like, can you go right there?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you can go.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: She, like, I assume they're on sale, like, the second she announced it this afternoon.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it was, like, I checked her own Instagram.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: She hasn't even posted about it.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_02: I think, like, her label did.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: And then, like, Rolling Stone, like, and, you know, like, the industry mags picked it up.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: But, like, I just thought it was so interesting.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: $25.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to see the Odyssey later.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: And my ticket for that costs more than the Olivia.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: There's definitely this democratization of music right now.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: You know, again, the Charli D'Amelio.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, not Charli D'Amelio.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, my God.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: Who am I thinking of?
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: Addison Rae.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Dark Hair.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Charli XCX?
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like Charli.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: Charli XCX.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: The other Charli.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: You were there.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was there, sort of.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: If you had just said Charlie, we would have just been like, uh-huh, Charlie.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I know.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: I should have just done that.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: Well, just getting back to like, you know, rock and roll and like simplifying.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, again,
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: this is also with other entertainment forums too,
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: like Savannah Bananas, like just trying to make things affordable.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I wish there was a live cam of like the outside of the box office.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: That'd be so fun to like watch that right now.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: There will be TikToks and I will send them
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: to you guys so you can see.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: I also think that I really like the spontaneity of this.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like this is so like,
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: even like in adulthood that I only saw in movies where it's like,
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: oh, this band is playing here tonight.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: Should we go check it out?
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like that just does not happen in today's day and age.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's so like plan, plan, plan.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like you're not getting tickets to that unless you plan for six months in advance
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: and or you want to spend an arm and a leg.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like people are craving this more like Let's see what happens.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: What's available to us.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: Let's make decisions right now.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I actually listened to a podcast where they're talking about Miley Cyrus
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: and how she doesn't want to tour.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like,
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: Miley should just start popping up at random dive bars and playing like a set
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: in L.A. Like that would be so cool, so fun.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: And like if Miley just or have a residency at like the Troubadour,
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: which is like a really small venue here.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: That would be so fun where it's just like sometimes Miley's here.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like Friday night, sometimes Miley's here.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like I want more of that vibe, especially living in L.A. and like living in New York.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: You want more like that's the point of being in a city that I don't have
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: to plan my life out six months in advance.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: I can see what's going on tonight.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: Let's go do something fun, you know?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: I totally agree.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_02: It reminds me of this documentary I watched,
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Meet Me in the Bathroom,
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: about, like, the 2000s New York City, like, indie music scene.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_02: Like, the Strokes, LCD sound system, the yeah, yeah, yeahs.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: And it was very much, like,
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_02: that vibe where it was, like,
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: you had to, like,
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: if you knew the right person,
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: you would get, like, a call, like, oh, so-and-so's playing at this club tonight.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: And, like, here's the door password.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: And that stuff, it happens, but, like, in much smaller, nichier communities.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's so fun.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like it
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: happens top down,
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: too, where, like, brands will be like, we're doing this thing.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: But it's like, then it's a branded event and it's not of the community, you know?
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: I also feel like this is, like, good for younger.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like younger people need more spontaneity in their lives.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: This is part of why they're like this.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: Well, as someone who lived in the 2000s in New York City.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: The Millennial Optimism Era.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's what they're talking about.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: The Millennial Optimism Era.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I moved into New York City by myself in fall of 2006.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: Started as an NBC page.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: And the page,
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: like when you worked Saturday Night Live,
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: They have an after-party, and then they have an after-after-party.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: And the after-after-party doesn't start until midnight to 2 a.m.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: And to get into it, you have to get a password, and it is a whole thing.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so...
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: It really was like so fun and it was a way like if you saw it all the way
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: through like I'm not gonna like reveal names but like one
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_01: of my page friends like fully dated seriously like one of the cast members of SNL
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: and it like definitely like okay you text us yeah I need this
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: tea yeah I
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: like tea
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: you know like my friends I went to Holy Cross right so We were all fans of
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: the show Entourage, right?
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like that was like such a big show in that era.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know,
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: like these were my like college guy friends,
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: like, you know, like a bunch of dorks, whatever.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, they were like, oh, what's your after after party?
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, whatever.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: And so we were all out.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't even like privy to the after party.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's really like, Like,
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: celebrities would go there,
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: and then this was, like, the people who wanted to, like, stay out and party.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like, Justin Timberlake was always known to go to the after-after.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there are certain celebrities that, like, see it all the way through.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, the funniest thing was Jeremy Piven hosted SNL,
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: and, like, he went to his own after-after party.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember who else was there.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: It was Jodi Sweetin from Full House was, like, partying.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: Random.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there were, like, other random...
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: B&C-list celebrities there,
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: but it was so funny because all my guy friends ended up in the bathroom line
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: with Jeremy Piven,
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: and it was 3 o'clock in the morning,
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: and they were all just like, oh my god, like, ah!
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: I forget what his name was in the show, but they were like, Ari.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, he's the talent agent, right?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Or whatever.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Or the manager or whatever.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, it was just like,
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: it was like a fun time,
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: and I remember also like, There's certain millennial influencers I follow.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_01: You guys know I'm like such a fan of tanks also.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like there really was more of this like go for it kind of mentality.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like I remember going,
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: I had a phase where I would go to One Oak, like the club on Sunday nights.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I would literally like go out like really hard.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: And like, you know, again, you don't even go out until 10.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_01: I would be out until 2,
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: 3 and then like I would come back,
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_01: go to bed and like get to the office at 8.30 and it was like a point of pride to do
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: that and like we just like Also,
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: can I say,
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: can I say
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: also though,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: like it was almost like part, it was part, it was expected of you.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like especially working in media,
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: like I feel like people want you to be out there and networking
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: and like your boss would ask you what you do over the weekend and didn't want
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: to hear nothing.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like your boss wanted to hear like,
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: I went here and I did this and I saw this and they like wanted to hear
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: that you were out there doing things.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: And like you talking about this is also making me realize that like the path
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: to fame has just changed like So much that,
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: like, honestly, I think people who are getting famous just aren't that cool.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like, when you think about what it takes to get famous these days,
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: it's like you have to be an internet, like,
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: person who is just, like,
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: relentlessly themselves and doesn't care about everyone else thinking you're weird.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: Which is also so nerdy and, like, narcissistic, like, weird.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: Weird.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's weirdos.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, in one of our… Homeschooled.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: One of our lives in the past month,
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: or maybe it was just when we three were on privately,
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like,
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: Megan, you talked about like influencer events and like going to events.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: And these are people who are not good at socializing because they built their brands
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: in their bedrooms alone at home on their phones.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: And then like these brands host these events and like expecting like building community.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: And these are like, this is a very introverted group.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_02: They're all introverts.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and it's funny that,
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_02: like, Millennial was, like, be out there, experience, like, live life.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_02: And Gen Z's version of, like, living life now is posting in
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: their bedroom at home.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Totally.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that is, I think that is so true.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and I say that about, like,
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: even in, like,
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: corporate culture,
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: when you go to, like,
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: networking events, too, or, like,
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: when I go to, like,
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Conferences,
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: which I am always honored to be invited to go,
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: but I don't love it because it's really like,
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: as I think I'm an introverted extrovert,
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: like I carry myself as an extrovert or whatever,
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: but I really need like to be like totally by myself
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: or like I need like quiet time like to reset.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's definitely how I'm coded.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so I like going to them,
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: but like when you're an extrovert,
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: you're sort of like,
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: there's like sort of this like extra burden to like carry the conversation and like,
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and like you bring the energy.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's like a very like energy sucking experience for me.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's so funny.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like as we were just talking about this too,
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: it reminded me back in the, so it was like, I was 25.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to say it was like, and I, it was like 2011.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: It was 2011.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I,
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: Gone through a really bad breakup.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: I also got into Columbia around this timeframe.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: Or no, I was in Columbia.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was at Columbia and working full-time.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so I was going to the Columbia Graduate School of Journalism as like a part-time student.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: It was a two-year path while working full-time at NBC.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I went through this awful breakup.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_01: And the guy had kind of been dating, which was never going to go anywhere.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: He was this like crazy frat boy from Boston.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: It was a world when I dated him where it was such exposure.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: He went to Bentley but had all these flashy friends.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_01: It was just a lot of
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_01: looks and money and events and travel and things.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: The scene.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and like I wasn't,
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sort of like,
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like I didn't have to, not to be whatever, but like I was at NBC.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like I worked on the Today Show.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: I was like at the concert series and like meeting all these like celebrities,
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: actually meeting them in the mornings.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so I was just like kind of like, why are you trying so hard?
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like this is like so insane.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway, it was sort of an era of like sharing on Instagram.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: It was like early aughts of Instagram.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I was, like,
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: of course,
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: feeling like, oh,
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: I got to, like,
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_01: shut, like, this breakup has happened and, like, my life isn't over now, you know?
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: And so I, like, this is, and Emma, you guys both know me very well.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm so type A.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm, like, okay, I'm going to fix this and now I'm going to, I think, fix it, you know?
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: And so I am not kidding.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: I pulled out a whole year of, like, a calendar.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then I started researching things to do every weekend.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, cool things, cool things in New York, cool things here, whatever.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, like I got to touch base with this friend because I know that she's free here or whatever.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not kidding.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: I ended up in the most wild year ever.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was like suddenly I was like snowboarding in Chamonix and none
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: of my friends made the flight.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I was with all these random people in France by myself.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, oh my God, if I get hurt, they have no idea who I am.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: I have no idea what's going on.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: Whatever.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: That was the year I went to Dubai.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: I went to India.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: I filled in weekdays all over New York.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: I was at the Deadmau5 concert.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: I made friends with this guy who's actually from San Francisco, but he was like...
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: He lived in this apartment that I think was Isaac Mizrahi's former apartment.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_01: It was this insane apartment that was so cool.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: He had three roommates,
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: and there was a big,
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: giant purple couch in it that Isaac had made,
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: but it was so big that they couldn't get it out of the apartment.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: It was just an iconic thing.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember going to all these crazy bars with him.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: You would start a bar crawl at 9 o'clock in the morning and you'd be like,
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: let's go watch soccer in the West Village.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to go on a boat.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to come back.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to order tacos.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to go and change and shower.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to go to the Gold Bar.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're going to go down to...
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: It was just...
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: The thing that's so cool about New York is that if you want to do something like
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: that, specifically New York, too.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I mean, again, I was all over the place.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: I spent so much money.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: I, like, I had a perpetual sore throat.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think my, like, lymph nodes were in for a whole year.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it was just, like, so crazy.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: I had a seizure.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know that meme that's,
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: like, a Victorian child, like, showing things that would kill a Victorian child?
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like you just described, like, a week in your life would kill a Gen Z.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like, they would legitimately die.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and imagine that you're doing this.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so it was 2010 to 2011.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: And
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: early 2011 was so, like, trauma-filled for me because I was, like, finishing my master's.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: It was my last semester.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: I had my, like, thesis that I had to do.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember January of that year,
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: this is, like,
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: per my schedule, okay,
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: I had to work the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas for NBC,
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: which I had done, like, literally, like, four years in a row.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, okay, well, like,
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just going to tack on a quick trip to Los Angeles to see my ex's sister, okay?
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how much of a loser am I?
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I was staying with her.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: In Manhattan Beach, like, or, you know, whatever, LA.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then I flew to Arizona and I ended up, it was, sadly,
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: it ended up being the last time I saw my grandmother and who had picked up smoking.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so my whole suitcase is, like, just stunk like someone was ripping cigarettes.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it was so disgusting.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: Then I flew to San Francisco and was like, I guess I'll go to Tahoe with my friends here.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: We go to Tahoe and, like, there was an 80s band playing in Tahoe.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I can't even remember the name of it.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's called, like, Rubik's Cube or something.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: I forget.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: All of my stuff smelled like cigarettes.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I was, like, gambling and, like, all of this stuff.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: It was just this, like, wild time.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: And, like, I had also been burned out so badly.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I just was so run down.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, two weeks before,
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: I, like, literally had a seizure in the Barnes & Noble on the Upper East Side.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think I remember you
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: telling me about
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: this.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was in the hospital.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's wild.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: I was just like the low of the low.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was like so depressing.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't done with graduate school.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: I needed my ex to see how fabulous my life was, but it wasn't.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it was a really rough time.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, funny enough, I met Jeff in like, it was like June, July of that year.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: It was like
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: I was like as
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: raw as like, ah.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, as you're describing all of this,
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: it reminds me of like kind of the summer Alex Earl is having
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_00: of like how she's just like jet setting around Europe and like,
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: like being like, well,
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going here and I met this guy and now we're going here
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: and I don't know how we ended up here.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_00: But like to think about like,
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: and this is so how we've categorized her as like,
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: she's the one who's teaching Gen
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_02: Z how to have fun.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_02: more of this, like, I don't know, like,
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: you know, the wind carries me vibe.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: But also, she's getting so much backlash right now.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, people are, like, being so critical of her like they've never seen before.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: They're, like, wishing ill on her relationship with Stassi.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I just feel like the way that Gen Z goes about,
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: like, exploring and socializing is just so, so different.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's very puritanical.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, very, very puritanical.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: But also,
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: since we're on a tangent,
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: did you guys see the drama with Good Noticings and Caroline Calloway?
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_02: I wanted to talk about that with you.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like, guys, let's just, this is a free-range episode.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_02: And we're just rolling with it.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: I meant to bring that up to you, Megan,
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_02: in the pre-call because Caroline Calloway is my, like, favorite internet scanner.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Emma is, like, on the
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: beat of Caroline Calloway.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_01: Okay,
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_02: so you saw.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_02: I think I took her for M.T.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_02: Deco literally, like, in the first six months I started working.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think you have to resurface it when you work.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you have to find it.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_02: You definitely should.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: So for those who don't know,
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_00: Caroline Calloway,
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_00: internet scammer who got famous because someone,
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: one of her friends wrote an article in The Cut about her,
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: went viral,
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: and then Caroline responded, and then they had their whole back and forth.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: But she's back having it.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: Really, that was the beginning of, like, The Cut essays, like, being there online.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: Agreed.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Agreed.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so then Caroline kind of like leveraged this into a persona
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: where she's just kind of like, what did she say in her video?
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: She's whimsical and ridiculous or whatever.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_02: Whimsical.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_02: Her life is full of whimsy and chaos or something.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, something like that.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: So she posted a rant where she's walking down the street in New York after a party
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_00: and she's like,
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: the girls The Good Noticing Podcast are the fakest bitches in all of New York City.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then goes on to describe how basically she's been on their podcast
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: and how they ripped into her, which like they did not.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: I listened to this episode.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: They did not rip into her.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: They had valid criticisms, but they didn't rip into her.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is like the whole drama where everyone today is just like,
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm living for this niche internet drama.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: But it's also, like, low stakes and fun.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it reminds me of the 2000s, like,
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: Britney and Paris and Hillary and,
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: like, the fights that they would have over, like, someone stole their boyfriend.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like, low stakes interpersonal drama, you know?
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's similar to this is another article you DMed, Megan,
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: the mtdeco account,
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_02: and I'm including in our Monday Cultural Gems email about, like,
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_02: you can't be messy on the internet anymore because everyone has,
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_02: like, a personal brand.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: And that like Reddit and anonymous platforms and Tumblr,
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: Tumblr also got a shout out, are like the last pillars of internet messiness.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_02: And Caroline Calloway.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_02: Because she knows her personal brand.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like I think this is fine.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like I don't think this is a scandal.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like I think this is really fun mess.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's literally just like, I don't like how you talked about me on your podcast.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: And now they're like, you know, everyone in the comments is like that too.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, as a hater, I can't wait to hear what they say about this.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: I hope they address it on their podcast and like talk
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_02: about it.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I saw they have,
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: I guess,
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_02: a scheduled episode they do on their Patreon
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_02: that they like maybe do live every Thursday.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: People are like, oh my God, I'm going to like pay for Patreon.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: Just get their thoughts on it.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know this?
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, maybe it was staged.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_00: I would love that even more if they were like,
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: let's have fake internet beef to raise both of our stars.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't think that's the case, but I would love it to be true.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think that's going to become a thing.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that the low stakes internet drama also, like,
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: speaking of some of what you guys are talking about,
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: but in a different way,
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: like, I've been listening to some of the discourse around Stassi's new show.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_01: Have you guys seen it at all?
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen clips.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't seen this show, but I've seen it.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, same.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: I need to watch it as well, but I was just listening to a podcast take on it.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's interesting what I'm hearing, right?
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: She's like...
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Very, like, again, low-stakes internet drama.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like, she's bringing, like, people on.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_01: She's, quote-unquote,
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: burying it all,
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: which is interesting because,
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: there's been sort of this,
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_01: like, move toward, like, more privacy, especially with, like, reality stars.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: And, like,
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: we talk about Alex Cooper and, like, kind of She's kind of doing the opposite.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I saw a short-form video somewhere on my For You page yesterday
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: where she was talking about how she was likening this whole thing to
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: the Kardashians.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_01: And the question from the interviewer was like,
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: well, why are you showing your kids so blatantly on the show?
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: And she's just like, well, they were born into a reality show.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know,
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: just as much as they might come out one day and say,
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: I hate you for doing this to me,
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_01: they could also say,
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: why didn't you do this for me when you had the chance to give me a platform?
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so she's like, so I'm just like putting them out there.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I was kind of like,
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: I do think she's doing,
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: I give her credit, like Stassi knows how to make like headlines.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's kind of cool that she's, it's like refreshing to me a little bit.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like I think people,
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like Bethany kind of like treads on this too,
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: where it's like, and this even harkens on the errands conversation too.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like people are wanting some return to like,
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: like the authenticity,
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: the like,
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: Lo-fi, the like, you know, again, like the real realness, I guess, you know?
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely really
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_02: as like,
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_02: especially like watching reality TV way too young,
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_02: like in the mid 2000s,
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: like how messy and chaotic and nobody was thinking about how like audiences were Oh,
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: perceive them and like long career longevity after the fact or like brand deals
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: at all.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: So like people were like, I need to be as messy as possible.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_02: So like they renew my contract.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: And now it's a very different vibe of like it needs to be like controlled messy.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like I feel like they're towing the line of like being interesting enough
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_02: without giving too much away and like maintaining privacy
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_02: and also like being brand safe.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: I also thought what Saucy said about her kid was interesting and like how she could,
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: you know, be mad at her for not putting her on reality TV.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it also speaks to parents knowing like that their kids are little versions of them.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's been something that's interesting.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's like there's no one size fits all for like this is what kids need to do
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: and this is like how they should behave.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like I even saw,
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was Jason Kelsey talking
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: about how like His wife didn't understand just how stubborn the kids were going
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: to be because he's like, no, we're very stubborn people.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_00: So gentle parenting isn't going to work.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: And eventually she came around on whatever it was.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think there is something of as much as we are so used to policing parents
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: and what they should do online,
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: at the end of the day,
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: every child is different and they know what's best for their kids, you know?
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I also think it is funny.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: I do think now that I hear her say this and I actually put, like,
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_01: my brain to thinking about it,
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_01: there is such a, like, passe thing putting your kids online.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you guys know my, like, take on it.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I do think sharenting and,
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: like, I think that there's a lot of, like, lack of safety related to this right now.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: So you know that.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: That being said,
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: and this is,
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like I'm talking to,
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: like, clients with this too because clients will be like, how do we...
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: How do we, like, create content around, like, a proprietary meeting where it's secret?
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like,
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: there's so many ways in to,
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: like, storytell something without, like, giving it away, you know?
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, figure it out.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like,
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: you can have an account without your kid's face or you can build an entire profile
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: for your kid built on a given purpose and, like, still protect them.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like I have like started,
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's this like little golf influencer who's 10 and she's amazing.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't even know,
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: I can't think of her name off the top of my head,
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: but you know,
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: you guys know my son is like super into sports and I've like thought to myself like,
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_01: wow, should I be like building online presence for him?
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like an audience's audience, it's valuable.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, like Listen, it crosses my mind even when we think about like colleges, right?
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_01: So like one of the paths if you like listen to all
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_01: of these like influencers out there now talking about this is like advising to start
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: a business and show how you're an entrepreneur and like do all this stuff
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_01: when you're like in high school as it all builds up.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: How are you giving back to the community doing all that?
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that can be a heck of a lot easier if you have a following.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: You can have a much bigger impact if you suddenly have like a very engaged following.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I do think like there is something fascinating.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like I feel like it,
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_01: like the examination of like even the baton passing of an account to a child
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: that has like, you know, like I do think that that is just a fascinating thing.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we're going to start to see a lot more of that in like the coming years.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I don't know.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_01: What do you guys think?
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think it's valuable?
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: Should I do it?
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think?
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: I think I said this before, but I think Wally's too much of a stress case.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I wouldn't fault parents for doing it if they are doing it with pure intentions,
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: as long as it doesn't result in the situation where it's like,
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_00: this isn't my dream, dad, it's yours.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: But if it really is coming from a place of genuine,
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: my kid wants to do this and I want to set them up for success, then yeah.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think I pretty much agree with that.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_02: And just monitoring analytics, seeing who the audience is.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_02: I think if there are ways to be careful about it,
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_02: it's just I think a lot of people aren't and those are the ones
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_01: we hear about.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: So they suck all the air out of the room.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_02: But thank you guys.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: I loved this.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, maybe we call the show Tangents.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: I think this is really fun, especially like end of the week.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like there's so many different stories.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't know.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's basically Friday.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's simply Friday.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: I was going to say, can I ask you guys a question?
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know, like whatever, you don't even have to answer on here.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: But like, should we rename the entire Substack, OpenTabs?
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's a big question.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, we'll leave the audience on that hook with a question mark,
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_01: and then we can talk about it on Tuesday in more depth.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't know.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like maybe we should.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's interesting.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_01: I saw one of the subjects we admire so much is Rachel Carton.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: We love you, Rachel.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: You are crushing.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: Rachel was featured in...
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_01: She shared on LinkedIn,
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_01: like she was shared in this like whole lineup of like, it was actually interesting.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_01: It was like a top newsletters that people who work in corporate actually expense.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: So they have the company like, which I think is really cool.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_01: And like, we aspire to that.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_01: But Rachel, we love you.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, the point is,
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: is that like,
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_01: just looking across the list,
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: the name of her, her, um,
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: Substack,
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_01: you know, which is a link in bio is just like so sharp and simple and clean.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, should we just be open tabs?
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: Food for thought.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_02: Well, maybe that'll be our behind the pig wall Tuesday.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, maybe we do a poll and we can make sure we just rename it.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_01: I like kind of where my head is at.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_01: I just feel like.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: M.T.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: Deco by Melissa Blum, or For You by Melissa Blum.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's so long.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: It is a bit of a mouthful.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_02: But interesting.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_02: I'll think about that over the weekend.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: Me too.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_01: I can't wait.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_01: Have fun at the Odyssey.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_01: Enjoy the Odyssey.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_01: Tell me what you think.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: We can't wait.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: We can't wait.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_01: Getting ready to walk in three hours.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: Bye, guys.