Latest / Aspergers & Autism Podcast [The Aspie World] AuDHD / Teaching Autism (The Future Of SEN Education)

Transcript

Teaching Autism (The Future Of SEN Education) · Aspergers & Autism Podcast [The Aspie World] AuDHD

• 0:06
  Hey guys, welcome back to another Saturday live.
• 0:07
  What is going on pump to be doing these out?
• 0:09
  We do quite a lot of these lately in the same day.
• 0:11
  So I think this is like the third one in a day, so I might
• 0:14
  brain is scrambled anyway. Super awesome, to have this next
• 0:18
  guest on the show. With, there's anyone left on the
• 0:19
  podcast. This is something that I've
• 0:20
  never done before. I'm normally interview people
• 0:23
  who are on the autism spectrum and doing stuff in that scene,
• 0:26
  even though I did interview somebody who was running like a
• 0:28
  disability section of a football stadium.
• 0:31
  But today, I have a very special guest who actually met in person
• 0:34
  once before as well. This Is Sophie and she when I
• 0:38
  met Sophie was a schoolteacher I think at the time in an essay in
• 0:41
  school but now she's a senko which is special educational
• 0:45
  needs coordinator for a mainstream school.
• 0:48
  So I'm excited to get into this conversation.
• 0:50
  Talk about all the bits and pieces and the ins and outs of
• 0:53
  what she does and hopefully it should lead to insights.
• 0:56
  Oh so if you wanna introduce yourself and what you do and
• 0:58
  stuff. Yeah, of course.
• 1:00
  Hi, I'm Sophie. Thank you for calling me a
• 1:03
  special guest, I feel and I feel honored to be Here, if that's
• 1:07
  okay. So yeah.
• 1:09
  I'm in my third year of teaching I've taught a lot of autistic
• 1:13
  children. I also study study a master's
• 1:16
  degree focusing on autism so it's really my passion and
• 1:20
  Champion e neurodiversity. Wow awesome.
• 1:24
  That's good to have you on the team because yeah, we need all
• 1:26
  the help. We can get right now is so much
• 1:28
  stuff being thrown at us. Thanks to seeing and Mark Rover.
• 1:31
  Anyway, we're not gonna get into that but but anyway, You know,
• 1:36
  it's really interesting because, you know, you know, coming from
• 1:39
  an awesome Advocate myself of being a, you know, a diagnosis
• 1:42
  of Asperger's syndrome, and ADHD OCD dyslexia and a bunch of
• 1:45
  other stuff, you know, it's easy for me to sit here and say,
• 1:48
  like, you know, this is what people need to know about
• 1:51
  autism, blah, blah. But what we never really kind of
• 1:54
  have on this shower or on my content is what do people who
• 1:58
  are working in that field. What do you need to know?
• 2:00
  You know what I mean? Because I'm always saying like
• 2:01
  you need to know this. What would you like to know?
• 2:03
  You know, I think that's interesting.
• 2:04
  So what would you say? Some of the biggest issue areas
• 2:08
  are for for kind of like educational establishments with
• 2:11
  autism. I mean where to start.
• 2:16
  Oh no. I think there's a whole host of
• 2:20
  things as there, always is with education.
• 2:22
  Unfortunately, I watched a video yesterday.
• 2:28
  I think with Joanna Grace about creating sensory spaces in our
• 2:34
  schools and it was found in her research that some people kind
• 2:39
  of have it, or don't have it sort of The Knack for teaching
• 2:45
  neurodiverse children, some people kind of get it and some
• 2:48
  people. Kind of don't.
• 2:49
  So I think that's a huge barrier that we face in terms of the
• 2:54
  attitudes that staff has towards working with Meola, this
• 2:58
  children, and, and kind of not understanding the communication
• 3:05
  in behavior in nonverbal cues, those sorts of things.
• 3:11
  So I definitely find that a challenge.
• 3:14
  And I think something that I would always love to know is
• 3:17
  particularly with Apple children.
• 3:20
  I'm always kind of assuming what they're trying to communicate.
• 3:24
  So I think from an autistic persons perspective, I would
• 3:29
  kind of love to know what some of those things could be
• 3:32
  interpreted as meaning from your perspective under wasn't that's
• 3:36
  super interesting. You know, I've I've got a
• 3:39
  course, I'll give you access to it actually, and I do sell the
• 3:43
  cost like 270 know. It's like 249 pounds, I think,
• 3:46
  but I'll give you access to the course for free.
• 3:48
  For like therapist educational, you know, professionals moms
• 3:53
  dads and also people on the Spectrum and actually cover
• 3:55
  this, this instant, you know, how do you how do you understand
• 3:57
  what I'm saying? You know, if they are unable to
• 4:01
  speak in a certain way, you know.
• 4:02
  So it's really interesting and I Do cover that in this course.
• 4:04
  So I'll send you access to them and, you know, definitely love
• 4:07
  your feedback or amazing. Thank you.
• 4:09
  No problem. You know, it's funny because
• 4:12
  when we think about school and stuff like that, I have the same
• 4:14
  issue with like hospitals and doctors surgeries that, you
• 4:17
  know, less than 40 Percent of the GPS in the hospital staff
• 4:20
  know anything about autism. So it's like, how on Earth are
• 4:23
  you going to go summer to be treated when they know less than
• 4:26
  40% of your condition? Another shouldn't they know how?
• 4:28
  They know everyone's condition. What are you going to a health
• 4:30
  establishment for a start right? So the same issue I have with
• 4:34
  like the education establishment like how would you say the ratio
• 4:38
  is of the amount of teachers who are aware of the issues at
• 4:41
  autism presents? I would say that almost everyone
• 4:45
  is aware but I think it's the kind of the portrayal of autism
• 4:52
  in the media is the level of what people understand.
• 4:58
  So expecting very kind of like Sheldon Cooper asked kind of
• 5:03
  children and if a child in their class, that has a diagnosis of
• 5:07
  autism doesn't present in that way.
• 5:10
  They ended up just feeling quite stuck.
• 5:12
  And not going. We're not knowing where to go
• 5:15
  with it. For example, we've got a child
• 5:17
  at the moment who's very fixated on sticks.
• 5:20
  That's the special interests who just loves steaks and the
• 5:23
  teachers. Like how am I supposed to teach
• 5:25
  him? What he wants to do is look at
• 5:26
  stinks to be, you make his learning about steaks.
• 5:31
  Yeah, something to me that feels like a second nature.
• 5:34
  Kind of laying but for some currently.
• 5:37
  No. I don't know.
• 5:38
  Well it's algebraic, isn't it? You apply sticks to a unit of
• 5:42
  anything. You just that's what it is.
• 5:44
  Is stick is the unit on the, ain't it, right?
• 5:46
  It's yeah. I love, I love algebra for that
• 5:48
  reason. That's I was like, you never use
• 5:49
  algebra real life, as I go you do son but you know it's and I
• 5:53
  just love my sister but, you know, it's funny because it's
• 5:57
  really like to like to me and the work that I do, it's really
• 6:01
  kind of like sometimes people ask me a question.
• 6:03
  I'm like, have I just answered that as simply as I just did?
• 6:07
  And I always say, like, did I answer your question, okay?
• 6:09
  Because I feel like I just said to you, like they say, how do I
• 6:12
  get them? A to be, and I'm like, you just
• 6:14
  walk it and they're like, oh yeah, yeah.
• 6:16
  And then I'm like, that just so simple that I just really did,
• 6:19
  but I think it's because, you know, from where I see is that
• 6:23
  if you're an educator, you know, if you're a professional working
• 6:25
  in the field, if you're not, like, you got so many things
• 6:28
  going on, if you're not actively, like searching at
• 6:30
  nighttime in a scrolling through, you know, those like
• 6:32
  papers and stuff at night on your phone, reading up on
• 6:34
  autism. Like, how are you supposed to
• 6:36
  know, like, is there training available?
• 6:38
  Like, how, what is your role as a senko?
• 6:40
  Do you have any responsibility to educate the staff?
• 6:42
  In the kids. Yeah, definitely.
• 6:46
  I do quite a lot of CPD training with the staff at my school.
• 6:50
  A lot of kind of generic training that all staff in
• 6:55
  school can attend and I also do specific class team meetings.
• 7:00
  If they have a child in a classic is neurodiverse specific
• 7:04
  strategies that are working for the key to keeping up-to-date on
• 7:08
  what's working. Well, what's not working?
• 7:10
  Because I think it's very easy. From a leadership perspective to
• 7:15
  just assume that you know what's going on on the ground from what
• 7:18
  you see. And I think that is absolutely
• 7:21
  huge making sure that staff are involved in every step of the
• 7:25
  process because they see that child every single day and also
• 7:30
  taking time out of my schedule to go and spend time with the
• 7:35
  child in their classroom, I think it was just huge because
• 7:38
  we're making massive decisions about their educational Health
• 7:42
  and Care. One's the interventions that
• 7:45
  we're putting in place for them. And I don't understand how it's
• 7:49
  supposed to do that without sort of seeing it firsthand in
• 7:53
  communicating to those people. Exactly.
• 7:55
  I mean, you know, it sounds like, is that a lot of work that
• 7:59
  you think needs to be done in terms of Education versus autism
• 8:02
  like because, you know, and I always say it like this.
• 8:05
  Like, one of the things I'm campaigning for is his, Like,
• 8:07
  You Know, Places need to be autism for it on your devotedly
• 8:11
  friendly, right? Because As you know, if you go
• 8:14
  back to like the twenties, if you're a wheelchair user in the
• 8:16
  20s and there was no ramps to get to the grocery store, or
• 8:19
  that's your problem, you know what I mean?
• 8:21
  But now, I mean, it'd be sacrilegious.
• 8:23
  Imagine a store didn't have disability access, right?
• 8:27
  That they could be sued and rightfully so.
• 8:29
  And I just think like, wow, look how far we've come with with
• 8:31
  protecting disability rights and things but then you look at
• 8:34
  University, guess I got back and slaps.
• 8:35
  That's cause I will give you one hour a year to shop in the
• 8:38
  store. It's like what, what is that
• 8:40
  about? You know, that autism our once
• 8:42
  Ew, that's a great but do not the store needs to rethink its
• 8:46
  Market. Because if you think that like
• 8:47
  one in a hundred people in their Kingdom diagnosed with autism,
• 8:51
  then the stores not accommodating.
• 8:52
  For one out of 100 people, walk through those doors.
• 8:55
  That's not good. You know, that there's a duty of
• 8:57
  care of anybody in a public service, right?
• 9:00
  So so my question is like, and if you apply it to the school
• 9:03
  and education board, how far away from being like
• 9:07
  neurodivergent, we friendly is the education system.
• 9:13
  Quite a way from Miles and Miles Away.
• 9:16
  Billions of honestly yeah I think it's compounded as well by
• 9:22
  the fact that a lot of children with and special needs and
• 9:25
  disabilities are currently in mainstream schools because
• 9:28
  special schools are kind of full.
• 9:31
  Yeah, I think it also goes back as well to you and the training
• 9:35
  that we get in your diversity within our initial teacher
• 9:39
  training its Not religion. It's really.
• 9:44
  This is the thing. That's why I designed the course
• 9:46
  I have so many people like yourself who like, and this is
• 9:49
  not me trying to sound like or something good.
• 9:50
  Don't worry about, but people like so many people like
• 9:52
  yourself, come, it's me. They say that they asked me the
• 9:53
  same question they want training.
• 9:55
  They want to know more and they want their in fact more deep
• 9:56
  inside. So this is why I was like, oh,
• 9:58
  maybe I'll create a book and I can just hand that out.
• 10:00
  And then I was like, well, books, not as notice, like
• 10:02
  Hands-On. So I thought I might make a
• 10:03
  video of me explaining. Those things could be a bit
• 10:05
  more, kind of like Express, you know, can express it more.
• 10:07
  So, I did that exact thing because I had I literally sat
• 10:11
  down The council a local console and they were like, oh, we have
• 10:15
  like, you know, did you train an awesome?
• 10:16
  Like yeah, I could do. And they like, oh, we don't know
• 10:18
  anything about it. I thought.
• 10:19
  Oh my God. Like, and it was just like, just
• 10:21
  mind-blowing. And we have a huge, special
• 10:24
  abridge school here on the island where I live.
• 10:26
  We have a big school here and it's a massive.
• 10:28
  Look at 4 million pounds of up. It's a fantastic school.
• 10:30
  But you know, still this still staff in there that don't really
• 10:35
  know. But I mean, they're working
• 10:36
  every day and they kind of like it's a Hands-On job and they're
• 10:38
  doing a great job, but I feel like there's still like, there's
• 10:40
  so much more work that needs to be done.
• 10:41
  Educating the staff were educating the kids and I don't
• 10:45
  know how we do that but this is my question to you, then what
• 10:47
  we, how do you think it could be tackled?
• 10:49
  Like, how would you if you were like, you know, the Lord or the
• 10:52
  king of all education right now in the UK?
• 10:55
  And I'm going to give you a Magic Money Tree that the gates
• 10:59
  of dup, they give you a magical energy and then they said to
• 11:02
  you. All right?
• 11:03
  So if we that's fix it, what would you do?
• 11:06
  I would initially probably improve initial teacher
• 11:10
  training. I think every single teacher
• 11:12
  that comes into the workforce, needs to have done a placement
• 11:15
  in a special school every day and it's currently not
• 11:18
  compulsory, it's not compulsory. I only did one because I chose
• 11:22
  to specialize in my girlfriend did the same thing.
• 11:25
  So my girlfriend has a first-degree owners and
• 11:27
  childhood studies and development in autism right now.
• 11:30
  She was going to do a PhD in it but we wanted to have a kid
• 11:34
  instead. So what?
• 11:36
  You're breaking that was and but she knows, she loves this kind
• 11:39
  of stuff. And she said the same thing.
• 11:40
  She voluntarily went to do the placement in the bridge school
• 11:44
  here and it's actually eventually got a job there and
• 11:45
  they keep asking the school back, but what YouTube is now,
• 11:47
  so we don't need to but she was good at her job and that's why
• 11:50
  they want a backward, you know, she did the same thing, you
• 11:52
  know? Like if everybody had like a
• 11:54
  little bit of time there that it was just open their minds a bit
• 11:57
  more. And that, I mean, you just
• 11:59
  nailed it, I think so. But is it, you know, nothing
• 12:02
  treats you better than experience, right?
• 12:04
  So that's what you want. Oh My just like that.
• 12:07
  You blow my mind. That was awesome.
• 12:09
  I also think as well, the portrayal of autism in the media
• 12:12
  needs to be vastly improved and way more inclusive 100%.
• 12:17
  Did you see my? Did you see my video on the
• 12:20
  circle? Did you see that?
• 12:22
  Yes I did, I did so I'm trying I'm trying I'm trying my best
• 12:26
  right? Because they offered me that you
• 12:27
  know they pay me a bunch of money to go on the show and do
• 12:29
  the same and I tried and we like we're going to do it.
• 12:31
  We're going to show the world like, you know, twenty four,
• 12:33
  twenty four, seven autism, right?
• 12:35
  And then they pulled Because I want to play it safe and I
• 12:38
  thought Mike, you know, then we're never going to get past
• 12:40
  this barrier if they keep doing that and the way they treated me
• 12:44
  as well as rubbish but a friend of mine Shabazz he was on it and
• 12:48
  and I've spoken about today and he was like oh man you know this
• 12:51
  channel for all like Rosie like oh we got all this diversity,
• 12:54
  you know we're you know Jon Snow and Jeremy corbyn and I was
• 12:58
  like, okay great you know they put themselves out there is this
• 13:01
  channel. It's very diverse but then when
• 13:02
  it actually comes down to it, I've had nothing but negative
• 13:06
  Dance with them and and I don't know how to challenge that.
• 13:09
  I mean, one thing I do know is I'm part of a, what did a summit
• 13:14
  in MIT with a company called the ruddiman foundation and they
• 13:17
  actually try to they campaign and change Hollywood's
• 13:22
  understanding and acceptance of their disability in Hollywood,
• 13:25
  right? So that's kind of on par with
• 13:27
  it. And I did consult with Netflix
• 13:29
  for a typical season 1 season 2 and 3 but in terms of like
• 13:33
  that's why some if you if you look at that.
• 13:36
  Netflix is a typical season. One Sam is like every single
• 13:39
  trait of autism going right? But then if you get, yeah, and
• 13:43
  it's like, just like also combine numbers isn't it?
• 13:45
  If you look at season two and three, he kind of like he
• 13:48
  Mellows out a bit like when it's because like I have the chance
• 13:50
  that well, actually, I was working on with season 1 but the
• 13:53
  problem was, they'd already shot all the footage on season one.
• 13:55
  So I couldn't, we couldn't really edit that much.
• 13:58
  So backwards, I know. It was date was like an
• 14:01
  afterthought. I think they kind of.
• 14:02
  They were, they found me. They were like, so I did I did
• 14:05
  this because Consultancy with them, and it was really fun, you
• 14:08
  know, they were really do a nice guys.
• 14:09
  And but you know, it was funny because I'm I said, I'm like
• 14:12
  look you should go to make him into this like Sheldon character
• 14:15
  which we've got loads of rain man right.
• 14:17
  We've got green man. We just need real people and
• 14:19
  then so that's why he's Milling out of it because they're trying
• 14:21
  to really bring that character to life, but I absolutely think
• 14:25
  you're right. You know, you think about the
• 14:27
  more people watch Telly and they just go and they see like this
• 14:29
  this representation and they think that's it.
• 14:31
  I got it now and Rain Man. You know anybody who also drain
• 14:34
  man but it's not, you know it's and it's No, how'd you break
• 14:37
  that egg? You know, and it's hard to how
• 14:39
  to penetrate that media. Kind of I'm going to do it
• 14:41
  though. I'm going to do it my
• 14:42
  sledgehammer and you've raised an army.
• 14:45
  Oh yeah, okay, okay, I'm sorry, I anybody watching and I froze,
• 14:48
  I'm sorry. Okay, so what is your like,
• 14:53
  what's your goal, what? Like because.
• 14:55
  Like, I'm passionate about what I do and my goal is, I'm
• 14:57
  creating a charity right now and not some charity and more to
• 15:00
  come on that. But, you know, I have a huge
• 15:02
  goals or what I'm doing. Like it, I want to try to smash
• 15:04
  down. But in terms of use a teacher,
• 15:06
  why L or R, senko right now like what is your goal?
• 15:10
  Like what would you what are you trying to say?
• 15:11
  Because we're all trying to change the world, right?
• 15:12
  And I feel that for me, like, I feel like you're passionate
• 15:14
  about it. And so anyone passionately say,
• 15:16
  okay, what's your goal, what are you what are you working
• 15:18
  towards? I think that's the top of my
• 15:22
  bucket list currently is, I would love to do a TED Talk.
• 15:26
  Hmm. I think that's that's the top of
• 15:28
  the list because I think this whole thing about people that
• 15:31
  get it and people that don't to blow my own trumpet, I think I
• 15:35
  get it and I think it would make the job.
• 15:38
  Yeah, exactly. And I just think like he said
• 15:44
  it's so simple when someone says it to you.
• 15:46
  And I think as well as that for myself though, I do also want to
• 15:52
  make sure that like you were saying Netflix consulted you as
• 15:55
  an afterthought. I think that that should never
• 15:58
  be the case. We should be listening to you
• 16:00
  autistic people to create provision for autistic people.
• 16:04
  People like me. No one knows what you need
• 16:07
  better than you and I appreciate that.
• 16:09
  Every autistic person is different and you can't speak
• 16:12
  for everyone, but I think that in itself is completely
• 16:15
  backwards. So think Bonkers, I want to
• 16:18
  educate, but I also want to be able to give lend my voice to
• 16:24
  people, that might not have the opportunity to talk to people
• 16:27
  about it. That's awesome.
• 16:30
  I think it's really good. I think like, you know, having
• 16:34
  there's no There's not enough outspoken teachers or like,
• 16:37
  professional working staff. There's not, there's not a lot
• 16:39
  of, a lot of them. So, maybe you could turn your
• 16:40
  Instagram. It's kind of like a place where
• 16:42
  people could talk and discuss ideas of topics with you about
• 16:45
  this specific genre because I think having that input with
• 16:49
  someone who's actually Champion, it would be just, you know, so
• 16:51
  much better than this because you get all the time, you get
• 16:54
  like the counselors and the politicians who are champions of
• 16:57
  Austin, but they don't do it, they just sign something, you
• 16:59
  know, to say like yes, I support this and it's nothing.
• 17:01
  It doesn't mean anything because it's so busy doing other.
• 17:03
  Maybe they do want to do. This will be doing the stuff,
• 17:05
  they don't do it so I think I think what you're doing is a
• 17:09
  great service to the community and I think having people like
• 17:11
  you is going to change the lives of so many kids who come through
• 17:14
  your like classrooms and stuff I think and that to me is like
• 17:17
  you're already doing it. You know you're already already
• 17:19
  changing the world for so many people so I think thanks for
• 17:23
  that by the way. You know.
• 17:26
  I think you know if you can help Inspire other people to do it
• 17:29
  like to learn more about it and educate.
• 17:31
  I think that'd be great. Maybe you can make your own kind
• 17:33
  of like Teaching plan and we could, we could Champion it
• 17:36
  together to the government. May be.
• 17:37
  There you go. We could do that.
• 17:38
  I did brief the European Parliament on autism and
• 17:41
  employment this year. Last year, I did.
• 17:44
  Wow. Yeah.
• 17:45
  So I do have I do have a lot of like political ties and stuff
• 17:48
  like that. And so so something we can look
• 17:49
  out. Anyway, Sophie this has been a
• 17:51
  great chart. I don't like boring on to death,
• 17:53
  but as talking about stuff, we might do.
• 17:55
  But as anything you'd like to say to my audience before we
• 17:57
  kind of depart, I think just keep educating people.
• 18:04
  Don't be afraid to speak out about it.
• 18:08
  It doesn't matter how many people you talk to, you don't
• 18:11
  know how big the Ripple of what you say is going to have.
• 18:14
  So just keep talking about it and don't be afraid of of saying
• 18:20
  the wrong thing and not saying something because you're scared
• 18:24
  of saying it wrong, please say it in a safe space and allow us
• 18:29
  to help you I suppose. Well, wise words are wise words.
• 18:33
  Thank you sir. It's amazing.
• 18:34
  All right so I will leave links to any links that.
• 18:37
  So if we want to share with me for public links, if she got any
• 18:40
  social media, if you want to get in touch or talk or reach out of
• 18:42
  see what she's talking about, I will leave all links in the show
• 18:44
  notes and inscriptions videos, and I will try and tag on
• 18:47
  Instagram if stuff is cool with that.
• 18:49
  And so if anybody watching on the screen right now, you can
• 18:50
  just click a name and go straight through.
• 18:52
  Anyway, guys, it's been awesome. I'll see you next Saturday for
• 18:54
  another one of these bad boys. Hey guys, thank you so much for
• 18:56
  listening to this podcast. If you haven't already, please
• 18:58
  share this with anybody and everyone who you think can get
• 19:00
  some benefit from it. And also I know a bunch of you
• 19:02
  guys who haven't. Already subscribe to this
• 19:04
  podcast but listen so please go over and subscribe to it now so
• 19:07
  you don't miss an episode. Also from hit me up on Twitter
• 19:09
  it's at the aspie world the th e as be a spie and then World wo
• 19:15
  rld so that is B World. Alright guys, thanks.