Latest / Let's Kick It Off! / Ep 54: The Ruben Plan Is Over! Amorim Sacked, Jason Wilcox Fallout, INEOS & New Manager Candidates

Transcript

Ep 54: The Ruben Plan Is Over! Amorim Sacked, Jason Wilcox Fallout, INEOS & New Manager Candidates · Let's Kick It Off!

0:31
Let's kick it off. I'm Steve and I'm joined by Ash
0:36
and us and Reuben Amrim has been sacked as head coach, not
0:40
manager, of Manchester United. What, Are you serious?
0:44
Yeah, I thought we were on here for the Trump Venezuela thing.
0:47
What have you been doing all day?
0:48
Steve, he didn't tell me about this breaking news.
0:52
Reuben didn't call you. He's been ignoring my calls all
0:55
day and now I know why. Exactly.
0:58
Episode 1 of this podcast was called the Reuben Plan.
1:03
So episode 54, the Reuben Plan is officially over.
1:07
As I know you love your data, so I will just give you a couple of
1:11
stats on Reuben's record at Manchester United.
1:13
So 1.24 points per game in the Premier League, the same as Alan
1:19
Pardew, Chris Coleman. So in terms of fewest points for
1:23
the PL teams that have been ever present since Reuben came in,
1:27
we're 4th bottom, only above Wolves, West Ham, Tottenham, we
1:32
have 15 wins and even Wolves have eleven wins and their
1:36
bottoms are only, you know, a little bit better than Wolves
1:39
there as a Manchester United manager in the Premier League.
1:42
Only manager worse than him is Ralph Raniak and he was in as an
1:46
interim. Amarim has the worst win ratio,
1:49
6th worst win ratio of any Manchester United manager of all
1:53
time in the First Division. So as immediate reaction the.
1:57
Price bit worried about what's going to happen now, right?
2:02
Because the thing that we've always sort of been fairly
2:05
consistent on across all of us was that probably Amarin will be
2:09
gone by the summer. I think the difference with you
2:13
and me were more like, OK, let's try and ride it out because we
2:16
don't see any good options. So I'm, I'm a little bit worried
2:19
about who's coming in, what's going on?
2:21
It's we've, we do you remember like when Ollie went and then we
2:23
bring Rangnik in, it just even got even worse.
2:26
So I know you've reeled off those stats and they're, you
2:29
know, unrefutable. We're also currently, I don't
2:33
know what 6 legal with Chelsea three points behind your title
2:37
prediction Liverpool. So, you know, this season it has
2:40
there has been some improvement. I think the the the big thing
2:44
though, was the that that pre lead to press conference was it
2:48
was almost like had a lot of thoughts, you know, previously,
2:53
right in the last 14 months about he's trying to get himself
2:56
fired. And that was the one where I
2:58
think he took it beyond any time that he's ever been.
3:02
Two things I've always said to you guys, right?
3:03
In terms of where, when does he have to go is that he either
3:09
loses the team or he loses upstairs.
3:12
It sounds like the teams. I've always said, look, the team
3:14
still looks like the fighting, but it looks like him and
3:17
upstairs have had a clash and that's it.
3:19
And it's it happens with like we've seen it with Maresca, seen
3:22
it with many other managers. If you lose the you know, the I
3:26
don't know who's sounds like Wilcox, but.
3:30
So, so it is Wilcox, just to let you know, like there was some
3:33
information that came out from the Telegraph, I think Sam
3:36
Wallace, apparently there was a meeting on Friday where Wilcox
3:39
and Ruben came to blows basically over sounds like the
3:42
formation tweak. So yes, I'm pretty sure I saw it
3:47
reported that the decision was made on Friday, but I don't
3:50
quite believe that, but I have seen that that the decision was
3:54
made on Friday. So yeah, just to give you that
3:57
information as. Yeah, so before the actual game
4:01
itself, right? Yeah, so that apparently it was
4:03
Friday, so. And it seems the clash is
4:06
overcoming into the January window which we're in now.
4:09
Who's in charge of transfers? It's two things, but yeah,
4:13
that's. Yeah.
4:14
What? Tell me, Tell me more.
4:16
So yeah, from what James Ducker has said and Sam Wallace in that
4:21
article, it was it was supposed to be like a normal meeting
4:24
between the two of them because they're in regular contact on a
4:26
weekly basis. Just obviously about the team.
4:29
And Wilcox essentially questioned why did we go back to
4:33
a back three against Wolves. And obviously the performance
4:37
was was appalling. I don't obviously know if that's
4:39
what was said to Ruben, but it was more we had two games back 4
4:45
Things seem to get better. How come we how come we're going
4:49
back and and reverting back to what Reuben prefers?
4:55
And Reuben just blew his top off.
4:56
And that seems fairly consistent because he's been like that in
5:01
press conferences. He's come up with outrageous
5:04
statements throughout his fourteen months, so there's
5:07
nothing to disbelieve. You know, that was the case and
5:10
why he was so animated when he gave answers in the press
5:15
conference, because the meeting was before the press conference,
5:19
so he came in a bad mood. I heard Critch from the
5:22
Athletics saying that even when he walked into the press
5:25
conference, something was off. So and just to clarify, are you
5:29
talking pre match Leeds conference here or post?
5:32
Pre match you're. Talking pre match because I've
5:34
not seen much of the pre match. I've seen the post match.
5:36
So was that was it quite hostile in the pre match press
5:39
conference? Yeah.
5:40
So he was very short with answers.
5:43
So he was asked about the January transfer window, which
5:46
as as alluded to and he just simply said there are no plans
5:51
and I've heard nothing. So there's obviously been
5:53
conversations apparently over the last few weeks about the
5:57
fact that Rubens asked for players.
5:59
And to be fair, I did say on the last part, he needs players,
6:03
whether it's loans. And it seems like there's been a
6:07
log ahead about the Semenyo deal.
6:10
I have to say, if Ruben is pissed off about the Semenyo
6:14
DealNews flash, he would never have come to us.
6:17
Can I just jump, jump in and add a couple of points there because
6:20
it's it's transfer related. So I've seen reported today and
6:23
I think over the weekend as well.
6:24
I've seen two things. One is he wanted Martin as as
6:28
goalkeeper in the summer. He can't be too disappointed
6:30
with the way Longman's has worked out, but that's one
6:32
thing. Second thing is something I
6:34
raised a few weeks ago, he did want Ollie Watkins over Chesco.
6:38
Yeah. So he feels like he's not been
6:40
backed in terms of his type of target, I guess is the general
6:44
consensus. The timelines are important in
6:46
all this because it's like the Martinez Watkins thing is
6:49
obviously something from the summer as in towards the end of
6:52
the summer. It's clear he wanted them to.
6:55
To be fair, I think a few of us wanted them to as opposed to
6:59
data sign insurance or whatever. So obviously any offset have
7:03
gone above him on that one. And then yeah, Friday, Friday
7:07
morning, he's had the meeting with Wilcox essentially about
7:10
the system and a bit to do with transfers.
7:14
But transfers has been apparently building up for the
7:16
last like 2 to 3 weeks. He's gone into the press
7:19
conference before the Leeds game, done the sound bites that
7:22
everyone's been talking about and then obviously after the
7:26
Leeds game, actually it was a pretty normal press conference.
7:32
Like I watched it after the game.
7:34
Plus, if 4-5 minutes, shout out James Ducker because he said one
7:39
last question and that's when he went into the two-minute run.
7:43
And interestingly, it wasn't the biggest run I've seen.
7:46
Moreskas was far worse. But it's the content of what he
7:49
said and that's the problem. He's been doing this the whole
7:52
time. So very little sympathy in terms
7:55
of that. But yes, Steve, tell us what you
7:57
thought then. Yeah, well, obviously I was at
8:00
Ellen Rd yesterday, so, you know, we should briefly talk
8:03
about the game because I thought we played quite well.
8:05
Like given it's, you know, a rival away, Leeds, obviously
8:10
Ellen Rd is always a hostile ground for United to go.
8:13
Thought we played pretty well. We had the disallowed goal from
8:15
Kunya. Obviously Leeds scored and then
8:18
we reacted immediately. Really good goal, good pass from
8:21
Xerxi. Can you equalise?
8:23
And then we had a, you know, through the game we had a couple
8:25
of chances, Chesco could have scored two, hit the post towards
8:28
the end. So like you're coming out of
8:30
that, You know what, you know how my mood is generally with
8:32
United at the moment. I feel a little bit, you know,
8:35
disconnected with the club. So I was coming out of that
8:38
thinking I would love to have won, but it's not the worst
8:41
performance, it's not the worst result.
8:43
So you could have easily just swept that aside and moved on.
8:46
So This is why the timing is really interesting.
8:49
Decent, decent fight in terms of the team as well, right they
8:51
seem. I thought Aiden Heaven like
8:53
really good, like in terms of just like the battle.
8:55
One mistake on the goal. Yeah, yeah, the goals.
8:57
Where he probably just didn't judge it well, but just
9:00
generally in terms of the winning those second balls,
9:02
right in a way, fixer against Leeds.
9:05
So competing, being combative, the passion was there, the
9:08
qualities again, right, we're lacking or like, you know, and
9:11
boom is not there. Bruno's not there.
9:13
So they're like the the some of those moments in the final
9:16
third, lack of lack of quality, right to to put to the goals
9:19
away. But like the great goal as you
9:21
said today. Was pretty acceptable like me
9:24
and as a luckier to seen the best United teams go to Annum
9:28
Rd, lose draw, you know, it's a tough place.
9:31
So in that context with the injuries, the absentees, because
9:35
there was a lot made about the team in terms of a defensive
9:39
players, I think it was I didn't count.
9:41
But given the circumstances, it's almost like you can you can
9:45
get by in terms of like understanding it just right.
9:48
It's not United, but it doesn't matter, right.
9:50
And he didn't look at the. Bench he brings on Xerxes then
9:53
there was no one else yeah, and he had any options is the.
9:57
Problem exactly and look we pillared him for when he makes
10:00
Subs and it doesn't go right. That was a decent sub.
10:03
Like he came on, made a good impact and that was actually
10:06
quite bright afterwards as as well.
10:09
So yeah, it was just weird, right?
10:10
Like just decent performance and then yeah, this.
10:14
Is why why yeah, why I said I think it's about January because
10:17
if the pre match press conference the the quote was
10:22
about he's a he's a manager and not a coach.
10:25
No, this is post match. No, it's post.
10:26
Match or was that post match? OK, Post match, yeah.
10:28
What's the difference between a manager and a coach?
10:30
To me is, is is to do with things like the scouting
10:33
department and recruitment and right, that's what
10:37
differentiates it. So it must be to do.
10:39
But do you know what's absolutely wild is the fact that
10:42
he was brought in as a head coach?
10:45
But officially, so obviously I've seen the quotes and
10:48
everything from Ruben I've mentioned.
10:50
I mentioned this quite early, right?
10:52
I don't know, a few months in when he was like, you know,
10:55
going crazy in press conferences or giving crazy quotes.
10:58
Anyway, he was clearly appointed as a head coach.
11:03
It was announced. And look, any also idiots for a
11:06
lot of reasons, but they're not absolute tools, right?
11:09
So he was he would he would have been clearly told he is a head
11:12
coach. However, I'm sure there were
11:16
probably assurances by the weasel Omar Barada about
11:19
transfer flexibility, right? In terms of how much influence
11:23
does Ruben get? I can bet you the word
11:25
collaboration was mentioned. Yeah, and all of it, right.
11:28
It's all gentlemen agreement stuff, right, The Daniel Levy
11:32
side, right, in terms of like you say these things, but just
11:36
like life, things change and but also it clearly happens.
11:40
A bit like, you know, like the Brendan Rodgers transfer
11:42
committee thing. You, you do have a transfer
11:45
committee. But who has the influence will
11:48
change based on if we're all here, sitting here on pod after
11:52
pod going, oh, in the summer, this is who we're going to bring
11:54
in. Why would you spend money on
11:56
this guy, Right? Yeah.
11:58
And then he's going to feel that he's going to be like, well,
12:01
wait a minute, I'm not 100% being backed here.
12:04
There's an interesting quote that I didn't see like on like
12:08
YouTube or whatever, but I think this was before Christmas.
12:11
But the quote and you can find it was along the lines of like
12:15
I'm, I'm realising that we can't do it for free because we can't
12:22
get the players and I don't have the time and we don't have the
12:24
money as well. So I'm I'm going to have to be
12:27
flexible, right? I haven't actually seen it come
12:29
from his mouth, but it's been well quoted, right?
12:32
That's a recent quote. That's a recent quote that
12:35
that's. Before Christmas, like literally
12:36
a few days before Christmas. So that feels like that was the
12:41
beginning of almost, you know, of the end in the end end right
12:44
in that as is right that transfers has been dominated by
12:49
this. I don't think you can ignore the
12:51
system discussion that Wilcox has brought up because as part
12:56
of kind of like the reason and they're saying, you know, behind
12:58
the scenes or reported is that, you know, Reuben was
13:02
uncontrollable like when he exploded on Friday.
13:05
Like, it's similar quotes what the Chelsea board of briefed to
13:10
the press about Maresca Light just too emotional and not
13:13
enough control. And that is apparently what
13:16
happened with with Reuben on the Friday.
13:19
And it all makes sense, right, In terms of what he said, you
13:22
know, pre and post leads and ultimately, yeah, like you guys,
13:27
I thought this was coming. I didn't expect it to be 10:00
13:31
on a Monday morning first week of Jan 1st.
13:34
Week of Jan Yeah, new. Year's resolution ticked new
13:37
manager. True, true.
13:38
You got that. You got that quick.
13:40
I just want to pick up on a point you discussed there about
13:42
the formation change. I think ours is right in terms
13:44
of there's definitely a recruitment angle to this.
13:47
I think that's quite clear. So that's definitely a big
13:49
factor. But I do agree with you that the
13:51
formation change, there's definitely some tension created
13:54
there. And Ash, this is something we
13:56
discussed on the pod well over a month ago.
13:58
You know, we don't like being kept in hindsight.
14:00
It's like Gary Neville on this pod, but we discussed the fact
14:03
that why is Jason Wilcox trying to influence the formation that
14:10
Ruben plays when you've clearly hired a manager that plays three
14:14
at the back? You know, it's quite clear to
14:16
everyone when he came in, that's his philosophy as a fan base.
14:20
As a club we criticised 10 Hard for lacking the system, so we
14:24
were looking for a manager with a clear identity.
14:26
We brought him in and obviously, you know, last season didn't go
14:29
to plan. They backed him in the summer
14:31
with some big signings. And then, yeah, we kind of saw
14:34
it coming. They started laying the
14:35
groundwork for the formation change.
14:37
But we know how stubborn Reuben is.
14:39
Those conversations with Jason Wilcox surely wouldn't have gone
14:43
down well with Reuben. Us.
14:46
Yeah, it just seems like a weird I don't I like I wasn't in the
14:49
room. I don't know how much this form.
14:52
But you can assume, right? You know.
14:53
You know enough about Reuben's character now.
14:55
Now I know about his character, but how much of this was this
14:57
formation thing? It just seems a bit of a it
14:59
feels weird for a director of football to be insisting on a
15:05
particular team formation. But this is the problem.
15:08
That is up to the coach, isn't it?
15:11
I would agree with that in terms of like when you look at the two
15:14
roles and that's what you should have, but this is.
15:18
I guess the concern when me and Steve watch those, sorry, the
15:22
podcast with Jason Wilcox, he referenced a few times like, you
15:26
know, he misses the training ground like it.
15:28
It was almost like you could just tell.
15:30
It's like if he was in charge, he'd have a back he.
15:33
Actually said, I'm pretty sure he actually said.
15:35
Sometimes I have to stop myself from trying to be the coach
15:38
like. And this is where context is
15:40
really important, right? Because a typical, particularly
15:43
continental sports and director, they don't care about these
15:47
elements because they leave it to the head coach, right?
15:50
In terms of Wilcox's background, he actually was a youth coach,
15:54
right? So he was a coach first after
15:56
retiring from football, then he's obviously become head of
16:00
Academy, which is different to, you know, first team football.
16:04
And then he only had I think 6 months as I believe it was
16:08
sports and director at Southampton before joining
16:12
United as first of all, technical director.
16:14
And just very quickly, for the fans who don't know about the
16:18
structure of Ineos at United, Jason Wilcox came in as a
16:21
technical director, which essentially is around looking at
16:25
the youth side, the pathway into the first team.
16:29
That's not about the sporting director role, which I believe
16:33
at the time was Dan Ashworth. And then he got fired.
16:35
And, you know, just very quickly, sporting director is
16:38
essentially the link with the manager in terms of recruitment.
16:42
They do look at the youth side, but it's more about recruitment
16:45
and like, you know, identifying the roles.
16:48
So just a bit of context for everyone there.
16:49
But yeah, essentially what I'm saying is I don't think Wilcox
16:53
is the right fit for being a sporting director.
16:57
It's the same as how John Murtagh got the role with Ed
17:01
Woodward. I don't know what you think,
17:03
Steve. Yeah, You know, I I fully agree
17:05
with Wilcox not being up to the role.
17:07
I pointed this out weeks ago, months ago, yeah, months ago.
17:11
I've got nothing against the guy.
17:13
I think, you know, he's he's clearly, clearly a smart guy in
17:15
football. I just don't think that was the
17:16
right role for him. We know based off of a lot, a
17:20
lot of reports that when Amarin was appointed, we know that Omar
17:25
Barada pushed for that appointment.
17:27
We know that Dan Ashworth wasn't supportive of that appointment,
17:31
hence why he left, you know, a few months later.
17:33
We also know that Jason Wilcox wasn't fully supportive of a
17:38
three at the back manager. So we know that.
17:40
And then obviously at the time he's a technical director and
17:42
then he then gets promoted to director of football.
17:44
So there's going to be some type of tension there from the get go
17:48
because of those circumstances. So yeah, it's not a massive
17:53
surprise in terms of this happening.
17:55
I think it's just the timing that's probably caught us all
17:59
cool us all out, really. But yeah, I just that outburst
18:02
from Reuben, I think he was almost asking for it.
18:05
But when you call them out like that, I think it's only going to
18:08
end one way to be honest. Interestingly, the statement
18:12
says about performances and results, and apparently this is
18:16
the best move in order to be able to get the highest
18:19
position. I do feel like that's a bit of a
18:22
smokescreen. The only thing I would say is
18:24
that I did mention it on the last, but those five games are
18:27
Old Trafford. I think we've picked up like 4-5
18:30
points and I feel almost like if Reuben had got those points, I
18:34
don't think we'd be in this position in terms of like
18:37
talking about the results as being a factor.
18:40
As any more to say on this structure or generally with
18:43
Reuben? Yeah, I was going to say, I
18:45
think where the cyst, I think, I do think the timing has to do
18:49
with this window because I think it must be related to transfers.
18:53
And I think where the formation comes into it is I think Wilcox
18:57
didn't want to recruit to the system basically because he
19:02
might not see the long term. So when Reuben says I need some
19:05
menu as a wing back, he's thinking well, if we move to
19:09
another system, do I, you know, do I need some menu etcetera,
19:13
right. Or is he worth the huge expense
19:17
that it would require to get him when I'm not sure about you as a
19:21
manager and to recruit to your system.
19:23
So I think I think it's all all going to be interlinked.
19:27
Yeah, Reuben's emotions, he's clearly an emotional guy.
19:30
So if there was any, let's say they hadn't had had a strong
19:34
relationship from the start, right.
19:36
But that's always like something that's waiting to boil over and
19:39
it clearly boiled over. And in terms of results, you
19:44
know, let's see. Because like I said, everyone
19:47
was happy apart from myself. I was not happy when Ollie left.
19:51
But you know, I understood it. You know, things didn't look
19:54
good on the pitch. Things can get worse.
19:56
So I don't know. Have you there any talk in terms
19:59
of odds? You're the, you're the betting
20:01
man, Steve. I don't want, you know, should
20:03
be revealing that. But you know, you like a little
20:05
50P here and there. Yeah.
20:07
Or Rudy's Pizza. Rudy's Pizza, which you owe me
20:11
now. Showers to Rudy's Pizza if they
20:13
want to sponsor the pod. Any talks in terms of the next
20:18
mate? I heard it's going to be an
20:19
interim. Well, yeah, so I mean, first of
20:24
all, let's, you know, confirm to the listeners, I'm sure they
20:26
already know that Darren Fletcher will be taking charge
20:29
of the team against Burnley on Wednesday.
20:32
So obviously good luck to Darren Fletcher.
20:34
Like he's a, you know, he's a Manchester United man.
20:36
We want him to do well. But interim in terms of very
20:39
short term or caretaker, if you will, is obviously Darren
20:42
Fletcher. So I have, I'm pretty sure I saw
20:44
BBC Sport confirm and other sources confirm that they're
20:47
looking at an interim for the rest of the season and then
20:50
they'll hire a permanent manager in the summer, which is
20:52
obviously what we've talked about.
20:53
So in terms of interims, I've not heard anything, you know,
20:58
concrete. The one story I did see, again,
21:00
I think it was a Telegraph, is that Glasner is #1 perm choice.
21:04
I'm just looking at the odds now and he is the favourite at 4:00
21:07
to 1:00 so that looks like the number one perm choice.
21:10
Slightly changed, right? Maresca was top of some list or
21:14
some odds list this morning. OK, well, I think that was
21:17
people just putting two and two together and getting fired.
21:20
I mean, Fletcher's their second favourite at 8:00 to 1:00.
21:22
Obviously, that's based on the fact that he's going to have
21:24
some games, yeah. But I don't know if that's
21:26
because the betting markets consider like 10 games as
21:29
permanent. So if Fletcher goes to the end
21:30
of the season, technically, you know, he he could be.
21:34
Yeah. So you almost ignore Fletcher.
21:36
And the number 3 on the list is Maresca, 17 to 20.
21:41
Number 4. Gareth Southgate 12:50 I've not
21:44
I've not looked at this list until now, to be honest.
21:47
And #5 on the list is shabby. 14 to one.
21:51
That's a good chance. And then beyond that, it's like
21:53
all 25 to one names is Emery, Iriola, Eddie Howe, Carrick
21:58
Solscha Porch at 28 to 1. That's just looking at the the
22:02
Manchester United midfield from the 2008 semi final against
22:05
Arsenal. Fletcher, Fletcher and Carrick
22:09
with Anderson. So we could have Anderson in
22:11
there as well as. A mascot, he could do the dance.
22:15
What do you reckon, Steve? A bit of Fletcher and Carrick.
22:18
I mean, I'd get, I'd get your man Ollie, He's in Manchester.
22:22
He's, he's had, you know, a managerial job.
22:25
Is he in Manchester? Is that, is that what?
22:26
Yeah. Yeah, he lives in Manchester.
22:28
Yeah, I think his daughter plays for United's women's team,
22:31
actually. Yeah, Ollie and Carrick, I
22:33
believe both live in Manchester, are both out of work, so I would
22:36
get them both back in to help Fletcher and probably have the
22:39
three of them till the rest of the season and that's what I
22:42
would do. What about you guys, Ash?
22:44
I. Was trying to think but surely
22:47
pay the buyout. I'm just trying to think about
22:51
it. Yeah, it's so difficult.
22:53
This isn't like in previous cases where it's like I've got a
22:56
clear like #1 #2 number. Three, do you agree with the
23:00
approach of going for an interim and hiring the per manager in
23:03
the summer like fundamentally? I'm not sure.
23:06
So at the moment, like I was thinking you're going to pay for
23:10
Eddie Howe. I thought that's the move
23:11
because you were always the thing with you, you always
23:13
firing Amrim anyway and you had the plan.
23:15
You're like go for how, can't get how, go for your Iola steal.
23:20
Football, football circumstantial, right?
23:21
So it depends on like, you know what, what do you want to do?
23:25
When do you want to do it? Like, you know, because like,
23:27
for example, like if I was to handpick any dream manager, I
23:33
think I'd actually go Louis Enrique.
23:35
But then immediately, it's almost like, well, OK, let's go
23:38
back to reality. No, but your plan.
23:40
Probably not going to happen saying your plan 2 weeks ago,
23:42
right? Yeah, but the plan 2 weeks ago
23:44
was the fact that and also it wasn't me saying get Marco
23:48
Silver in that. It was more you were saying, OK.
23:51
No, no, no, Eddie, you can. Have Ruben or.
23:53
Mark, you said she'd go for Eddie Howe, right?
23:56
Yeah, I mean, he'd still be very high.
23:58
Make them a list now. Costs.
24:00
It costs 8 million. Yeah, but wouldn't you, wouldn't
24:03
you do it Like, here's the 8 million, Eddie, let's go.
24:06
Yeah, if I could get buy in and stuff like that.
24:08
The thing is, and this is the thing, right, we are close to
24:12
the summer. So it depends.
24:14
For example, with my back channel discussions with Carlo
24:18
Tuku, who else am I missing? I'll speak to Pochettino.
24:21
He wouldn't be high up on my lips.
24:23
Whiskey speak to him about what? Argentinian restaurant BBQ.
24:26
Listen, I know the best Argentinian restaurant in
24:29
London, so yeah. Tell us, tell us, tell the
24:31
viewers. Where?
24:32
Where should we go for Argentina?
24:33
Buenares in Hackney. Excellent.
24:35
Ash, if you forget about like, you know, whether you can get
24:37
them or not, what is your say, you know, top three candidates
24:41
on the perm, you know, like irrespective of whether you can
24:44
get them, maybe take out Louis Enrique because that's really.
24:48
Hard. You've always said Eddie Howe
24:49
would come, right? Ash?
24:50
You've always said that that he would come.
24:53
I'm I'm happy. What do you mean?
24:54
Like he's you've always said, if you approach Eddie Howe, he
24:57
would take the job, he would come to United, you'd pay the
25:00
buyout Newcastle, you know, and and to be fair, it's not like
25:03
Newcastle are in the perfect situation.
25:05
It's not like he had a great summer with the Isaac and right
25:09
so. Eddie Howe's Eddie Eddie Howe
25:12
would be high up on my list for sure.
25:14
I'm just saying because like this thing that you guys have
25:18
been discussing about the fact that the names are in the
25:21
summer, they're top. They're top of the top.
25:25
So you're trying to decide whether whether you take Carlo
25:28
over Howe, for example, is what you're trying to decide.
25:30
I'll give you kind of like a quick overview, right?
25:34
You got, first of all, you got to make a decision.
25:36
Are you going to go with stability, right?
25:39
Because like in the past, basically in the last two years,
25:42
that's kind of where I've more angled towards or as his
25:46
approach that he likes normally. But we need a top name to do it.
25:50
High ceiling, right? So high ceiling is obviously
25:53
Carlo Thomas too cool. I think them too in particular,
25:58
right. So now I've got to decide, can I
26:02
I gamble and wait and do the Michael Carrick, Ollie, Darren
26:07
Fletcher dream team? Because, for example, if we get
26:10
fumped on Wednesday, that bubble will burst.
26:14
Not just no, not just for me, but for other people, right?
26:18
No, but that would be, I don't think Fletcher can be the guy in
26:21
show. That would be unbelievable.
26:22
What for you don't you don't think he can do it till the end
26:26
of the season? He's got no managerial
26:27
experience managing the under 20 ones.
26:30
The thing with the thing under eighteens the thing with Ollie.
26:34
Ollie and Carrick, they were Manchester United #1 and #2 for
26:37
what, two, 2 1/2 years? Or we say no Darren Fletcher,
26:41
then OK, yeah, that's fine. I can.
26:43
I can live with Carrick or. Steve's asking, would you go
26:46
interim with a whatever you know, whoever that name is, or
26:50
would you hit the Eddie Howe, you know, 8 million?
26:54
I'd have to wait because like Thomas Too Cool and Carlo
26:57
Angelotti. Also, you could get how in the
27:00
summer, right? You're probably just as likely
27:02
to get how, which is unlikely. You can get how in the summer.
27:05
Still don't have to pay the comp I'll tell you.
27:07
But this is the thing, right? You know, goes back to any of us
27:10
as I don't trust him, right, especially with their record
27:14
over the last 14 months. And it's the thing, if they're
27:17
doing back channels into Carlo, into Thomas T Cool now and
27:20
they're getting reassurances that they're going to be
27:23
available and they're willing to come, just wait till the World
27:27
Cup finishes, then fine, I'll wait.
27:30
So your fight is actually the same as Steve, right?
27:32
Ignore. Let's forget the timing.
27:34
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Carlo and Tuka are one and two.
27:38
If you can get them, you're going to get them.
27:40
You you don't have any. I'm going to try anyway, yeah.
27:43
Yeah, because let's let's, let's be honest, Lewis, Enrique seems
27:46
like a wild shot. I don't think he would want to
27:48
join any us either. So you know.
27:50
What about you? I've always said I'm I'm with
27:54
Steve. I would rather wait till the
27:55
summer to get a name. I've always felt all the name.
27:58
This is why people have misconstrued my position has
28:01
really been in. I'm just like I keep saying it
28:03
until you give me a better option, an upgrade and and you
28:06
know, I shook. I thought, was it with do we
28:08
have a pod? Was it with Ron and with Scott?
28:11
Maybe where I was like we shook on Ollie.
28:13
I was like, yeah, we. Did, yeah.
28:15
It's like done, done, done deal, right?
28:17
Here's. Everyone, I think even Ron,
28:19
Thing is even even the people that kind of wanted Ollie out
28:22
now, I was one of them. You know, after 2-3 years, I'm
28:25
pretty sure we all said at the time we've fully appreciate he
28:28
did a really good job for those like 2 full seasons.
28:31
I'm telling you Edward would screwed him with Ronaldo.
28:34
Probably, yeah. 100% he was working on something.
28:37
Bad profiling of Sancho, you could say as well in hindsight,
28:41
you know, Yeah. There's a lot of mistakes.
28:43
That's a pod in itself. My point is is like, yeah, even
28:45
the fans that you know, did want Ollie out by the end, I'm pretty
28:49
sure most of them would happily take him back given the shit
28:52
football for well over, you know, a season.
28:55
So we, you know. That's the thing I took on Ollie
28:58
like weeks ago is like if you can get me my man and bring me
29:01
Carrick as well, we're done. So if that happens, I'll be
29:04
really happy. I'm worried that you know, he
29:06
said you both of you don't trust in yours.
29:09
I don't trust them either because they've made poor
29:12
decisions on 10 Hog, on Ashworth, on Ruben.
29:16
I don't think they're going to go down that route.
29:18
Yeah. What?
29:18
What do you think they will do? What?
29:20
Do you think I think they. Love a Glasner, I think that's
29:23
who. They yeah, I agree.
29:24
I think there's a there's a glass.
29:26
Glasner is a type of name. Yeah.
29:28
And is he part of Red? Bull.
29:30
I think he was. Let me have a look.
29:32
He was. He was frank.
29:33
That's big. He was the Frankfurt manager
29:35
before. I don't know if he was part of
29:37
the Red Bull network. I mean, it was.
29:38
Christian Bevelle right he because his influence.
29:41
Have you heard the story as about Bevelle?
29:45
Apparently in August after the Fulham United game at Craven
29:48
Cottage and when Goodall Marco Silva came up with his quote
29:53
about how easy it is to play against United and Iwobi, he
29:57
referenced that in a WhatsApp group with like United senior
30:00
hierarchy saying like yeah. I saw that story.
30:05
I think I didn't click on the story.
30:07
I saw the headline but I also saw that Vivel is going to be
30:10
quite central in this next like manager appointment which is.
30:13
Why I think the Olly Glasner thing keeps popping up like
30:16
Jason Link from Telegraph's reporting.
30:18
It is there a link then between? I'm just having a look now.
30:21
You guys carry on. I mean obviously 2 Shields ex
30:24
mates with Ratnik right? He's Ragnik's the guy who
30:28
brought him in. Ragnick's obviously the
30:30
godfather of the Red Bull Network.
30:32
Narglesman is another one from that, and he'll be available in
30:35
the summer. So if there's a Red Bull thing
30:36
going on, look out for those two names.
30:39
Yeah, they've worked together, like in the background of the
30:43
Red Bull football system, Because I think from memory, I
30:47
haven't seen an Ollie Klazer interview.
30:49
He kind of like done his coaching within the Red Bull
30:52
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31:19
So there's a lot of names out there, but I think one thing
31:22
United fans are struggling with generally that we've seen this
31:25
in our community and we know this in the wider fan base.
31:28
There's almost a part of us which is like, it doesn't matter
31:31
who the manager is, they're going to fail in this setup,
31:34
under these owners, in this football structure.
31:36
So as I asked you on the last part, will you admit any US have
31:40
been a failure in terms of on the pitch now that they've had
31:43
two seconds in their two years, will you now admit that any us
31:48
have been a failure on the pitch?
31:50
On the pitch, I think you'll be undeniable.
31:53
I've always said that. I think overall there's putting
31:56
the club potentially. I'll give you the training
31:58
ground. I'll give you that's.
32:00
Where I see the positivity? I'll give you that.
32:02
You can have that. That's fine.
32:03
I'm talking on the. Pitch.
32:05
I mean, like, you know, you don't, we don't need to be a
32:08
rocket scientist to say that results have not been good
32:11
enough. Performances have not been good
32:12
enough. As I mentioned, they messed up
32:14
the 10 hog. He should have been fired in the
32:16
summer. That was just a poor decision
32:18
that created instability. The following season also
32:21
creates instability in the summer window and then the
32:25
following season, then you bring in Amarin in the middle of the
32:28
season. That's never good.
32:30
Last season was horrific. This season I think has been a
32:34
major improvement. I see positives like I said that
32:39
in terms of yes, training ground, but also I do feel the
32:42
recruitment is better. So I do feel like, yes, we said
32:47
this is the thing, saying no to Martinez and Watkins are things
32:51
I like. I want the sporting director to
32:54
come in and go, no, these are older players that for the
32:57
project 2030 or whatever the project is, they're not going to
32:59
be around. They're high wages, they're on a
33:02
decline. We're not signing them.
33:03
Sorry. We're getting Benjamin, Cesco
33:06
and Lamont. I preferred that.
33:08
I actually like that approach. I like the fact they've gone for
33:11
the likes of an Aid in Heaven who we mentioned having a good
33:13
game. Sorry, just quickly on Lamont's
33:17
and Cesco, so where do you stand with the way Cesco's playing in
33:23
terms of like, OK, fine, because this is like the Harry Kane
33:26
discussion two years ago, like you were concerned about the
33:29
wages and the transfer fee, so. Is it no goals in three months,
33:35
I think for Cesco? Yeah, so like this the thing
33:37
like it's, it's one thing to kind of like go cheaper, but
33:42
then that's why we're fifth, two points behind Liverpool or
33:46
whatever you said, instead of maybe outright 4th and closer to
33:51
Aston Villa, maybe even closer to Man City.
33:54
So like. Got to be done.
33:56
We've got to target A profile of player in an age bracket that we
34:01
can grow with the team. Now whether Cesco's that guy or
34:04
not, we're going to find out. So far, I think he's done well.
34:08
Like if you look at his, his finishing hasn't been there, but
34:11
his all around game is good. Let's see.
34:13
Because that's the point is Cesco now is, is not what you're
34:17
looking at. Who?
34:18
What does Ollie Watkins look like in three years and what
34:20
does Cesco look like in 3? Years.
34:22
Does it matter though? Because it does matter.
34:23
That's the whole. Point it matters, but it's about
34:26
now, isn't it at the moment? It's it's it's it's it's always
34:29
about now, but it's it's also. One striker who's apparently not
34:34
scored in three months and like Watkins, will score more.
34:38
And we always said that. I even said that I was like
34:41
Watkins would have a better season and maybe even next
34:44
season then Cesco will have. But it what happened in year 3-4
34:47
and five that matters. And then you write off this
34:50
transfer fee, you pay him more wages and you write off this
34:53
transfer fee. I 100% back that move for
34:56
Arsenal because I'm like, Arsenal need to win now.
34:58
They should buy Ollie Watkins because this is the time to win
35:01
the title for Arsenal. They went and got Yocharis your
35:04
mate and I think you know, go and get Watkins Premier League
35:08
proven. They should have done it in
35:09
January. They should have put the money
35:10
down and got what? For us it's more we need to
35:13
think of so you. Think so, yeah, because where we
35:16
are in the cycle, yeah, of going back to the top, you think the
35:22
Cesco younger signing even if it's a higher transfer.
35:26
And it's OK to bite older players, but they have to be
35:29
like a free transfer. So like for example, it was OK,
35:35
the Ericsson deal was OK and the Casimiro deal wasn't.
35:38
They both are a similar age profile.
35:40
But look at the fee and the wages. 1 was a bad transfer, one
35:44
was OK. It was not a good transfer, but
35:46
So what? And Ericsson did a job.
35:50
And if there was, if Watkins was available on a free, if Martin
35:53
is, there was talk about Martin is on a free or something.
35:56
If that was the case, OK, fine. You do a little short term
35:58
patchwork because you're building right, But they were
36:01
talking 40 million for Martinez and 60 million for Watkins and
36:05
I'm like can't spend 100 million on two guys that are not elite
36:09
level, right? They're not elite level and then
36:12
in 2-3 years time they're done. Do you have any sympathy with
36:16
Ruben then for targeting those two players, which he clearly
36:19
did? I mean sympathy in that I
36:22
understand that he is going to be judged on short term results.
36:26
So he wants the players. It will deliver for him next
36:28
season, but this is where I would prefer rather than an Ed
36:32
Woodward style. OK, whatever you want.
36:34
I'm going to bring him in. We've got some some backbone.
36:38
Who's saying no? We've got you mentioned
36:39
Christopher Vivel. He's very much into to youth and
36:43
data, data youth recruitment. He would have been driving Cesco
36:48
deal, right? Because he's part of Red Bull.
36:50
Right. So I actually prefer that we
36:52
have a structure in place where recruitment has a bigger say
36:54
than just so when Reuben says I'm the manager and not the
36:57
coach, No, we need someone who's a coach that can work with the
37:03
hierarchy to turn things around in the longer term.
37:07
If he if Rube and This is why I said I don't want to show.
37:10
So if Ruben is of that view of older player, he had to go
37:14
because it doesn't fit with the recruitment.
37:16
And that was a that's a mistake at the time of hiring him from
37:20
Omar Barada, because you need to get this clear.
37:23
This is the plan. Are you in for this plan?
37:25
If you're not in for this plan, stay at Lisbon.
37:27
We we need to find someone. Steve, what about you on that
37:30
question? Yeah, I don't have too much
37:32
sympathy. I think ultimately, forget the
37:36
system, forget recruitment, he failed in terms of results, like
37:39
obviously more so last season. I know this season you could say
37:42
improvement, but within that improvement of this season,
37:46
guys, we've not beaten 5 of the bottom 6 this season and the
37:50
sixth team we're playing on Wednesday.
37:53
And the manner of some of those performances that we didn't win
37:55
is not acceptable. And actually just to pick up on
37:58
one of the points Ruben made in the press conference, which
38:01
shows how much Gary Neville is in his head, he actually
38:04
referenced the fact that certain people need to get over what
38:07
Gary Neville thinks. And I think that is to do with
38:09
the fact that Neville heavily criticised US post Wolves.
38:13
Deservedly. Deservedly from most of the fans
38:16
perspective, he said. That's the baddest of the bad.
38:18
So it sounds like people within the club are hearing that and,
38:22
you know, passing that back to Reuben.
38:24
I feel like that's probably in Reuben said to be perfectly.
38:27
Yeah. That's why he referenced these
38:28
pundits before. He's mentioned Keen, he's
38:30
mentioned never before that this is the thing.
38:32
He just seems too emotionally volatile for the job.
38:36
I said I've said it on multiple occasions, I thought the job was
38:39
too big for him and it's proved to be the case.
38:42
But going going back to that point about, you know,
38:43
recruitment, I get as what you're trying to create at the
38:47
club, you're trying to go for that model, that which Liverpool
38:49
have got, which probably City have got, where the club take
38:52
care of recruitment. Although Pep's probably heavily
38:55
involved at City. But the general modern approach
38:58
at most well run football clubs is you do have a football
39:01
department. I don't even think Pep is it.
39:03
If you look at the signings of mates, you think Pep's actually
39:06
was involved in any of them? I mean, I'm sure he has a sign
39:09
off given given what he's achieved there like.
39:11
You'd have a sign off, but do you understand what I'm saying?
39:13
Of course you look at the names, there's clearly a scouting
39:15
department going around that they're finding these got the
39:18
relevant. Yeah.
39:19
And it's not like City of Nailed recruitment recently, they've
39:21
bought a lot of random players. But yeah, you need to have a
39:27
structure in place and not just an A manager and his agent
39:30
network, which is like the Mourinho style, right.
39:33
OK, what does Joe? And this is the issue where I
39:35
didn't foresee with 10 Hog I got massively wrong was it seems
39:39
like 10 Hog and his his network was involved in transfers.
39:43
Now, now I've realised, oh actually the good transfers are
39:46
happening at IAX were done by Overmars.
39:49
He's now come to United and his somehow his agency has taken
39:53
over. We need to get away from that.
39:54
We need independence in recruitment.
39:56
I agree and I think most, most like, you know, progressive
39:59
football fans would agree with that approach.
40:01
I just think it's delusional to think that you can go from a
40:05
Edward Wood style run club to a Liverpool within one year, 2
40:09
years. This is a probably a five year
40:11
project. It is to trans.
40:13
It just said that no, they haven't.
40:15
No, no they have. They've said, look, it's a five
40:17
year, we need to rebuild. 2020. 8 they've targeted to win the
40:21
league in two years time, which is delusional.
40:24
Which is delusional. It wasn't it five years from
40:26
when it was 2028? Project Twenty 28150.
40:29
Years. I think, to be fair, that that
40:31
is delusional. I'm sure Jim has probably said
40:33
that's probably too ambitious. Aim high.
40:36
Yeah, but aim high whether whether we can win the league or
40:39
not, it's it's the approach the right one.
40:42
I personally think that we have to go younger when I see these
40:46
more interesting signings. I know that people who I've
40:50
never heard of this guy and it's like, yeah, it's better to try
40:53
and do a few of those also then add in the Prem proven at the I
40:58
actually think, like I said, we overpaid for Mbumo and Kunya,
41:03
but you you know what you're getting.
41:05
So he got that. He got his know what you're
41:07
getting mixed in with a Cesco and a Lamons who a little bit
41:11
more like OK, little bit project.
41:14
He needed a midfielder. So I have sympathy there.
41:17
The biggest sympathy I have for Ruben.
41:18
I don't know how much of this is him is the the entry list is
41:23
unbelievable. Like the team you could put out
41:27
who are injured is probably better than the team starting
41:29
almost right. Some big names.
41:31
Bruno Fernandez being out, he's by far our best player.
41:34
You've lost your two big centre backs in McGuire and Delict and
41:38
Bumo and Ahmad and Mazra. We are AFCON.
41:42
It's, you know, Mason mounts injured.
41:44
Mason mounts always injured. He's always injured, but you
41:47
know what I mean? It's like when people say, oh
41:49
you've got 8 defenders. Well, who are the purse?
41:52
Who's the 1st Kobe man who's out?
41:53
You know The Who is who, who did you want him to start?
41:56
And yet we still put up some kind of fight against Leeds.
42:00
But fundamentally, if you're now saying I want you to spend
42:03
607080 million on XYZ player, no you, you haven't done enough to
42:10
deserve that level of backing. If that's a player I want to
42:13
target anyway, respective, fine. We're in a poor financial
42:18
situation though. We haven't got European football
42:20
at the moment. In the summer we'll have a
42:22
better understanding our finances.
42:25
It's hard for us to do anything in January so I can understand
42:28
where the club's coming from. I've got a different question
42:31
for you guys because look, it's fairly obvious from Steve's side
42:35
like he wanted to call or a car low and like he's happy on a
42:38
Southgate, you know, on that like next batch of managers
42:41
down. So kind of like the Eddie
42:44
Howe's, the ER rollers and all that, those types of managers
42:48
even across Europe, if you were to pick like a couple or one, if
42:53
you got one in particular, like have you got any names in your
42:56
heads? Nogglesman is 1 I'd throw into
42:59
that mix I guess, but yeah. Your mates, your mate.
43:03
BBQ Boy part number 5. Yeah, these managers you can
43:07
all. Friends.
43:08
Even Steve. But the problem is guys like I
43:11
made this point when Reuben came in, like as I said, I get where
43:14
you're trying to get to as a club in terms of the way it's
43:17
run, but you don't do that overnight.
43:19
So we need a couple of years of stability of getting good
43:22
results while you build up that football side of the club
43:25
because it's still not right. Us.
43:27
Jason Wilcox is not competent and I'll say it now, Omar Barada
43:31
is a snake. He should not be running
43:33
Manchester United. He doesn't know anything about
43:35
the values of the club. He's an ex city man.
43:37
He was probably involved in the 115 charges and I want him out
43:41
the club. He's a joke of Aceo.
43:42
He can't communicate. OK, you raise ticket prices.
43:44
This. Is his first gig as a COO.
43:46
Yeah, don't forget. But how can you bring someone
43:48
that hasn't even done this role externally?
43:50
If you if you're going to promote someone, promote someone
43:52
internally that knows the club. These highs aren't good.
43:55
And you know, I know you need to give them time, the likes of
43:58
Christopher Vivel, But ultimately the two most
44:02
important positions in the football club, Omar Barada, CEO
44:06
Jason Wilcox, director of football, are not competent.
44:09
I've said it for a year now and it's proven true.
44:13
But Steve, there's a bigger problem because, and I've seen
44:16
it now, right, because we've had two years of Ineos, you could
44:20
have Michael Edwards in charge of the football side.
44:25
The problem is Jim Ratcliffe. There's a pattern here, OK,
44:28
with, you know, 10 Hog, Dan Ashworth, Ruben Amarim, maybe
44:33
Omar Barada in the future. They're all hired by him.
44:38
He talks about gardening leave like he's never understood it,
44:40
even though he's in the corporate world.
44:42
And then they all get fired, right?
44:44
I was going to ask you, Ashley Ratcliffe.
44:46
Fingerprints are all over. The decisions have been made
44:49
even. The cost cutting, right, because
44:51
I heard today like, you know, some of like the positive stuff
44:54
that Omar has done in terms of the finances, that's all driven
44:57
by Jim. Jim's looking at these numbers
45:00
and Omar probably doesn't even have a say, right?
45:03
You saw the snake movie did with the ticket in last season in
45:07
terms of I think he did an interview or there was a sign to
45:10
say nothing's going to happen. Then boom, you know, we had
45:13
those those price increases. So this is the issue like
45:17
because I know where you're going to go next, Steve.
45:20
It's like ownership and the wider problems.
45:23
But unless Saudi are going to come or another private equity
45:26
firm, we're stuck with these guys.
45:29
Well, I'll tell you what, I've got a 5 point plan that will fix
45:32
the club right? Number one, hire Ollie and
45:36
Carrick until the end of the season to get through and let's
45:39
see how we do #2 Hire Carlo on a 2 year contract for the
45:44
following two seasons to take us into 2028.
45:47
During those two years, force the owners out and we've got an
45:51
interesting guest on that point. So we'll talk more about that on
45:53
future pods #4 Rehire Dan Rashworth as director of
45:58
football, get Dan Ashworth to basically build that football
46:02
department of the club. And then #5 you can have your
46:05
sexy appointment, you can have your areola, you can have your
46:07
Eddie Howe, you can have the hot prospect in two years time.
46:10
But this is not going to be an overnight fix.
46:12
This is going to be in stages so that's what I would do to fix
46:15
the club. So do you think then Thomas T
46:18
calls the right man, given that his track record is 18 to 24
46:21
months at a club? If anything, if I was trying to
46:24
be really sly and clever, I would get him in on the basis
46:28
that he will fall out with the hierarchy and as a fan base who
46:31
want the ownership out, that could work in our favour.
46:34
I want someone who's going to get results over the two years
46:38
and, you know, not take too many risks because we we can't afford
46:42
to. We finished 15th last season.
46:44
We need to get back into Europe. So we need to just minimise the
46:48
risk and go with experience, in my opinion if.
46:50
You're going for a Dan Ashworth and you're looking to build
46:52
structure and culture. Surely Southgate's your man,
46:55
isn't he? Well, but if you, if you think
46:58
about my timeline, I'm forcing the owners out over 2 years, so
47:02
in 2020. Southgate will get the owners
47:04
out because the fan base will revolt.
47:06
That's my goal. Can you imagine?
47:09
I mean, do you remember in Bilbao?
47:12
This tells you I've never been Ruben in I was trying to do the
47:15
Gareth Southgate campaign. See, let me survey the fanbase,
47:18
see what the see what their appetite is.
47:19
Because, you know, let's get my man in post the EUR.
47:22
It's going to win the Euros. Pfizer Islam, didn't we?
47:25
Just about, I think I did convince Pfizer, if you're
47:27
listening. I mean, we've got video evidence
47:30
I think somewhere. Have you given some concrete
47:32
names then? Because I'm still trying to work
47:34
it out because you said on the last part that Southgate's a bit
47:37
of like a non star. So what?
47:39
What is your names? Let's go, let's go.
47:41
Our top three, then, Yeah. We discussed it with Steve last
47:43
week, right? Let's go individual because you
47:45
don't like 2 cores. Give us your top three.
47:47
For yeah, no, we discussed, we went through you off top five,
47:49
wasn't it? And I was like, yeah, Carlo
47:51
boom, love that too cool. Don't like it.
47:53
What was number 3? Was it Gareth?
47:55
Southgate. Yeah, Southgate.
47:56
And I was like, yeah, boom, love that.
47:58
Who's number 4? Glasner, Glasner, I don't mind,
48:01
but the thing interesting thing with Glasner seems to have
48:03
fallen out with the Palace hierarchy as well.
48:05
So we need to work out on this head coach versus but as a as a
48:09
speaker. And as you know, he's done well
48:11
at Palace. Won a trophy.
48:14
Won a trophy. Interestingly, one thing that
48:16
always interests me is the transferability of I didn't
48:19
watch his Frankfurt teams as much with transferability of
48:21
football style. From what I see in the Premier
48:23
League, we can't play the Crystal Palace way United, you
48:26
know, that's not attacking enough.
48:28
It works at Palace, but he's obviously he's working with the
48:32
players. He's got those.
48:33
Yeah, he's obviously said no, this is I'm working with the
48:35
players I've got. He's never played a back three,
48:38
played a back four at flank Frankfurt.
48:39
So he's like I'm he's flexible on formation.
48:42
So in theory, Glasner should be an interesting 15 pot shows.
48:45
No, thank you. If you want a wild card in the
48:48
kind of, you know, big name, don't know what his English is
48:50
like. I think we've mentioned shabby
48:52
before. I think, yeah.
48:53
Was it Ron who was a Jabby fan? I wanted him.
48:55
I wanted him when. Reuben was good.
48:58
When Reuben came in because because of the stature of having
49:00
managed a Barcelona. Yeah, so like, again, someone
49:04
who would play decent enough. I don't think he was
49:07
particularly good at Barcelona, but I also think Barcelona are
49:10
going through a lot of horrible situations to the Titans.
49:13
Which we which we have as a club and, and just one point and
49:15
Reuben, I slightly feel sorry for him in the fact that the
49:19
club has gone through a lot of change as an organisation over
49:22
the last few years. That's one point I will make.
49:24
And sometimes, like, United is a Titanic and you know, he's
49:28
managing the main floor on it and, you know, it didn't go
49:31
well, but we just have to acknowledge the change.
49:34
We talked about the culture, the fat, the feeling of the fans he
49:36
has had to manage in a very difficult environment.
49:39
And to be fair to him, honestly, our punditry is difficult to
49:44
deal with because I listen to these guys as well myself.
49:48
And I'm like, come on, guys. You know that you've got an
49:50
influence over this fan base near riling them up.
49:52
Like show some a bit more positivity skulls.
49:56
Neville, if the football was positive, they would be like you
50:00
see, even when we win 2 free games in a rate, it looks if you
50:04
look at social media, if you look at even the news clippings,
50:07
it looks like we've won the league.
50:08
So if the football was decent then they would.
50:12
Be But they're all they're always waiting, right?
50:14
There's there's a clip circling on social media at the moment of
50:17
Gary Neville when 10 hog was in hammering, you know, the lack of
50:20
system and actually recommending a back 3 based on the squad, he
50:25
says. You know, you know.
50:26
Sure and Dallow and. To me, do you know what that
50:28
shows, Steve? It just shows how shit Reuben
50:31
was that coach in a back three, right?
50:33
So look, you can talk about the players, right?
50:37
Three points by Liverpool. Yeah, but in terms of coaching a
50:41
back three, he's not been good enough, right?
50:43
It's his system. That's the system he wanted.
50:46
That's the system. Looks like Ineos agreed that he
50:48
can do. He's had 14 months.
50:51
He's had some of the most shocking starts in the club's
50:53
history, let alone the Premier League history.
50:56
That's under Reuben, right? You just said it yourself.
50:59
Ollie Glasner came in I think after Reuben got more out of a
51:03
tune out of a weaker Crystal Palace squad in terms of the
51:07
overall squad. So to your point, like if Volley
51:12
Glassner was in charge, it's like I wouldn't be offended by
51:15
it. The one thing Steve, I would say
51:18
whoever the next permanent manager is are within reason
51:22
unless they're absolutely unbelievable is prerequisite.
51:25
They've got to have experience of the Premier League.
51:28
They have to you. Wouldn't go with the Javi,
51:32
right? I would probably not wouldn't
51:35
hit Naglesman. I'm I don't.
51:38
I don't actually rate Naglesman as highly as you guys, or even
51:42
just generally, so that's fair. Lewis Enrico's is an obvious
51:45
exception to the rule. Does Southgate qualify given
51:49
he's managed the England players who play in the Premier League
51:52
or do you have to manage in the league itself and he watches all
51:54
the Premier League games? He's England manager.
51:56
Yeah, no, ideally, ideally I want, I want them to have.
52:00
Me. In the Premier League.
52:01
It's the minimum is got to be one out of managed a big club or
52:06
managed in the Premier League, ideally both, but at the minimum
52:09
it's got to be 1 and that's what Reuben did not have.
52:13
You know when we rewind the clock?
52:14
Do you know one thing about the interim situation?
52:17
If Michael Carrick was hired as the interim boss, I'm fairly
52:22
comfortable with that because he's recently been a manager.
52:25
I know he doesn't take the Premier League box but if we're
52:28
just talking about we get, we're going to get to the end of the
52:31
season to get the best man for the job, I can deal with that.
52:35
But I'm just saying as a part, the next permanent gig manager
52:39
is going to be minimum prerequisite Premier League,
52:42
other or or top club experience. What about Maresca then?
52:47
I wouldn't. Personally, I wouldn't.
52:49
I wouldn't touch him after what he did.
52:50
I mean, to be fair, if it looks like to me in hindsight, I feel
52:54
like Reuben was trying to get fired as well.
52:56
Do you know what I need, guys? I've talked about my lack of
53:00
connection to the club that I'm feeling at the moment.
53:02
I just need the Manchester United DNA and values back and
53:06
that's why I'm really open to Ollie.
53:08
That's why I take Carrick, that's why I'm actually half
53:11
please Fletcher, even if it's a couple of games.
53:14
I just need like some attacking football, some wingers, some
53:17
people that represent the club, speak well, honour the
53:20
traditions, get Kobe Manu back in the team.
53:23
That's what I need as a fan is just that reconnection to the
53:27
club and that's why I'm actually really supportive of the interim
53:30
on top of the fact that the options in the summer are
53:32
better. We all want that, but this is
53:36
the thing because we've been down this road so many times,
53:38
right? Like we were the biggest fans of
53:40
Gigsy taking. Well, yeah, I know it's not
53:44
right long term, but interim. But even interim like as said,
53:48
it could go badly wrong even with like a Michael Carrick or
53:52
an Ollie Salsh. But Ollie's done it before.
53:55
Yeah. And like you, you have to bear
53:57
with it, right? Because you've taken this
53:58
massive decision to do it in January the 2nd.
54:01
So Steve, I've got a question for you though.
54:03
Like we know Southgate would not go down well with the fan base.
54:06
Do you think Ollie would? Yeah, you would.
54:09
Yeah, I think he would, given the circumstances.
54:12
Yeah, I think like I said before, I was one of the ones
54:14
that wanted him out by the end because I thought what we could
54:16
do better. But as an interim gig and, you
54:19
know, honouring the work that you did in those first two
54:21
years, especially now in hindsight, looks even better.
54:24
The work that you did. I think again, I think the the
54:27
connection, the values, a lot of fans are feeling that as well.
54:30
So that I think he'd get a lot of.
54:31
Something well, I would obviously, you know, I was the
54:33
biggest Ollie fan here. And I think what it would also
54:36
give as well for him is some closure, I think because you've
54:39
just left in bad circumstances. And it would.
54:43
I would love it for him. Yeah, I think his.
54:44
Question though, do you think any US could do something like
54:47
that? I don't think they will.
54:48
That's what I'm saying. I don't think they have it.
54:49
Buys them time though. They know it will be popular.
54:52
They should know it will be relatively popular with the fan
54:54
base and it buys them time. They have more candidates so
54:57
I've not heard any talk of it yet, but I'm surprised that they
55:00
wouldn't even consider it. I don't think they will because
55:03
a lot of this recruitment decision will be based on data
55:07
and not sentiment. So I mean, obviously if Fletcher
55:09
wins at Burnley on Wednesday and he wins the FA Cup game against
55:14
Brighton, which is this weekend, right, you know there will be a
55:17
clamour I think. At the contract.
55:19
Well, get the interim contract. Don't think I would be really
55:23
disappointed in our fan base if there was a clamour off one
55:27
game. A couple of games, let's say.
55:30
Because the thing, the thing that people underestimate with
55:34
Ollie, he did manage at Moulder, yeah, he had managerial.
55:39
Which Fletcher doesn't have. Also, he also coached, I think
55:43
he went the Fletcher pathway, right?
55:45
He coached underage in the reserves and then he went and
55:48
did a smaller gig somewhere else, won the league once, maybe
55:52
twice with Moulder. Had had had some cope, proper
55:56
coaching experience before he took the United job.
55:59
He was the assistant manager under Ollie.
56:01
They they, they basically talk was that McKenna and Carrick
56:05
were mainly on the training ground doing the coaching.
56:08
So Ollie ran it in a Fergie style where you know he would
56:11
oversee things but McKenna and Carrick would do the sessions.
56:15
Then Carrick took the Middlesbrough job.
56:18
Mixed results, but apparently, you know, from what I remember
56:22
hearing, you know, the football was decent but you know you
56:24
couldn't get it together fully. Yeah.
56:27
That would make some sense. I still think that I would
56:31
rather him with Ollie again, just because you have that
56:35
shield, right? We're talking about the the
56:38
voices and the press, and this is a man that's done the job.
56:42
He's handled the job. He knows what it's all about.
56:44
You're telling me he's in Manchester, Steve, tell him
56:47
about Rudy's Pizza. Arrange the meeting, get the
56:49
contract, tell him to put everyone's down there.
56:53
Not with any us in charge. Our our man for bitsyo Romano
56:58
tweeted 48 minutes ago. Oligon a Social has shown
57:01
interest in taking Manchester United job as caretaker manager
57:04
regardless of contract length. Of course.
57:07
What's this space? Yeah, we'll wrap it there, I
57:10
think. Yeah, in terms of interim, Ollie
57:12
and Carrick seem like obvious choices, possibly both even
57:15
working with Fletcher. Would you go back to Old
57:17
Trafford if it was Ollie and Carrick?
57:20
Michael Carrick on the sidelines.
57:22
If it was Ollie and Carrick or one of them, I'd be tempted.
57:25
Yeah, I'd be tempted. Oh, there you go, Jim Ratcliffe,
57:29
if you're listening, If you want to get Steve back in Old
57:32
Trafford, get Michael Carrick on the phone.
57:35
We'll wrap it up there unless there's any more breaking news.
57:38
Do we get gardening leave now just for a little bit of time.
57:42
We can have gardening leave until the interims announced.
57:44
So yeah, thanks for tuning into this episode, and we'll catch
57:48
you on the next one.