Latest / Career Identity + Growth Conversations for Professional Women: Exposing the Hidden Reality / 056: How Do You Know A Coach Is Right For You?

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056: How Do You Know A Coach Is Right For You? · Career Identity + Growth Conversations for Professional Women: Exposing the Hidden Reality

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello Annette.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: Sandra.
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: What are we talking about this week?
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: Today we're going to put the punctuation mark on the
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: conversation we've been having since episode 53, which is what
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: do you do when you realize that you need help?
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: What kind of help have you figured out you needed?
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Who are some options of people that can help you?
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: And that leads us to this conversation today, which is
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: diving a little bit deeper into the choice between, not
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: maybe even a choice, but how about the best ways
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: to select a coach and maybe similarly a therapist? Since
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: we have so many therapists in our circle, I feel
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: like we know a little bit about this. And then
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: what happens once we've selected someone? How do we further
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: that relationship, continue to work with them? Does that sound
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: like what we need to talk about?
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: I think that sounds great.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: Okay, perfect. And if you want to go back and
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: go to the start of this conversation, again, start with
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: episode 53. Don't forget to subscribe and follow so that
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: you get the conversation delivered via your preferred mode every
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: single week.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: Back in episode 53, we said that it may not
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: just be one person you need. It might be a
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: group of people that you need. You might need a consultant.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: You might need a coach. You might need a therapist.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: And that there is no right answer until you start
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: the process of trying to figure out what is it
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: that I'm trying to fix or work on. Yes. Seek
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: some outside help. We've made the decision that it's going
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: to be outside of our organization.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: I love that conversation. We had an episode 55 about that. Yes. Yes.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: So now where do I start?
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: I think you might want to start with some research
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: at this point. So you've decided to go external from
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: your organization. So you're probably looking at coach, consultant, or therapist.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: And maybe the therapist distinction is the easiest one. one
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: for us to make. We sort of alluded to this
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: in episode 55 though already, and you had a great
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: way to say this, which is, are you processing a
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: past trauma experience incident that is now coming up for
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: you again, or is being triggered maybe by current circumstances?
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: Yes. That is a really good way to understand it.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: There's another aspect of therapy and the other aspect of
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: therapy is because they bill insurance, there's also a diagnosis
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: that goes along with the work that you're doing. So
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: for example, I have anxiety and nothing that I do
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: can get underneath what it is that I'm feeling this
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: anxiety around, right? Then clearly, or maybe not so clearly,
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: I would start with therapy, right? Is there an underlying
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: diagnosis here that could be helpful in working through this situation?
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: If there is depression or if there's ADHD, although there
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: are some very effective ADHD coaches, but if you need medication,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: if you need a diagnosis, licensed independent social worker, licensed therapist, therapist,
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: licensed medical practitioner would be the place to go first.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Your coach can direct you there. Your medical primary care
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: physician might direct you there as well. The other aspect
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: of it is, are there other aspects involved? of this
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: problem that are manifesting in ways that would clearly indicate
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: that there is a medical diagnosis that is relevant. So
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: for example, cutting. Cutting is not something that I would
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: go and see a coach about, that there is definitely
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: some work there that is required. A licensed therapist, if
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: there's any suicidal ideation and it is suicide prevention, Awareness Month,
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: if there's any kind of suicidal ideation, that is not
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: material you take to a coach. You would definitely take
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: that to a medical professional and a licensed therapist. If
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: there's any kind of PTSD or complex PTSD, and if
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: we want, I can get into explaining what the difference
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: between those two are. But if there is significant trauma
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: that's involved, that we're working with, definitely a licensed therapist
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: is the place to start.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: I love those. Those are really good ways to think
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: about what you could be needing. And I also think
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: a more subtle distinction that you made is it's sort
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: of medical in nature, could fall under your health insurance plan.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: That's a really good way to think about it. And
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: I like that idea of talking with your primary care provider,
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: your nurse practitioner, whoever it is that you see. And
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: or if you bring it up to your coach that
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: they could say, oh, that sounds like it would fall
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: under the therapy umbrella. And a lot of women, I
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: know this has been true in my network, in my circle,
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: is a lot of women say, that they need some
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: sort of diagnosis when they watch their children going through.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: Absolutely. In the behavior between my child and the teacher,
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: my child and the parent was bringing up old stuff
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: for me and I was feeling inappropriately anxious. And that
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: caused me to go talk to somebody. And in the
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: talking to somebody, I realized. That, oh, the reason I'm
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: having these feelings is because I'm also carrying this old
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: wounding around this pattern. And that's when I received my diagnosis. So, yes,
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: a lot of women in particular receive diagnoses around ADHD
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: later in life. It's very common. Yeah.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: I wish it weren't so common, but yes.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Well, part of the challenge, and I don't want to
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: completely derail us, but I think it's an important piece
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: of information since we're talking about it, is a lot
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: of it is women know how to be compliant. Yeah.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: They know how to work with authority. They know how
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: to get along. Not that boys don't, but boys tend
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: to be earlier diagnosed simply because they acted. out, whereas
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: girls are rewarded for being compliant. And so their diagnosis
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: takes longer because they seem to fit the mold that
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: we want kids to follow in school, which is more relational.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: It's a function of how girls behave relationally rather than
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: not not having ADHD. So yes, there are probably signs,
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: but at the time we didn't know how to diagnose
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: those things. They weren't as prevalent, but that is exactly
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: why women get diagnosed later. Yeah.
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: Good conversation and a very good side note.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: So then let's talk about selecting an individual, specifically coaches.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: There are a lot of coaches out there and some
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: coaching is easier to find than others. Like you were
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: talking about, we do know an ADD ADHD coach, and
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: that person helps you learn how to deal with your diagnosis.
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: And there's a coach for everything.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: There is a coach for everything. So I would start
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: with the conversation we had in our first episode about this,
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: episode 53. What is the problem that you're trying to address?
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: What is it that you want help with, right? If it's,
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I want help with understanding how to use the gifts
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: of ADHD and manage some of the other aspects of ADHD,
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: then you're probably looking for an ADHD coach. So do
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: they have some type of, ADHD background? What is their
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: experience dealing with that? Have they attended any training classes
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: related to ADHD? Because even for people who have not
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: dealt with ADHD personally, there are definitely programs of study
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: that you can use to help guide your clients. So
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: what is it that you're trying to work through? Is
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: it that you're looking to develop your career in-house? Is
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: it that you are feeling stuck in your career and
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: you don't know what you want next? Is it that
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: I need to update my recipe because I haven't updated
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: it in 10 years and the technology is really dated?
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: Or maybe it doesn't really talk about what I really
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: would like to do or how I can position myself
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: for other roles. then you would look for somebody like
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: Annette who specializes in this type of career change. Yeah.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: And for someone looking for working within the workplace. How
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: do I take ownership of my leadership narrative, right? How
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: do I not let earlier work trauma enter this workspace
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: that I'm in now? How many women step into a
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: leadership role and then have so much imposter syndrome and
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: feel like they aren't qualified to be there all of
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: a sudden? These are really good questions that I often
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: refer to you, Sandra. to help either my clients or
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: somebody that thinks they need career coaching, but maybe what
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: they need is more of what you offer, which is
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: that leadership, trauma-informed coaching.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and getting under what are the patterns that you're
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: bringing in that you're not maybe even aware of. And
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: then there's another aspect of coaching that I know you
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: and I have made use of, and that is when
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: you have a business, right? What I want help with is,
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: how to do my marketing, how to go out and find,
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: when I find the clients, how do I write a proposal?
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: All these things that from running a business, when you're
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: used to not running a business because you've worked internally
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: and there's a set of skills that you've developed for
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: working internally, you want somebody who's had that experience of
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: building a successful business to help coach you on. That
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: might be where you start. And I say where you
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: start because Let's say you seek out a business coach
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: and they're telling you, well, you have to do this
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: and you have to do that and you need to
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: post and you need to have pictures with you or
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: you have to like put your LinkedIn profile and it
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: has to have a picture of you and it has
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: to be recent. And then what happens when you start
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: to do all that is all of these anxious thoughts
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: start to come up. What are people going to say?
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: What are people going to who knew me before going
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: to say about what I do now? And all of
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: these opinions. Right. And your business coach may be qualified
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: to help you with those, but they might also be
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: deeper rooted problems that you need to take to someone
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: like me. Right.
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: Or honestly.
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: Someone like Annette who can say, look at all these
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: skills that you have from this role over here. And
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: even if you're in this niche of I'm still working
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: my full time job, but building a career that I
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: want to step into, then really Annette is a fantastic
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: person to help you clarify where those skills lie. and
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: how those skills move over.
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: So if somebody is trying to decide between this type
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: of coach or that type of coach, I would encourage
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: you to meet the coaches. Get out, set up a
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: session or an exploratory call. where you can say this
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: is the problem that I'm experiencing and I met with
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: you because xyz I saw you deal with these types
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: of problems what I would say is even better than
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: that than exploring on your own because you know you
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: can throw it into chat gpt and find Sandra or
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: I but you can probably ask a friend who's a
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: trusted friend that you know has already received coaching Or
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: who's a trusted friend that you saw them transform from
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: somebody that maybe was a little concerned about their visibility
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: and positioning. And now they seem like this person that
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: now doesn't care what other people think and is more
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: true to themselves and appears to be more confident. Those
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: are things that maybe that person got coaching. Maybe that
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: person got therapy. Maybe they have a name or a
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: referral of somebody that you can talk to. But I
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: say normalize talking about it, talking about your experience and
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: meet a few different people and see if there's somebody
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: that really feels aligned or that the relationship resonates. Or
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: when you meet them, you're like, oh my gosh, where's
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: this person been my whole life? I really feel like
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: I can move forward with them. Because sometimes it clicks.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: And Sandra, there's so many different kinds of coaches out there.
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: And because the relationship is so important to me, as
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: I know it is to you, sometimes it's not the
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: right kind of coach on paper. But the rapport and
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: relationship you build with this person helps you develop. Because
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: as a coach, you're trained on so many different things,
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: so many different areas. And we have so many different
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: tools and frameworks that we learn about.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: That we can take what we know and help you
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: apply it to your situation. Or, for example, I use
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: the STAR framework for interview storytelling.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: I help you use that very same framework to talk
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: about your success in your one-on-ones with your boss.
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: It's not a different concept. It's just a different application. Correct.
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: of the concept. My suggestion is to meet people. What
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: would you do if you were picking a coach right now?
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: I think meeting people, asking for referrals, those are all
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: really excellent things. And then getting very specific with the
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: person when you meet with them. How have you coached
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: somebody with these types of situations. How do you deal
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: with this? And treating it very much like a hiring decision, right?
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: So if I come to you with this kind of problem,
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: how do you support me with those things? Or maybe
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: even just taking a problem that you currently have. I'm
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: a huge fan of starting with a small activity. So
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: is there something small that you and I can work
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: on so that I can start to see how you
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: work how I work and whether there's a good fit.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: Because the other problem as well is that we tend
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: to think about, are you the right person for me?
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: The coach also needs to decide, am I the right
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: coach for you?
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: And I would say that often I'm not the right
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: coach for somebody for a variety of different reasons, right?
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: and that they might be better served by going to
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: somebody else, and then I can make a referral or recommendation.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: But if we sign right away a six-month contract to
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: work on something, and then we find three months in
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: or four weeks in, this just isn't working, then that
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: becomes a contentious situation. So I would look for things like,
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: What's a small thing that you and I could work
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: on so that we can decide, are we a good fit?
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: What is not a small thing, a chunk of work?
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: What are some questions that I can ask you that
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: might help me to root out some things that I
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: know might be challenging for me? What happens if we
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: decide three months in or two weeks in that this
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: is not a good functional relationship? What is the policy
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: around work? extricating myself from the contract, both as a consultant,
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: the coach, or as the person being coached, right? Because
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: it's not going to be effective if we're butting heads.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: Oh, no. Agreed. And what are the variety of ways
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: that you can work together as well? If I feel
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: like I need a in-person relationship, does this coach that
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: I'm working with offer that kind of support? Or is
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: it a remote relationship? Is it Zoom calls? What is it?
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: Maybe looking at the ways in which the relationship would work.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: And then I would like the person seeking coaching. To
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: also think about are they open to these changes or
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: are they in a place where it is too raw?
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: And if I asked you to do something different, would
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: it be too triggering or too upsetting for you? So
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: there's some considerations. And as a coach, I can see that.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: When we're meeting initially, I can see if something's super raw.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: We were talking about tears in episodes 54 and 55.
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: Five.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: And tears are a real indication that something's really recent, raw,
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: and happening in real time. And is that something that
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: has to be worked on before, right? Like, I understand
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: you want to change jobs and we can do that, Sandra.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: But if every time we meet for the first three weeks,
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: you are just in tears and we can't even get
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: through a session, then that's maybe an indication that you
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: need something more first. From me, fine. maybe from somebody else. Okay.
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: And that's something that we were talking about previously too.
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: So knowing that about yourself.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I was just going to say that's a clear
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: sign that there's a body in dysregulation at that particular point.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: And yeah, getting re-regulated before we do any work is
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: so important. I would say often that's where I'm meeting
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: my clients for the first few times is they're crying.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of tears because they've bottled in a
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: lot of stuff or they've been afraid to say it
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: or they don't know what's happening anymore. They just know
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: something has to be different. Yeah.
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: And what an amazing amount of foresight it takes to say,
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: I can't stay here.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: I can't stay stuck. I'm going to seek the help
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: of someone else. So please don't feel like if you
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: are teary or weepy or emotional that you shouldn't ask
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: for help. You should.
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: That's a clear indication you need some support.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. So don't let that potential that you could
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: break into tears keep you from meeting with someone and
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: also knowing that that's what we're here to help.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: You with.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: So even if it's not a match for me or
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: it's not a match for Sandra, our networks are very deep.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: We have lots of other coaches, other therapists, other consultants
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: that we work with. We could certainly get you to
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: the right place. And trust me, nothing gives us more
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: joy than to refer you to someone that we know
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: you'd be a better match with. Because I don't just
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: want a client. I want you to get the best
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: help that you need that will really help you get
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: to where you're going.
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: A client that... A client that's unable to make the
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: change isn't the ideal fit, right? Because the goal isn't
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: just to have a client. The goal is to have
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: a client that you can actually help make the transformation
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: that's needed. Yeah. And if there's something blocking that transformation,
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: whether it's the relationship with you, where they're at within
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: dealing with any relationship, not much less the relationship with
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: the coach. Yeah. Then that is work that needs to
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: be dealt with before they're ready to really kind of
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: move forward in any way. So yes, absolutely. It's not
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: just about having a client. It's about making sure that
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: you can help the client that's in front of you. Yeah.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: And I think that brings us to a really good
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: point and that is when you visit a coach and
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: you feel minimized when you feel like they can't take
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: time to actually give you the space that you need
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: if you feel rushed in any way if you feel
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: condescended to if you feel like you can't ask the
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: questions that you want to ask those are all really
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: good signs. You're not with the right person.
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. It's not a good match. That is so important.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: And you might want to have a list of questions ready, right?
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Have you heard something about other coaches? How does this work?
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: What do we work on?
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: How do we work together? And I have a note here, Sandra,
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: about credentials. So I know you're heavily credentialed. I know
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: I'm heavily credentialed, but do all coaches need credentials? What's
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: your thoughts on that?
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: I have mixed feelings on that. Okay. Surprise, surprise. But
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: I have an opinion. Okay. I think what is most
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: important is asking the coach questions like, what are your
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: ethics what ethics do you follow if you're not credentialed
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: what is the expertise that you're bringing into this relationship
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: and how does that inform the work that we're going
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: to be doing here yeah i am credentialed two ways
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: one is through the gestalt institute of cleveland um And
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: as a Gestalt coach, I am certified that I understand
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: the theory, that I understand the techniques, that I understand
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: the work that Gestalt as a profession is the body
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: of knowledge that that supports and the work that that does.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: And so the Gestalt Institute of Cleveland, I went through
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: a long program with them and they certify that I
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: have that level of knowledge. they are also credentialed under
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: the International Coaching Federation. So as part of my training program,
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: I am also credentialed under the International Coaching Federation and
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: I abide through those ethics and the code of ethics
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: that the ICF deems for coaches. But coaching is an
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: unregulated field. So anybody could say, I'm going to hang
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: up my shingle and I'm going to coach you on stuff.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: And I think the big question is that might be
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: perfectly fine. Like for my business coach, my business coach
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: is not credentialed under the International Coaching Federation, right? And
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: I'm okay with that because the level of coaching that
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: I'm looking for is based on their experience of producing
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: the results that I'm looking for in my business. And
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: I think that is a big factor in understanding how
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: to address the coaching credential question is, what is it
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: that I want you to do? Are there regulations in
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: that field that you need to understand and know about?
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: And based on that, where do you sit on those ethics,
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: those guidelines, those regulations? Yeah.
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: Some of the things that I talk about in my
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: practice are I was a hiring manager within two Fortune
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: 50 companies. Does my career coaching credentials have anything to
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: do with that? It builds upon that. But I had
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: those credentials on my own based on the work that
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: I had done in my career. That informs my perspective.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: And it really does help me say to you, Sandra,
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: we're not going to do that during an interview. I
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: want you to focus on answering the questions this way.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: I want you to ask questions this way when you're inquiring.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: But the credentials I have built from the International Association
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: of Career Coaches then build upon all of that hiring experience,
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: leading teams, project management, all those things that I have
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: naturally through the course of my own career. So I
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: love that you talked about that because, yes, having an
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: ADHD coach. that has ADHD. But having somebody that has
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: that lived experience and is credentialed might be the supernova
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: that you need for your career or your life. Objectively
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: looking and saying, again, going back to those questions, what
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: do I need? How do I want to work with somebody?
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: What am I looking for? Am I looking to get
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: deliverables from this coaching experience? Or am I looking to
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: move through a process? Am I looking for accountability? Those
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: are all good questions. And then you should ask those
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: questions of your coach, potential coach, when you meet with them.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: I think there's one other aspect that I don't want
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: to lose sight on. And that is when you're credentialed,
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: there's an expectation of ongoing continuing education.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: That's correct.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: I cannot maintain my GPCC, my Gestalt Professional Coaching Certification,
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: without renewing it every three years. And I can't do
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: that without ongoing courses that continue to grow my expertise,
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: grow my knowledge, and expose me to maybe new learning
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: that's coming up in the field, maybe new information. So recently,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: I went on a two-day class on trauma and body
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: regulation and understanding what's happening in the nervous system and
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: and how to see that through the lens of addiction.
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: And it was fascinating for me personally, so rewarding. It
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: continues to stretch my knowledge, my compassion, my ability to
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: work with people in a lot of different spectrums that
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: maybe I was not aware of when I first got
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: my coaching certification from the Gestalt Institute of Cleveland. So
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: that's important. And to maintain your ICF credentials, you also
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: need to continually demonstrate that you're meeting ongoing educational credits.
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: And on top of that, you can be certified at
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: different levels. So as you move up, as well as
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: you continue to gain more experience, you can get further
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: credentialed within the ICF as well. So I think the
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: other aspect of this is we expect doctors we expect
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: therapists we expect people who are treating others to continue
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: to stay relevant and knowledgeable and that is one thing
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: that you get when you are going to a certified.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: Coach agreed you want somebody that's just as invested in
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: their career as you are in yours Yes. And you
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: can get some of this information by looking at people's websites.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: You can get some of it by looking at their
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: LinkedIn profile. Maybe they make videos on YouTube or Instagram, right?
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: So there's all kinds of information. So I do recommend
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: that you do a little research beforehand, but- Meet with them.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: Get the referrals from your friends and family. And then
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: don't be afraid to ask your potential coach any of
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: these questions that come up for you.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: There is one thing that I think is worth talking about. Yeah.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: And that is that a coach has to tread a
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: fine line between support and challenge. Okay.
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: Tell me more about that.
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you said it early in this conversation. In order
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: to grow, we need to be challenged, which is one
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: of the reasons why working with close family members or
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: people who really love you may not be the best
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: approach because they may not challenge you in the way
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: that you need to be challenged. And sometimes when we
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: go see a coach, a coach might deliberately poke at
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: some things that make us uncomfortable. And when we're in
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: that stage of trying to figure out, is this somebody
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: that I really want to continue to work with? Right.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: What is what is constructive pushing versus I'm just feeling
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: really uncomfortable. And how do I make that distinction? And
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: how do I decide not too early that this might
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: not be the right person for me?
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: It was a really good question.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: So you have thoughts on that?
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I do think that's correct. And having thoughtful questions
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: prepared that will let you know where this person's at
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: and how they will challenge you. And then knowing if
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: you're ready for that. If I challenge you and say,
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: is that really the best story you have about your
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: greatest strength? Is that really the story you want to
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: tell about your greatest weakness? I'm going to be challenging you.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: Tough for some people. But if you know that I'm
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: doing it out of a good place and that my
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: intention is to have you be the best version of yourself,
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: then I think that that's okay and we can work
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: through that.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: Absolutely. And I would also add that this is a
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: good place to practice in a safe environment. Raising, I
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: don't feel safe. I don't feel heard. Yeah. I am
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: maybe misinterpreting what you're saying and to practice standing up
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: and owning your own voice and that that might be
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: a good conversation to have with the coach. When I
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: feel like you're pushing too hard, how do you want
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: me to tell you? How do you want to work
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: through it? What are some things that we don't cross
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: this line?
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: That's a great question and a great awareness of boundaries.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah. All right. So Have we exhausted this topic? I
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: think it's really important. I do think it's important.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: From my perspective, I'm viewing it as this is a
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: comprehensive set of episodes that should help anybody that's interested
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: in coaching or thinking about getting a coach, but really
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: doesn't know where to start. This series of discussions is
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: for you.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Where have we netted at? It starts with understanding
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: what kind of help you want, understanding what level of
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: safety is possible. And that drives in or out of
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: an organization. What do I want to say? The other
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: part of what we talked about is understanding the problem
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: can also help clarify, am I looking for a consultant
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: who brings the expertise about what it is that I
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: need solved?
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: To the equation? Or am I looking for an opportunity
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: to dig deeper and learn about myself and develop myself?
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: In which case, then that's more of a coaching practice.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: What else have we talked about?
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: We've talked about finding the best coach. Once you've landed on,
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: I think that's what I want to explore, how to
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: go about exploring different options for you, getting referrals, doing
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: your research, and then meeting with a bunch of different
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: people to see which coach aligns with you and their
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: style resonates with you.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: And that it may not be one person.
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. I love that awareness. Talk us a
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: little bit more through that.
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: It might be an internal mentor, an external coach, a therapist,
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: and a consultant all wrapped up.
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: You might go through cycles in your life where you
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: need multiple people at one time, or you transition from
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: a coaching relationship into a therapeutic relationship back to coaching.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: There's coaches for different stages of your life.
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: And for different aspects, right? Business coaches, diagnoses of specific issues. Yeah.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: I love that. This is a comprehensive conversation. If there's
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: any other questions that you have, you are welcome to
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: join our newsletter at And then respond to it. Sandra
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: and I see those emails and we will get back
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: to you. So go over to exposingthehiddenreality.com, join our newsletter,
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: and we can get in conversation.
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: So good.
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: It is so good. Thanks again for talking with me
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: about this, Sandra.
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: Thank you.